Hunting Washington Forum

Big Game Hunting => Muzzleloader Hunting => Topic started by: ThePascoKid on February 18, 2010, 06:28:44 PM

Title: Pistol carry rule
Post by: ThePascoKid on February 18, 2010, 06:28:44 PM: Anyone else notice this in the new proposed regulations?

Quote
However, a modern handgun may be carried for
personal protection ((if that person possesses a concealed pistol
license as defined in RCW 9.41.070)).

Looks like they're thinking about letting anyone carry.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: sisu on February 18, 2010, 07:00:55 PM: Where is the quote coming from? I'd like to see the link if at all possible.
thanks, scott
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: bobcat on February 18, 2010, 07:00:59 PM: Yes, I did see it. Archers and muzzleloaders will now be allowed to carry handguns.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: sisu on February 18, 2010, 07:05:43 PM: Quote from: bobcat on February 18, 2010, 07:00:59 PM
Yes, I did see it. Archers and muzzleloaders will now be allowed to carry handguns.
Bob, archers and muzzys were allowed last year too! How is this different?
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: bobcat on February 18, 2010, 07:06:51 PM: Last year you had to have a CPL. They are taking that requirement away.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: sisu on February 18, 2010, 07:07:27 PM: Quote from: bobcat on February 18, 2010, 07:06:51 PM
Last year you had to have a CPL. They are taking that requirement away.
Arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr I'm a LD learner, my bad.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: bobcat on February 18, 2010, 07:12:00 PM: Quote
WAC 232-12-054 Archery requirements--Archery special use
permits. (1) Rules pertaining to all archery:
(a) It is unlawful for any person to carry or have in his
possession any firearm while in the field archery hunting, during
an archery season specified for that area, except for modern
handguns carried for personal protection ((if that person possesses
a concealed pistol license as defined by RCW 9.41.070)). Modern
handguns cannot be used to hunt big game or dispatch wounded big
game during an archery, big game hunting season.

Quote
(3) In addition to the above requirements, it is unlawful to
participate (hunt) in a muzzleloading hunting season using a
firearm which does not meet the following specifications for a
muzzleloader. However, a modern handgun may be carried for
personal protection ((if that person possesses a concealed pistol
license as defined in RCW 9.41.070)). Modern handguns cannot be
used to hunt big game or dispatch wounded big game during a big
game hunting season for muzzleloading firearms.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: Whitelightning on February 21, 2010, 07:22:22 AM: Will interesting to see if it makes the regulations for this year.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: sako223 on February 21, 2010, 08:06:49 AM: This has been coming for years, a WDFW warden told me this about five years ago. He also expressed concerns of how long it would take to start seeing cheater kills. I bet it won't be long.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: Whitelightning on February 21, 2010, 08:11:02 AM: Quote from: sako223 on February 21, 2010, 08:06:49 AM
This has been coming for years, a WDFW warden told me this about five years ago. He also expressed concerns of how long it would take to start seeing cheater kills. I bet it won't be long.

I hope it takes a long time before we hear of cheater kills >:( I have m/l hunted for many years only wished a couple of times I had a side arm with me and truth be told a side arm would not have helped me if the critters had decided to take action.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: lee on February 21, 2010, 08:24:30 AM: I don't know 'bout the rest of my fellow hunters but, ... I don't carry a sidearm for the fear of runn'un into 4 leg critters. I carry for protection from the 2 legged ones.

A few years back someone had the balls to come into camp and steal my buddies generator.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: Whitelightning on February 21, 2010, 12:40:32 PM: Quote from: lee on February 21, 2010, 08:24:30 AM
I don't know 'bout the rest of my fellow hunters but, ... I don't carry a sidearm for the fear of runn'un into 4 leg critters. I carry for protection from the 2 legged ones.

A few years back someone had the balls to come into camp and steal my buddies generator.
:yeah:
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: bobcat on February 21, 2010, 01:15:36 PM: A pistol won't outshoot a muzzleloader so I don't see why there's any concern over somebody killing an animal with a handgun rather than their muzzleloader. :dunno:
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: carpsniperg2 on February 21, 2010, 01:49:18 PM: i agree with allot said, but some pistols will out shoot muzzleloaders as well i have a cfp in 7mm-08 that will out shoot my muzzle any day of the week i don't shoot my muzzles past 150 and would not have a prob with the 7mm-08 but yes most carry guns will not outshoot a muzzle. but at the same time i see more cheaters using them during archery season then muzzle season. i like the way it is set up now and there is some felons out there that hunt muzzle or archery because they can not have any mod firearms and i would not like them having a gun at anytime when i have to deal with them this is my :twocents: i hope it fails and stays the way it is.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: bonkellekter on February 21, 2010, 02:00:37 PM: Quote from: carpsniperg2 on February 21, 2010, 01:49:18 PM
i agree with allot said, but some pistols will out shoot muzzleloaders as well i have a cfp in 7mm-08 that will out shoot my muzzle any day of the week i don't shoot my muzzles past 150 and would not have a prob with the 7mm-08 but yes most carry guns will not outshoot a muzzle. but at the same time i see more cheaters using them during archery season then muzzle season. i like the way it is set up now and there is some felons out there that hunt muzzle or archery because they can not have any mod firearms and i would not like them having a gun at anytime when i have to deal with them this is my :twocents: i hope it fails and stays the way it is.

