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Big Game Hunting => Deer Hunting => Topic started by: PA BEN on March 01, 2017, 06:50:08 PM


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Title: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: PA BEN on March 01, 2017, 06:50:08 PM
https://www.gohunt.com/read/news/one-of-idahos-most-impressive-mule-deer-from-2015-poached#gs.M2tMcPM
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: bowhunterforever on March 01, 2017, 06:56:08 PM
Impressive buck :drool: To bad it was poached
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: teanawayslayer on March 01, 2017, 06:59:01 PM
Wow
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: Rainier10 on March 01, 2017, 07:04:36 PM
Impressive buck :drool: To bad it was poached
:yeah:
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: Bowgina on March 02, 2017, 07:54:11 AM
bummer
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: Rainier10 on March 02, 2017, 08:00:27 AM
Not sure why but I just couldn't quit thinking about this story last night.  :bash:  What an awesome buck and what a shame they couldn't get it done the right way.  All that time scouting and hunting and if he would have just spent a little more bench time at the rifle range it all would have been different.

Practice, practice, practice, you never know when that buck of a lifetime is going to present a shot.

This guy had a pretty good idea of where this buck was going to be and just wasn't prepared.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: 2MANY on March 02, 2017, 08:02:00 AM
The fine and punishment is a joke.
Should be a minimum 10 year license yank IMHO.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: jackelope on March 02, 2017, 08:07:54 AM
Greed.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: boneaddict on March 02, 2017, 08:12:45 AM
Sad. 
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: boneaddict on March 02, 2017, 08:17:14 AM
The fine and punishment is a joke.
Should be a minimum 10 year license yank IMHO.

That's all they got?  that's what that deer was worth?  SICK
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: Gringo31 on March 02, 2017, 08:18:58 AM
Why would the son even have a rifle with him?

 :bash:
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: jackelope on March 02, 2017, 08:20:44 AM
Why would the son even have a rifle with him?

 :bash:
Well, surely it was there in case he saw a coyote.
:rolleyes:
(insert needed sarcasm emoji here)
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: Gringo31 on March 02, 2017, 08:22:37 AM
Right....

Because if I had the sheds of a big buck, had the tag, I'd love it for someone to be shooting coyotes while I looked for him.  :bash:
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: JDHasty on March 02, 2017, 08:29:47 AM
The fine and punishment is a joke.
Should be a minimum 10 year license yank IMHO.

No kidding
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: JDHasty on March 02, 2017, 08:31:59 AM
It would be interesting to take a look at the publicly available documents behind that case. 
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: Rainier10 on March 02, 2017, 08:42:03 AM
So they had the sheds from the previous year.  They knew it was a shooter buck. They targeted it that entire next season.  When they found it they were shocked at how much bigger it was this year.  On the last day as it was escaping over the hill and the father couldn't hit the broadside of the barn the son shot it.

How about this?  Instead of the son shooting it, let it go and come back the next year and try again.  My guess is it would have still been as big and you would have even more history with the buck making success if achieved even sweeter.

How pissed would the dad have been to find out that someone shot it out of season while it was still in velvet this year before he had a chance at it?  He would have been irate that someone took his opportunity away before he even got a chance.  That is exactly what they did to everyone else with a tag.  The son took the opportunity away from the dad and every other hunter who had a tag or was going to have a tag the next year.


 :bash: :bash:
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: JDHasty on March 02, 2017, 08:49:05 AM
So they had the sheds from the previous year.  They knew it was a shooter buck. They targeted it that entire next season.  When they found it they were shocked at how much bigger it was this year.  On the last day as it was escaping over the hill and the father couldn't hit the broadside of the barn the son shot it.

How about this?  Instead of the son shooting it, let it go and come back the next year and try again.  My guess is it would have still been as big and you would have even more history with the buck making success if achieved even sweeter.

How pissed would the dad have been to find out that someone shot it out of season while it was still in velvet this year before he had a chance at it?  He would have been irate that someone took his opportunity away before he even got a chance.  That is exactly what they did to everyone else with a tag.  The son took the opportunity away from the dad and every other hunter who had a tag or was going to have a tag the next year.


