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Equipment & Gear => Power Equipment & RV => Topic started by: CoryTDF on January 24, 2020, 09:12:44 AM

Title: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: CoryTDF on January 24, 2020, 09:12:44 AM
So, I knew that I needed a new, more powerful, motor for my boat. I acquired a 1990 Spectrum Bluefin 1606 that was in pretty good shape as far as I could tell. IT had been covered and after doing some work on the floor it was ready for the water. Anyway, the 50HP Force outboard was a bit under powered so i started shopping for a new motor. I settled on the Mercury 60HP Command Thrust and i took it to the shop to have it mounted.

The shop was in Portland and they asked me to bring the boat so they could make sure the transom was in good enough shape to re-power the boat. I was told all was well and they sent me out the door with a new motor. I had to pick up my boat after hours in an absolute downpour so my inspection was not perfect but everything seemed in order. I towed the boat home and once home I noticed some pretty signification separation from the splash-well and the transom. I set about cleaning the area so that I could caulk it. During the cleaning I notice one of the drain plugs was broken and I pulled it out. I also saw wood on the plug so I put my finger into the hole and all the wood felt like jello. I decided to pull the other scupper out and it was the same thing. So it is now a certain that the transom is/was bad. No idea how the shop missed this.

I called the shop and told them what I had found. They were pretty shocked and have been trying to work this out with me. One option is that they will sort-of by back the motor from me and resell it to me in package deal with a new boat. Anyway, now I am looking a big decision, do I buy a new boat or do I try to put more time and money into a 30 year old riveted hull?   

Thoughts?   
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: Buckhunter24 on January 24, 2020, 09:33:59 AM
Aluminum will probably be a lot better than dealing with fiberglass so maybe it is worth it. I replaced one in an old fiberglass tri hull and it was a huge pita. Did they give you any indication of out the door cost?
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: rainshadow1 on January 24, 2020, 09:48:09 AM
You talking about do-it-yourselfing, or having it done?

Don't try to FIX it, I'm sure you know that. Jigsaw time. Lots of laminating and glassing to rebuild a motor mount transom. It would cost a couple hundred and a few days (with glassing/laminating skills), kinda depends on the trade off.

My experience is west side, and salt water, but OFTEN it was good money after bad... let it go. If the transom happens to somehow be the only rot in the boat, then maybe it's worth it. But (west, salt) it was rarely the only rot in the boat!

Edit: Looked it up, Aluminum laminated ply transom? I'd never fix it myself, but I'd use my do-it-yourself cost/time to judge their estimate. I'm skeptical! How much wood/glass is in that design?
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: CoryTDF on January 24, 2020, 10:04:10 AM
You talking about do-it-yourselfing, or having it done?

Don't try to FIX it, I'm sure you know that. Jigsaw time. Lots of laminating and glassing to rebuild a motor mount transom. It would cost a couple hundred and a few days (with glassing/laminating skills), kinda depends on the trade off.

My experience is west side, and salt water, but OFTEN it was good money after bad... let it go. If the transom happens to somehow be the only rot in the boat, then maybe it's worth it. But (west, salt) it was rarely the only rot in the boat!

Edit: Looked it up, Aluminum laminated ply transom? I'd never fix it myself, but I'd use my do-it-yourself cost/time to judge their estimate. I'm skeptical! How much wood/glass is in that design?

From everything I can tell it's just a wood piece that sits between two pieces of aluminum. Weirdly enough Smokercraft is still using this method of building transoms. Anyway, looks like I need to take off the motor, take the top cap off, take the inner skin off, pull out the old wood, and build a new piece coated in epoxy resin and then remount everything. It is the only wood in the boat that is bad.
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: Boss .300 winmag on January 24, 2020, 11:43:16 AM
Post some pics, Iím curious on how itís put together.

Iíve never done any fiberglass, but have seen it done, doesnít look that tough to do, plus youtube Iím sure had great how too videos.👍

Lokidog has a boat sitting in my barn I know he would make you a killer deal on since heís moving to WI.🤔
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: Blacklab on January 24, 2020, 12:30:34 PM
Dang that bites. I guess itís a coin flip  :dunno: New would be better in the long run. Hence all new. If you have the skill and time and want to do it, why not.
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: Fl0und3rz on January 24, 2020, 12:36:23 PM
Fix.

Check this guy out for some vids/tips.

https://www.boatworkstoday.com/

His youtube channel.


Also might find something useful from this guy, who is a wizard with fiberglassing.

His channel is Sail Life, and he is documenting restoration of a 40 or so foot sailboat.

https://www.youtube.com/user/madsdahlke
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: Buckhunter24 on January 24, 2020, 12:38:39 PM
Post some pics, Iím curious on how itís put together.