Shouldn't have to worry about the felons carrying a side arm - it is still illegal for them to carry a firearm regardless.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: carpsniperg2 on February 21, 2010, 02:03:06 PM: yes i know this but they are felons for a reason they like to break the law :chuckle: and one more reason for them to maybe get away with it. not very many gamies are going to do a background check on a archery hunter that has a handgun on them to know if they are legal or not and i think a few of them will use this a reason to carry one in the field :twocents:
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: bonkellekter on February 21, 2010, 03:25:34 PM: Your probably right about that. In general I just have a problem with any rule that affects when, where, why or how a law abiding citizen can protect themselves. Even though it may open up the doors to a very small group of individuals who would abuse it I would have to vote for this proposal.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: bonkellekter on February 21, 2010, 03:31:56 PM: This is the same approach that is commonly used by the anti-gun crowd. Trying to put rules in place to control the bad guys typically only has a negative affect on the good guy.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: Wacenturion on February 21, 2010, 03:47:05 PM: The question really should be...........why should the majority of law abiding folks be penalized for the possibility of a few that might take advantage of the situation and use the handgun. Just make the penalty stiff enough and most of those who might be tempted to try, won't. Those who are going to do something illegal in spite of possible penalty or law, are going to do it irregardless.

I shouldn't need WDFW's permission to carry concealed or otherwise, as it's a right, not a privilege. :twocents:
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: shoot-em-dead on February 21, 2010, 03:57:26 PM: on a side note- the rule says you can carry a modern handgun. It does not say that it can be carried concealed. I would assume that it would have to be open carry unless the said individual has a CLP.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: Curly on February 21, 2010, 04:16:56 PM: Shoot-em dead, I think you would be assuming wrong.

Washington State law allows conceal carry for people participating in a lawful outdoor activity. So, concealed should be allowed.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: carpsniperg2 on February 21, 2010, 07:23:58 PM: :yeah: just untill last year you could not then they made it with permit only. when they put this new rule in it did not say how you had to carry and in most countys you can carry open or concealed.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: Special T on February 21, 2010, 07:35:55 PM: If they can't catch poachers and rarely contact people in the field, why do you care how "legal" it is? I know we would all like to air on the side of caution but i would rather get home after a confrontation with a 2 legged predator, than worry about some BS with a game warden... :twocents: I read the post about the guy hunting in the Idaho panhandle with just a 4 shot rifle and 10 wolves tried to jump him... my little 38 revolver is gonna get traded in on a hi cap 9mm during hunting season next year! Its AWAYS better to be judged by your peers than not come home to your wife and kids!
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: bearhunter99 on February 21, 2010, 07:39:15 PM: I don't think the argument about the felons carrying is really an issue. Obviously they don't assume the same responsibility or worry about breaking the law in the first place. There are already laws in place to prevent them from carrying a firearm, what difference does it make if they have another law preventing them? They are going to have it concealed regardless of what the game laws state, therefore the Warden would have to have probable cause to search them anyway, and just being a felon does not give them probable cause from what I know of the law.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: Kain on February 22, 2010, 08:43:50 PM: This change was due to state law allowing people engaging in legal outdoor activities to carry concealed without a CPL. This also allows people under 21 to carry for protection while out in the woods, since a CPL requires you to be 21 to apply.

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=9.41.060 (http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=9.41.060)

Quote
The provisions of RCW 9.41.050 shall not apply to:
( 8 ) Any person engaging in a lawful outdoor recreational activity such as hunting, fishing, camping, hiking, or horseback riding, only if, considering all of the attendant circumstances, including but not limited to whether the person has a valid hunting or fishing license, it is reasonable to conclude that the person is participating in lawful outdoor activities or is traveling to or from a legitimate outdoor recreation area;

It is still illegal to use a modern firearm to kill or dispatch wounded game so adding another law on top of this make no sense.

http://wdfw.wa.gov/wlm/game/hunter/huntregs2009.pdf (http://wdfw.wa.gov/wlm/game/hunter/huntregs2009.pdf) Page 63
Quote
Dispatching Wounded Game
A hunter can only use a hunting method that meets
the equipment requirements of his/her tag to
dispatch wounded game.

Felons and criminals will still break the law no matter how many restrictions you put on the rest of us.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: bobcat on February 22, 2010, 08:45:35 PM: Right, plus if someone wants to break the law and use something other than a muzzleloader during muzzleloader season, why not use a modern rifle?
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: carpsniperg2 on February 22, 2010, 09:02:06 PM: i agree with you guys, and i am all aginst them puting restritions on us as well. i am all about the good old 2nd and am a life member of the NRA to boot. so i hear what you are saying, maybe it is wrong to think what i do, but i can just see some people shooting at a animal with a smoke pull missing and not bothering to reload the muzzle loader and start shooting with a handgun like said no matter how you look at it, it is still unlawful to use them to harvest or dispact the game.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: Kain on February 22, 2010, 09:28:43 PM: I hear ya. Totally could see that happening also which really sucks. I believe that black powder pistols are legal there is really no excuse for something like that to happen. I only hope that they come down hard on anyone that breaks the rules. It just seems like they always let them off easy and the rest of us are the ones who pay. The first time they catch someone doing that they will say "see, we told you this would happen."
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: carpsniperg2 on February 22, 2010, 09:33:56 PM: yeah they are legal, but there is limitations on barrel and size i cant remember what they are right now. i don't think the revolvers are legal :dunno: but don't remember right off hand.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: Kain on February 22, 2010, 09:40:16 PM: e. A muzzleloading handgun must have a
single or double barrel of at least eight
inches, must be rifled and be capable of
being loaded with forty-five grains or more
of black powder or black powder substitute
per the manufacturer's recommendations.
f. A muzzleloading handgun used for big
game must be .45 caliber or larger.
Title: Re: Pistol carry rule
Post by: carpsniperg2 on February 22, 2010, 09:47:21 PM: yep thats it.