Post by: Practical Approach on January 24, 2022, 01:11:00 PM
https://www.governor.wa.gov/boards-commissions/board-and-commissions/profile/Fish%20and%20Wildlife%20Commission
Post by: WAcoyotehunter on January 24, 2022, 01:14:59 PM
Post by: bearpaw on January 24, 2022, 01:15:47 PM
Timothy Ragen 01/24/2022 12/31/2024 Western Washington
John Lehmkuhl 01/24/2022 12/31/2026 Eastern Washington
Melanie Rowland 01/24/2022 12/31/2026 At -Large Washington
Post by: Practical Approach on January 24, 2022, 01:20:27 PM
Post by: bowhunterty on January 24, 2022, 01:21:42 PM
Contact:
Sophia Ressler, (206) 399-4004, sressler@biologicaldiversity.org
Gov. Inslee Makes Three New Appointments to Washington Fish and Wildlife Commission
OLYMPIA, Wash.— Gov. Jay Inslee appointed three new members to the Washington Fish and Wildlife Commission today. These new commissioners — Tim Ragen, John Lehmkhul and Melanie Rowland — will complete the nine-member body that makes decisions regarding management of the state’s fish, wildlife and other resources.
One of the appointments fills an empty commission seat left after Fred Koontz resigned in December. The other appointments fill one available seat and one expired position open for over a year.
“We applaud Gov. Inslee for appointing commissioners with science and environmental policy backgrounds,” said Sophia Ressler, an attorney at the Center for Biological Diversity. “We’re hopeful that these new commissioners will be champions of our state’s wildlife and wild places.”
Tim Ragen is a retired scientist residing in Anacortes who most recently served as the executive director for the Marine Mammal Commission; he has a doctoral degree in oceanography and has dedicated both his career and life to conservation of marine species such as Steller sea lions, Southern Resident killer whales, Hawaiian monk seals and vaquitas.
John Lehmkhul, a resident of Wenatchee, has a bachelor’s degree in wildlife biology, a master’s in wildlife ecology, and a doctoral degree in forest science from the University of Washington. He is a lifelong hunter and angler who stated in his application to the commission that he believes in the “sound scientific management of fish and wildlife in Washington.”
Melanie Rowland, a resident of Twisp, was an attorney at the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration’s office of general counsel for more than 15 years. Her work focused on the Endangered Species Act as well as issues surrounding climate change.
The Center for Biological Diversity is a national, nonprofit conservation organization with more than 1.7 million members and online activists dedicated to the protection of endangered species and wild places.
Post by: buckfvr on January 24, 2022, 01:22:04 PM
Cant question their qualifications, or so it appears, but I still have the feeling the writing is on the wall.
Post by: Bob33 on January 24, 2022, 01:25:32 PM
https://mvcitizens.org/board-and-staff/
Melanie Rowland
Legal Counsel
Melanie is an environmental attorney who retired in 2011 after 15 years with the Office of General Counsel for NOAA (the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration) where she worked on conservation of salmon and marine mammals protected by the federal Endangered Species Act. Prior to that, she taught environmental law at the University of Washington. As Senior Counsel for The Wilderness Society, she worked on the national campaign to preserve Northwest ancient forests. She also served on the boards of Seattle Audubon, the Washington Environmental Council, the Washington Foundation for the Environment, and Pacific Biodiversity Institute in Winthrop. She holds a BA from Stanford University and a law degree from the University of Pennsylvania.
Melanie and her husband, Randy Brook (also a public interest lawyer), have been coming to the Methow Valley since the early 1980s and bought a recreational cabin on the Twisp-Carlton Road in 1999. They built a house on their property and moved here full-time in 2011.
Melanie and Randy are avid birders, hikers, cross-country skiers, and sea kayakers. Melanie spends as much time as possible learning about plants and animals. She often has her nose buried in a wildflower or a science book.
Post by: buckfvr on January 24, 2022, 01:31:15 PM
Post by: bearpaw on January 24, 2022, 01:32:44 PM
Post by: Humptulips on January 24, 2022, 01:33:24 PM
It is not encouraging that CBD applauds the appointments.
