Post by: James on February 01, 2021, 02:17:08 PM
It will be mostly used for elk hunting on the Olympic Peninsula during modern firearm season, but maybe get some use in Montana in Oct - November.
Been reading the big wall tent thread, but my big question is material. Waxed cotton/canvas just seems like a bad idea in the rain forest. Being waterproof enough, keeping it waterproof, getting it dry after somehow, and making sure it doesn’t rot in the offseason, etc.
It seems to me there should be some better materials by now.
So what do my rainforest friends have to say? Best wall tent material for constant downpours? Any other pro tips?
Post by: nwmein199 on February 01, 2021, 02:21:35 PM
Post by: birddogdad on February 01, 2021, 02:22:15 PM
A big ass tarp over your canvas wall tent. my tent is 25 years old and the material you are talking about above.. used 100% in PNW weather with a big ass tarp cover.. works just fine.. The trick is drying out before long term storage...
:yeah:
Post by: Stein on February 01, 2021, 02:26:16 PM
In addition to while you are in it, think about cleaning and storing it, canvas can be a huge PIA to clean and dry out to make sure mold doesn't grow. Synthetic dries quickly, brush big chunks off, roll and store, mold pretty much never happens.
Post by: vandeman17 on February 01, 2021, 02:55:17 PM
Post by: Buzz2401 on February 01, 2021, 03:15:13 PM
Post by: jackelope on February 01, 2021, 03:19:16 PM
:dunno:
Post by: birddogdad on February 01, 2021, 03:21:41 PM
We have three canvas wall tents ranging from 25+ years old to 3 years old. Not one of them have ever had a tarp on them or any kind of treatment and they dont leak. They get put up for 4-5 weeks every year typically from mid october through second weekend in November. Keep people from touching the roof while its raining and they wont leak.
i run a plastic tarp over as it really helps to shed snow.. also an exta layer of insulation keeps the metal frame and roof from snow condensation a lot better...not that the roof has ever leaked..
Post by: JimmyHoffa on February 01, 2021, 03:29:39 PM
Post by: James on February 01, 2021, 04:05:16 PM
It's usually 3-5 of us and our current shelter is 10x20 with a giant tarp.
So on the material front, I see the utility of having a cheap rainfly both for another layer and to protect from embers from when it's not raining.
What I am struggling with is the mainatince of cotton and the fact it just seems like an inferior material.
Our current tarp we can get it less wet hanging it in mine or my buddies shop after and pack it away damp without issue. I am pretty sure cotton would rot before it drys out (prob sometime late spring).
Honestly if it was thicker, had better tear and UV resistance our current tarp seems like a better plan.
There has to be better options than cotton out there right? Any wall tent manufacturers making something that is easy to deal with?
Post by: TheStovePipeKid on February 01, 2021, 04:24:06 PM
Post by: trophyhunt on February 01, 2021, 04:28:26 PM
Post by: Stein on February 01, 2021, 05:36:40 PM
the reel lite material like what the alakanak is made of, is very nice, you can put it away wet if you had no choice and it will be fine. Canvas is a pain in the butt to get dry to put away for the season, if you have a big barn or garage, you can hang it up and it will be fine. But I've had both, and the alaknak is just way easier to set up and put away. With a good stove, the heat will feel the same as if you had canvas.
:yeah: It's basically the same argument as trying to say that cotton hunting clothes are better than synthetics if you want to stay warm and dry.
Post by: Magnum_Willys on February 01, 2021, 05:52:46 PM
Post by: ghosthunter on February 01, 2021, 06:02:23 PM
But you seem to want something different with little effort to maintain.
If that’s what you want look at a Costco canopy. Put a stove jack in it. 10x 20.
Material is easy to maintain. If the sides don’t hit ground cut the legs off a little.we have used one for years has cook shack. You might ha e $500.00 bucks in it plus a stove.
Or
Get your self a large pvc tarp ,like the cover hay with and keep doing what you are doing now.
Post by: Special T on February 01, 2021, 06:13:20 PM
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Post by: ghosthunter on February 01, 2021, 06:38:03 PM
Do folks not treat thier canvas with a linseed oil and Bewswax treatment? Ive seen a few differend home made recipies and have made my own tin pants as a result. Totally waterproof and resist snagging and tearing.
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I don’t know.
I can tell you I am five years down the road with my #1 tent which is 10 oz canvas and never had it leak. I do use a fly to keep it clean of pitch, but I set it up in the yard and hose off with a garden hose every spring and it repels water like the day I bought it.
I just don’t understand why folks think they need to re-treat canvas every few years.
