Post by: slowhand on October 01, 2019, 11:31:24 AM
That's about as far as I got that season.
The next season I bought a doe bleat (the can), a grunt tube (blacktail specific), and a rattle bag (I am scared of having antlers stick out of My pack while hunting). I found info and videos about black tail rattling and how successful some hunters had been with it.
3nails was by far the most informative info I found (highly recommend anything you can find from him).
I continued that season doing the same old same with the rattle bag never coming out of my pack.
To be continued (back to work)
Post by: Skyvalhunter on October 01, 2019, 11:34:25 AM
Post by: slowhand on October 01, 2019, 11:38:30 AM
That's all you have to say? :dunno:I'm at work :dunno:
I will add more when I get a second. Just don't want to retype everything over and over. I just add when I can.
:sry:
Post by: Skyvalhunter on October 01, 2019, 11:42:24 AM
Post by: slowhand on October 01, 2019, 11:48:22 AM
Will this be for info on how you will attack Blacktails this hunting season?All around info.
How it goes for Me this season. How My one try last year went, LOL.
Help from others if possible. 3nails You out there?
My setup and steps I take. I'm looking for help and hopefully to help others.
It's totally new for Me but exciting as hell.
Post by: Skyvalhunter on October 01, 2019, 11:52:52 AM
Post by: slowhand on October 01, 2019, 12:05:26 PM
Have you had some cams set up in your hunting are to know if there are bucks around. Blacktail typically have a small area with which they roam.I hunt an area that has a very good population of blacktail and very few hunters. It's behind a gate and requires a incredible amount of effort to get to. It's all up hill 6.5 miles before you reach the top. There are plenty of bucks. My hunting partner and I are going in this weekend with three cameras. We both have the mutli season tags as well as My middle son. I would put My life on the fact there are no less then 15 good bucks in the area I hunt. I have never used a game camera until yesterday. Just bought one and learned how to use it last night. I honestly can't wait to see some of the pictures I expect to get from this area. Last Year there was a very nice 4 point taken about 100 yards from Me during modern rifle Rut hunt. So close!
Post by: slowhand on October 01, 2019, 12:27:40 PM
So a few years back I got so frustrated with Blacktail hunting that I decided I needed to look into other ways of hunting them. The same methods I had used for years and years were not producing the successful results I had seen before. I started reading and learning about rattling. everything I found was on whitetail :(So now We make it to last season (modern) My middle boy (Carson) and I both get lucky and pull doe tags. I decide that I am focused completely on Getting the boy His first Deer. Opening day he brings a good friend of his with as his hunting partner (Hayden).
That's about as far as I got that season.
The next season I bought a doe bleat (the can), a grunt tube (blacktail specific), and a rattle bag (I am scared of having antlers stick out of My pack while hunting). I found info and videos about black tail rattling and how successful some hunters had been with it.
3nails was by far the most informative info I found (highly recommend anything you can find from him).
I continued that season doing the same old same with the rattle bag never coming out of my pack.
To be continued (back to work)
It's opening morning and we are all standing in the pitch black at the entrance to the first big clear cut. After a silent game of rock paper scissors it's decided that Carson will lead followed closely by his friend Hayden. Me and My hunting partner will head in after an additional 30min wait. I tell the boys that if it's a doe Carson shoots but if it's a Buck then Hayden should have the opportunity because He has no doe tag. Official shooting time hits and I send the Boys in to start their slow walk as I watch their behavior with My binoculars.
Back soon to continue
Post by: slowhand on October 01, 2019, 01:17:59 PM
When I get there I can see the excitement on their faces. The story goes like this as told By My Son.
So We came around that corner and walked up to this edge to take a look. I look over the edge and there's a Deer walking right to us.
I pull up My gun and find it in My scope and it's got tons of horns Dad! So I'm thinking I can't shoot Because You said if it's got horns to let Hayden shoot it. So I'm Like "Hayden get over here! There's a big buck right here!" then the Deer looked at Me.
