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Author Topic: Commercial Gill Nets Target BASS in Lake WA  (Read 7141 times)

Offline Angry Perch

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Re: Commercial Gill Nets Target BASS in Lake WA
« Reply #60 on: April 20, 2021, 08:32:39 AM »
FYI, this is what 2400 yards of net looks like on Lake Washington.

Offline Stein

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Re: Commercial Gill Nets Target BASS in Lake WA
« Reply #61 on: April 20, 2021, 08:52:56 AM »
They should get much stronger nets and run them right below the locks.  That would make a difference in salmon mortality for sure.

Offline AKBowman

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Re: Commercial Gill Nets Target BASS in Lake WA
« Reply #62 on: April 20, 2021, 09:18:50 AM »
FYI, this is what 2400 yards of net looks like on Lake Washington.

Yes but no. Check out the article in my original post. It has an outline of exactly where the nets were placed. They are being extremely strategic about where the nets are placed and when they are placed there.

Plus think about that line being moved around the lake 5 days per week for 2 months. That’s like moving your line around the lake to 40 different strategic locations. There is nothing random about where these are placed.

It will make a big hit on the population but not wipe it out. Regardless the science isn’t there. Heck what if the Perch are actually killing more salmon smolt then the bass. The bass eat the Perch so if they are going to go straight off of theory then this netting could actually make things worse for the smolt survival.
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Offline Angry Perch

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Re: Commercial Gill Nets Target BASS in Lake WA
« Reply #63 on: April 20, 2021, 09:40:43 AM »
FYI, this is what 2400 yards of net looks like on Lake Washington.

Yes but no. Check out the article in my original post. It has an outline of exactly where the nets were placed. They are being extremely strategic about where the nets are placed and when they are placed there.

Plus think about that line being moved around the lake 5 days per week for 2 months. That’s like moving your line around the lake to 40 different strategic locations. There is nothing random about where these are placed.

It will make a big hit on the population but not wipe it out. Regardless the science isn’t there. Heck what if the Perch are actually killing more salmon smolt then the bass. The bass eat the Perch so if they are going to go straight off of theory then this netting could actually make things worse for the smolt survival.

The map looks bass ackwards to me, but maybe that's why I suck at catching smallmouth! I'd think there would be more movement between deep and shallow (east-west on that map), and that they'd have the nets parallel to the shoreline.

Offline duckmen1

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Re: Commercial Gill Nets Target BASS in Lake WA
« Reply #64 on: April 20, 2021, 09:50:17 AM »
First off dude my post also say that I am not in denial of bass predation. Thats pretty obvious. I have also said that if multiple management practices are done sure have at it. All I have said repeatedly is that we won't see a sockeye fishery due to solely netting of bass.

 Dude? How old are you? :chuckle:

 “Multiple management practices” begin somewhere. Again, you presume this is “the one step fix all”, as you continue to rail on about it. Please point out where ANYONE has suggested this!

 Secondly, I never said this would bring back the sockeye fishery, another “assumption” of yours.

 You should know there are other species of salmon that run through the lake. The silver fishing is quite good and we limit regularly when they run. ;)

 Carry on Dude! :tup:

If the Silver run is quite good with regular limitsI guess they are doing good. Sockeye fisheries have struggled and there are no fisheries in there anymore. So that is where my focus turns to on lake Washington. But lets back up a little. Go back over to lake Sammamish. Where you out talking to the tribe out at the state park in the boat they had there. I was. It was said by them that this was a one step fix all for the Kings that run up Issaquah Creek. Yeah even after netting took place I looked at Hatchery escapement reports and such and actually did some research on it. Didn't just get onto a forum and run my mouth about something I new nothing about. Ill post up a couple years of reports. Reports are documents of actual data. Not just me running my mouth. So far we have seen a decrease in Salmon after netting and poor warmwater fisheries in return on Sammamish. Just saying. Although it does take time to rebound. So give it a few years and remember the discussing we are all having about how this would "fix" the salmon runs. I am done with this topic. Pics show 2008 well when there was a fantastic bass fishery. To current report well when the bass fishery went to trash at Sammamish.

