Hunting Washington Forum

Big Game Hunting => Deer Hunting => Topic started by: fishnfur on April 15, 2018, 03:45:23 PM

Title: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: fishnfur on April 15, 2018, 03:45:23 PM
I know you all notched a tag last year with B&C class animals.  Here's your chance to see how the rest of us did: 

https://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/harvest/2017/

As I suspected, the numbers for Ryderwood/530 were down by 25%  (448 down to 340).  District 10 (pretty much the top BT producing district) was down by 20% from 2016.  District 11 containing Skookumchuck - the highest producing BT GMU in 2016, was down around 25%.  It wasn't just me.  It really was a crappy year! 

Funny that WDFW has no comment on the significant drop in success.  "Just keep sending us your money suckers!"
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: fish vacuum on April 15, 2018, 04:33:38 PM
I guess I can feel good that I got a deer after seeing how low the success rate was where I hunted?
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: pd on April 15, 2018, 04:46:26 PM
Tag for later analysis.

However, your points are well taken.  Sure, the weather has been very strange these past few years.  Also, reporting accuracy is always in question.  But the numbers (taken across thousands of hunters, in dozens and dozens of districts) do make a clear trend. 

Am I the only one, I sometimes feel like the Last Mohican when it comes to hunting here.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: fishnfur on April 15, 2018, 06:48:07 PM
Man, I don't get it.  The down trend seems to be virtually across the board.  Capitol Peak went down to 280 total harvest vs 427 from the previous year.  Really significant changes.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: White Pass Outfitters on April 15, 2018, 06:59:23 PM
Wow ! after seeing that I guess I can say we had a very good year last year.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: rsrubalcaba on April 15, 2018, 07:04:40 PM
Do the reports show hunter participation as well as harvest numbers?  Could the state lost of bunch of hunters to out of state opportunities?
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: Mudman on April 15, 2018, 07:16:14 PM
Less hunters.  Simple.  We are tired of this states crap.  Wa down, Id up.  I know first hand.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: pope on April 15, 2018, 07:37:34 PM
I spend a little time in the pathetic 653 White River chasing deer, where harvest numbers are also down. I noticed 1 antlerless harvest. Is this possible? The unit was formerly any deer for archery, but recently became a buck only unit (2 point or better on the tree farm). I looked through all of the youth and disabled hunts and didn't see any doe tags.

BTW, look at the Puyallup numbers for special deer hunts. 0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: optic2 on April 15, 2018, 10:33:18 PM
Do the reports show hunter participation as well as harvest numbers?  Could the state lost of bunch of hunters to out of state opportunities?

Yes, look at the columns further to the right. They show number of hunters as well as hunter days (total number of days hunted by all hunters in that unit).
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: fishnfur on April 15, 2018, 11:58:46 PM
Less hunters.  Simple.  We are tired of this states crap.  Wa down, Id up.  I know first hand.

Well certainly, many are tired of Washington's "management" of game, but I'm thinking that fewer numbers of deer hunters does not result in a lower harvest.  Conversely, it means more opportunity for those still hunting here.  Success rates should be higher, and total harvest roughly equivalent with fewer hunters in the field. 

It seems plausible that the long white winter of 2016 - 2017, when we had multiple snow storms and extended periods of snow on the ground may have negatively affected Blacktail population survival rates.  I seem to remember making numerous rants about how tired I was of the snow that winter.  Any apparent change in harvest numbers may well be within the statistical norm.  I certainly can't draw any conclusions from the district 10 numbers (below).

Just for chuckles, I ran the numbers for select Districts, plus the Skookumchuck/667 GMU, for the seasons 2014 through 2017.  Certainly, in some areas, hunter numbers are down.  Whether a 5% decrease in hunter numbers causes a 20% reduction in harvest is anybody's guess.  I kind of doubt it.

