Post by: Coasthunterjay on June 22, 2008, 10:03:59 AM
this all together is kind of cool, because i always thought of fish as being a really strong slimmy thing that i would like to catch more of......just man handle and throw back in the water.........so i can say ill deffinantly aproach fish differently.
But im also learning how to catch or fish for alot of different fish that i have never fished for differently.........
In western washington there are alot of regualations on most the lakes, and a few have weight regs, like crescent......
i am wanting to fish deep, but keep all my gear far away from what ever i am fishing with thats getting my gear low.....the problem is i can only use 2 ounces of lead to get it low........
WHAT ELSE CAN I DO TO GET MY GEAR LOW? and be able to keep my lure far away from what is getting me down there?
can anyone help? and if anyone else has any pointers on taking care of or handling fish that would be great.......all the pointers are appriciated!
Post by: Dman on June 22, 2008, 12:43:55 PM
Post by: Coasthunterjay on June 22, 2008, 01:00:48 PM
Post by: Dman on June 22, 2008, 01:28:33 PM
Post by: Coasthunterjay on June 22, 2008, 02:00:07 PM
if anyone else has an idea let me know.....i need to get around the 90 ft deep area.........
Post by: MIKEXRAY on June 22, 2008, 02:34:08 PM
I HATE GUYS THAT DON'T READ THE POST CLOSELY AND THEN GIVE THEIR ADVICE LIKE THEY KNOW EVERYTHING. OBVIOUSLY IF THE GUY COULD USE DOWN RIGGERS HE WOULDN'T OF POSTED THE ?. I OUGHT
TO GO TO FEDERAL WAY AND KICK MIKE XRAYS ASS. :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle: MIKE.
Post by: MuleySniper on June 22, 2008, 02:53:42 PM
MS
Post by: Alchase on June 22, 2008, 03:52:16 PM
"12 leadcore with rapala can achieve a max depth ( all colors out ) of around 30-35 feet deep depending upon speed. 15 - 27 lb leadcore will depend upon how much you can fit on your reel. One way to achieve a greater depth without using heavier leadcore is to use some of today's bass crankbaits. With some crankbaits on the market breaking the 20 foot barrier with monofilament, leadcore can achieve a greater depth. I have found the following baits to work great when I need to get down there - Bill Normans DD 22, Manns 15+, 20+, Rapala Risto Raps, and that's just to name a few."
Adding two ounces of weight can get you probably around 55-65 "while trolling" depending on how much line you put out and how fast you troll. At best your line will be around 45 deg of the back. Two hundred feet out at 45 deg is down 100 feet. Then at depth pressure bends it out flat agian. In reality it takes allot of weight to keep your bait at 90 - 100 feet.
Post by: Alchase on June 22, 2008, 03:56:13 PM
Sounds like you need some downriggers. I'm not sure what test line you use, but I mooch for salmon with 12 lb. line and 2 oz lead and get down no problem. Not sure how that will work trolling though.
MS
IF you have current to work with, I would do as MuleySniper suggests and troll vertically while mooching, allowing the current to provide trolling speed. Let your bait to sink to around 100 feet and jig it while slowely retreaving.
This covers both horizontal and vertical planes.
Post by: jackelope on June 22, 2008, 05:20:45 PM
lead core or wire line if you can find it and afford it, and 2oz should do it...or vertical jig them up maybe.??
Post by: boneaddict on June 22, 2008, 05:58:26 PM
Post by: MIKEXRAY on June 22, 2008, 06:15:57 PM
Post by: popeshawnpaul on June 22, 2008, 06:19:42 PM
Post by: jackelope on June 22, 2008, 07:27:26 PM
Hire a guide to take you out one day. Copy what he does. There are some huge cutts in there...
x2....learning that way is priceless IMO.
go back and do exactly what he did whenever you feel like it.
Post by: Dman on June 22, 2008, 09:13:48 PM
Post by: Coasthunterjay on June 22, 2008, 09:24:35 PM
Sounds like you need some downriggers. I'm not sure what test line you use, but I mooch for salmon with 12 lb. line and 2 oz lead and get down no problem. Not sure how that will work trolling though.
MS
IF you have current to work with, I would do as MuleySniper suggests and troll vertically while mooching, allowing the current to provide trolling speed. Let your bait to sink to around 100 feet and jig it while slowely retreaving.
This covers both horizontal and vertical planes.
on crescent you can only use artificial and if im fishing for the beardlee trout i figure something like a spoon aught to work the best, but it cant be a weighted spoon.
and i have 50 yrds of 18 lbs lead core line with another 50 yrds of 20 lbs power pro already.....
can i jig a spoon deep and still be sucessful?
Post by: Coasthunterjay on June 22, 2008, 09:27:19 PM
Virtually impossible to troll at that depth with those restrictions. Jiggin it would be your best or as Jack and I plan to do someday. Chironimid with a long leader. :)
chironomid? isnt that a fly?
im already using a 30 yrd leader? how much longer do i need to go? and i figure im on the 40 ft range now give or take 10 ft......