 :bash: :bash:

That is pretty much the alpha and the omega of this story
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: bobcat on March 02, 2017, 08:58:09 AM
It was a special permit hunt, so they couldn't have come back to hunt it the following year. As far as the story of it getting away so the son shot it, we don't know if that's true. Nobody really knows what happened except the father and son. Maybe the intent was for the son to shoot it all along, since he was the one who scouted it and found that buck.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: Rainier10 on March 02, 2017, 09:14:52 AM
It was a special permit hunt, so they couldn't have come back to hunt it the following year. As far as the story of it getting away so the son shot it, we don't know if that's true. Nobody really knows what happened except the father and son. Maybe the intent was for the son to shoot it all along, since he was the one who scouted it and found that buck.
He shot it without a tag this year, he could have easily come back after the season and shot it without a tag or come back next year and shot it without a tag.  He did have the option to come back and shoot it anytime he wanted if he was willing to shoot it without a tag.  He was obviously willing to shoot it without a tag.

By doing that he took opportunity away from an unknown amount of legal hunters including his father.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: idahohuntr on March 02, 2017, 09:27:14 AM
I wonder how IDFG solved this case...would seem incredibly difficult to prove without a guilty plea from Dad/son.  Was it being videoed? 

Idaho has a program that allows parents/grandparents to give tags to their minor children...not that the son in this case is a minor...but I guess I just don't see this as the crime of the century, particularly given Idaho currently supports some form of tag sharing among family.  All that said, I do not condone such actions - but I do think the punishment is probably about right...not too light.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: WAPatriot on March 02, 2017, 09:32:54 AM
Ya who was these guys lawyer he should be dismembered from the bar!!!
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: bobcat on March 02, 2017, 09:36:07 AM
I agree with Idahohntr- not the crime of the century. They DID have a tag. I think the fine was excessive. I also do not condone this but I don't consider it "poaching." Honestly if the dad wants his son to fill his tag that he drew, I almost don't see a reason why it shouldn't be legal. As long as the father is with him it seems like it doesn't make much difference who pulls the trigger. I'm also curious how this case was solved, they only had to deny it unless there was a witness.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: JDHasty on March 02, 2017, 09:37:54 AM
The investigation showed that Gary Nix had a valid tag and permit for the deer and began shooting at it, but when it did not fall he asked his son Garrett, who did not have a valid tag, to help him kill the deer to prevent it from getting away. Both men fired multiple shots before the deer was finally fatally wounded.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: PA BEN on March 02, 2017, 09:39:32 AM
Not sure why but I just couldn't quit thinking about this story last night.  :bash:  What an awesome buck and what a shame they couldn't get it done the right way.  All that time scouting and hunting and if he would have just spent a little more bench time at the rifle range it all would have been different.

Practice, practice, practice, you never know when that buck of a lifetime is going to present a shot.

This guy had a pretty good idea of where this buck was going to be and just wasn't prepared.
:yeah:
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: JDHasty on March 02, 2017, 09:42:02 AM
I agree with Idahohntr- not the crime of the century. They DID have a tag. I think the fine was excessive. I also do not condone this but I don't consider it "poaching." Honestly if the dad wants his son to fill his tag that he drew, I almost don't see a reason why it shouldn't be legal. As long as the father is with him it seems like it doesn't make much difference who pulls the trigger. I'm also curious how this case was solved, they only had to deny it unless there was a witness.

Let me help ya' out. 

How about: if the son wants his dad to fill his tag that the son drew, I almost don't see a reason why it shouldn't be legal.  That would mean the guy with seven kids of his own and five more by marriage gets thirteen chances to put in for a tag that you and I are only allowed a single entry for.  And if you don't think there are a LOT of "dad's" who don't already pull this stunt every year you are living a very cloistered life.  The last thing we need is to "legalize" it. 

Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: JODakota on March 02, 2017, 09:44:20 AM
I agree with Idahohntr- not the crime of the century. They DID have a tag. I think the fine was excessive. I also do not condone this but I don't consider it "poaching." Honestly if the dad wants his son to fill his tag that he drew, I almost don't see a reason why it shouldn't be legal. As long as the father is with him it seems like it doesn't make much difference who pulls the trigger. I'm also curious how this case was solved, they only had to deny it unless there was a witness.

I agree. Don't ever go to Minnesota or any of the other Midwest states. Party hunting is pretty normal.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: JDHasty on March 02, 2017, 09:44:42 AM
Not sure why but I just couldn't quit thinking about this story last night.  :bash:  What an awesome buck and what a shame they couldn't get it done the right way.  All that time scouting and hunting and if he would have just spent a little more bench time at the rifle range it all would have been different.

