Hunting Washington Forum

Equipment & Gear => Guns and Ammo => Topic started by: PA BEN on June 21, 2010, 06:32:55 PM

Title: Floating a gun barrel
Post by: PA BEN on June 21, 2010, 06:32:55 PM: Whats the best way to do this?
Title: Re: Floating a gun barrel
Post by: winshooter88 on June 21, 2010, 06:42:20 PM: If I was going to float the barrel on a high powered rifle, first I would pillar bed the action and the first 2 inches of the barrel. Then sand out the barrel channel so that it dosen't touch anywhere else along the barrel. This gives you a solid repeatable seat for the action to eliminate any movement in stock. Sanding out the barrel channel is to make sure that changes in the stock due to temperature or climate don't let the stock put pressure on the barrel and change the point of impact. On some guns it helps accuracy and on some guns it doesn't. Out of about ten guns I've done over the years, nine have geen helped by bedding the action and floating the barrel.
Title: Re: Floating a gun barrel
Post by: coop2424 on June 21, 2010, 07:15:10 PM: When I float a barrel I will usually find a round dowel or marker that is about the same size as the barrel and wrap sand paper around it and go back and forth on the stock where the barrel is tell the barrel would be floated if mounted in the stock. I want to have enough room to run a dollar bill down the barrel and does not touch any of the stock.. You can also loosen the screws tell you get space between the barrel and stock and put sand paper around half the barrel and run it up and down the barrel with sand paper facing the stock and then tighten the screws and continue tell the action is completely mounted and the sand paper moves up and down and does not touch the stock.. Hope this makes sense..
Title: Re: Floating a gun barrel
Post by: Bofire on June 21, 2010, 08:21:36 PM: :)very salty water and a very light barrel. :chuckle:
Carl
Title: Re: Floating a gun barrel
Post by: addicted on June 21, 2010, 09:54:05 PM: Quote from: Bofire on June 21, 2010, 08:21:36 PM
:)very salty water and a very light barrel. :chuckle:
Carl

try the dead sea, does wonders.
Title: Re: Floating a gun barrel
Post by: PA BEN on June 22, 2010, 05:45:35 AM: OK, settle down and get back to business. I have a Ruger M77 Mark II. The stock is tight to the barrel. I hear there hard to bed the action, but floating the barrel? Anybody done one?
Title: Re: Floating a gun barrel
Post by: jeepasaurusrex on June 22, 2010, 05:54:20 AM: Die grinder with a sanding drum attached. :)
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm4.static.flickr.com%2F3020%2F2747925441_e4e2a87256.jpg&hash=754ba95102a0eef3cbdefb93c65cc7612b25cf1e)
Title: Re: Floating a gun barrel
Post by: MDGrand on June 22, 2010, 09:01:31 AM: I do not have a ruger myself to compare too. But I have floated the barrel and bedded the action on my older SW model 1500. One thing I would offer is this:

How does it shoot now? If you are getting really good groups, then the barrel might shoot better with forend pressure, I found this to be the case with my 1500. if so, after you free float the barrel and if groups worsen, add some glass bedding material to the foreend tip or have a gunsmith do it and reshoot.

Midway USA has the exact tool for free floating a barrel. Might want to check them out. I would not free float the barrel without trying to see if you can glass bed the action, you need a really solid connection if the barrel is to be floated. :twocents:
Title: Re: Floating a gun barrel
Post by: JackOfAllTrades on June 23, 2010, 01:22:49 PM: Quote
first I would pillar bed the action and the first 2 inches of the barrel. Then sand out the barrel channel so that it dosen't touch anywhere else along the barrel. This gives you a solid repeatable seat for the action to eliminate any movement in stock. Sanding out the barrel channel is to make sure that changes in the stock due to temperature or climate don't let the stock put pressure on the barrel and change the point of impact. On some guns it helps accuracy and on some guns it doesn't. Out of about ten guns I've done over the years, nine have geen helped by bedding the action and floating the barrel.

This is very good advice.

Quote
I have a Ruger M77 Mark II. The stock is tight to the barrel. I hear there hard to bed the action, but floating the barrel?

These stocks are no more difficult than any other composite stock.

http://www.varminthunters.com/tech/bedding.html (http://www.varminthunters.com/tech/bedding.html)

I recommend this:

http://www.scorehi.com/pillar%20installation.htm (http://www.scorehi.com/pillar%20installation.htm)

Once you've used his kit, then you'll have learned enough to do it on your own without a kit. I prefer to use Acra Glass (Brownels.com) as the bedding agent.

