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Author Topic: Proposed wording change for trap checking?  (Read 2644 times)

Offline BigCutty3

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Proposed wording change for trap checking?
« on: March 26, 2019, 06:43:21 PM »
I will preface by saying Im not a trapper, and don't pretend to know the laws...but I was going through the Commission Agenda items for April and they are changing the wording for trap checking....I would assume this is really going to change the game, having to check live traps every 24 hours? The change as proposed is below:
(c) Unless ((animals captured in)) restraining traps (any nonkilling set) are ((removed within)) checked every twenty-four hours and captured animals are restrained in a trap for no more than twentyfour hours ((of capture)).
Some of the strikethroughs didnt copy/paste but you can look it up if interested.  They are essentially adding the "checked every twenty four hours" part to the "and captured animals are restrained in a trap for no more than twenty four hours".

Offline Humptulips

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Re: Proposed wording change for trap checking?
« Reply #1 on: March 26, 2019, 07:03:32 PM »
Thank you.
Bruce Vandervort

Offline Skyvalhunter

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Re: Proposed wording change for trap checking?
« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2019, 07:40:26 PM »
So how do the trappers feel about this and why was it changed.

Offline BigCutty3

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Re: Proposed wording change for trap checking?
« Reply #3 on: March 26, 2019, 08:01:01 PM »
https://wdfw.wa.gov/sites/default/files/about/commission/meetings/2019/04/apr04_06_summary.pdf

Top of page 7

Its still proposed, sounds like they are going to vote on it during the April 5th meeting?  But bet you it goes through if no vocal opposition

Offline Oh Mah

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Re: Proposed wording change for trap checking?
« Reply #4 on: March 26, 2019, 08:14:48 PM »
I'm new this year to trapping so bare with me but i think its the same wording is it not.
"Boss of the woods"
(this is in reference to the biggie not me).

Offline BigCutty3

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Re: Proposed wording change for trap checking?
« Reply #5 on: March 26, 2019, 08:17:33 PM »
I read it a bit more...sounds like WDFW staff is recommending moving forward with the change, saying it will "foster humane treatment and welfare of trapped furbearers and by catch animals"......last paragraph.

Summary of Public Comments Received During the Official Comment Period  WAC 220-417-030 Wild animal trapping.
 Supporting Comments: There were two (2) comments received in support of the proposed changes. One commenter suggested that traps should be checked every 12 hours instead of every 24 hours. 
 Opposing, Neutral, and Other Comments: There were four (4) comments received in opposition to the proposed changes. The common theme in the opposing comments was requesting a longer time period for checking restraining traps (live capture). The four opposing comments were as follows: One (1) suggested no change, One (1) suggested not to make things harder for users and allow more opportunities, Two (2) suggested longer trap check intervals (36 hours and 48 hours).
 Direction and Rationale: The department will move forward with the proposed changes to the Fish and Wildlife Commission. The 24 hour check of restraining traps was implied in the existing rule. The proposal is not changing the window of time that live capture traps must be checked but rather clarifying that it occurs every 24 hours. The proposed changes will foster humane treatment and welfare of trapped furbearers and by-catch animals (WAC 220-417-030).

Offline Fishhunt223

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Re: Proposed wording change for trap checking?
« Reply #6 on: March 26, 2019, 08:56:42 PM »
The current wording of the law does not specify a check time, it only states that an animal must not be restrained for longer than 24 hours.

How are “trap checks” being defined? If traps are checked from a distance with binoculars from a vehicle, is this acceptable?

I would also be curious how they would interpret the law in regard to electronic monitoring of traps. Many trappers are using wireless cameras or other electronic devices to monitor traps continuously, and may or may not have eyes on their traps every single day. Does a device like this fall under the definition of a trap check?

Offline Oh Mah

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Re: Proposed wording change for trap checking?
« Reply #7 on: March 26, 2019, 09:03:16 PM »
cant be restrained for more than 24 hours is in fact a check time.I'm not seeing any real change at all.  :dunno: what am i missing?Like i said i'm new.Humptulips told us in class that the wording was intentional to favor the trapper,If it is a real change in wording then i will assume it is to try and trap a trapper into mistakes.
"Boss of the woods"
(this is in reference to the biggie not me).

