Hunting Washington Forum

Equipment & Gear => Guns and Ammo => Topic started by: Jekemi on September 28, 2010, 02:53:31 PM

Title: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: Jekemi on September 28, 2010, 02:53:31 PM: With just a few days to spare I’ve finally completed the Mosin Negant modernization project.
•   New synthetic stock
•   New drop-down bolt
•   New hex screws and aluminum bedding pillars
•   I machined and built the scope mount from inexpensive aluminum alloy bar stock, black socket screws, high-temp paint, and JB Weld (they wanted $90 for a new one)
•   New trigger pin
•   Shortened and re-crowned barrel
•   New scope, rings, and scope brackets
Now I just need to clean it up, polish the bore, sight it in, and my son is ready to hunt deer on October 15th over in Eastern WA. It was a fun project that took more time than I reckoned, mostly working on the scope mount. Many thanks to those on HuntWA who offered valuable advice. If you want a detailed, step-by-step let me know. Just email me.
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: FC on September 28, 2010, 03:55:04 PM: Can you see through that scope with the rifle normally shouldered? I only ask because it looks like the scope is centered at least 3" over the bore.
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: PA BEN on September 28, 2010, 04:06:49 PM: Looks more like 4"
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: Pathfinder101 on September 28, 2010, 04:23:26 PM: Interesting. Never seen one sporterized like that...
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: hunterofelk on September 28, 2010, 05:56:11 PM: Scope seems a little high. That rifle is going to get some second looks and start a few conversations.
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: Jekemi on September 28, 2010, 07:47:51 PM: FC. yes I can see through the scope normally shouldered. I haven't done any adjustments or fine tuning yet. Just finished the project this morning. I have tons of cleaning up to do and lots of work to do on the barrel. I hope to take it to the range on this Saturday. Any suggestions or recommendations you have are greatly appreciated. I may be asking you all for additional advice after Saturday's initial shoot. The gun feels very heavy and a little bulky but I won't be carrying it in October. My 22 year old, 6' 5" son, who is in great shape will be toting the gun.
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: FC on September 28, 2010, 09:16:18 PM: Please take this with the kindness intended: that rifle will be very difficult to shoot at varied ranges due to the scope height. You will find that the usual 2" high at 100 yards idea will not work well at all. If you set it 2" high at 100 it will shoot about 8-10" high at 200, if you set it equal to the distance in height from scope center to bore center at 100 you will hit maybe 4-6" low at 200.

The tough part is when you have a moment to take a quick shot, you have a good rest but little time due to the fact that the animal is only 30 yards away...Where on that animal do you aim? High...or low...FWIW I don't give that JB weld long against rifle recoil.

If you can get that scope down tighter to the barrel you will have a much better time of it. A mount like this one here will get the scope down as will one of the scout type mounts.

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=78/Product/MOISIN_NAGANT_SCOPE_MOUNTING_SYSTEM (http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=78/Product/MOISIN_NAGANT_SCOPE_MOUNTING_SYSTEM)

Scout mount. Use a long eye relief (pistol) scope with this.

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=12461/Product/NO_DRILL__NO_TAP_SCOPE_MOUNT (http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=12461/Product/NO_DRILL__NO_TAP_SCOPE_MOUNT)
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: Jekemi on September 29, 2010, 05:49:23 AM: FC, thanks for your comments. The problem I had was that the mount had to be sufficiently high in order for the bolt to clear the mount. I could have used a much thinner top bar, which would have brought the scope down about 1/4".
The mount is screwed into the receiver and into the rear sight bracket. The JB Weld is simply a little insurance. I used black socketed 10/32 machine screws. It is a solid mount.
The other problem I faced was that the 50mm front objective wouldn't clear the rear sight bracket. This required me to use high scope rings. I could try mid-height scope rings.
I didn't want to go with a long eye relief scope, which would have solved both problems; bolt clearance and front objective clearance.
This may be my only solution however.
Again, your advice and consultation is greatly appreciated.
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: jeepasaurusrex on September 29, 2010, 06:37:50 AM: What I have seen done in those situations is removing the bolt handle and rewelding/bending it to clear a scope. It may not have been practical in this situation though as my experience with these guns is limited.
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: Jekemi on September 29, 2010, 07:35:02 AM: jeepasaurusrex & FC: Thanks for your comments. I sent the original Mosin bolt (sticks straight out) to be replaced with this drop down model. But, when I slid it in place it hit the mount. I added and additional spacer as you can see. The bolt still just barely hit the top aluminum bar so I grown down the right rear edge to clear the bolt. As I see it there are 4 things I can do at this point.
1.   Use a thinner top bar, I have one; I just need to drill it and mount the scope brackets.
2.   Use mid-high scope rings (short rings don’t allow the scope to clear the rear sight bracket)
3.   Get a 3x9x40 scope, which has a smaller diameter front objective
4.   Use a long relief scope (I don’t want to do that)
I believe that if I follow the first three steps I can get the distance from the scope center to the bore center to 2" or 2 1/2 inches, which is acceptable. What do you guys think?
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: jeepasaurusrex on September 29, 2010, 11:18:23 AM: Didn't the originals have the scope mounted to the side?

It seems the high mounted scope is the norm on them.
I wonder if a cheek rest on the stock would improve stock to cheek meld?

Found this pic online. It looks like the scope is sitting a bit lower than yours?

(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fadvancedrifleparts.com%2Fimages%2F1942%2520Mosin%2520Nagant%2520Finished.JPG&hash=1b2466bf18c7491bb33bef1b048df0e02a96e2a3)
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: fisheral87 on September 29, 2010, 01:49:13 PM: That is sick man! Beautiful!

