Post by: washelkhunter on May 14, 2012, 09:37:26 AM
Post by: shoot-em-dead on May 14, 2012, 09:45:12 AM
Post by: gaddy on May 14, 2012, 10:08:41 AM
benton county, the RME, & the nature conservancy are working on the project with the state.
sorry i dont know how to put up links for the full article. TRI-CITY HERALD, sunday.
Post by: bigtex on May 14, 2012, 10:09:19 AM
Post by: fair-chase on May 14, 2012, 10:13:30 AM
Almost all of WDFW land purchases are paid through federal grants. Do some research on the WDFW land acquisition proposal site and you will see almost all of the proposals involve no WDFW money.
:yeah: Also, since this is a multi phase project/purchase that will likely take several years to complete, I'm sure the legislature will continue to issue the funding that it is responsible for as it comes due.
I for one don't mind this purchase. It wouldn't be my first choice for a land purchase (not by a long shot) but it will open up a rather significant area to recreation. Also, tensions between landowners and hunters in this area have been a sore subject for the department for many years. Maybe this will alleviate some of that.
http://wdfw.wa.gov/lands/acquisitions/rattlesnake_mountain.pdf (http://wdfw.wa.gov/lands/acquisitions/rattlesnake_mountain.pdf)
Post by: shoot-em-dead on May 14, 2012, 10:15:26 AM
Post by: shoot-em-dead on May 14, 2012, 10:17:46 AM
Post by: Kain on May 14, 2012, 10:55:03 AM
Post by: whacker1 on May 14, 2012, 11:17:39 AM
I don't mind lots of public lands, but it seems that their has been an unusually high amount of purchases by WDFW over the last 5 years. It makes me wonder when enough will be enough.
I just ask that these purchases are thought out carefully. 15-30 years from now, we will all be paying exhorbinant property taxes and purchasign a $250 discover pass to go look at the birds, let alone be able to hunt on it. I over dramatized it to illustrate a point.
I know in the City of Spokane they are trying to determine what municipal properties they can sell, so they don't have to maintain them, and can get them back in the private sector paying property taxes again. It is not a parralllel example, but again, I am just trying to illustrate a point.
Post by: JimmyHoffa on May 14, 2012, 11:18:24 AM
I don't imagine that WDFW land is going to be available to lease for mineral exploration or anything keeping money private. Guessing that it would be used for encouraging more disco passes or a new special permit. I'm kind of wondering how the amount of money sent to acquire, loss of tax base and loss of owner revenue/production will compare to having it be public land with disco passes?
EDIT: I see the above has similar concerns and is a faster typer.
Post by: Kain on May 14, 2012, 11:27:35 AM
Post by: buckcanyonlodge on May 14, 2012, 11:29:36 AM
Post by: Kain on May 14, 2012, 11:31:20 AM
http://wdfw.wa.gov/lands/landline/2010.html
Post by: JimmyHoffa on May 14, 2012, 11:43:56 AM
I believe WDFW pays property taxes on their land. I remember them posting a report on how much the check was.
Okay, saw in the link you provided. They have a payment-in-lieu-of-taxes that they send the respective counties to substitute as a property tax. Guess that is good for the counties, but still the money is coming from a government agency, so originally citizens I'd think?
Post by: bearpaw on May 14, 2012, 12:13:33 PM
Noxious weeds are rampant on many of the lands they already have. :bash:
Post by: KopperBuck on May 14, 2012, 12:25:34 PM
I am opposed to the WDFW buying any more lands. :bdid:
Noxious weeds are rampant on many of the lands they already have. :bash:
Oh man... you are not kidding. And the private landowners pay the price on it. This is a huge issue and unfortunately not enough people are aware of this problem.
Post by: washelkhunter on May 14, 2012, 01:52:24 PM
Almost all of WDFW land purchases are paid through federal grants. Do some research on the WDFW land acquisition proposal site and you will see almost all of the proposals involve no WDFW money.
So the feds are taking our money and giving it to wdfw to buy property they will not be able to properly care for just like most everything else (WE) own in this state.
