Post by: trophyhunt on March 07, 2012, 02:21:52 PM
Post by: Atroxus on March 07, 2012, 02:26:13 PM
Post by: rtspring on March 07, 2012, 02:26:37 PM
I wash my truck all the time, atleast spray it off.
Post by: bear on March 07, 2012, 02:33:48 PM
Post by: JLS on March 07, 2012, 02:51:50 PM
I think they should put whatever is most effective on the streets. I would much rather have to wash my car, than have to get me and my car peeled off the the grill of a semi.
No kidding. They are trying to make roads safer. Have you called DOT about it, or just complain on the internet?
Post by: wraithen on March 07, 2012, 03:29:17 PM
Post by: Skillet on March 07, 2012, 03:54:23 PM
I think they should put whatever is most effective on the streets. I would much rather have to wash my car, than have to get me and my car peeled off the the grill of a semi.
No kidding. They are trying to make roads safer. Have you called DOT about it, or just complain on the internet?
Couldn't disagree more. "They" don't make the roads safer, people paying attention to WTF they're doing while driving do (ie., Guns don't kill people, people kill people). "They" are spending tax dollars on laying this corrosive crap down when it is not justified (it never is - learn to drive in the climate in which you live, folks). This is the same "They" that come to us and say they don't have enough money to fix the roads so we need to pay more taxes... the same "They" that try to legislate every bit of minutae of your lives to make it safer, and the same "They" that 99% of the frequent posters of this board bitch about when talking about our government pandering to the socialist Left.
So, I too get irritated when I see those lines of corrosive solution on the roads I'm driving on. It represents the 9 scariest words you'll ever hear - "I'm from the government, and I'm here to help" (thank you Ronald Reagan).
Voting on it ain't gonna help, though. There are too many people out there who say "The government needs to make my life safe for me!" :bash: So, a regular wash down is a necessity to keep our rigs looking nice. If you feel like REALLY getting pissed off about this stuff on the roads, try taking an aluminum boat over the pass in the winter...
Post by: rtspring on March 07, 2012, 03:57:33 PM
Post by: sirfunkeybut on March 07, 2012, 04:53:03 PM
Post by: wraithen on March 07, 2012, 05:37:55 PM
I've almost been in wreck from that stuff, it's just as slick as ice
If it was the bluish greenish stuff it probably was ice. Seems like they use an alcohol mix. After 10 minutes you get all the alcohol gone and end up with slick pretty ice.
Post by: sirfunkeybut on March 07, 2012, 05:45:45 PM
Post by: Atroxus on March 07, 2012, 08:24:19 PM
I think they should put whatever is most effective on the streets. I would much rather have to wash my car, than have to get me and my car peeled off the the grill of a semi.
No kidding. They are trying to make roads safer. Have you called DOT about it, or just complain on the internet?
Couldn't disagree more. "They" don't make the roads safer, people paying attention to WTF they're doing while driving do (ie., Guns don't kill people, people kill people). "They" are spending tax dollars on laying this corrosive crap down when it is not justified (it never is - learn to drive in the climate in which you live, folks). This is the same "They" that come to us and say they don't have enough money to fix the roads so we need to pay more taxes... the same "They" that try to legislate every bit of minutae of your lives to make it safer, and the same "They" that 99% of the frequent posters of this board bitch about when talking about our government pandering to the socialist Left.
So, I too get irritated when I see those lines of corrosive solution on the roads I'm driving on. It represents the 9 scariest words you'll ever hear - "I'm from the government, and I'm here to help" (thank you Ronald Reagan).
Voting on it ain't gonna help, though. There are too many people out there who say "The government needs to make my life safe for me!" :bash: So, a regular wash down is a necessity to keep our rigs looking nice. If you feel like REALLY getting pissed off about this stuff on the roads, try taking an aluminum boat over the pass in the winter...
If you think that de-icing the roads with an effective de-icing agent doesn't reduce the risks of accidents, you are fooling yourself. I don't have a problem concentrating on driving, but a lot of other people in this state do. Until someone figures out a way to force the idiots to stop driving like idiots; I want the DoT doing whatever they can to minimize the chances of me or my family getting killed by one of those idiots. If that means some extra car washing throughout the year I am perfectly fine with it.
Post by: ICEMAN on March 07, 2012, 08:29:01 PM
I thought our budgets were tight?
How about doing nothing and letting folks get themselves to work like in the past?