Submitted for your consideration:

District/GMU             2017       2016      2015      2014

GMU 667   harvest      537         681        841        795
             # hunters   2055        2228      2335      2237

Dist 10      harvest    2147       2712      2434      2243
            #  hunters 10,009    10,406    12,093  12,360

Dist 11      harvest    1203      1634       1799      1525
            #  hunters    6009      6362       6989      6590

Dist 14      harvest      739       976         939        926
            #  hunters    3795      3699       4032      4242
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: justyhntr on April 16, 2018, 06:25:23 AM
Part of those numbers could be a reflection of rut timing, in 2016 the rut seemed to line up with late buck and we saw branched bucks all 4 days . In 2017 that wasn't the case, we did not see a single branched buck during that time and the 2 buck that we known got shot in our area were forkies. Cameras we had out 2017 showed the majority of the rut movement was between Nov.4 - Nov.9 . We had 11 different bucks on one camera moving daily during those dates. I think it was 2014 the same thing happened and a lot of bucks got killed that year skewing the numbers the next year.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: bobcat on April 16, 2018, 06:34:41 AM
My guess on 667, is that more deer were taken out of the Vail tree farm since Weyerhaeuser began the access permit system, and now, after a few years of excessive harvest, there are simply less deer. In the past Vail was only open to hunting a few weekends during modern firearm season. Now people can drive in there and hunt or scout 7 days a week, year around. That has to have had a negative affect on the deer population in there.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: Magnum_Willys on April 16, 2018, 06:43:19 AM
Does show 10% drop in hunters over 4 years.   
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: Mudman on April 16, 2018, 08:12:07 AM
My guess on 667, is that more deer were taken out of the Vail tree farm since Weyerhaeuser began the access permit system, and now, after a few years of excessive harvest, there are simply less deer. In the past Vail was only open to hunting a few weekends during modern firearm season. Now people can drive in there and hunt or scout 7 days a week, year around. That has to have had a negative affect on the deer population in there.
Since the 90's it has been declining.  Not even close to what it was growing up.  Permits didn't change much really.  A Zoo of rifles and trucks shooting spikes imop.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: WSU on April 16, 2018, 08:13:53 AM
My guess on 667, is that more deer were taken out of the Vail tree farm since Weyerhaeuser began the access permit system, and now, after a few years of excessive harvest, there are simply less deer. In the past Vail was only open to hunting a few weekends during modern firearm season. Now people can drive in there and hunt or scout 7 days a week, year around. That has to have had a negative affect on the deer population in there.
Since the 90's it has been declining.  Not even close to what it was growing up.  Permits didn't change much really.  A Zoo of rifles and trucks shooting spikes imop.

Or maybe forestry practices?  I hunt other tree farms and there aren't many deer and the habitat (largely grass or firs, not much in between) doesn't lend itself to having lots of deer. 
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: weatherbow21 on April 16, 2018, 08:38:38 AM
The south sound area has had such a drastic drop in deer numbers in the last several years its not even worth my time anymore, and its my backyard.

Two things I know:

1-Branch antlered deer are tough to find anymore, much less a mature buck.

2-I think my odds of seeing a cougar are higher than seeing a mature buck. Cat sightings USED to be rare.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: Sandberm on April 16, 2018, 08:43:20 AM
150,000 deer hunters in 2000
112,000 deer hunters in 2017

25% decline.

Most archers ever in my little honey hole however  :(
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: PolarBear on April 16, 2018, 08:50:21 AM
My guess on 667, is that more deer were taken out of the Vail tree farm since Weyerhaeuser began the access permit system, and now, after a few years of excessive harvest, there are simply less deer. In the past Vail was only open to hunting a few weekends during modern firearm season. Now people can drive in there and hunt or scout 7 days a week, year around. That has to have had a negative affect on the deer population in there.
The poaching is also out of control in VAIL.  Add that to more predators and the vast majority of bucks taken are 6 moths to 1, 1/2 year  olds and yeah, the hunting has fallen off a cliff.  2015 we we picking and choosing what bucks we wanted, last year we worked our butts off for nothing.  Tons of folks coming out of the woods at daylight, headed in after dark and brush picker vans with blood running out from under their salal.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: Sandberm on April 16, 2018, 09:31:31 AM
My bro in law likes to go up to the dayton unit.

162 archers tried to get an Elk, only 2 were successful! Jeez
691 modern firearm elk hunters with a 1% success rate! Jeez, futile.

1571 rifle deer hunters with a 19% success rate. Sea of orange eh?
261 deer archers with a 24% success rate.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: bigtex on April 16, 2018, 09:37:36 AM
The poaching is also out of control in VAIL.
About 15 years ago Oregon St U. did a study on poaching in Oregon. They found that for every 1 animal legally taken, 1 animal is illegally taken.

