Post by: bobcat on March 10, 2010, 04:04:05 PM
Quote
*ADDED 3/10/2010
PETITION FOR RULE CHANGE – DECISION:
Pursuant to Pursuant to RCW 34.05.330, the Commission will discuss and consider a petition for rule change submitted by Stevens County Commissioners and related to the next agenda item (#15). The Commission may either (a) deny the petition in writing, stating (i) its reasons for the denial, specifically addressing the concerns raised by the petitioner, and, where appropriate, (ii) the alternative means by which it will address the concerns raised by the petitioner, or (b) initiate rule-making proceedings
Here is the letter from Stevens County:
Post by: bowhunterforever on March 10, 2010, 04:26:58 PM
Post by: bobcat on March 10, 2010, 04:36:18 PM
Post by: bobcat on March 10, 2010, 04:40:52 PM
Scroll down to item #15 and click on "Stevens County Petition."
Post by: WAcoyotehunter on March 10, 2010, 05:23:00 PM
Post by: bearpaw on March 10, 2010, 05:30:56 PM
It might really make for some great hunting to let the yearlings survive their stupid year.... :dunno:
Post by: bowhunterforever on March 10, 2010, 05:36:18 PM
Post by: bobcat on March 10, 2010, 05:38:16 PM
the pend oreille county sportsmans club voted to support this petition as well (part of unit 117 is in this county) and I think the commissioners will support it. I think it's for a 3 pt though?
The letter says 4 point. Did you read it?
Post by: bearpaw on March 10, 2010, 08:28:01 PM
We do have a lot of cover, get them past the stupid year and they know how to stay out of sight. :dunno:
Post by: Wacenturion on March 10, 2010, 10:09:08 PM
Biologists all have varying opinions.......where Zender wasn't fond of it, the Biologist in the SE thought it was a good idea many years ago. It has worked well in the Blues, with excellent buck/doe ratios and lots of bruisers as well as plenty of legal smaller bucks taken every year.
A whitetail is a whitetail......you may see some differences based on habitat type and densities tied to that habitat, but in principal you will see a increase in mature bucks as well as smaller legal bucks available for harvest.
Post by: bearpaw on March 10, 2010, 10:47:23 PM
Post by: bobcat on March 11, 2010, 06:20:55 AM
Post by: bearpaw on March 11, 2010, 06:35:30 AM
There's only one way to know for sure.....a trial
Post by: bobcat on March 11, 2010, 07:14:10 AM
Post by: WAcoyotehunter on March 11, 2010, 08:08:54 AM
Post by: Wacenturion on March 11, 2010, 10:03:15 AM
http://www.wogameandfish.com/hunting/mule-deer-blacktail-deer-hunting/wo_aa075504a/ (http://www.wogameandfish.com/hunting/mule-deer-blacktail-deer-hunting/wo_aa075504a/)
Post by: Wacenturion on March 11, 2010, 10:10:48 AM
http://www.whitetailjournal.com/ArticleContent.aspx?id=2095 (http://www.whitetailjournal.com/ArticleContent.aspx?id=2095)
Post by: mulehunter on March 11, 2010, 10:30:17 AM
Mulehunter :dunno:
Post by: Ray on March 11, 2010, 10:38:20 AM
Post by: bearpaw on March 11, 2010, 10:39:25 AM
Post by: WAcoyotehunter on March 11, 2010, 10:54:36 AM
I promise they are trying to fool all of us trying to save as many deer to feed enough to Diamond pack and some new packs coming in. So it will balance out ok for 3 years at least then worst after that will happen for sure.that's untrue. The people pushing this are the sportsmen.
Mulehunter :dunno:
Post by: bearpaw on March 11, 2010, 10:59:52 AM
I promise they are trying to fool all of us trying to save as many deer to feed enough to Diamond pack and some new packs coming in. So it will balance out ok for 3 years at least then worst after that will happen for sure.that's untrue. The people pushing this are the sportsmen.
Mulehunter :dunno:
That is correct on this issue, it is local hunters pushing for this.
