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Community => Butchering, Cooking, Recipes => Topic started by: Vktully on September 05, 2020, 11:56:55 PM

Title: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Vktully on September 05, 2020, 11:56:55 PM
Hey everyone. Fairly new on here but Iím offering up some services. Iím a full time cook/butcher apprentice in Seattle. I work with whole cows every week, specializing in seam butchery. After processing I preserve and ferment various cuts of beef. Iím sure most people on here process there own meat and are very satisfied with the product. Iím offering to teach people different ways to treat specific muscles as well as making your own charcuterie. I go as far as taking trim that most people throw away as turn it into garum which is a soy sauce like product. All these things can be done at home with basic equipment. This is a free service, I just want to show hunters the potential of their meat outside of traditional techniques. My recent favorite is treating game hearts like ham. I respect whatever people choose to do with their meat but if your interested in some outside the box techniques let me know.
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: kentrek on September 06, 2020, 01:53:28 AM
This is pretty neat...have you considered a YouTube channel?
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: full choke on September 06, 2020, 07:54:14 AM
Sounds like a pretty cool stand up offer!  :tup:

Do you have any experience with waterfowl? Advanced tips for canada geese?
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: b0bbyg on September 06, 2020, 08:27:40 AM
This would make a cool video, hopefully we can get a member to take advantage of this and possibly have a write up on some techniques or a video.

I imagine there are many like me, steak cuts and burger and done  :chuckle:
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Vktully on September 06, 2020, 10:46:52 AM
Sounds like a pretty cool stand up offer!  :tup:

Do you have any experience with waterfowl? Advanced tips for canada geese?

Definitely have experience with waterfowl. I like to hang my birds in the fridge for a month after plucking. Makes the skin super crispy.
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Vktully on September 06, 2020, 10:48:57 AM
This is pretty neat...have you considered a YouTube channel?

Yeah Iíve considered it. If Iím not working Iím either fishing or hunting or doing projects so I donít have much time to compose videos and all that. I want to start my helping local hunters and then maybe branch out to YouTube. Thanks for the interest!
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: pianoman9701 on September 06, 2020, 10:56:48 AM
That's a great offer. Which restaurant were you at?
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Vktully on September 06, 2020, 11:14:27 AM
That's a great offer. Which restaurant were you at?

Iím currently at Bateau on Capitol Hill. Itís a Renee Erickson restaurant. Definitely google us or instagram to see our program. Prior to that I was at Canlis and Ursa Minor on Lopez Island.
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Stein on September 06, 2020, 12:03:26 PM
So, how would this work?  Would we bring the meat to you, chat on the phone or by e-mail or something else?  I would be very interested and hope to have antelope and deer to work with in a couple months.
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: LastLookTaxidermy on September 06, 2020, 01:20:03 PM
I am very intrigued by this. Would we come to you? It would be neat to have it taught like a class in a kitchen/butcher space. Maybe get a group of people together to watch and learn. I know a lot of folks that would be interested.
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Vktully on September 06, 2020, 02:30:13 PM
I am very intrigued by this. Would we come to you? It would be neat to have it taught like a class in a kitchen/butcher space. Maybe get a group of people together to watch and learn. I know a lot of folks that would be interested.

Thanks for the interest. Unfortunately with covid I canít have yíall come into the kitchen where I work. This would most likely be done at my home where I have a butchers block. Initially the plan was to come to you guys. I want to show people what they can accomplish within their own kitchen with their own tools. I donít want to teach people to do things with commercial equipment. This is all good feedback. Wasnít anticipating this much interest to be honest.
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Vktully on September 06, 2020, 02:31:53 PM
So, how would this work?  Would we bring the meat to you, chat on the phone or by e-mail or something else?  I would be very interested and hope to have antelope and deer to work with in a couple months.

