Post by: hunter399 on November 15, 2022, 05:52:17 AM
Example would be moose and all the OIL species.
That permit money would go directly back to moose ,bighorn or whatever the permit money was put in for.
Deer
Elk
Spring bear if we had a permit season.
All of it.
This is the type of reform and accountability I would like to see at WDFW.
Also when permit hunts and seasons are closed it would take away funds from that species.
It would also ensure our permit money is not spent on things like wolf management,or conservation over consumption crap. Making sure hunter dollars go back to species we hunt.
Honestly that money should be relocated to that species.
We need to think outside the box,on ways we can reform WDFW in a way that they work for us,and put funds back into species that matter the most to hunters.
Also if Washington was to go to a permit only hunting,it would also ensure that money goes back to that species.
I might of purposed this before on HW .
Can't remember sorry if I have.
But we got to start thinking of different reform for hunters ,instead of anti-hunters reforming WDFW against hunters.
Anybody eles with reform ideas that can be purposed as a rule change ,I would love to hear some brain storming.
Post by: Boss .300 winmag on November 15, 2022, 06:02:09 AM
Post by: hunter399 on November 15, 2022, 06:04:23 AM
I like your idea, but bears don’t need that kind of help.😉
When I say management ,like bears that money would be used most likely for population counts. Stuff like that .
Not to feed them or anything.
Plus as it sits we don't have any permit season for predators.
Including bears give more incentives to have more permit seasons on predators.
Kinda insures that WDFW pays for conflicts and removals out of general funds and not permit money.
Post by: hunter399 on November 15, 2022, 06:11:15 AM
They might even sell more that way. :dunno:
These anti-hunters have all kinds of ideas to reform WDFW.
None of them are good for hunters.
Even this idea might go through with our conservative Commission.
We have to think of ways to slow down funds or money,when they decided to end hunting,while ensuring our money is going to the right species in the mean time.
Post by: follow maggie on November 15, 2022, 09:41:20 AM
Post by: KFhunter on November 15, 2022, 09:45:45 AM
Post by: buckfvr on November 15, 2022, 10:20:33 AM
I think it’s a good idea. My question is if WDFW has the math competency to do the accounting?
To me its more about trust and accountability, and both of those attributes are sorely lacking at WDFW. To "allocate" funds by specie would mean a surplus of funds for certain specie that wdfw would be dreaming up ways to "re"-allocate those funds elsewhere, (see trust and accountability).
I would love to see new laws that water down the measure of power the commission has. They can make their recommendations, but wdfw doesnt have to accept it as its presented. Emotional vs. scientific, wdfw should hold that trump card and exercise it often.
Post by: hunter399 on November 15, 2022, 12:40:31 PM
Did think about some species getting more funds than needed.
At the end of the day ,From enforcement,to research and science ,I don't really care how they spend the money as long as it goes directly back to that species.
More biologists
More research directly aimed at ungulate .
More enforcement.
Whatever as long as it goes back to that species.
Moose can be an example.
They don't do much,but make a ton of 💰.
That should go back to moose.
The whole north American conservation model is based on this.
Take the money you make and put it back into that resource.
They still have general funds,Pittman funds,and other funding.
Our Wildlife would start to benefit from something like this.
In return our state might see an uptick of hunters,instead of reduced hunter perception as it sits now.
Us as hunters need reform of WDFW back to a conservation model that might benifit Wildlife.
We as hunters need to get organized,United,and come up with good reform ideas that benifit hunters and Wildlife alike.
Ideas that this new Commission might be able to change.
Post by: Dan-o on November 15, 2022, 12:42:39 PM
I wouldn't want this proposal implemented.
I don't think it would be good for game management.
The biggest thing it would do would be to remove flexibility from WDFW.
Personally, I still trust them more than I trust untrained folks.
Post by: Platensek-po on November 15, 2022, 01:03:34 PM
I guess I'll be the contrarian.
I wouldn't want this proposal implemented.
I don't think it would be good for game management.
The biggest thing it would do would be to remove flexibility from WDFW.
Personally, I still trust them more than I trust untrained folks.
I agree. Wildlife conservation and management is much more than just the species we hunt.
Post by: buckfvr on November 15, 2022, 02:30:19 PM
We are in a bind and trusting them is just not an option for many of us.
Post by: hunter399 on November 16, 2022, 12:31:35 AM
I'm just gonna throw out something to think on.I guess I'll be the contrarian.
I wouldn't want this proposal implemented.
I don't think it would be good for game management.
The biggest thing it would do would be to remove flexibility from WDFW.
Personally, I still trust them more than I trust untrained folks.