-Steve
Title: Re: Floating a gun barrel
Post by: runamuk on June 23, 2010, 03:38:07 PM: for what its worth I have a ruger hawkeye and floated the barrel with my dremel tool using a sanding drum may not be the perfect way to do it but it worked :dunno: oh safety glasses are a must I still managed to get bits of synthetic barrel in my eye 8)
Title: Re: Floating a gun barrel
Post by: turkey buster on June 23, 2010, 04:20:17 PM: dont mean to ba a thread jacker but I have a question on this,
Is floating the barrel the same as bedding, if not what is the difference, and what is better and why
thanks chuck
Title: Re: Floating a gun barrel
Post by: PA BEN on June 23, 2010, 06:11:47 PM: My stock is wood.
Title: Re: Floating a gun barrel
Post by: yorketransport on June 23, 2010, 08:18:38 PM: As others have said, your barrel may not shoot any better once it's floating. There's an easy way to test it without modifying the gun though.

Take a pop can and cut small pieces to use as shims between the action and the stock. Just cut a hole in the aluminum shims so that the action bolts can fit through. Then place the shims between the action and the stock and tighten down the bolts. 2-3 shims should be enough to float the barrel so that it doesn't make any contact. Then just take it out and test fire it with a proven load. If the rifle shoots better than before, go ahead and open up the barrel channel to float the barrel.

If you want to bed the action and float the barrel, just wrap a little electrical tape around the barrel until it's floating in the forend the desired amount. Then when you bed the action, it (the action) will be sitting slightly higher in the stock, floating your barrel. FWIW, I use Devcon to bed all of my rifles.

Andrew
Title: Re: Floating a gun barrel
Post by: JackOfAllTrades on June 23, 2010, 10:12:41 PM: Turkey buster, I don't think you'd be considered a thread jacker at all by asking that question. So, I'll answer for that and to PaBen also.

Why would I want to float the barrel of my wood/synthetic stocked rifle?

Why would i want to pillar and/or glass bed my rifle's action? (and yes, there is a difference between pillar bedding and glass bedding, but most often the two tasks are combined.)

You would want to free float a barrel of a wood stocked gun because the wood changes it's amount of pressure on the barrel depending on the humidity and temperature of the wood. This amount of change can make the gun shoot to a different point of impact than when the rifle was sighted in if temperature and humidity conditions are different than the hunting/different time temperature and humidity. Can this happen with a synthetic stocked rifle? Yes, but normally to a lesser degree.

You want to pillar bed AND glass bed the action in the stock to have it in the same 'tight' position in the stock when the action is mounted in place so that for every shot, the action is solid, resulting in better consistency of what happens when a shot is fired. Most often, this leads to more consistent groups on target.

Floating the barrel is usually combined with the Pillar and glass bedding of the action as it is the result of the two actions most often regarded as being the most return for the layman and/or gunsmith to gain more consistent grouping of shots fired on target without working on the bolt face, barrel, or muzzle crown.

I've glass/pillar bedded, floated some actions/barrels to get a rifle that had a sloppy fit in the stock to get one that was so bad at 3" groups at 100yds, to be right at 1" at 100yds. Most people are quite happy with MOA shooting.

So, the question needs to be raised. . How is the gun shooting now? Bedding an action, and floating the barrel won't normally make a 1 1/2" gun shoot 3/4" groups.

Thing is, it's not a mirracle worker. There are several things that make a rifle shoot accurately. A loose fit in the stock is just one piece that can make a decent rifle/action/barrel shoot poorly, so attention needs to be focused on how well the action and barrel fit the stock.

-Steve
Title: Re: Floating a gun barrel
Post by: PA BEN on June 24, 2010, 06:26:46 AM: I talked to a gun smith yesterday about my ruger m77. He told me that the ruger stock only touches the barrel at the fore end of the stock. He said if it shoots OK then don't touch it. I told him my groups move around as the barrel worms up. It does fit tight in the stock. He said to take it out of the stock and see where the barrel is riding in the stock, the barrel will leave an impression on the wood. If it is to one side and not even then it's a problem. Sure enough the bluing on one side where the barrel touches the stock is worn and I can see where the barrel rides to that side by the impression in the wood. So I will even it out and see how it shoots. BTW, this gun has maybe 150 rounds through it.
Title: Re: Floating a gun barrel
Post by: JackOfAllTrades on June 24, 2010, 12:35:30 PM: Your groups move around as the barrel warms up. This is understandable to a degree in a hunting rifle as the barrel needs to cool to be predictable and shoot to a consistent point of aim. That said, if a sighting system is faultless, the shooter faultless, then often times the action is moving in the stock due to recoil. This is where pillar/glass bedding really helps. Pressure from the stock on the barrel is the first place to look, you've found that. Floating it may have a great affect, but may not if the action is loose in the stock, (not that you can move it around by hand), but loose under the snap of recoil. If clearancing that barrel doesn't help much, I'd look to the action bedding, loads, and sighting system.

-Steve
Title: Re: Floating a gun barrel
Post by: fremont on June 27, 2010, 09:26:15 AM: http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/3003214/1 (http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/3003214/1)