Post by: supermatt9 on November 10, 2012, 11:32:47 AM
So here's what happened (i'll try to keep this short). I was hunting with a buddy in a 3 point or better area. We saw about 20 deer and snuck up to about 200 yards on them. We saw one buck in the group that we both would have sworn on a bible that was a 3 point. I shot it and when we walk up to it we realize it was a 2 point. No eye guard, nothing. Just a 2 (mistake #1).
Well I put my tag on it and we start field dressing it. Our plan is to get it out of there and call it in when I get home (mistake #2). There was no cell reception where we were hunting and I honestly had no idea what number to call. I figured I'd look it up when I got home and call it in. Now I know that calling 911 is the proper thing to do, but I honestly never in a million years would've thought to call 911.
So we start dragging it out and 2 guys hike up to us and start chatting with us. I told them what happened and they seemed to understand that it was a mistake.
Well to keep it short, as soon as those guys got into cell phone range, they did the right thing, and called it in. They were long gone by the time we got to my truck. So we loaded up the deer and headed for home. Well we've been driving for a few minutes and my buddy says we should stop and put the deer in the back seat of the truck so that no one else can see it and call it in. I'm not sure why this would matter since I was already very certain that those other guys had called us in. For some stupid reason I listen to him and we move the deer inside the truck (mistake #3).
On the way home we got pulled over by a cop and 5 or so minutes later the game warden shows up. I told him exactly what happened and how I didn't know who to call and that I intended to call it in when I got home. Of course he asked me why the deer was inside the truck and I didn't really have an answer for him. Whether he believed me or not I don't know, but he took the deer (told me that it would be donated to a local gun club who would butcher it and donate it to a shelter) and gave me a ticket.
So my court date is 11/21 (day before thanksgiving) and I'd love to advice from anyone who has been there before.
Please refrain from calling me an idiot or telling me how dumb I am or to be absolutely 110% certain before you shoot. I know all those things. I've already called myself all of those things. Believe me when I say that no one feels worse/dumber about this than me. And not because I got caught, but because I know I made a stupid stupid mistake.
If you've been there before can you tell me what the court appointment will be like? What kind of potential fine am I looking at? Do I just go by myself and tell the judge what happened? I don't need an attorney, do I?
Any help/advice you can give me will be greatly appreciated.
Post by: Bean Counter on November 10, 2012, 11:35:10 AM
Post by: rtspring on November 10, 2012, 11:36:59 AM
Post by: SemperFidelis97 on November 10, 2012, 11:43:02 AM
Post by: ORCA_SIX on November 10, 2012, 11:51:04 AM
Post by: supermatt9 on November 10, 2012, 11:54:27 AM
If you have already signed an affadvit than an attorney isn't going to do much for you. I am curious was the charge unlawful hunting of big game, or something else? I believe the unlawful hunting of big game charge if convicted carry's a 3500 dollar penalty, and forfiture of your weapon. If that is the only charge that sticks you will not lose your privleges if they manage to stick you with a couple of charges you may end up losing your rights for two years.
Here's what it says under violations: 77.15.410.1B CLOSED SEASON DEER: 2-POINT IN 3-POINT OR BETTER AREA.
Here's a link to that RCW: http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=77.15.410.1 (http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=77.15.410.1)
Looks like a 2nd degree violation will result in 2 years of suspended hunting privileges.
So I guess my question is does the judge have to uphold that law? Or can he adjust the punishment based on the person?
Post by: SemperFidelis97 on November 10, 2012, 12:06:02 PM
Post by: RifleRidge on November 10, 2012, 12:16:24 PM
Post by: HornHoarder on November 10, 2012, 12:53:49 PM
Post by: supermatt9 on November 10, 2012, 12:57:23 PM
(1) A person is guilty of unlawful hunting of big game in the second degree if the person:
(a) Hunts for, takes, or possesses big game and the person does not have and possess all licenses, tags, or permits required under this title; or
(b) Violates any department rule regarding seasons, bag or possession limits, closed areas including game reserves, closed times, or any other rule governing the hunting, taking, or possession of big game.
and then says...
(3)(a) Unlawful hunting of big game in the second degree is a gross misdemeanor. Upon conviction of an offense involving killing or possession of big game taken during a closed season, closed area, without the proper license, tag, or permit using an unlawful method, or in excess of the bag or possession limit, the department shall revoke all of the person's hunting licenses and tags and order a suspension of the person's hunting privileges for two years.
Looks to me like if they want to they can take away my hunting privileges for two years. I wonder what the fine associated with it is??
I guess I was hoping for some leniency from the judge because I honestly felt like I was trying to do the right thing. We could have easily just left the deer there and booked it out of there. But that's not the kind of guy I am. I knew that the right thing to do was harvest the deer and then turn myself in. The mistake was to not call in right away and of course putting the deer in the truck. Man that was stupid.
Post by: RifleRidge on November 10, 2012, 01:26:36 PM
Post by: Greenhorn on November 10, 2012, 01:50:56 PM
Post by: 400out on November 10, 2012, 01:52:47 PM
Post by: mdbuck5x5 on November 10, 2012, 01:55:55 PM
Post by: mfswallace on November 10, 2012, 01:59:25 PM
Definitely PM RTSPRING. He just went through this whole scenario. However, he was innocent to begin with.
:dunno:
Post by: huntergreg on November 10, 2012, 02:01:17 PM
:spank_butt::yeah:
Post by: mdbuck5x5 on November 10, 2012, 02:17:44 PM
:spank_butt:
No Slap On The HAND here folks....