I could definitely help you out their email or over the phone. Ideally if you had an animal that you wanted to process I would come to you and show you what you could do with that things you have in your kitchen.
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Stein on September 06, 2020, 02:38:28 PM
Great, that is super generous.  I'll certainly take you up on that if I get some animals in November.  I'm going to try to bring the antelope back as close to whole as possible but the deer will have to be boneless due to CWD.
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: cem3434 on September 06, 2020, 02:52:18 PM
Following
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Buzz2401 on September 06, 2020, 04:51:29 PM
No offense but butchering beef and butchering deer and elk are 100% different.  Not saying you are not proficient at both but I've yet to find a cattle butcher that can cut game worth a damn. I also don't feel game can be cooked the same as beef.  Butchered over 100 game animals since I got fed up with multiple local butchers.
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: HillHound on September 06, 2020, 05:04:04 PM
No offense but butchering beef and butchering deer and elk are 100% different.  Not saying you are not proficient at both but I've yet to find a cattle butcher that can cut game worth a damn. I also don't feel game can be cooked the same as beef.  Butchered over 100 game animals since I got fed up with multiple local butchers.
:yeah:
They can so grind ok
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: kentrek on September 06, 2020, 05:09:32 PM
No offense but butchering beef and butchering deer and elk are 100% different.  Not saying you are not proficient at both but I've yet to find a cattle butcher that can cut game worth a damn. I also don't feel game can be cooked the same as beef.  Butchered over 100 game animals since I got fed up with multiple local butchers.

I think you would be surprised what you could learn...100 animals is not very many
Title: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Stein on September 06, 2020, 05:17:45 PM
Many techniques for cutting, preparing and cooking or preserving from all over the world.  Many opportunities to learn.


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Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Vktully on September 06, 2020, 06:27:12 PM
No offense but butchering beef and butchering deer and elk are 100% different.  Not saying you are not proficient at both but I've yet to find a cattle butcher that can cut game worth a damn. I also don't feel game can be cooked the same as beef.  Butchered over 100 game animals since I got fed up with multiple local butchers.

Yeah I agree they are very different.  What is similar is individual muscle locations and cooking techniques that can allow somebody to get more out of their kill. Understanding why muscles cook the way they do is something that you can apply to any animal. Making products from trim and other things that go into grind or the garbage is a great feeling.  Iíve butchered all kinds of ungulates, waterfowl, and domestic animals. Iím not the end all be all of cooks and butchers Iím just offering help for guys who are interested. If your happy with your product thatís cool with me. Happy hunting
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Buzz2401 on September 06, 2020, 08:21:23 PM
Never afraid to learn. I got hunting partners who have showed me you can take the most gristly, tendon filled piece of shank and make it into a delicious meal
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: full choke on September 06, 2020, 10:12:33 PM
No offense but butchering beef and butchering deer and elk are 100% different.  Not saying you are not proficient at both but I've yet to find a cattle butcher that can cut game worth a damn. I also don't feel game can be cooked the same as beef.  Butchered over 100 game animals since I got fed up with multiple local butchers.

Yeah I agree they are very different.  What is similar is individual muscle locations and cooking techniques that can allow somebody to get more out of their kill. Understanding why muscles cook the way they do is something that you can apply to any animal. Making products from trim and other things that go into grind or the garbage is a great feeling.  Iíve butchered all kinds of ungulates, waterfowl, and domestic animals. Iím not the end all be all of cooks and butchers Iím just offering help for guys who are interested. If your happy with your product thatís cool with me. Happy hunting

Don't get discouraged by voices on the internet. I think your offer is very stand up. I hope I can take advantage of it this season.  :tup:
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: WSU on September 07, 2020, 07:26:44 AM
Iíd be really interested.  Iíve been experimenting more every year.  What are some techniques for waterfowl? Elk and deer too?
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: pianoman9701 on September 07, 2020, 09:06:59 AM
No offense but butchering beef and butchering deer and elk are 100% different.  Not saying you are not proficient at both but I've yet to find a cattle butcher that can cut game worth a damn. I also don't feel game can be cooked the same as beef.  Butchered over 100 game animals since I got fed up with multiple local butchers.