Post by: pianoman9701 on January 24, 2022, 01:35:50 PM
Post by: bearpaw on January 24, 2022, 01:37:01 PM
The Center for Biological Diversity is a national, nonprofitconservation(animal rights) organization with more than 1.7 million members and online activists dedicated to theprotection of endangered species and wild places(end of hunting).
:yeah: good summation...
Post by: pianoman9701 on January 24, 2022, 01:38:02 PM
Post by: Ridgeratt on January 24, 2022, 01:40:48 PM
If it were any more obvious that animal rights groups have bought Jay Inslee, he'd have their logo on the pocket of his blazer. :bash:
Don't ask if he has any tattoos. 8)
Post by: huntnphool on January 24, 2022, 01:45:53 PM
If it were any more obvious that animal rights groups have bought Jay Inslee, he'd have their logo on the pocket of his blazer. :bash:
And yet our liberal members on this site will continue voting for him.
Post by: Jake Dogfish on January 24, 2022, 01:46:12 PM
If it were any more obvious that animal rights groups have bought Jay Inslee, he'd have their logo on the pocket of his blazer. :bash:If hunters were smart, they would be the ones for animal rights.
Most of these people are nothing more than predator “starvationists”.
Post by: pianoman9701 on January 24, 2022, 01:58:22 PM
If it were any more obvious that animal rights groups have bought Jay Inslee, he'd have their logo on the pocket of his blazer. :bash:If hunters were smart, they would be the ones for animal rights.
Most of these people are nothing more than predator “starvationists”.
Hunters are for wildlife conservation. D of W are not. HSUS are not. PETA are not. These are litigation organizations. "Animal rights" is a term that stands for putting wild animals ahead of humans, regardless of the cost to the animals. It has nothing to do with helping animals and usually ends up hurting them.
Post by: Rainier10 on January 24, 2022, 02:01:33 PM
Post by: Humptulips on January 24, 2022, 02:10:19 PM
Well hopefully they listen to the WDFW bio's and implement sound management.:lol4:
Post by: idahohuntr on January 24, 2022, 02:16:40 PM
It appears John Lemkhul is a hunter. The other two don't sound good to me. I hope I am wrong. If that plays out we have a majority in the Commission, some of which are not what I would call solid. Portends a fight on all substantive issues.Given the 4-3 vote, I agree, as long as one of these folks is a solid hunter I think we can stave off any radical craziness. Just hope the other two are not as bad as smith or koontz.
It is not encouraging that CBD applauds the appointments.
Post by: pd on January 24, 2022, 02:25:08 PM
Wonderful. I have always thought that the Columbia River needed more sea lions. Maybe they could displace the California kind?
Post by: Rainier10 on January 24, 2022, 02:33:01 PM
:chuckle: You don't think that is possible? :dunno: You think I need to take a drug test? :chuckle: You'll have whatever I'm having? :chuckle:Well hopefully they listen to the WDFW bio's and implement sound management.:lol4:
Post by: buckfvr on January 24, 2022, 02:35:54 PM
It appears John Lemkhul is a hunter. The other two don't sound good to me. I hope I am wrong. If that plays out we have a majority in the Commission, some of which are not what I would call solid. Portends a fight on all substantive issues.
It is not encouraging that CBD applauds the appointments.
By whos definition is this guy a hunter ?? Occasional, casual, once upon a time ? None of these appointments were made to bolster our point of view.
Post by: Humptulips on January 24, 2022, 02:38:19 PM
It's just such a novel concept. :chuckle::chuckle: You don't think that is possible? :dunno: You think I need to take a drug test? :chuckle: You'll have whatever I'm having? :chuckle:Well hopefully they listen to the WDFW bio's and implement sound management.:lol4:
Post by: Humptulips on January 24, 2022, 02:40:44 PM
I will admit I am working on very limited information. Can't disagree with your last sentence.It appears John Lemkhul is a hunter. The other two don't sound good to me. I hope I am wrong. If that plays out we have a majority in the Commission, some of which are not what I would call solid. Portends a fight on all substantive issues.