I understand that and it sucks but you HAVE to know what you're shooting at!
Post by: ICEMAN on November 10, 2012, 02:27:03 PM
I would lawyer up. On it's face, your story sounds bad, and I would rather have legal representation.....since you did not automatically report, and since you attempted to conceal.
Post by: scoyoc5 on November 10, 2012, 02:39:10 PM
Not sure I'm buyin " I was gonna call when I got home" that's going to be a tough sell
Post by: RifleRidge on November 10, 2012, 02:43:41 PM
Post by: akirkland on November 10, 2012, 02:51:23 PM
Let us know how it turns out for ya.... :tup:
Not sure I'm buyin " I was gonna call when I got home" that's going to be a tough sell
:yeah:
Post by: iusmc2002 on November 10, 2012, 02:52:12 PM
When the courts allow you to hunt again, I would Invest in a better pair of optics.. :cryriver:
I'm sure the OP thanks you SOOOO much for all your invaluable advice, you are a huge help. :rolleyes:
Post by: James E on November 10, 2012, 02:58:07 PM
Post by: supermatt9 on November 10, 2012, 03:02:01 PM
A sarcastic thanks to everyone else for piling on. Again there is nothing you can say to me that I already haven't thought or said to myself.
As for whether you believe my story or not, it's all true. I have no reason to make anything up.
Post by: iusmc2002 on November 10, 2012, 03:41:51 PM
A non-sarcastic thank you to those who have offered helpful advice. I appreciate it. Again, I'm not trying to get out of my punishment or dodge the proverbial bullet here.
A sarcastic thanks to everyone else for piling on. Again there is nothing you can say to me that I already haven't thought or said to myself.
As for whether you believe my story or not, it's all true. I have no reason to make anything up.
Let this be a lesson to you! Don't EVER, EVER, EVER bring some mistake you made up on this forum!! Most of the people here are PERFECT, and will ensure you know that by belittling you for your mistake. It happens all the time.
Since most others are doing it, YOU ARE AN EVIL, IGNORANT PERSON! YOU DON'T DESERVE TO BREATHE, LET ALONE HUNT IN OUR GREAT, AWESOME, WELL-RUN, WELL-MANAGED STATE! SO STUPID! YOU MUST HAVE BEEN DRUNK OR RETARDED OR SOMETHING. YOU DON'T DESERVE TO BE IN A TEACHING POSITION, YOUR EVIL VALUES WILL WARP OUR CHILDREN'S BRAINS! (Not video games or social media or lack of parent involvement, you.) I HOPE THEY BURN YOU AT THE STAKE AS AN EXAMPLE TO ALL THE OTHERS WHO WOULD THOUGHTLESSLY MAKE A MISTAKE IN THE WOODS..... blah blah blah *yaaaawn
Did I cover all of it?
Oh wait, you are stupid because you don't have good optics.
Think that's it.
Little joke for you
Jesus showed up just as a man was about to be stoned.
He said "Let them without sin cast the first stone"
No one moved for a second, then a rock came sailing out from the back of the crowd and hit the man
Jesus said "MOM! I hate it when you come to these things"
Post by: Hunterman on November 10, 2012, 03:45:58 PM
Good lick to the OP on your court case..
Hunterman(Tony)
Post by: BuckHunter23 on November 10, 2012, 04:04:40 PM
Good luck fighting this. From the sounds of it. There is no chance of you getting off the hook for what you did. At least you're not in jail.
Since you stated you are a high school teacher, you need to teach this valuable lesson to all your kids to not commit a crime and be an idiot like you were.
One question, we're you drunk or just stupid? It seems like a person like this should have their rights from hunting and fishing taken away for life.
Please tell me this was a sarcastic response? Let me guess, you're an angel and have never done anything wrong in your entire life? Most likely story is you've never been caught or had the balls to own up to something like this guy is. It's pretty clear to me from his remarks that he truly regrets his actions and would take them back if he could. Stupid mistake? Absolutely! And from the sounds of it he will paying some price for it. Just wants some advice from others who may have experienced something similar and what to expect. Why would you suggest having his hunting and fishing rights be taken away forever? That sounds more stupid to me. Shoot, drunk drivers usually only lose there driver's license for a year. The guy made a bonehead mistake and owned up to it. Though, I guess he should have known he's get flamed for even looking for some advice. Thanks for offering your help, I'm sure he's better off for it. :bash: Good for you for owning up to it, hope they don't throw the book at you too hard.
Post by: scoyoc5 on November 10, 2012, 04:09:32 PM
A non-sarcastic thank you to those who have offered helpful advice. I appreciate it. Again, I'm not trying to get out of my punishment or dodge the proverbial bullet here.
A sarcastic thanks to everyone else for piling on. Again there is nothing you can say to me that I already haven't thought or said to myself.
As for whether you believe my story or not, it's all true. I have no reason to make anything up.
Let this be a lesson to you! Don't EVER, EVER, EVER bring some mistake you made up on this forum!! Most of the people here are PERFECT, and will ensure you know that by belittling you for your mistake. It happens all the time.
