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Author Topic: Taking away quality permits or general season  (Read 5607 times)

Offline Katmai Guy

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Re: Taking away quality permits or general season
« Reply #15 on: November 11, 2019, 12:29:22 PM »
No quality deer tags, general season for bucks 3 pt and smaller, permit for 4pt and bigger, doe tags to 65 and older and youths ,hunts run concurrent with larger windows between different weapon choice seasons.  All weapons same rules.  :twocents:
"Keep shootin, when there's lead in the air, there's hope"

Offline Skyvalhunter

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Re: Taking away quality permits or general season
« Reply #16 on: November 11, 2019, 01:01:18 PM »
What GMU's

Offline Bob33

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Re: Taking away quality permits or general season
« Reply #17 on: November 11, 2019, 01:12:10 PM »
How about you have to shoot a cougar this year to hunt deer or elk next year sort of thing? Or a bear or X many coyotes. Change the poaching reward to pick of any special draw tag instead of just points. Some off the cuff thoughts

Then only like 100 people would be able to hunt the next year.

Yep, that would thin the ranks!
Craigslist "Used coyote, like new!" ads will take off.
Nature. It's cheaper than therapy.

Offline Ironhead

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Re: Taking away quality permits or general season
« Reply #18 on: November 11, 2019, 01:30:05 PM »
If you're going to do it, do it right. General season Mule Deer should be permit only. There is a reason nearly every state in the West does it. We know Washington does a terrible job managing Fish and Wildlife already, the status quo is not working. Its time for a change!
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Offline mburrows

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Re: Taking away quality permits or general season
« Reply #19 on: November 11, 2019, 01:35:06 PM »
I wish WA would go the route of Colorado.  No general season but have several different seasons that had to be applied for.   :twocents:


Offline buckfvr

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Re: Taking away quality permits or general season
« Reply #20 on: November 11, 2019, 01:43:21 PM »
The 4pt minimum for whitetail here in the ne rapidly brought about increased success on better bucks.  WDFW has stopped posting the data from that time frame as it is damning for their agenda (high yield of young animals).  For those that say point restrictions dont work, that is the bs spread by wdfw even though they use point restrictions liberally in other areas.  I pointed it out to the head bio for ungulates as a question.....he said the dont work, I said then why is there a 3pt restriction for whitetail in the s.e. ?  Hmmmph  dunno.

All young bucks and does walk.  Youth and seniors get any buck.  Mule deer needs to go to resident draw or every other year.  Deer should go the way of elk......east/west tags. 

Wholesale changes need to be made but with maintaining as much opportunity to hunt as the primary goal.

Less opportunity, lower fees , way fewer special hunts, less confusing regs.  WIDE OPEN predator hunting.

Offline Rainier10

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Re: Taking away quality permits or general season
« Reply #21 on: November 11, 2019, 01:48:54 PM »
I have said this before and will say it again and probably get flamed for it but habitat loss is a huge issue.  There isn't enough good habitat for the amount of animals that we want so that more people can fill tags.  The habitat that is left will only hold so many animals and only allow so many animals to survive liberal seasons.  They have to have plenty of cover to escape the pressure and ensure their are more animals to hunt the next year.

Second and a very close second in my opinion is poaching, non native overharvest.  There are estimates that say that for every deer taken legally there are at least 3 others taken illegally.  That is a massive amount of deer that could be harvested by legal hunters.

I think these two should be addressed before limiting opportunity.  Unfortunately limiting opportunity is way easier than fixing the other two.
Pain is temporary, achieving the goal is worth it.

I didn't say it would be easy, I said it would be worth it.

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The views and opinions expressed in this post are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of HuntWa or the site owner.

Offline JakeLand

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Re: Taking away quality permits or general season
« Reply #22 on: November 11, 2019, 02:06:12 PM »
For deer pick east side or west side like elk and 2 point minimum on blacktail

Online skidynastar33

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Re: Taking away quality permits or general season
« Reply #23 on: November 11, 2019, 02:14:39 PM »
several thoughts and ideas?

1. What are we comparing herd size too?
-  I think we all probably compare herd sizes to when they were at record highs vs comparing to what would be a healthy herd size for the landscape.
- also deer use the landscape differently. They adjust to pressure, predators, ect. So stating things like ďI have done this hunted this one spot for 20years and this is the lowest herd size Iíve ever seenĒ may not add much value because deer can use the landscape differently.

2. Habitat
- this is the most important of all. Deer need places to live. How do we protect existing habitat? Or do we create more?

3. Do we want Washington to be more of a quality hunting state?  Or opportunity?
I think it needs to be a opportunity state. Look at California. We need all the hunters we can or we will be out voted of hunter opportunity.

How then do we manage wildlife while creating opportunity
- no doe tags in areas that need to grow herd size
- I think permit only is a bad idea for this state. There are other ways to limit pressure instead.
- you have to choose a unit? Mule deer, black tail, or whitetail only? While ideas like this are kinda painful. I think itís a good middle ground that keep opportunity high.
- late tags, I donít see a reason to eliminate? I think you can adjust tag numbers up and down without going to 0. Go from 15 tags to 5, ect. Shooting 5 big bucks in a unit is not going to make a huge difference in the bigger picture. But will keep money flowing into wildlife.

