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Author Topic: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"  (Read 13988 times)

Offline Bofire

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Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« on: October 09, 2007, 07:26:36 AM »
 :) In this state, WA, hunting is legally a "privlege" I read where some state in the South East passed an amendment that made hunting a legal "right" last year.

Anbody know about this? How does one organize this kind of thing? a referendum? Any lawyers here?
Carl
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Offline singleshot12

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #1 on: October 09, 2007, 07:32:26 AM »
Don't know anything about it,but is it wrong to be a "Right" ?
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Offline Bofire

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #2 on: October 09, 2007, 07:46:59 AM »
here since it is a privlege, the game commision makes rules, like hunter orange, without having to go through the process of making it a "law". I think we would have much more protection if our hunting was a "legal right", such as a constitutional amendment.
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Offline jackelope

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #3 on: October 09, 2007, 09:22:40 AM »
the right to hunt bill in washington died in legislature. HR4204
http://www.serconline.org/huntandfish.html

:fire.:

" In today's instant gratification society, more and more pressure revolves around success and the measurement of one's prowess as a hunter by inches on a score chart or field photos produced on social media. Don't fall into the trap. Hunting is-and always will be- about the hunt, the adventure, the views, and time spent with close friends and family. " Ryan Hatfield

My posts, opinions and statements do not represent those of this forum

Offline Ray

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #4 on: October 09, 2007, 08:06:28 PM »
They need to get this done before the enviro-wackos erase the rights one by one. They'd rather have the world swimming in a fish bowl looking at the outside world as if it was Mars or Jupiter.

Offline Dman

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #5 on: October 10, 2007, 08:47:56 PM »
 I had proposed a rework of that failed submittal for next session. I still plan to do so if I have time. There were many thing's about that failed submittal that doomed it to failure, I think could be changed to get it passed. I've been told done the right way, it would succeed by folks inside State GOV.

Offline Bofire

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #6 on: October 11, 2007, 06:33:34 PM »
I am willing to help, if I can.
Carl
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Offline bearhunter59

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #7 on: October 24, 2007, 12:01:21 PM »
At what point did fishing and hunting in this state become a "priveledge"?  When this state became a state?  Because I have never figured out where they get off calling it a "privledge".  Unless there was something in the state constitution, then our "right" to hunt and fish for "subsistance" purposes, like the Indians, has been illegally infringed by the State.

I would love to see a class-action lawsuit brought against this state, on behalf of all non-native hunters and fishers, for discrimination, and violating our "natural" right to harvest natural resources in this state; to put food on our tables for our families.  Why shouldn't we go after the state, using the same arguments the Indians have all these years.  Our forefathers lived off the game and fish, just the same way as the Indians were relieant on the game and fish to subsist.  They say their rights were granted in the original treaties.  Well, out right was granted in the original constitution, and I haven't seen an amendment yet, which revoked my right to "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness".

Offline huntingnut

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #8 on: October 24, 2007, 12:24:38 PM »
I would be on board to help round up support to make it a right.

Offline Palmer

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #9 on: November 03, 2007, 12:33:37 AM »
here since it is a privilege, the game commission makes rules, like hunter orange, without having to go through the process of making it a "law". I think we would have much more protection if our hunting was a "legal right", such as a constitutional amendment.
Carl

I believe the commission must form a committee to adopt rules.  The rules must then be submitted to the legislature where they are probably adopted into the RCW and the WAC so therefore, they are laws.  Refer to RCW Title 77 or WAC Title 220.

I'm a little confused.  I've thought of this concept before but if it was a right, then I have some questions:

Could the state force you to buy a tag and a license?
How would the WDFW get funded?
How could you restrict the quantity of fish and game being harvested?
Would the state illegally harass and intimidate us to purchase a license to hunt?  (similar to a concealed weapons permit or has the Federal Supreme Court upheld the CWP?)

All I know is that there can be no law that could legally conflict with an amendment to the state constitution that stated we have the right to hunt.  In other words if a hunting offense were to go to trial using a law that conflicted with the constitution then it would be up to a juror to call out that law as bogus and acquit the defendant being charged with an illegal law.  Or the defendant could take their case to the state supreme court.

Offline Palmer

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #10 on: November 03, 2007, 10:48:10 PM »
I don't know if this info is 100% correct.  But I remember learning somewhere that in Europe hunting was a right if you owned land. For example a lord owned a huge plot of land and all the game within it. 