It is not encouraging that CBD applauds the appointments.
By whos definition is this guy a hunter ?? Occasional, casual, once upon a time ? None of these appointments were made to bolster our point of view.
Post by: jackelope on January 24, 2022, 04:50:15 PM
Today, Governor Jay Inslee appointed of three new Commissioners to the Fish and Wildlife Commission responsible for overseeing and guiding the state’s Department of Fish and Wildlife. These new appointees will finally fill the Commissions two vacant seats and will replace the current Chair Larry Carpenter whose term expired in October 2020.
Dr. John Lehmkuhl is a retired research biologist with the U.S. Forest Service who holds a PhD in forest science and an M.S. in wildlife ecology and spent 25 years working with Washington wildlife populations on both sides of the state.
Melanie Rowland is a retired senior attorney for the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) where she focused on enforcement of the Endangered Species Act, the Marine Mammal Protection Act, and other key environmental statues. She is co-author of The Evolution of National Wildlife Law, the leading legal treatise on federal wildlife law.
Dr. Timothy Ragen has a PhD in oceanography and is the former executive director of the Marine Mammal Commission where he dedicated his career to conserving endangered marine species. In his retirement he continues to work on projects to protect endangered and threatened species, including Southern Resident killer whales.
Thank you Governor Jay Inslee for appointing these qualified candidates who understand and value science and have a demonstrated commitment to conservation.
We welcome these new commissioners and look forward to working with them to advance responsible and science-based natural resource management.
Post by: zwickeyman on January 24, 2022, 06:14:33 PM
Post by: hunter399 on January 24, 2022, 06:32:41 PM
When the Center for Biological Diversity cheers the appointments it's probably not going to be good for hunters, fishers, and trappers!I totally agree with this........
Post by: Skyvalhunter on January 24, 2022, 07:04:24 PM
When the Center for Biological Diversity cheers the appointments it's probably not going to be good for hunters, fishers, and trappers!I have bad feeling about this too. I think hunters and fishermen just took it in the shorts. The best thing we could do is make sure our voice is heard and make sure they are aware of our dis satisfaction.
Post by: GASoline71 on January 24, 2022, 10:01:37 PM
Life as hunters in this state has changed drastically. We will have to continue to fight the anti-hunting/animal rights groups every single year for every single hunt. They are well organized and will stop at nothing to end hunting (and fishing) in this state. They got a taste of what we are capable of, when backed in to a corner and mislead during a commission meeting that had nothing to do with cancelling a spring bear hunt.
We have to keep at it! Never give an inch!
Gary
Post by: hunter399 on January 25, 2022, 04:04:55 AM
This also means we have to stay in the trenches and continue to send email, make phone calls, sign up to speak at zoom meetings, and make our voices heard to the commission. We cannot waver! The anti's have used Covid as a platform to infiltrate the zoom style meetings as everything is online and not in person.Looked at the agenda for the entire year.
Life as hunters in this state has changed drastically. We will have to continue to fight the anti-hunting/animal rights groups every single year for every single hunt. They are well organized and will stop at nothing to end hunting (and fishing) in this state. They got a taste of what we are capable of, when backed in to a corner and mislead during a commission meeting that had nothing to do with cancelling a spring bear hunt.
We have to keep at it! Never give an inch!
Gary
Looks like some of the meetings may be hybrid ,is what there calling them. Where they may be starting to go back to some what in person . It would be nice to have hunter/fishmen standing in the front of that line to speak in person.
And also I agree you.
Post by: trophyhunt on January 25, 2022, 06:33:32 AM
has dedicated both his career and life to conservation of marine species such as Steller sea lions,:yeah: my jaw dropped when I read that, Maybe he can help save the coyote population as well. :bash:
Wonderful. I have always thought that the Columbia River needed more sea lions. Maybe they could displace the California kind?