While that study was in Oregon I would think the same would go for WA, maybe even more so since the population is higher in WA.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: Special T on April 16, 2018, 11:09:55 AM
The poaching is also out of control in VAIL.
About 15 years ago Oregon St U. did a study on poaching in Oregon. They found that for every 1 animal legally taken, 1 animal is illegally taken.

While that study was in Oregon I would think the same would go for WA, maybe even more so since the population is higher in WA.
I would love to see that study... any link?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: PolarBear on April 16, 2018, 12:13:13 PM
The poaching is also out of control in VAIL.
About 15 years ago Oregon St U. did a study on poaching in Oregon. They found that for every 1 animal legally taken, 1 animal is illegally taken.

While that study was in Oregon I would think the same would go for WA, maybe even more so since the population is higher in WA.
Yep.  I also know of at least 2 dozen deer and elk that were shot in Vail and never recovered.  Several of those were because the shooter was too lazy.  I helped at least 3 guys look for their deer and every time they gave up in less than a half hour.  I bet there is a lot more of that crap going on than you would think.  I personally know one guy who killed 3 does before he recovered a single one of them and that one was a fawn.   :bash:
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: fishnfur on April 16, 2018, 01:56:50 PM
Part of those numbers could be a reflection of rut timing, in 2016 the rut seemed to line up with late buck and we saw branched bucks all 4 days . In 2017 that wasn't the case, we did not see a single branched buck during that time and the 2 buck that we known got shot in our area were forkies. Cameras we had out 2017 showed the majority of the rut movement was between Nov.4 - Nov.9 . We had 11 different bucks on one camera moving daily during those dates. I think it was 2014 the same thing happened and a lot of bucks got killed that year skewing the numbers the next year.

Good thought there.  That could also be a significant reason.  It was definitely different last year.  I had a ton of fun last year and saw more bucks than normal during the general season.  I only saw a few solo doe (no bucks in tow) during late buck season.  If you remember, the rut thread during general season was generally endless complaining about the lack of action - it never really seemed to pick up. 

I also wouldn't  argue about the poaching issue.  On my property in Kitsap, I used to see does virtually every time I was there over the last several years.  I saw just one fawn and and only had one doe on the trail cam during a 4 month soak in 2017.  Something has dropped the doe numbers way, way down out there.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: npaull on April 16, 2018, 02:43:14 PM
Hair loss disease, maybe? I'm seeing lots of fawns with that around here in the south sound. Most seem to be doing ok, but then, obviously I'm only seeing the ones that AREN'T dying...
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: Webfoot on April 16, 2018, 03:54:37 PM
The elk #'s reported are not right. I have a hard time believing that there was only 1 bull taken in the Clearwater!
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: Webfoot on April 16, 2018, 03:58:53 PM
I recant my last statement. I was reading special permits.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: fishnfur on April 16, 2018, 04:22:46 PM
Well, I went to the horses mouth.  I contacted Eric Holman, the head WDFW Biologist and asked the reason for the sudden downward trend.  Here's his response:

"This is a combination of the effects of the very severe winter of 2016-17 and fewer hunters trying for black-tails (which is itself a combination of Fee Access Systems by Industrial Forestland owners, development and the reduced number of hunters overall).

 

Hope this helps,


Eric "

I assume "development" refers to loss of habitat due to development of neighborhoods/businesses etc. 
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: Mudman on April 16, 2018, 05:15:33 PM
Ya know what this means right??  Less hunters=less $$$.  So being its WA they will raise fees to gather more revenue. :bash:  We lose again while $ pours into timber Co.'s  I wonder if they can still afford worthless million dollar restrooms in places like Elbe?  Discover pass discover thru discovery that discover isn't discovering as much $!
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: buglebrush on April 16, 2018, 05:43:00 PM
The poaching is also out of control in VAIL.
About 15 years ago Oregon St U. did a study on poaching in Oregon. They found that for every 1 animal legally taken, 1 animal is illegally taken.

While that study was in Oregon I would think the same would go for WA, maybe even more so since the population is higher in WA.

And for every poached animal the Bloody Tribes "Poach" two more of them. 
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: Tjv28 on April 16, 2018, 06:14:34 PM
Part of those numbers could be a reflection of rut timing, in 2016 the rut seemed to line up with late buck and we saw branched bucks all 4 days . In 2017 that wasn't the case, we did not see a single branched buck during that time and the 2 buck that we known got shot in our area were forkies. Cameras we had out 2017 showed the majority of the rut movement was between Nov.4 - Nov.9 . We had 11 different bucks on one camera moving daily during those dates. I think it was 2014 the same thing happened and a lot of bucks got killed that year skewing the numbers the next year.


