Post by: Ridgeratt on December 21, 2019, 07:28:31 AM
Washington bass, walleye fishing limits liberalized in response to orca crisis
Washington bass, walleye fishing limits liberalized in response to orca crisis
UPDATED: Wed., Dec. 18, 2019
Limits on bass and walleye fishing - alongside other warm water species - were liberalized by the Washington Fish and Wildlife Commission, S
By Eli Francovich
elif@spokesman.com
(509) 459-5508
Limits on bass and walleye fishing – alongside other warmwater species – were liberalized by the Washington Fish and Wildlife Commission on Saturday.
The new rules, which will go into effect mid-February, remove size limits and daily limits on rivers and streams throughout the state. The rules also double the daily limits for most species on 77 lakes throughout Washington, said Steve Caromile, the Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife’s warmwater fish program manager.
The changes are in response to new legislation aimed at increasing chinook survival in hopes of helping struggling orca populations in the Puget Sound. Bass and walleye eat salmon smolts, although to what extent they impact the migrating fish is disputed.
Initially, WDFW officials proposed removing bag limits statewide, but the commission directed them to narrow their proposal.
The entire process has angered many bass and walleye anglers who prize the two non-native game fish species. Allowing anglers to keep the fish means there will be fewer large fish in Washington waterways, a blow to the catch-and-release ethic championed by many. Some anglers feel that a 2017 liberalization of bag limits for walleye and bass already fulfilled the Legislature’s mandate.
“We are disappointed in this result and this points out more strongly the need for us to move forward with legislation intended to protect and grow the warmwater fishery in Washington State for the positive social and economic future that it represents,” said Joel Nania, the former president of the Inland Empire Bass Club, in an email.
According to a WDFW presentation to the commission Saturday, 500 people supported liberalized bass and walleye limits. Those in favor were concerned that the non-native fish were killing salmon and hurting endangered native species, like orca. They also believed broadly that protecting native fish and wildlife is more important than protecting nonnative predators.
In all, 190 people opposed the liberalized limits. Those opposed questioned the science behind the change, pointed out the economic value of bass, walleye and other warmwater fisheries and believed that orca and salmon conservation efforts should focus on “bigger issues.”
Groups that called for liberalized rules for bass, walleye and other species praised the decision online.
“These species are tremendous predators of juvenile salmon and steelhead,” according to a statement from the Wild Steelhead Coalition on its Facebook page. “The Wild Steelhead Coalition has long advocated for such changes to protect threatened native salmonids.”
The commission also approved a proposal from commissioner Kim Thorburn to develop a non-native game fish policy.
“That will be a big piece of work for staff,” Thorburn said. “Most fishing policies are related to salmonids.”
For detailed rule information, see Alan Liere’s fishing-hunting report on Page 12 or visit the Fish and Wildlife Commission’s website at wdfw.wa.gov/about/commission.
https://www.spokesman.com/stories/2019/dec/16/washington-bass-walleye-fishing-limits-liberalized/
I can honestly say I have never witnessed an Orca in Roosevelt. I have however seen a few whales and walruses, usually around the boat launches and lounging on the beaches. But that's another thread. :sry:
Post by: snowshoes22 on December 21, 2019, 07:43:22 AM
Post by: bigskyhounds on December 21, 2019, 07:45:40 AM
Post by: Ridgeratt on December 21, 2019, 07:56:33 AM
.
Bunch of bs. Warm water fisheries take another hit. How about no more netting for commercial and natives?
The invasive turkey species will have an impact on any of the small bird populations they eat everything. Insects, small nesting birds.
Buddy from Oklahoma has watched the local nesting ducks disappear from the turkeys eating the little ducks. Could this have an impact on the local grouse populations around here. :dunno:
I really have a hard time with the wdfw when they do stuff like this to protect something no one can use as a resource. but yet our deer elk and moose never get the help they need. How can an agency have an all out assault on one non native species but turn a blind eye to others. They even have a bounty on a native species (northern pike minnow) just don't understand how they can pick and choose how they manage. Seems to me they just do whatever they want. Turkeys weren't native to Washington and I would guess they have to have a negative impact on some native species.
