Hunting Washington Forum

Big Game Hunting => Bear Hunting => Topic started by: pickardjw on February 23, 2021, 03:13:26 PM

Title: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: pickardjw on February 23, 2021, 03:13:26 PM
Noticed this new requirement for Spring Bear hunters for 2021 in the regs. Didn't see any other thread/discusson on it.

The unfrozen raw pelt, with evidence of sex attached, and the first premolar must be presented to an authorized department employee for inspection within 5 days of notification of kill. All permit hunters must comply with harvest reporting and submission of biological samples as described above. Failure to comply with the submission of biological samples is a misdemeanor pursuant to RCW 77.15.280.

Still new to researching and participating in reg changes. All I could find was the CES on it which states that part of the rule change was to, "Clarify language associated with spring bear check-in to gather biological
information on harvested bear.
"

Anyone with more info on why they are now requiring a check-in of the entire pelt? And, as far as I can tell, this is only for spring bear right? Looking at the 2021 proposed changes I see some bear changes listed but no real info. Is it just not out for public review/comment yet?

Seems like a major pain in the ass for backcountry hunters with no interest in keeping the pelt.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: BULLBLASTER on February 23, 2021, 03:24:01 PM
I was law starting in the 2020 season but covid made them push it off a year.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: cougforester on February 23, 2021, 03:35:23 PM
I was law starting in the 2020 season but covid made them push it off a year.
:yeah: it was discussed pretty heavily last year around this time.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: brokentrail on February 23, 2021, 04:08:41 PM
Unfortunately I think this came about because at every meeting I've attended about spring bear hunting, there are those that state most of the harvest is sows with cubs and it is cruel.  The department has little data to dispute that claim and I'll guess this is to have that data accessible but I've been wrong before.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: trophyhunt on February 23, 2021, 04:28:48 PM
Notification within 5 days notice of kill, does that mean you can wait to notify of the kill later?
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: dilleytech on February 23, 2021, 08:03:29 PM
Was there ever any clarification on how much of the hide you need to be considered a ďpeltĒ?
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: cougforester on February 23, 2021, 08:23:39 PM
Was there ever any clarification on how much of the hide you need to be considered a ďpeltĒ?
This is the crux of the issue and I don't think any clarification was reached
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Stein on February 23, 2021, 08:28:30 PM
Yeah, if the goal is to determine whether it's a boar or dry sow or sow with cubs, why can't they just come out and say that and state the minimum required for a boar and sow?  It's not like they don't have a barn full of biologists over there.  Evidence of sex is pretty easy, add a sentence for sows to include the udders and put a picture or drawing in the regs or online or send a paper copy with the tags - who knows maybe they do.

If it's for some other reason, then explain that.  As it sits, me thinks bears won't be reported because someone doesn't want to haul a heavy pack of bear hide out from a nasty spot downhill from the truck.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: hunter399 on February 23, 2021, 08:32:18 PM
I don't care , give me a tag I'll drag it out makes no difference to me .
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Ghost Hunter on February 23, 2021, 08:40:40 PM
Well, it doesn't say a portion of the pelt. :dunno:
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Stein on February 23, 2021, 09:16:02 PM
Do you have to skin out the skull and paws?   :chuckle:

They shouldn't be surprised when someone drags it home, puts it in a black contractor bag, leaves it in the sun for a day or three and drops it off.  I'm glad it isn't me doing the inspection on those.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: trophyhunt on February 24, 2021, 06:25:27 AM
Well the way I read it you don't have to report it within 5 days of kill, but within 5 days of notifying them you killed it.  Which is better, if you have a partner with you and he/she still is hunting you can store it in a cooler till the hunts done.  Still a ridiculous rule, not all hunters take a bears hide out, two spring bear tags ago I talked to a guy who killed a pig of a bear and left the hide and skull, only wanted the meat.  If I kill a bear and the hide is crap, I guess I won't be reporting that bear or cutting off the part of the hide with balls or teets.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: MooseZ25 on February 24, 2021, 06:41:18 AM
I think some of this has to do with our NE Washington grizzly units too.  I will bring them a pelt and they can keep it.  I know they wont want it but neither will I.  If I actually thought that WDFW was using this as a management tool I would be all for it.  But since it's just for spring bears, it just another way to say we as sportsman are doing something wrong.   :twocents:
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Skyvalhunter on February 24, 2021, 06:48:46 AM
From listening to the spring bear commission meetings its all tied to the number of sows taken and those that might have cubs.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: dilleytech on February 24, 2021, 08:32:37 AM
Well the way I read it you don't have to report it within 5 days of kill, but within 5 days of notifying them you killed it.  Which is better, if you have a partner with you and he/she still is hunting you can store it in a cooler till the hunts done.  Still a ridiculous rule, not all hunters take a bears hide out, two spring bear tags ago I talked to a guy who killed a pig of a bear and left the hide and skull, only wanted the meat.  If I kill a bear and the hide is crap, I guess I won't be reporting that bear or cutting off the part of the hide with balls or teets.

Agreed. If itís a nice hide then they will get there info.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: h20hunter on February 24, 2021, 08:53:45 AM
So.......because of the hide requirements you both  (?) are saying you won't report the kill as required? :dunno:
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: KFhunter on February 24, 2021, 08:55:06 AM
They need to clarify, because all I intend to bring em is a nut sack.

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Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: h20hunter on February 24, 2021, 09:01:13 AM
Coin Purse and a swizzle stick!
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Fl0und3rz on February 24, 2021, 09:18:16 AM
:chuckle:
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: pickardjw on February 24, 2021, 09:27:33 AM
If it gives the wdfw ammo against the anti's I guess I'm okay with it. Just wish there was clarification on how much is required to be submitted. I'll be bringing a pelt with no paws or head for sure.

Good point regarding the NE brown bear overlap units too.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: trophyhunt on February 24, 2021, 10:08:06 AM
So.......because of the hide requirements you both  (?) are saying you won't report the kill as required? :dunno:
I'll have to make up my mind at the time I guess, I did say I might just bring out a piece with evidence of sex though. 
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Fl0und3rz on February 24, 2021, 10:10:43 AM
Misdemeanor if you do it wrong without adequate guidance?  I cannot fault a guy for having reservations.

:twocents:

If WDFW is concerned about it, they should provide as clear guidance as possible.  It's not rocket science.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: brokentrail on February 24, 2021, 10:43:34 AM
IMO, the way I read it is pelt = skin, not a portion thereof, with evidence of sex attached.  I, myself, don't need any further clarification.
 I will bring out the pelt, defined as the way I interpreted it, as it is the law, regardless if I agree with it or not.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Special T on February 24, 2021, 10:50:58 AM
Perhaps they are stalling because spring bear is under litigation.