I don't know when the concept of "privelege" was started, but Americans wanted to make sure that no one had a right to the game simply because they owned the land.  Instead hunting was a privelege so that everyone could have an opportunity to harvest an animal.  As a privelege there is a need for the government to manage wildlife and habitat on public and private lands.  I would think this would prevent animals from being harvested into extinction in some areas. I've heard that whitetails and turkeys were becoming scarce 50+ years ago.

It looks to me like parts of Europe has lost some of its game due to lack of management and the concept of "right to hunt any game on one's own land."  I hear there are few deer left in England and are there any wolves left in Europe?  Italy has lots of game animals.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2007, 07:41:06 AM by Palmer »

Offline singleshot12

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #11 on: November 04, 2007, 06:29:26 AM »
You made some very good points Palmer.With that being said,it makes it a right and a privlege,and I agree.But lets not let anybody use the "privlege" part of it-to be used against us and our constitutional "right"...to hunt.
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Offline Bofire

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #12 on: November 05, 2007, 11:51:07 AM »
Palmer,
Look in the game rules, you'll see "hunter orange" is listed as a "rule' the Game commision(appointed positions) can make rules and do not have to submit them to anyone. Some of the regs. we must follow are LAW, like dogs and baiting for bear, that was passed as a referendum, not by legislation.
Part of it is needed, how could seasons be set, limits change if the commission had to go to the legislature every time? You can read RCW 77.15 on line and see what is Law, RCW or WAC, and what is Rule. You will be surprised. Most of the things in the regs, book are identified if they are by Law, see WAC232-12-828 for handicap hunters, vs-rule 12 on page 66, which is the prohibited use of electronic calls, note Turkey was added last spring by a RULE, not Law. Another note is that you can follow everything in the Hunting Rules Phamplet and still be in violation of state Law, it is the hunters responsibility to know the rules and regs, and laws.  Look on page 9 of the rule book WAC summary information.  I have the RCW book open in front of me.  RCW77.15 is the chapter, 77.15.020 states: "Authority to define violation of rule as infraction.  If the commission or director has authority to adopt a rule that is punishable as a crime under this chapter, then the commission or director may provide that violation of the rule shall be punished with a notice of infraction under RCW 7.84.030" so you see They DO have the right to make rules and enforce them as Law.
I do NOT know all this stuff it is very confusing.
Carl
« Last Edit: November 05, 2007, 11:58:35 AM by Bofire »
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Offline Palmer

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #13 on: November 05, 2007, 09:46:59 PM »
I'm glad you enjoy looking up the laws.  I'm an electrician and the state adopts the National Electrical Code Book every year so I have to study a bit of law myself.  As far as I know the code is adopted and is therefore law.  I thought it would be the same for any rules in the regs. 

Its helpfull to know your rights out there.  I've been harassed several times by people who just don't like hunters period.  No matter how nice I am to them they keep raising their voice at me.  I've also had a fellow drive his car up and down an area honking his horn on opening day of deer modern fire arm.  Its interesting to know that they are actually breaking the law when they harass us.
« Last Edit: November 05, 2007, 10:02:36 PM by Palmer »

Offline Palmer

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #14 on: November 05, 2007, 10:01:16 PM »
RCW77.15 is the chapter, 77.15.020 states: "Authority to define violation of rule as infraction.  If the commission or director has authority to adopt a rule that is punishable as a crime under this chapter, then the commission or director may provide that violation of the rule shall be punished with a notice of infraction under RCW 7.84.030" so you see They DO have the right to make rules and enforce them as Law.
I do NOT know all this stuff it is very confusing.
Carl


Because RCW 7.15.020 states: "Authority to define violation of rule as infraction,"  I would think this is saying that all rules stated in the regs are adopted as laws under the revised code and administrative code of Washington.  I'm probably boring everyone to death but if the state constitution stated you had the "right" to hunt then only the state supreme court would have the jurisdiction to interpret the scope of "right to hunt."  The RCW 7.15.020 would be in violation of the state constitution if there was a right to hunt amendment.  No RCW or WAC is higher then a constitutional amendment.

Offline Ray

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #15 on: November 05, 2007, 10:11:39 PM »
I hear what you are saying Palmer. However we also have the 1st and 2nd amendments being "regulated" all the time.

Offline Palmer

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #16 on: November 06, 2007, 05:00:00 AM »
Its my understanding that when the legislature gets involved in regulating a constitutional amendment, state or federal, and if you end up in court, you may end up taking it all the way to the supreme court.  The supreme court would then decide if the regulatory measures over an amendment were unconstitutional.  Hopefully,  we have a make up of good justices who studied and believe in the vision of those who founded our country and wrote the constitution.

