Post by: cboom on July 13, 2012, 09:17:27 PM
Post by: DoubleJ on July 13, 2012, 09:22:48 PM
Post by: DoubleJ on July 13, 2012, 09:26:36 PM
Post by: DoubleJ on July 13, 2012, 09:35:09 PM
Dairy Products
Chicken
Lamb
Fish,
Chicken Eggs
Corn
Wheat
Soy
There's the list from most common to least common
Kirkland puppy food ingredient list:
chicken, chicken meal, whole grain brown rice, cracked pearled barley, egg product, chicken fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols and vitamin E), dried beet pulp, potatoes, fish meal, flaxseed, natural flavor, brewers dried yeast, salmon oil (a source of DHA), millet, potassium chloride, salt, choline chloride, carrots, peas, kelp, apples, cranberry powder, rosemary extract, parsley flake, dried chicory root, vitamin E supplement, iron proteinate, zinc proteinate, copper proteinate, ferrous sulfate, zinc sulfate, copper sulfate, potassium iodide, thiamine mononitrate, manganese proteinate, manganous oxide, ascorbic acid, vitamin A supplement, biotin, niacin, calcium pantothenate, manganese sulfate, sodium selenite, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), vitamin B12 supplement, riboflavin, vitamin D supplement, folic acid.
Blue Buffalo large breed puppy chicken and brown rice list (You didn't say what flavor you got):
Deboned Chicken,
Chicken Meal,
Whole Ground Barley,
Whole Ground Brown Rice,
Oatmeal,
Tomato Pomace (source of Lycopene),
Natural Chicken Flavor,
Chicken Fat (preserved with Mixed Tocopherols),
Whole Potatoes,
Peas,
Flaxseed (source of Omega 3 and 6 Fatty Acids),
Whole Carrots,
Whole Sweet Potatoes,
Blueberries,
Cranberries,
Barley Grass,
Dried Parsley,
Garlic,
Alfalfa Meal,
Dried Kelp,
Yucca Schidigera Extract,
L-Carnitine,
L-Lysine,
Turmeric,
Dried Chicory Root,
Oil of Rosemary,
Vitamin A Supplement,
Thiamine Mononitrate (Vitamin B1),
Riboflavin (Vitamin B2),
Niacin (Vitamin B3),
d-Calcium Pantothenate (Vitamin B5),
Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B6),
Beta Carotene,
Biotin (Vitamin B7),
Folic Acid (Vitamin B9),
Vitamin B12 Supplement,
Vitamin D3 Supplement,
Vitamin E Supplement,
Iron Amino Acid Chelate,
Zinc Amino Acid Chelate,
Manganese Amino Acid Chelate,
Copper Amino Acid Chelate,
Calcium Ascorbate (source of Vitamin C),
Sodium Selenite,
Choline Chloride,
Calcium Iodate,
Caramel,
Salt,
Potassium Chloride,
Dried Yeast (source of Saccharomyces cerevisiae),
Dried Lactobacillus acidophilus fermentation product,
Dried Bacillus subtilis fermentation product,
Dried Enterococcus faecium fermentation product
Post by: DoubleJ on July 13, 2012, 09:38:54 PM
Post by: bobcat on July 13, 2012, 10:02:28 PM
Post by: DoubleJ on July 13, 2012, 10:04:23 PM
Post by: DoubleJ on July 13, 2012, 10:05:11 PM
I always try to give my dog as much "people" food as I can. You never really know what kind of crap is in that dog food. So I try to give my dog a lot of our leftover chicken, deer steak, elk steak, hamburger, whatever. As long as it's real meat it's gotta be better than any dog food. I figure the less dog food I give her, the healthier she should be. I do use Kirkland brand dog food and have never had a problem.
This too. If I could, my dogs would eat a raw meat diet only. Best food for them is their natural diet. Too much money for me though with 2 100lb dogs
Post by: Stilly bay on July 13, 2012, 10:12:55 PM
If your dog comes across something its allergic to it could take up to three months for it to work just one exposure out of its system, so if you don't get an instant fix don't give up or change what your doing unless this get worse -going to the vet is always a good idea.
this is the main reason why allergy screenings are worth their weight in gold, it can take forever and a fortune in different dog foods to isolate a problem on your own, mean while your dog has chewed its arse bald.