Practice, practice, practice, you never know when that buck of a lifetime is going to present a shot.

This guy had a pretty good idea of where this buck was going to be and just wasn't prepared.

Also, I have found that a Harris Bipod is your friend and I have shot and won in a lot of competition events including rifle silhouette. 
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: Rainier10 on March 02, 2017, 09:56:41 AM
It just becomes a slippery slope in my mind and where do you then draw the line?

Dad draws a tag.  Dad has one son, two sons or seven sons.  "Hey boys, I drew a great tag, let's go hunting whoever sees the shooter go ahead and drop it."  Now you have 1-8 people hunting with one tag.  Odds of filling it just went way up.  They give out tags based on average success rates.  Well the success rate just went through the roof when you have more than one person trying to fill the same tag.

Some will say that dad and one son is okay but dad and three sons is not okay.  Others will say well dad and three sons is fine but you can't include cousins or son in laws in the hunt.

If you are willing to fudge the line of who actually has the tag why not fudge where the GMU boundary line is just a little?  Why not fudge the legal shooting hours just a little?  Why not fudge the season dates a little?

Where do you draw the line of "that was almost legal so it is okay in my book."?
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: bobcat on March 02, 2017, 10:01:21 AM
Rainier10- I totally agree with that analysis as well. It's just like I said though, this particular incident doesn't seem to me like the crime of the century, I wouldn't call that guy a poacher, and I think losing his hunting rights for three years along with a $2,200 fine, plus losing the deer, was excessive.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: JDHasty on March 02, 2017, 10:02:12 AM
It just becomes a slippery slope in my mind and where do you then draw the line?

Dad draws a tag.  Dad has one son, two sons or seven sons.  "Hey boys, I drew a great tag, let's go hunting whoever sees the shooter go ahead and drop it."  Now you have 1-8 people hunting with one tag.  Odds of filling it just went way up.  They give out tags based on average success rates.  Well the success rate just went through the roof when you have more than one person trying to fill the same tag.

Some will say that dad and one son is okay but dad and three sons is not okay.  Others will say well dad and three sons is fine but you can't include cousins or son in laws in the hunt.

If you are willing to fudge the line of who actually has the tag why not fudge where the GMU boundary line is just a little?  Why not fudge the legal shooting hours just a little?  Why not fudge the season dates a little?

Where do you draw the line of "that was almost legal so it is okay in my book."?

That is another distinct possibility inevitability. 
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: jackelope on March 02, 2017, 10:06:09 AM
I agree with Idahohntr- not the crime of the century. They DID have a tag. I think the fine was excessive. I also do not condone this but I don't consider it "poaching." Honestly if the dad wants his son to fill his tag that he drew, I almost don't see a reason why it shouldn't be legal. As long as the father is with him it seems like it doesn't make much difference who pulls the trigger. I'm also curious how this case was solved, they only had to deny it unless there was a witness.

I agree. Don't ever go to Minnesota or any of the other Midwest states. Party hunting is pretty normal.

normal, maybe it's legal??
It's not in this case.
If it's legal, have at it. If it's not, don't have at it. Pretty straight forward, no-slip slope. The Idaho hunting regs are the traction aid on this potentially slippery slope.

Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: jackelope on March 02, 2017, 10:07:25 AM
Rainier10- I totally agree with that analysis as well. It's just like I said though, this particular incident doesn't seem to me like the crime of the century, I wouldn't call that guy a poacher, and I think losing his hunting rights for three years along with a $2,200 fine, plus losing the deer, was excessive.

Are you good with questionable party hunting in a completely illegal scenario?
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: bobcat on March 02, 2017, 10:10:44 AM
Rainier10- I totally agree with that analysis as well. It's just like I said though, this particular incident doesn't seem to me like the crime of the century, I wouldn't call that guy a poacher, and I think losing his hunting rights for three years along with a $2,200 fine, plus losing the deer, was excessive.

Are you good with questionable party hunting in a completely illegal scenario?

No.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: jackelope on March 02, 2017, 10:13:35 AM
Rainier10- I totally agree with that analysis as well. It's just like I said though, this particular incident doesn't seem to me like the crime of the century, I wouldn't call that guy a poacher, and I think losing his hunting rights for three years along with a $2,200 fine, plus losing the deer, was excessive.

Are you good with questionable party hunting in a completely illegal scenario?

No.

