Post by: jetboatinghunter on January 28, 2012, 11:04:42 AM
I want to figure out which bullet shoots best out of it, then go and buy the dials for it. I want one bullet, that will shoot elk, mule deer, bears and the occasional moose. I get confused when I look at all of the different offerings. I don't handload, so it would have to be something I could buy over the counter. I would like the ability to shoot to 50-500 yards, and consistently kill something. I have looked at the Bergers, E-Tips, Accubonds, Interbonds, etc. I am kind of old school, and like the Nosler Partitions, but it seems to me they may have faded out?
If you guys had to shoot one bullet for everything, for the rest of your life, what would it be? Thanks!
Post by: Curly on January 28, 2012, 11:10:07 AM
Post by: Gutpile on January 28, 2012, 11:44:04 AM
BTW, you dont have to buy the dial for the CDS, its free. You call them with the load information, elevation where you hunt, average temp and they send the dial for free.
Post by: Fowlweather25 on January 28, 2012, 11:48:01 AM
Post by: Gutpile on January 28, 2012, 11:50:02 AM
Post by: Fowlweather25 on January 28, 2012, 11:51:12 AM
Post by: addicted on January 28, 2012, 02:18:44 PM
Accubond, perfect combination of high BC, bonded toughness, and mushroomability.
It would be wicked if they made a partition with a polymer tip and a boattail, but hat would be one long stinking bullet because some of the lead space is taken up by the copper "partition".
Post by: 300rum on January 28, 2012, 02:42:45 PM
It is a little expensive to begin with but once you know, you know, and it will be significantly less expensive then loading your own unless you shoot thousands of rounds/year.
Post by: KenPCPilot on January 28, 2012, 02:51:14 PM
Post by: PA BEN on January 28, 2012, 03:20:10 PM
Post by: Biggerhammer on January 28, 2012, 04:03:53 PM
I have taken many big game animals over the last 25 years and I have used many bullets in the process. I was very fond of the Hornady Interlocks in the early years and still am but due to success in the field and accuracy Nosler has been my mainstay for many years and I have no doubt whatsoever when a Accubond is snuggly seated in the chamber, no matter what weight or bore diameter. Through first hand experience from point blank to extended ranges the Accubond kills like lightning and is just as accurate.
Then again Remington green box factory ammo accounts for more big game animals stuffed in the dirt per year than probably all other factory ammo combined and what bullet are they running in their basic stuff? CORE-LOKT!
Post by: JohnVH on January 28, 2012, 05:21:18 PM
Post by: jackelope on January 28, 2012, 05:25:08 PM
Post by: bobcat on January 28, 2012, 06:15:01 PM
Post by: Bob33 on January 28, 2012, 06:27:39 PM
AccubotBarnes are good but the BC is so bad compared to the others I wouldnt choose them for a long range bullet.The difference in trajectory at 500 yards between a 180 grain bullet at 2960 ft/sec zeroed at 250 yards with a BC of .4, and one with a BC of .5 is about 3".
Post by: Eli346 on January 28, 2012, 06:44:24 PM
Post by: Bofire on January 28, 2012, 06:59:34 PM
Carl
Post by: Fowlweather25 on January 28, 2012, 07:02:50 PM
Post by: Biggerhammer on January 28, 2012, 09:06:15 PM
If you're wanting to hunt moose I definatley wouldn't shoot any lighter than 180 grains :twocents:
Moose are wusses. Seen plenty of them tipped over by much smaller. Watched a 14 year old girl crush a big boy with a .270 and a 130gr.
Post by: Gutpile on January 28, 2012, 10:35:24 PM
AccubotBarnes are good but the BC is so bad compared to the others I wouldnt choose them for a long range bullet.The difference in trajectory at 500 yards between a 180 grain bullet at 2960 ft/sec zeroed at 250 yards with a BC of .4, and one with a BC of .5 is about 3".
Not sure what your point is. If you build your entire rig around long range performance why not use a high b.c. bullet. I have nothing against Barnes, I use them. They wouldnt be my "long range bullet" choice. Just sayin.
Post by: carpsniperg2 on January 28, 2012, 11:07:15 PM
Post by: Jerbear on January 28, 2012, 11:39:05 PM
Post by: addicted on January 28, 2012, 11:59:05 PM
AccubotBarnes are good but the BC is so bad compared to the others I wouldnt choose them for a long range bullet.The difference in trajectory at 500 yards between a 180 grain bullet at 2960 ft/sec zeroed at 250 yards with a BC of .4, and one with a BC of .5 is about 3".