I just switched from kirkland ( diamond) to purina pro plan performace because of all the recall, Diamond is cheap enough, and my dogs do pretty good on it, but that company just can't seem to get things right with all those recalls.
Post by: wraithen on July 14, 2012, 11:06:52 AM
Post by: bobcat on July 14, 2012, 01:11:47 PM
Post by: MadHatter on July 14, 2012, 01:52:15 PM
When rabbit is not in season I use the Kirkland wet food and pedigree dry food.
Post by: singleshot12 on July 14, 2012, 02:06:21 PM
Post by: DoubleJ on July 14, 2012, 02:28:55 PM
http://www.vetmed.wsu.edu/cliented/salmon.aspx (http://www.vetmed.wsu.edu/cliented/salmon.aspx)
Post by: bobcat on July 14, 2012, 02:32:14 PM
Post by: DoubleJ on July 14, 2012, 02:37:46 PM
Post by: ORCA_SIX on July 16, 2012, 04:40:58 AM
I actually feed rabbit to my dogs until I run out, I just boil them up, put them bones and all through the grinder... Dogs were really healthy for a few months when it was rabbit season as we have hundreds of them around the house...
When rabbit is not in season I use the Kirkland wet food and pedigree dry food.
When do you go rabbit hunting in that area? PM me if you are willing to share some good info.
Post by: Camp David on July 16, 2012, 05:29:54 AM
Post by: 10Key on July 16, 2012, 09:28:36 AM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on July 16, 2012, 10:29:41 AM
Last recall was really small and it was salmonella. Salmonella can rarely do more to a dog than give it the chits for a day if anything. The recall was more to protect it from being spread to the people who handle the dog food.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on July 16, 2012, 05:39:59 PM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on July 17, 2012, 09:29:04 AM
Basically, they have a percentage they can swing batch to batch. Dog food companies can completely change formulas and don't have to re-label the product for 6 months.
There is no difference in smell, kibble size, look, feel....etc. They still need the small boutique stores to be able to convince someone to pay $15 more for the same thing.
The kennel here goes through about 7-10 bags a week. Other brands costing a lot more money have been fed and performance, look, energy level etc was not better. 12 master hunter titles, 8 Senior hunter titles and 6-7 show Champions in 2012 all eating on it can't be all that wrong.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on July 17, 2012, 10:26:13 AM
Happy I'm not trying to say Natures Domain is a bad food at all. All I was saying is it is not the same as TOTW. a quick look at the ingredient list will tell you that.
for 1% protein difference. The food is from the same batch.
when it comes to dog food, i'd be willing to bet, if we visited the factory, there would be zero difference in salmon meal and "salmon"... your dog aint getting a filet of fish here. All this stuff is 50gallon tubs of processed goo and powder.. mixed, extruded and dried.
Post by: runamuk on July 17, 2012, 11:03:37 AM
meat meal is usually mixed meats.....chicken meal vs chicken the meal is actually more nutritious same goes for lamb vs lamb meal and salmon vs salmon meal meal includes bones skin fat etc which contains lots of things carnivores need. what you dont want is corn, soy, wheat as your first ingredients its just cheap filler and makes your dog crap big piles :dunno:
read labels dont rely on names and advertising or what the vet carries some of those are just full of fillers and cost way more than they should.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on July 17, 2012, 11:16:23 AM
A meat and a meat meal product are two different things. And this is not the only difference in the the two products. Look at the order of the ingredients lists, there are many differences. And TOTW have ingredients like smoked salmon that ND do not have.
The only reason I point this out is because I didn't want the guy asking if they were the same running out buying ND thinking it was on bad information. The foods are similar, but not the same.
Its made at the same place, by the same company. It looks exactly the same, smells exactly the same and comes in exactly the same bag with different writing. Knowing that dog food companies can change ingredients without changing the label is telling me that they leave certain little differences so they can make and charge a higher price and have folks believe it will make a difference in the performance or appearance of their dog.
THere have probably been more field champions, show champions and hall of fame dogs fed old-school purina with lots of corn filler than there have been in the last few years of the anti-corn in food craze....just sayin'...