And the nets will spread all throughout areas of lake washington and rotated to more areas throughout the season as bass transition. So it won't be a 1 line along an Island pic. That's kinda lime saying hey a river is only 50 yards wide. But the river runs 50 river miles. But they only want to use 1 50 yard net on a 50 mile river. I know that's a math equation but let's pull out our math skills. Lol
« Last Edit: April 20, 2021, 09:56:05 AM by duckmen1 »

Offline Special T

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Re: Commercial Gill Nets Target BASS in Lake WA
« Reply #65 on: April 20, 2021, 10:25:11 AM »
I see this netting being consistant with the Tribes past actions of actually embracing predator control. Will this one thing of reducing bass make a difference? I doubt it.

What I do know us that the WDFW won't be the tip of the spear when it comes to predator control. The Tribes will in large part because the Animal Rights organizations fear them and wont attack them like they will the WDFW.

Some have mentioned doing something about the seals by the locks... dont you think the Tribes have a better chance at adressing this issue than the department? How about reinstating a second bag limit for Mergansers during Duck season?  Or how about dealing with the massive ammounts of Cormorants? (I have heard rumor that a couple of tribes have been doing thier part on the DL....


Im personally not happy that salmon seem to dictate all things in this state. Most of us have bitched and moaned about all manner of predators. Would I prefer that the Tribes focus thier efforst else where? Sure! The fact is that ALL predators need management.

As to the fact that the Tribes have not shared salmon data... be it the recruitment they think they will get from flooding the Farmed Island, or the ammount of Fry the bass eat.  I WISH they shared the data with the public. As consumptive users we share a similar goal. It should be plainly obvious that they dont trust the wdfw... nor are they especially concerned with our oppinion... lots of uniformed ones on here, and not that anyone seems to make that easier by not sharing the data...

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Offline Platensek-po

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Re: Commercial Gill Nets Target BASS in Lake WA
« Reply #66 on: April 20, 2021, 10:38:02 AM »
Man this topic is kind of sad to me. Why do so many people care about bass in western wa? You can catch bass in what? 49 states? You can only catch pacific salmon in 4 or 5. And the way it’s going soon you won’t be able to catch them anywhere but in one state. There are literally thousands and thousands of places to catch bass and it’s rising. Salmon have specific habitats that they need or they don’t survive. Bunch of crybabies on here worried about what a tribe is doing to try and save a resource that they have been using for some 14k years. Yet you guys think bass should be considered native cause some dumbbell introduces them 100yrs ago? A lot needs to be done to save salmon and IMO it’s already probably to late. Rising temps in the sound and how our rain patterns are now in the fall will probably do them in along with everything else. Does that mean we should just give up and all fish for bass? Yuck. Do you guys not want to see future generations at least be able to see salmon runs? If you love spiny ray fish you can literally fish for them just about anywhere. Go for it. But if it comes to competing with salmon or steelhead then I see no argument as to why you would ever ever possibly think that spiny rays fish need any kind of protection. How many of you actually eat bass anyway? Gross.
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Offline Angry Perch

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Re: Commercial Gill Nets Target BASS in Lake WA
« Reply #67 on: April 20, 2021, 10:53:20 AM »
First off dude my post also say that I am not in denial of bass predation. Thats pretty obvious. I have also said that if multiple management practices are done sure have at it. All I have said repeatedly is that we won't see a sockeye fishery due to solely netting of bass.

 Dude? How old are you? :chuckle:

 “Multiple management practices” begin somewhere. Again, you presume this is “the one step fix all”, as you continue to rail on about it. Please point out where ANYONE has suggested this!

 Secondly, I never said this would bring back the sockeye fishery, another “assumption” of yours.

 You should know there are other species of salmon that run through the lake. The silver fishing is quite good and we limit regularly when they run. ;)

 Carry on Dude! :tup:

If the Silver run is quite good with regular limitsI guess they are doing good. Sockeye fisheries have struggled and there are no fisheries in there anymore. So that is where my focus turns to on lake Washington. But lets back up a little. Go back over to lake Sammamish. Where you out talking to the tribe out at the state park in the boat they had there. I was. It was said by them that this was a one step fix all for the Kings that run up Issaquah Creek. Yeah even after netting took place I looked at Hatchery escapement reports and such and actually did some research on it. Didn't just get onto a forum and run my mouth about something I new nothing about. Ill post up a couple years of reports. Reports are documents of actual data. Not just me running my mouth. So far we have seen a decrease in Salmon after netting and poor warmwater fisheries in return on Sammamish. Just saying. Although it does take time to rebound. So give it a few years and remember the discussing we are all having about how this would "fix" the salmon runs. I am done with this topic. Pics show 2008 well when there was a fantastic bass fishery. To current report well when the bass fishery went to trash at Sammamish.