Since most others are doing it, YOU ARE AN EVIL, IGNORANT PERSON! YOU DON'T DESERVE TO BREATHE, LET ALONE HUNT IN OUR GREAT, AWESOME, WELL-RUN, WELL-MANAGED STATE! SO STUPID! YOU MUST HAVE BEEN DRUNK OR RETARDED OR SOMETHING. YOU DON'T DESERVE TO BE IN A TEACHING POSITION, YOUR EVIL VALUES WILL WARP OUR CHILDREN'S BRAINS! (Not video games or social media or lack of parent involvement, you.) I HOPE THEY BURN YOU AT THE STAKE AS AN EXAMPLE TO ALL THE OTHERS WHO WOULD THOUGHTLESSLY MAKE A MISTAKE IN THE WOODS..... blah blah blah *yaaaawn
Did I cover all of it?
Oh wait, you are stupid because you don't have good optics.
Think that's it.
Little joke for you
Jesus showed up just as a man was about to be stoned.
He said "Let them without sin cast the first stone"
No one moved for a second, then a rock came sailing out from the back of the crowd and hit the man
Jesus said "MOM! I hate it when you come to these things"
I don't get your point???? :dunno:
The OP comes onto a hunting website and just because he admits to poaching we're not supposed to speak our mind? Going through a multi error check list of your mistakes after the fact only leaves the door open for opinions. I also agree you hunterman
Post by: winshooter88 on November 10, 2012, 04:14:45 PM
Post by: Curly on November 10, 2012, 04:18:15 PM
This is a prime example of how this state is so screwed up...I would be willing to bet that the OP "Thought" this deer was a 3 point hoping for an eye guard..They need to take this stupid ass rule out of the equation, that would save a hell of a lot of 2 points from being killed..But we all know this state is all about the all mighty "Dollar"...3 points on the main beam only. Eye guards should never be considered a point.
Good luck to the OP on your court case..
Hunterman(Tony)
:yeah:
On the bright side, at least they didn't charge Supermatt9 with wastage of game.......... (I hate it when I find a dead 2-point just left because of someone's mistake; so good for you for at least taking it instead of leaving it lay like a lot of people would have done.)
Post by: supermatt9 on November 10, 2012, 04:29:43 PM
I don't get your point???? :dunno:
The OP comes onto a hunting website and just because he admits to poaching we're not supposed to speak our mind? Going through a multi error check list of your mistakes after the fact only leaves the door open for opinions. I also agree you hunterman
Yes, but I freely admitted that I was stupid and owned up to my mistake. To have others piling on, saying the same thing I said is pointless.
:yeah:
On the bright side, at least they didn't charge Supermatt9 with wastage of game.......... (I hate it when I find a dead 2-point just left because of someone's mistake; so good for you for at least taking it instead of leaving it lay like a lot of people would have done.)
Just the day before I saw a dead 2-point that someone had shot and left there. I promised myself that if I ever made that dumb mistake I would not be that guy.
Post by: supermatt9 on November 10, 2012, 04:33:57 PM
Woulda coulda shoulda field dressed the animal stayed at the scene and sent your partner to contact the Gammies to respond to the scene to file a report that would show that you did everything in your power to make a major f' up right.
Definitely look into legal counsel as everyone has recommended or else the picture painted will lead to the maximum penalty without someone that can protect you.
:twocents:
If I had known that this was the right thing to do, believe me I would have done it. Hindsight is 20/20! I had never been in this situation before and did some dumb things.
Like I've said, I'm not trying to get out of the penalty, I just want to be prepared when I go in to the court appointment.
Post by: shedcrazy on November 10, 2012, 04:37:59 PM
Post by: BIGMIKE on November 10, 2012, 05:07:55 PM
Post by: Mudman on November 10, 2012, 05:11:10 PM
Post by: BK Dave on November 10, 2012, 06:15:25 PM
#1 how Did you two *censored*s get the drop on a Cat?!
#2 I've never know you 2 to ever have a cougar tag?!
Oh easy ill just go buy my tag tomorrow after work he said. And same as you somebody that saw them load it up in the woods called it in! So when these guy tagged it and waited a few days to bring the cat in for sealing the hide, the Game department was already waiting for them. They told they're story (How the Cougar was actually already shot wounded and dying). And it was' hence these two idiots even got it!
So they hired an Attorney and long story short they ended up winning! Cost them about $5000
I suggest a Lawyer
Post by: EDT on November 10, 2012, 06:35:18 PM
Post by: steeleywhopper on November 10, 2012, 06:43:51 PM
Im sorry for you. good luck! but I have to admit, bringing it up on this forum was a mistake. I would delete your posts from this tread. :twocents:
I would have to agree with this as well.
Post by: christopheri on November 10, 2012, 06:51:30 PM
I agree also however It might be to late because there are a few that are a few "manditory reporters" on here that could hae already seen your post and recorded it. Good luck to you. I am sure you wont make that same mistakes again.Im sorry for you. good luck! but I have to admit, bringing it up on this forum was a mistake. I would delete your posts from this tread. :twocents:
I would have to agree with this as well.
Post by: billythekidrock on November 10, 2012, 06:52:06 PM
First of all, I need to say that I'm not trying to "pass the buck" here or find a way to get out of what I did. I fully admit that I made a mistake (several of them) and have no excuses or any of that crap. I am a high school teacher and have no patience for people who can't admit their mistakes and fess up when they've done something wrong. What I really need is some advice or some suggestions about what will happen on the court date.
So here's what happened (i'll try to keep this short). I was hunting with a buddy in a 3 point or better area. We saw about 20 deer and snuck up to about 200 yards on them. We saw one buck in the group that we both would have sworn on a bible that was a 3 point. I shot it and when we walk up to it we realize it was a 2 point. No eye guard, nothing. Just a 2 (mistake #1).