Post by: Stilly bay on July 18, 2012, 10:57:02 AM
THere have probably been more field champions, show champions and hall of fame dogs fed old-school purina with lots of corn filler than there have been in the last few years of the anti-corn in food craze....just sayin'...
thats kinda like saying more deer have been killed through primitive archery equipment than firearms.
old school purina has been around for a very long time and has the one of the largest customer bases- people tend to stick with what works for them but that doesn't mean its the best food out there. it was one time viewed as the best mainly because of its ad campaign. information and education on dog food is a relatively new thing as well, up until recently the vast majority of dog owners that weren't feeding cheap went off of hearsay or what their vet recommended.
also...
a trainer/trialer isn't going to spring for blue buffalo when he has a couple dozen of his clients dogs to feed. that doesn't mean higher quality foods don't factor into success, health or stamina.
FWIW I am not saying purina is bad food or even mediocre, Its what I feed my dogs- just without the corn filler.
Post by: runamuk on July 18, 2012, 11:14:49 AM
for the record I had the worst luck with more dogs of more breeds on science diet than any other brand out there including ol roy, science diet seemed to be a guaranteed give the dog the craps food and most of their formulas include corn as a primary ingredient so cost does not determine whats in a dog food....read the labels....investigate......and if whats working is working for crying out loud don't fix what isn't broke no matter who tells you that you should.
Post by: DoubleJ on July 18, 2012, 11:14:54 AM
A meat and a meat meal product are two different things. And this is not the only difference in the the two products. Look at the order of the ingredients lists, there are many differences. And TOTW have ingredients like smoked salmon that ND do not have.
The only reason I point this out is because I didn't want the guy asking if they were the same running out buying ND thinking it was on bad information. The foods are similar, but not the same.
The real meat vs. meal debate is for wet food only. Real meat as the #1 ingredient means nothing in dry food since, well, it's dry and looses it's weight. Ingredient lists for dog food is listed in order of weight When real meat is listed as #1 ingredient, it can more accurately be called the 2nd or even 3rd ingredient since, when dehydrated, it looses most of it's weight. You actually want some form of meat meal as the #1 ingredient since it's dry when added so you get the actual weight of the ingredient. It may not be all white meat chicken breast or whatever but, I'd rather have more of a "2nd tier" meat, which like Run says, is packed with bone and skin providing things like calcium and oils needed by carnivores, than quite a bit less of a prime meat.
Post by: wraithen on July 18, 2012, 02:19:32 PM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on July 18, 2012, 09:32:22 PM
I have had plenty of dogs that could eat corn based diets, however have had 2 dogs severely allergic to corn, hence why i dont support any specific brand of dog food and say read labels. I will say no creature is designed to digest corn no human, carnivore or herbivore fully utilizes corn most extract some sugar and the rest is waste so corn= poop, if you like/dont mind scooping poo and your dog maintains weight, health, and coat on corn based diets I say go for it. Of course corn also poisoned a bunch of dogs when it got an ergot in a batch....believe it was a diamond plant....
for the record I had the worst luck with more dogs of more breeds on science diet than any other brand out there including ol roy, science diet seemed to be a guaranteed give the dog the craps food and most of their formulas include corn as a primary ingredient so cost does not determine whats in a dog food....read the labels....investigate......and if whats working is working for crying out loud don't fix what isn't broke no matter who tells you that you should.
try feeding a super high protein diet......that doesn't work either...dogs need fat and carbs just like us. People get caught up in feeding high protein content food and all their dogs do is chit it all out because their bodies cannot process it. High protein does not equal higher quality food like some companies try to get people to believe. Many dogs can't put weight on because they are eating to high pro diet. They need lower protein and higher fat content. A lot of guys want to think their super dogs are like weight lifters and are going to get all ripped because they eat the highest protein food and run alot.