Hayden pulled up his gun and the deer started bouncing like it had spring in it's feet. It went crashing into the trees over in the corner at the bottom of the hill.
So close!
I asked Him If He could show me where the Deer was when He had his gun on it. Right next to that stump there He said. 50yards! LOL
Later this same season I helped a vet pull His nice 4 point out and to his truck. He stopped By camp later to show the boys and see if it was the same buck that they had seen. This was a very nice Deer a true trophy blacktail buck. Both the boys agreed that the buck they had a chance at was much bigger than the one in the back of the truck.
Long story I know. This Deer that the boys missed out on is My back up plan. I figure that He must be one of the dominant males in the area. I know where He lives now and plan to try to rattle him in.
More to come later
Post by: slowhand on October 01, 2019, 02:42:26 PM
At this time of the season how aggressive should I be rattling?
My thoughts are medium to light rattling. I'm guessing the Bucks are grouped up and maybe light sparing at the most right now.
Almost all of the bucks I have found at this time of the year in My spot are in bachelor groups of two or more. I have even found one group that had a spike, two point, three point, and a mature 4 point all walking together.
My hunting partner Zack was out last weekend and spotted a doe and spike together. My thoughts are that the spike is last years fawn?
Just not sexualy mature yet? Just still hanging out with mom for another month before it's time for him to leave out on his own.
Post by: slowhand on October 01, 2019, 03:13:02 PM
Post by: JasonG on October 01, 2019, 05:32:17 PM
Post by: Turner89 on October 01, 2019, 08:10:44 PM
Very long story short.....I know nothing about rattling. Good luck
Post by: grundy53 on October 01, 2019, 08:44:48 PM
Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
Post by: JakeLand on October 01, 2019, 09:00:58 PM
Post by: 3nails on October 01, 2019, 09:18:02 PM
Last year was the first time in 24 years that I did not make it into the woods of Idaho or Montana with my rattling antlers. I blew a disc in my lower back requiring back surgery preventing my usual November hunt. My back feels great now and I have a tag for Montana. Maybe I feel extra motivated this year to rattle both due to withdrawals!
I wouldn't start until you see some serious rub activity or signs of chasing otherwise it may seem unnatural to a mature buck. The blacktail bucks in my areas start showing strong aggressive behavior around the 20th which is why I picked that date.
Post up your thoughts as you learn and I will too. (Time for bed. My brain is done)
Post by: Pete112288 on October 01, 2019, 10:49:42 PM
Here is the story of the one time that produced.
I was set up inside some big timber, behind me about 20 yards was where the big timber ended and thick jack firs started. I was on top of an 8 foot tall old growth stump that had a big tree growing out of the back of it, so it made for a nice improvised tree stand setup. I rattled for a few moments, thumped the antlers on the stump, where a root was, made a nice thump sound that carried through the woods well. After about 5-8 min I paused and looked around. Behind me came a doe. She had her head up and ears perked, looking all over the place, obviously worked up and searching for what the source of the fight was. Then about 30 feet behind her came a nice 3 point buck, he wouldnt stop chasing her no matter what i did. as they swung around I found a gap in the brush and dropped the buck on the move at about 25 yards.
Was a great experience. My opinion of it is make sure there is rutting activity and WATCH THE WIND! I also think they are more willing to come check it out when its not out in the pain open like a clear cut. Try to do it in the woods. and keep your head on a swivel, they can sneak on you pretty quick.
Post by: slowhand on October 01, 2019, 10:58:26 PM
It was last season second day of modern rut season, I’m gonna guess November 14th or 15th. I went to one of my most confident locations. I’ll give it my best to describe the scenario and scene. It’s somewhat open with lots of tall old trees all around two sides are heavy reprod, above is a logging road that receives almost no traffic, and below is a very overgrown old clear cut.
It’s about 2 hours before sundown. Visibility was around 75 yards+ in any direction.
I found an old growth log that was large enough I could lean up against it and not be seen from below. I faced the logging road with it above me by 100+ yards. Reprod to my right and left. I chose this direction because the wind was coming from this direction. I waited a solid 30min after I had settled in and had everything I needed at my side (rattle bag, the can, a large stick and grunt tube).