Well I put my tag on it and we start field dressing it. Our plan is to get it out of there and call it in when I get home (mistake #2). There was no cell reception where we were hunting and I honestly had no idea what number to call. I figured I'd look it up when I got home and call it in. Now I know that calling 911 is the proper thing to do, but I honestly never in a million years would've thought to call 911.
So we start dragging it out and 2 guys hike up to us and start chatting with us. I told them what happened and they seemed to understand that it was a mistake.
Well to keep it short, as soon as those guys got into cell phone range, they did the right thing, and called it in. They were long gone by the time we got to my truck. So we loaded up the deer and headed for home. Well we've been driving for a few minutes and my buddy says we should stop and put the deer in the back seat of the truck so that no one else can see it and call it in. I'm not sure why this would matter since I was already very certain that those other guys had called us in. For some stupid reason I listen to him and we move the deer inside the truck (mistake #3).
On the way home we got pulled over by a cop and 5 or so minutes later the game warden shows up. I told him exactly what happened and how I didn't know who to call and that I intended to call it in when I got home. Of course he asked me why the deer was inside the truck and I didn't really have an answer for him. Whether he believed me or not I don't know, but he took the deer (told me that it would be donated to a local gun club who would butcher it and donate it to a shelter) and gave me a ticket.
So my court date is 11/21 (day before thanksgiving) and I'd love to advice from anyone who has been there before.
Please refrain from calling me an idiot or telling me how dumb I am or to be absolutely 110% certain before you shoot. I know all those things. I've already called myself all of those things. Believe me when I say that no one feels worse/dumber about this than me. And not because I got caught, but because I know I made a stupid stupid mistake.
If you've been there before can you tell me what the court appointment will be like? What kind of potential fine am I looking at? Do I just go by myself and tell the judge what happened? I don't need an attorney, do I?
Any help/advice you can give me will be greatly appreciated.
I can understand making a mistake...but putting inside your rig so no one can see it. :dunno:
Post by: billythekidrock on November 10, 2012, 06:53:43 PM
I agree also however It might be to late because there are a few that are a few "manditory reporters" on here that could hae already seen your post and recorded it. Good luck to you. I am sure you wont make that same mistakes again.Im sorry for you. good luck! but I have to admit, bringing it up on this forum was a mistake. I would delete your posts from this tread. :twocents:
I would have to agree with this as well.
There are also a lot of people here who can't read, jump to conclusions and just want points.
Post by: chad s. on November 10, 2012, 07:06:27 PM
Post by: Curly on November 10, 2012, 07:09:17 PM
Post by: supermatt9 on November 10, 2012, 07:10:31 PM
Don't listen to any of these morons about gettin an attorney and wasting your money. Don't change your story. You made a mistake, and you've already confessed. I feel you're being honest with us, so my advice is to ask for a deferal. I don't know if a deferal is an option for this particular case, but I would ask! I know a disabled hunter who shot a 4 point two years ago. It turned out he shot it unknowingly on private property, and he was turned in. He told the truth throughout the process, and the judge granted him a deferal. Like I stated last week in another post, a lot of people on here are *censored* bags "OMG I spelled it correct this time," so don't listen to them! :)
What's a deferral?
Post by: RifleRidge on November 10, 2012, 07:11:31 PM
Post by: billythekidrock on November 10, 2012, 07:12:52 PM
, so my advice is to ask for a deferal. I don't know if a deferal is an option for this particular case, but I would ask!
Ask who? An attorney perhaps?
Like I stated last week in another post, a lot of people on here are *censored* bags
Pot... meet kettle.
Post by: chad s. on November 10, 2012, 07:22:36 PM
Post by: Shannon on November 10, 2012, 07:39:40 PM
Post by: ghosthunter on November 10, 2012, 07:54:16 PM
I sat and watched a clearing in the woods. I had open sights.
Two deer came out,a 2pt and a doe. I got the 2pt in my sights and squeezed. When I got to the deer I had killed the doe.
I knew if anyone came along ,it would look bad. I dressed out the doe, and covered with brush. I hiked to my truck,drove to pay phone in Glacier and called 911. A agent called me back. He met me and I led him to the doe we packed it out and he wrote me a ticket.
Hunting doe deer during a closed season.
I went to court, open. I was one of the first cases called. The agent stood up and asked the judge to move my case to the end.
So I set through 30 other cases.
Finally it was my turn.
The agent stood and told the judge what I had done and that they would never had found the deer if I had not reported it.
The judge commended me and fined me 250.00. Than suspended the sentence provided I not have another violation in 3 years.
To this day I still run across agents who have never met me but know the story.
For years after agents would check me and just wave me on.
Turns out the agent was brand new and I was is first ever ticket.
30 years later I am telling the story to a hunter Ed class. Hand goes up and kid says that was my uncle , he just retired and still tells the same story.
Good luck.
Post by: Maverick on November 10, 2012, 08:27:11 PM
how would not having the 3 point min rule save more 2 points? then everyone would kill the 2 point and id be about impossible to even a 3 point mulie on the east side. letting them grow gives them a chance to get smarter and thats why we have some pretty good mulie huntin. yeah some 2 points get poached and some end up never growing a 3rd point, but because of that rule there are still way nicer bucks than would have been here without it. blacktail have all the brush on the west to hide and do alright. where i hunt mulies is all open country and theyd get slaughtered. honestly i think if the blacktail were 3 point min you guys on the west could be killing some masher bucks. but i would NEVER push for that because i dont hunt over there. its none of my business how things are regulated over there and just a personal opinion...
but anyways, good luck bud
Post by: Bob33 on November 10, 2012, 08:27:52 PM
I wish you well.