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Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: hunter399 on February 24, 2021, 10:52:50 AM
Just give me the tag - no problem dragging it.
Problem solved. :chuckle: :tung: :chuckle:
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Fl0und3rz on February 24, 2021, 10:56:47 AM
IMO, the way I read it is pelt = skin, not a portion thereof, with evidence of sex attached.  I, myself, don't need any further clarification.
 I will bring out the pelt, defined as the way I interpreted it, as it is the law, regardless if I agree with it or not.

Thanks for proving the point.  It is not up to your interpretation.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: millerwheeler on February 24, 2021, 11:43:41 AM
IMO, the way I read it is pelt = skin, not a portion thereof, with evidence of sex attached.  I, myself, don't need any further clarification.
 I will bring out the pelt, defined as the way I interpreted it, as it is the law, regardless if I agree with it or not.

Thanks for proving the point.  It is not up to your interpretation.
:yeah: :yeah:

Canít imagine why  the pics of hide with the piece of hide attached would
Need to be whole , and the tooth part is easy just odd and I do hope they clarify it
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: brokentrail on February 24, 2021, 12:06:28 PM
IMO, the way I read it is pelt = skin, not a portion thereof, with evidence of sex attached.  I, myself, don't need any further clarification.
 I will bring out the pelt, defined as the way I interpreted it, as it is the law, regardless if I agree with it or not.

Thanks for proving the point.  It is not up to your interpretation.

Actually, unless/until it is clarified and exact, it currently is up to my interpretation, just like yours is up to your interpretation.  I'll do what I think the law is telling me to do, you can do the same... I won't complain about it not being clarified/exact, or how I won't comply,  and others can feel free to do so.  I could care less tbh.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Stein on February 24, 2021, 12:18:30 PM
IMO, the way I read it is pelt = skin, not a portion thereof, with evidence of sex attached.  I, myself, don't need any further clarification.
 I will bring out the pelt, defined as the way I interpreted it, as it is the law, regardless if I agree with it or not.

Thanks for proving the point.  It is not up to your interpretation.

So, hunters need to bring in the entire pelt including the head and paws?
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Fl0und3rz on February 24, 2021, 12:22:33 PM
IMO, the way I read it is pelt = skin, not a portion thereof, with evidence of sex attached.  I, myself, don't need any further clarification.
 I will bring out the pelt, defined as the way I interpreted it, as it is the law, regardless if I agree with it or not.

Thanks for proving the point.  It is not up to your interpretation.

Actually, unless/until it is clarified and exact, it currently is up to my interpretation, just like yours is up to your interpretation.  I'll do what I think the law is telling me to do, you can do the same... I won't complain about it not being clarified/exact, or how I won't comply,  and others can feel free to do so.  I could care less tbh.

And you proved the point, again.

:tup:
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: KFhunter on February 24, 2021, 02:48:32 PM
IMO, the way I read it is pelt = skin, not a portion thereof, with evidence of sex attached.  I, myself, don't need any further clarification.
 I will bring out the pelt, defined as the way I interpreted it, as it is the law, regardless if I agree with it or not.

Thanks for proving the point.  It is not up to your interpretation.

So, hunters need to bring in the entire pelt including the head and paws?
Preferably in a black garbage sack apparently, since I read it on hw

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Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: boneaddict on February 24, 2021, 03:04:22 PM
Frustrating
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Chesapeake on March 07, 2021, 09:17:10 PM
Had to do this in SE Alaska for as long as I can recall. Not an issue. Although the Alaska sealing requirements say the claws and proof of sex must remain naturally attached until sealed. They take a premolar for aging.

Iím happy to help them collect data.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: dilleytech on March 08, 2021, 07:36:53 AM
Had to do this in SE Alaska for as long as I can recall. Not an issue. Although the Alaska sealing requirements say the claws and proof of sex must remain naturally attached until sealed. They take a premolar for aging.

Iím happy to help them collect data.

So in Alaska a strip 3Ē wide from proof of sex to a claw would work?
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Ghost Hunter on March 08, 2021, 07:45:27 AM
Had to do this in SE Alaska for as long as I can recall. Not an issue. Although the Alaska sealing requirements say the claws and proof of sex must remain naturally attached until sealed. They take a premolar for aging.

Iím happy to help them collect data.

So in Alaska a strip 3Ē wide from proof of sex to a claw would work?

Take bail money with you.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: HillHound on March 08, 2021, 07:54:20 AM
I think Everyone is overthinking this since no one even has a tag yet. If I draw I will contact the game warden that is local to the unit I will be hunting and check with them Seems best to go with the interpretation of the person enforcing the rule .
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: dilleytech on March 08, 2021, 09:11:42 AM
I think Everyone is overthinking this since no one even has a tag yet. If I draw I will contact the game warden that is local to the unit I will be hunting and check with them Seems best to go with the interpretation of the person enforcing the rule .

This will be great. Iím surprised no one has asked the question to someone who is paid to know the law.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: hunter399 on March 08, 2021, 09:25:38 AM
I think Everyone is overthinking this since no one even has a tag yet. If I draw I will contact the game warden that is local to the unit I will be hunting and check with them Seems best to go with the interpretation of the person enforcing the rule .

This will be great. Iím surprised no one has asked the question to someone who is paid to know the law.
They are paid to enforce the law with evidence to the prosecuter.
But I agree the best advise is gonna come from a warden in this regards to the interpretation of the law.

The only reason I say it this way is cause it is very easy to be on the wrong side of the law.Depending on who's enforcing it.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Chesapeake on March 08, 2021, 09:28:39 PM
Had to do this in SE Alaska for as long as I can recall. Not an issue. Although the Alaska sealing requirements say the claws and proof of sex must remain naturally attached until sealed. They take a premolar for aging.

Iím happy to help them collect data.

So in Alaska a strip 3Ē wide from proof of sex to a claw would work?

Per their definition;

 skin, hide, or pelt of a bear means the entire external covering with claws attached.

So no, a 3Ē strip of hide wonít cut it.

Why is everyone so against bringing a bear hide to a fish and game office?
Idaho requires the same for wolves and I donít recall anyone complaining about it.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: HillHound on March 08, 2021, 11:47:12 PM
I think most of these comments must be coming from back country hunters shooting small meat bears that just donít wanna deal with the extra weight. I take all my hides big or small and at least get them tanned. Iím sure there might be a few taxidermist out there that might give you some credit towards other work for a good hide too
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: trophyhunt on March 09, 2021, 06:30:19 AM
Had to do this in SE Alaska for as long as I can recall. Not an issue. Although the Alaska sealing requirements say the claws and proof of sex must remain naturally attached until sealed. They take a premolar for aging.

Iím happy to help them collect data.

So in Alaska a strip 3Ē wide from proof of sex to a claw would work?

