Hunting Washington Forum

Big Game Hunting => Elk Hunting => Topic started by: WoolSocks on June 10, 2023, 07:56:37 PM

Title: 243 for elk
Post by: WoolSocks on June 10, 2023, 07:56:37 PM: New to Washington, and new elk hunter. I usually hunt archery because I like quiet woods, but I hear archery season for elk isn’t as quiet and non-competitive as I’m used to with whitetail hunting back east. Sounds like my tack might be high country with modern firearm.

Here’s the question. Can one take down an elk with a .243?

Here’s my case. My first gun was a Rem. 700 243, and after many years and many guns, it’s still my go-to. It’s incredibly light, shoots way better than it should (.5MOA with factory Hornady) and just always puts the bullet where I want. I’ve dropped several white tails at 300-400 yards if I have a tree handy to rest on, and a few at about 150 yards off-hand. Moving deer, quartered away, no problem. Have shot at least a dozen deer with it- never missed, double lung every time, never had one go farther than 20 yards. I keep telling myself I need a bigger gun, so I’ve been through 270’s, 280’s,300mag - and I find myself tracking blood trails for 200 yards. For what I’ve been hunting, bullet placement matters. Knockdown power, not so much.

True for elk, or do I just need to learn to shoot a 300mag?
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: WapitiTalk1 on June 10, 2023, 08:15:10 PM: Welcome to the Evergreen State bud. You can kill an elk with a well placed 22-250 shot (seen it). You can kill a big game animal with a well placed field point with your bow I’m sure. That said, I personally would use a heavier caliber than a .243 for elk. You’ve gotta think “break/devastate” bone on an elk if you would like to collect him before he hops three ridges, (insert hundreds of yards or more here). Look to something with a “30” in its caliber title for Wapiti and you’ll be fine sir.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: Igor on June 10, 2023, 08:28:00 PM: My opinion is that the animal you are hunting should be killed quickly and humanely. The .243 is simply not the optimal caliber to do that when it comes to elk.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: Dan-o on June 10, 2023, 08:34:59 PM: Lots of different opinions on this.
I'll offer mine:

A 243 is marginal for elk. A well placed shot into the heart/lungs will definitely kill an elk, but a larger round does provide some room for error or less optimal shots.

You'd want to use a different bullet for elk than you are using for deer. Something stout, like a Nosler Partition that will retain a lot of weight through a tougher animal than deer.

I'd also think you'd want to limit shot to some distance 300 yards or less.
Yes, there are videos of elk getting killed at long range with a 243...... 'I wouldn't try it.

I think something like a 30-06 is a much better choice for elk.
If you can go up in killing power, do it.

Best of luck.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: PsoasHunter on June 10, 2023, 08:57:24 PM: I'm with these fellas, there are better calibers than the. 243 for elk. If you're used to a .243, a 300 win mag is maybe too big of a jump up to get comfortable with. I know I don't shoot huge calibers like that as well, recoil jump is real whether we like to admit it or not.

I'll second the 30-06, it's a great all around caliber for washington and for elk. If you're not shooting bigger calibers well, maybe a muzzle brake would help?
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: Humptulips on June 10, 2023, 08:59:01 PM: I'm with the crowd so far. .243 is not enough for elk.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: Jolten on June 10, 2023, 09:12:45 PM: I believe most "experts" recommend 1500 ft/lbs of energy at impact for elk. My .243 wouldn't be my first choice for elk. My .308 using 165gr or my 26 Nosler with 127 Barnes would be my first choices
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: OltHunter on June 10, 2023, 09:17:14 PM: I wouldn't use a 243 for elk, but given budgets and individuals situations, it could be done but well within 200 yards and is legal here.

