Hunting Washington Forum

Big Game Hunting => Elk Hunting => Topic started by: Crunchy on June 03, 2009, 09:57:19 AM

Title: Elk calling
Post by: Crunchy on June 03, 2009, 09:57:19 AM: So I have been practicing with some different diaphram calls and it made me think. First once youve set up in an area do you bugle first or make a cow call? I think I understand a locator bugle which is the bugle without any chuckle after? If a bull bugles do you respond with a bugle or cow call? If you bugle back do you include the chuckle or just a response bulgle? I think in the past I have responded to bulls incorrectly and want to get these issues figured out.
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: boneaddict on June 03, 2009, 10:03:50 AM: It seriously all depends Crunchy. I know it doesn't answer your question. One solid thing I can say is you generally don't reply to a locator bugle with an agressive I'm going to kick your ass bugle. (chuckler)

but even that can happen if the situation is right.
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: Slider on June 03, 2009, 10:11:18 AM: Usually I will locate a Bull with a Bugle and slip in on him and softly cow call. :)
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: Huntbear on June 03, 2009, 10:14:07 AM: I have always tried a locator bugle first, if no response, will start using cow calls, then another locator bugle. The only time I have used a chuckler type bugle is if the bull used it first, or I KNOW I am within a couple hundred yards of a big boy.

BUT, like in anything, let circumstances and the animals dictate what to do.
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: Kain on June 03, 2009, 11:25:32 AM: Sometimes we use our cow calls as we are walking in. Like we are herd of cows. If by the time we get set up we still dont hear or see anything we let out a small bull bugle then open up with the cow calls for a few seconds then wait. Then play it from there.
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: Buckrub on June 03, 2009, 12:00:31 PM: Quote from: Huntbear on June 03, 2009, 10:14:07 AM
I have always tried a locator bugle first, if no response, will start using cow calls, then another locator bugle. The only time I have used a chuckler type bugle is if the bull used it first, or I KNOW I am within a couple hundred yards of a big boy.

BUT, like in anything, let circumstances and the animals dictate what to do.
:yeah:
Good Advice
to add on....if you know he is there and doesn't respond to anything....throw it all at him including beating the hell out of a tree.
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: bow4elk on June 03, 2009, 12:16:23 PM: I always go in light with cow calling, especially if I hear a bull first. May as well cater to his ego a bit. I generally call as little as possible in any situation. Locator/social bugling is good when you're covering ground and trying to locate a bull but adding chuckles or grunts is situation dependent and usually initiated when you want to force the situation. I reserve this, and lip bawl bugling for aggressive situations where you need to make something happen. If you mimic what the bull is doing, you can usually keep them interested for bit while you close the gap. I've found raking a tree works really well when you are inside 100 yards of the bull and he's hung up. I've had bulls bugle to the sound of raking in NM where it's wide open and the sound carries well.

Remember that your set up is absolutely key in all game calling. You have to make the bull come look for you so calling across large openings is generally a waste of time. They can pinpoint your sound/location within feet so you have to overcome this fact if you want to get him to come looking for you. If he hears you and should be able to see an elk, then he will get nervous and hang up and soon leave. Get in the thick of it and plan on the bull circling downwind of you in order to scent check what his ears are telling him. You'll need shooting lanes that allow you a shot before he can get downwind.

You're question is the topic of whole books so hopefully you can take the bits and pieces here and put together a strategy that works for you. Every situation is different and the best way to learn is by doing, making mistakes, and hopefully tagging a few bulls along the way. Good luck!!
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: BLKBEARKLR on June 03, 2009, 12:19:23 PM: Locator bugle, then it goes from there for me
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: TheHunt on June 03, 2009, 01:39:33 PM: If you bugle first you are shock gobbling the elk. Which means that if the elk are near by you have a good chance he will bugle back and move off. If you sound too big that will definitally happen.

I always cow call first. Wait.... Cow call again and wait.... Then bugle. Once you have the bull located then you can get your game plan together on how to attack the situation.
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: Houndhunter on June 03, 2009, 02:31:54 PM: to put it short-i always bugle first, unless he already is or has bugled or i see the bull
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: whacker1 on June 03, 2009, 02:54:28 PM: Great question - getting some even better answers - thanks to everyone.
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: Crunchy on June 03, 2009, 04:08:46 PM: Keep it going guys this is great info, and archery season is around the corner so I'm looking for help. Several times I have found myself into elk over the last three years, and could not get the bulls to come out. All suggestions are appreciated.
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: bow4elk on June 03, 2009, 04:50:49 PM: Some bulls need some "in your face" pressure to commit. Remember, the most vocal bulls usually have cows. Why would they leave their cows to come to your calling? That's the question you have to ask yourself. If you can slip in as close as possible without letting the wind or wandering eyes bust you, you can either cow call or squeal at close range to cause a reaction from the bull. If you bugle, you need to be OK with him hooking cows and moving off. If he moves off bugling, then he's still "huntable" because he thinks you're another bull and will bellar repeatedly while moving his cows. If he shuts up, you likely were seen or winded. Time to look for another bull or come back the next day.
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: pinetree on June 04, 2009, 05:42:51 AM: I like Jim Horn's (Primos Staff) Silent Calling technique. Have found it to be effective all thorugh the season and works even when the bulls are not talking much. Had to learn to be patient and watchful cuz most of the time they come in silent, but it does work.
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: Huntbear on June 04, 2009, 10:13:58 AM: Quote from: Buckrub on June 03, 2009, 12:00:31 PM
Quote from: Huntbear on June 03, 2009, 10:14:07 AM
I have always tried a locator bugle first, if no response, will start using cow calls, then another locator bugle. The only time I have used a chuckler type bugle is if the bull used it first, or I KNOW I am within a couple hundred yards of a big boy.