Post by: stuckalot on May 14, 2012, 09:13:46 PM
Post by: Moose22 on May 14, 2012, 09:31:12 PM
Almost all of WDFW land purchases are paid through federal grants. Do some research on the WDFW land acquisition proposal site and you will see almost all of the proposals involve no WDFW money.
So the feds are taking our money and giving it to wdfw to buy property they will not be able to properly care for just like most everything else (WE) own in this state.
I keep seeing this trend of Federal grants. Where in the hell does the general public that supporst these purchases think the money actually comes from?
Just frustrated AGAIN.
Post by: DeerThug on May 14, 2012, 09:48:51 PM
Post by: Moose22 on May 14, 2012, 09:54:20 PM
Post by: JimmyHoffa on May 14, 2012, 10:00:16 PM
Post by: washelkhunter on May 14, 2012, 10:07:00 PM
No jokes here, first they are not spending your or my WDFW fees on this venture and do you think that private partners are willing to allow anyone onto their investment for free?
So wdfw lets us on their holdings for free? They spend the peoples money whether you want to call it taxes or fees, its the peoples money.
Post by: washelkhunter on May 14, 2012, 10:12:27 PM
Probably been covered in a previous thread that I missed, but I'm curious is WDFW land considered 'open and unclaimed'?
We could only wish. If it was unclaimed they couldnt charge us $35 for the DP and the priviledge to walk on land we already own. :bash:
Post by: Moose22 on May 14, 2012, 10:17:29 PM
Post by: bush_beater on May 14, 2012, 10:18:00 PM
according to the paper,its an opportunity to save a large section of arid lands shrub steppe & provide nonmoterized puplic access for recreation thats compatible with wildlife habitat, including hiking, horseback riding, bird watching & some hunting. the upper portion borders the ale reserve.
benton county, the RME, & the nature conservancy are working on the project with the state.
sorry i dont know how to put up links for the full article. TRI-CITY HERALD, sunday.
sounds like another "natural area"- hope not
Post by: washelkhunter on May 14, 2012, 10:29:08 PM
washelkhunter, I agree with you. In one way or another you and I are going to pay to access WDFW land. I just don't see how a private investors, as DeerThug hopes to happen, can benefit the general public.
Well at least someone will be paying taxes on it, hopefully another rancher.
Post by: Jerbear on May 15, 2012, 11:17:42 AM
Post by: JimmyHoffa on May 26, 2012, 11:26:19 AM
http://news.yahoo.com/wash-hopes-buy-historic-ranch-conservation-150600013.html (http://news.yahoo.com/wash-hopes-buy-historic-ranch-conservation-150600013.html)
Wash. hopes to buy historic ranch for conservation
By SHANNON DININNY | Associated Press – 2 hrs 38 mins ago...
BENTON COUNTY, Wash. (AP) — Rattlesnake Mountain offers sweeping views of the historic McWhorter Ranch, a pristine property largely unchanged since it was settled in 1903, laced with dry grasses and sagebrush and home to elk and other wildlife. The ranch stretches down the mountain's south face across more than 20 square miles of Washington's shrinking shrub-steppe habitat.
In the not-so-far-off distance, another scene unfolds: the bustle of the nation's fastest-growing metropolitan area, complete with high-tech businesses and newly-planted vineyards to support a booming wine industry.
McWhorter Ranch is going up for sale June 1, and given its size and location, the property could very likely draw bids from agricultural and real estate developers. But state and local officials are working with conservation groups to try to raise enough money to stave off any speculators and preserve it.
"There aren't many of these big ranches left. It's a rarity and it's precious," said Jeff Tayer, regional director for the Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife. "As rare as this is now and as precious as it is now, it's nothing compared to how rare it will be 20 years from now."
Lucullus Virgil McWhorter traveled west from Ohio to settle a sprawling stretch of land in arid south-central Washington in 1903, raising sheep, cattle and children. He developed relationships with the Native American tribes in the area, studied their culture and helped them defend their land and water rights.