Post by: Coasthunterjay on June 22, 2008, 09:36:30 PM
you can definitely hit 90 feet with leadcore and 2oz weight. I know this is how a couple locals do very well up there, if I can find the article I'll scan it for you. Slow, slow, slow.
Do tell please....thanks that is what im looking for!
A plug trolls well at slow speeds
like a flat fish or like a spoon , what type of plug? ? ?
. Jigging is also worth a try but trolling will work, though these guys put days in for each fish, it's not a fishery that lends itself to impatience.
Deffinantly got patience and usually i just troll! just had to learn how to handle fish better, now im learning and hopefully soon ill be catching, even if its only one fish ! ! ! now that i know how special those fish are i think it would be an honor to catdch and release one and be able to tell about it.....kind of cool if i dont say so myself!
thanks guys keep the info comming.....but remember i cant use anymore than 2 oz....thats including the jig, lure, or down rigger thats getting me down there......
and as far as i was told downriggers are not allowed.....and im not sure if they make deep 6 gear that small.......maybe they do though, ill look into it, and see what the benefit would be!
maybe jackelope or bone can tell me! can i catch those trout at 40 plus feet or do i still need to get deeper? would it benefit me to use a heavier pound lead core line to get deeper? or maybe use a flat fish versus a spoon, or maybe a single hooked rapala style lure? something that fishes deeper like a diver?
Post by: robodad on June 22, 2008, 09:53:06 PM
http://www.washingtontrout.org/crescent.shtml (http://www.washingtontrout.org/crescent.shtml)
Post by: MooseStock on June 22, 2008, 09:59:59 PM
Post by: Coasthunterjay on June 22, 2008, 10:03:39 PM
Jay, I dug up a little information you may want to read and maybe change your plans on trying to catch one of these fish, They are in deep trouble according to this article !!
http://www.washingtontrout.org/crescent.shtml (http://www.washingtontrout.org/crescent.shtml)
i understand, But am still going to.....as long as fish and wildlife says its ok, and i catch it in the means that they put for me i am going to.......
thats why imtrying to do it legally!
But thanks allen.
Post by: jackelope on June 22, 2008, 10:10:52 PM
i think these fish hang on the bottom. thats what i know. if the bottom is 40', then they will be at 40'. i would suspect that with colder water temps, they will probably be a little shallower.
Quote
The new rules are designed to protect Lake Crescent’s population of Beardslee rainbow trout, which has declined to a critically low level. Beardslee trout are a unique form of rainbow trout, native to Lake Crescent, and found nowhere else on earth. They spawn in late winter and early spring in only one small area of the Lyre River, near the outlet of the lake. Washington Trout conducted independent spawning surveys on the Lyre this past spring and found alarming evidence of very low numbers of spawning fish, indicating that the population has experienced a severe decline. This evidence was supported by counts made by Park Service crews that officially counted only 35 spawning redds (slightly higher than WT’s count), the lowest number since official redd counts were begun in 1989.
Post by: robodad on June 22, 2008, 10:15:08 PM
I know you will do the right thing !!
Sorry didn't get to read all of the nuked thread before it blew up !!!
Post by: Coasthunterjay on June 22, 2008, 10:29:57 PM
But as for now.....i need deep talk.....and i need 100 ft deep.....im getting half that.....
Post by: jackelope on June 22, 2008, 10:42:11 PM
it's popular on the great lakes...it requires special rods or rod tips at a minimum and a reel.
you should have 600' of wire to reach 100' depth
Post by: Coasthunterjay on June 22, 2008, 10:47:32 PM
would a diver of some kind work jackelope? or do you think that wil just scare fish? kind of hard to attach a diver without it being close to your lure?
Post by: jackelope on June 22, 2008, 10:56:06 PM
you could put a lure as far away from the diver as you want, but you will lose control of the depth of your lure if you are too far away.
the wire sinks faster and has a lot less resistance in the water than the lead core because of a much thinner diameter. i have never fished with either lead core or copper wire, so i couldn't tell you which works better.
the weight restrictions are in place to make it as difficult as possible for you to get to the depths these fish hang at. go into this knowing that you will likely fish for more than 1 day to catch 1 fish. if you were upset with your day of 2 trout and a koke the other day, you are in for a long day doing this right.
Post by: Coasthunterjay on June 22, 2008, 11:02:26 PM
i think i might invent something.....been thinking about it, and my idea might work, just got to make it work........
if i use a deep 6 style, no more than 2 ounces.....
the mas you can use is 2 so that will be it.....no added weight, but if i can find a non weighted diver....and then run my weight, then aedd a diver plug, maybe ill get it to 100 ft......ill do what ever it takes......and im in no hurry!
Post by: Dman on June 23, 2008, 07:57:01 AM
Post by: Alchase on June 25, 2008, 11:14:09 AM
Post by: tlbradford on June 25, 2008, 01:29:32 PM