Thanks for sharing.
:rockin:
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: Chesapeake on September 29, 2010, 01:57:07 PM: You need to copy the scope mount in the pic above. The base needs to be far enough forward to clear the bolt handle and the scope rings close enought that you can slide the scope back so the rear ring is aainst the turrets.
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: FC on September 29, 2010, 04:17:11 PM: If you can get that thing down to 2" or so I would say you are in business.
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: carpsniperg2 on September 29, 2010, 04:29:43 PM: looks like you did a fine job!
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: Jamieb on September 29, 2010, 06:53:48 PM: Jekemi
Take a look at the scout scopes.
http://www.leupold.com/hunting-and-shooting/products/scopes/fx-ii-riflescopes/fx-ii-2-5x28mm-ier-scout/ (http://www.leupold.com/hunting-and-shooting/products/scopes/fx-ii-riflescopes/fx-ii-2-5x28mm-ier-scout/)
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: FC on September 29, 2010, 07:02:48 PM: If a guy was trying to get by on the cheap: http://cgi.ebay.com/Mosin-Nagant-M44-2-7x32-scout-scope-mount-ring-combo-/180376498148?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0 (http://cgi.ebay.com/Mosin-Nagant-M44-2-7x32-scout-scope-mount-ring-combo-/180376498148?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0)
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: G.R.K on September 30, 2010, 10:32:32 PM: ARAIG was a little tuff on you :chuckle:
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: Grizzly95 on September 30, 2010, 10:47:28 PM: Quote
Found this pic online. It looks like the scope is sitting a bit lower than yours?

Notice the bolt difference also.
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: Jekemi on October 03, 2010, 10:26:02 AM: I've appreciated all your great advice. As you know the Mosin Negant that I just sporterized has a 3 ½ inch gap between the center of the scope and the center of the bolt. Some have cautioned that this will make it very difficult to correctly sight it in. So here’s my solution that potential problem.
1.   I have a 50 mm front objective on the already high scope mount for the Mosin for two reasons.
a.   Stupidly, I bought a 50 mm scope (which I didn’t need)
b.   Scope mount top rail must be high enough to clear the bolt necessitating the unusually high scope mount
2.   I also own a Weatherby .270 with a Nikon 3x9x40 on it with short post rings.
3.   Then I had a Eureka moment!
a.   I simply took the .40 mm Nikon scope and put it on the Mosin using some extra short rings I already owned (looks great)
b.   I then put the .50 mm scope on the Weatherby. Problem solved.
4.   Now I have a 2 ¾ inch separation between the center of the scope and the center of the bolt.
5.   One Problem: the .50 mm front objective barely “kisses” the barrel of the Weatherby. You can slide an onion skin through but not a dollar bill. Will this be an issue?
If so, I will simply order some mid-high post rings for the Weatherby and re-mount the 3x9x50 on my Weatherby. Any thoughts?
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: Jekemi on October 03, 2010, 02:10:34 PM: Chesapeake: My custom made scope mount is much more rigid than the one pictured above. The reson is that it is anchored both by the rear sight and on the receiver. Now with the 3x9x40 scope and short rings it is at a reasonable hight above the bore.
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: FC on October 03, 2010, 03:54:20 PM: Jekemi, that flat bar that you have the picatinny blocks on? Move it forward just enough for the bolt to clear when you lift it and then re-modify that mount so you can drop it as low as possible. The closer to the barrel you can get that scope bell without touching the better off you will be. 2.75" is still pretty high but it looks like you can get it under 1.5" to me.
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: Jekemi on October 04, 2010, 08:28:41 AM: FC. that's a great idea. I can move it forward about 1" and remove two sets of spacers. This will get me right about 2 inches.
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: FC on October 04, 2010, 11:02:18 AM: Quote from: Jekemi on October 04, 2010, 08:28:41 AM
FC. that's a great idea. I can move it forward about 1" and remove two sets of spacers. This will get me right about 2 inches.

Did you do it yet? Let's see some pics!
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: Jekemi on October 07, 2010, 12:48:27 PM: FC. haven't made the modifications yet. I got this work thing at Microsoft that keeps me hopping. We are right in the middle of a product release si it's crazy right now. I'll try to get er done on Sunday. We leave Thursday morning for eastern WA. A buddy of mine has several hundred acres of private land that we will have exclusive access to. Keeping my fingers crossed.
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: FC on October 07, 2010, 02:30:37 PM: Yikes! Get that thing done and sighted in!
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: toyoda on March 01, 2011, 10:36:48 AM: What stock did you use? I would like to get a new lighter stock for mine
Title: Re: Mosin Negant project finally finshed
Post by: Jekemi on March 01, 2011, 02:13:13 PM: I used the ATI stock. I'd like to get the camo version however. Here's an update on the scope mount. I took the resized aluminum rail and removed the spacers. Then I got a solid piece of aluminum that was the same size. I machined the front section of the aluminum to match the narrow piece that fits into the rear sight on the barrel. This makes for a much more solid, single piece of aluminum that does't involve spacers or any JB Weld. Next I'll drill and tap the holes, paint the aluminum with several coats of high-heat flat black, and reattach the scope mounts.

This will make a very nice looking mount that sits much lower to the center of the chamber and should make sighting in much easier. The distance from the center of the scope to the center of the chamber will be about 1.5 inch. Total cost of the aluminum - $3.00. It will be a very strong and solid mount. Pictures will follow when completed.