I think this is a big part of it.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: ctwiggs1 on April 16, 2018, 06:17:10 PM
Itís been a few years since they dumped the trophy units too so we should start seeing a decline from the huge peaks that were happening. 
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: W_Ellison2011 on April 16, 2018, 07:21:47 PM
WOOHOO! I beat out the odds again! 16.8% of archery hunters harvested deer in the Mashel unit! Of course I'm used to hunting 513 that hasn't had a high harvest rate until the last couple years!
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: MAVsled on April 16, 2018, 07:46:04 PM
I was one of these 7 that reported, one of 5 that hunted....Zero success rate.
Perfect hunt weather. Cold, cloudy for first 4 days, then snowy days and dusting of fresh snow last 4 nights for quiet, cold conditions. In 10 successive days of Teanaway late archery buck, I saw only 2 bucks and maybe 5 does. Passed the 25 yard first day shot at the small 2 point. The other was a 4x4 at 600 yards away and on the move out of Dickey creek. Why? Wolves.
I spotted 2 wolves in a 3 day span, while hunting 3 miles on backtrails off the main roads. One black dark one, one grayish-white one. The 6" of fresh snow, their fresh tracks were right on Dickey creek and off a trail on Blue creek roads.

hunt #: 1085
Name: Teanaway
Unit: GMU 335
# applicants: 126
tags issued: 10
reports returned: 7
Number of hunters: 5
success rate: 0%
Antlered Harvest Total
1 Point : 0
2 Point : 0
3 Point : 0
4 Point : 0
5+ Point : 0

Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: fishnfur on April 16, 2018, 08:08:33 PM
Ouch!  Nothing good about that report.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: Vine Maples and Cottonwoo on April 16, 2018, 08:22:11 PM
Reasons:
Lack of Access
Poor Habitat, No Food- The programs/chemicals the Timber Companies and the State use to control weeds, deciduous growth actually destroy the kind of food deer need.
Predators
Poaching
Lack of Logging, and Slash Burning
Just a few possibilities
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: bobcat on April 16, 2018, 08:34:32 PM
Reasons:
Lack of Access
Poor Habitat, No Food- The programs/chemicals the Timber Companies and the State use to control weeds, deciduous growth actually destroy the kind of food deer need.
Predators
Poaching
Lack of Logging, and Slash Burning
Just a few possibilities


Number 1 reason in bold.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: Gringo31 on April 16, 2018, 08:42:59 PM
I'm glad to see so many folks reading the report.... :tup:
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: teanawayslayer on April 16, 2018, 08:45:45 PM
I was one of these 7 that reported, one of 5 that hunted....Zero success rate.
Perfect hunt weather. Cold, cloudy for first 4 days, then snowy days and dusting of fresh snow last 4 nights for quiet, cold conditions. In 10 successive days of Teanaway late archery buck, I saw only 2 bucks and maybe 5 does. Passed the 25 yard first day shot at the small 2 point. The other was a 4x4 at 600 yards away and on the move out of Dickey creek. Why? Wolves.
I spotted 2 wolves in a 3 day span, while hunting 3 miles on backtrails off the main roads. One black dark one, one grayish-white one. The 6" of fresh snow, their fresh tracks were right on Dickey creek and off a trail on Blue creek roads.

hunt #: 1085
Name: Teanaway
Unit: GMU 335
# applicants: 126
tags issued: 10
reports returned: 7
Number of hunters: 5
success rate: 0%
Antlered Harvest Total
1 Point : 0
2 Point : 0
3 Point : 0
4 Point : 0
5+ Point : 0
why do you think there were only 126 applicants? Not much of a quality hunt and hasnít been for quite some time.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: pope on April 16, 2018, 08:53:19 PM
Reasons:
Lack of Access
Poor Habitat, No Food- The programs/chemicals the Timber Companies and the State use to control weeds, deciduous growth actually destroy the kind of food deer need.
Predators
Poaching
Lack of Logging, and Slash Burning
Just a few possibilities

 
Number 1 reason in bold.