And the nets will spread all throughout areas of lake washington and rotated to more areas throughout the season as bass transition. So it won't be a 1 line along an Island pic. That's kinda lime saying hey a river is only 50 yards wide. But the river runs 50 river miles. But they only want to use 1 50 yard net on a 50 mile river. I know that's a math equation but let's pull out our math skills. Lol

It was just for scale. My point is, it's a gigantic lake. But your comparison to a 50 yard net in a 50 yard wide river is silly. But...math.

Offline AKBowman

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Re: Commercial Gill Nets Target BASS in Lake WA
« Reply #68 on: April 20, 2021, 11:02:11 AM »
The mail was put in the Sockeye coffin long ago for Lake WA when man completely altered the lake. There’s nothing native about how salmon enter and exit the lake now anyhow. Combined with literally every home on the lake shore having a large dock, light and other pollution all along the smolt migration route, etc.


I think a lot of the beef with this from most people is more about a single special interest group being allowed to mess with a public sport fishery without prior public approval to do so. Not so much about Bass VS Salmon.

That being said the bass we’re doing amazingly well in the lake. Lake WA was a top 100 bass lake in the US and top 16 bass lake in the West. But let’s wipe out the bass for no scientific reasoning just so this special interest group can have access to more fish they claim to have rights to. Mind you these “native” fish are being produced through state funded and state run hatcheries.

Like myself and others have said the chances of any sport fishery having access to any successful sockeye or Chinook run recovery is laughable. What will happen if there is excess is they will be netted under “subsistence” regulations then commercially sold that same day for a PROFIT.

The whole process is a PATHETIC
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Offline Stein

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Re: Commercial Gill Nets Target BASS in Lake WA
« Reply #69 on: April 20, 2021, 11:09:01 AM »
There were docks and locks when the last bumper return of sockeye happened.  I'm not ready to write it off as a lost cause.  It certainly needs a ton of help, but it could happen.

In addition to bass, they are trying to locate, remove and figure out how many pike are in the lake.  Getting the pike out of there would help all of the fish people want to chase with the exception of pike I suppose.

Offline duckmen1

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Re: Commercial Gill Nets Target BASS in Lake WA
« Reply #70 on: April 20, 2021, 11:09:59 AM »
First off dude my post also say that I am not in denial of bass predation. Thats pretty obvious. I have also said that if multiple management practices are done sure have at it. All I have said repeatedly is that we won't see a sockeye fishery due to solely netting of bass.

 Dude? How old are you? :chuckle:

 “Multiple management practices” begin somewhere. Again, you presume this is “the one step fix all”, as you continue to rail on about it. Please point out where ANYONE has suggested this!

 Secondly, I never said this would bring back the sockeye fishery, another “assumption” of yours.

 You should know there are other species of salmon that run through the lake. The silver fishing is quite good and we limit regularly when they run. ;)

 Carry on Dude! :tup:

If the Silver run is quite good with regular limitsI guess they are doing good. Sockeye fisheries have struggled and there are no fisheries in there anymore. So that is where my focus turns to on lake Washington. But lets back up a little. Go back over to lake Sammamish. Where you out talking to the tribe out at the state park in the boat they had there. I was. It was said by them that this was a one step fix all for the Kings that run up Issaquah Creek. Yeah even after netting took place I looked at Hatchery escapement reports and such and actually did some research on it. Didn't just get onto a forum and run my mouth about something I new nothing about. Ill post up a couple years of reports. Reports are documents of actual data. Not just me running my mouth. So far we have seen a decrease in Salmon after netting and poor warmwater fisheries in return on Sammamish. Just saying. Although it does take time to rebound. So give it a few years and remember the discussing we are all having about how this would "fix" the salmon runs. I am done with this topic. Pics show 2008 well when there was a fantastic bass fishery. To current report well when the bass fishery went to trash at Sammamish.

