Post by: dylanb on December 08, 2011, 06:48:58 PM
Post by: colockumelk on December 09, 2011, 05:40:27 AM
http://stores.elknut.com/Detail.bok?no=48 (http://stores.elknut.com/Detail.bok?no=48)
Elknuts playbook will help a lot. It goes great with tje audio cds.
http://stores.elknut.com/Detail.bok?no=140 (http://stores.elknut.com/Detail.bok?no=140)
As far as calls goes. I own elknuts bugle. "The chuckler". It works great. All my other calls are made by Rocky Jacobson. Pretty much the only reed I carry in my mouth is the blue one called "the remedy" does everything from cow calls to rag horn bulls. Does all of their sounds. You will also want a mouth call to give you more range. Rocky Jacobsons "who's yer daddy is the best." Here's some links.
Who's yer daddy
https://buglingbull.com/gamecalls/140-whos-yrr-daddy/ (https://buglingbull.com/gamecalls/140-whos-yrr-daddy/)
The remedy
https://buglingbull.com/gamecalls/100-the-remedy-navy-blue-elk-call-diaphragm/ (https://buglingbull.com/gamecalls/100-the-remedy-navy-blue-elk-call-diaphragm/)
Bully bull grunt tube.
https://buglingbull.com/gamecalls/126-bully-bull-grunt-tube/ (https://buglingbull.com/gamecalls/126-bully-bull-grunt-tube/)
Anymore questions just ask. The calls are a personal preferance. But work great. The calling CDs are non negotiable. You want to learn to call in elk. Get them now and listen to them over and over again and practise practise practise. If you do this you will call in bulls.
Post by: Elkpiss on December 09, 2011, 06:57:41 AM
Simple go to elknut.com buy his 4pack of audio CDs. Or his MP3. It will teach you all you will need to know about calling in bulls and then some. It will instantly give you about 10years of calling experience. Here's his link.
http://stores.elknut.com/Detail.bok?no=48 (http://stores.elknut.com/Detail.bok?no=48)
Elknuts playbook will help a lot. It goes great with tje audio cds.
http://stores.elknut.com/Detail.bok?no=140 (http://stores.elknut.com/Detail.bok?no=140)
As far as calls goes. I own elknuts bugle. "The chuckler". It works great. All my other calls are made by Rocky Jacobson. Pretty much the only reed I carry in my mouth is the blue one called "the remedy" does everything from cow calls to rag horn bulls. Does all of their sounds. You will also want a mouth call to give you more range. Rocky Jacobsons "who's yer daddy is the best." Here's some links.
Who's yer daddy
https://buglingbull.com/gamecalls/140-whos-yrr-daddy/ (https://buglingbull.com/gamecalls/140-whos-yrr-daddy/)
The remedy
https://buglingbull.com/gamecalls/100-the-remedy-navy-blue-elk-call-diaphragm/ (https://buglingbull.com/gamecalls/100-the-remedy-navy-blue-elk-call-diaphragm/)
Bully bull grunt tube.
https://buglingbull.com/gamecalls/126-bully-bull-grunt-tube/ (https://buglingbull.com/gamecalls/126-bully-bull-grunt-tube/)
Anymore questions just ask. The calls are a personal preferance. But work great. The calling CDs are non negotiable. You want to learn to call in elk. Get them now and listen to them over and over again and practise practise practise. If you do this you will call in bulls.
Funny, that is pretty much my arsonale as well, The Remedy is a dandy, but also get the brown one, its the Ragging Bull, but I am starting to like the Remedy the best.. And as far as the whose your daddy cow call, its pretty good I tooted that for a few years but i will have to be honest, Phelps cow call blows it out the water, more realistic sounding IMO.. You cant practice enough blowing elk calls especially one you put a reed in your mouth it takes practice to be an elk.. :twocents:
Post by: ELKBURGER on December 09, 2011, 07:04:31 AM
Post by: Martinhunter on December 09, 2011, 07:23:43 AM
Post by: NWWABOWHNTR on December 09, 2011, 07:31:10 AM
Post by: deerhunter_98520 on December 09, 2011, 07:38:37 AM
Get ahold of jphelps, he's a member on here and makes his own custom cow/calf calls and they work excellent. Or just go to his web site primetime-outdoors.com.:yeah: i dont head in the woods without it...best call ive heard...if i can call in a bull the first time out with it the call must be damn good :chuckle:
Post by: Button Nubbs on December 09, 2011, 08:02:49 AM
Post by: PolarBear on December 09, 2011, 08:12:17 AM
Post by: BrushChimp on December 09, 2011, 08:45:30 AM
Get ahold of jphelps, he's a member on here and makes his own custom cow/calf calls and they work excellent. Or just go to his web site primetime-outdoors.com.
Actually, you can just go directly to Jason's own website. http://www.phelpsgamecalls.com/ :tup: Great calls.