Post by: Wenatcheejay on November 10, 2012, 08:30:11 PM
A non-sarcastic thank you to those who have offered helpful advice. I appreciate it. Again, I'm not trying to get out of my punishment or dodge the proverbial bullet here.
A sarcastic thanks to everyone else for piling on. Again there is nothing you can say to me that I already haven't thought or said to myself.
As for whether you believe my story or not, it's all true. I have no reason to make anything up.
Let this be a lesson to you! Don't EVER, EVER, EVER bring some mistake you made up on this forum!! Most of the people here are PERFECT, and will ensure you know that by belittling you for your mistake. It happens all the time.
Since most others are doing it, YOU ARE AN EVIL, IGNORANT PERSON! YOU DON'T DESERVE TO BREATHE, LET ALONE HUNT IN OUR GREAT, AWESOME, WELL-RUN, WELL-MANAGED STATE! SO STUPID! YOU MUST HAVE BEEN DRUNK OR RETARDED OR SOMETHING. YOU DON'T DESERVE TO BE IN A TEACHING POSITION, YOUR EVIL VALUES WILL WARP OUR CHILDREN'S BRAINS! (Not video games or social media or lack of parent involvement, you.) I HOPE THEY BURN YOU AT THE STAKE AS AN EXAMPLE TO ALL THE OTHERS WHO WOULD THOUGHTLESSLY MAKE A MISTAKE IN THE WOODS..... blah blah blah *yaaaawn
Did I cover all of it?
Oh wait, you are stupid because you don't have good optics.
Think that's it.
Little joke for you
Jesus showed up just as a man was about to be stoned.
He said "Let them without sin cast the first stone"
No one moved for a second, then a rock came sailing out from the back of the crowd and hit the man
Jesus said "MOM! I hate it when you come to these things"
:yeah:
Nicepost (very true.)
Honestly Matt, you did make a mistake. (As you already freely admit.) You will go to court. You will probably pay a fine and might loose your gun. (Or have to buy it back.) But, it is not a capital crime. You should always at least consult a lawyer. You will get your hunt again at some point if you choose. The feeling bad about it is normal (I'd guess.) Pay your dues and move on.
Post by: simondude on November 10, 2012, 08:36:44 PM
Post by: deerslyr on November 10, 2012, 08:38:05 PM
*censored* bags? :yike:
You havent provided one useful post to this topic, move along to the speak your mind board where those posts are the norm and some what appreciated.
Matt, sounds like you made a mistake. It happens. Wasnt very bright to put it in the cab, like you said. Im sure it will work out. Good luck.
Post by: ldjbuff on November 10, 2012, 08:57:00 PM
Post by: Maverick on November 10, 2012, 09:08:18 PM
People on here are stupid. Some dude shoots an illegal deer gets caught then post it on here and a bunch of you feel sorry for him. He should get buster just like any other poacher you guys would wanna hang in the street, if someone would have posted that they had seen this happen that's what you all would be screening for.
yeah but that some dude at least didnt waste the animal. yeah he was in the wrong on several things but at least he packed it out.. being in the wrong he did a little right...
Post by: dreamunelk on November 10, 2012, 09:25:17 PM
Definitely talk to a lawyer.
Post by: Dan-o on November 10, 2012, 09:33:44 PM
Personally, I would NOT lawyer up. I would just go tell my story and let the chips fall. In my VERY LIMITED experience, the lawyer can cost more than they save you.
(These posts always bring out the perfect who walk among us........ It has to be quite something to have never screwed up.)
I hope it works out OK for you.
Post by: BurleyDog on November 10, 2012, 10:18:50 PM
Do the right thing, it will be for the best.
Don't cost the taxpayer by bogging down the system any more then you have to.
Post by: follow maggie on November 10, 2012, 10:23:27 PM
Post by: rtspring on November 10, 2012, 11:07:38 PM
Post by: Mudman on November 10, 2012, 11:17:29 PM
Lawyer no matter what!:yeah: Listen to those with experience.
Post by: akashasdaddy on November 10, 2012, 11:32:03 PM
Not sure if this has been said already but, a gross misdemeanor comes with the potential of up to a $5,000 fine and/or a year in jail. Not sure of the repercussions as far as hunting and/or firearm rights. From the RCW's that have been posted it looks like you could possibly lose your hunting rights for the two years.
This offense does not fall under the mandatory minimums law (with the exception of the hunting rights); so the judge could decide to be more or less lenient when it comes to sentencing.
Since it is a criminal charge, your first appearance in court will be an arraignment; this is where you enter a plea, you wont be sentenced. Personally, I suggest you plead not guilty and talk to a lawyer. The lawyer can work with the prosecutor to work out a plea deal. This is your best bet since you will have to make more than one appearance in court anyway. Going to a jury trial would be a huge mistake, you have far too much evidence against you and two law enforcement officers who will testify against you. Good intentions mean nothing in a court of law and your three mistakes will weigh heavily against you with a jury.
If this is your very first criminal offense and if your attorney is worth his or her salt, you will probably be spared any jail time. You are more than likely looking at a fine in the neighborhood of $500-$1,000, loss of hunting rights for a period of time (two years), and probably two years of probation. Again, all this could be more or less depending on the deal that is worked out with the prosecutor. But,remember our criminal justice system is based on a points system, meaning the more criminal offenses you have on your record the more points you have, the stiffer the penalty you will receive.