Post by: wraithen on March 07, 2012, 08:29:43 PM
Post by: Atroxus on March 07, 2012, 08:41:53 PM
Why is it the governments responsibility to treat for ice anyway? I can see plowing some main roads clear, but the jackazzes in Lacey treat every freaking stop sign approach. curves or cross roads anytime they feel ice is coming. Multiple applications per year.
I thought our budgets were tight?
How about doing nothing and letting folks get themselves to work like in the past?
Because back then there were FAR fewer cars on the road, and drivers tended to be a lot less distracted because they didn't have things like handheld computers, in car TVs/dvd players, laptop computers, etc.
Post by: trophyhunt on March 07, 2012, 11:31:29 PM
:yeah: I also think it's easier to drive on the road when they don't plow it, the snow tracks are almost like a railroad when the snow gets deep enough- heck you can almost let go of your steering wheel (I did say almost so you don't have to slam me for that). Man how ever did we make it around this frozen tundra back in the years they didn't put this corrosive crap on the roads. And just like iceman said, thought they were broke. The aluminum boat example is great, it's f n scary what this s hit is doing to our stuff. I didn't know it takes sealer off of your concrete, that's neat since sealer is so cheap. Yes I could rinse my truck off every time I get home during the winter, but what a pain in the a ss. Especially the times my hoses are frozen and how about the ice skating rink you make by doing that. Don't get me wrong, it's not the end of the world and yes there are far more important things in life to b itch about but this is a forum and yes it does bug the s hit out of me that they decide to ruin my hard earned toy's without even telling us we should wash our stuff off. How about a warning about it, don't you think that's the least they should do???I think they should put whatever is most effective on the streets. I would much rather have to wash my car, than have to get me and my car peeled off the the grill of a semi.
No kidding. They are trying to make roads safer. Have you called DOT about it, or just complain on the internet?
Couldn't disagree more. "They" don't make the roads safer, people paying attention to WTF they're doing while driving do (ie., Guns don't kill people, people kill people). "They" are spending tax dollars on laying this corrosive crap down when it is not justified (it never is - learn to drive in the climate in which you live, folks). This is the same "They" that come to us and say they don't have enough money to fix the roads so we need to pay more taxes... the same "They" that try to legislate every bit of minute of your lives to make it safer, and the same "They" that 99% of the frequent posters of this board bitch about when talking about our government pandering to the socialist Left.
So, I too get irritated when I see those lines of corrosive solution on the roads I'm driving on. It represents the 9 scariest words you'll ever hear - "I'm from the government, and I'm here to help" (thank you Ronald Reagan).
Voting on it ain't gonna help, though. There are too many people out there who say "The government needs to make my life safe for me!" :bash: So, a regular wash down is a necessity to keep our rigs looking nice. If you feel like REALLY getting pissed off about this stuff on the roads, try taking an aluminum boat over the pass in the winter...
Post by: Miles on March 08, 2012, 12:24:03 AM
Plus every bolt is rusted to crap (torches are used, not wrenches), the gas tanks fall out when you hit a bump cause the straps are rusted through. The rocker panels are GONE. And everything you try to work on takes twice as long cause it's all rusted together.
You folks in Washington have it easy.
Post by: firefighter4607 on March 08, 2012, 01:38:55 AM
Post by: fish vacuum on March 08, 2012, 01:56:54 AM
Hard to wash the car off every time you drive in it since it's used when temps are below freezing. Am I supposed come home at night and hose my car off in 28 degree temps?
Post by: sakoshooter on March 08, 2012, 02:25:57 AM
I think they should put whatever is most effective on the streets. I would much rather have to wash my car, than have to get me and my car peeled off the the grill of a semi.
Goes for me too.
Post by: Miles on March 08, 2012, 02:42:53 AM
Post by: wraithen on March 08, 2012, 07:11:26 AM
Post by: Miles on March 08, 2012, 07:25:10 AM
What part of NY did you live in, and how long where you there?
Post by: wraithen on March 08, 2012, 07:39:01 AM
Post by: TheHunt on March 08, 2012, 07:49:33 AM
I have to wash down the truck when they put that crap on the road. I also see some very, very, minor pitting on my bumper so I waxed the entire truck and put on three coats of wax on the bumper to protect it. I think it is a conspiracy to make people buy new rigs.