Not sure what your point is. If you build your entire rig around long range performance why not use a high b.c. bullet. I have nothing against Barnes, I use them. They wouldnt be my "long range bullet" choice. Just sayin.
Got no lead, got no soul lol.
Every time you buy a lead free bullet, an anti gets her picketing sign :(
I Know barnes as been around since before the antis were taking away hunting one bite at a time but it still doesnt help us keep our hunting priveledges by dumping money where the anti's push us rather than keeping lead bullets in demand so that the ammo manufacturers fight to keep them there which stops the antis from coming from that angle.
and no, how could they make a good long range bullet. Need high weight to get high BC and with no lead these things gotta be way long. thats why they cut those 3 grooves in the side. The bullets were getting so long that they had to do something to reduce the drag in the barrel. They probably get so long that you need an even tighter RoT like the VLD's.
Post by: jetboatinghunter on January 29, 2012, 08:49:22 AM
Post by: bobcat on January 29, 2012, 09:06:43 AM
Thanks for all of the input. I am leaning towards the Nosler accubonds. Does anyone know how they are really different than the e tip?
The etip is an entirely different type of bullet. It is made of 100% copper, like Barnes bullets. The etip should penetrate better than the Accubond, and retain a higher percentage of its weight. It also likely does not expand quite as much or as easily as the Accubond.
Post by: Bob33 on January 29, 2012, 09:14:49 AM
My point is that he already defined "long distance" as 500 yards, and at 500 yards the difference in trajectory due to BC is negligible..AccubotBarnes are good but the BC is so bad compared to the others I wouldnt choose them for a long range bullet.The difference in trajectory at 500 yards between a 180 grain bullet at 2960 ft/sec zeroed at 250 yards with a BC of .4, and one with a BC of .5 is about 3".
Not sure what your point is. If you build your entire rig around long range performance why not use a high b.c. bullet. I have nothing against Barnes, I use them. They wouldnt be my "long range bullet" choice. Just sayin.
Post by: jackelope on January 29, 2012, 10:19:53 AM
Berger VLD's rely heavily on the rate of twist in the barrel I think, and their bullet that shines regarding the super high BC is their 7mm bullet. How does their .30 cal bullets stack up#1, #2 are they a good hunting bullet or are they a good target bullet?--I think on deer it doesn't matter much but when you get up into the elk/moose/bear sized animals anyway, and #3 what's your rate of twist in the barrel and how much will that matter? I'm not a long range guy so I don't know the answers here, just raising some possible points for talk.
Post by: high country on January 29, 2012, 10:51:33 AM
Post by: JPhelps on January 29, 2012, 11:05:31 AM
Post by: addicted on January 29, 2012, 11:12:50 AM
Addicted brings up an interesting point for discussion.
Berger VLD's rely heavily on the rate of twist in the barrel I think, and their bullet that shines regarding the super high BC is their 7mm bullet. How does their .30 cal bullets stack up#1, #2 are they a good hunting bullet or are they a good target bullet?--I think on deer it doesn't matter much but when you get up into the elk/moose/bear sized animals anyway, and #3 what's your rate of twist in the barrel and how much will that matter? I'm not a long range guy so I don't know the answers here, just raising some possible points for talk.
the Berger VLD is not a strong bullet, and they even claim to make it explode on purpose. But the reason it shines down range is because it is very accurate and has a great BC which helps keep it accurate, fast, and energized long range. It puts proof to the thought that 95% of killing an animal is putting the bullet in the right place.
between 7mm bullets and .338 bullets covering the weights and BC's that they do there is almost no need for 30 cal bullets.
a 7mm 140 boat tail has a BC of .485 which is nearly the .507 of the 180 grain 30 cal with less recoil.
Post by: addicted on January 29, 2012, 11:16:26 AM
Addicted brings up an interesting point for discussion.
Berger VLD's rely heavily on the rate of twist in the barrel I think, and their bullet that shines regarding the super high BC is their 7mm bullet. How does their .30 cal bullets stack up#1, #2 are they a good hunting bullet or are they a good target bullet?--I think on deer it doesn't matter much but when you get up into the elk/moose/bear sized animals anyway, and #3 what's your rate of twist in the barrel and how much will that matter? I'm not a long range guy so I don't know the answers here, just raising some possible points for talk.
the Berger VLD is not a strong bullet, and they even claim to make it explode on purpose. But the reason it shines down range is because it is very accurate and has a great BC which helps keep it accurate, fast, and energized long range. It puts proof to the thought that 95% of killing an animal is putting the bullet in the right place.
between 7mm bullets and .338 bullets covering the weights and BC's that they do there is almost no need for 30 cal bullets.
a 7mm 140 boat tail has a BC of .485 which is nearly the .507 of the 180 grain 30 cal with less recoil.
so it would take a very heavy 30cal bullet to get the BC of a middleweight bullet in 7mm. Lets say the 180grn7mm vld with .659 BC. it would take a 208grn A-max to get up to .64 bc.