Post by: Cleve on March 11, 2010, 11:09:35 AM
Post by: Viszla on March 11, 2010, 11:59:52 AM
Post by: Ray on March 11, 2010, 12:03:24 PM
Quote
Like everywhere else in the state, if they want larger deer herds maybe they should just cut down the archery and muzzle season.
I don't see how that works out. You should explain how the math works on that or the philosophy. The way I view such an idea is that many current muzzleloaders and archers will pick up a rifle and harvest the same numbers during the modern season. Probably same number of deer killed. People would just migrate to different tags (or even different states) if the respective primitive seasons are diminished enough. The only solutions I see are going to be shortening seasons which nobody wants to give on and/or creating permit only hunting where it's needed (seems more viable).
Post by: NWBREW on March 11, 2010, 12:12:53 PM
If anything it would let deer live past their first year with antlers on their heads.
Post by: Viszla on March 11, 2010, 12:17:43 PM
Post by: Ray on March 11, 2010, 12:19:36 PM
Post by: sako223 on March 11, 2010, 04:15:44 PM
Quote
Antler restrictions are not synonymous with Quality Deer
Management. Rather, antler restrictions are a strategy to protect a specific age class (generally
1½ -year-old bucks, also called yearlings) or classes of bucks.
Quote
Many antler restrictions have been
used, including point, spread and beam length requirements as well as Boone & Crockett score. All
restrictions have advantages and disadvantages. The key to implementing an effective strategy is to
devise it from local data and then educate local sportsmen and women on the benefits.
Quote
Antler spread is a better predictor of whether a buck is 1½ or 2½ years or
older, and is therefore a more biologically sound approach to protecting yearlings.
Quote
The QDMA is encouraged by the increasing number of
states implementing strategies to protect yearling bucks. In general, the QDMA prefers the voluntary
passing of yearling bucks to mandatory antler regulations. However, we recognize that antler
restrictions may be justified in some situations to achieve specific deer management objectives. In
the long term, QDMA is optimistic that enough hunters will voluntarily pass young bucks that antler
restrictions will become unnecessary and even cumbersome to more sophisticated management.
Quote
The percentage of bucks in the harvest has declined in most states during the past decade. This is
a positive trend for the health of deer herds and habitat and for the future of hunting. The QDMA
recommends deer herds are maintained in balance with their habitat, with balanced adult sex ratios
and age structures. This situation is obtained by harvesting the biologically appropriate number of
antlerless deer and by protecting young bucks. For most states, adult bucks (1½ years and older)
should constitute less than half of the total deer harvest, and yearlings should constitute less
than half of the adult buck harvest.
These are quotes from the following Long Download link.
http://www.qdma.com/media/WhitetailReport09.pdf (http://www.qdma.com/media/WhitetailReport09.pdf)
Unlike most biologists WDFW related articles I find some palatable info here put together from across the US.
I also don't agree with more attempts at creating Trophy units as all that I can remember have failed and it is a lot of time wasted because the recovery time makes it even more miserable. Trophy units have failed for many reasons including that the goal is not exactly herd balanced. Next obviously is shoot-n-run and poaching. Then tribal hunting. Increased predators. Then the unthinkable disease and winters can bring it to zero again instantly.
Point restriction have become a requirement but dreams of creating trophy units will fail with point restriction being the only restriction. Even permit only trophy units have failed. Herd management should be the goal with limiting hunters. This will yield trophy animals.
Post by: Skycruiser on March 12, 2010, 03:56:21 AM
Post by: Skyvalhunter on March 12, 2010, 05:30:02 AM
Post by: yelp on March 12, 2010, 06:48:00 AM
So the WDFW now has this in the regulations..The Colville River permit 2nd deer tag..25 antlerless whitetail permits (wow) (won't solve any vehicle collision problems)
Here is the deer area description..