Offline Humptulips

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Re: Proposed wording change for trap checking?
« Reply #8 on: March 26, 2019, 09:05:41 PM »
This is the first I have heard about it and that in its self is a problem. More on that later.
The problem with the wording is it looks like we would be required to visit a trap every 24 hours. Other states have that language and it creates a hardship on trappers because to be legal you have to visit traps earlier every day. One may argue that it only requires once a day but the wording could be interpreted differently and in my experience DFW will interpret it in the most restrictive way.
Also there is no language that might take into account unforeseen circumstances such as a break down or even dangerous weather conditions. trappers might be the only user group required to risk their life to comply with the law.
The wording of the law now is ambiguous enough so that a trapper can stay in compliance while checking a trap at different times of the day.

Beyond that is the Departments unwillingness to work with user groups. They know my number and my e-mail and use it when they want something from me but when changing a law that effects trapping they have made no outreach to the Trappers Association plus they spring this right during trapping season. They know darn well trappers are trapping this time of year. It looks like an effort to hide this from us until it is too late to do anything about it. Plus, when ever I bring something up regarding trapping they tell me no changes can be made until the three year package comes up for renewal. This on the other hand has to happen now?
Why is DFW so unwilling to work with user groups?
Bruce Vandervort

Offline Oh Mah

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Re: Proposed wording change for trap checking?
« Reply #9 on: March 26, 2019, 09:09:41 PM »
After reading  :yeah: i see the difference now.It will be a way to make things harder on the trapping group.
"Boss of the woods"
(this is in reference to the biggie not me).

Offline Fishhunt223

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Re: Proposed wording change for trap checking?
« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2019, 09:30:52 PM »
Thanks for everything you do Bruce. This affects all of us. Please let us know if there is any way we can help.

Offline KFhunter

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Re: Proposed wording change for trap checking?
« Reply #11 on: March 26, 2019, 09:34:36 PM »
So if I get time stamped checking a trap at exactly 12:00 noon,  tomorrow I would have to check that trap before noon to make sure I comply, the new time stamp is 11:55am, then 11:50

but the 4th day I have to check a tad early because of a doctor appointment later on, so I'm out by 9:00 am.  Then 8:50 then 8:30 then then then next thing you know I gotta be checking traps in the wee hours of the morning.

Now I have to close the doors on the traps and pull bait to reset the clock, or I gotta maintain that earlier and earlier check times.


who knew trappers were so punctual? 

In reality there's going to be hangups and problems, and you might be a few minutes to hours late checking a trap and bingo bango you're time stamped going beyond your 24h check time.

It just adds more hassle and frustration to (legal) trapping  :bash:

Offline UrbanTrapper

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Re: Proposed wording change for trap checking?
« Reply #12 on: March 26, 2019, 10:03:11 PM »
You are correct KFHunter and that is one of the reasons the current law is worded as it is.

 This is clearly just meant to harass trappers, increase their 'marginal propensity to quit trapping, make it easier for WDFW officers to ticket trappers and open trappers up to additional prosecution. It's a real shame but it often really seems that WDFW has been captured/cowed by, and is taking its marching orders from the anti's. How hard would it be for WDFW to come up with something new that showed they actually SUPPORTED trappers and hunters, their paying customers, by making things a little EASIER for us?   

  If a cage trap is empty and the trapper doesn't manage to check in 24 hours, there was nothing inhumane done AT ALL but the trapper can still get ticketed.  Current law makes it illegal to LEAVE an animal in a cage trap trap for longer than 24 hours and that, if the intent is REALLY to be humane to animals, is how the law should stay.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2019, 10:55:42 PM by UrbanTrapper »

Offline lewy

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Re: Proposed wording change for trap checking?
« Reply #13 on: March 27, 2019, 05:54:31 AM »
What a crock is $hit! Heck a lot of the critters in my cages are sleeping when I show up!
Go hawks

Offline Humptulips

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Re: Proposed wording change for trap checking?
« Reply #14 on: March 27, 2019, 01:09:05 PM »
They will hang a trail cam up at your trap and when the camera shows a time stamp of 24 hours and 1 minute between your checks they will mail you a ticket.
Bruce Vandervort

 


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