If possible, use it as a good reason to buy a new rifle. You don't need much more, like a 7mm-08 or 308 to be in a better spot for elk. You don't need a magnum.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: phildobaggins on June 10, 2023, 09:19:46 PM: I’ve seen some slick .30 cal rifles for sale on the forum. I say get a second hand .30 cal and have confidence. Doesn’t need to be a 300 win Mag. Welcome to WA.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: bobcat on June 10, 2023, 09:22:38 PM: I'd say only if you're using a 243 to challenge yourself, and to make your hunt harder. I'd want to be within a couple hundred yards and have a perfect shot. So yeah, if you'd be willing to get closer and pass up all marginal shots I think it would be fine. It's just that I'm not sure this is the state to be making your elk hunt more challenging by using a small caliber rifle.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: jrebel on June 10, 2023, 09:32:00 PM: I would say shot placement and bullet choice are more important than caliber. Clearly the bigger calibers will carry more punch (energy), but that often leads to hunters taking less than optimal shots….”I’ve got the big 338 so that shot should work” mentality. Know your limits and make an ethical shot and a .243 is plenty enough gun for an elk.

What bullet are you shooting? If you say hornady SST, I would say that is not a good elk bullet in any caliber.

I’ve got a 7-08 that shoots 101 grain hammers that I know would crush an elk with a properly places shot.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: blackveltbowhunter on June 10, 2023, 09:34:01 PM: Sounds like you shoot the gun very well, and I would typically be a guy that would advise shot placement over caliber. But.... 243 is very light. Elk, especially bigger bodied bulls are incredibly tough and hold on to life. The bone and muscle structure is much denser than even heavy bodied whitetails and blacktail. You can for sure kill them with it and it sounds like you could be a candidate to do so. However, nothing stings like the heartbreak of losing one, especially if you can't square with yourself you did everything in your power to keep it from happening. If sticking with the 243 be extremely selective and research an appropriate bullet. What your shooting currently is not it. If possible, i think a 308 might be a great step up, offering higher bullet weights and options and still very manageable recoil in light handy guns.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: HillHound on June 10, 2023, 09:53:47 PM: I had a friend when I was younger that was in the same boat. Dad had bought him a youth model Remington 243 when he was like eight. Only rifle he owned until he was in his 30s. He killed the biggest blacktail bucks I have ever seen with that little gun. One 7 x 7 that you would swear it was a white tail. And he did kill four or five elk with it over the years to. But he lost more elk than anybody I know. Four I can think of off the top of my head that he shot with that little 243 that were either not found or took a extensive tracking job to find them miles away still alive or once with somebody else already gutting it after they had put the finishing shot in it. That was the final straw and He finally moved up to a 300 savage. Now if he can even find ammo for that gun he probably can’t afford it since the prices have skyrocketed on that caliber. I have killed a bear, a cougar, and a half dozen deer with a 243 for the same reasons you have, it’s light and accurate so it’s easy to gravitate towards it when the safe opens, but you need more to consistently kill elk in less than perfect conditions. 270 minimum if I was buying a new gun for elk. I like my 300wsm it has gotten the job done for me on deer, elk, bears, and a moose. You can find light for caliber bullets for deer and coyote or the big heavy solids for heavy bone and hide.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: WoolSocks on June 10, 2023, 09:59:05 PM: Sounds like the consensus is to go up, unless I want to always do head shots 😁. Going to miss my 4-pound tack driving .243 though. I can shoot a 300 mag off a bench all day. In the real world, taking offhand shots with a 9-pound gun after lugging it up the side of a mountain is so much less fun. Agreed on the recoil flinching. Most of us can take a shoulder-pounding at the range without pulling shots, but in the field some corner of our mind knows a heavy recoil gun might punish you for failing to tuck it in perfectly, or for having your eye just a little too close to the scope. Might have to build me a setup with a big ol’ recoil pad and some glass that has lots of eye relief.