Post by: runamuk on July 18, 2012, 09:44:58 PM
I have had plenty of dogs that could eat corn based diets, however have had 2 dogs severely allergic to corn, hence why i dont support any specific brand of dog food and say read labels. I will say no creature is designed to digest corn no human, carnivore or herbivore fully utilizes corn most extract some sugar and the rest is waste so corn= poop, if you like/dont mind scooping poo and your dog maintains weight, health, and coat on corn based diets I say go for it. Of course corn also poisoned a bunch of dogs when it got an ergot in a batch....believe it was a diamond plant....
for the record I had the worst luck with more dogs of more breeds on science diet than any other brand out there including ol roy, science diet seemed to be a guaranteed give the dog the craps food and most of their formulas include corn as a primary ingredient so cost does not determine whats in a dog food....read the labels....investigate......and if whats working is working for crying out loud don't fix what isn't broke no matter who tells you that you should.
try feeding a super high protein diet......that doesn't work either...dogs need fat and carbs just like us. People get caught up in feeding high protein content food and all their dogs do is chit it all out because their bodies cannot process it. High protein does not equal higher quality food like some companies try to get people to believe. Many dogs can't put weight on because they are eating to high pro diet. They need lower protein and higher fat content. A lot of guys want to think their super dogs are like weight lifters and are going to get all ripped because they eat the highest protein food and run alot.
exactly balance is the key just like us, and with dogs if a diet is working then I say leave it be :tup: again I have fed everything from ol roy to strictly raw meat and everything in between, dogs with allergies are becoming a major problem but then so are people something is going into our food to make this happen is my thinking. If a dog clears up quickly after changing the diet then allergy is likely and read those labels so you can find the culprit and avoid it :dunno:
why do we make diet and exercise so difficult...its easy feed a moderate diet and get those dogs out for a walk or swim, the same principles that work for us, all the supplements in the world wont fix an overall broken diet and exercise routine :dunno: they will mask some symptoms for a while but eventually it will catch up with you, why would our animals be any different.
Post by: rosscrazyelk on September 04, 2012, 08:28:48 PM
Post by: akirkland on September 05, 2012, 08:33:50 PM
Post by: zeke7111 on December 31, 2013, 04:20:31 PM
Post by: WRL on December 31, 2013, 04:56:00 PM
Its possible, that the protein level is too high for the people that tried it for their dogs.
I don't feed anything with corn it in because it is often an ingredient that causes allergic reactions.
I have never had any issue with Kirkland brand dog foods for MY DOGS.
Another thing people forget to look at, is the protein to fat ratio. The "large breed" puppy and lots of "grain free" foods lack fat which could be why certain dogs do better on it.
And Iams, in my opinion is junk since splitting years ago from Eukanuba.
WRL
Post by: wildweeds on December 31, 2013, 06:01:03 PM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on January 01, 2014, 12:02:58 AM
I don't know anyone who feeds performance dogs Iams personally but I'm happy your dog doesn't have the runs.
Post by: AspenBud on January 01, 2014, 08:48:34 AM
Side note since someone mentioned Blue Buffalo in this thread, there is a recall out on it now.
Post by: RatherBOutdoors on January 01, 2014, 12:20:25 PM
Post by: Sportfury on January 01, 2014, 01:07:08 PM
Post by: JJD on January 02, 2014, 12:24:56 PM
Just because a dog gets "the runs" does not mean there is anything wrong with the dog food. Just might be not the right food for that dog.Well put, as I posted on another thread, I had a dog that did not tolerate better feeds.
Its possible, that the protein level is too high for the people that tried it for their dogs.
WRL
kept having to go back to regular old Purina Chow. Tried several different primium feeds introduced slowly, same result with each. One day I was talking to a DVM friend about the issue. He asked why I was changing, I told him I believed dogs perform better and stay healthier, longer on better feed.
He said, while that is most often the case, your dog is probably one of the strongest, healthiest dogs I know, stay on whats workin.
My current dogs are well maintained on a better feed, but I never say never.
Post by: wafisherman on January 02, 2014, 12:29:21 PM
Post by: DogZilla on January 02, 2014, 03:35:03 PM
There is nothing wrong with what you're feeding from a nutrition standpoint but the pup is old enough to be on adult food. If you want to stick with Kirkland, feed the purple bag. The green bag stuff causes gas in a bad way.
I did read here that some of the food mentioned contained Canola Oil. This can be very bad stuff. Almost lost a dog because I didn't have my reading glasses when I bought food and didn't see it listed on the label. In fact, don't feed any foods with added vegetable oil.