Post by: Martinhunter on December 09, 2011, 08:58:07 AM
:yeah:Get ahold of jphelps, he's a member on here and makes his own custom cow/calf calls and they work excellent. Or just go to his web site primetime-outdoors.com.
Actually, you can just go directly to Jason's own website. http://www.phelpsgamecalls.com/ :tup: Great calls.
Post by: colockumelk on December 09, 2011, 09:15:01 AM
Post by: PlateauNDN on December 09, 2011, 09:22:00 AM
x2 on Rocky's Bugling Bull calls... I prefer the yellow and red reeds myself with the brown a close 3rd.
:yeah: :tup: I use the blue reed for all my cow calls, the yellow for young satellite bull calling and the brown for herd bull/big bull calling. This year worked out great for it and I put on a show for my wife calling away at three different bulls at the same time mixing up the calls facing different directions. What ever works for you give it a try. :tup: After JPhelps's article on his calls earlier this year I think I'm going to pick one up for next year. :dunno:
Post by: THEBUGLER on December 09, 2011, 09:36:00 AM
Dirk
Post by: STIKNSTRINGBOW on December 09, 2011, 09:40:00 AM
EVERY year I talk to quite a few Elk hunters who always say "Their just not bugling", and "They are not in the rut yet".
I have heard Elk bugle every year despite what these guys have said, even managed to get in some bugling exchanges with Bulls.
I feel that whatever you can make work for you, what you are confortable with, will work.
Practice, practice, well you get the idea.
Then when you think you can make a reasonable bugle...
Thats all you need, some real elk I have heard have been the worst buglers out there.
The key is knowing when to bugle, and when not to.
When hunting Roosevelts, I have learned that if you bugle from the top of a hill, you usually do not get a response.
But get down in the "Thick and Nasty" and lots of times it is a whole different story...
I also learned a new "trick" this year from a member on here that resulted in a LOT more responses, but have taken an oath of silence.
I highly reccomend getting Elknuts DVD's, they will also tell you when to bugle, and why...
IMO, cow/calf calls need more practice than the bugles.
Remember, in September, Bulls want cows.
So a Cow call can be your best friend, You can get a response from a lousy bugle, but if your cow calling does not sound real...
Post by: PolarBear on December 09, 2011, 10:11:28 AM
What I have found with Roosies is that the looooooong drawn out. 16 note bugles that you see these Rocky hunters on TV blow will spook Roosies sometimes but the very short, higher pitched bugles will get a reponse. If you get one to answer you back try to mimic what he said but it more abrupt and higher pitched. I agree with not screaming from the mountian tops and consentrating on the brush. Another thing is most guys bugle waaay too much. Do a couple of bugles to locate, get closer then try again. I like to have them calling me and not the other way around. :twocents:
Post by: colockumelk on December 09, 2011, 10:17:16 AM
What I find curious, I have been chasing Roosevelts for 3 years now, after 20+ years on the east-side (I began on the west-side 33 years ago,but that was rifle) and thought I was a good Elk caller.
EVERY year I talk to quite a few Elk hunters who always say "Their just not bugling", and "They are not in the rut yet".
I love this. Every year its always "too hot" or the "moon isn't right" :chuckle: Its always something else and not them. I just nod my head agree and push deeper in. My opinion is if you are not hearing anything bugling etc then you are not where the elk are. If you are in a basin 30 minutes before daylight and you are not hearing anything, and a locator bugle or lost cow call doesn't get a response, the elk are NOT THERE. Move on. I have noticed that when I am in an area where there are no elk, I typically do not get anything to respond. But when I am in a place that has elk in it I usually get elk to respond.
My typicall method is use a locator call and listen. When a bull responds, take note of where he is and move in on him as fast as I can and ALWAYS with the wind in my face. When I think I am near where he is I will do another locator. If close enough the bull will usually tell you to pound sand. Then sneak in as close as you can and do the one of the 3 elknut threat scenarios. Works every time. A note if I have moved in and I know where he is such as cows are chirping or I hear him then I will skip the second locator and just move in as close as I can get.
Post by: ouchfoss on December 09, 2011, 10:20:12 AM
Post by: colockumelk on December 09, 2011, 11:05:46 AM
I am in close, and there is about ten cows and a herd bull. No matter how many times I cow call to him or what cow call I use I am NOT gonna get him to come to me. He has a bunch of cows so why leave them for a single cow. Oh he will respond and tell me to come over but he is not gonna come over. Now if I'm close enough and I do a scenario where one of his cows have strayed a bit and a small raghorn is trying to push her away (especially if I have used estrus sounds) he WILL respond because one of his cows is getting picked off by a small punk. So this is a situation where the bugle is a must.