I think his offer is quite generous. This size of the cuts may be different, the fat content of the meat may be different, and the quality of the trim meat may be different, but the anatomy is the same with the cuts in the same places. :dunno: I don't know too many hunters with advanced experience in charcuterie who've applied their talents to wild game. This is a rare opportunity for most on this forum. Thanks to the OP.  :tup:
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: nwwanderer on September 07, 2020, 09:32:37 AM
Very generous and interesting, this household has a fair bit of experience and what you offer is very beneficial, thanks
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Vktully on September 07, 2020, 10:12:28 AM
Iíd be really interested.  Iíve been experimenting more every year.  What are some techniques for waterfowl? Elk and deer too?

For waterfowl I like to let them hang skin on in my fridge for a month of so, the skin becomes incredibly crisp and rich in flavor. I like making prosciutto with the breastís as well. For ungulates its more about understanding how to cook muscles from various parts of the animal. Even different muscles from the hindquarter can cook way different. Know that information I can decide to cook it like a steak, braise it, grind it, or make it into charcuterie. Brining and smoking hearts are one of my favorites as well.
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: kentrek on September 07, 2020, 11:24:02 AM
So is this something you would like to do during the butcher process? Like we shoot something and then call you up ?? We have a walk in cooler so could have a week or two time window

Also at what cost ? Your time is worth alot
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Vktully on September 07, 2020, 01:09:14 PM
So is this something you would like to do during the butcher process? Like we shoot something and then call you up ?? We have a walk in cooler so could have a week or two time window

Also at what cost ? Your time is worth alot

Yeah exactly. If you have bone in or boned out quarters etc. in the cooler I can come in and help you break down those quarters. For example if you wanted to take a portion of your top round and turn it into bressola- a type of charcuterie made from lean muscle, Iíd show you how to brine it, rub it with spices, truss it and hang it. From there we could go through the process of how to monitor the bressola, and when it will be finished. We could look at some parts of that animal that you typically grind and I could show you how to prepare that as a steak. It can be as hands on or hands off as you want. Iím looking to turn this type of service into a career in the future so basically youíd just be paying for some salt, cheese cloth, and butchers twine. Not charging for labor or anything. Having a walk in cooler allows you to do some cool stuff.
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: kentrek on September 07, 2020, 03:50:56 PM
I would love to get more quality steaks off an animal
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Cascade on September 07, 2020, 04:24:29 PM
I would absolutely love to get on this train!  I bought Hank Shawís buck, buck, moose years ago and and experiment with his recipes.  Charcuterie is an area I would like to learn from someone with more experience than I. 


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Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Vktully on September 07, 2020, 04:28:44 PM
I would absolutely love to get on this train!  I bought Hank Shawís buck, buck, moose years ago and and experiment with his recipes.  Charcuterie is an area I would like to learn from someone with more experience than I. 

Itís definitely an area that most people think is unobtainable at home. With some salt, cheese cloth, and butchers twine itís very doable. After that itís just about maintaining the right environment, people have been doing this for thousands of years without commercial equipment and modern comforts. Understanding the process behind preserving and fermentation is the key. Thanks for the interest!


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Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: huntingfool7 on September 07, 2020, 04:50:33 PM
My recent favorite is treating game hearts like ham.

Can you clarify your process for this?
Title: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Cascade on September 07, 2020, 04:51:53 PM
My recent favorite is treating game hearts like ham.

Can you clarify your process for this?
Exactly.  I have a heart in the freezer Iíve been trying to find something different to do with.


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Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Vktully on September 07, 2020, 04:58:38 PM
My recent favorite is treating game hearts like ham.

Can you clarify your process for this?