They bring more pressure on another fishery to support the idea they are working for the publics best interest.
Post by: Bullkllr on December 21, 2019, 08:04:47 AM
Further deplete the warm-water fisheries and ban plastic straws- that'll really fix the Orca situation :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
No one is willing or able to make the decisions that will matter. With what has happened the last 20 or so years and continued decisions like this, it is getting harder and harder to be optimistic about ANY fish or wildlife management in this state.
Post by: Bango skank on December 21, 2019, 08:09:46 AM
Post by: Axle on December 21, 2019, 08:14:23 AM
If they really are worried about salmon, they should work on killing off some sea lions.I totally agree. Along with the birds that eat salmon fry.
I have never been a fan of limits on bass in salmon waters though.
Post by: snake on December 21, 2019, 08:16:24 AM
2. kill the sea lions
3. regulate tribal
pretty easy solution on paper, but none of these will happen.
Post by: full choke on December 21, 2019, 09:14:04 AM
If they really are worried about salmon, they should work on killing off some sea lions.I totally agree. Along with the birds that eat salmon fry.
I have never been a fan of limits on bass in salmon waters though.
Seperate limit for mergansers from other waterfowl.
Put a bounty on cormorants.
Post by: E-10 on December 21, 2019, 12:04:31 PM
1. increase hatchery chinook production. (giving the orcas something to eat)
2. kill the sea lions
3. regulate tribal
pretty easy solution on paper, but none of these will happen.
Post by: ne kid on December 21, 2019, 12:26:43 PM
Post by: Ridgeratt on December 21, 2019, 01:49:21 PM
You’re on the right track. Don’t kill the sea lions, turn large barges in the ports and harbors in to large live-traps. Trap the sea lions, tow the barges out to where the orcas are and release them. Let nature do the rest. There won’t be as many sea lions to devistate the salmon and steelhead populations, the orcas get fat on sea lions, and we don’t have to rewrite any laws to make it legal to shoot select sea lions.1. increase hatchery chinook production. (giving the orcas something to eat)
2. kill the sea lions
3. regulate tribal
pretty easy solution on paper, but none of these will happen.
This should be a no-brainer they transport smolts down the river so they have the technology in place. Just need to supersize the side walls.
Watching the pair of them on the sailboat they could feed a few orcas with each one.
Post by: bassquatch on December 21, 2019, 07:20:34 PM
Probably do the same with every salmon and steelhead as well.
It will look like I'm just removing the hooks through WDFW binos though, eff these idiots. :mgun2:
Post by: bigtex on December 21, 2019, 07:32:39 PM
1. increase hatchery chinook production. (giving the orcas something to eat)Increasing hatchery chinook production is actually now being funded because of the orca issue.
2. kill the sea lions
3. regulate tribal
pretty easy solution on paper, but none of these will happen.
Post by: Bango skank on December 21, 2019, 07:36:33 PM
1. increase hatchery chinook production. (giving the orcas something to eat)Increasing hatchery chinook production is actually now being funded because of the orca issue.
2. kill the sea lions
3. regulate tribal
pretty easy solution on paper, but none of these will happen.
Alright, so on to step two when?
Post by: bassquatch on December 21, 2019, 08:34:46 PM
1. increase hatchery chinook production. (giving the orcas something to eat)Increasing hatchery chinook production is actually now being funded because of the orca issue.
2. kill the sea lions
3. regulate tribal
pretty easy solution on paper, but none of these will happen.
Alright, so on to step two when?
NEVER! These idiots don't give a rat's red ass about saving salmon! It's all about land grabs and generating revenue, always has been always will be!
The pikeminnow crap has accomplished nothing but wasted time and money, so shift focus to spiny rays to make their constituents feel warm and fuzzy inside.
Everything the WDFW does is nonsense, smoke and mirrors as far as I'm concerned. :puke:
Post by: E-10 on December 21, 2019, 09:15:40 PM
1. increase hatchery chinook production. (giving the orcas something to eat)Increasing hatchery chinook production is actually now being funded because of the orca issue.