Pretty sure this case is THE definition of party hunting, isn't it?
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: bobcat on March 02, 2017, 10:20:29 AM
Rainier10- I totally agree with that analysis as well. It's just like I said though, this particular incident doesn't seem to me like the crime of the century, I wouldn't call that guy a poacher, and I think losing his hunting rights for three years along with a $2,200 fine, plus losing the deer, was excessive.

Are you good with questionable party hunting in a completely illegal scenario?

No.

Pretty sure this case is THE definition of party hunting, isn't it?

I don't know. I don't know exactly how it went down. I'd say a lot depends on their intent. But we'll never know that. I'm done with this thread. Basically all I wanted to say is that I feel the penalty was more than necessary. Some people it sounds like would give him the death penalty, while the Green River killer gets to live.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: Rainier10 on March 02, 2017, 10:22:48 AM
Rainier10- I totally agree with that analysis as well. It's just like I said though, this particular incident doesn't seem to me like the crime of the century, I wouldn't call that guy a poacher, and I think losing his hunting rights for three years along with a $2,200 fine, plus losing the deer, was excessive.
:tup:
I agree there are certainly worse crimes.

So your comments were more about how steep the penalty was for something that was illegal but just not as bad as it could have been?

I guess I can see that a little.  I think many have continued to hunt after filling a tag under the premise of "I still have a cougar or bear tag".

At this point in my hunting life I am beyond the kill and more into the hunt and sharing the experiences with friends and family.  I can do that without breaking the rules and it just makes it more enjoyable for me.

Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: Gringo31 on March 02, 2017, 10:36:36 AM
Quote
Honestly if the dad wants his son to fill his tag that he drew, I almost don't see a reason why it shouldn't be legal.


The issue comes down to Can you transfer your tag to someone else?

The answer is no. 

IF this was legal, people would be selling their tags.  I drew a sheep tag.  I'm certain if legal, I could have taken bids and made a good profit.  This state is so goofy the other way, that it was made clear that anyone in the field with me sheep hunting couldn't carry a weapon.  It is for the reasons in the buck story....that is why.  At the time, I would have loved to have my brother pack my rifle or bow (one or the other).  It is the law that made me pick one and not have both as options on the hill.  Or...cuz I'm lazy and didn't want to pack both of them myself  :chuckle:
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: idahohuntr on March 02, 2017, 10:52:14 AM
Quote
Honestly if the dad wants his son to fill his tag that he drew, I almost don't see a reason why it shouldn't be legal.


The issue comes down to Can you transfer your tag to someone else?

The answer is no. 


Actually, in Idaho - the answer is YES.  You can transfer any controlled hunt tag to a child/grandchild under 18 years old.  I vehemently opposed this rule for the reasons JDHasty brought up...while I like the idea of Grandpa giving his grandchild that coveted bull tag he drew...I don't like the idea of people putting mom, dad, grandma and grandpa on both sides of the family in for hunts - thereby increasing their odds 6-fold. 

Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: OutHouse on March 02, 2017, 11:03:43 AM
It would be interesting to take a look at the publicly available documents behind that case.

I was thinking the same thing. The article says they ended up pleading guilty. I would think the evidence would have to be pretty good to cause them to plead in this situation. Like most people confronted by police, they may have simply told the truth after being read their rights. Must have been a confession for them to give up in such fashion. And if they told the truth, I applaud them for that.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: Rainier10 on March 02, 2017, 11:08:04 AM
It would be interesting to take a look at the publicly available documents behind that case.

I was thinking the same thing. The article says they ended up pleading guilty. I would think the evidence would have to be pretty good to cause them to plead in this situation. Like most people confronted by police, they may have simply told the truth after being read their rights. Must have been a confession for them to give up in such fashion. And if they told the truth, I applaud them for that.
:yeah: The best advice for their defense would have been to say nothing and let the lawyers handle it all.  If they did just come clean when questioned that is great.  It saves everyone a bunch of time and money trying to prove it.  Just come clean, take your lumps and move on.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: Forks on March 02, 2017, 11:39:55 AM
Here is a photo of a living Idaho legend that didn't need his kids or grandkids to put down the #1 and #3 Muley's in the state. His grandson Jared, who is a close friend, gave me this.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: Timberstalker on March 02, 2017, 11:47:16 AM
Greed.

There are a lot of words, thoughts and opinions in this thread.  This one is the best descriptor.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: huntnphool on March 02, 2017, 12:32:03 PM
The fine and punishment is a joke.
Should be a minimum 10 year license yank IMHO.