Deer Area No. 1035 Highway 395 Corridor (Stevens County): That
portion of GMU 121 beginning at the intersection of US Highway
(Hwy) 395 (State Route 20) and State Route (SR) 25: S on SR 25 to
Old Kettle Rd; E on Old Kettle Rd to Mingo Mountain Rd; S on Mingo
Mountain Rd to Greenwood Loop Rd; E on Greenwood Loop Rd to the
bridge over the Colville River; S on the Colville River to the
bridge over Gold Creek Loop/Valley Westside Rd; W and S on Valley
Westside Rd to the Orin-Rice Rd; E on Orin-Rice Rd to Haller Creek
Rd; S on Haller Creek Rd to Skidmore Rd; E and S on Skidmore Rd to
Arden Hill Rd; E on Arden Hill Rd to Townsend-Sackman Rd; S on
Townsend-Sackman Rd to Twelve Mile Rd; S on Twelve Mile Rd to
Marble Valley Basin Rd; S on Marble Valley Basin Rd to Zimmer Rd;
S on Zimmer Rd to Blue Creek West Rd; E on Blue Creek West Rd to
Dry Creek Rd; S on Dry Creek Rd to Duncan Rd; E on Duncan Rd to
Tetro Rd; S on Tetro Rd to Heine Rd; E and S on Heine Rd to Farmto-
Market Rd; S on Farm-to-Market Rd to Newton Rd (also known as
Rickers Lane); E on Newton Rd to US Hwy 395; N on US Hwy 395 to
McLean Rd and Twelve Mile Rd (also known as Old Arden Hwy); N on
McLean Rd and Twelve Mile Rd to US Hwy 395; N on US Hwy 395 to Old
Arden Hwy (again); N on Old Arden Hwy to US Hwy 395; N on US Hwy
395, through the town of Colville, then W on US Hwy 395 (SR 20) to
SR 25 and the point of beginning.
Post by: NWBREW on March 12, 2010, 08:18:02 AM
I've hunted Stevens County for over 30 years and have never shot a buck with less than five points on at least one side. I'm sure even some of the 4 x 5's I've taken weren't more than 2 1/2 years old. I think it's a good idea to let 'em grow up a bit.
Yea I know how it is I don't shoot anything less than 8 point mule deer myself!!
I may be wrong but are these quotes a response to my post? If so all I am saying is there are a lot of whitetails that put points on there heads at a young age. Last year I killed a 3x4 that was 2 1/2 years of age. No he was not big but would have been legal in the 4 pt. rule. I am not claiming to be the almighty trophy hunter. In 97' I killed a 1 1/2 year old buck that would have been legal for the 3 pt. rule....again, not big but legal. I believe whitetails to be different then mule deer in the reasoning that they put points on earlier. So I am not sure what your trying to get at. I'm just saying that a whitetail doesn't have to be old to meet the 3 pt. or 4 pt. criteria. It would be nice to see them get past the first year....that's all I was trying to say. No B.S. just my opinion and :twocents:.
I think if you want to shoot a buck with a nice BIG rack you need age. not so for points....at least not for whitetails.
Post by: Skycruiser on March 12, 2010, 06:53:41 PM
I've hunted Stevens County for over 30 years and have never shot a buck with less than five points on at least one side.
I wasn't being a wise guy, what I posted was true. I hunt on private property, a timbered ridge about a mile long above wheat and alfalfa fields. I routinely pass up smaller deer and regularly go home empty handed. Personally, I don't mind waiting for a good buck.
The last couple of years though have been particularly slim though, because of the string of bad winters and the high coyote population. The farmer who owns the property tells me he hasn't seen a fawn in the past two years. He's lived there his entire life (he's 70 now) and he says he's never seen a deer drought like this, even though the habitat hasn't changed.
Post by: boonerboy on March 12, 2010, 07:34:41 PM
Post by: bearpaw on March 13, 2010, 06:16:43 AM
Post by: Skycruiser on March 13, 2010, 10:26:08 AM
Post by: bobcat on March 13, 2010, 12:50:19 PM
One thing they are doing to help whitetail deer recover in the NE region is the youth/senior/disabled hunter general season in which they are allowed to harvest antlerless deer has been reduced from 14 days to 4 days. The 4 days will fall on the second weekend of the general season. This is a step in the right direction. They have also reduced antlerless special permit opportunity accordingly. The one thing they are doing that I'm confused on, is to address the antlerless deer archers take, they have taken away the antlerless opportunity in the early season and moved it to the late season. I don't understand what this is meant to do. Will it actually reduce the number of does killed by archers, or will it just move the harvest back to a later season?