2. kill the sea lions
3. regulate tribal
pretty easy solution on paper, but none of these will happen.
Post by: snake on December 22, 2019, 07:32:55 AM
I haven't heard about this but its a start and good news.1. increase hatchery chinook production. (giving the orcas something to eat)Increasing hatchery chinook production is actually now being funded because of the orca issue.
2. kill the sea lions
3. regulate tribal
pretty easy solution on paper, but none of these will happen.
Post by: Axle on December 22, 2019, 07:44:35 AM
Walleye: Change from eight- to a 16-fish daily limit; only one fish may be over 22 inches.
Smallmouth bass: Change from 10- to a 15-fish daily limit; only one fish may be over 14 inches.
Largemouth bass: Change from five- to a 10-fish daily limit; only one fish may be over 17 inches.
Then I don't see this affecting anything but walleye. There appears to be the same restrictions on the bigger bass unless they pull the plug on the 12" to 17" restriction for largemouth.
Most folks don't keep little bass anyway. Increasing the limit by 5 fish per day won't do anything to the numbers of bass; and therefore, it won't affect the numbers of salmon.
The real issue, as stated before, is the seals and certain birds.
There didn't seem to be an issue with salmon numbers before the seals started showing up in high numbers.
Again - I'm not for any bass regulations in salmon waters but I don't feel the bass are the main problem.
Post by: Taco280AI on December 22, 2019, 08:35:56 AM
Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on December 22, 2019, 09:33:08 AM
Are the tribes going after seals and sea lions? Killing a few thousand, for ceremonial and sustenance purposes, would certainly help.
Ill.donate rifles and ammo for the celebration.
Post by: snake on December 22, 2019, 11:35:04 AM
Post by: MtnMuley on December 22, 2019, 01:01:48 PM
Ocean conditions have been a factor in this as well. Ocean conditions have improved over the last 3 years, I would expect to see improved runs in the near future. When you mix seals, birds, tribal, commercial harvest, decreased hatchery production and poor ocean conditions you get a recipe for disaster. Don't forget it was only 5-7 years ago we had record numbers of returning chinook. I am hopeful for an improvement in the near future.
:yeah: Also, not to forget the "blob" back in 2014/15 warming the waters off much of the northern Pacific Coast.
Post by: castie2504 on December 24, 2019, 11:20:33 AM
1. increase hatchery chinook production. (giving the orcas something to eat)
2. kill the sea lions
3. regulate tribal
pretty easy solution on paper, but none of these will happen.
Increasing hatchery salmon is not a good idea. Hatchery salmon are destroying what little genetic diversity is left in truly wild fish. It’s dumbing the natural population down through our selfish actions. The best course of action, albeit unreasonable, is to remove the man made barriers that have decimated the population, kill the hatcheries and let Mother Nature heal itself.
Post by: snake on December 24, 2019, 01:51:32 PM
I don't even know where to start... I should probably put together a 30 minute powerpoint presentation or something.1. increase hatchery chinook production. (giving the orcas something to eat)
2. kill the sea lions
3. regulate tribal
pretty easy solution on paper, but none of these will happen.
Increasing hatchery salmon is not a good idea. Hatchery salmon are destroying what little genetic diversity is left in truly wild fish. It’s dumbing the natural population down through our selfish actions. The best course of action, albeit unreasonable, is to remove the man made barriers that have decimated the population, kill the hatcheries and let Mother Nature heal itself.
Post by: Bullkllr on December 24, 2019, 02:21:34 PM
:bdid: Best to just let it go. Only semi-kidding.I don't even know where to start... I should probably put together a 30 minute powerpoint presentation or something.1. increase hatchery chinook production. (giving the orcas something to eat)
2. kill the sea lions
3. regulate tribal
pretty easy solution on paper, but none of these will happen.