Rifle across my lap.
I started with a doe bleat followed by a second about 1 min later. I waited watched and listened. I then rattled the rattle bag a little Followed by some hits to the ground with the large stick. More rattle bag with a second or two pause and then started in with the allout rattle of a big dog vs big dog fight. Rattle, big stick to the ground, intense rattle followed by more intense rattle. I would say I went for about 5 to 10 min then I sat as still as possible, listening and looking. I waited around 20 min for some form of response. Nothing? Well it’s only my first try no big deal I thought.
I stood up and started very quietly picking up my gear and putting on my pack.
Once I was ready I started to head down wind as it was my exit direction.
I didn’t take more then ten silent steps before I caught the rear portion of a very large bodied deer go crashing into the reprod.
Now I’m sure it’s possible that it could of had nothing to do with the rattling.
It’s also possible that the deer rear quarter I saw run into the reprod could have been a doe
But I like to think that the Deer rear belonged to an old dominant Buck that was just smarter at this game than a first time Rattle hunter.
It’s also very possible from what I have read that it might have circled around to see what it smelled like where the rattle fight was coming from.
It’s impossible to say but I sure was encouraged to try this again.
Post by: AKmyles on October 02, 2019, 09:51:17 AM
Following along!
Post by: CavemantheHunter on October 02, 2019, 10:02:36 AM
I have rattled in one other buck previously in thick reprod. He wouldn't show himself, though, just kept grunting and circling to catch my wind.
Post by: fishnfur on October 03, 2019, 12:09:10 AM
It is important to stay hidden, and expect that the buck will come in from downwind. You're hiding place should have an open view of the area downwind of you, because more often than not, they will circle and try to smell you first, unless they are already just wild with testosterone pumping. Having a natural barrier, like a stream or rock wall that limits an approaching animal's direction in coming in is a great idea in concept, but hard to put into practice. Rattle, stomp, grunt whatever, then glass and listen for movement. Sometimes it may take a buck 30 minutes or more to get to your spot, so be patient. If you know where your buck lives, then I wouldn't move for an hour or more once I started my rattling sets. Good luck.
Post by: slowhand on October 03, 2019, 07:32:08 AM
I assumed the Deer would come in from the upwind side (can't smell Me) but now you have Me thinking I should focus my attention to the down wind area. I don't disagree as this is where I ran into the Deer on My first and only setup.
Question for all the experienced rattlers reading. What time of the day have you had your success? Morning? Midday? evening?
Post by: fishnfur on October 03, 2019, 10:01:15 AM
A tree stand is a consideration, 'cause it gets your scent off the forest floor. Whitetail hunters have good results rattling from above. This might be your best bet. Also, a two person set-up has been suggested. Hunter number one hides well and is the rattler. Hunter two hides 50 yards or so downwind of hunter one - he's the shooter. At a predetermined time, perhaps 30 minutes after hiding and the woods have settled down, hunter one does a predetermined number of rattling sets. Assuming the buck will come in from the downwind side, the second hunter should located close to where a buck might come in to try to wind whatever animals are suspected to be fighting in the woods. If a buck comes straight in to hunter number one, he takes the shot. If all fails, the two hunters move on to a new location and switch jobs.
Scent use is an intriguing idea. I keep thinking that retained/frozen forehead gland and tarsal glands from previous harvested bucks could be used to mark tree rubs or patches of ground in an area you are working, and would make perfect sense to a buck investigating rattling noises that he is smelling the funk of bucks that are in his territory. This takes a lot of prior planning, previous success, and still leaves your human stench all over the same area you are marking. During the peak of the chasing period, bucks tend to ignore human scent more than other less crazy periods. That might be the time this type of setup could work. ?? I've saved some glands in my freezer for just this use, but I'll be darned if I can find them!
Good luck!
Post by: slowhand on October 03, 2019, 10:11:38 AM
I want to do two setups, one mid day and one couple hour before sunset. I can't help but stick to My old run and gun ways early in the morning.