Post by: hunter399 on January 25, 2022, 06:37:47 AM
In the next few meetings will see there character I'm sure.has dedicated both his career and life to conservation of marine species such as Steller sea lions,:yeah: my jaw dropped when I read that, Maybe he can help save the coyote population as well. :bash:
Wonderful. I have always thought that the Columbia River needed more sea lions. Maybe they could displace the California kind?
And it does not sound good so far.
Attending or watching meetings even at a later date.
It gonna be top priority right now to see how screwed we really are.
Post by: Bushcraft on January 25, 2022, 07:41:47 AM
Attached is John Lehmkuhl's application. He has held small game, turkey and fishing licenses. I have worked with him while serving on the WDAC. He's the most reasonable of the three (which isn't saying much), but wants to radically change the funding structure of the Dept., which in turn would de-emphasize the importance of the traditional core priority stakeholders in the hunting and fishing communities.
Post by: Bushcraft on January 25, 2022, 07:43:33 AM
She was a hand-picked shoe-in by Inslee, which should tell you all you need to know.
Post by: Bushcraft on January 25, 2022, 07:45:04 AM
Post by: Jingles on January 25, 2022, 07:51:06 AM
Post by: Rob on January 25, 2022, 08:08:50 AM
Post by: Bushcraft on January 25, 2022, 08:14:04 AM
Looks like Melanie spent 3 min on her application.
No need to waste time if it's a mere formality in the process. ;)
Post by: Rainier10 on January 25, 2022, 08:18:09 AM
Looks like Melanie spent 3 min on her application.That application is one of the top three that applied?! Unbelievable. :bash:
Post by: idahohuntr on January 25, 2022, 08:34:06 AM
Post by: GWP on January 25, 2022, 08:42:40 AM
Looks like Melanie spent 3 min on her application.That application is one of the top three that applied?! Unbelievable. :bash:
Well, she DID ‘accidentally’ put with it the fine money she figured she owed because of having the fleeting thought of killing something. This was while handing the paperwork directly to the Gov…
It was a substantial fine. With interest. Much interest. OBSCENE interest. But, she just wanted to ‘make it right’. Had nothing to do with her getting the pick!
Purely speculation. A ‘muse’. Not based on fact or information. An opinion.
Post by: Special T on January 25, 2022, 08:44:20 AM
So we need to find articles and examples of these folks that show they are against consumptive use, and any examples where they express protecting robust numbers of predators.
Post by: Special T on January 25, 2022, 08:45:36 AM
Looks like Melanie spent 3 min on her application.That application is one of the top three that applied?! Unbelievable. :bash:
Well, she DID ‘accidentally’ put with it the fine money she figured she owed because of having the fleeting thought of killing something. This was while handing the paperwork directly to the Gov…
It was a substantial fine. With interest. Much interest. OBSCENE interest. But, she just wanted to ‘make it right’. Had nothing to do with her getting the pick!
Details, what fine, what are you talking about?
Post by: GWP on January 25, 2022, 08:54:49 AM
Heard later she will be the best, most well rounded pick for all concerned, with all consideration and concern for hunters as well as conservationists.
Fixed it!
Post by: Rainier10 on January 25, 2022, 09:57:04 AM
As idahohuntr says the vote is what matters. It will be interesting to see how they vote. We can only hope that they listen to the information presented and make an informed unbiased decision on hunting and fishing issues as they come. If they can back up their votes/decisions with sound reasoning I am all for it.
Post by: dreamingbig on January 25, 2022, 10:11:42 AM
I have usually scoffed at the idea of splitting WA state but the end of hunting is one reason for me to support eastern WA becoming a separate entity. This is getting nuts.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: buckfvr on January 25, 2022, 10:54:01 AM
Post by: idahohuntr on January 25, 2022, 10:58:22 AM
Lorna and Barbara got their voters. This just flipped 5-4 or 6-3. Hunting in this state is doomed for non-native. Which means I am going to have to move.The Lemkhul fella...I'm seeing him as a 5th vote in line with the 4 who just voted to accept the spring bear petition. He identifies as a hunter, had some articles about his cutting horses (which means he must run in some livestock/cattle groups), lives in Wenatchee...I just don't see that as some definitive anti hunter who is going to go along with the lorna smith crowd. :dunno:
I have usually scoffed at the idea of splitting WA state but the end of hunting is one reason for me to support eastern WA becoming a separate entity. This is getting nuts.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: GWP on January 25, 2022, 11:01:53 AM
I wish they would split us off but the crooks wont allow it, leaving me as a hugely disgruntled resident of a state managed by politicians I despise. Getting out of here is definitely resurfacing as a legitimate consideration.