Generations of McWhorters grew up on the ranch that has become a shining example of conservation farming practices.
"It's amazing to look around and see, not only the beauty, but how's it been preserved," said Max Benitz, a former Benton County commissioner and longtime family friend who's serving as property caretaker. "It's just a real opportunity for perspective."
Adding to that perspective is that during World War II the federal government condemned some of McWhorter's land — along with the land of many others — for a top-secret project to build the atomic bomb. In the process, the Hanford nuclear reservation was born, spawning a nuclear industry that produced plutonium for the nation's weapons arsenal for decades.
Thousands of people now work to clean up the highly contaminated Hanford nuclear site. Scientific research there and at the nearby Pacific Northwest National Laboratory has spawned dozens of high-tech businesses in the Tri-Cities of Richland, Kennewick and Pasco.
In addition, agriculture remains a huge economic driver. Dozens of apple, pear and cherry orchards line the hillsides, and new vineyards are continually being planted to support Washington's growing wine industry, ranked second nationally behind California.
Industry and jobs have boosted the region's population beyond 260,000, and the U.S. Census Bureau earlier this year tagged it as the nation's fastest-growing metro area since 2010.
All that growth doesn't bode well for Washington's shrub-steppe habitat, which is just a fraction of what it was decades ago, and the species that rely on it.
Wildlife officials see the ranch, with its deep soils and healthy plants, as an opportunity to boost populations of threatened sage grouse and ferruginous hawk, as well as a number of other species: badgers, black-tailed and white-tailed jackrabbits, Townsend's ground squirrels, burrowing owls and pygmy rabbits.
"Shrub-steppe diversity is based on space. In a forest, you can create diversity by going up, but to enable biodiversity in shrub-steppe, you need land," said Mike Livingston of the Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife.
Water could be an issue for anyone who wants to develop the site. The water supply for the ranch came from 13 cisterns, which were gravity fed from a natural spring higher up the mountain.
"Our experience has been that if there's a good place to develop, whether it's agriculture or housing, it gets developed," Fish and Wildlife's Tayer said. "Our idea is to focus development next to infrastructure and focus conservation on more remote areas. That's what we're trying to do here."
The property encompasses some 16,000 acres broken into three separate sales. The state is focusing its efforts on the main ranch of 14,135 acres as a public recreation spot for hikers, horseback riders, bird watchers and hunters.
Public land access for hunters is key to managing an elk herd that roams between private property, the nuclear site and the neighboring Hanford Reach National Monument. The herd is estimated at 700 animals — roughly twice what wildlife managers say it should be — largely because the elk migrate during hunting season to the federal lands, where hunting is barred.
"This could one of the largest remaining blocks of shrub-steppe that could be available for public acquisition, and the McWhorter family has been incredible stewards of the land," said Ranch Block, director of lands for the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation based in Missoula, Mont. "We've committed to help financially, but as to what the value is and what the partnership is going to look like, it's too soon to say."
The McWhorter family declined to comment on the impending sale. The state has set aside $1.8 million toward the purchase. An appraisal of the property is still being completed, but Tayer estimates the state will likely need at least another $3.5 million to buy just the main ranch.
McWhorter's grandson, R.J. McWhorter, approached Tayer eight or nine years ago about selling the property to ensure it was preserved, Tayer said, but just couldn't part with it. R.J. McWhorter died in a four-wheeler accident on the ranch in 1987. He was 86.
Now his children have decided it's time to sell.
"My sense from the family is that they want to keep their options open," Tayer said. "We just hope we'll be the best option."
Post by: KopperBuck on May 26, 2012, 12:44:40 PM
Post by: Mudman on May 26, 2012, 01:23:11 PM
Post by: Humptulips on May 30, 2012, 06:32:02 PM
If it's not, seems like a win even if there are some restrictions put on users.
Good question on the open and unclaimed lands question. Like to know the answer to that.
If it will be the tribe that claims treaty rights on this should kick in on the funding.