I agree. Wildlife conservation and management is much more than just the species we hunt.
Hunter participation way down.
Most ungulate population way down
Permit money is only percentage of overall budget.
Just maybe too flexibly ,may be the problem.
I'm not gonna purpose it.
I'm thinking we will have to go down the rabbit hole little farther.
The rabbit hole. .... Conservation over consumption.
The rabbit hole... Co-exist over hunting.
Maybe some day hunters will come together,but not now.
Any other ideas on reform of WDFW.
Or are you ok with spring bear closed and whatever comes next.
The people you trust are the same people that go to convention about ideas on how to end hunting.
Here we sit with a line in the sand ,drawn clearly that the end of hunting is in our future.
But we are ok with that,and I trust them.
I'll shut up now.
But any other ideas on reform.
Never mind there must be none,everybody must be satisfied with the end of hunting,starting with spring bear.
Moderates feel free to nuke this topic if you wish.
Sorry I even thrown an idea out there.
Post by: Dan-o on November 16, 2022, 01:12:29 AM
I'm just gonna throw out something to think on.I guess I'll be the contrarian.
I wouldn't want this proposal implemented.
I don't think it would be good for game management.
The biggest thing it would do would be to remove flexibility from WDFW.
Personally, I still trust them more than I trust untrained folks.
I agree. Wildlife conservation and management is much more than just the species we hunt.
Hunter participation way down.
Most ungulate population way down
Permit money is only percentage of overall budget.
Just maybe too flexibly ,may be the problem.
I'm not gonna purpose it.
I'm thinking we will have to go down the rabbit hole little farther.
The rabbit hole. .... Conservation over consumption.
The rabbit hole... Co-exist over hunting.
Maybe some day hunters will come together,but not now.
Any other ideas on reform of WDFW.
Or are you ok with spring bear closed and whatever comes next.
The people you trust are the same people that go to convention about ideas on how to end hunting.
Here we sit with a line in the sand ,drawn clearly that the end of hunting is in our future.
But we are ok with that,and I trust them.
I'll shut up now.
But any other ideas on reform.
Never mind there must be none,everybody must be satisfied with the end of hunting,starting with spring bear.
Moderates feel free to nuke this topic if you wish.
Sorry I even thrown an idea out there.
There was no harm in throwing out your idea.
Rarely will you get everyone to agree with you, but if you quit that easily you'll never drive change.
Post by: Scruffy on November 16, 2022, 01:42:56 AM
I don't have any specific ideas except we in the hunting community should be coming together instead of arguing amongst ourselves. If we could all get on the same page we could have more of us getting involved with the WDFW with suggestions and urging to push things in our favor. Right now the Anti's are very well on the same page, bring lots of money, have loud voices, and are in the ear of the WDFW. We only get on a forum and argue about how we are getting screwed and blame one group or the other. We are not talking facts, and making real cases with valid ideas on how to fix the issues. just my :twocents: I don't have all the answers and it's hard to get anyone to agree on anything but that is where it needs to start I think. United We Stand, Divided We Fall
Post by: Russ McDonald on November 16, 2022, 02:54:47 AM
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Post by: hunter399 on November 16, 2022, 07:47:38 AM
Basically just bouncing back and fourth.
Ready to milk that cash cow till it's powder milk.
I'm ready to admit it's not that great of an idea.
Thinking about it ,it's not gonna stop them from pissing our money down the drain.
Example:
Moose money,let's say they took the extra money and put water troughs in every region at springs on public ground.
To combat climate change ,which really is just drought conditions.
Well something like that helps all wildlife,not just permit species,predators,birds,you name it.
I just thought maybe it would force them to use the money for projects that could help all wildlife,while directly helping permit species.
Like just a few years ago they spent some crazy money on a wolf conflict specialist. Maybe that was our moose permit money,they could of done that meeting in a zoom setting and just muted people and saved a lot of money.
Bottom line though.
I do trust the work they do to protect Washington resources.
But trusting them to do the right thing with my money.
Are two very different things.
WDFW is like two sides of a coin,and has been for awhile.
A lot of people there support hunting,and A lot don't.
Keep ungulate population below objective,is slowly killing hunting. The ones that don't support are just there incognito mode.
When I've purposed rule changes in the past that could of benefited future of hunting and wss turned down.
Ya my trust is limited at best.
Post by: wheels1 on November 21, 2022, 10:08:34 AM
Post by: pianoman9701 on November 21, 2022, 10:13:51 AM
Post by: JBG on November 21, 2022, 10:32:29 AM
Post by: wheels1 on November 21, 2022, 11:02:18 AM