Increasing hatchery salmon is not a good idea. Hatchery salmon are destroying what little genetic diversity is left in truly wild fish. It’s dumbing the natural population down through our selfish actions. The best course of action, albeit unreasonable, is to remove the man made barriers that have decimated the population, kill the hatcheries and let Mother Nature heal itself.
Post by: MtnMuley on December 24, 2019, 09:00:15 PM
:chuckle::bdid: Best to just let it go. Only semi-kidding.I don't even know where to start... I should probably put together a 30 minute powerpoint presentation or something.1. increase hatchery chinook production. (giving the orcas something to eat)
2. kill the sea lions
3. regulate tribal
pretty easy solution on paper, but none of these will happen.
Increasing hatchery salmon is not a good idea. Hatchery salmon are destroying what little genetic diversity is left in truly wild fish. It’s dumbing the natural population down through our selfish actions. The best course of action, albeit unreasonable, is to remove the man made barriers that have decimated the population, kill the hatcheries and let Mother Nature heal itself.
Post by: BigGoonTuna on December 25, 2019, 06:30:13 AM
where WDFW is just making things worse, is taking fisheries that are actually productive and thriving - eastside bass and walleye, and taking them the same direction of salmon and steelhead in this state. pretty soon, all we'll have left to fish for is planter trout.
Post by: duckmen1 on December 25, 2019, 09:52:03 AM
seems pointless to plant more fish that just don't come back anyway. look at the cowlitz if you need proof of that.
where WDFW is just making things worse, is taking fisheries that are actually productive and thriving - eastside bass and walleye, and taking them the same direction of salmon and steelhead in this state. pretty soon, all we'll have left to fish for is planter trout.
Even stocker trout are seeing some cut backs and changes throughtout the recent years.
Post by: fishngamereaper on December 25, 2019, 09:57:59 AM
1. increase hatchery chinook production. (giving the orcas something to eat)
2. kill the sea lions
3. regulate tribal
pretty easy solution on paper, but none of these will happen.
Increasing hatchery salmon is not a good idea. Hatchery salmon are destroying what little genetic diversity is left in truly wild fish. It’s dumbing the natural population down through our selfish actions. The best course of action, albeit unreasonable, is to remove the man made barriers that have decimated the population, kill the hatcheries and let Mother Nature heal itself.
There aren't enough "wild " fish left to sustain most runs ..most "wild" fish are just unclipped hatchery fish..
Post by: HUNTIN4SIX on December 25, 2019, 12:09:20 PM
seems pointless to plant more fish that just don't come back anyway. look at the cowlitz if you need proof of that.
where WDFW is just making things worse, is taking fisheries that are actually productive and thriving - eastside bass and walleye, and taking them the same direction of salmon and steelhead in this state. pretty soon, all we'll have left to fish for is planter trout.
Yes just look at Cowlitz......they have decreased production in the last 15 years, wdfw is playing the game with Tacoma power who does not want hatchery fish. Now we have very low returns
Post by: HUNTIN4SIX on December 25, 2019, 12:24:36 PM
1. increase hatchery chinook production. (giving the orcas something to eat)
2. kill the sea lions
3. regulate tribal
pretty easy solution on paper, but none of these will happen.
Increasing hatchery salmon is not a good idea. Hatchery salmon are destroying what little genetic diversity is left in truly wild fish. It’s dumbing the natural population down through our selfish actions. The best course of action, albeit unreasonable, is to remove the man made barriers that have decimated the population, kill the hatcheries and let Mother Nature heal itself.
I hope your just being funny? This exact thinking is why we are in this situation with low returns and orca problems. Ever wonder where hatchery fish came from? LOL!
Best returns came from the 70's And 80's when hatchery production was at it's peak. That was before very smart educated liberal people got involved. Hatcheries have been around long before all these problems. It's a shame terrible dams and humans messed up the liberal utopia of nature.
Since you are a geneticist enlighten be on the difference in genetics of wild vs hatchery fish. I promise not to bring up stray rates either.
Post by: ctwiggs1 on December 25, 2019, 01:31:03 PM
seems pointless to plant more fish that just don't come back anyway. look at the cowlitz if you need proof of that.
where WDFW is just making things worse, is taking fisheries that are actually productive and thriving - eastside bass and walleye, and taking them the same direction of salmon and steelhead in this state. pretty soon, all we'll have left to fish for is planter trout.