UV is very damaging. So the fly helps with that too. But honestly I think some folks really over think it.
Post by: bigsads on February 01, 2021, 06:41:14 PM
Post by: trophyhunt on February 01, 2021, 07:50:47 PM
Post by: 2MANY on February 01, 2021, 08:28:19 PM
Post by: James on February 01, 2021, 09:08:47 PM
Well I am in the canvas tent rain fly club.
But you seem to want something different with little effort to maintain.
If that’s what you want look at a Costco canopy. Put a stove jack in it. 10x 20.
Material is easy to maintain. If the sides don’t hit ground cut the legs off a little.we have used one for years has cook shack. You might ha e $500.00 bucks in it plus a stove.
Or
Get your self a large pvc tarp ,like the cover hay with and keep doing what you are doing now.
Funny you mention that, a costco car canopy with a big tarp and stove is what we have been using for years. Couple reasons we have been wanting to step up to a real wall tent. One is snow load for Montana hunts, but we don't want to have rainforest problems with the new setup that we spend a bunch of money on.
If you tarp try to keep open air separation between the top of tent and tarp or it will condensate in wet conditions.
I don't know if you are familiar with Buzzacot, but at elk camp we quite enjoy reading passages from his fantastic work.
He is very big on this principal and had drawings of his tent designs that separate the rainfly from the tent.
https://www.amazon.com/Buzzacotts-Masterpiece-Complete-Trappers-Information/dp/0342396056/ref=tmm_hrd_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=&sr=
the reel lite material like what the alakanak is made of, is very nice, you can put it away wet if you had no choice and it will be fine. Canvas is a pain in the butt to get dry to put away for the season, if you have a big barn or garage, you can hang it up and it will be fine. But I've had both, and the alaknak is just way easier to set up and put away. With a good stove, the heat will feel the same as if you had canvas.
Do you know of any wall tent manufactures that offer this material (or something similar) as an option? I think a traditional style wall tent would suit us better.
Post by: Stein on February 01, 2021, 09:32:10 PM
https://www.hunttalk.com/threads/who-makes-a-synthetic-material-wall-tent.261665/
Post by: trophyhunt on February 02, 2021, 05:25:18 AM
Post by: 2MANY on February 02, 2021, 07:04:16 AM
Post by: gutsnthegrass on February 02, 2021, 08:33:22 AM
Post by: James on February 02, 2021, 03:23:41 PM
Maybe check this thread, it's a few years old but might have some good info.
https://www.hunttalk.com/threads/who-makes-a-synthetic-material-wall-tent.261665/
Interesting in that thread a couple of posters are saying the relite material isn't as waterproof as they want.
Post by: whacker1 on February 02, 2021, 05:23:21 PM
Post by: 2MANY on February 02, 2021, 05:27:47 PM
Post by: trophyhunt on February 02, 2021, 05:48:30 PM
I wonder if they mistaken condensation for a leak? But, we put a tarp over it and never had a leak.Maybe check this thread, it's a few years old but might have some good info.
https://www.hunttalk.com/threads/who-makes-a-synthetic-material-wall-tent.261665/
Interesting in that thread a couple of posters are saying the relite material isn't as waterproof as they want.
Post by: Axle on February 02, 2021, 05:54:54 PM
Don't put it away wet.
Post by: ghosthunter on February 02, 2021, 07:58:51 PM
Well I am in the canvas tent rain fly club.
But you seem to want something different with little effort to maintain.
If that’s what you want look at a Costco canopy. Put a stove jack in it. 10x 20.
Material is easy to maintain. If the sides don’t hit ground cut the legs off a little.we have used one for years has cook shack. You might ha e $500.00 bucks in it plus a stove.
Or
Get your self a large pvc tarp ,like the cover hay with and keep doing what you are doing now.
Funny you mention that, a costco car canopy with a big tarp and stove is what we have been using for years. Couple reasons we have been wanting to step up to a real wall tent. One is snow load for Montana hunts, but we don't want to have rainforest problems with the new setup that we spend a bunch of money on.If you tarp try to keep open air separation between the top of tent and tarp or it will condensate in wet conditions.
I don't know if you are familiar with Buzzacot, but at elk camp we quite enjoy reading passages from his fantastic work.
He is very big on this principal and had drawings of his tent designs that separate the rainfly from the tent.
https://www.amazon.com/Buzzacotts-Masterpiece-Complete-Trappers-Information/dp/0342396056/ref=tmm_hrd_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=&sr=the reel lite material like what the alakanak is made of, is very nice, you can put it away wet if you had no choice and it will be fine. Canvas is a pain in the butt to get dry to put away for the season, if you have a big barn or garage, you can hang it up and it will be fine. But I've had both, and the alaknak is just way easier to set up and put away. With a good stove, the heat will feel the same as if you had canvas.