Seems like hunters and granola crunchers could get behind a ban of using herbicides, form some kind of alliance against "the man". Popular among the progressive outdoor crowd are the writings of Edward Abbey, who considered the importance of habitat conservation to all user groups, including hunters:

"It is not enough to fight for the land; it is even more important to enjoy it. While you can. While itís still here. So get out there and hunt and fish and mess around with your friends, ramble out yonder and explore the forests, climb the mountains, bag the peaks, run the rivers, breathe deep of that yet sweet and lucid air, sit quietly for a while and contemplate the precious stillness, the lovely, mysterious, and awesome space."
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: jstone on April 16, 2018, 08:59:33 PM
That is kind of a no brained that the chemicals are doing in the animals. It is probably getting into the water and into the lakes and the rivers. Then what? Hiding it?
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: PolarBear on April 17, 2018, 12:39:04 AM
The elk #'s reported are not right. I have a hard time believing that there was only 1 bull taken in the Clearwater!
I know of 6 bulls taken in the Clearwater during archery alone.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: duckmen1 on April 17, 2018, 01:13:48 AM
The reports show 34 bulls taken during general seasons. As well as 1 bull and 2 cows from permit hunts.
The elk #'s reported are not right. I have a hard time believing that there was only 1 bull taken in the Clearwater!
I know of 6 bulls taken in the Clearwater during archery alone.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: White Pass Outfitters on April 17, 2018, 07:08:00 AM
Some people are missing one big reason why numbers are so low.
How about the capability of our hunters. No scouting, putting in areas they dont know anything about, dont practice shooting enough and #1 to many hunters are out of shape and spend more time in camp drinking rather than out hunting. Get in shape and out of the truck and your success rate will go up. Its not always someones else's fault why your not successful. No roads mean more Bigger Bulls. My drops camps are even over 50% so really no excuses.     
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: ctwiggs1 on April 17, 2018, 07:20:06 AM
Some people are missing one big reason why numbers are so low.
How about the capability of our hunters. No scouting, putting in areas they dont know anything about, dont practice shooting enough and #1 to many hunters are out of shape and spend more time in camp drinking rather than out hunting. Get in shape and out of the truck and your success rate will go up. Its not always someones else's fault why your not successful. No roads mean more Bigger Bulls. My drops camps are even over 50% so really no excuses.   

I don't think that is a problem that has developed over the last 3-4 years.  That's the consistent story we've been hearing since I was a kid - I'm assuming much longer as well.

I do think think the access passes for Weyerhauser land on the west side, combined with the removal of the trophy units on the east side, have likely contributed greatly to the overall decline of harvest.

A mean a 30% drop in 2 years statewide - can't just blame that on rut timing or a couple guys drinking booze.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: White Pass Outfitters on April 17, 2018, 07:38:54 AM
Couple guys drinking, have you ever driving the 1500 line during rifle season. More Elk campers than Elk hunters. Just saying we get our animals every year.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: dscubame on April 17, 2018, 08:16:09 AM
Timing of the rut had to do with the Eastern WA deer statistics without a doubt....  But I would take the 18 inches of snow I was hunting in last year over the rut timing.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: jstone on April 17, 2018, 08:49:11 AM
How many people donít fill out there harvest report wrong so that it shows no harvest? I bet there are more kills than is reported
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: PolarBear on April 17, 2018, 09:22:29 AM
And some guys fill them out for the wrong unit on purpose
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: jackelope on April 17, 2018, 12:33:40 PM
I was particularly interested in the mountain goat hunts this year. I see Goat Rocks permit holders went 5 for 5. That's great. What's depressing reading that report is folks drew permits and didn't hunt at all. 3 tag holders in the Naches Pass hunt area and -0- total days spent hunting. I can think of 3 guys that would have loved those permits. People need to know what they're getting into before they apply. (I believe one of those tagholders killed a billy in the wrong unit, so I'm going to guess he didn't fill out a report like normal) Multiple units where folks didn't hunt at all, or didn't report which also sucks with these hunts.