It will typically take about 3 quarts of water to submerge a heart, I weigh the water. After I have the weight of water I add 7% salt by that weight. If the water weights 100 grams I add 7 grams of salt. After dissolving the salt I add the heart and let it sit in the brine for 5 days. You want the heart to be fully submerged so weigh it down with some plates or something. I then smoke the heart for 8 hours at 200 degrees. If you want more smoke flavor go for longer at 190 less smoke go less time at 210.  Recipes will vary but thatís what works for me. If you want some extra flavor blend half a onion and a couple garlic cloves into your brine. Thanks for the interest
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: LastLookTaxidermy on September 07, 2020, 06:41:54 PM
My sister and I would love to learn from you. We are hoping to have either a deer or a bear at some point. We usually butcher our own and try to watch YouTube videos on different unique cuts, along with brining and curing. It would be great to learn from someone with knowledge, and we would be happy to pay for whatever supplies we would need.
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: kyle dillehay on September 18, 2020, 09:27:22 PM
What a generous offer!  I'm in the middle of slicing and dicing a fresh elk right now and could use some processing and cooking tips.
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: greenhead_killer on September 18, 2020, 09:34:04 PM
I better tag this
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: kellama2001 on September 19, 2020, 07:42:30 AM
This is an incredible offer! I too am very interested in learning from you, would you be willing to travel to eastern Washington? Of course I would cover fuel, and whatever other expenses are necessary.
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Vktully on September 23, 2020, 01:32:50 PM
What a generous offer!  I'm in the middle of slicing and dicing a fresh elk right now and could use some processing and cooking tips.

Feel free to message me with any questions. Spent the last two weeks in the Idaho elk woods but didnít find the bull I was looking for. Good to hear some people are getting it done!
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Vktully on September 23, 2020, 01:36:17 PM
This is an incredible offer! I too am very interested in learning from you, would you be willing to travel to eastern Washington? Of course I would cover fuel, and whatever other expenses are necessary.

My schedule is pretty tight right now as are most hunters but might have some free time before November. Iíll keep you posted. Thanks for the interest!
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: CoryTDF on September 23, 2020, 03:08:50 PM
Super cool offer!!!  Tagging along as well. I have a fresh cow elk hanging in my cooler at the moment as well!


I have a walk-in cooler at my house so I have the ability to hand meat at a controlled temp for long periods of time.

I have the following butcher supplies

1/2 HP grinder
1 HP grinder
Cabelas Mixer
20LBS Stuffing Tube
Knives, sharpeners ext

I live in Walla Walla though so pretty sure there is no chance of you checking out my kitchen LOL. So given what i shared what would you suggest?
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Woodchuck on September 23, 2020, 03:21:56 PM
My recent favorite is treating game hearts like ham.

Can you clarify your process for this?

It will typically take about 3 quarts of water to submerge a heart, I weigh the water. After I have the weight of water I add 7% salt by that weight. If the water weights 100 grams I add 7 grams of salt. After dissolving the salt I add the heart and let it sit in the brine for 5 days. You want the heart to be fully submerged so weigh it down with some plates or something. I then smoke the heart for 8 hours at 200 degrees. If you want more smoke flavor go for longer at 190 less smoke go less time at 210.  Recipes will vary but thatís what works for me. If you want some extra flavor blend half a onion and a couple garlic cloves into your brine. Thanks for the interest
Amazing offer man. I use this for when i brine something. It has multiple notches in the side that the lid can lock into and hold meat submerged without getting my but chewed for using the "good plates". Also, my brine bucket never gets confused with a garden or trash bucket any more.
https://www.amazon.com/Briner-Ultimate-Brine-Container-22/dp/B00PPRX9MO/ref=sr_1_1?crid=3PJ37EO3UBQ2E&dchild=1&keywords=briner+buckets&qid=1600899503&sprefix=BRINER%2Caps%2C219&sr=8-1
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Vktully on September 23, 2020, 06:25:11 PM
My recent favorite is treating game hearts like ham.

Can you clarify your process for this?