And there are those on this site that believe it's no big deal if the poacher simply buys back the antlers.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: JDHasty on March 02, 2017, 12:47:29 PM
Remember this guy? 

https://www.gohunt.com/read/news/breaking-story-bull-elk-scam-DIY-backcountry-hunt-or-high-fence#gs.18waIYM

Well, well, well.... lookie what I got in my email.  Maybe these guys were on the radar already.   
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: huntnphool on March 02, 2017, 12:52:02 PM
What am I missing? :dunno:
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: JDHasty on March 02, 2017, 12:55:46 PM
What am I missing? :dunno:

this Wyohighcountry was known a "sketchy" site ran by a sketchy guy
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: huntnphool on March 02, 2017, 12:59:19 PM
What am I missing? :dunno:

this Wyohighcountry was known a "sketchy" site ran by a sketchy guy

Did Gary Nix own the site? :dunno:
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: JDHasty on March 02, 2017, 01:07:43 PM
What am I missing? :dunno:

this Wyohighcountry was known a "sketchy" site ran by a sketchy guy

Did Gary Nix own the site? :dunno:

Guy I got the email from said that he remembered both the father and son as being very active on it. 
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: Rainier10 on March 02, 2017, 01:13:20 PM
I absolutely love this quote and think it really applies in this case.

" In today's instant gratification society, more and more pressure revolves around success and the measurement of one's prowess as a hunter by inches on a score chart or field photos produced on social media. Don't fall into the trap. Hunting is-and always will be- about the hunt, the adventure, the views, and time spent with close friends and family. " Ryan Hatfield
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: DOUBLELUNG on March 02, 2017, 01:22:51 PM
I agree with Idahohntr- not the crime of the century. They DID have a tag. I think the fine was excessive. I also do not condone this but I don't consider it "poaching." Honestly if the dad wants his son to fill his tag that he drew, I almost don't see a reason why it shouldn't be legal. As long as the father is with him it seems like it doesn't make much difference who pulls the trigger. I'm also curious how this case was solved, they only had to deny it unless there was a witness.
I agree with you more often than not - but not this time.  I include these guys in with the class of scum who break the rules for notoriety and gain.  The internet and hunting show celebrities, the gear reps, the article submitters and contest enterers who cheat to win - all scum in my book, and anathema to fair chase.  I'm glad they forfeited the head, since that is what they most craved - their own 'pedestal" in the look-at-me community.  They are no different than the spotlighters, closed season and trespassing scum in my opinion.  They are a blight within the hunting community, and a blight on the reputation of hunters with the nonhunting majority who support legal, regulated hunting done lawfully by hunters of integrity.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: DOUBLELUNG on March 02, 2017, 01:23:39 PM
I agree with Idahohntr- not the crime of the century. They DID have a tag. I think the fine was excessive. I also do not condone this but I don't consider it "poaching." Honestly if the dad wants his son to fill his tag that he drew, I almost don't see a reason why it shouldn't be legal. As long as the father is with him it seems like it doesn't make much difference who pulls the trigger. I'm also curious how this case was solved, they only had to deny it unless there was a witness.

I agree. Don't ever go to Minnesota or any of the other Midwest states. Party hunting is pretty normal.
I'm fine with it where it is legal.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: huntnphool on March 02, 2017, 01:26:56 PM
What am I missing? :dunno:

this Wyohighcountry was known a "sketchy" site ran by a sketchy guy

Did Gary Nix own the site? :dunno:

Guy I got the email from said that he remembered both the father and son as being very active on it.

 I fail to see the relevance, but okay. :dunno:

 One of the biggest poaching rings ever in the PacNW involved guys like "rougheye" and his family that frequented this site, does that make this site shady? http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,84322.msg1052743.html#msg1052743
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: JDHasty on March 02, 2017, 01:27:20 PM
I agree with Idahohntr- not the crime of the century. They DID have a tag. I think the fine was excessive. I also do not condone this but I don't consider it "poaching." Honestly if the dad wants his son to fill his tag that he drew, I almost don't see a reason why it shouldn't be legal. As long as the father is with him it seems like it doesn't make much difference who pulls the trigger. I'm also curious how this case was solved, they only had to deny it unless there was a witness.
I agree with you more often than not - but not this time.  I include these guys in with the class of scum who break the rules for notoriety and gain.  The internet and hunting show celebrities, the gear reps, the article submitters and contest enterers who cheat to win - all scum in my book, and anathema to fair chase.  I'm glad they forfeited the head, since that is what they most craved - their own 'pedestal" in the look at me community.  They are no different than the spotlighters, closed season and trespassing scum in my opinion.  They are a blight within the hunting community, and a blight on the reputation of hunters with the nonhunting majority who support legal, regulated hunting done lawfully by hunters of integrity.