For instance, I've heard that some states have outlawed the right to own a gun, but has anyone taken this up in the courts and all the way to the supreme court.  I've heard a commentator talk about this recently.  Evidently a similar issue is making its way to the supreme court.  Does anyone have any info?  Kirby Wilbur was talking about it a couple months ago and I was sort of listening and didn't catch the whole story.

Offline Ray

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #17 on: November 06, 2007, 08:12:02 AM »
Legislature does not need to be involved in it if the WDFW has been designated the authority to regulate with regular and real input from the citizens. Of course there will always be a corner case here or there as there is with anything we already have on the books today.


Offline Bofire

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #18 on: November 06, 2007, 08:37:13 AM »
 ;) I am not sure, but I think this issue comes up as the animals are property of the state, so they grant us the 'privilige' of hunting them.
Then again, if the Govt. of the state is us, as we are the citizens, then we own the animals...??? also we cant use boat ramps and stuff the game dept. owns without a permit...
this is all to confusing we need a Lawyer thats on our side.
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Offline Ray

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #19 on: November 06, 2007, 09:18:47 AM »
I don't believe that it would equate to "a hunting right means hunters own the animals"  or even how they are pursued which is seemingly what you are suggesting. That is more complex than most any consitutional right was ever meant to be and there lies more questions and issues. Mostly I hear questions about "regulation" instead of "right" when people have talked about it here.

To me, the idea is...  hunting would be recognized by authorities, their decision making process and that hunting becomes a protected activity in that regard.

To be honest I don't think it will ever happen but that's how I would view it.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2007, 09:27:22 AM by huntwa »

Offline Palmer

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #20 on: November 06, 2007, 03:07:24 PM »
IMO hunting and fishing is very much a part of American tradition and culture enjoyed by many and should be protected.  It worries me when I hear of thousands of our fellow citizens are trying to outlaw hunting.  I'm sure that if they ever succeeded, fishing would be next.  I hope this day never comes.

It would be interesting to hear an attorney's input on "right" and "privilege."  I'll call Prepaid Legal and see what they say. I'll ask them to send me an email.

Offline popeshawnpaul

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #21 on: November 21, 2007, 08:26:28 PM »
Ok, I guess I'll chime in as an attorney.  Palmer was on the right track.  When you deal with the difference between a right and a privilege, you look to see where the right or privilege comes from.  As a general rule, if it comes from the Constitution it is a right...bear arms, freedom, etc.  Hunting is no doubt a privilege.  In fact, the state owns the wildlife that walks on your property.  Hunting is a privilege just like driving a car and the state may regulate it as it sees fit.  I know many of you believe so strongly in hunting and it is engrained in your family to where you believe it is your right to hunt.  If I believed in driving so much and it was engrained in my family so much that it was important to me it would not make it a right.  Our forefathers decided long ago what was a right and a privilege.  I don't think it would make much difference in the grand scheme of things.  If you get a felony the state takes your right to bear arms and vote.  In essence, everything is regulated one way or another. 

A quick look through case law on hunting rights showed a pattern.  Here is an exerpt I find compelling from a case decided by the U.S. Supreme Court:  "There is simply no nexus between the right to hunt for sport and the right to speak, the right to vote, the right to travel, the right to pursue a calling." 417 F. Supp., at 1009

Not to go down this road too far...but under a treaty with the U.S. a member of an indian tribe has a right to hunt.  Current WA case law refuses to distinguish between the right and privilege to hunt for an indian...  However, the right/privilege can be regulated by the tribe.  In Washington v. Miller, the court stated:  "Whatever the legal distinction between "right" and
"privilege" might be in some contexts, there is no persuasive authority to distinguish between these terms when interpreting treaties between Indians and the federal government. In fact, the Byrd court's implication that a treaty "privilege" somehow reserves less to the Indians than a treaty "right" is in direct conflict with the canons of construction applicable to Indian treaties."