It will typically take about 3 quarts of water to submerge a heart, I weigh the water. After I have the weight of water I add 7% salt by that weight. If the water weights 100 grams I add 7 grams of salt. After dissolving the salt I add the heart and let it sit in the brine for 5 days. You want the heart to be fully submerged so weigh it down with some plates or something. I then smoke the heart for 8 hours at 200 degrees. If you want more smoke flavor go for longer at 190 less smoke go less time at 210.  Recipes will vary but thatís what works for me. If you want some extra flavor blend half a onion and a couple garlic cloves into your brine. Thanks for the interest
Amazing offer man. I use this for when i brine something. It has multiple notches in the side that the lid can lock into and hold meat submerged without getting my but chewed for using the "good plates". Also, my brine bucket never gets confused with a garden or trash bucket any more.
https://www.amazon.com/Briner-Ultimate-Brine-Container-22/dp/B00PPRX9MO/ref=sr_1_1?crid=3PJ37EO3UBQ2E&dchild=1&keywords=briner+buckets&qid=1600899503&sprefix=BRINER%2Caps%2C219&sr=8-1

Man thatís cool, never seen one before. Luckily my better half is also a cook so sheís used to crazy cooking *censored* all around our house.
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: kyle dillehay on September 23, 2020, 08:08:44 PM
Would you have any creative suggestions on what to do with a 5 lb. sirloin roast? Or back-strap steaks/roasts?  Charcuterie ideas?  Which cuts are best?

Thanks for your time!
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: HarboritE on September 24, 2020, 11:07:24 AM
Would you care to elaborate a little more in the heart recipe ? I want to try this with a fresh elk heart . I get the brine for 5 days and then smoke, but what then ? Do you slice it for sandwiches cold ? Slice and fry with breakfast ? Treat it just like a pork ham ? Also, for prep do you just use it whole since the brine will pull out a lot of the blood? Or do I trim it up nice first. Thank you for this information, very generous of you . Thank you
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Vktully on September 26, 2020, 12:02:22 AM
Would you have any creative suggestions on what to do with a 5 lb. sirloin roast? Or back-strap steaks/roasts?  Charcuterie ideas?  Which cuts are best?

Thanks for your time!

Back straps would make great charcuterie. Obviously this is a popular cut to sear and treat like a steak. If I found myself with a lot of blackstrap and was looking to do something different I would treat it like a coppa. Coppa is a muscle from the neck running to the sirloin so fairly similar to back straps. The main difference is going to be fat content. It make great charcuterie nonetheless. There are some really good muscles from the round that are great for curing. Feel free to pm for recipes and instruction.
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Vktully on September 26, 2020, 12:10:42 AM
Would you care to elaborate a little more in the heart recipe ? I want to try this with a fresh elk heart . I get the brine for 5 days and then smoke, but what then ? Do you slice it for sandwiches cold ? Slice and fry with breakfast ? Treat it just like a pork ham ? Also, for prep do you just use it whole since the brine will pull out a lot of the blood? Or do I trim it up nice first. Thank you for this information, very generous of you . Thank you
Iíll start with the prep side. I would leave all organ fat on the heart. If you were looking at the heart as it came out of the animal I would leave all that fat on the outside. Even with beef heart which has more fat I donít trim it at all. When you open up the heart and your looking at the inside your going to want to trim all things that look like tendon. Youíll mostly find them connecting the folds in the heart. There gonna be noticeably tougher than the rest of the muscle. I unfold the heart to trim it but keep it in one piece the whole time. Your correct the brine will wash and draw out the blood. I like to eat it cold just like prosciutto but itíd be great on a sandwich. I personally like to keep it thin but cooking is about experimenting so dicing it up and eating it with eggs would be delicious. Get creative. Iíll post some pictures to go along with this answer.
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: Vktully on September 26, 2020, 12:17:03 AM
These are beef hearts. First picture is raw after trimming. Second is after the brine,  rolling, and trussing. I basically roll the heart into itself to form a log. The cheese cloth and twine hold the shape. Last picture is post smoking, notice how the cheese cloth and twine allows it to keep its shape out of the smoker. I cook them till the internal temperature is about 150. I would say anywhere from 140-160 would be good.
Title: Re: Offering advanced butchery and meat care techniques
Post by: HarboritE on September 27, 2020, 08:17:41 AM
Thank you for taking the time to write that up and post pictures. Iíll update how my experience is after I try this.