4. Wildlife need our money, I donít think blaming wdfw for everything solves anything.
- also there are a ton of great biologists that manage these wildlife for what best for the wildlife.
- biologist donít care about how big of a buck you shoot, and they shouldnít care for it. They should be focused on the health of the herd.

Offline ljsommer

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Re: Taking away quality permits or general season
« Reply #24 on: November 11, 2019, 02:26:04 PM »
I have said this before and will say it again and probably get flamed for it but habitat loss is a huge issue.  There isn't enough good habitat for the amount of animals that we want so that more people can fill tags.  The habitat that is left will only hold so many animals and only allow so many animals to survive liberal seasons.  They have to have plenty of cover to escape the pressure and ensure their are more animals to hunt the next year.

Second and a very close second in my opinion is poaching, non native overharvest.  There are estimates that say that for every deer taken legally there are at least 3 others taken illegally.  That is a massive amount of deer that could be harvested by legal hunters.

I think these two should be addressed before limiting opportunity.  Unfortunately limiting opportunity is way easier than fixing the other two.

I have two questions: where was the 1/3 number sourced from regarding poaching? That seems extremely high.
Second, let's say a state did have rampant poaching, and did have resources available (as we do), what can be done to effectively combat poaching, given how distributed the wilds are and how thin our game wardens are spread? How do you stop poaching?

Offline buckfvr

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Re: Taking away quality permits or general season
« Reply #25 on: November 11, 2019, 02:30:33 PM »
Hunters are just 2% of the population so we are horribly out voted........wdfw IS at fault for the condition of our herds and our predators.....make no mistake about it.  The great bios and managers do what they have to to keep their jobs and their future pensions.....that is first and foremost on their minds.  Everyone is in step with the political agenda of the governor and his constituents.....make no mistakes about that.

We have been railroaded down the wrong path for 50 years I know of and the last 20 being the most damaging. 

There wont be a miracle fix and there wont be an easy fast one, but again......wdfw cowtowing to the governor is by far the biggest problem.

Offline Bob33

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Re: Taking away quality permits or general season
« Reply #26 on: November 11, 2019, 02:34:51 PM »
Everyone is in step with the political agenda of the governor and his constituents.....make no mistakes about that.
That's amazing. You know every single biologist for WDFW and his political agendas.
Nature. It's cheaper than therapy.

Offline TriggerMike

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Re: Taking away quality permits or general season
« Reply #27 on: November 11, 2019, 02:44:44 PM »
I would be for having to choose blacktail, muley or whitetail over just an east/west tag for 5 or so years and no anterless except for close to metro areas to reduce collisions, etc. They should probably reduce the number of multi season tags by a few thousand as well during that time period. And this is coming from a guy who lives on the Westside, hunted all 3 sub-species this year and shot a whitetail buck yesterday in the NE corner after having hunted most days of the blacktail season. It would suck to limit opportunity for a while but would be worth it down the road, at least for a few years. Someone else mentioned this won't matter though if other changes aren't made as well because we'll just keep coming back to this same issue and I agree with that. I also believe that plan would be for nothing if there isn't a solution brought on, and SOON, for the growing predator populations.

Offline buckfvr

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Re: Taking away quality permits or general season
« Reply #28 on: November 11, 2019, 02:45:05 PM »
If you arent in step and keep your mouth shut, you are in step.

Offline Rainier10

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Re: Taking away quality permits or general season
« Reply #29 on: November 11, 2019, 03:03:12 PM »
I have said this before and will say it again and probably get flamed for it but habitat loss is a huge issue.  There isn't enough good habitat for the amount of animals that we want so that more people can fill tags.  The habitat that is left will only hold so many animals and only allow so many animals to survive liberal seasons.  They have to have plenty of cover to escape the pressure and ensure their are more animals to hunt the next year.

Second and a very close second in my opinion is poaching, non native overharvest.  There are estimates that say that for every deer taken legally there are at least 3 others taken illegally.  That is a massive amount of deer that could be harvested by legal hunters.

I think these two should be addressed before limiting opportunity.  Unfortunately limiting opportunity is way easier than fixing the other two.

I have two questions: where was the 1/3 number sourced from regarding poaching? That seems extremely high.
Second, let's say a state did have rampant poaching, and did have resources available (as we do), what can be done to effectively combat poaching, given how distributed the wilds are and how thin our game wardens are spread? How do you stop poaching?
Here is an article that talks about poaching taking more animals than legal harvest and the issue with stopping it.  Even if you arrest someone they know they aren't going to be prosecuted to the fullest extent so they get off easy and keep doing it.

https://www.kuow.org/stories/northwest-poachers-rarely-caught-and-lightly-punished
Pain is temporary, achieving the goal is worth it.

I didn't say it would be easy, I said it would be worth it.

Every father should remember that one day his children will follow his example instead of his advice.


The views and opinions expressed in this post are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of HuntWa or the site owner.

 


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