Offline ICEMAN

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #22 on: November 21, 2007, 09:18:20 PM »
Man, you really know how to bum me out. Thanks.  :( 

In your opinion, the only way to remove these indian "rights, would be to break the treaties? Also... their "rights" were originally intended to include fishing and hunting on reservation land. Surely the framers of the treaties never intended for indian "rights" to extend across the state, to encompass all other lands, for profit.
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Offline popeshawnpaul

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #23 on: November 22, 2007, 05:16:33 AM »
To answer the question is to look at the language of the court.  I found this was common throughout the cases involving indians and the right to fish and privilege to hunt.  Even though the treaty worded it at they have a right to fish and privilege to hunt, they determined that they are one in the same with respect to the treaty and the U.S.  To answer the question Sisu we look at the treaty landguage and they are allowed to hunt in their "usual and accustomed grounds"  So now the questions is...is the Oak Creek Wildlife area their usual and accustomed grounds for hunting elk...  And, if you want to now take the hunting/fishing rights, you have to break the treaty.  Have you ever signed a contract you then regret later because you end up paying in ways you didn't expect?  Read this exerpt from State v. Miller:

Article 4 of the Point No Point Treaty of 1855 provides:

    The right of taking fish at usual and accustomed grounds and stations is further secured to said Indians, in common with all citizens of the United States; and of erecting temporary houses for the purpose of curing; Page 681 together with the privilege of hunting and gathering roots and berries on open and unclaimed lands.


....

In order to determine whether the regulations in this case are valid as applied to petitioners, we must first determine whether the same standards for determining the validity of regulations limiting treaty Indians' "right" to fish applies to their "privilege" to hunt. This question was first raised in Washington courts in State v. Byrd, supra. There the court stated, in
dicta, that

  the treaty by its own terms reserves in the Skokomish
  Indians less than an absolute right to hunt. While
  the treaty provides that the Indians have the right
  to fish at their usual and accustomed grounds, it
  provides that they have only the privilege to hunt
  on open and unclaimed lands. This difference in
  language has been recognized as more than a semantic
  distinction. See United States v. Washington,
  384 F. Supp. 312, 336 (W.D. Wash. 1974),

Offline Palmer

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #24 on: November 22, 2007, 08:58:09 AM »
I've talked with many Coastal Indians and Indians from Colville and Yakama on such issues.  Here are a couple of examples that I remember illustrating their situation.

Example #1:  The land along I-5 entering into Canada and containing the park with the peace arch is owned by a Lummi Indian and charges a lease for the use of the land.  This land is obviously outside the reservation but many lands were not given up when they were forced onto the reservations.  I was told that the coastal Indians North of the Snohomish were told to stay on the reservation until all the American settlers were removed and then the Indians would have all lands North of the Snohomish and west of the Cascades.

Example #2  In Colville I was told that their reservation was 5x larger and then reduced to the current southern border and the east and west border but the Northern border extended to Canada.  When the Northern border was moved South to its current location, they retained their hunting rights to the Canadian border.

Example #3  Most tribal members I've talked to tell me they have hunting right boundaries so its not state wide.

Example #4  If they aren't responsable with their resources they'll lose them.  I've heard of Indians getting busted because they didn't have tribal affiliation with the tribal lands they were hunting or fishing on.



Offline Bofire

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #25 on: November 22, 2007, 09:03:40 AM »
Thanks, Popeshaw, I am understanding more and more.
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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #26 on: December 20, 2007, 08:38:58 AM »
Just for everybodie's info:

State Right to Hunt and Fish Laws and Constitutional Amendments
Alabama
Sportsperson’s Bill of Rights
Bill Number: H 359, 1996, Amendment 597
Status: Passed
In 1996, the voters of Alabama amended that state’s constitution to guarantee a “right to hunt and fish.”
For text of the amendment, see: Alabama Considers Constitutional “Right to Fish”

Arkansas
Constitutional Right to Hunt
Bill Number: SJR 1, 2003
Status: Died
Proposes a constitutional amendment, to be known as the Sportsperson’s Bill of Rights, guaranteeing the right to hunt, fish, and harvest game.

California
“The people shall have the right to fish upon and from the public lands of the
State and in the waters thereof, excepting upon lands set aside for fish hatcheries, and no land owned by the State shall ever be sold or transferred without reserving in the people the absolute right to fish thereupon; and no law shall ever be passed making it a crime for the people to enter upon the public lands within this State for the purpose of fishing in any water containing fish that have been planted therein by the State; provided, that the Legislature may by statute, provide for the season when and the conditions under which the different species of fish may be taken.” (California Constitution, Article 1, Section 25, 1910)

Florida
Hunting, Fishing, & Gaming Rights
Bill Number: HJR 453, 2002
Status: Died in Committee
Constitutional amendment establishing the right of the people of the state to hunt, fish, and harvest game, subject to reasonable regulations and restrictions as prescribed by general law and state constitution. Amends s. 26, Art. I.