 
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: Bob33 on April 17, 2018, 12:42:05 PM
I was particularly interested in the mountain goat hunts this year. I see Goat Rocks permit holders went 5 for 5. That's great. What's depressing reading that report is folks drew permits and didn't hunt at all. 3 tag holders in the Naches Pass hunt area and -0- total days spent hunting. I can think of 3 guys that would have loved those permits. People need to know what they're getting into before they apply. (I believe one of those tagholders killed a billy in the wrong unit, so I'm going to guess he didn't fill out a report like normal) Multiple units where folks didn't hunt at all, or didn't report which also sucks with these hunts.
That may have been caused in part by the fire in that area which restricted access. It could also be that some didn't report accurately.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: ctwiggs1 on April 17, 2018, 02:15:54 PM
Didn't WDFW offer points back to tagholders who chose not to hunt?  May have been just elk.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: Bob33 on April 17, 2018, 02:45:45 PM
Didn't WDFW offer points back to tagholders who chose not to hunt?  May have been just elk.
I suspect they were offered to all permit holders that may have been open during that time period. The Naches Pass goat permit season started September 15.

http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,218001.msg2900652.html#msg2900652
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: Bushcraft on April 17, 2018, 03:15:58 PM
I was particularly interested in the mountain goat hunts this year. I see Goat Rocks permit holders went 5 for 5. That's great. What's depressing reading that report is folks drew permits and didn't hunt at all. 3 tag holders in the Naches Pass hunt area and -0- total days spent hunting. I can think of 3 guys that would have loved those permits. People need to know what they're getting into before they apply. (I believe one of those tagholders killed a billy in the wrong unit, so I'm going to guess he didn't fill out a report like normal) Multiple units where folks didn't hunt at all, or didn't report which also sucks with these hunts.

It's my understanding that all three were given the option to forfeit the opportunity and put in again next year with an additional point, or wait and use them this year. Uhmmm....:dunno:...DUH!...Easy choice!  :chuckle:

The odd/crappy part is they've apparently (so I've heard) added another opportunity to draw a Naches goat tag for a total of four goat hunters, without knowing how many goats actually made it through the winter.  Science-based management much?    :rolleyes:
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: jackelope on April 17, 2018, 04:06:35 PM
I was particularly interested in the mountain goat hunts this year. I see Goat Rocks permit holders went 5 for 5. That's great. What's depressing reading that report is folks drew permits and didn't hunt at all. 3 tag holders in the Naches Pass hunt area and -0- total days spent hunting. I can think of 3 guys that would have loved those permits. People need to know what they're getting into before they apply. (I believe one of those tagholders killed a billy in the wrong unit, so I'm going to guess he didn't fill out a report like normal) Multiple units where folks didn't hunt at all, or didn't report which also sucks with these hunts.

It's my understanding that all three were given the option to forfeit the opportunity and put in again next year with an additional point, or wait and use them this year. Uhmmm....:dunno:...DUH!...Easy choice!  :chuckle:

The odd/crappy part is they've apparently (so I've heard) added another opportunity to draw a Naches goat tag for a total of four goat hunters, without knowing how many goats actually made it through the winter.  Science-based management much?    :rolleyes:

Totally spaced out the fire. Thanks for reminding me. OK. I don't feel so bad anymore.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: Tbob on April 18, 2018, 04:36:52 PM
I donít know, these numbers seem really alarming to me! Meaning the  current overall harvest report numbers... dang!
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: X-Force on April 18, 2018, 05:21:15 PM
Maybe this should be its own thread but I just looked up some numbers District 1 only 101-121 general elk harvests every 2 years since 97. These are just the harvest numbers and number of hunters for the district.
Year - Harvests - Hunters
97 - 79 - 1946
99 - 70 - 4978
01 - 52 - 3296
03 - 119 - 3106
05 - 127 - 2439
07 - 167 - 1789
09 - 224 - 4833
11 - 234 - 4530
13 - 229 - 4377
15 - 229 - 4245* Multiseason harvests included but not hunters
17 - 222 - 3532

Looking at just one barometer it looks like elk in the Northeast are stable especially over the last 10 years.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: fishnfur on April 18, 2018, 06:21:25 PM
Yeah, it's hard to draw concrete conclusions from a single year's report.  Trends are important.  I do think timing of the rut can be crucial to success though.  If the peak of the rut happens, say in the first two weeks of November, while the majority of the hunters are sitting on their thumbs waiting for the late season to open, numbers are going to be lower than if the peak begins on/around the 14th (or later) of that month.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: dscubame on April 18, 2018, 09:30:59 PM
Maybe this should be its own thread but I just looked up some numbers District 1 only 101-121 general elk harvests every 2 years since 97. These are just the harvest numbers and number of hunters for the district.
Year - Harvests - Hunters
97 - 79 - 1946
99 - 70 - 4978
01 - 52 - 3296
03 - 119 - 3106
05 - 127 - 2439
07 - 167 - 1789
09 - 224 - 4833
11 - 234 - 4530
13 - 229 - 4377
15 - 229 - 4245* Multiseason harvests included but not hunters
17 - 222 - 3532

Looking at just one barometer it looks like elk in the Northeast are stable especially over the last 10 years.