Per their definition;

 skin, hide, or pelt of a bear means the entire external covering with claws attached.

So no, a 3Ē strip of hide wonít cut it.

Why is everyone so against bringing a bear hide to a fish and game office?
Idaho requires the same for wolves and I donít recall anyone complaining about it.
Hillhound touched on it.  Cesapeake, have you hunted for bear miles off the road, on your back without stock?  Not being a dick, serious question, you may be hard core, I have no idea.  Last season I hiked in only 2 miles, they opened the spring season till the end of June because of the late start.  Because of the later season I almost expected to find a rubbed out bear, liking the meat, I was prepared to leave my first hide in the woods.  It actually was a nice Idea for a change, a lot less weight!!  The blues are steep as hell and the top and bottoms are a long way.  Well, my bear ended up with a really nice coat, and he was BIG!  So, I packed out the hide either way, really almost killed me. At 51 and many, many pack out trips in my past, I thought I was having a heart attack with this one.  Now to the point, If the rug was crap, all rubbed out, why should I have to pack it out?  There are a percentage of hunters out there that don't care about the hide, it's a lot of extra work and now they are forcing that on spring hunters.  Not sure why a patch of hide with evidence of sex isn't good enough? That is what they are after anyway.  I personally hate the new rule and will probably just not report the bear kill, (which I hate doing) or I'll just leave the hide and have the meat processed.  And you can't compare a wolf hide to a bear hide, not sure if anyone packs out the meat of a wolf and eats it, much more to deal with when you kill a bear.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Special T on March 09, 2021, 06:41:15 AM
I think Everyone is overthinking this since no one even has a tag yet. If I draw I will contact the game warden that is local to the unit I will be hunting and check with them Seems best to go with the interpretation of the person enforcing the rule .

This will be great. Iím surprised no one has asked the question to someone who is paid to know the law.
What makes you think the question hasnt been asked? Just not answered?

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Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Chesapeake on March 09, 2021, 08:56:04 AM
Trophy,

Iím in my 40ís, not self described as hard core.... Yes Iíve hunted the Blues as well as other steep places and passed bears due to the terrain. Donít use stock.
I understand the hide would be another 30-40# load to take out. 

In the context of having good data to support the continuation of good management I feel itís probably worth it.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: trophyhunt on March 09, 2021, 09:16:52 AM
I support the good data for management idea, I just donít think forcing people to pack something out they may not want to will get it done. Iím just saying why not a small part of the hide, the important part for sex ID and milk production.  Iíd like to hear from Wdfw on specifics, it should be addressed. 
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: KFhunter on March 09, 2021, 10:17:14 AM
Unless I hear a definitive answer, they're getting a nutsack in a baggie and a tooth.

Unless I want the hide, or can roll it downhill into a truck.




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Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: hunter399 on March 09, 2021, 10:22:11 AM
Unless I hear a definitive answer, they're getting a nutsack in a baggie and a tooth.

Unless I want the hide, or can roll it downhill into a truck.




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I hate see what you say your giving them if you shoot a female.
How many tits do you cut off.
Never mind I might not want to know.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: KFhunter on March 09, 2021, 10:40:46 AM
They'll get a "patch" that will be unmistakable


Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: hunter399 on March 09, 2021, 11:03:23 AM
That's what I'm calling that area now .
The patch.......
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: hunter399 on March 09, 2021, 11:09:45 AM
Back on topic now.
Who is.........
Dragging it out
Slice and dice
Doing nothing cause they don't report

Is there another option or did I miss something?
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: dilleytech on March 09, 2021, 11:21:24 AM
Had to do this in SE Alaska for as long as I can recall. Not an issue. Although the Alaska sealing requirements say the claws and proof of sex must remain naturally attached until sealed. They take a premolar for aging.

Iím happy to help them collect data.

So in Alaska a strip 3Ē wide from proof of sex to a claw would work?

Per their definition;

 skin, hide, or pelt of a bear means the entire external covering with claws attached.

So no, a 3Ē strip of hide wonít cut it.

Why is everyone so against bringing a bear hide to a fish and game office?
Idaho requires the same for wolves and I donít recall anyone complaining about it.

I donít keep most of my bear hides. Iím certainly not packing a hide out of the back country thatís going to end up in the dumpster if itís not some fantastic hide worth tanning. I just want it to be simply proof of sex. So theres less people breaking the laws and more honest reporting. What possible reason could there be for the need of a whole pelt? Claws attached? Why? Proof of sex has some logic to it. A full pelt requirement seems like an attempt to have less bears killed. Or at least reported.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: dilleytech on March 09, 2021, 11:24:55 AM
I think Everyone is overthinking this since no one even has a tag yet. If I draw I will contact the game warden that is local to the unit I will be hunting and check with them Seems best to go with the interpretation of the person enforcing the rule .

This will be great. Iím surprised no one has asked the question to someone who is paid to know the law.
What makes you think the question hasnt been asked? Just not answered?

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Because I think someone would gladly post the response to this question to clarify on this site. Is there not any officials that are on hunt Washington that could chime in?
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: DOUBLELUNG on March 09, 2021, 11:25:41 AM
We got here because compliance with mandatory reporting and tooth submission was too low to produce estimates with necessary precision to defend spring bear management.  I wrote in opposition to mandatory pelt submission and suggested enforcing the existing laws on reporting and tooth submission instead to increase compliance - crickets.  So now we get to pack out unwanted hides.  I will do so, reluctantly, and cussing as much as I can while my fat, sweating, diabetic, diseased heart azz packs an unwanted hide out (yes, I'm planning for success :)).  Expect this to be a fall general season requirement soon.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: dilleytech on March 09, 2021, 11:30:01 AM
We got here because compliance with mandatory reporting and tooth submission was too low to produce estimates with necessary precision to defend spring bear management.  I wrote in opposition to mandatory pelt submission and suggested enforcing the existing laws on reporting and tooth submission instead to increase compliance - crickets.  So now we get to pack out unwanted hides.  I will do so, reluctantly, and cussing as much as I can while my fat, sweating, diabetic, diseased heart azz packs an unwanted hide out (yes, I'm planning for success :)).  Expect this to be a fall general season requirement soon.

And even more fall bears wonít be reported as well if that happens.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: KFhunter on March 09, 2021, 12:15:19 PM
Yup - less reporting will occur.