Georgia
Right to Hunt and Fish
Bill Number: HB 301, 2001
Status: Passed and signed into law 4/18/2001
This bill amends the Georgia Code to declare that Georgia citizens have the right to take fish and wildlife, subject to the laws and regulations adopted by the board for the public good and welfare. In addition, this bill prohibits local governments from regulating hunting, trapping, or fishing by local ordinance.

Constitutional Right to Hunt
Bill Number: SR 563
Status: Senate Passed/Adopted 1/26/04; House Committee Favorably Reported 2/12/04
Proposes an amendment to the Constitution so as to provide that the people have the right to hunt, fish, and harvest game, subject only to reasonable restrictions as the General Assembly may prescribe by general law.

Indiana
Constitutional Right to Hunt
Bill Number: HJR 2, 2004
Status: Referred to Committee on Rules and Legislative Procedures 1/13/04
Amends the Indiana constitution to provide that the people have the right to hunt, fish, and harvest game.

Louisiana
Constitutional Right to Hunt and Trap
Bill Number: SB 47, 2003
Status: In Committee, session ended (no carryover)
Amends the constitution to preserve the right to hunt, fish, and trap.

Michigan
Hunting Rights
Bill Number: HJR L, 2003
Status: In Committee
Establishes hunting, fishing, camping, or taking game as a Constitutional right.

Minnesota
The Hunting and Fishing Amendment
Bill Number: SF 41, 1997-1998
Status: Amendment Passed
A bill for an act proposing an amendment to the Minnesota Constitution, article XIII, by adding a section affirming that hunting and fishing and the taking of game and fish are a valued part of our heritage.

Mississippi
In 1997, the Mississippi legislature considered putting a similar state constitutional amendment before the voters, but the measure did not pass.

Missouri
Constitutional Right to Hunt
Bill Number: SJR 24, 2004
Status
Amends the state constitution to provide for a constitutional right to hunt, fish, and harvest game.

Montana
Constitutional Right to Hunt
Bill Number: HB 306, 2003
Status: Chaptered 4/3/2003
Amends the state constitution forever preserving the right to hunt.

Nebraska
Preserve Hunting Rights
Bill number: LR 4CA, 2003
Status: Carried over to Second Regular Session
Constitutional amendment to preserve the right to fish, trap, and hunt
Attorney General’s Opinion #04003: Whether LR4CA, a proposed amendment to the Nebraska Constitution regarding hunting, fishing, and trapping, will have an affect on the Nebraska Constitution and various existing statutes.

New Hampshire
Codifies the Right to Hunt, Trap, and Fish
Bill Number: HB 273, 2001
Status: Passed
This bill amends the New Hampshire Code by stating that the fish and game department will recognize, preserve, and promote hunting, fishing, and trapping and will provide opportunities to carry out such activities in accordance with title XVIII.

New Mexico
Right to Hunt
Bill Number: SJR 1, 1999
Status: Died
The “right to hunt” resolution would have made it a constitutional right to hunt and fish, placing that use above and beyond all other non-consumptive wildlife uses.

North Dakota
Hunting, Fishing, Trapping for the Public Good/State Heritage
Bill Number: Constitutional Measure 1, 2000
Status: Passed
This constitutional amendment, passed in 2000, provides that hunting, trapping, and fishing are a valued part of residents’ heritage and will be preserved for the people and managed by law and regulation for the public good.

Pennsylvania
Right to Hunt
Bill Number: HB 1512, 2003
Status: Passed House 2/9/04; In Senate Committee
Proposes an amendment to the constitution guaranteeing the right to hunt and fish. Hunting and fishing are already legal in the state.

Rhode Island
“The people shall continue to enjoy and freely exercise all the rights of fishery, and the privileges of the shore, to which they have been heretofore entitled under the charter and usages of this state. But no new right is intended to be granted, nor any existing right impaired, by this declaration.” (Rhode Island Constitution, Article 1, Section 17, 1844)

South Carolina
Declaration of Rights
Bill Number: H 3702, 2003
Status: In Committee, session ended (03-04 carryover)
Proposes an amendment to the State Constitution; relates to the declaration of rights; provides for the right of the people to hunt, fish, and take game.

South Dakota
Bill Number: HJR 1004, 2003
Status: Introduced, session ended (no carryover)
A joint resolution, proposing and submitting to the voters at the next general election an amendment to Article XXI of the Constitution of the State of South Dakota, relating to hunting, fishing, and trapping.