You have put into words my sentiments on this crap, particularly the part about internet and hunting show celebrities, the gear reps, the article submitters and contest enterers who cheat to win. 
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: JDHasty on March 02, 2017, 01:30:08 PM
What am I missing? :dunno:

this Wyohighcountry was known a "sketchy" site ran by a sketchy guy

Did Gary Nix own the site? :dunno:

Guy I got the email from said that he remembered both the father and son as being very active on it.

 I fail to see the relevance, but okay. :dunno:

 One of the biggest poaching rings ever in the PacNW involved guys like "rougheye" and his family that frequented this site, does that make this site shady?

The site was run by a flim-flammer and... from what I know about it, those who were most active on it were the epitome of internet and hunting show wanna' be celebrities, gear reps, article submitters and contest enterers who cheat to win.   
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: huntnphool on March 02, 2017, 01:32:02 PM
What am I missing? :dunno:

this Wyohighcountry was known a "sketchy" site ran by a sketchy guy

Did Gary Nix own the site? :dunno:

Guy I got the email from said that he remembered both the father and son as being very active on it.

 I fail to see the relevance, but okay. :dunno:

 One of the biggest poaching rings ever in the PacNW involved guys like "rougheye" and his family that frequented this site, does that make this site shady?

The site was run by a flim-flammer and, from what I know about it, those who were most active on it were the epitome of  internet and hunting show wanna' be celebrities, gear reps, article submitters and contest enterers

 Ah, got it. :tup:
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: jackelope on March 02, 2017, 01:38:31 PM
I absolutely love this quote and think it really applies in this case.

" In today's instant gratification society, more and more pressure revolves around success and the measurement of one's prowess as a hunter by inches on a score chart or field photos produced on social media. Don't fall into the trap. Hunting is-and always will be- about the hunt, the adventure, the views, and time spent with close friends and family. " Ryan Hatfield


Kaboom.

Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: jackelope on March 02, 2017, 01:41:28 PM
Just a bunch of flim flammers.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: Timberstalker on March 02, 2017, 01:43:52 PM
 :chuckle: :chuckle:
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: bobcat on March 02, 2017, 01:45:41 PM
Yeah I agree 100% with that Ryan Hatfield quote as well. The funny thing is if the same scenario happened but it was a doe, or a young little buck, they never would have been caught and most people wouldn't even care. But it's a record book buck so everyone's in an uproar over it.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: jackelope on March 02, 2017, 01:52:29 PM
Yeah I agree 100% with that Ryan Hatfield quote as well. The funny thing is if the same scenario happened but it was a doe, or a young little buck, they never would have been caught and most people wouldn't even care. But it's a record book buck so everyone's in an uproar over it.

I'm confident saying the only reason those guys got busted is because they posted it all over social media(greed). That's also the reason why everyone is in an uproar over it. I'm also confident saying they likely wouldn't have posted a doe or a small buck all over social media like that.
Were it not for social media, would any of us be in an uproar over Bullwinkle or any of the other questionable trophy animal kills we've seen on here over the years? No. We wouldn't.

Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: JDHasty on March 02, 2017, 01:54:12 PM
Yeah I agree 100% with that Ryan Hatfield quote as well. The funny thing is if the same scenario happened but it was a doe, or a young little buck, they never would have been caught and most people wouldn't even care. But it's a record book buck so everyone's in an uproar over it.

That is true, but my take on it is:  These monster bucks are not unknown.  In fact a lot more people know about them than people would think.  They just don't go running their mouth about them to every Tom, Dick & Harry.  Here is another example of the wheels coming off one on one of these glory and fame seekers:  https://www.gohunt.com/read/news/breaking-story-230-inch-mule-deer-buck-poached-in-wyoming#gs.e55AhtQ

I think this clown got and served jail time. 
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: andrew_in_idaho on March 02, 2017, 03:57:34 PM
I wonder how IDFG solved this case...would seem incredibly difficult to prove without a guilty plea from Dad/son.  Was it being videoed? 