BUT, like in anything, let circumstances and the animals dictate what to do.
:yeah:
Good Advice
to add on....if you know he is there and doesn't respond to anything....throw it all at him including beating the hell out of a tree.

Just be careful, lol. I have brought in hunters doing the raking part.... lmao
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: TheHunt on June 04, 2009, 01:34:04 PM: Remember that Washington elk react to calls differently then other states.
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: bucklucky on June 04, 2009, 01:44:25 PM: Quote from: TheHunt on June 04, 2009, 01:34:04 PM
Remember that Washington elk react to calls differently then other states.

What??
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: Huntbear on June 04, 2009, 02:34:11 PM: Quote from: TheHunt on June 04, 2009, 01:34:04 PM
Remember that Washington elk react to calls differently then other states.

Not sure what you mean by that, but I learned my technique in Idaho, hunting with my dad and uncles, and it works just as well here on the wet side. Now, pressured bulls will definitely act different, that is why when I am looking for the big boys I am down in hell holes, or up on ridge tops 3-5 miles from the gates. I have called bulls in as close as 20 ft. up on St. Helens. Have had cows almost step on me too.

It all depends on the animals, and if you are believable in your calling, and that takes A LOT of practice. I normally keep a CD of elk calls in my vehicle, and practice as I go down the road... makes for some interesting looks, but at least it is accomplishing something during a boring drive.
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: pinetree on June 04, 2009, 05:25:20 PM: Yes, here in Washington you have to add an "accent" to your bugle so the elk will know that they have not wandered out of the state !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
:chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle:
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: TheHunt on June 04, 2009, 05:40:06 PM: Quote from: Huntbear on June 04, 2009, 02:34:11 PM
Quote from: TheHunt on June 04, 2009, 01:34:04 PM
Remember that Washington elk react to calls differently then other states.

Not sure what you mean by that, but I learned my technique in Idaho, hunting with my dad and uncles, and it works just as well here on the wet side. Now, pressured bulls will definitely act different, that is why when I am looking for the big boys I am down in hell holes, or up on ridge tops 3-5 miles from the gates. I have called bulls in as close as 20 ft. up on St. Helens. Have had cows almost step on me too.

Exactly, In Western Washington most herds are small compared to any other state. In Western Washington there are HUGE 4X4 and 5X5 and massive 300 inch 6X6's. If they have 8 to 10 cows they are going to pick up their ladies and move off before they are stolen from them. YOu sound big they will move off. Add that to the amount of pressure each elk gets each season they move off.

Go hunt a state that actually manages their elk for size and the elk will act differently. Arizona, Utah, Colorado...
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: Houndhunter on June 04, 2009, 06:24:02 PM: go to loowit, and you'll see some major action. although 5 mins there and you'll think your an elk calling expert :chuckle:
Title: Re: Elk calling
Post by: Pathfinder101 on June 04, 2009, 06:27:21 PM: I usually start by using a locater bugle, then if I get an answer, I cut the distance between myself and the bull by half and start cow calling. If that doesn't work to pull him in, I will try another light bugle. Like everyone's been saying, each bull is different. Sometimes they come to cows, sometimes they come for a fight, sometimes they act like they just want to be left alone, sometimes they act like they just couldn't care less, I think sometimes they are just looking for other elk to hang out with.
The year before last my boy was messin' with a nice satallite bull (about a 290-300 class 6X6 - I didn't have a bull tag, so we were just doing it for kicks). He was reall aggressive, so Justin started calling back to him agressively. Every time the bull bugled, Justin would "step on him" (meaning to bugle and interrupt him before he had finished his bugle). I don't think I have ever seen an elk so mad. He dug a hole in the ground that you could have just about hidden a Volkswagen in. We are lucky he didn't kick the crap out of us... :chuckle:
Of course it depends on the elk's social status too. Is he a spike? A raghorn? A satallite bull? A herd bull? Big herd? Small herd? Sometimes, early in the season, i have seen big herd bulls ignore the cows and the bugling while the younger bulls spend all their energy rounding up the cows into herds. Then when the temp drops and the breeding starts the old guy comes in, chases the young bull off his cows, and gets to work. :IBCOOL:

...I think there may be a life-lesson there...but I'm not sure.. :chuckle: