Post by: HighCountryHunter88 on January 05, 2012, 09:34:08 PM
Post by: JimmyHoffa on January 05, 2012, 09:49:39 PM
Post by: high country on January 05, 2012, 09:49:50 PM
Post by: MtnMuley on January 05, 2012, 09:55:57 PM
Post by: JimmyHoffa on January 05, 2012, 09:56:56 PM
Post by: RadSav on January 05, 2012, 10:02:23 PM
I've got about 10 different light weight packable rain shells. Have yet to find one I really like that is quiet. They're either heavy and quiet, light and noisy, or repel water like a paper bag. I'd really like to know if you find a good one!
Post by: MtnMuley on January 05, 2012, 10:07:39 PM
Post by: Miles on January 05, 2012, 10:11:52 PM
Jacket - Wool or fleece (I use high quality fleece a lot more these days, but still have my green Johnson wool jacket)
Vest - Sometimes I'll pack a down vest because it's light, although it rarely gets used...
Rain gear - Marmot precip./ Space rain/ frog toggs (based on use and weight)
The reason I bring the down is because it's light and gets tossed in my waterproof E-vent compression sack. I may use it while bumming around the tent or if I'm sitting for a long period of time and get a little chill. I personally would steer away from down as a full outer layer for everyday use because IF it gets wet it will not insulate as well, and they tend to have noisy outer shells on down jackets. Fleece and wool are very quiet.
Post by: Miles on January 05, 2012, 10:13:41 PM
Post by: RadSav on January 05, 2012, 11:17:01 PM
RadSav -- KUIUs rain gear is top notch. Just spendy.
I'd agree. It's the best so far though still too noisy. When it gets cold it sounds like it is made of broken glass. Liked it slightly better than Sitka's light, but that camo pattern is even worse than Optifade! My guide in NWT was wearing it and he glowed in the fog like a lighthouse.
I've been wearing my Cabela's Gore-Tex bird pants lately just because all the rain pants are so dang loud or uncomfortable. But, climbing in Ascent or even 90% pants is so much nicer. One of these days someone is going to do it right. Hopefully before I'm too old to hit the high country. Though I expect that's only a few years away.
Post by: jager on January 06, 2012, 12:03:54 AM
RadSav -- KUIUs rain gear is top notch. Just spendy.
I'd agree. It's the best so far though still too noisy. When it gets cold it sounds like it is made of broken glass. Liked it slightly better than Sitka's light, but that camo pattern is even worse than Optifade! My guide in NWT was wearing it and he glowed in the fog like a lighthouse.
I've been wearing my Cabela's Gore-Tex bird pants lately just because all the rain pants are so dang loud or uncomfortable. But, climbing in Ascent or even 90% pants is so much nicer. One of these days someone is going to do it right. Hopefully before I'm too old to hit the high country. Though I expect that's only a few years away.
I'm in the process of replacing most of my camo since some low life thieves thought they needed it more than me.
So are you saying that the kuiu glowed from the ambient light reflecting of of the "hard"surface and was not being absorbed by something like fleece...or???
I had a ton of the Sitka mothwing...gone!
I just ordered 2 pair of 90% 2 pair of the mountain, one ascent and one timberline pant. In the optifade open country pattern :dunno:
I read the reviews mostly good the pics looked good too..why dont you like it?
I have a pair of the stormfront lite pants, they are NOISY, but very,very packable.
I have never relied on "lofted" garments..is that a word? :chuckle: You know like down or polyfill stuff. My opinion: I'ts too risky to end up with soggy clothes.
I layer with the thinner stuff.
Post by: RadSav on January 06, 2012, 01:01:16 AM
Gore's claim is that the animals can not tell what you are - not that they won't see you. I myself, if I know something is following me yet I can not tell what it is I get a little nerveous. Animals seem to be the same way. I wore the OC one day on the wetside elk hunting on a dark day. I'd never before seen blacktail does turn inside out at 300 yards away - regardless as to wheather I've been skylined or making human noises. It was truly amazing how much I upset them that day.
In contrast I've spend a good amount of time in the past few years chasing goats in lower BC above timberline. The Open Country and Kuiu has been reasonably good up there. Though, my guides all want my Mothwing as a tip instead of cash money after they see it in that environment. I love the Sitka fit and feel so I purchased a ton of Forest and what Mothwing I could get my hands on. Both seem to work well Eastside and Westside, Texas to the North Slope. I believe in the Sitka products and highly recommend them to anyone hitting the high country or stand hunting. I'm just not fond of the OptiFade pattern for stalking. Sitting still is not my idea of hunting. I have a nice recliner and a 60" tv when I want to sit still.
Jager - I'd be doing some serious investigative work if my Mothwing were stollen. Tweekers have a way of falling down and hurting themselves really bad after a score like that. My cousin "Guitto" is in the market for some Mothwing :chuckle:
The Stormfront lites and the Kuiu are both very packable. And, if it's raining hard enough the noise isn't such a big deal. But, that is also the best time to be stalking and OC makes that really tough.
The other thing that really sets those two apart is they have no elastic cuffs. Browning made some fantastic lightweight/packable rainwear in the past, but the elastic cuffs made them worthless unless you tore out the seams and removed it. That was a lot of work for a $150.00 set of rain gear that only held up to 5 or 6 days of hunting.
Post by: Miles on January 06, 2012, 01:14:34 AM
I usually rifle hunt in a solid green fleece jacket, or a checkered green and black wool jacket. I've never had any real problems sneaking up on deer.
Post by: jager on January 06, 2012, 01:15:59 AM
I really liked the mothwing pattern. I think sitka, for all the hype, really is fantastic gear.
Looks like I'm going to need some of the forest pattern... :)
Post by: jager on January 06, 2012, 01:18:36 AM
If you're rifle hunting the camo pattern doesn't matter much. The big orange vest negates any "advantage" the camo may be giving you.
I usually rifle hunt in a solid green fleece jacket, or a checkered green and black wool jacket. I've never had any real problems sneaking up on deer.
I wear orange camo :chuckle:
I bow and rifle hunt..I know there is much more to it than the camo pattern....I like to hide from the two legged predators too... :chuckle:
Post by: RadSav on January 06, 2012, 02:00:03 AM
But try still hunting bedded blacktail bucks in the tall timber or cutting across a hill side in plain view of a bedded sheep at 100 yards so you can get behind that one single rock that might keep you hidden while you close the rest of the distance to bowhunting glory. That's when your camo pattern makes a difference. Light beige in front of dark green or dark brown ain't going to allow you much room for error.
That shopping list you gave there Jager adds up to be about as much as my elk hunt in Canada is going to cost. And that's at my Sitka ambassador price!!! And for all the stollen goods to be Mothwing....Makes me sick and it's not even mine.
Bummer part is that not all the selection is available in Forest. Sure wish it was! Sad thing is it probably never will be either. I believe my Sitka Gear is worth every penny I spent on it, but it could be worth Oh so much more ;).
Post by: high country on January 06, 2012, 05:43:49 AM
Post by: boneaddict on January 06, 2012, 05:47:50 AM
Post by: lewy on January 06, 2012, 06:20:59 AM
Not many orange vest hunters are going to try and get that 50 yard shot down to 30 or less. And usually you want to stay completely out of sight at that distance. So camo patterns don't always play a big role there, I agree.
But try still hunting bedded blacktail bucks in the tall timber or cutting across a hill side in plain view of a bedded sheep at 100 yards so you can get behind that one single rock that might keep you hidden while you close the rest of the distance to bowhunting glory. That's when your camo pattern makes a difference. Light beige in front of dark green or dark brown ain't going to allow you much room for error.
That shopping list you gave there Jager adds up to be about as much as my elk hunt in Canada is going to cost. And that's at my Sitka ambassador price!!! And for all the stollen goods to be Mothwing....Makes me sick and it's not even mine.
Bummer part is that not all the selection is available in Forest. Sure wish it was! Sad thing is it probably never will be either. I believe my Sitka Gear is worth every penny I spent on it, but it could be worth Oh so much more ;).
:yeah: I sure wish they would offer mothwing again, some of my stuff has worn out and i had to replace it with oc, love the feel but hate the look
Post by: boneaddict on January 06, 2012, 07:05:23 AM
LOW AND SLOW
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv47%2Fboneaddict%2FAntler%2520Images%2Fdeerinrocks.jpg&hash=91efb7d46a57972ad88c9bcea5a84bde422187ab)
Post by: 400out on January 06, 2012, 07:24:22 AM
Post by: boneaddict on January 06, 2012, 07:27:20 AM
If a man my size can hide...... :chuckle:
I blend in by looking like a squatch
Post by: blackveltbowhunter on January 06, 2012, 11:35:16 AM
Post by: Skyvalhunter on January 06, 2012, 11:44:01 AM
Post by: yajsab on January 06, 2012, 12:27:26 PM
Post by: RadSav on January 06, 2012, 02:07:07 PM
Post by: RadSav on January 06, 2012, 02:19:04 PM
Sorry HighCountry, we sort of jacked your thread.
Post by: HighCountryHunter88 on January 06, 2012, 02:36:09 PM
Post by: swanny on January 07, 2012, 12:43:46 PM
http://www.rei.com/product/807677/rei-revelcloud-jacket-mens (http://www.rei.com/product/807677/rei-revelcloud-jacket-mens)
Post by: deerslyr on January 07, 2012, 01:36:04 PM
Post by: jackelope on January 07, 2012, 01:47:04 PM
Post by: RadSav on January 07, 2012, 02:33:46 PM
RadSav, you seem to be a gear junky so I have a question, have you tried the apxg2 l5 rain gear from russel outdoors? If so how does it compare to sitka and kuiu?
I've held 'em in my hands and thats about it. Looks like good stuff on the rack. I really liked the color they used on the Mossy Tree Stand. Only reason I did not get them was the Kuiu had just arrived. If I remember correctly it was built more like the Stormfront than the Stormfront Lite and a little heavier. But I look at so much of the stuff trying to find something better I can never remember what was what. Getting "Old man" memory issues I think. If you get it I'd like to know what you think.
Post by: RadSav on January 08, 2012, 12:27:41 AM
If Russel is there I'll take another more detailed look at the APX stuff. Might even try to swindle them out of a pair or two.
Planning on spending some extra time with the Eberle guys this trip. My hope is I can get them to make me an improved waist belt for the Blue Widow similar to Kuiu's. Got the camera just incase I can find something new worth sharing. Talk to you guys next weekend.
Damn I hate the airports and flyings these days :bash:
Post by: boneaddict on January 08, 2012, 07:16:17 AM
Post by: fillthefreezer on January 09, 2012, 07:53:45 AM
the spacerain from cabelas ahs ALOT of reviews complaining abou it tearing very easy
Post by: RadSav on January 14, 2012, 09:03:18 PM
Post by: deerslyr on January 14, 2012, 09:04:34 PM
Post by: RadSav on January 14, 2012, 09:11:51 PM
Post by: RadSav on January 15, 2012, 05:50:45 AM
That being said, Sitka had some great additions and changes that fit perfectly into our post here. I was extremely happy to see them offer a Kelvin Lite vest this year. Same fantastic design I have grown to really appreciate in my Kelvin series clothing with about 30-50% less Primaloft. Should be a great addition to my pack for those late summer/early fall nights on the mountain. It made me so happy I purchased one for all the guys heading to Canada elk camp with us this September.
In 2012 Sitka will no longer be offering the Stormfront Lite series of rainwear. It will be replaced with the new Dewpoint series. An ultra lite model should pack smaller, has a quieter shell and much, much better color. The softer texture to this new Dewpoint series must absorb more color from the dye used. No more bright beige almost white background in the Open Country pattern. It's even a good bit darker than my Jetstream vest though not so dark as to effect the features of the OptiFade pattern. I wish it was available in the Forest pattern. However, I was impressed enough to purchase one set in standard weight and a set in the ultra lite weight to give them a good testing. I think those of you who procrastinated in getting your Stormfront Lite's will be glad you did. It's more than a small improvement, in my opinion.
There are a handful of guys I look forward to seeing each year at this show. These guys are world class bowhunters who spend a good amount of their fall chasing critters above timberline. I have the utmost respect for them and appreciate their willingness to share knowledge. This year I asked each one of them what rainwear they were carrying during the past season. Each and every one of them said the same thing, "Under Armour!" Each one was carrying the UA Stealth in their packs and a couple were also wearing the Ridge Reaper pants and jacket when hunting a little closer to the truck. The Reaper series has a liner, which makes it heavier and less packable, but it does not have that typical rainwear clamminess they say. It is also a much more durable product which might make it a reasonable tradeoff when I'm chasing goats in the jagged rocks of Kimberly or bear in the north Cascades berry fields. As luck would have it UA did not have any rainwear at the show for display or pictures. But with that kind of recommendation I ordered a pair of each anyway.
Each year ends with me disappointed with my rain wear. Hopefully between the new Sitka and Under Armour 2012 will break my endless cycle of frustration. They will be worth every penny if I don't feel I need to try something else for the next seven or eight years. Or listen to the squaw complain about how much of my crap just takes up space she could be using for her stuff (insert George Carlin quote here).
The most exciting new item of the show this year, or at least to myself, was PureWash. After breaking the bank on rainwear it was a pleasure finding myself horse trading one of my miniature display bows for one of these cool gadgets. Similar to the systems used by hospitals it attaches to your washing machine and turns your cold water from H2O to H3O. Gone will be the days of buying high priced Scent Free laundry detergent to avoid smelly detergent with blue white brighteners. All my cloths will now be washed in cold water saving energy and protecting colors. Not using soap should also be much more friendly to all the Gore-Tex garments as well. If it works as advertised it should be one of the best deals I've made in years.
Post by: RadSav on January 15, 2012, 05:51:59 AM
Post by: boneaddict on January 16, 2012, 06:54:18 AM
Post by: huntnnw on January 16, 2012, 09:43:36 PM
Post by: huntnnw on January 16, 2012, 09:53:51 PM
Post by: alecvg on January 17, 2012, 11:56:25 AM
Iam buying the KUIU stuff this year...Ill buy that over Sitka...Sitka is way over priced. The KUIU chugach coat is $299 and if you keep eyes open in there closeout or overstock u can get it considerably cheaper
The Kuiu stuff is awesome! Altho9ugh I like the optifade camo WAY better, I am not gonna pay the price sitka charges.
Post by: MtnMuley on January 17, 2012, 03:49:58 PM
Post by: summit creek on January 17, 2012, 07:11:25 PM
Post by: RadSav on January 17, 2012, 08:07:37 PM
Iam buying the KUIU stuff this year...Ill buy that over Sitka...Sitka is way over priced. The KUIU chugach coat is $299 and if you keep eyes open in there closeout or overstock u can get it considerably cheaper
Sitka's jacket that equals the Kuiu chugach is the exact same $299.00 suggested retail. And with the Stormfront Lite being discontinued I expect you'll find some better deals on that as well (239.99 @ Cabela's right now). Guess I don't understand why it's "way over priced" yet costs the same. Same guy designed it. Pretty much the same process to manufacture it. Perhaps I'm missing something :dunno:
Edited Wed: 18th - I did forget about the standard Stormfront which is a Performance Shell and not the Packlite Shell running it's price to a suggested retail of $499.00. Though I haven't seen a retailer ask that much it is a more expensive garment. I personally did like the Lite a little better.
Also, remember that Kuiu is not sold in stores and is sold wholesale direct to the consumer.
It's not completely apples to apples so "yes" I guess I did miss a little something.
Post by: blackveltbowhunter on January 17, 2012, 08:43:30 PM
Post by: RadSav on January 17, 2012, 09:07:38 PM
I do agree Gore-Tex does have it's limitations and shelf life.
Post by: huntnnw on January 17, 2012, 10:25:54 PM
Post by: huntnnw on January 17, 2012, 10:26:49 PM
Post by: RadSav on January 17, 2012, 10:41:39 PM
Post by: JimmyHoffa on January 17, 2012, 10:42:45 PM
Post by: RadSav on January 17, 2012, 10:57:39 PM
A well made and laminated Gore should have no crease. That's why Danner boots will never stay water resistant and Hanwags will. Sitka has Gore membrane and a DWR outer coating. Kuiu has a Toray Dermizax membrane and a DWR outer coating. Very much alike. Just because it doesn't carry the Gore name doesn't necessarily mean it's a whole lot different. The new Sitka outer fabric brings them even closer together. You like one you should like the other. You hate one I'm not so sure you're going to be pleased with the other. Again, same designer, very much the same manufacturing. Only real difference I could see is that Tamoda Apparel seems to have a bit better stitching.
Camo is for humans when on stand or rifle distance. Move within bow range and it's a different story. Just ask my Kuiu clad NWT guide who spooked the first two rams we approached. And, that's in country better suited to the lighter high contrast patterns. He was young, could bend over and hide much better than I and yet they busted hard upon seeing his slightest movement. White on Black will never be better than black on black. Ungulate or human.
I'm in no way trying to talk anyone out of purchasing Kuiu. It is good stuff and worth every penny. Might even be a little better deal than the standard Stormfront being wholesale direct. Just saying the right Sitka stuff is worth what I spend. Like any extensive product line some items are good and some not so much. Both Kuiu and Sitka still have their weaknesses. But both are better than any others I've tried.
If Kuiu went to Mountain Mimicry I'd switch back in a heart beat. Even though their cut doesn't seem to fit my fat arse quite as nicely as the Sitka.
Post by: runngun on January 27, 2012, 09:21:31 PM
I have been pretty impressed with the Core 4 Element Mountain Mimicry stuff off of Camofire.com. I have only gotten their light weight stuff, but it's great quality for the price.