Post by: trophyhunt on March 08, 2012, 10:25:54 AM
Post by: Bean Counter on March 08, 2012, 10:41:22 AM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on March 08, 2012, 11:04:24 AM
Post by: trophyhunt on March 08, 2012, 11:25:36 AM
Should the back of my bear tag remind me of the dangers of trichinosis? :dunno:Really, we could go on and on with those kind of warnings. I don't think in general the public knows what that stuff does to our rigs. If you don't mind your sh it getting ruined by the stuff then that's your deal, I just think the public should know about it. And by the way, I'm sure we've all at one time in our lives been told about trichinosis.
Post by: KopperBuck on March 08, 2012, 11:35:01 AM
Post by: Missing on March 08, 2012, 05:59:51 PM
Post by: Special T on March 08, 2012, 08:45:53 PM
Post by: D-Rock425 on March 08, 2012, 08:46:38 PM
Post by: netcoyote on March 09, 2012, 07:00:21 AM
I read about guys saying they can wash the salt off. Nice try. The salt tends to leave a residue even after flushing with clean water and only a thorough scrubbing will you be able to remove enough to prevent corrosion. Since you cannot reach every crack, seam and crevasse in you sheet metal, the salt stays in those places to continue to do damage even after the outside appears clean.
I work on my own rigs and noticed this starting about 5 or so years ago. There is a lot more rust and pitting when working underneath a vehicle and parts that used to be able to be easily removed now need torches and hammers.
I also agree with the thinking that it's the desire of people for the government to "do something" that started this. I always thought that the used of road sand was a much better traction enhancer but that now seems out of vogue.
Another mystery to me is that environmentalists aren't screaming about these corrosive chemicals being applied to roads that flush eventually to streams and waterways. Whatever happened to "saving the salmon"?? I guess what happens to salmon doesn't matter as long as you can drive your Prius to the latte stand without sliding off the road.
Post by: trophyhunt on March 09, 2012, 10:25:05 AM
I lived in Ohio for 30 years and have a pretty good idea of what road salt can do to a vehicle. When I moved to WA, I considered it a bonus, like a raise in pay, to not have a vehicle rust out in a few years. I was amazed when I bought my first WA used car and found the underside almost like new when the car was ten years old. A ten year old car in the Midwest is ready for the scrap heap.:yeah: Thanks for posting. I got a response from the dot, trying to figure out how to post it.
I read about guys saying they can wash the salt off. Nice try. The salt tends to leave a residue even after flushing with clean water and only a thorough scrubbing will you be able to remove enough to prevent corrosion. Since you cannot reach every crack, seam and crevasse in you sheet metal, the salt stays in those places to continue to do damage even after the outside appears clean.
I work on my own rigs and noticed this starting about 5 or so years ago. There is a lot more rust and pitting when working underneath a vehicle and parts that used to be able to be easily removed now need torches and hammers.
I also agree with the thinking that it's the desire of people for the government to "do something" that started this. I always thought that the used of road sand was a much better traction enhancer but that now seems out of vogue.
Another mystery to me is that environmentalists aren't screaming about these corrosive chemicals being applied to roads that flush eventually to streams and waterways. Whatever happened to "saving the salmon"?? I guess what happens to salmon doesn't matter as long as you can drive your Prius to the latte stand without sliding off the road.
Post by: trophyhunt on March 09, 2012, 01:02:57 PM
Thanks for contacting us. Your concern was forwarded to me for response.
I am the WSDOT Branch Manager with oversight and support duties for the Statewide Snow and Ice Program.
We try to be very upfront and transparent about the materials and methods with which we respond to winter conditions. We have been using liquid anti-icers and salt for many years and we publish this information in a variety of ways. Our Website has information on anti-icer and deicer use http://www.wsdot.wa.gov/winter/anti.htm, there are many media reports each fall and before every major storm event about the materials that WSDOT and local agencies are using to treat highways, and we have pre-winter meetings and media events in many areas which discuss our plans and practices. Every snowbelt state in the U.S. uses some combination of salt, anti-icer and sand to provide for winter mobility since the traveling public and the freight community have come to expect that highways and mountain passes remain open year-round.
We use three different types of liquid deicer depending upon area specific needs and conditions. All of these materials have corrosion inhibitors added to them, but no deicer material is 100% non-corrosive.
They will tend to leave a film on vehicles so we encourage people to frequently wash their cars when they have passed over a treated highway.