I'm also going to try one rattle setup where My Son saw the monster opening morning last year. Not in the clearing but back in the thick stuff.
Light rattling only.
Post by: MountainTracker on October 03, 2019, 12:10:59 PM
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: predatorG on October 03, 2019, 01:11:52 PM
It is important to stay hidden, and expect that the buck will come in from downwind.
This is generally true, but it reminded me of an Elk hunting podcast I listened to once. It was ElkNut saying that when elk are calling to each other, they never circle downwind to check if it's an Elk, Because they know its another Elk! The only reason for an elk to circle downwind of you is if you messed up in your calling and they got suspicious. I would assume that the same thing works for deer. No deer coming naturally to a fight will circle downwind, because he knows its other bucks he's responding to. The only reason that a buck would circle on you is if you did something suspicious that hes not sure about. Obviously no one is perfect, and blacktail rattling is relatively new, but once people get more proficient they should not expect anymore for the majority of deer to circle on them. That is just my theory. I've only rattled a couple times. Once I had a doe walk right up to me at about 10 yard with 2 fawns, and then walk away. The other time I watched a big buck simply ignore me, but it was pretty early in the season.
Do people like 3nails struggle with getting circled? I'd love some input on whether or not its true that the better you get the less you get circled, and I think its pretty obvious hes about as good as it gets.
Post by: slowhand on October 03, 2019, 01:35:27 PM
It is important to stay hidden, and expect that the buck will come in from downwind.
This is generally true, but it reminded me of an Elk hunting podcast I listened to once. It was ElkNut saying that when elk are calling to each other, they never circle downwind to check if it's an Elk, Because they know its another Elk! The only reason for an elk to circle downwind of you is if you messed up in your calling and they got suspicious. I would assume that the same thing works for deer. No deer coming naturally to a fight will circle downwind, because he knows its other bucks he's responding to. The only reason that a buck would circle on you is if you did something suspicious that hes not sure about. Obviously no one is perfect, and blacktail rattling is relatively new, but once people get more proficient they should not expect anymore for the majority of deer to circle on them. That is just my theory. I've only rattled a couple times. Once I had a doe walk right up to me at about 10 yard with 2 fawns, and then walk away. The other time I watched a big buck simply ignore me, but it was pretty early in the season.
Do people like 3nails struggle with getting circled? I'd love some input on whether or not its true that the better you get the less you get circled, and I think its pretty obvious hes about as good as it gets.
Can We get some additional information on the buck that ignored You? I want to learn as much as I can from each described encounter as I can.
Post by: predatorG on October 03, 2019, 01:45:21 PM
It is important to stay hidden, and expect that the buck will come in from downwind.
This is generally true, but it reminded me of an Elk hunting podcast I listened to once. It was ElkNut saying that when elk are calling to each other, they never circle downwind to check if it's an Elk, Because they know its another Elk! The only reason for an elk to circle downwind of you is if you messed up in your calling and they got suspicious. I would assume that the same thing works for deer. No deer coming naturally to a fight will circle downwind, because he knows its other bucks he's responding to. The only reason that a buck would circle on you is if you did something suspicious that hes not sure about. Obviously no one is perfect, and blacktail rattling is relatively new, but once people get more proficient they should not expect anymore for the majority of deer to circle on them. That is just my theory. I've only rattled a couple times. Once I had a doe walk right up to me at about 10 yard with 2 fawns, and then walk away. The other time I watched a big buck simply ignore me, but it was pretty early in the season.
Do people like 3nails struggle with getting circled? I'd love some input on whether or not its true that the better you get the less you get circled, and I think its pretty obvious hes about as good as it gets.
Can We get some additional information on the buck that ignored You? I want to learn as much as I can from each described encounter as I can.