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Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: ghosthunter on March 09, 2021, 12:20:38 PM
If you draw Spring Bear in Skagit, there will be a meeting of some sort. And what to do with the hide requirement would be a good question than. Since several offical types attend those meetings.
How covid effects that ummmm not sure.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Stein on March 09, 2021, 12:22:19 PM
When I drew, the local bio was at that meeting with maps and stuff, but not the warden.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Special T on March 09, 2021, 01:47:25 PM
We got here because compliance with mandatory reporting and tooth submission was too low to produce estimates with necessary precision to defend spring bear management.  I wrote in opposition to mandatory pelt submission and suggested enforcing the existing laws on reporting and tooth submission instead to increase compliance - crickets.  So now we get to pack out unwanted hides.  I will do so, reluctantly, and cussing as much as I can while my fat, sweating, diabetic, diseased heart azz packs an unwanted hide out (yes, I'm planning for success :)).  Expect this to be a fall general season requirement soon.

I hate to disagree or correct you so perhaps my statement can just be a clarification. Statistically the tooth sample size is big enough. Yes they didn't get the 30% they prefer, they got 28... and in a known sample size that is much better information that most businesses get to make decisions.

I personally want bios to have plenty of information to make educated management suggestions. Unfortunately I belive increased requirements are all about reducing the pursuit and harvest.

Dillytech, I know for a fact the question has been asked... but no response from the department.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: KFhunter on March 09, 2021, 02:35:20 PM
Plus, I don't think decisions are made by sample statistics, but by political whimsy.

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Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: downtownbrown0610 on March 19, 2021, 03:39:20 PM
So earlier this week I received my special hunt paperwork in the mail for this years spring bear. It has a welcome letter stating the " If you kill a bear during the special hunt, you must provide a premolar tooth to any WDFW wildlife regional office within 24 HOURS of harvesting a bear" 24hr?? That seemed a little unreasonable to me.

This is the 3rd time I have seen a different time/different harvest submission requirements associated with submitting for Spring Bear and each was from the WDFW. I have seen 5 days, 72 hours and now the letter says 24hrs. I decided to give them a call to clarify some of the harvest reporting requirements because it is getting in my opinion a little out of control. I am always looking to do the right thing, but if I don't even know what right is, it makes that pretty tough. I left a Voicemail and someone called me from the dept about an hour later. Take it as you will but this is from the WDFW's mouth and what I will abide by if I harvest a spring bear.

He said that he did not know why the letter would state 24hr because that would be impossible to track. It was a mistake and the are working on correcting the mistake. He said as long as you can send the tooth into a regional office at your first opportunity, you will be fine.
I then asked a question in regards to pelt submission. He stated that the ENTIRE pelt is to be taken during harvest (evidence of sex still attached) and that you have 5 days from harvest to set that appointment up. The pelt should be unfrozen for purposes of inspection and sealing. He said cooling of the pelt is fine just not to completely freeze it. He said that spring bear harvest requirements are going to be basically the same as cougar harvest requirements ( I am not up to date to cougar requirements but I am assuming that they are similar to what is now being asked).

As stated, whether I agree or disagree with the requirements I had to clarify what is actually being asked of me if I do actually harvest a bear. Again take it as is, and I hope everyone has a good spring season. Hope this clears some stuff for everyone. Take care.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Jingles on March 19, 2021, 03:44:01 PM
If the hide is not worth tanning and ANYONE or AGENCY wants they are more than welcome to hike into kill site and pack it out otherwise the carrion eaters get it.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: vandeman17 on March 19, 2021, 04:00:22 PM
Glad I caught this thread since I drew my first spring bear tag this year and have never killed a bear. Regardless of the hide, I was going to be packing mine out since I just don't know any better. I see both sides to the argument since it would be like requiring me to pack out every deer/elk hide which I only do if I plan to have taxidermy work done.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: dilleytech on March 19, 2021, 04:35:44 PM
I didnít know you had to bring in the entire cougar hide. So if you skinned a cougar and skinned around the wrists leaving the paws in the field you would go to jail or something? I highly doubt it. When I brought in a cougar they only took pieces of the teeth because they broke trying to get them out. How does this change taxidermist requirements? Will spring bear pelts need sealed but fall donít?
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Ghost Hunter on March 19, 2021, 04:56:21 PM
The 2020 requirements for bringing the pelt in for sealing were known when applying for spring bear, and waived due to Covid.  Once again 2021 rules were posted before applying this year, so why apply if you don't plan on following the rules?  I don't follow the logic.  Filter out the advertisements and the GMU descriptions you don't hunt, the regulation book doesn't take that long to read.   :twocents:
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: downtownbrown0610 on March 19, 2021, 05:28:45 PM
While I am sure you would not go to jail, I am not sure what the actual punishment would be. More than likely I would think a ticket would be more reasonable. He did not state when I talked to him in the phone. What people end up deciding to do is thier own decision, I am just stating what WDFW said when I talked to them on the phone. As others has stated this is not new, it was just pushed back due to COVID last year.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: dilleytech on March 20, 2021, 07:38:25 AM
The 2020 requirements for bringing the pelt in for sealing were known when applying for spring bear, and waived due to Covid.  Once again 2021 rules were posted before applying this year, so why apply if you don't plan on following the rules?  I don't follow the logic.  Filter out the advertisements and the GMU descriptions you don't hunt, the regulation book doesn't take that long to read.   :twocents:

I donít think many people who put in for spring bear are caught off guard by this. Itís just crazy to require you to carry out a non edible portion of an animal and not even clarify how much of the pelt they need. This will result in less reporting. Just like if you had to pack out an entire elk pelt on any elk kill. There would just be less people fallowing the laws and not reporting elk kills. Iím not supporting breaking of the new law but it is a reality.
 It becomes to easy to not fallow this law once your bear hide is home, you want to get it in the freezer and you canít get ahold of a Bioligist.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: KFhunter on March 20, 2021, 08:17:50 AM
Whole pelt in a black garbage sack after 5 days sitting in the sun is legal

But frozen partial pelt w sex attached in a zip lock is not

Amazing



Thank you for relaying the message
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Torrent50 on March 20, 2021, 08:44:13 AM
So WDFW has a rule with spring bear permits that you have to bring the entire pelt in and some folks are going to ignore that rule and just do what they want because they don't agree with it.  I wonder if those same people are going to hunt anywhere they want instead of just the unit they were drawn for because they don't agree with the boundary?  Or maybe someone doesn't agree with the number of permits for a particular area and the fact they didn't draw.  Just going to go out and hunt anyway?  Season ends on June 15th and don't agree.  Hunt until July?  Makes me wonder how some people determine where that line they won't cross is located...........or is it constantly shifting? 

Personally, I'll hunt only where and when I have a tag/permit, during legal hours, following the published rules.  If I'm lucky enough to get a bear, I'll haul the whole damn pelt out and jump thru the hoops.  Might it suck?  Yup.  But it's all part of the deal.  Reminds me of a conversation Rinella had on one of his shows about high-grade vs low-grade fun.  Low-grade is like riding a roller coaster.  Fun at the time, but nobody remembers it 10 years later.  High-grade is the stuff that seems to suck at the time, but 10 years later you look back and say, "damn that was pretty fun."  Guess I will just hope for some high-grade fun.