We have looked at and tried alternative (non-chloride) materials, but they are extremely expensive and have environmental issues of their own.
Salt and liquid chloride anti-icers remain the most cost effective product for winter use.
I hope that this helps answer your concerns. Again, the best advice that I can give you is to wash your car when it has been exposed to treated highways, but enjoy your ability to actually cross the pass in winter time because you would not be able to do it if we didn't use deicers.
Thanks,
Monty Mills
Monty Mills
Maintenance Operations Branch Manager
WSDOT Maintenance Operations Division
310 Maple Park Avenue SE
PO Box 47538
Olympia, WA 98504-7358
Post by: JimmyHoffa on March 09, 2012, 01:17:10 PM
Another mystery to me is that environmentalists aren't screaming about these corrosive chemicals being applied to roads that flush eventually to streams and waterways. Whatever happened to "saving the salmon"?? I guess what happens to salmon doesn't matter as long as you can drive your Prius to the latte stand without sliding off the road.One of the reasons cited by my county for using magnesium chloride is that it is the least toxic of the available de-icing chemicals. It doesn't do as great of a job as the other salts when it comes to melting, but it was the 'eco-friendly' salt for the salmon huggers. Supposedly it was even friendlier than sand/gravel. Costs a bit more than a few of the other alternatives.
Post by: wraithen on March 09, 2012, 02:34:17 PM
Post by: netcoyote on March 09, 2012, 07:33:02 PM
Quote
I hope that this helps answer your concerns. Again, the best advice that I can give you is to wash your car when it has been exposed to treated highways, but enjoy your ability to actually cross the pass in winter time because you would not be able to do it if we didn't use deicers.
Thanks,
Monty Mills
Hmmmm...I'll bet if I tried REAL hard I can remember being able to cross the passes back when they were only using sand and gravel. After all, there are some benefits of being a geezer.
Post by: Chadrick60 on March 09, 2012, 11:49:21 PM
Yeah right. Don't de-ice it. Use a plow and leave a layer of snow on it and watch me go. I don't need your deicer. You want to know how I learned to drive in the snow? When I was 18 I would come home from work and watch the news. My favorite thing to hear was "Folks if you don't have to cross the pass then stay home" I would call my buddies and get in my little Ford Escort and tear off for the summit. I taught myself in the worst conditions I could. I think it should be mandatory to get some kind of winter driving class passed before you get your license. As for that deicer crap. The year they started using that crap my travel trailer wheels turned orange (rust) as well as the outdoor stove mounted to the side of my RV. I wanted to send the bill to the state for my new wheels. I was so pissed off. Great now you got me worked up about it again. Thanks a lot!!! :bash: :bash:
Post by: KopperBuck on March 10, 2012, 09:33:26 AM
Post by: goosegetter79 on March 10, 2012, 09:57:10 AM
QuoteI hope that this helps answer your concerns. Again, the best advice that I can give you is to wash your car when it has been exposed to treated highways, but enjoy your ability to actually cross the pass in winter time because you would not be able to do it if we didn't use deicers.
Thanks,
Monty Mills
Hmmmm...I'll bet if I tried REAL hard I can remember being able to cross the passes back when they were only using sand and gravel. After all, there are some benefits of being a geezer.
City of Pullman and WSU still use gravel with very little de-icer. Lots of chipped windows and broken windows from gravel on roads.
Post by: Special T on March 10, 2012, 12:29:22 PM
Post by: Bean Counter on March 10, 2012, 02:27:19 PM
WSDOT to employ. Your life is worth more than the roads, but there are other ways to realize this (use chains, just stay home, etc).
Post by: rtspring on March 10, 2012, 02:35:59 PM
You dont need chains, studded tires, or any kind of ice melt..
You do need to slow down and remember the brake pedal on slick roads is your enemy....
RTSPRING
Post by: Special T on March 10, 2012, 02:46:01 PM
BC we disagreed before on the whole studded snow tire thing, but if the deicer is having a negative effect on roads then studs can't be much worse. :twocents: Even still there are very few people who purchase snow tires let alone a good one like the blizzak or Hankook ones, Or Nokians. A spare set of dedicated snow rims and snow tires, studded or not, is a great investment. The last few times i have put the wifes tires on there was already snow on the ground! Even people with AWD need good tires, and that seems to be something that many people try and avoid...
Post by: Missing on March 12, 2012, 05:59:57 PM