Sure. I was down deep in a hole that I knew had some deer in it. It was about 10 minutes after sunrise but still super dark in there. I had got there about 30 minutes before sunrise, so right at legal shooting light. I had settled in and could hear stuff moving, but where I was was super thick and honestly a terrible spot to set up. I gave it a soft grunt, and then heard one to my left and one to my right. This was early in archery season so sometime in september. Watched 2 big bodied bucks walk from below me up past me about 50 yards to the right, but it was so thick (and dark) I didn't have a shot. I don't really rember which year this happened, but i ended up shooting a buck out of a stand either a week later or a year later :chuckle: it all kinda runs together. The buck I shot was a decently sexy forky, but theres a masher in there thats been evading us for 3 years.
Post by: fishnfur on October 04, 2019, 12:43:23 AM
Regarding rattling during the opener, I would just say that I have never had a deer respond to rattling prior to the season opener, and it was likely a week after that that the earliest buck moved in response to the horns -somewhere around the 20th. During the end of the muzzy week one season, I could hear bucks about 75 yards or so deeper in the woods sparring towards last light. I did three sets of rattling and they showed no interest in my attempts. Totally unresponsive.
The deer are curious to what is going on when they hear rattling. One of my graduate level college books on Mule Deer and BT deer states that the deer act like kids running to see a fight when they hear the antlers banging between two sparring deer. That remark was made regarding Mule Deer, though I suppose it happens in the BT world as well, though I've never seen it. From Pred. G.'s story about the doe and fawn showing up after rattling, that may be exactly what happened in that case. Regardless, I consider rattling to be a quality tactic to consider in the last 10 or so days of October. If I was chasing a big buck in the early season, I'd save that tactic till his hormones are raging a bit more, say the last week of October. I'd guess that you're only going to get one chance to get it right on that buck, so timing is of the essence.
Let us know how it turns out.
Post by: Okanagan on October 04, 2019, 06:58:04 AM
Will add only one oddball tale:
My first try at rattling blacktails I used a large set of mule deer 3x3 antlers, long tines and heavy. At first grey light I spotted a spike blacktail on a brushy hillside 125 yards below me, totally unaware of me. Wind was quartering him to me. At the first clack of antlers the spike instantly raised his head to stare, and did not move. I was in full camo including face, body and hands behind solid brush from him, looking through a lace of brush. After several minutes of off and on rattling, the young buck lowered his head and sneaked away in the opposite direction. It appeared that he wanted no part of bucks with antlers as big as those sounded. :)
Post by: predatorG on October 04, 2019, 08:31:36 AM
Hey! Predator G takes a break from the books and makes an appearance! How's college young man? Are you coming home to hunt this season?
College is good! Pretty warm down here in AZ. Saw a 350+ In. Bull while backpacking last weekend. I lived in Missouri and worked all summer so I didn't come home at all, which meant no August bear season for me :(
December I'll be back and better than ever for the end of late archery 8)
Won't count on any rut or rattling that late, so this thread is just theory and future info for me... I'll just be cruising around and looking for deer in the open when I'm home, maybe some stand hunting.
Man I miss hunting good dates :(
Post by: slowhand on October 04, 2019, 10:15:43 AM
Hey! Predator G takes a break from the books and makes an appearance! How's college young man? Are you coming home to hunt this season?
Regarding rattling during the opener, I would just say that I have never had a deer respond to rattling prior to the season opener, and it was likely a week after that that the earliest buck moved in response to the horns -somewhere around the 20th. During the end of the muzzy week one season, I could hear bucks about 75 yards or so deeper in the woods sparring towards last light. I did three sets of rattling and they showed no interest in my attempts. Totally unresponsive.
The deer are curious to what is going on when they hear rattling. One of my graduate level college books on Mule Deer and BT deer states that the deer act like kids running to see a fight when they hear the antlers banging between two sparring deer. That remark was made regarding Mule Deer, though I suppose it happens in the BT world as well, though I've never seen it. From Pred. G.'s story about the doe and fawn showing up after rattling, that may be exactly what happened in that case. Regardless, I consider rattling to be a quality tactic to consider in the last 10 or so days of October. If I was chasing a big buck in the early season, I'd save that tactic till his hormones are raging a bit more, say the last week of October. I'd guess that you're only going to get one chance to get it right on that buck, so timing is of the essence.