It is always a kick (in a bad way) that when people vote something in they don't like ($30 car tabs) they say "You made an agreement", but when it is something they want it is for "Everyones best interest", or "They did not understand what they were voting for".
They have talked about splitting the State for a long time. They will not let that happen.
Post by: luvmystang67 on January 25, 2022, 11:25:18 AM
At first glance it certainly doesn't look good, that application reminds me of my daughters first scholarship application that she get. With just a little more effort the next year she won it easily. The application from Melanie was obviously just a formality.
As idahohuntr says the vote is what matters. It will be interesting to see how they vote. We can only hope that they listen to the information presented and make an informed unbiased decision on hunting and fishing issues as they come. If they can back up their votes/decisions with sound reasoning I am all for it.
Yeah, you really dont know until the votes come. There are some things that they won't be open to though, as an example, Tim Ragen is retired and spent his entire life trying to save marine mammals. You can expect him to support anything that keeps mammals alive including whales. He's written articles advocating for the removal of the lower snake dams, increases in hatchery chinook and decreased boat traffic around orcas. I don't think anything at this late stage in his life is going to convince him away from policies that protect marine mammals, especially orcas. However, that doesn't mean that he hates bear hunting, as an example. He's a fisheries guy and might be very rational on other topic areas outside his normal expertise. I kind of doubt it, but you won't know until he's got to cast the vote.
Melanie Rowland... I got a bad feeling. She came from California and is a lawyer. I'm sure Twisp really loves having her *JOKING*. I would MUCH rather see someone science-based in these roles than a lawyer from California. She's the most likely to disappoint me.
Post by: luvmystang67 on January 25, 2022, 11:37:17 AM
https://www.c-span.org/video/?12488-1/jim-french-show
Post by: buckfvr on January 25, 2022, 11:41:56 AM
At first glance it certainly doesn't look good, that application reminds me of my daughters first scholarship application that she get. With just a little more effort the next year she won it easily. The application from Melanie was obviously just a formality.
As idahohuntr says the vote is what matters. It will be interesting to see how they vote. We can only hope that they listen to the information presented and make an informed unbiased decision on hunting and fishing issues as they come. If they can back up their votes/decisions with sound reasoning I am all for it.
Yeah, you really dont know until the votes come. There are some things that they won't be open to though, as an example, Tim Ragen is retired and spent his entire life trying to save marine mammals. You can expect him to support anything that keeps mammals alive including whales. He's written articles advocating for the removal of the lower snake dams, increases in hatchery chinook and decreased boat traffic around orcas. I don't think anything at this late stage in his life is going to convince him away from policies that protect marine mammals, especially orcas. However, that doesn't mean that he hates bear hunting, as an example. He's a fisheries guy and might be very rational on other topic areas outside his normal expertise. I kind of doubt it, but you won't know until he's got to cast the vote.
Melanie Rowland... I got a bad feeling. She came from California and is a lawyer. I'm sure Twisp really loves having her *JOKING*. I would MUCH rather see someone science-based in these roles than a lawyer from California. She's the most likely to disappoint me.
Just a thought, so if this guy expects his commissioner colleagues to follow his lead towards marine mammals decisions, I expect him to reciprocate by following others leads outside of his expertise. Compromise to accommodate, tit for tat, reciprocity among colleagues. I expect it.
Post by: builtfordtough on January 25, 2022, 12:43:45 PM
Post by: bow4elk on January 26, 2022, 10:44:56 AM
This site is not a closed room cone of silence forum. When the media links to this forum thread and there are derogatory comments, name-calling, and insults levied against the WDFW and/or commissioners, it effectively makes us all look like a bunch of backwoods thugs. Like it or not, that's the reality.