Why 30-06 over.270 or 7mm, though? The recoil isn’t all that different, and the flatter trajectory gets you some range.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: WapitiTalk1 on June 10, 2023, 10:10:41 PM: Quote from: WoolSocks on June 10, 2023, 09:59:05 PM
Sounds like the consensus is to go up, unless I want to always do head shots 😁. Going to miss my 4-pound tack driving .243 though. I can shoot a 300 mag off a bench all day. In the real world, taking offhand shots with a 9-pound gun after lugging it up the side of a mountain is so much less fun. Agreed on the recoil flinching. Most of us can take a shoulder-pounding at the range without pulling shots, but in the field some corner of our mind knows a heavy recoil gun might punish you for failing to tuck it in perfectly, or for having your eye just a little too close to the scope. Might have to build me a setup with a big ol’ recoil pad and some glass that has lots of eye relief.

Why 30-06 over.270 or 7mm, though? The recoil isn’t all that different, and the flatter trajectory gets you some range.

I have a buddy who drew a primo rifle tag in Idaho a few years back. He shot his trophy 6X with a custom 7MM mag. The bull barely flinched at two dead center lung shots until the 3rd shot in bone/shoulder brought him down. I’m telling you, you need a bone crunching round to drop Mr Bull. I’m not just recommending, I’m telling you what it is. 06, 270, and 7MM are great deer rounds…… Look at a 30 Caliber if you want to ensure you do the job right. Just my meager opinion
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: Dan-o on June 10, 2023, 10:15:54 PM: Quote from: WoolSocks on June 10, 2023, 09:59:05 PM
Sounds like the consensus is to go up, unless I want to always do head shots 😁. Going to miss my 4-pound tack driving .243 though. I can shoot a 300 mag off a bench all day. In the real world, taking offhand shots with a 9-pound gun after lugging it up the side of a mountain is so much less fun. Agreed on the recoil flinching. Most of us can take a shoulder-pounding at the range without pulling shots, but in the field some corner of our mind knows a heavy recoil gun might punish you for failing to tuck it in perfectly, or for having your eye just a little too close to the scope. Might have to build me a setup with a big ol’ recoil pad and some glass that has lots of eye relief.

Why 30-06 over.270 or 7mm, though? The recoil isn’t all that different, and the flatter trajectory gets you some range.

Between 270, 30-06 and 7MM Mag I would choose the 7MM Mag....... When I hunt elk with modern rifle, I always pick my trusty 7MM Mag. But any of those three is a significant step up from a 243.

I suggested 30-06 because it's so popular and you can shoot elk at distance with it. Most folks shouldn't be shooting at elk at 500 yards anyway, and all 3 of these will shoot out there. (just most hunters can't.).

You really need a good, stout elk bullet no matter what caliber you choose.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: northwesthunter84 on June 10, 2023, 10:20:39 PM: You don’t need a heavy 300. 280AI,7mm and 30.06 are great elk calibers too. I feel a hot 6.5 has plenty of energy. I run a Tikka 7RM and that gun is right about 8.5lb. Plenty of guns out there that are light and that don’t kick bad either. Stout bullets are necessary though. The partions, accubonds, ELDx, coppers like hammers or TSX annd plenty of others. One thing that has not been said yet but gun season will be just as busy as archery season even up high. Archery is tons of fun.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: Moose Master on June 11, 2023, 08:46:34 AM: Welcome to Washington, you have been given some really good insights to rifle choices and bullets.
This isn't your east coast whitetails, these are a magnificent animal that will go up and down mountains all day long. They are also not the numbers of them like whitetails. When your opportunity comes you will want a clean hammering shot. It's worth every second while in pursuit of these animals. Good luck
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: 7mmfan on June 11, 2023, 08:56:40 AM: 7mm is fine. It's all I've ever shot and never had a problem. 160 gr accubond, or similar, or 140-150 gr copper and you're in good shape.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: hunter399 on June 11, 2023, 09:45:23 AM: I say use it.
Alot of the same could be said about using 223 for deer.
Is it the best choice. Probably not, can it be done,yes it can.
But I've always been the type to make due with what you got.
I use 243 for bears sometimes.
Elk and bear are the toughest animals your gonna find in Washington for general seasons.
Know your limits of what your rifle can do.
If a second shot is possible ,keep shooting till it's down.
It will work ,if that's all you got.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: Fidelk on June 11, 2023, 10:32:07 AM: Quote from: WoolSocks on June 10, 2023, 07:56:37 PM
New to Washington, and new elk hunter........Sounds like my tack might be high country with modern firearm.