For what its worth, I hope this helps and good luck.
Post by: hunterrcc on November 10, 2012, 11:36:16 PM
Post by: mdbuck5x5 on November 11, 2012, 06:27:36 AM
Post by: Blacktail99 on November 11, 2012, 10:07:04 AM
Post by: Bofire on November 11, 2012, 06:18:54 PM
Carl
Post by: KFhunter on November 11, 2012, 06:40:01 PM
I don't think the judge will see the humor, let us know how it turns out.
Post by: jeepguy on November 11, 2012, 07:06:36 PM
Post by: RifleRidge on November 11, 2012, 07:57:28 PM
What brand & power binos and spotting scope do you own and what did you use to look at the deer to see the 3 points?
I thought I gave good advise in the beginning, I suggested investing in a good / new pair of optics for sure.. I agree with your question..hunterrcc..
Post by: Kc_Kracker on November 11, 2012, 08:23:35 PM
personally i have thought about what i would do, i decided early on I would leave the animal and call wdfw and tell them i effed up and face whatever comes my way
Post by: supermatt9 on November 11, 2012, 09:22:56 PM
i have never came across this so how does this work when it happens to a hunter? I would assume that trying to smuggle the animal out would make things alot worse for the shooter :dunno:
personally i have thought about what i would do, i decided early on I would leave the animal and call wdfw and tell them i effed up and face whatever comes my way
Do you know what number to call though? That was my problem. I had no idea that I should have just called 911.
Make sure you tag it and field dress it first as well.
Post by: Bob33 on November 11, 2012, 09:30:16 PM
A deer that can't be positively identified at 200 yards with marginal optics becomes a deer that can't be positively identified at 300 with superior optics...What brand & power binos and spotting scope do you own and what did you use to look at the deer to see the 3 points?
I thought I gave good advise in the beginning, I suggested investing in a good / new pair of optics for sure.. I agree with your question..hunterrcc..
Good optics are great but not a foolproof solution to proper identification.
Post by: bigtex on November 11, 2012, 09:52:33 PM
HAPPENED TO ME ALSO I JUST PAID THE TICKET AN NEVER HEARD ANYTHING MORE ABOUT IT DIDN'T LOSE HUNTING RIGHT OR GUN ALSO HUNTED THE FOLOWING YEAR KILLING A BIGGER BUCK GOD IS GOOD TO THOSE WHO TELL THE TRUTH AN DO RIGHT BY HIM.
As of June 2012 all criminal violations require a mandatory court date. Prior to this date the OP could have simply paid a $2,540 ticket for shooting the deer out of season. The state supreme court ruled that all criminal matters must now be heard in front of a judge. You now have people going before judges for fishing without a license.
Post by: bigtex on November 11, 2012, 09:54:06 PM
If this is your very first criminal offense and if your attorney is worth his or her salt, you will probably be spared any jail time. You are more than likely looking at a fine in the neighborhood of $500-$1,000, loss of hunting rights for a period of time (two years), and probably two years of probation. Again, all this could be more or less depending on the deal that is worked out with the prosecutor. But,remember our criminal justice system is based on a points system, meaning the more criminal offenses you have on your record the more points you have, the stiffer the penalty you will receive.
This violation requires a MANDATORY $2,000 civil fine paid to WDFW upon a guilty conviction, in addition to any criminal fines set by a judge.
Post by: lokidog on November 11, 2012, 10:11:35 PM
If this is your very first criminal offense and if your attorney is worth his or her salt, you will probably be spared any jail time. You are more than likely looking at a fine in the neighborhood of $500-$1,000, loss of hunting rights for a period of time (two years), and probably two years of probation. Again, all this could be more or less depending on the deal that is worked out with the prosecutor. But,remember our criminal justice system is based on a points system, meaning the more criminal offenses you have on your record the more points you have, the stiffer the penalty you will receive.
This violation requires a MANDATORY $2,000 civil fine paid to WDFW upon a guilty conviction, in addition to any criminal fines set by a judge.
Would this be mitigated in any way if he had called immediately before gutting/tagging/moving the deer? Curious if there is actually any benefit to doing the "right" thing, other than having a clearer conscience.
Post by: bigtex on November 11, 2012, 10:14:49 PM
If this is your very first criminal offense and if your attorney is worth his or her salt, you will probably be spared any jail time. You are more than likely looking at a fine in the neighborhood of $500-$1,000, loss of hunting rights for a period of time (two years), and probably two years of probation. Again, all this could be more or less depending on the deal that is worked out with the prosecutor. But,remember our criminal justice system is based on a points system, meaning the more criminal offenses you have on your record the more points you have, the stiffer the penalty you will receive.
This violation requires a MANDATORY $2,000 civil fine paid to WDFW upon a guilty conviction, in addition to any criminal fines set by a judge.
Would this be mitigated in any way if he had called immediately before gutting/tagging/moving the deer? Curious if there is actually any benefit to doing the "right" thing, other than having a clearer conscience.
No. There was talk several years ago abou creating some type of "accident" killing of wildlife charge in these circumstances when a friend of a legislator got in trouble, it went no where.
As I said, along with the conviction of killing a big game animal out of season (including 2pt in 3pt) requires a MANDATORY criminal wildlife penalty assessment, in this case it would be $2,000.