Iíve never done any fiberglass, but have seen it done, doesnít look that tough to do, plus youtube Iím sure had great how too videos.👍

Lokidog has a boat sitting in my barn I know he would make you a killer deal on since heís moving to WI.🤔

I thought it looked easy too, until I did it. Its pretty unpleasant to work with. It sounds like he will only be dealing with aluminum and wood, and may have the top cover riveted on rather than welded. If so I would consider trying myself. My last experience was that the wood was epoxied in and a real pain to get all of it out. The rotten parts pulled out while the parts that were solid were Stuck in and took a lot of elbow grease and beer to get out. You have to get it all out or your new piece isnt going to fit proper. The shape I was dealing with had a number of angles too which made getting the new one cut right and in a hassle.
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: rainshadow1 on January 24, 2020, 12:39:26 PM
You talking about do-it-yourselfing, or having it done?

Don't try to FIX it, I'm sure you know that. Jigsaw time. Lots of laminating and glassing to rebuild a motor mount transom. It would cost a couple hundred and a few days (with glassing/laminating skills), kinda depends on the trade off.

My experience is west side, and salt water, but OFTEN it was good money after bad... let it go. If the transom happens to somehow be the only rot in the boat, then maybe it's worth it. But (west, salt) it was rarely the only rot in the boat!

Edit: Looked it up, Aluminum laminated ply transom? I'd never fix it myself, but I'd use my do-it-yourself cost/time to judge their estimate. I'm skeptical! How much wood/glass is in that design?

From everything I can tell it's just a wood piece that sits between two pieces of aluminum. Weirdly enough Smokercraft is still using this method of building transoms. Anyway, looks like I need to take off the motor, take the top cap off, take the inner skin off, pull out the old wood, and build a new piece coated in epoxy resin and then remount everything. It is the only wood in the boat that is bad.


Has to tie into something forward too... if you get that, then I think you're golden.
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: CoryTDF on January 24, 2020, 12:44:45 PM
I got these pictures from another forum but it's the same boat. This shows the transom without the inner skin and the wood taken out. It seems pretty to-the-point but we all know how that always turns out.
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: CoryTDF on January 24, 2020, 12:48:23 PM
Been looking at products like SeaCast, Carbon-Core, and Nida-Pour. These are all a compound that you pour into the void between the inner and outer skin and they create a new composite transom. They all look to be about the same and seem to work but man is the shipping expensive. I need about 8.5 gallons of product to do what i need to do and that is about $5-600 after shipping. Not sure it's worth it.
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: rainshadow1 on January 24, 2020, 12:50:34 PM
I'm surprised how little forward connection... low center, and side walls. I'd add one on each side of the motor after I was done if it was me, but I reckon as long as you bond extremely well at all points, then it looks pretty straightforward.
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: fishngamereaper on January 24, 2020, 01:06:50 PM
Look into Coosa composite board...from what I've heard it's good stuff.
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: CP on January 24, 2020, 01:24:25 PM
New boat. 
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: CoryTDF on January 24, 2020, 02:24:00 PM
Look into Coosa composite board...from what I've heard it's good stuff.

I called about that today. cant seem to find a place to buy it?
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: Sundance on January 24, 2020, 02:26:06 PM
Look into Coosa composite board...from what I've heard it's good stuff.

I called about that today. cant seem to find a place to buy it?

Fisheries supply
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: ballpark on January 24, 2020, 03:05:02 PM

Me and my son used coosa board to replace his transom on Lund aluminum boat.   Easy to cut and install.  Toughest part was getting the old wood transom out in one piece to make a template from.  :tup:
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: buckfvr on January 24, 2020, 03:09:13 PM
For me it boils down to who will be in the boat and how often and where am I taking said boat........Big water, kids, wife, often = new (bigger) boat.

Buddies, lakes, now and then........fix.
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: CoryTDF on January 24, 2020, 03:23:33 PM

Me and my son used coosa board to replace his transom on Lund aluminum boat.   Easy to cut and install.  Toughest part was getting the old wood transom out in one piece to make a template from.  :tup:

Where did you get it? The only stuff i can find is over $500 and I just done see that penciling out.
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: KFhunter on January 24, 2020, 03:26:22 PM
At this point all you have is aluminium scrap metal in the shape of a boat, so you have nothing to loose by fixing it, and a lot to gain if you do. 

So fixing it is a no brainer, do it right, enlist help if you must. 

take the time to redo the flotation and floor, do some upgrades, re-upholster,  then run it or sell it for a bigger boat. 