Even stocker trout are seeing some cut backs and changes throughtout the recent years.
That’s great news! I could live a good life if I never have to eat dog food trout again.
Post by: castie2504 on December 25, 2019, 07:02:02 PM
1. increase hatchery chinook production. (giving the orcas something to eat)
2. kill the sea lions
3. regulate tribal
pretty easy solution on paper, but none of these will happen.
Increasing hatchery salmon is not a good idea. Hatchery salmon are destroying what little genetic diversity is left in truly wild fish. It’s dumbing the natural population down through our selfish actions. The best course of action, albeit unreasonable, is to remove the man made barriers that have decimated the population, kill the hatcheries and let Mother Nature heal itself.
I hope your just being funny? This exact thinking is why we are in this situation with low returns and orca problems. Ever wonder where hatchery fish came from? LOL!
Best returns came from the 70's And 80's when hatchery production was at it's peak. That was before very smart educated liberal people got involved. Hatcheries have been around long before all these problems. It's a shame terrible dams and humans messed up the liberal utopia of nature.
Since you are a geneticist enlighten be on the difference in genetics of wild vs hatchery fish. I promise not to bring up stray rates either.
The low numbers are a man made problem, no? Before our predecessors let greed destroy the runs they were incredible. What we have now is remnants of this. Why were hatcheries started anyway? To produce and replace fish because nature could no longer keep up with the stress humans placed upon them. The genetics part is easy. Hatcheries are built to maximize production where the survival rate is super inflated. The fish are raised unnaturally in pens, even those that otherwise would not have made it. It’s no longer survival of the fittest. Even those fish who are genetically inferior are reproducing now I’m hatcheries. Only the best genetics made it to reproduce (before hatcheries) hence keeping strong, healthy fish. Being raised in pens does not allow natural selection to occur how it should and altering genetic diversity. I for one, would love to see the natural runs return, if there are any left. But I am afraid that we’ve muddied the water too much and it will never happen in my lifetime. The salmon population problem is a very complicated issue with no simple solution. There are pros and cons, arguments for and against every idea or thought. The one thing I think we can agree on is this: it is a damn travesty what has occurred to this once seemingly endless supply of salmon.
Post by: Bullkllr on December 25, 2019, 07:18:31 PM
Post by: Taco280AI on December 25, 2019, 09:02:05 PM
Post by: lokidog on December 28, 2019, 09:48:19 PM
Ocean conditions have been a factor in this as well. Ocean conditions have improved over the last 3 years, I would expect to see improved runs in the near future. When you mix seals, birds, tribal, commercial harvest, decreased hatchery production and poor ocean conditions you get a recipe for disaster. Don't forget it was only 5-7 years ago we had record numbers of returning chinook. I am hopeful for an improvement in the near future.
:yeah: Also, not to forget the "blob" back in 2014/15 warming the waters off much of the northern Pacific Coast.
Unfortunately, it looks like the Blob is back.
Water temperatures were warmer during all of our smolt sampling in the San Juans last summer and catch rates were down.
Post by: lokidog on December 28, 2019, 09:53:00 PM
1. increase hatchery chinook production. (giving the orcas something to eat)
2. kill the sea lions
3. regulate tribal
pretty easy solution on paper, but none of these will happen.
Increasing hatchery salmon is not a good idea. Hatchery salmon are destroying what little genetic diversity is left in truly wild fish. It’s dumbing the natural population down through our selfish actions. The best course of action, albeit unreasonable, is to remove the man made barriers that have decimated the population, kill the hatcheries and let Mother Nature heal itself.
I hope your just being funny? This exact thinking is why we are in this situation with low returns and orca problems. Ever wonder where hatchery fish came from? LOL!
Best returns came from the 70's And 80's when hatchery production was at it's peak. That was before very smart educated liberal people got involved. Hatcheries have been around long before all these problems. It's a shame terrible dams and humans messed up the liberal utopia of nature.