Here’s the question. Can one take down an elk with a .243?

There's another question that will need to be asked......how many special permit points do you have? Also.....did you buy special permit applications for this season? Are you hunting Eastern or Western WA for elk? Without a successful special hunt draw, you will be hunting for spike elk only in E. WA......along with most other hunters.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: Ridgeratt on June 11, 2023, 10:37:27 AM: Fidoelk if you review the current seasons there are several units open for any bull or any elk.

Firearm

Aug. 1 2023-Jan. 20, 2024

Master Hunters Only: Elk Areas 3911 and 3912. Must wear hunter orange and/or hunter pink.

Antlerless only

Sept. 9-24

Elk Area 3722*

Antlerless only

Oct. 28-Nov. 5

101, 105, 108, 111, 113, 117d, 121, 204

Any bull

Oct. 28-Nov. 5

145, 149d, 154,162 through 186, 249, 336 through 368

Spike bull

Oct. 28-Nov. 5

251, 328, 329, 334, 335

True spike bull

Oct. 28-Nov. 5

124 through 142, 372*, 382*, 388

Any elk

Oct. 28-Nov. 15

203, 209 through 248, 250, 254 through 272, 278d, 284, 290, 373d, 379d, 381

Any elk

Aug. 1-31

Master Hunters Only: 371. Must wear hunter orange and/or hunter pink.

Antlerless only

Dec. 9-31

Master Hunters Only: 127, 130
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: Fidelk on June 11, 2023, 12:30:31 PM: He needs to stay out of those 101, 105, etc. GMUs.......KF and HUNTIN4SIX ran me out of there several years ago.......good place to hunt deer but I think the locals tag out the elk up there.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: jason stevens on June 11, 2023, 12:48:31 PM: With the right shot placement a .243 will harvest an elk everytime. Don't buy into the hype of bigger calibers. Use what you have an enjoy your season. Remember you can harvest an elk with a razor blade at the end of a stick. So your 243 will work . I've taken 5 cows with mine . One shot. (Permit in hand ).
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: hunter399 on June 11, 2023, 02:10:44 PM: Quote from: Fidelk on June 11, 2023, 12:30:31 PM
He needs to stay out of those 101, 105, etc. GMUs.......KF and HUNTIN4SIX ran me out of there several years ago.......good place to hunt deer but I think the locals tag out the elk up there.

I know where.
I don't hunt there much, but trust me .
I know all about those spots.
Got a few friends in low places.
I've known for a long time ,your secrect is safe with me.
Anybody eles ,can't really tell ya.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: dvolmer on June 11, 2023, 02:11:53 PM: Just don't do it. Just my opinion. You can kill an elk with a well placed rock to the head, but not recommended either. Elk are thick, dense, and extremely tough animals. Ive seen elk take three well placed 300 Win Mag shots and still not want to go down. Im really big on down range bullet energy. In this state you can hunt for years for elk and never get a shot opportunity. When and if you are blessed to ever have that opportunity, don't let yourself or the animal down. Had a friend years ago shoot a big bull behind the front shoulder with a 6mm Remington (243 with a little bit more powder behind it). Chased and tracked the animal for miles and never did recover it. Just my thoughts. do as you please.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: jrebel on June 11, 2023, 02:21:46 PM: Quote from: dvolmer on June 11, 2023, 02:11:53 PM
Just don't do it. Just my opinion. You can kill an elk with a well placed rock to the head, but not recommended either. Elk are thick, dense, and extremely tough animals. Ive seen elk take three well placed 300 Win Mag shots and still not want to go down. Im really big on down range bullet energy. In this state you can hunt for years for elk and never get a shot opportunity. When and if you are blessed to ever have that opportunity, don't let yourself or the animal down. Had a friend years ago shoot a big bull behind the front shoulder with a 6mm Remington (243 with a little bit more powder behind it). Chased and tracked the animal for miles and never did recover it. Just my thoughts. do as you please.