And the nets will spread all throughout areas of lake washington and rotated to more areas throughout the season as bass transition. So it won't be a 1 line along an Island pic. That's kinda lime saying hey a river is only 50 yards wide. But the river runs 50 river miles. But they only want to use 1 50 yard net on a 50 mile river. I know that's a math equation but let's pull out our math skills. Lol

It was just for scale. My point is, it's a gigantic lake. But your comparison to a 50 yard net in a 50 yard wide river is silly. But...math.

My point is a valid point though. Those 24 100yard long nets will be spread out amongst the lake and throughout the lake. Along different sections of the lake and rotated around for months. Will have a big impact on that fishery. Not as small of an impact as that map portrays. Just saying. But it really don't matter take that fishery down and again see no difference as my documents are showing from the hatchery.

But on a positive note yes at least these groups don't have a say on matters the tribe does as the wdfw can't do anything because of these anti groups. So maybe just maybe it will show more of a light to push for more practices to combine with this netting and then hopefully we will see higher returns.

Offline Tbar

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Re: Commercial Gill Nets Target BASS in Lake WA
« Reply #71 on: April 20, 2021, 11:23:42 AM »
The mail was put in the Sockeye coffin long ago for Lake WA when man completely altered the lake. There’s nothing native about how salmon enter and exit the lake now anyhow. Combined with literally every home on the lake shore having a large dock, light and other pollution all along the smolt migration route, etc.


I think a lot of the beef with this from most people is more about a single special interest group being allowed to mess with a public sport fishery without prior public approval to do so. Not so much about Bass VS Salmon.

That being said the bass we’re doing amazingly well in the lake. Lake WA was a top 100 bass lake in the US and top 16 bass lake in the West. But let’s wipe out the bass for no scientific reasoning just so this special interest group can have access to more fish they claim to have rights to. Mind you these “native” fish are being produced through state funded and state run hatcheries.

Like myself and others have said the chances of any sport fishery having access to any successful sockeye or Chinook run recovery is laughable. What will happen if there is excess is they will be netted under “subsistence” regulations then commercially sold that same day for a PROFIT.

The whole process is a PATHETIC
You have a tremendous misunderstanding of life.  In addition to the misunderstanding you show a lack of willingness to educate yourself or even learn.

Offline Angry Perch

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Re: Commercial Gill Nets Target BASS in Lake WA
« Reply #72 on: April 20, 2021, 11:31:16 AM »
I think it's interesting to discuss "native" anything in a waterway that is so far removed from it's natural state. I never really studied the history of Lake Washington, or heard of the Black River, which was the only way in for Salmon prior to the Montlake cut and ship canal. Pretty interesting for anyone like me that hadn't really looked into it. 

Offline Angry Perch

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Re: Commercial Gill Nets Target BASS in Lake WA
« Reply #73 on: April 20, 2021, 11:40:14 AM »
Certainly not your typical salmon run, in or out.


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Re: Commercial Gill Nets Target BASS in Lake WA
« Reply #74 on: April 20, 2021, 12:02:36 PM »
FYI, this is what 2400 yards of net looks like on Lake Washington.

Yes but no. Check out the article in my original post. It has an outline of exactly where the nets were placed. They are being extremely strategic about where the nets are placed and when they are placed there.

Plus think about that line being moved around the lake 5 days per week for 2 months. That’s like moving your line around the lake to 40 different strategic locations. There is nothing random about where these are placed.

It will make a big hit on the population but not wipe it out. Regardless the science isn’t there. Heck what if the Perch are actually killing more salmon smolt then the bass. The bass eat the Perch so if they are going to go straight off of theory then this netting could actually make things worse for the smolt survival.

https://depts.washington.edu/oldenlab/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/ReviewsFisheriesScience_2011.pdf

Look at the charts here. Some are showing salmon are up to 50% of the bass' diet in certain places. The study concludes that bass can have a dramatic effect on salmon and steelhead runs.

I believe that the OP is likely a dedicated bass fisherman, while he may indeed fish for other species including salmonids. I spent decades pursuing only bass for catch and release fishing. I get it. Being a bass fisherman, he's upset this species is being singled out for removal (fair?). But they're not being singled out. The WDFW and tribes have been aggressively targeting several invasive species which affect the salmonids - pike minnow, walleye, smallmouth and largemouth bass, musky.

I think it's a good thing and they're not going far enough. Why not also single out the sea lions? They should be killing them wherever they see them upstream from Astoria. I believe that combining all of these efforts could have a dramatic positive effect on salmonid populations.
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