Since you are a geneticist enlighten be on the difference in genetics of wild vs hatchery fish. I promise not to bring up stray rates either.
The low numbers are a man made problem, no? Before our predecessors let greed destroy the runs they were incredible. What we have now is remnants of this. Why were hatcheries started anyway? To produce and replace fish because nature could no longer keep up with the stress humans placed upon them. The genetics part is easy. Hatcheries are built to maximize production where the survival rate is super inflated. The fish are raised unnaturally in pens, even those that otherwise would not have made it. It’s no longer survival of the fittest. Even those fish who are genetically inferior are reproducing now I’m hatcheries. Only the best genetics made it to reproduce (before hatcheries) hence keeping strong, healthy fish. Being raised in pens does not allow natural selection to occur how it should and altering genetic diversity. I for one, would love to see the natural runs return, if there are any left. But I am afraid that we’ve muddied the water too much and it will never happen in my lifetime. The salmon population problem is a very complicated issue with no simple solution. There are pros and cons, arguments for and against every idea or thought. The one thing I think we can agree on is this: it is a damn travesty what has occurred to this once seemingly endless supply of salmon.
If a fish, hatchery or wild, makes it back to the hatchery these days, I would suggest that it is, indeed, fit. Sure, some "unfit" fish might survive to be released into the river system, but they have a huge gamut of adversity to concur once they leave the hatcheries, the same adversity a wild fish would have. My only beef with hatcheries is that they should take a smaller amount of eggs/milt from a larger number of fish so there is indeed more genetic diversity.
Post by: plugger on December 30, 2019, 05:10:56 AM
Post by: Camo on December 30, 2019, 07:31:50 PM
I can only hope the guides are not stupid enough to let there clients keep 16 walleye each.
Unfortunately they already do on the lower Columbia and Lk. Roosevelt where the limits previously increased or were completely eliminated.
Post by: plugger on December 31, 2019, 05:26:31 AM
Post by: Angry Perch on December 31, 2019, 11:21:37 AM
Ya I know they do. There are a few that put restrictions for there boats, but not many. The river, due to the size can handle it better than say, moses lake though. Just not enough water or enough cover for the walleye in there. If the local guides pound on those fish day after day taking that many fish out of there, they will be cutting there own throat.
Yep. The right time of year on Moses Lake when the fish are stacked up, they could sure put a dent in the population.
Post by: Camo on December 31, 2019, 04:49:13 PM
Post by: Ironhead on December 31, 2019, 05:01:38 PM
Post by: bigskyhounds on December 31, 2019, 05:16:17 PM
How about they raise the limit on Lions and Wolves and give us an OTC spring Bear hunt. If it works for Salmon and Whales the same thought process should work for predators and Big Game, no? WDFW is going downhill fast.
If only you could convince them that harvesting more bears, raising lion quotas, and opening a season for wolves would increase salmon runs. If you could do that then we might get somewhere.
Post by: Ironhead on December 31, 2019, 05:20:09 PM
It would definitely cut down on the predation of Salmon. Every one Knows Cats and Bears love Fish. I read on the internet that Wolves love Chinook too. :)How about they raise the limit on Lions and Wolves and give us an OTC spring Bear hunt. If it works for Salmon and Whales the same thought process should work for predators and Big Game, no? WDFW is going downhill fast.
If only you could convince them that harvesting more bears, raising lion quotas, and opening a season for wolves would increase salmon runs. If you could do that then we might get somewhere.
Post by: 3cityhuntr on January 02, 2020, 10:44:07 AM
https://wdfw.wa.gov/sites/default/files/2019-12/option_b2_wacs_all.pdf
Post by: Angry Perch on January 02, 2020, 01:04:11 PM
So I don’t know if you all have actually looked into the 77 lakes that they liberalized limits on warmwater species. It’s called option B2 and really doesn’t include any of the good walleye fishing lakes (banks, Roosevelt, potholes, scooteney, etc.). So nothing to be concerned about at this point. Not to say they won’t make a run at statewide again at some point.....
https://wdfw.wa.gov/sites/default/files/2019-12/option_b2_wacs_all.pdf
Except the Columbia River.