It's time to face the reality facing hunting in Washington and across the country.
We need to clean up our collective act as hunters and start demonstrating our value to conservation.
We need to get organized, act and speak with professionalism and integrity, always.
I work with state reps from the 49 other states along with many pro-hunting conservation organizations, authors, and researchers. I can assure you that these things are more important now than ever before. People are watching, reading, and listening. The HSUS and MANY anti-hunting organizations are collecting evidence to use against hunting across the country and in Washington.
I'm not calling anyone out here, just making the point that we need to do better and work tirelessly to keep the perceptions of hunting and hunters in a positive light. This is a long game and we all need to lean in and get involved.
The other thing everyone must understand is that wildlife and natural resource management will never be solely science-based. It's nearly 100% political, as we've all seen for decades. Understanding state politics is nearly impossible so the only thing we can do in that domain is to ensure that we don't provide anything to be used against us. Everything we do and say is being watched. Getting angry is a given but keeping our cool, using facts and data to support our arguments, and getting involved is worth every bit of effort. The future of hunting depends on it.
Thanks for listening...
Post by: Fatherof5 on January 26, 2022, 10:49:56 AM
Post by: idahohuntr on January 26, 2022, 10:51:36 AM
Post by: NRA4LIFE on January 26, 2022, 11:14:38 AM
Quote
I'm not calling anyone out here, just making the point that we need to do better and work tirelessly to keep the perceptions of hunting and hunters in a positive light.
The political/COVID section comes to mind here. How many members on here are non-hunters and just taking all of it in?
Post by: Boss .300 winmag on January 26, 2022, 11:34:42 AM
I agree as well.QuoteI'm not calling anyone out here, just making the point that we need to do better and work tirelessly to keep the perceptions of hunting and hunters in a positive light.
The political/COVID section comes to mind here. How many members on here are non-hunters and just taking all of it in?
I think we have a pretty good population of them on here, no better way to take something away but from within.
They read all our disgruntled groups posts I’m sure, it’s all being used against us.
Post by: Ghost Hunter on January 26, 2022, 11:52:12 AM
Post by: buckfvr on January 26, 2022, 11:57:28 AM
Post by: hughjorgan on January 26, 2022, 12:00:28 PM
Was Carpenter at the end of term, or resign? Didn't realize that was in the works.
His term was up in 2020 I believe
Post by: luvmystang67 on January 26, 2022, 12:28:06 PM
I agree for the most part BUT....being politically correct, writing letters, sugar coating issues, never really letting the opposition know how really upset we are, seems to me has led to issues being swept under the rug and outright dismissed, as our being opposed to many issues for many years and getting no where while being nice about it has, again, in my opinion been/is being construed as weakness and lack of conviction and that is how we are being treated by so many people. Its like this is what we're going to do about it no matter what you think and say. More and more we face predetermined outcomes on issues just to show protocol has been met. I cant help but think all the older guys on here have watched the slippery slope get steeper and steeper over the last 40 years or more even. We are losing, they arent. We are being dismissed, they arent. :twocents:
I'm a little more aligned here. I don't think voicing displeasure about people impact our lives and likely think entirely differently than us is a problem. Name calling, poor spelling, hyping of conspiracy theories are probably all bad markers. Making assumptions based on people's resumes, voicing displeasure, talking about solutions, strategizing for how to organize are all things I think are really advantageous for us.
I also agree that if we put some thought into our perspectives, that if someone is watching, they'll understand why. For example, I had a conversation with a semi-liberal friend about why I cannot support any gun control initiatives. Its not that I think gun violence isn't a problem, it is and I hate it probably more than people who don't enjoy guns, its that there's no end in sight from the left. I used examples of WA's continuing attempts at new legislation for "just one common sense step" that has turned into 4-5 common sense steps, with no real end in sight. I explained how we had to fight the erosion of gun rights, its not any specific single piece of legislation. He might disagree with me, but at least he understands more fully where my position is.