Now lets say there is a herd bull without any cows or a herdbull with a bunch of cows but you know there is some raghorns hanging around. A lost cow call or an estrus cow call is going to be deadly. A raghorn is going to come in to investigate and try to pull this cow away from the herd, which is why he's hanging around. Like I've said there are times to bugle and times to cow call. Experience will tell you which one to use and when.
Post by: christopheri on December 09, 2011, 11:07:47 AM
x2 on Rocky's Bugling Bull calls... I prefer the yellow and red reeds myself with the brown a close 3rd.
I second that. Look up Elk Nut, he has everything you will need to start calling. Pratice, Practice, practice. Good luck :tup:
Post by: colockumelk on December 09, 2011, 11:16:49 AM
Post by: Elkpiss on December 09, 2011, 11:58:06 AM
Post by: ouchfoss on December 09, 2011, 02:48:05 PM
My last post kind of sounded like I was trying to say I'm better than ouchfoss. That wasn't my intent. Sorry if it sounded that way. My intent was to show that each situation is different and no two elk are going to be called in the exact same. So don't restrict yourself to one single method. Didn't mean to try and trump someon elses experience. Again I'm sorry.
Honestly you probably are better at it then I am considering my track record the last couple years! :chuckle: Its still a learning process for me. I use to never call at all for elk up until 8 years ago. First day that I ever decided to use cow talk I arrowed a nice 5x5 and swear by it now. I use to just spot and stalk elk and always seemed to be pretty productive when you could take cows in so many different places back in the day. I mainly target lone bulls and have been pretty productive at that with my strategy but a bull who already has cows and is the lead bull is a whole other ball game I have yet to seal the deal on. Seems like if I try bugling at a herd bull he just answers back and leaves with his herd.
Post by: colockumelk on December 09, 2011, 03:14:54 PM
Post by: big wood on December 09, 2011, 08:53:40 PM
Post by: AKBowman on December 10, 2011, 06:33:04 AM
I found Roe Hunting Resources website from a member on the forum here and it was like seeing the light. Chris Roe is a active wildlife bio who has spent thousands of hrs studying and living with elk. The way he breaks down when and why elk make sounds really helps the listener understand elk language.
I would recommend googling the site and checking it out, I am really impressed.
Post by: colockumelk on December 10, 2011, 09:34:28 AM
I will definately check out the guy you mentioned since you can not ever get enough info.
Post by: AKBowman on December 10, 2011, 11:46:28 AM
Either way you are better off by researching either one
Post by: colockumelk on December 10, 2011, 12:25:56 PM
Post by: Hunter Dug on December 10, 2011, 12:29:50 PM
Post by: BowBender87 on December 10, 2011, 01:41:17 PM
Post by: throttlejocky20 on December 10, 2011, 01:51:13 PM
Post by: JPhelps on December 10, 2011, 02:02:41 PM
The specific call doesn't matter as much as being able to produce the right call at the right time. This takes buying many different elk calls (especially diaphragms) to see what works best for each caller. Mouth shape is a key factor. External calls come down to the tone you're looking for and ease of use.
Creating the right setup to call in a bull is the single most important thing I have found to consistantly calling in bulls. Is the wind right? How is the bull reacting/responding to calls? What time of day is it? Etc...
Paul (elknut) does a very good job of explaining elk vocalizations. With that being said I only use three calls 99% of the time to call a bull in during the rut. They are the locator bugle, estrus whine and challenge bugle. In all of my readings on calling in bulls this is the same strategy and methodology used by other good elk hunters/callers such as Corey Jacobsen and Steve Chappel.
Also you may hear it said that Roosevelts don't talk much and people approach them different than Rocky Mtn elk. I have not found this to be true and call very aggresivley (part of the fun). Everyone eventually will come up with their own way of calling and I say use what works best for you.
My advice to you would be to buy some different calls (the calls mentioned in this thread would be a good start) and practice and see what works for you. YouTube videos of live elk is a great resource for practicing calling.
I also do all my bugling through a modified $5 whiffle ball bat.
Post by: colockumelk on December 10, 2011, 05:05:16 PM
Jphelps. Sounds like we have the same exact bugle. In fact somewhere this year I lost my bugle. If it was a $30-40 storebought I would be pissed. But mine is homemade so oh well :chuckle:
Post by: christopheri on December 10, 2011, 07:06:52 PM
Yeah dude you should get his worse than wolves cds it will change your life.
I cant agree that it is life changeing but I do like Pauls aproach and the way he explains what each sound or series of sounds meanes to an Elk. It has been an excellent vidio for learning. I am new to Elk hunting and Elk hunting has changed my life forever! :tup:
Post by: colockumelk on December 10, 2011, 08:31:10 PM
Post by: dylanb on December 11, 2011, 08:51:25 PM
Post by: foambeetle on December 12, 2011, 10:03:24 AM
TONS of instructional stuff at RHR (Roe Hunting Resources) on vocalizations, etc. To get at all the content at RHR you have to pay a few $, but it is well worth it. :twocents:
From what I've seen the "twist of the tube" does not do much w/ the select a bull tube.