Post by: lokidog on January 02, 2020, 06:19:41 PM
Post by: JimmyHoffa on January 02, 2020, 06:40:07 PM
Post by: Hilltop123 on January 02, 2020, 06:44:30 PM
So, I'm curious... and a little note.... The note, I prefer eating bass and walleye over any trout caught in a lake besides Browns and Arctic Char. I also think it is stupid for this state to poison self-reproducing spiny rays out of lakes just to plant mushy, muddy, rainbow trout. Now, having said that, why is reducing a predator of salmon, that is not native here anyways, a bad thing?
my guess: it will degrade the quantity and quality of the bass/walleye fishing and not lead to any effect on salmon. So, two fisheries managed to the toilet.
Yup and we all sit around and cook the Talapia we bought at Safeway. :twocents:
Post by: Camo on January 02, 2020, 09:11:29 PM
So I don’t know if you all have actually looked into the 77 lakes that they liberalized limits on warmwater species. It’s called option B2 and really doesn’t include any of the good walleye fishing lakes (banks, Roosevelt, potholes, scooteney, etc.). So nothing to be concerned about at this point. Not to say they won’t make a run at statewide again at some point.....
https://wdfw.wa.gov/sites/default/files/2019-12/option_b2_wacs_all.pdf
Good call, admittedly I interpreted option B2 as the "new" statewide rules as part of the simplification process.
Thanks for the clarification.
Post by: Bango skank on January 02, 2020, 09:14:40 PM
So, I'm curious... and a little note.... The note, I prefer eating bass and walleye over any trout caught in a lake besides Browns and Arctic Char. I also think it is stupid for this state to poison self-reproducing spiny rays out of lakes just to plant mushy, muddy, rainbow trout. Now, having said that, why is reducing a predator of salmon, that is not native here anyways, a bad thing?my guess: it will degrade the quantity and quality of the bass/walleye fishing and not lead to any effect on salmon. So, two fisheries managed to the toilet.
Yup and we all sit around and cook the Talapia we bought at Safeway. :twocents:
You dont actually eat tilapia do you??? :puke:
Post by: DOUBLELUNG on January 03, 2020, 02:32:17 PM
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/09/080901205633.htm
Post by: full choke on January 03, 2020, 02:46:54 PM
"
Post by: Bango skank on January 03, 2020, 02:59:18 PM
I'll just leave this right here ... :chuckle:
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/09/080901205633.htm
Lets see, how would an anti hunting moron spin this... i know. "We have to stop recreational salmon fishing to protect the resource for the endangered coastal wolf."
Post by: lokidog on January 03, 2020, 05:33:34 PM
You dont actually eat tilapia do you??? :puke:
I used to fish for "wild" Tilapia in the irrigation canals in Southern CA. They were delicious, they tasted like Bluegills.
Post by: bassquatch on February 23, 2020, 10:26:12 AM
Those rat *censored*s!...
"
Looks like we need to "liberalize" the limits on bears, wolves, orcas, trout, eagles, anglers, indians, commecial fishing, natural disasters as well as warm water species and anything else that's ever killed a fricking salmon for that matter?!! Rip down all dams immediately!! C'mon people this is a CRISIS!! Kill everything but salmon!!!!!! Spread COVID19 to everyone with a fishing pole or net! Salmon must inherit the planet!! Do whatever is necessary to help the little salmon survive! :puke:
Post by: bassquatch on February 23, 2020, 11:54:23 AM
From now on every smolt eating TROUT I catch gets its gills cut! Some I'll eat, the rest will sink.
Probably do the same with every salmon and steelhead as well.
It will look like I'm just removing the hooks through WDFW binos though, eff these idiots. :mgun2:
Because I was asked about this comment privately, here is my public reply:
I appreciate you sharing your stories. Yes, I am extremely frustrated, disappointed and irritated by an attack on these fish because there is literally no point to it and it's just a feel good measure.