Let us know how it turns out.
I absolutely will. Trucks outside all loaded up and ready to roll as soon as the clock strikes 4pm or My boss gives Me the green light.
Set up camp tonight then up at 4am and off to My favorite gate. Zack (hunting partner) took today off so He will be all set by the time I get there. Super pumped.
It's going to be a great weekend. :tup:
Post by: fishnfur on October 04, 2019, 02:53:11 PM
Post by: fishnfur on October 05, 2019, 07:05:01 AM
Post by: ridgefire on October 05, 2019, 07:00:43 PM
Post by: Turner89 on October 07, 2019, 12:16:03 PM
Post by: slowhand on October 07, 2019, 12:42:14 PM
Zack and I found a nice spot way down in a hole with decent views in all directions. No luck :(
I stayed out of My number one and number two spots as I anticipate the greatest chance for success to be in those areas and would prefer to wait until a better part of the season (more run activity) before any rattling in these locations. We did do a morning hunt in My number two spot looking for a chance at a buck and a good rattling location for future use. I found an absolute ton of last years rubs. It made Me wonder. How many rubs does one buck make? How many bucks can be in a few square miles of land? There just can't be any way all these rubs are made buy one or two Bucks?
Post by: sagerat on October 07, 2019, 01:42:14 PM
I have pretty good series a pics of 2 nice blacktail fighting. It was the end of December.
Please share those!
Post by: fishnfur on October 07, 2019, 11:54:58 PM
Post by: deerhunter_98520 on October 08, 2019, 06:40:17 PM
Post by: Turner89 on October 08, 2019, 09:15:56 PM
I will :tup:I have pretty good series a pics of 2 nice blacktail fighting. It was the end of December.
Please share those!
Post by: Turner89 on October 08, 2019, 09:18:43 PM
Seen some new rubs Monday, just a matter of time fellas :tup:This should be a pretty good year in BT country.
Post by: Turner89 on October 08, 2019, 10:44:36 PM
These pics of buck fighting were actually early January. This camera was left out almost a year and a half. I couldn't get back to it due to some road construction. The camera actually took pics of me when I finally got back to check it. Thats how I know that the date is correct. I figured they would be all done fighting by this time.
Post by: SeaRun1 on October 08, 2019, 11:20:44 PM
SR1
Post by: fishnfur on October 09, 2019, 12:19:37 AM
The only rubs I've seen were from a month ago when the bucks were shedding velvet. Lost a couple trees on one of the tree farms, one from a bull, one from a buck. Normally the bucks won't kill a tree stripping velvet, but it happens from time to time that they girdle the thing completely. Bulls are rubbing everywhere and everything.
Rather than hijack this thread, I think it's time for a new one on early season. Look for it!
Good luck to the rattlers on the MF opener. Might be a touch early, but you never know what might come in to the horns.
Post by: slowhand on October 18, 2019, 10:59:10 AM
I will be in My honey hole tomorrow at sunrise Rattling at about a med light level.
This will be the same spot that I tried on My first attempt. I also have a game camera I plan to drop at the same location. I plan to rattle only once in this area. My middle Son (Carson 17) is coming with us this weekend. Wish us Luck!
So Far Blacktail 1 My hunting group 0
Post by: fishnfur on October 18, 2019, 11:11:17 PM
Post by: Tree Killer on October 19, 2019, 07:33:10 AM
Post by: slowhand on October 19, 2019, 08:58:37 PM
Story and pictures to come.
Success! I been on a drought for a few years.
So happy right now!
Post by: Birdguy on October 19, 2019, 10:16:59 PM
Post by: slowhand on October 20, 2019, 10:16:35 PM
Weather was torrential and cold.
I will write the story I promise. I just want to do it justice.
Here’s the pictures!
Post by: lokidog on October 21, 2019, 01:02:25 PM
Post by: Turner89 on October 21, 2019, 07:10:45 PM