Ps.  If someone is having trouble packing everything out and needs some help, if I'm in the area and can help I will gladly put in some work to help a fellow hunter stay within the rules.   Bottom line is that if we all start doing whatever we want pretty soon opportunities will start to disappear for all of us.    :twocents:
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Ridgeratt on March 20, 2021, 08:52:43 AM
Excellent response torrent. 👏

Do you have a spring bear tag in your boot? If so what area?

Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Torrent50 on March 20, 2021, 08:57:04 AM
I was lucky enough to draw Kelly Hill.  Hoping for some great time out there seeing what i can turn up.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: dilleytech on March 20, 2021, 09:02:00 AM
So WDFW has a rule with spring bear permits that you have to bring the entire pelt in and some folks are going to ignore that rule and just do what they want because they don't agree with it.  I wonder if those same people are going to hunt anywhere they want instead of just the unit they were drawn for because they don't agree with the boundary?  Or maybe someone doesn't agree with the number of permits for a particular area and the fact they didn't draw.  Just going to go out and hunt anyway?  Season ends on June 15th and don't agree.  Hunt until July?  Makes me wonder how some people determine where that line they won't cross is located...........or is it constantly shifting? 

Personally, I'll hunt only where and when I have a tag/permit, during legal hours, following the published rules.  If I'm lucky enough to get a bear, I'll haul the whole damn pelt out and jump thru the hoops.  Might it suck?  Yup.  But it's all part of the deal.  Reminds me of a conversation Rinella had on one of his shows about high-grade vs low-grade fun.  Low-grade is like riding a roller coaster.  Fun at the time, but nobody remembers it 10 years later.  High-grade is the stuff that seems to suck at the time, but 10 years later you look back and say, "damn that was pretty fun."  Guess I will just hope for some high-grade fun.

Ps.  If someone is having trouble packing everything out and needs some help, if I'm in the area and can help I will gladly put in some work to help a fellow hunter stay within the rules.   Bottom line is that if we all start doing whatever we want pretty soon opportunities will start to disappear for all of us.    :twocents:

No. People are going to follow all the laws until they are home. When it at that point is far to easy to break the law by not reporting there bear kill. Thatís the problem. Maybe they removed the paws but then learn itís the ďentire peltĒ so they panic and just donít report. Make the requirement simple. Proof of sex, maybe nipples of sows or whatever they need and tooth. No problem. There motive seems to be less people reporting.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Rob on March 20, 2021, 09:05:13 AM
I was lucky enough to draw Kelly Hill.  Hoping for some great time out there seeing what i can turn up.

Totally agree with what you posted.

A buddy of mine and I drew Kelly Hill as well.  Hope to see you out there!
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: KFhunter on March 20, 2021, 09:28:01 AM
I agree with torret50 as well.

Sweating about violating some rule or law is not fun for me, so I do it right and my fun is higher grade.


But I'm not exactly 'pie in the sky' about my fellow hunters, so I'll advocate for common since rules and regulations that encourages participation and are easy to follow.

There is a massive lack of trust and lots of resentment towards WDFW, rules like bringing a whole freaking pelt is stupid when a patch with proof of sex should be adequate, and that tooth of course.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: vandeman17 on March 20, 2021, 09:31:57 AM
I agree with torret50 as well.

Sweating about violating some rule or law is not fun for me, so I do it right and my fun is higher grade.


But I'm not exactly 'pie in the sky' about my fellow hunters, so I'll advocate for common since rules and regulations that encourages participation and are easy to follow.

There is a massive lack of trust and lots of resentment towards WDFW, rules like bringing a whole freaking pelt is stupid when a patch with proof of sex should be adequate, and that tooth of course.

I think an open and honest explanation as to why they are asking for the entire pelt would help quell at least some of the back and forth we see going on here.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: trophyhunt on March 20, 2021, 09:38:21 AM
I agree with torret50 as well.

Sweating about violating some rule or law is not fun for me, so I do it right and my fun is higher grade.


But I'm not exactly 'pie in the sky' about my fellow hunters, so I'll advocate for common since rules and regulations that encourages participation and are easy to follow.

There is a massive lack of trust and lots of resentment towards WDFW, rules like bringing a whole freaking pelt is stupid when a patch with proof of sex should be adequate, and that tooth of course.

I think an open and honest explanation as to why they are asking for the entire pelt would help quell at least some of the back and forth we see going on here.
I agree, but Iíd bet they donít have one. I bet they didnít even think of the option to just see a patch w evidence of sex.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: hunter399 on March 20, 2021, 09:38:37 AM
THE PATCH
😄 😄 😄
HAHAHAHA

I'm not forgetting the patch anytime soon!
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: dilleytech on March 20, 2021, 10:05:04 AM
I agree with torret50 as well.

Sweating about violating some rule or law is not fun for me, so I do it right and my fun is higher grade.


But I'm not exactly 'pie in the sky' about my fellow hunters, so I'll advocate for common since rules and regulations that encourages participation and are easy to follow.

There is a massive lack of trust and lots of resentment towards WDFW, rules like bringing a whole freaking pelt is stupid when a patch with proof of sex should be adequate, and that tooth of course.

I think an open and honest explanation as to why they are asking for the entire pelt would help quell at least some of the back and forth we see going on here.

That would be great. Itís like some anti hunter  just picked what sounded like the hardest possible way to report a kill. Which Iím assuming was the case with WDFG..
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: dilleytech on March 23, 2021, 09:14:19 AM
My spring bear tag envelope says we  are required to submit ďthe raw pelt with evidence of sex and premolar toothĒ still sounds like partial pelt or whatever amount you choose is fine. Anyone hear anything else?
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: downtownbrown0610 on March 23, 2021, 09:31:46 AM
My spring bear tag envelope says we  are required to submit ďthe raw pelt with evidence of sex and premolar toothĒ still sounds like partial pelt or whatever amount you choose is fine. Anyone hear anything else?

 So I called WDFW last week because I had a few questions. Mostly regarding to the part on the front page of the letter that says 24HRS after harvest the premolar must be submitted. I also asked about the pelt as well.