The old 6mm only stabilized 65-70 grain bullets with the slow twist rate. Wonder if that was more the problem than the actual caliber. Modern .243 (6mm) have a faster twist rate and most Hunters are shooting 90-105 grain bullets. Bullet construction is also super important…..don’t shoot fragmenting bullets and make sure you have a bullet that can penetrate. This is why arrows kill so well….they penetrate!! The 300 win mag likely had a bullet that wasn’t penetrating before expansion. Of course it could be the opposite….and a fmj just pencils through. A good bullet out of the .243 will kill very effectively.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: Taco280AI on June 11, 2023, 03:25:53 PM: Can be done, as many have said, but I'd look at the 270, 7-08, 280, 280AI, 7mag, 308, 30-06 with Accubonds, Partition, TTSX, or LRX.

LRX is the only bullet I use on big game anymore.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: BKMFR on June 11, 2023, 05:32:07 PM: Quote from: jason stevens on June 11, 2023, 12:48:31 PM
With the right shot placement a .243 will harvest an elk everytime. Don't buy into the hype of bigger calibers. Use what you have an enjoy your season. Remember you can harvest an elk with a razor blade at the end of a stick. So your 243 will work . I've taken 5 cows with mine . One shot. (Permit in hand ).
There might be some limitations at longer ranges, other than that if you are accurate and have the confidence in your .243 it will work just fine. At least it has for me, multiple times.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: JWBINX on June 11, 2023, 06:26:39 PM: Despite all the great replies:
The 243 is NOT elk Medicine!
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: Igor on June 11, 2023, 07:10:07 PM: Quote from: JWBINX on June 11, 2023, 06:26:39 PM
Despite all the great replies:
The 243 is NOT elk Medicine!

(https://i.imgur.com/W0K01tPl.gif)
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: dvolmer on June 11, 2023, 07:44:55 PM: Like shooting geese with a 410 shotgun. Can be done but not recommended.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: MADMAX on June 11, 2023, 07:59:57 PM: Can you ? Yes
Should you ? No
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: BEARHUNTER1 on June 11, 2023, 09:08:54 PM: Has the draw already happened!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: duckmen1 on June 11, 2023, 09:42:29 PM: Quote from: dvolmer on June 11, 2023, 07:44:55 PM
Like shooting geese with a 410 shotgun. Can be done but not recommended.

Can it be done yes. Effectively yes. To run steel in a 410 for geese. Not the best option. Agreed. But to say 410 not good at all I disagree. As there have been a lot of new shot options on the market. But you better be prepared to pay for the shot. Reloading for the 410 opens up a lot of opportunity when invested. But deadly effective on geese, turkey, ducks and upland birds. I hardly ever loose a bird waterfowl hunting. Have smoked 6 turkeys with the 410 none lost. Last 4 years have really opened my eyes to the effectiveness to the 410.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: Shawn Ryan on June 11, 2023, 10:54:38 PM: Shot my first few elk with a .243. Using it makes you get closer and choose shots like you are archery hunting. If you have that discipline, then use the .243. If you want to take longer or riskier shots, then choose a cartridge with more downrange energy.

Your decision to choose rifle over bow is based on having fewer fellow hunters, right? If that is your basis, I'd say that is bad info. Still less felt competition during archery season, IMO.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: huntingfool7 on June 12, 2023, 06:09:01 AM: Quote from: Shawn Ryan on June 11, 2023, 10:54:38 PM
Shot my first few elk with a .243. Using it makes you get closer and choose shots like you are archery hunting. If you have that discipline, then use the .243. If you want to take longer or riskier shots, then choose a cartridge with more downrange energy.