Idaho has a program that allows parents/grandparents to give tags to their minor children...not that the son in this case is a minor...but I guess I just don't see this as the crime of the century, particularly given Idaho currently supports some form of tag sharing among family.  All that said, I do not condone such actions - but I do think the punishment is probably about right...not too light.
You can give a tag to a minor child or grandchild but not in the heat of the moment, you have to file paperwork and you don't get to shoot several times or even hunt at all before the minor child/grandchild decides to take the tag so that's not even slightly relevant in this situation


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Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: trophyhunt on March 02, 2017, 04:45:33 PM
I didn't read the entire thread so please don't hammer me, but I just want to know which unit this deer was killed in???  PM's please
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: bigmacc on March 02, 2017, 07:31:33 PM
Wow, ....myself and family have killed a few big bucks and bulls that would probably be in in some sort of "record book" and in the hundreds and hundreds of animals our family has taken in the state of Washington since the early 1900,s not a one was ever scored, even tho a few fish and game folks my family have been friends with over the last hundred years or so have wanted us to do so, or at least "advised" us to. I have posted some of the bucks on here a few years ago but have hundreds more pictures that I will not. The reason our family hunts has never been about "the score", but about "the hunt", "the experience", "the time spent with friends and family" and putting food on the table. Killing the "biggest animal on the block" has never been a motivator. The fame and fortune of taking a big buck or bull is not why we hunt, but unfortunately for some it is..... :twocents:
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: idahohuntr on March 02, 2017, 08:00:12 PM
Yeah I agree 100% with that Ryan Hatfield quote as well. The funny thing is if the same scenario happened but it was a doe, or a young little buck, they never would have been caught and most people wouldn't even care. But it's a record book buck so everyone's in an uproar over it.

I'm confident saying the only reason those guys got busted is because they posted it all over social media(greed). That's also the reason why everyone is in an uproar over it. I'm also confident saying they likely wouldn't have posted a doe or a small buck all over social media like that.
Were it not for social media, would any of us be in an uproar over Bullwinkle or any of the other questionable trophy animal kills we've seen on here over the years? No. We wouldn't.
Only from the perspective that none of us would know about said poaching, or "questionable" kills...whether a poacher posts his kill on social media or hides it in a closet and never speaks about said trophy has no bearing on my view of a poaching incident. 
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: huntnphool on March 02, 2017, 08:02:13 PM
I didn't read the entire thread so please don't hammer me, but I just want to know which unit this deer was killed in???  PM's please

SE corner
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: trophyhunt on March 02, 2017, 08:33:04 PM
I didn't read the entire thread so please don't hammer me, but I just want to know which unit this deer was killed in???  PM's please

SE corner
I hunted by Paris down there one year, the poaching was obvious. Never went back, but that hunt was an over the counter tag. 
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: 257 Wby Mag on March 02, 2017, 08:47:17 PM
I didn't read the entire thread so please don't hammer me, but I just want to know which unit this deer was killed in???  PM's please

SE corner
I hunted by Paris down there one year, the poaching was obvious. Never went back, but that hunt was an over the counter tag.

Jerry, it was in Bonneville county, so one of the LE tags in there...
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: DOUBLELUNG on March 02, 2017, 09:18:29 PM
Wow, ....myself and family have killed a few big bucks and bulls that would probably be in in some sort of "record book" and in the hundreds and hundreds of animals our family has taken in the state of Washington since the early 1900,s not a one was ever scored, even tho a few fish and game folks my family have been friends with over the last hundred years or so have wanted us to do so, or at least "advised" us to. I have posted some of the bucks on here a few years ago but have hundreds more pictures that I will not. The reason our family hunts has never been about "the score", but about "the hunt", "the experience", "the time spent with friends and family" and putting food on the table. Killing the "biggest animal on the block" has never been a motivator. The fame and fortune of taking a big buck or bull is not why we hunt, but unfortunately for some it is..... :twocents:
I have killed 5 animals that would have qualified for state records or record books.  My very best hunting buddy, who is a phenomenal and honest hunter, has a few in P&Y.  When I killed a bull that was eligible, he was disappointed I didn't enter it.  I think 15 years on now, he understands why.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: TeacherMan on March 03, 2017, 09:50:16 AM
The story is very vague how they say it... I've kept up on this story for a while and the father had hit the deer and the son finished it off without a license. I guess I'm old school but I don't see anything wrong with that; better than letting it go off and die. But I don't see anything wrong with putting a deer out of it misery if its back snapped and its laying in the ditch suffering. Good thing I'm always to the book  8)
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: idaho guy on March 03, 2017, 05:49:52 PM
The story is very vague how they say it... I've kept up on this story for a while and the father had hit the deer and the son finished it off without a license. I guess I'm old school but I don't see anything wrong with that; better than letting it go off and die. But I don't see anything wrong with putting a deer out of it misery if its back snapped and its laying in the ditch suffering. Good thing I'm always to the book  8)