According to the Specialist I talked to on the phone the entire pelt with evidence of sex is to be taken. If you look a few pages back I put a more in depth reply to this exact question in this post.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: cougforester on March 23, 2021, 09:45:39 AM
This is part of my conversation with the NE bio. Pretty clear in my eyes. (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210323/2301ad3d635badd7df70cdf93849a0ce.jpg)

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Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: hunter399 on March 23, 2021, 10:18:41 AM
This is part of my conversation with the NE bio. Pretty clear in my eyes. (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210323/2301ad3d635badd7df70cdf93849a0ce.jpg)

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You guys better listen to her.
I've emailed her in the past .She's is pretty great about answering questions. We haven't always see eye to eye on everything that's for sure. But if you have a question ,she will answer to the best of her ability.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: birddogdad on March 23, 2021, 10:25:26 AM
almost sounds like a new business model, pin on onx, hide retrieval services for spring bear kills....
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Ghost Hunter on March 23, 2021, 10:26:50 AM
 :rolleyes: :beatdeadhorse:
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: dilleytech on March 23, 2021, 10:38:29 AM
My spring bear tag envelope says we  are required to submit ďthe raw pelt with evidence of sex and premolar toothĒ still sounds like partial pelt or whatever amount you choose is fine. Anyone hear anything else?

 So I called WDFW last week because I had a few questions. Mostly regarding to the part on the front page of the letter that says 24HRS after harvest the premolar must be submitted. I also asked about the pelt as well.

According to the Specialist I talked to on the phone the entire pelt with evidence of sex is to be taken. If you look a few pages back I put a more in depth reply to this exact question in this post.

Ya I read your comments. I was wondering if any one has talked to a bio. Like the person who will actually be inspecting the hide. Of course WDFW will give the safe answer of every square inch. They wouldnít want to be held liable.

We can report to any bio in any region correct?
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: DOUBLELUNG on March 23, 2021, 10:43:19 AM
So WDFW has a rule with spring bear permits that you have to bring the entire pelt in and some folks are going to ignore that rule and just do what they want because they don't agree with it.  I wonder if those same people are going to hunt anywhere they want instead of just the unit they were drawn for because they don't agree with the boundary?  Or maybe someone doesn't agree with the number of permits for a particular area and the fact they didn't draw.  Just going to go out and hunt anyway?  Season ends on June 15th and don't agree.  Hunt until July?  Makes me wonder how some people determine where that line they won't cross is located...........or is it constantly shifting? 

Personally, I'll hunt only where and when I have a tag/permit, during legal hours, following the published rules.  If I'm lucky enough to get a bear, I'll haul the whole damn pelt out and jump thru the hoops.  Might it suck?  Yup.  But it's all part of the deal.  Reminds me of a conversation Rinella had on one of his shows about high-grade vs low-grade fun.  Low-grade is like riding a roller coaster.  Fun at the time, but nobody remembers it 10 years later.  High-grade is the stuff that seems to suck at the time, but 10 years later you look back and say, "damn that was pretty fun."  Guess I will just hope for some high-grade fun.

Ps.  If someone is having trouble packing everything out and needs some help, if I'm in the area and can help I will gladly put in some work to help a fellow hunter stay within the rules.   Bottom line is that if we all start doing whatever we want pretty soon opportunities will start to disappear for all of us.    :twocents:
Congrats on drawing Kelly Hill.  It was my first choice.

I agree with everything you wrote.  I was opposed to the pelt requirement, and submitted comments during rulemaking that recommended successful hunters only be required to present evidence of sex, and with sows the teats naturally attached to hide so lactation status could be determined.  It didn't go my way.

When I applied this year, it was with the knowledge that if successful I would be required to present the entire pelt.  I don't plan to get another bear rugged, I want the spring permit for the experience and the meat.  If successful, I would have made the effort required to pack out the hide as well as the skull and meat.  My choices of where to hunt are already constrained by my health issues and preference for solo hunting, and packing out the entire hide is not my preference - but I'll do it.  I don't always agree with WDFW, but I'll follow the rules because I'm a hunter and not a poacher.  As a hunter, I don't have the liberty to decide which rules I'll follow, to the absolute best of my ability I follow all of them. 
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: dilleytech on March 23, 2021, 11:21:24 AM
When we call the hotline number to report our dead bear will there be a appointment for a date and location made at that point, in the region we live to submit the ďpeltĒ the same as cougar?
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Rob on March 23, 2021, 12:15:37 PM
I don't always agree with WDFW, but I'll follow the rules because I'm a hunter and not a poacher. 

great quote!
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: dilleytech on March 23, 2021, 12:25:38 PM
I don't always agree with WDFW, but I'll follow the rules because I'm a hunter and not a poacher. 

great quote!

I agree. Now only if they could make the rules clear.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Rob on March 23, 2021, 12:39:19 PM
that's crazy talk..
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: HillHound on March 23, 2021, 06:31:09 PM
Yeah they make it super easy to figure out. On my actual bear permit it says I must provide a tooth to a regional office within 24 hours of harvesting a bear. Then the letter they sent me with the permit says I have 72 hours to notify them and five days to get it to them to have the tooth extracted and Hide inspected. So..... guess I will do my best to hit the 24 hour mark to be safe? Probably not realistic Though if I shoot one late far from the truck and turns into a pack the next day. Then trying to coordinate with someone who can check it after hours and possibly on a weekend.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: trophyhunt on March 23, 2021, 06:57:42 PM
Yeah they make it super easy to figure out. On my actual bear permit it says I must provide a tooth to a regional office within 24 hours of harvesting a bear. Then the letter they sent me with the permit says I have 72 hours to notify them and five days to get it to them to have the tooth extracted and Hide inspected. So..... guess I will do my best to hit the 24 hour mark to be safe? Probably not realistic Though if I shoot one late far from the truck and turns into a pack the next day. Then trying to coordinate with someone who can check it after hours and possibly on a weekend.
exactly, what a F n joke.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: slim9300 on March 24, 2021, 11:04:44 PM
Idaho has an identical requirement in their regs and they do not require the entire pelt for inspection. Only proof of sex being attached. I would argue that there is nothing they can do to you if you present the pelt with the proof of sex attached until they amend the regs to state the Ďcomplete pelt/hide.í This was discussed last year also.

New in 2020 The raw pelt with evidence of sex
 https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink/topic?share_fid=9945&share_tid=247737&url=https%3A%2F%2Fhunting-washington%2Ecom%2Fsmf%2Findex%2Ephp%3Ftopic%3D247737&share_type=t&link_source=app


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Title: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: slim9300 on March 24, 2021, 11:13:15 PM
Had to do this in SE Alaska for as long as I can recall. Not an issue. Although the Alaska sealing requirements say the claws and proof of sex must remain naturally attached until sealed. They take a premolar for aging.

Iím happy to help them collect data.

So in Alaska a strip 3Ē wide from proof of sex to a claw would work?

Per their definition;

 skin, hide, or pelt of a bear means the entire external covering with claws attached.

So no, a 3Ē strip of hide wonít cut it.

Why is everyone so against bringing a bear hide to a fish and game office?
Idaho requires the same for wolves and I donít recall anyone complaining about it.
Per what definition? Letís see a link.