Texas
Right to hunt
Bill Number: HJR 14, 2001
Proposing a constitutional amendment relating to the right to hunt and fish.
Status: Died

Vermont
“The inhabitants of this State shall have the liberty in seasonable times, to hunt and fowl on the lands they hold, and on other lands not inclosed, and in like manner to fish in all boatable and other waters (not private property) under proper regulations, to be made and provided by the General Assembly.” (Vermont Constitution, Chapter 2, part 67, 1777)

Virginia
Right to hunt
Ballot Measure 2, 2000
Status: Passed
This Virginia ballot measure, passed in 2000, provides by constitutional amendment that “the people have a right to hunt, fish, and harvest game, subject to such regulations and restrictions as the General Assembly may prescribe by general law.”

Washington
Right to hunt and fish
Bill Number: HJR 4204, 2001
Status: Died in Committee
Adds the right to hunt and fish to the Constitution of the state of Washington.

Wisconsin
“Right to Hunt”
Bill Number: AJR 1, 2003
Status: Amendment Passed
Calls for a constitutional amendment guaranteeing the right to hunt, fish, and trap.


Offline Dman

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #27 on: December 20, 2007, 11:53:54 AM »
 A whole lot of quality info given. It is good to see that many states have passed, or are actively seeking to pass this type of legislation.

Offline Bofire

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #28 on: December 20, 2007, 12:32:13 PM »
I agree that is a lot of information. Encouraging!!
Now what other board do you go to that you get a ton of good information and Legal opinion!
Carl
When the chips are down..... the buffalo is empty!!

I do not shop at Amazon

Offline Palmer

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #29 on: December 23, 2007, 06:17:55 PM »
Sounds to me like some states have a NOMINAL RIGHT which is no better than what we have in our state.  Perhaps I'm missing something but what is the point of making hunting and fishing a right if the state legislature can still regulate your rights.  That's no right at all.

Offline griz272000

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #30 on: December 24, 2007, 05:34:55 PM »
ok  then im new to all this stuff lol im kind of ileturate  lol when it comes to this kind of thing but i do know that our right to hunt and fish are very important . i just want to put myself out there to say i want to help but somebody needs to get me on the right track as to how.   
Want to make a difference in our state ? Then VOTE!

Offline popeshawnpaul

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #31 on: December 25, 2007, 10:25:37 AM »
Be careful what you wish for.  What will this actually do for us?  Rights are often much harder to take from people than privileges.  For instance, I would imagine taking one's right to hunt for poaching would be legally more difficult than taking one's privilege to hunt...

Offline Dman

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #32 on: December 26, 2007, 04:05:45 PM »
Sounds to me like some states have a NOMINAL RIGHT which is no better than what we have in our state.  Perhaps I'm missing something but what is the point of making hunting and fishing a right if the state legislature can still regulate your rights.  That's no right at all.

 I disagree Palmer, on the basis that once it is part of the State Constitution, it is similar to the US constitution, it may be "regulated" to a certain degree, only if it does not enfringe upon your right to hunt and fish. A lot of it would depend on how the Bill was written, if it was not written adequately than that is a different story. The key difference is right now, the State could bow to special interest groups and close hunting areas for various reason's. With this type of Bill, emphasizing at the State level the same requirement's of the recent executive order, it begin's to make a very tough legal case for the State to bow to small special interest groups without recognizing the; 2nd Amendment, Executive Order on hunting/ fishing and a State level Constitutional right to hunt and fish. Another key advantage I see potentially also, is co-management status for the resident's of the State equivalent to that of the Tribe's. If we 'sportsmen' have more say in what our public agency does behind closed doors with the Tribes without disclosure, I think it would smooth over some issues that have created some friction within the State and be more productive that the atmosphere of distrust that has developed since the Boldt decision.

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #33 on: December 28, 2007, 03:29:06 PM »
I want to protect the sport of hunting and keep areas open.  I think this is a good cause.  I just get concerned when the state and the federal gov.  regulate our rights.  I think the less regulation of our rights the better. 

I'll keep reading what others have to say on this thread.  It's all interesting.

Offline Bofire

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Re: Hunting, "right" or "privlege?"
« Reply #34 on: December 28, 2007, 04:57:59 PM »
Pope Shawn, right now criminals lose all sorts of rights if convicted. I dont see that as a problem, BUT you are correct in that we must look at this very closely!
Carl
Palmer, the problem is right now we are being regulated without any say so, no representation. The Game Commission can do what ever they want regardless of any 'majority'  or anything.
Carl
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I do not shop at Amazon

 


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