Post by: buckfvr on January 29, 2012, 11:36:43 AM
Post by: high country on January 29, 2012, 11:41:14 AM
Addicted brings up an interesting point for discussion.
Berger VLD's rely heavily on the rate of twist in the barrel I think, and their bullet that shines regarding the super high BC is their 7mm bullet. How does their .30 cal bullets stack up#1, #2 are they a good hunting bullet or are they a good target bullet?--I think on deer it doesn't matter much but when you get up into the elk/moose/bear sized animals anyway, and #3 what's your rate of twist in the barrel and how much will that matter? I'm not a long range guy so I don't know the answers here, just raising some possible points for talk.
the Berger VLD is not a strong bullet, and they even claim to make it explode on purpose. But the reason it shines down range is because it is very accurate and has a great BC which helps keep it accurate, fast, and energized long range. It puts proof to the thought that 95% of killing an animal is putting the bullet in the right place.
between 7mm bullets and .338 bullets covering the weights and BC's that they do there is almost no need for 30 cal bullets.
a 7mm 140 boat tail has a BC of .485 which is nearly the .507 of the 180 grain 30 cal with less recoil.
so it would take a very heavy 30cal bullet to get the BC of a middleweight bullet in 7mm. Lets say the 180grn7mm vld with .659 BC. it would take a 208grn A-max to get up to .64 bc.
A 180 7mm is far from a middleweight. most guns wont stabilize one. It takes a custom to even chamber one efficiently.
Post by: addicted on January 29, 2012, 11:44:23 AM
Addicted brings up an interesting point for discussion.
Berger VLD's rely heavily on the rate of twist in the barrel I think, and their bullet that shines regarding the super high BC is their 7mm bullet. How does their .30 cal bullets stack up#1, #2 are they a good hunting bullet or are they a good target bullet?--I think on deer it doesn't matter much but when you get up into the elk/moose/bear sized animals anyway, and #3 what's your rate of twist in the barrel and how much will that matter? I'm not a long range guy so I don't know the answers here, just raising some possible points for talk.
the Berger VLD is not a strong bullet, and they even claim to make it explode on purpose. But the reason it shines down range is because it is very accurate and has a great BC which helps keep it accurate, fast, and energized long range. It puts proof to the thought that 95% of killing an animal is putting the bullet in the right place.
between 7mm bullets and .338 bullets covering the weights and BC's that they do there is almost no need for 30 cal bullets.
a 7mm 140 boat tail has a BC of .485 which is nearly the .507 of the 180 grain 30 cal with less recoil.
so it would take a very heavy 30cal bullet to get the BC of a middleweight bullet in 7mm. Lets say the 180grn7mm vld with .659 BC. it would take a 208grn A-max to get up to .64 bc.
A 180 7mm is far from a middleweight. most guns wont stabilize one. It takes a custom to even chamber one efficiently.
middle weight as far as popular bullets in general, .243-.338
My new 7mm has a 1:8.7 twist btw :IBCOOL:
Post by: high country on January 29, 2012, 11:53:58 AM
Post by: Bob33 on January 29, 2012, 12:25:48 PM
In considering which bullet to choose, it’s important to decide what’s most important to the game you are hunting. For example, with elk I would rate terminal performance first, accuracy second, and ballistics third. For antelope, I would rate accuracy first and ballistics second, and probably not care at all about the rest. Killing an antelope is easy if you can hit it. For varmints I would rate accuracy first, ballistics second, and maybe cost as a third. I’d never consider cost a very important factor for big game.
Accuracy comes out near the top for everything I hunt. Finding a bullet/load that your gun likes can be challenging. You cannot rely on the experience of others. You must ask your gun what it likes, and obey.
Post by: addicted on January 30, 2012, 03:04:08 AM
It won't likely shoot worth a hoot. Have you ever seen a 180 7mm? They will be seated super deep in order to fit in your mag. You could throat the rifle and do some custom work to get them to feed....$$
my action is made to take magnum cartridges so IF i wanted to look into it, I think i could make it work without too much seating depth. I'm thinking my needs will have me peter out in the 160's.
Post by: Curly on January 30, 2012, 09:09:27 AM
Post by: coachcw on January 30, 2012, 12:57:34 PM