Good advice from JPhelps:
"My advice to you would be to buy some different calls (the calls mentioned in this thread would be a good start) and practice and see what works for you. YouTube videos of live elk is a great resource for practicing calling.
I also do all my bugling through a modified $5 whiffle ball bat."
Post by: colockumelk on December 12, 2011, 01:23:01 PM
First of all thank you guys for all the help. I think I made my mind up on the bugling bull ' select a bull' the reason is you can use a diagram or aregular snap on band and you can make small medium and big bulls all with the twist of the tube.
Not saying that tube is a good tube but its overpriced IMHO. For one thing I can make small medium and big bull sounds without the need for a twist thing on my tube. Also you are not going to "blow away" an elk with how big your sound is. Anyone who has had an elk scream at them 50yds or less knows what I'm talking about. Even a small raghorn will put out WAY WAY more sound than you could ever possibly hope to put out. When people say big bull or medium bull etc they are referring to the tone/pitch of the bugle, not the amount of volume. Our tiny lungs can't put out close to the amount of volume as a real elk can put out. So I don't know why some bugles have the volume restrictors on them. IMHO they are useless and can only impede your calling.
Second I would never go into the hills with one of those snap on bands. They sound like what they are, a person calling. I primarily use the remedy. I can do cow sounds, spikes bugles, and medium sized bugles. All with one call. I don't have to change anything out. This means if I'm doing a "threat" set up I can instantly go from a cow sound to a bull sound instantly. With a snap on band I dont see you doing that.
I would buy elknuts chuckler or Rocky Jacobson bully grunt tube for cheaper than the one you listed and just learn how to use a diaphram. Because once you do you wont ever use the snap on stuff. Also if you want to call in bulls you wont want to use the snap on stuff. Now I will say this the thing I do like about the tube you mentioned is the fact that it collapses down in size. That is its only redeaming feature IMHO.
Post by: JPhelps on December 12, 2011, 01:59:14 PM
Also a caller that wants to continue to get better and progress in their calling will limit out using these type of bugles.
Not to mention I don't personally like the sound they make. With the time you have until next year, I would suggest an open tube and diaphragms.
Post by: dylanb on December 12, 2011, 05:06:52 PM
Post by: colockumelk on December 12, 2011, 05:25:46 PM
Post by: Elknut1 on December 12, 2011, 05:29:15 PM
I would certainly check out Phelps game calls as well, his cow call is very nice that he offers & would compliment any mouth reeds you decide on!
There are some very good calls out there in the various brands available to elk hunters today, we all have slightly different builds so it's not rare to find one call feels & works better than another! As to your question, the Closer & Mellow Yellow calls are what I would recommend to you as a beginner or a veteran elk caller! These 2 are the most user friendly calls on the market & this is very important in how they work & feel now & you can grow with these calls, actually you would never need anything different than these 2 to be come a very good elk hunter & caller! If you are looking for a lightweight Grunt Tube Bugle that would go good with these reeds I would recommend the Lil Chuckler Starter Kit. This Kit includes the 2 reeds, Bugle & a 1-Hr. DVD called Mastering The Mouth Reed. The Bugle DVD & Calls go well together & will get you on the right track to start your learning process now. Here's a link to this Kit!
http://stores.elknut.com/Categories.bok?category=COMBINED+PACKAGES&searchpath=130257487&start=13&total=13
ElkNut1
Post by: colockumelk on December 12, 2011, 05:39:43 PM
Post by: JPhelps on December 12, 2011, 09:11:21 PM
I am also going to give away one of my best kept secrets. The Knight and Hale "Prosecutor" turkey call is the best bugling diaphragm I have ever used. Yes I typed that right and it is marketed as a turkey call. The only downside is that it doesn't make very good cow talk (the rasp prevents a clean break). This diaphragm is for real, and was my go to locator and challenge bugle reed this year.
Post by: deleted BGS on December 12, 2011, 09:15:07 PM
Post by: colockumelk on December 13, 2011, 07:01:29 AM
The reason our rut goes so long is unlike other states WA has a really low bull:cow ratio. Most states are 30:100 where in WA other than the blues the best you're gonna find is 15:100. So there are alot of cows not getting bred. Therefore the rut in WA lasts longer and is not as intense as in other states. When you have only a couple bulls per harem of cows the rut isn't going to be too intense. Where in other states you might have 4 or 5 bulls per cows. So the rut is gonna be intense. :twocents:
Post by: PlateauNDN on December 13, 2011, 08:48:29 AM
Post by: PA BEN on December 13, 2011, 05:16:06 PM
Post by: TommyH on December 16, 2011, 09:43:33 AM