Or sell for scrap, sell engine separately as near new.   
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: Boss .300 winmag on January 24, 2020, 06:28:03 PM
I'm surprised how little forward connection... low center, and side walls. I'd add one on each side of the motor after I was done if it was me, but I reckon as long as you bond extremely well at all points, then it looks pretty straightforward.

 :yeah:

Pretty straight forward, youíll have a little learning curve with fiberglass, or what ever compound you decide to use, but that doesnít like rocket science.😉

Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: Encore 280 on January 24, 2020, 08:35:23 PM
I had the same thing happen on a 16' Olympic. Took the aluminum cap off the top of the transom and started digging away. When it got too far down then I got the chain saw out and went about getting the rest of the wood out without damaging any of the glass. When I was done with that there was a good inch and a half space where the wood had been. I taped cardboard on the outside of the transom and drew an outline then cut it out. I had a sheet of 3/4" mahogany plywood so I made 2 cutouts and glassed them together and slid them between the outside and inside transoms. I did test fits first to make sure everything was going to fit. When I was done the new transom was better than when it was new.
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: j_h_nimrod on January 24, 2020, 09:24:09 PM
Should be a pretty easy fix (as I see it from my recliner  :) )

In all seriousness, this is a fairly easy fix as long as there are no major aluminum corrosion issues hiding. Iíve worked on a number of Whalers, Lundís, a few Starcrafts, and a few other miscellaneous boats over the years. I never did a full transom, but dealt with a few soft ones or ones with heavier than spec motors needing a little more beef. I would not desire to do a fiberglass boat transom, but the riveted aluminum wood transom donít take much. As mentioned above, getting the old piece out for a template is likely going to be the most difficult part. I was told Lund used the same plywood as commercial concrete form boards because of manufactured thickness requiring no additional lamination of layers and a product with hard sealed faces and very high quality layup and materials. If this were my project that is what I would look into. For additional bonding and waterproofing I would clean the aluminum very well, lightly etch it and then immediately goop the crap out of it with 5200 (marine sealant/adhesive that is pretty ubiquitous if you are unfamiliar) and then put in your new transom piece and start putting it back together. Seal the new scuppers with 5200 inside the hole n around the flanges. Seal all your seams and fasteners that go through the aluminum into the wood. I would potentially leave off the inner skin (common place to retain moisture and accelerate future rot) and manufacture a new top cap and seal the crap out of it. Make a heavy duty washer plate out of 1/4Ē aluminum to place in the inside of the new transom For the for the engines transom bolts so the force of the bolts is better transferred.

You should be as good as new  :tup:
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: CoryTDF on January 27, 2020, 09:28:55 AM
Looks like either way it goes I am going to fix this boat up. If I get a new boat i'll fix this one up and sell it. So, i guess the question has been answered. Time to start working on the old boat. 
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: Fl0und3rz on January 27, 2020, 09:34:48 AM
:tup:
Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: Special T on January 27, 2020, 05:48:29 PM
Should be a pretty easy fix (as I see it from my recliner  :) )

In all seriousness, this is a fairly easy fix as long as there are no major aluminum corrosion issues hiding. Iíve worked on a number of Whalers, Lundís, a few Starcrafts, and a few other miscellaneous boats over the years. I never did a full transom, but dealt with a few soft ones or ones with heavier than spec motors needing a little more beef. I would not desire to do a fiberglass boat transom, but the riveted aluminum wood transom donít take much. As mentioned above, getting the old piece out for a template is likely going to be the most difficult part. I was told Lund used the same plywood as commercial concrete form boards because of manufactured thickness requiring no additional lamination of layers and a product with hard sealed faces and very high quality layup and materials. If this were my project that is what I would look into. For additional bonding and waterproofing I would clean the aluminum very well, lightly etch it and then immediately goop the crap out of it with 5200 (marine sealant/adhesive that is pretty ubiquitous if you are unfamiliar) and then put in your new transom piece and start putting it back together. Seal the new scuppers with 5200 inside the hole n around the flanges. Seal all your seams and fasteners that go through the aluminum into the wood. I would potentially leave off the inner skin (common place to retain moisture and accelerate future rot) and manufacture a new top cap and seal the crap out of it. Make a heavy duty washer plate out of 1/4Ē aluminum to place in the inside of the new transom For the for the engines transom bolts so the force of the bolts is better transferred.

You should be as good as new  :tup:
This would be the route I would go.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

Title: Re: New boat or just fix the transom?
Post by: kball4 on January 28, 2020, 08:40:24 AM

Me and my son used coosa board to replace his transom on Lund aluminum boat.   Easy to cut and install.  Toughest part was getting the old wood transom out in one piece to make a template from.  :tup:

Where did you get it? The only stuff i can find is over $500 and I just done see that penciling out.
Fisheries Supply in Seattle.