Agree it should be it's own thread for elk since this thread is in the deer forums.  Super interesting for the elk perspective none the less.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: MAVsled on April 19, 2018, 07:55:21 PM
agree, but didn't think I'd draw the unit as 2nd choice.
only because I know the Teanaway unit well, did well there in past regular rifle seasons. Thought late archery would see migrating bucks from the high country...not!


I was one of these 7 that reported, one of 5 that hunted....Zero success rate.
Perfect hunt weather. Cold, cloudy for first 4 days, then snowy days and dusting of fresh snow last 4 nights for quiet, cold conditions. In 10 successive days of Teanaway late archery buck, I saw only 2 bucks and maybe 5 does. Passed the 25 yard first day shot at the small 2 point. The other was a 4x4 at 600 yards away and on the move out of Dickey creek. Why? Wolves.
I spotted 2 wolves in a 3 day span, while hunting 3 miles on backtrails off the main roads. One black dark one, one grayish-white one. The 6" of fresh snow, their fresh tracks were right on Dickey creek and off a trail on Blue creek roads.


hunt #: 1085
Name: Teanaway
Unit: GMU 335
# applicants: 126
tags issued: 10
reports returned: 7
Number of hunters: 5
success rate: 0%
Antlered Harvest Total
1 Point : 0
2 Point : 0
3 Point : 0
4 Point : 0
5+ Point : 0
why do you think there were only 126 applicants? Not much of a quality hunt and hasnít been for quite some time.
Title: Re: Read 'em and weep - 2017 Game harvest reports are out.
Post by: Deerelk37 on May 06, 2018, 11:58:37 AM
The predation and hard winter on the east side would be my best guess as to why the numbers are so down in the short term. I havenít hunted the east since 2015, however.

As far as the Westside goes...numbers dipped a little in my units but only by about 5-7% or so. This seems right to me for the weather this year. Opening weekend was hot. The entire second week, Sunday through Sunday at least was horrid hunting weather for blAcktails. Case and point the second Saturday it was good hunting weather (there was also a good day or two before that but I had to work) and we bagged 3 out of our 4 deer on one day. We filled our last tag at first light late season. I didnít see another deer for 4 days when it was hot and I stay out all day. Then another 3 days with no sightings. 

Anyone who has hunted the westside and east side knows weather has more effect on the westside. When itís hot on the westside youíre stuck to first light and dark only. The deer donít move much and you canít go in the thick after them like you can when itís damp. So all in all there were only a few good days for blacktail this year. Plus everyone I saw were just driving roads or watching a clearcut and first light. Some massive clear cuts, hunters wouldnít even get out and glass sometimes and there were deer in them. Iím not sure if people just think theyíll just jump in the back of the truck or what.

On the east side, even when itís hot I can turn up deer all day. Less than when itís overcast etc,  but itís still possible. From glassing shady areas or kicking up deer in draws. You always see far more deer on the east, than west (For every deer on the westside I could spot 10-20 on the east). But you gotta pick through tons them for a legal buck  on the east, while the west you might only see 5 deer in a week but a legal animal is easier to find if conditions are right.

There should be a survey question on if you drive roads only or actually get out of the truck. The number of road hunters on the east and west alike is astounding. I have no issue with it if it gets you out there, but donít complain about not seeing animals if youíre just driving the same roads as everyone else. I canít tell you how many guys I see in the trucks just chatting and looking out the front windshield. I even see it with my hunting partners, Iíll keep an eye on them as my head is swiveling in all directions searching for an animal to and from locations. Needless to say I see/spot more animals than they do.

Iím no expert but try and talk to that buddy who always says they want to go, and take them. Even if just for a good time.  :twocents: we need more hunters to fight the good fight. I have started two new hunters since last year, another this year and just had a daughter who I hope will love the outdoors as I do.