Do you know of any wall tent manufactures that offer this material (or something similar) as an option? I think a traditional style wall tent would suit us better.
I generally use a fly made from a white regular tarp. But when it really snows, clear plastic is hard to beat. The tarp has fiber that catches snow, clear plastic does not and it slides right off.
Post by: James on February 03, 2021, 11:45:53 AM
i know several outfitters that use the fiber reinforced poly construction sheeting. Mtncook taught me that trick several years ago. clear, so the light comes through and water proof tarp. using golf ball in the corner pulled tight over the 20 ft wide by whatever length you can find.
For the rainfly or the actual primary wall tent material?
I wonder if they mistaken condensation for a leak? But, we put a tarp over it and never had a leak.
Good question.
Maybe another good question:
Are their still any outfitters that do drop camps and such on the Olympic Peninsula? If so what do they use?
Maybe an better question is what do outfitters in SE Alaska and Vancouver island use?
Post by: trophyhunt on February 03, 2021, 12:20:46 PM
Post by: trophyhunt on February 03, 2021, 12:22:31 PM
Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on February 03, 2021, 12:46:16 PM
I was thinking if a person built a wall tent with reel lite roof and canvas walls/doors you would have a great tent that breaths and with great roof?
Post by: gutsnthegrass on February 03, 2021, 01:43:05 PM
As stated both setups will and need the tarp over the tent. The tarp protects from the sun, insulates to keep warmer and remove snow build up. Canvas material breaths which keeps tent drier and more comfortable. Reel lite doesn't breath so well.
I was thinking if a person built a wall tent with reel lite roof and canvas walls/doors you would have a great tent that breaths and with great roof?
I will add that when I fired up the propane stove in the Alakanak to heat meals, the condensation inside was very noticeable, even with the wood stove going.
Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on February 03, 2021, 01:53:23 PM
As stated both setups will and need the tarp over the tent. The tarp protects from the sun, insulates to keep warmer and remove snow build up. Canvas material breaths which keeps tent drier and more comfortable. Reel lite doesn't breath so well.
I was thinking if a person built a wall tent with reel lite roof and canvas walls/doors you would have a great tent that breaths and with great roof?
I will add that when I fired up the propane stove in the Alakanak to heat meals, the condensation inside was very noticeable, even with the wood stove going.
Good point with the propane heater operating and condensation forming. We have strictly operated two propane heaters in our canvas wall tent with zero condensation with lots of wet hunting clothes drying out. It definitely has to do with breathability of the canvas. Pros and cons to everything I guess. :dunno:
Post by: James on February 03, 2021, 04:51:48 PM
If I bring back a canvas wall tent from elk hunting in November then hang it up in my shop, I can’t imagine it drying before it starts to grow mildew. From hanging up large wet items in there before I am guessing it would be solidly into spring time before it would get dry enough to pack away.
Post by: ghosthunter on February 03, 2021, 05:08:57 PM
As stated both setups will and need the tarp over the tent. The tarp protects from the sun, insulates to keep warmer and remove snow build up. Canvas material breaths which keeps tent drier and more comfortable. Reel lite doesn't breath so well.
I was thinking if a person built a wall tent with reel lite roof and canvas walls/doors you would have a great tent that breaths and with great roof?
I will add that when I fired up the propane stove in the Alakanak to heat meals, the condensation inside was very noticeable, even with the wood stove going.
Condensation can be handled with sufficient air movement. We never had condensation in our Costco cook shack because it’s not air tight. I also have never had condensation in a canvas wall tent in part because I never cook in it and always have cross ventilation. Keep a window crackled on either side. This year I have added a stove fan.
I had a tent with canvas top and relite sides. It was easy to maintain and I didn’t worry so much about mud splashing up on it as I do with the white canvas.
But let’s face it their are a lot of tenting personalities out there. We have seen several on this thread. There’s guys who want as little work as possible ,they want to get there put up camp,hunt, take it down and forget about it. Nothing wrong with that.
I am one who thinks about my wall tents a little every day. Planning , outfitting them, Messing in my head with them. For me the wall tent and set up is as enjoyable as the hunting.
Post by: ghosthunter on February 03, 2021, 05:18:58 PM
Yes, waterproofness is part of it, but the other is maintenance.
If I bring back a canvas wall tent from elk hunting in November then hang it up in my shop, I can’t imagine it drying before it starts to grow mildew. From hanging up large wet items in there before I am guessing it would be solidly into spring time before it would get dry enough to pack away.