I think a similar thing can happen here. Everyone who posts often probably feels fairly similarly, and on this topic its more likely than not that we have similar perceptions of these commissioners. Calling them names on here, not productive. Posting their history, informing, adding contact information, talking about potential legislation or action that might help are all great ways to move forward. Heck, even posting about science-based articles that support our beliefs helps us speak with one voice and yeah, maybe an anti will run across it and have one micro-realization. It all helps.
Post by: pickardjw on January 26, 2022, 12:48:57 PM
1. Large amount of input from hunters, sometimes it's a numbers game.
2. Dialogue can be passionate but should not disrespectful, full of foul language or threats
3. Be concise. No one wants to read a rambling, incoherent mess nor will they take away anything from it.
4. Cite your sources if possible!
5. Spell check.
Post by: fishngamereaper on January 26, 2022, 01:17:36 PM
Maybe being more vocal will work ..it's worked for allot of others things in this country the last couple years... sometimes you have to become the problem to fix the problem...
Just ranting...been in this state almost 50 years and haven't seen much good come out of always being the good guys .. :twocents:
Post by: buckfvr on January 26, 2022, 01:20:44 PM
Imo you can't bargain with these people... peacefully sitting at the table with people that listen to you but don't hear you may feel good, look good, but does no good.... IDK..
Maybe being more vocal will work ..it's worked for allot of others things in this country the last couple years... sometimes you have to become the problem to fix the problem...
Just ranting...been in this state almost 50 years and haven't seen much good come out of always being the good guys .. :twocents:
:yeah: 67 years for me.
Post by: buckfvr on January 26, 2022, 01:22:03 PM
Totally agree with Stang67 here. We can voice how upset we are without disrespectful personal attacks, foul language and threats. Commissioner Anderson said they received all of that from pro-hunters regarding Spring Bear. I think the 5 things below are critical.
1. Large amount of input from hunters, sometimes it's a numbers game.
2. Dialogue can be passionate but should not disrespectful, full of foul language or threats
3. Be concise. No one wants to read a rambling, incoherent mess nor will they take away anything from it.
4. Cite your sources if possible!
5. Spell check.
People been saying this for many years and gotten the same results. Or should I say lack of results.
Post by: Rainier10 on January 26, 2022, 01:51:08 PM
Post by: jackelope on January 26, 2022, 02:01:20 PM
I agree as well.Keep in mind that nobody can see the OT section unless they’re a member and then they have to opt into that board. People who are not members who are just surfing the web can’t see any of that.QuoteI'm not calling anyone out here, just making the point that we need to do better and work tirelessly to keep the perceptions of hunting and hunters in a positive light.
The political/COVID section comes to mind here. How many members on here are non-hunters and just taking all of it in?
Post by: Blacktail Sniper on January 26, 2022, 02:24:02 PM
What they really do listen to is money.
Why is it that whenever an anti-hunting/fishing group wants to change something that they can't necessarily easily get changed, they file or threaten to file a civil lawsuit, which win or lose, will still cost the agency time & money to defend.
It becomes a business decision as to how to spend money, do they defend it and maybe win, but it always costs money out of their budget. Do they choose to prevent the suit and associated costs to defend against it and comply/pacify them, or spend thousands upon thousands of dollars that could be used elsewhere?
And in Washington, if they are willing to spend enough time & money, they can get something put on the ballot for vote, then they can use stuff like video from YouTube, Facebook and other social media posts to help swing emotion to their point of view while showing the consumptive user group in the worst possible light.
Until hunters and fishermen are willing to collectively stand together AND spend the money necessary to bring civil lawsuits against WDFW, HSUS, Peta, etc., and to do that means a major part of that is gathering and using science and hard, researchable facts and statistics as a foundation for the suits, otherwise I don't really see us being any more effective than yelling into the wind most days.
Target the administrative process and decisions that are made, compare actions to RCW & WAC codes for compliance when something is done or not done. This where I think we have the best chance to really force change, especially in WDFW since they are driven and directed by RCW & WAC codes on how and what they can and cannot do. If you hit in the pocket book, and I don't mean a few people refusing to buy licenses for example, that is going to get their full attention. But it is going to cost a lot of money to do this.