Your decision to choose rifle over bow is based on having fewer fellow hunters, right? If that is your basis, I'd say that is bad info. Still less felt competition during archery season, IMO.

^^^ This! ^^^ 243 will kill 'em ^^^ & Not going to see less hunters out there in a unit open for General season. ^^^
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: Stein on June 12, 2023, 06:44:13 AM: For sure, don't use your deer bullet on an elk. I wouldn't use a .243 but that's your choice. You don't need to jump to a magnum though, get a .308 standard cartridge and you'll be golden. .308, 30-06 something in that range.

If you're tracking deer you hit with a magnum, you either hit them very poorly or had very poor bullet performance, or both.

If you hunt general season in Washington, it's going to be high pressure. You can't get away from that by changing weapons or units, if it's a general tag you're going to see other hunters.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: rtspring on June 12, 2023, 06:48:13 AM: My kiddo killed a elk at 427 yds last year with 100 gr bullet from his .243

Bullet Placement is what matters.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: Taco280AI on June 12, 2023, 06:49:10 AM: Some people also win the lotto, but that doesn't make it the rule, only the exception.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: Buzzsaw461 on June 12, 2023, 07:08:41 AM: Quote from: Taco280AI on June 12, 2023, 06:49:10 AM
Some people also win the lotto, but that doesn't make it the rule, only the exception.
exactly
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: Mtnwalker on June 12, 2023, 08:24:29 AM: Quote from: Shawn Ryan on June 11, 2023, 10:54:38 PM
Shot my first few elk with a .243. Using it makes you get closer and choose shots like you are archery hunting. If you have that discipline, then use the .243. If you want to take longer or riskier shots, then choose a cartridge with more downrange energy.

Your decision to choose rifle over bow is based on having fewer fellow hunters, right? If that is your basis, I'd say that is bad info. Still less felt competition during archery season, IMO.

:yeah: This is where I'm at. If its the only rifle you're proficient with then I wouldn't hesitate to use it. Get the right bullet, close the distance and take smart shots. Would it be my first choice? No. Would it keep me out of the woods if it was my best or only option? Absolutely not.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: C-Money on June 12, 2023, 10:00:24 AM: Family on my wife's side killed a monster 360 class bull with a .243 win. They have killed quite a few elk with the .243 win. Those particular family members have about aged out of hunting like they use to, but they sure use to punch tags, a lot with a .243 win. I do think the .243 win is a bit under estimated. Its a pretty good big game cartridge. Probably wouldn't use it my self as a first choice elk gun, but I know its a dang good cartridge for filling the freezer.
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: dvolmer on June 12, 2023, 01:28:24 PM: Quote from: C-Money on June 12, 2023, 10:00:24 AM
Family on my wife's side killed a monster 360 class bull with a .243 win. They have killed quite a few elk with the .243 win. Those particular family members have about aged out of hunting like they use to, but they sure use to punch tags, a lot with a .243 win. I do think the .243 win is a bit under estimated. Its a pretty good big game cartridge. Probably wouldn't use it my self as a first choice elk gun, but I know its a dang good cartridge for filling the freezer.
. I agree. Great deer and antelope gun for sure!!
Title: Re: 243 for elk
Post by: WoolSocks on June 13, 2023, 06:15:36 PM: Quote from: Shawn Ryan on June 11, 2023, 10:54:38 PM
Your decision to choose rifle over bow is based on having fewer fellow hunters, right? If that is your basis, I'd say that is bad info. Still less felt competition during archery season, IMO.

It’s not that I think there will be less people in the woods, so much as that there will be others in the woods at all :) Sounds like if I want to hunt in solitude I have to combine my love for multi-day backpacking trips into the middle of nowhere with my love for hunting. At that point it probably doesn’t matter what weapon I choose.