I bring mine home in October. I have a walk in attic in my garage. I spread them out suspended about three feet off the floor and turn on a small electric space heater. Every week for a month I move them around a little.
At about 2 Nd week of December I check them real well. Than stuff in 55 gal drums.
No mildew yet.
Post by: ghosthunter on February 03, 2021, 05:24:24 PM
If ya want slam bam thank ya mamm, a canvas wall tent may not be for you. If that’s the case the Costco carport is a better option or a RV.
No question that White Canvas Wall tents are a little more work. :twocents: :twocents:
Post by: Magnum_Willys on February 03, 2021, 06:29:32 PM
Yes, waterproofness is part of it, but the other is maintenance.
If I bring back a canvas wall tent from elk hunting in November then hang it up in my shop, I can’t imagine it drying before it starts to grow mildew. From hanging up large wet items in there before I am guessing it would be solidly into spring time before it would get dry enough to pack away.
You need to add heat. In heated shop I hang two 12 x 16s and will dry in 3-5 days depending on if I pressure washed em or not.
Post by: trophyhunt on February 03, 2021, 07:22:15 PM
Post by: Magnum_Willys on February 03, 2021, 07:29:53 PM
Post by: jeffro on February 03, 2021, 08:28:06 PM
4-6 sheets of plywood for the floor 8x16 or 12x16
20 gallon ish barrel stove, homemade
And a box or 2 of screws 6”
Cordless screw guns
Framing material, “pecker poles” from sites or you can by a frame
Never got wet or cold
Pulled all man made materials and deposited in job site dumpster if unreusable
One camp lasted 2 seasons up past Spada lake
Post by: ipkus on February 03, 2021, 09:12:06 PM
Yes, waterproofness is part of it, but the other is maintenance.
If I bring back a canvas wall tent from elk hunting in November then hang it up in my shop, I can’t imagine it drying before it starts to grow mildew. From hanging up large wet items in there before I am guessing it would be solidly into spring time before it would get dry enough to pack away.
Don’t just hang it then; set it up and run one 5 gallon bottle of propane through a double burner Mr Heater inside of it. Bone dry, fold it and put it away.
Post by: Buzz2401 on February 03, 2021, 09:13:45 PM
Post by: kentrek on February 03, 2021, 09:32:56 PM
Yes, waterproofness is part of it, but the other is maintenance.
If I bring back a canvas wall tent from elk hunting in November then hang it up in my shop, I can’t imagine it drying before it starts to grow mildew. From hanging up large wet items in there before I am guessing it would be solidly into spring time before it would get dry enough to pack away.
Don’t just hang it then; set it up and run one 5 gallon bottle of propane through a double burner Mr Heater inside of it. Bone dry, fold it and put it away.
We tarp our canvas but have zero problem drying it before putting it away...two small heaters for a few days
Zero mill dew
My favorite late has been the Arctic oven tent...expensive but the comfort is worth it...coupled with the propane stove and its honestly better then a hotel
Post by: Shawn Ryan on February 04, 2021, 03:34:25 PM
Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on February 05, 2021, 09:24:04 PM
If you choose canvas, know there are different types of canvas: https://www.bravotents.com/quality-canvas/.
Good reminder of quality and value! Pay once cry once and move on with the next expedition! :IBCOOL:
Post by: ghosthunter on February 05, 2021, 11:02:24 PM
The guys in the Cabelas tents all felt the need for a rain fly tarp. But it was difficult to put over those tents. Both those guys finally went to trailers.
Post by: Moose Master on February 17, 2021, 08:34:54 PM
The question is I plan on spraying it with Thompson original. Does the Thompson discolor the canvas and how long for the drying of the Thompson? Thanks for any comments.
Post by: ghosthunter on February 17, 2021, 09:34:46 PM
Your tent should still be water proof. Unless sun has damaged it.
I would hose it down with a garden hose. If the water runs off still repels water.
Dirty spots maybe I would use dawn dish soap.
I would call the manufacture and ask them before I would use Thompson’s on it.
Seems like I read that Thompson’s flakes off. Never used it.
Proceed with caution.
Can You waterproof canvas wall tent?
If you feel that you need to retreat your canvas wall tent for waterproofing, there are right ways and wrong ways to approach it. You should purchase a product made specifically for this purpose, such as Canvak. People have used other products in the past, such as Thompsons Water Seal or other types of wood sealants.
https://www.davistent.com/product/waterproofing/
Post by: Moose Master on February 18, 2021, 08:18:14 AM