The anti-groups are and have proven they are willing to spend the money to get what they want, and as a smaller and to be honest, less organized group, that may never be something we are able to orchestrate. "Everybody" thinks something should be done, that "somebody" should do something, but expect someone else to pay for if it costs money or takes too much time.
There are plenty of attorneys that would happily take on these type cases for outdoor user groups, but are not going to do it for free, much like you are not going to go to your job if you are not going to get paid, justice is not fair and it is certainly not free.
That is my thoughts anyway, may not make a difference in the end, but I think it would certainly help tip the scales in our favor now and then.
Post by: pickardjw on January 26, 2022, 03:30:44 PM
Post by: hunter399 on January 26, 2022, 04:09:57 PM
If the state,WDFW, want my money ,then they can uphold seasons that "science" supports.
If inslee or the state,or WDFW wants to support anti-hunters,shut down seasons,and all that. I'm fine with that,but you'll do it without my wallet in your back pocket.
Inslee is riding the double edge sword and he knows it.
Appoint these do gooder to Commission or lose them votes comes election time,on the other side shut down too many seasons ,no money,and WDFW can't operate without costing the state a huge nest egg. He is just riding the line till election time.
Just ask your self ,How much money is the state losing over this spring bear hunt. Then times that by about 50 and that's about how much they lose if hunting is gone all together.
When they spend money in court to defend hunters ,it's like an investment that pays yearly.
All Wildlife management has become is big business.
Cash is king in my opinion. We will always have some kind of hunting. If you have the money to pay to play.
The state is and are Wildlife farmer ,biologists,and so on are just yes men/woman in the chess game they play to please public opinion.
Us as hunter pay for the opportunity,most of us on this site,
Pay for the opportunity,no matter how well they are at wildlife farming.
Post by: Russ McDonald on January 26, 2022, 04:12:03 PM
Yes it was.Was Carpenter at the end of term, or resign? Didn't realize that was in the works.
His term was up in 2020 I believe
Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk
Post by: hunter399 on January 26, 2022, 04:25:37 PM
Yup,Yes it was.Was Carpenter at the end of term, or resign? Didn't realize that was in the works.
His term was up in 2020 I believe
Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk
And he really wasn't helping hunters anyway.
So I don't really see it at a loss.
Post by: Jake Dogfish on January 26, 2022, 04:44:01 PM
Other than the inexplicable vote on spring bear, Carpenter was one of the more reasonable pro fishing and hunting commissioners.Yup,Yes it was.Was Carpenter at the end of term, or resign? Didn't realize that was in the works.
His term was up in 2020 I believe
Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk
And he really wasn't helping hunters anyway.
So I don't really see it at a loss.
Post by: hunter399 on January 26, 2022, 05:02:18 PM
I agree with that.Other than the inexplicable vote on spring bear, Carpenter was one of the more reasonable pro fishing and hunting commissioners.Yup,Yes it was.Was Carpenter at the end of term, or resign? Didn't realize that was in the works.
His term was up in 2020 I believe
Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk
And he really wasn't helping hunters anyway.
So I don't really see it at a loss.
Not sure what happened with spring bear.
Post by: 509 on January 26, 2022, 06:48:20 PM
It appears John Lemkhul is a hunter. The other two don't sound good to me. I hope I am wrong. If that plays out we have a majority in the Commission, some of which are not what I would call solid. Portends a fight on all substantive issues.
It is not encouraging that CBD applauds the appointments.
By whos definition is this guy a hunter ?? Occasional, casual, once upon a time ? None of these appointments were made to bolster our point of view.
I worked with John, years ago.
We talked about going out and hunting together. But I only hunt birds, and I believe he also hunted big game. We never did get together for hunting birds.
So I don't know how important hunting was to him. But he did hunt.
He was a great professional to work with and a good human being. I did enjoy working with him. We did get into professional disagreements and he was fair as we tried to hash them out. I was enjoyable working with him even in disagreement between us.
He is politically liberal. What a surprise for a PhD!!! I suspect that is why Inslee picked him.