Now what a judge can do is say, no criminal penalties, just the civil penalty. To show the opposite extreme, the highest criminal penalty is $5,000 plus the $2,000 civil penalty.
Post by: firefighter4607 on November 11, 2012, 10:45:16 PM
This violation requires a MANDATORY $2,000 civil fine paid to WDFW upon a guilty conviction, in addition to any criminal fines set by a judge.
bigtex can they possibly take his rifle and vehicle if he if found guilty? I thought they could take anything used while commiting the crime.
Post by: bigtex on November 11, 2012, 10:46:45 PM
This violation requires a MANDATORY $2,000 civil fine paid to WDFW upon a guilty conviction, in addition to any criminal fines set by a judge.
bigtex can they possibly take his rifle and vehicle if he if found guilty? I thought they could take anything used while commiting the crime.
A judge could order it be surrendered. But if the officers didnt take it during the contact 99.9% of the time the judge won't say anything about it.
Post by: akashasdaddy on November 11, 2012, 11:23:44 PM
If this is your very first criminal offense and if your attorney is worth his or her salt, you will probably be spared any jail time. You are more than likely looking at a fine in the neighborhood of $500-$1,000, loss of hunting rights for a period of time (two years), and probably two years of probation. Again, all this could be more or less depending on the deal that is worked out with the prosecutor. But,remember our criminal justice system is based on a points system, meaning the more criminal offenses you have on your record the more points you have, the stiffer the penalty you will receive.
This violation requires a MANDATORY $2,000 civil fine paid to WDFW upon a guilty conviction, in addition to any criminal fines set by a judge.
I wasn't sure of the penalties imposed by WDFW, everything related to the criminal charges should be close but they are estimates that will be handled through negotiations between the defense attorney and prosecutor.
Post by: jeepguy on November 12, 2012, 04:12:00 PM
Post by: h20hunter on November 12, 2012, 04:23:03 PM
May want to read up on forum do's and dont's. I'm not sure why that little tag on the end of your post rubbed me the wrong way. I thought you made a good point up until then. Maybe being an interned tough guy calling people names is fun..I don't know. I would use better grammer and not text lingo. You may have wanted to say "you are an idiot" but doing so makes the rest of your statement, which I said I agree with, just get lost in the name calling.
Just saying.
Post by: Bob33 on November 12, 2012, 04:31:52 PM
Post by: wildmanoutdoors on November 12, 2012, 04:33:25 PM
Post by: Atroxus on November 12, 2012, 04:38:49 PM
Trying to justify ur by doing wat u seem eight does not make it okay. Its ur responseability to know ur target u messed up time too pay why would even put it inside ur truck ur whole story is messed up and u have no excuse. When there is antler restrictions u follow them no exceptions. I will not make this mistake ever why cause i make sure sure 100% of my target before i pull the hammer down ur situation brings no sympathy. Ur a idiot
First, the OP said he wasn't looking for sympathy. Second, with spelling/grammar that terrible, you shouldn't be calling anyone an idiot. Third, even if you did have impeccable grammar/spelling there is no call for personal insults here. :(
Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2
Post by: bigtex on November 12, 2012, 04:50:50 PM
If this is your very first criminal offense and if your attorney is worth his or her salt, you will probably be spared any jail time. You are more than likely looking at a fine in the neighborhood of $500-$1,000, loss of hunting rights for a period of time (two years), and probably two years of probation. Again, all this could be more or less depending on the deal that is worked out with the prosecutor. But,remember our criminal justice system is based on a points system, meaning the more criminal offenses you have on your record the more points you have, the stiffer the penalty you will receive.
This violation requires a MANDATORY $2,000 civil fine paid to WDFW upon a guilty conviction, in addition to any criminal fines set by a judge.
I wasn't sure of the penalties imposed by WDFW, everything related to the criminal charges should be close but they are estimates that will be handled through negotiations between the defense attorney and prosecutor.
The civil fine is including in the sentencing by a judge. The fine will be paid to the county court, who then forwards the money into the WDFW account
Post by: Huntbear on November 12, 2012, 04:53:57 PM
I got seasick reading Jeepguys post.:yeah:
Post by: brackens on November 12, 2012, 07:14:35 PM
Post by: jeepguy on November 13, 2012, 12:01:58 AM
Post by: BK Dave on November 13, 2012, 01:03:39 AM
New topic ? :tup:
Post by: dvolmer on November 13, 2012, 01:04:06 PM
Post by: skywalker253 on November 13, 2012, 01:41:52 PM
Shooting an illegal big game animal up to $5000 fine etc (criminal trial)
Wastage of game up to $5000 fine etc (criminal trial)
Shooting an illegal big game up to $2500 (civil trial)
Wastage of game up to $2500 (civil trial)
Probably lost your gun? You have to pay a percentage of what it is worth to get it back. Usually around $200-$600 per gun.
Loss of deer tag?
You should be looking at up to $15,000 in fines, temp. loss of gun, loss of 2012 deer tag, etc. It is usually around $1000-$1500 to pay for the attorney.
In the end you won't pay anything now. You will likely get deferred prosecution for 1-2 years. At the end of it (if you don't screw up again.) you will have to pay $500-$2000 fines, plus the cost to get your gun back $400-$600, plus the attorney fees. It will remain on your criminal record for 7 years, unless you pay $5000 to get it expungement. I know the laws and fines have changed some, but this is what a member of our hunting camps kid had charged to him in 2001. He was only 19 years old, and shot a 2 point whitetail in a 3 point or better area. He was turned in by someone for leaving it (wastage of game) to go find his father to figure out what to do. Once nailed he told the truth and that is what he got. He moved to Hawaii to build houses and no longer hunts with us. Good luck!