I agree the penalty was too much especially if the buck was already hit. They are Not the same as the poacher who shoots something out of season and without a tag or in season without a tag. 
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: trophyhunt on March 03, 2017, 05:56:15 PM
The story is very vague how they say it... I've kept up on this story for a while and the father had hit the deer and the son finished it off without a license. I guess I'm old school but I don't see anything wrong with that; better than letting it go off and die. But I don't see anything wrong with putting a deer out of it misery if its back snapped and its laying in the ditch suffering. Good thing I'm always to the book  8)


I agree the penalty was too much especially if the buck was already hit. They are Not the same as the poacher who shoots something out of season and without a tag or in season without a tag.
I tend to agree, they were honest with Leo and that is what got them in trouble.  I also agree that if this was a small 3 point or doe, we wouldn't be talking about this.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: trophyhunt on March 03, 2017, 06:00:47 PM
Furthermore, my dad is 75 years old, if he finally drew a big bull or deer tag, and he wounded an animal of this caliber or any size, and I had a chance to finish it off and recover the animal, done deal.  Roast away !
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: idaho guy on March 03, 2017, 06:06:45 PM
Furthermore, my dad is 75 years old, if he finally drew a big bull or deer tag, and he wounded an animal of this caliber or any size, and I had a chance to finish it off and recover the animal, done deal.  Roast away !


me too :yeah:
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: goldenhtr on March 03, 2017, 06:26:52 PM
I'll bet the Law Office of Hormel.LLC could have argued that the regs were vague about family members being able to give tags to each other.
DAD: bang bang bang DAMN here son you can have my tag!!!!! shoot shoot :IBCOOL: :yike: :dunno:
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: bobcat on March 03, 2017, 06:58:27 PM

I'll bet the Law Office of Hormel.LLC could have argued that the regs were vague about family members being able to give tags to each other.
DAD: bang bang bang DAMN here son you can have my tag!!!!! shoot shoot :IBCOOL: :yike: :dunno:

I'm sure if they had as much money as Mr. Reichert they would have gotten out of it for sure. All it takes is enough money and the right attorney.
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on March 03, 2017, 07:07:43 PM

I'll bet the Law Office of Hormel.LLC could have argued that the regs were vague about family members being able to give tags to each other.
DAD: bang bang bang DAMN here son you can have my tag!!!!! shoot shoot :IBCOOL: :yike: :dunno:

I'm sure if they had as much money as Mr. Reichert they would have gotten out of it for sure. All it takes is enough money and the right attorney.


 :yeah:  That's the facts jack...............................
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: DOUBLELUNG on March 07, 2017, 11:56:02 AM
The story is very vague how they say it... I've kept up on this story for a while and the father had hit the deer and the son finished it off without a license. I guess I'm old school but I don't see anything wrong with that; better than letting it go off and die. But I don't see anything wrong with putting a deer out of it misery if its back snapped and its laying in the ditch suffering. Good thing I'm always to the book  8)


I agree the penalty was too much especially if the buck was already hit. They are Not the same as the poacher who shoots something out of season and without a tag or in season without a tag.
I tend to agree, they were honest with Leo and that is what got them in trouble.  I also agree that if this was a small 3 point or doe, we wouldn't be talking about this.
If I believed that was the real story I might be a bit sympathetic.  My experience with wildlife LEOs is that once they get the confession that will lead to conviction, one of the informal bonuses to the confessed poachers is LEOs don't contest their public version of events - and in virtually every publicized case of which I had personal knowledge of the circumstances, the poachers lie about those circumstances.     
Title: Re: Idaho 2015 record mule deer poached
Post by: fly4fish on April 02, 2017, 08:13:53 AM
2015. I found this buck 30 yards off a 4 wheeler road with what appeared to be a bullet hole in the shoulder.  We scouted and planned our limited entry archery season around him.  A huge let down when we found him the day before season in this state. Some tines were broke off; they're laying on the ground.
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