In Idaho you only have to take a small portion of the hide with the proof of sex attached for both a bear and wolf. And here are their regs.

Iím against packing a 40-60# hide with skull and paws attached 5-10 miles out on my back when I have killed enough bears, and only want the meat and skull. There is zero chance WDFW would win this case based on their own wording if you showed up with a Ďpatch.í

I will keep hunting Idaho in the spring anyways since I will never draw again. This state is a joke.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210325/b31247a5a305cd71c0eea39752917f7d.png)


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Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: hunter399 on March 25, 2021, 05:45:36 AM
I will comply spring pelt requirements.
If drawn or harvest..........
But will say I don't see any good from it.
Look at harvest reports now. Based off of that spring bear permits should of doubled or tripled by now.
So even with this requirement unless I see a HUGE number of spring bear permits next year.
Waste of time........ :twocents:

And to add ...... I don't look down on any hunter that doesn't want to report. I don't really see any difference in harvest a male or female it's not illegal to harvest a female that I know of. Reporting requirements such as this just gives anti's fuel to try and shut down the hunt. WDFW is happy to do it.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: dilleytech on March 25, 2021, 08:01:14 AM
Had to do this in SE Alaska for as long as I can recall. Not an issue. Although the Alaska sealing requirements say the claws and proof of sex must remain naturally attached until sealed. They take a premolar for aging.

Iím happy to help them collect data.

So in Alaska a strip 3Ē wide from proof of sex to a claw would work?

Per their definition;

 skin, hide, or pelt of a bear means the entire external covering with claws attached.

So no, a 3Ē strip of hide wonít cut it.

Why is everyone so against bringing a bear hide to a fish and game office?
Idaho requires the same for wolves and I donít recall anyone complaining about it.
Per what definition? Letís see a link.

In Idaho you only have to take a small portion of the hide with the proof of sex attached for both a bear and wolf. And here are their regs.

Iím against packing a 40-60# hide with skull and paws attached 5-10 miles out on my back when I have killed enough bears, and only want the meat and skull. There is zero chance WDFW would win this case based on their own wording if you showed up with a Ďpatch.í

I will keep hunting Idaho in the spring anyways since I will never draw again. This state is a joke.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210325/b31247a5a305cd71c0eea39752917f7d.png)


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I canít even see in Washington regs where it explains how and where to submit the ďpeltĒ besides a number to call. It would be. A shame to get home and be told to travel back across the state for submission or something. I do think since they donít specifically state the entire pelt including... then they have no legal ground. Iíll be trying to get this figured out before my hunt itís just frustrating.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: slim9300 on March 25, 2021, 08:06:16 AM
Had to do this in SE Alaska for as long as I can recall. Not an issue. Although the Alaska sealing requirements say the claws and proof of sex must remain naturally attached until sealed. They take a premolar for aging.

Iím happy to help them collect data.

So in Alaska a strip 3Ē wide from proof of sex to a claw would work?

Per their definition;

 skin, hide, or pelt of a bear means the entire external covering with claws attached.

So no, a 3Ē strip of hide wonít cut it.

Why is everyone so against bringing a bear hide to a fish and game office?
Idaho requires the same for wolves and I donít recall anyone complaining about it.
Per what definition? Letís see a link.

In Idaho you only have to take a small portion of the hide with the proof of sex attached for both a bear and wolf. And here are their regs.

Iím against packing a 40-60# hide with skull and paws attached 5-10 miles out on my back when I have killed enough bears, and only want the meat and skull. There is zero chance WDFW would win this case based on their own wording if you showed up with a Ďpatch.í

I will keep hunting Idaho in the spring anyways since I will never draw again. This state is a joke.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210325/b31247a5a305cd71c0eea39752917f7d.png)


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I canít even see in Washington regs where it explains how and where to submit the ďpeltĒ besides a number to call. It would be. A shame to get home and be told to travel back across the state for submission or something. I do think since they donít specifically state the entire pelt including... then they have no legal ground. Iíll be trying to get this figured out before my hunt itís just frustrating.
Agreed. If you take 99% is that still a Ďpelt.í What about 95%? Now 50%? At what point does it not become a pelt? 😂


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Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: dilleytech on March 25, 2021, 08:45:53 AM
Exactly.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Special T on March 25, 2021, 10:30:41 AM
Im curious if anyone will take the spirit of the rule and just bring the nipple region.

I understand the spirit of the rule change, but like most things test cases are necessary to to force change /clarification. This seems to be a failing of ours that the anti/animal rights groups dont suffer from. 

Im not making an endorsement one way or the other as to what action to take, But the vibe ive gotten from this discussion is either compliance or nonreporting. When will we organize and utilize legal means to fight back.

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Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: slim9300 on March 25, 2021, 11:46:07 AM
Im curious if anyone will take the spirit of the rule and just bring the nipple region.

I understand the spirit of the rule change, but like most things test cases are necessary to to force change /clarification. This seems to be a failing of ours that the anti/animal rights groups dont suffer from. 

Im not making an endorsement one way or the other as to what action to take, But the vibe ive gotten from this discussion is either compliance or nonreporting. When will we organize and utilize legal means to fight back.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
If I had the spring tag again this year and I was hunting the backcountry where I have packed them out in the past (5-10 miles in) AND I wasnít happy with the hide, I would pack a roughly 12Ēx12Ē patch of hide with proof of sex attached along with the skull and meat of course.

Since I donít have the tag, itís a moot point. When I go to Idaho this year and if I kill a bear, that is exactly what I will pack out for them (which is 100% legal per their F&G).


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Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: trophyhunt on March 25, 2021, 12:04:48 PM
Im curious if anyone will take the spirit of the rule and just bring the nipple region.

I understand the spirit of the rule change, but like most things test cases are necessary to to force change /clarification. This seems to be a failing of ours that the anti/animal rights groups dont suffer from. 

Im not making an endorsement one way or the other as to what action to take, But the vibe ive gotten from this discussion is either compliance or nonreporting. When will we organize and utilize legal means to fight back.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
If I had the spring tag again this year and I was hunting the backcountry where I have packed them out in the past (5-10 miles in) AND I wasnít happy with the hide, I would pack a roughly 12Ēx12Ē patch of hide with proof of sex attached along with the skull and meat of course.

Since I donít have the tag, itís a moot point. When I go to Idaho this year and if I kill a bear, that is exactly what I will pack out for them (which is 100% legal per their F&G).


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:yeah:Same, that is the most I will pack out IF, big IF the hide is crap.  I guess I'll see what happens, but it's surly not poaching like some on here have said.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: dilleytech on March 25, 2021, 08:35:21 PM
Im curious if anyone will take the spirit of the rule and just bring the nipple region.

I understand the spirit of the rule change, but like most things test cases are necessary to to force change /clarification. This seems to be a failing of ours that the anti/animal rights groups dont suffer from. 