That comment was simply intended to show a ridiculous reaction to a equally ridiculous action. As were my comments today. The absurdity of going after warm water species is equally as absurd as believing it will have any positive effect.
95% of bass anglers do not retain bass and will not retain bass regardless of this, or any initiative. The few people that do consume bass will continue to do so and the people that poach all species will continue to do so. WDFW's enforcement level in this State has always been understaffed and honestly dismal to the point of redundancy during my lifetime.
If anyone TRULY wants to save salmon then the major issues regarding commercial and tribal harvest levels need to be the primary focus! Beyond that, seals, sea lions, eagles, cormorants etc...but delisting warm water species won't result in protests and news stories about the protests, so it's the path of least resistance as well as the path of least effectiveness.
Since I already know our words fall on deaf ears when it comes to the WDFW, I opt to make equally ridiculous statements to match the absolute ridiculous policies and be on my way.
Hope that clarifies. Thx.
Post by: plugger on February 25, 2020, 05:26:23 AM
Post by: Stein on February 25, 2020, 09:11:29 AM
I fully agree it isn't in the top 3 list of problems facing salmon, but it is on the list. There isn't a magic button because even if we killed all the seals and birds there is still the problem of the blob and general ocean conditions as well as stuff like drought, dams, bedding grounds, poaching, and a hundred other things.
In my opinion, we should make progress wherever we can. It's a small step, but a step. I have no problems with WDFW trying things knowing they won't all work as expected. This is something they can do that doesn't cost a ton of money, require a decade or two of studies.
That said, we should absolutely be pursuing the other fixes as well. As sportsmen, we should be much better organized and funded to provide some hp to the fight.
Post by: bassquatch on February 26, 2020, 08:58:05 PM
The money saved not planting trout annually could go towards habitat restoration or towards payouts for the pike minnow program (that hasn't eliminated pike minnow) Spiny rays aren't the only carnivorous fish species sharing the water with the defenseless salmon smolts. :twocents:
Post by: ctwiggs1 on February 26, 2020, 09:00:46 PM
Post by: Panic Minnow on February 27, 2020, 12:21:23 PM
Appreciate it and not trying to argue but EVERY species of TROUT eat small fish as well, including salmon smolts. For the survival of the salmon species, should the WDFW stop planting trout in all of the 77 lakes listed? Should all trout limits be lifted? Should trout be eradicated from the rivers and streams also? :dunno: Just because trout are "native" to these waters doesn't discount their negative impact on salmon smolts.
The money saved not planting trout annually could go towards habitat restoration or towards payouts for the pike minnow program (that hasn't eliminated pike minnow) Spiny rays aren't the only carnivorous fish species sharing the water with the defenseless salmon smolts. :twocents:
Great idea! But what would I be able to use to fertilize my garden then if it weren't for the incidental hatchery trout catches.....JK
Post by: Stein on February 27, 2020, 01:10:45 PM
I doubt rainbow trout are truly native in most of those waters either.
:yeah:
Rainbows are only native to a tiny fraction of WA waters. They have been around in mass for so long we tend to think of them as native as opposed to an man-made invasive species. :peep:
Post by: GoldenRing270 on February 27, 2020, 04:42:02 PM
yellow perch, bluegill, bass, crappie and other spiny rays were introduced by the US government to Washington lakes as early as 1890's... decades before rainbows were introduced.
Post by: Katmai Guy on February 27, 2020, 05:19:02 PM
Post by: GoldenRing270 on February 27, 2020, 05:24:17 PM
Post by: JimmyHoffa on February 27, 2020, 05:25:19 PM
Post by: Stein on February 27, 2020, 07:31:19 PM
You're incorrect, the rainbow has been around for 40-50,000 yrs. You might be thinking of the Brook trout, they were planted in just about every piece of stillwater in western WA.
It’s been on existence, just not on many WA lakes and rivers. WA plants the original species native to the few places, but puts them everywhere.
It’s the same story everywhere in the country. I bet 80-90% of the places that have them were introduced by man.
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