Im not making an endorsement one way or the other as to what action to take, But the vibe ive gotten from this discussion is either compliance or nonreporting. When will we organize and utilize legal means to fight back.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
If I had the spring tag again this year and I was hunting the backcountry where I have packed them out in the past (5-10 miles in) AND I wasnít happy with the hide, I would pack a roughly 12Ēx12Ē patch of hide with proof of sex attached along with the skull and meat of course.

Since I donít have the tag, itís a moot point. When I go to Idaho this year and if I kill a bear, that is exactly what I will pack out for them (which is 100% legal per their F&G).


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:yeah:Same, that is the most I will pack out IF, big IF the hide is crap.  I guess I'll see what happens, but it's surly not poaching like some on here have said.

Agreed agreed agreed. You would think someone high up reads these boards and could chime in. If itís a horrible hide way back in Iíll bring out proof of everything. I will call it in and if they say you must provide the entire hide. Then I guess I was unsuccessful. Because as I read the requirements. That is whatís required. 
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Ghost Hunter on March 25, 2021, 10:02:31 PM
Im curious if anyone will take the spirit of the rule and just bring the nipple region.

I understand the spirit of the rule change, but like most things test cases are necessary to to force change /clarification. This seems to be a failing of ours that the anti/animal rights groups dont suffer from. 

Im not making an endorsement one way or the other as to what action to take, But the vibe ive gotten from this discussion is either compliance or nonreporting. When will we organize and utilize legal means to fight back.

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If I had the spring tag again this year and I was hunting the backcountry where I have packed them out in the past (5-10 miles in) AND I wasnít happy with the hide, I would pack a roughly 12Ēx12Ē patch of hide with proof of sex attached along with the skull and meat of course.

Since I donít have the tag, itís a moot point. When I go to Idaho this year and if I kill a bear, that is exactly what I will pack out for them (which is 100% legal per their F&G).


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:yeah:Same, that is the most I will pack out IF, big IF the hide is crap.  I guess I'll see what happens, but it's surly not poaching like some on here have said.
RCW 77.15.280 is simply a misdemeanor in 2021 spring bear regs. 
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Special T on March 25, 2021, 11:26:27 PM
Im curious if anyone will take the spirit of the rule and just bring the nipple region.

I understand the spirit of the rule change, but like most things test cases are necessary to to force change /clarification. This seems to be a failing of ours that the anti/animal rights groups dont suffer from. 

Im not making an endorsement one way or the other as to what action to take, But the vibe ive gotten from this discussion is either compliance or nonreporting. When will we organize and utilize legal means to fight back.

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If I had the spring tag again this year and I was hunting the backcountry where I have packed them out in the past (5-10 miles in) AND I wasnít happy with the hide, I would pack a roughly 12Ēx12Ē patch of hide with proof of sex attached along with the skull and meat of course.

Since I donít have the tag, itís a moot point. When I go to Idaho this year and if I kill a bear, that is exactly what I will pack out for them (which is 100% legal per their F&G).


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:yeah:Same, that is the most I will pack out IF, big IF the hide is crap.  I guess I'll see what happens, but it's surly not poaching like some on here have said.
RCW 77.15.280 is simply a misdemeanor in 2021 spring bear regs.

So... not for nothing... if you brought out all the tits 6? 8? and nothing else because the  fur sucked or you didn't care about the hide should this not be sufficient?  are you willing to risk a misdemeanor and or a strike against your hunting record to make a point of this issue?

First not many folks drew this, second I hope most folks don't shoot a sow, 3rd I hope those that shoot a sow don't shoot a lactating one... That said IF  you drew and harvested are you willing to risk a strike against yourself and an $250 fine? Are you willing to spend some $ to make a point on this issue?

I say this not because I endorse this, but because I know others that have risked much higher fines and risks to take Wildlife issues to court. To my knowledge the state has NOT clarified this issue. You can AGREE with the spirit and DISAGREE with the implementation.   Anti Folks are willing to fight this fight in the courts... Are you willing to fight it? In a rural court? In an Urban court?
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: KFhunter on March 25, 2021, 11:33:33 PM
They'll get enough pelt to do want they need ti do. if its a boar they'll get a scrotum.  If it's a sow they'll get a patch with a vulva in it.

Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: slim9300 on March 26, 2021, 07:32:00 AM
Im curious if anyone will take the spirit of the rule and just bring the nipple region.

I understand the spirit of the rule change, but like most things test cases are necessary to to force change /clarification. This seems to be a failing of ours that the anti/animal rights groups dont suffer from. 

Im not making an endorsement one way or the other as to what action to take, But the vibe ive gotten from this discussion is either compliance or nonreporting. When will we organize and utilize legal means to fight back.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
If I had the spring tag again this year and I was hunting the backcountry where I have packed them out in the past (5-10 miles in) AND I wasnít happy with the hide, I would pack a roughly 12Ēx12Ē patch of hide with proof of sex attached along with the skull and meat of course.

Since I donít have the tag, itís a moot point. When I go to Idaho this year and if I kill a bear, that is exactly what I will pack out for them (which is 100% legal per their F&G).


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
:yeah:Same, that is the most I will pack out IF, big IF the hide is crap.  I guess I'll see what happens, but it's surly not poaching like some on here have said.
RCW 77.15.280 is simply a misdemeanor in 2021 spring bear regs.
https://app.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=77.15.280

Hahaha. Throwing out RCWís like this one has an impact... 🙄 A regulation/law must be clearly defined, and this one is not. That is why it will never hold up in court. I am 100% prepared to pay to defend myself if necessary, but Iím sure it will be challenged before I have a spring bear tag in this state again.


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Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: dilleytech on March 26, 2021, 07:45:34 AM
I hope people shoot whatever bear they want. Besides a sow WITh Cubs. The idea of the spring bear hunt is to reduce the bear population I thought. You do that best by killing sows. Do people want more predators or less? If you want less you would be passing a boar for a sow. I like the great bear hunting we have but I would prefer if the deer, elk and moose hunting was better personally.
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: Ghost Hunter on March 26, 2021, 08:50:21 AM
Sorry.  I'm not shooting a sow so cubs suffer.  🙄
Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: KFhunter on March 26, 2021, 09:00:00 AM
He said: "besides a sow with cubs"

If a sow is being closly followed by a boar, its a safe bet no cubs.

I'd still watch to make sure they're a mated pair, then I'd take the boar, but I can't fault his reasoning at all.

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Title: Re: Spring Bear Pelt Submission
Post by: millerwheeler on March 26, 2021, 07:45:14 PM
I donít discriminate predator all go  there are more bears in wa then many other states if every member took a sow we wouldnít even put a dent in our predator problems