Post by: Curly on November 13, 2012, 01:46:10 PM
Post by: Blacktail Sniper on November 13, 2012, 01:54:20 PM
Have not read the entire thread, so maybe you mentioned it already? What tickets did you get? I beleive you should have got the following...
Shooting an illegal big game animal up to $5000 fine etc (criminal trial)
Wastage of game up to $5000 fine etc (criminal trial)
Shooting an illegal big game up to $2500 (civil trial)
Wastage of game up to $2500 (civil trial)
Probably lost your gun? You have to pay a percentage of what it is worth to get it back. Usually around $200-$600 per gun.
Loss of deer tag?
You should be looking at up to $15,000 in fines, temp. loss of gun, loss of 2012 deer tag, etc. It is usually around $1000-$1500 to pay for the attorney.
In the end you won't pay anything now. You will likely get deferred prosecution for 1-2 years. At the end of it (if you don't screw up again.) you will have to pay $500-$2000 fines, plus the cost to get your gun back $400-$600, plus the attorney fees. It will remain on your criminal record for 7 years, unless you pay $5000 to get it expungement. I know the laws and fines have changed some, but this is what a member of our hunting camps kid had charged to him in 2001. He was only 19 years old, and shot a 2 point whitetail in a 3 point or better area. He was turned in by someone for leaving it (wastage of game) to go find his father to figure out what to do. Once nailed he told the truth and that is what he got. He moved to Hawaii to build houses and no longer hunts with us. Good luck!
Copied from the OP's post, he was ticketed for "77.15.410.1B CLOSED SEASON DEER: 2-POINT IN 3-POINT OR BETTER AREA."
Post by: skywalker253 on November 13, 2012, 02:17:34 PM
He should not get waste of game charge since he tried to keep the deer.
And what sucks about that. They have another charge they issue you if you take it. So its a lose; lose situation. Your screwed either way. Best to just tell the truth and hope for the best.
Post by: Labs07 on November 15, 2012, 09:25:03 AM
Nice work for doing the right thing and admitting guilt and manning up!
Post by: JLS on November 15, 2012, 09:28:23 AM
If you ever make this mistake my advice would be to let it lie and leave ASAP. Coyotes have to eat and no good no matter how you think will ever come from it. you could have called the Warden as soon as it happened and he still would have smiled as he wrote you the same ticket. Never had the problem myself. I have always made sure of my target but had a person i know do the same thing only he re proted right away and his life was still a living hell until it was all wrapped up. you think that if you did the best you could you would have some leniency but don't fool yourself. they will put the screws to you.
That's a real outstanding idea until someone watches you do it. Then, you'll get exactly what you deserve.
Post by: JLS on November 15, 2012, 09:31:09 AM
He should not get waste of game charge since he tried to keep the deer.
And what sucks about that. They have another charge they issue you if you take it. So its a lose; lose situation. Your screwed either way. Best to just tell the truth and hope for the best.
Or, you could just call it in immediately. Then it's not wasted/abandoned and you're not trying to transport an illegal animal. Ethics are doing the right thing when no one is watching.
I've self reported violations before and been treated very professionally during the process. I don't expect a break when I screw up, but appreciate it when they are given :twocents:
Post by: pianoman9701 on November 15, 2012, 09:32:20 AM
Post by: JLS on November 15, 2012, 09:39:06 AM
Good luck fighting this. From the sounds of it. There is no chance of you getting off the hook for what you did. At least you're not in jail.
Since you stated you are a high school teacher, you need to teach this valuable lesson to all your kids to not commit a crime and be an idiot like you were.
One question, we're you drunk or just stupid? It seems like a person like this should have their rights from hunting and fishing taken away for life.
The came came onto a pubic forum and admitted he was wrong and was just asking a couple questions. And you have to come back with this? I sure hope you have never made any kind of mistake in your life. Because that would make you a hypocrite on top of the jerk you are.
I think Mr. Naches is still young enough that he hasn't had time to realize that he is not as smart as he thinks he is. It took me some years to learn that, along with some big helpings of humble pie.
Post by: deerslyr on November 15, 2012, 09:41:29 AM
Good luck fighting this. From the sounds of it. There is no chance of you getting off the hook for what you did. At least you're not in jail.
Since you stated you are a high school teacher, you need to teach this valuable lesson to all your kids to not commit a crime and be an idiot like you were.
One question, we're you drunk or just stupid? It seems like a person like this should have their rights from hunting and fishing taken away for life.
The came came onto a pubic forum and admitted he was wrong and was just asking a couple questions. And you have to come back with this? I sure hope you have never made any kind of mistake in your life. Because that would make you a hypocrite on top of the jerk you are.
I think Mr. Naches is still young enough that he hasn't had time to realize that he is not as smart as he thinks he is. It took me some years to learn that, along with some big helpings of humble pie.
Or hes just a tool and will never learn :dunno:
Post by: pianoman9701 on November 15, 2012, 09:43:03 AM
Good luck fighting this. From the sounds of it. There is no chance of you getting off the hook for what you did. At least you're not in jail.
Since you stated you are a high school teacher, you need to teach this valuable lesson to all your kids to not commit a crime and be an idiot like you were.
One question, we're you drunk or just stupid? It seems like a person like this should have their rights from hunting and fishing taken away for life.
The came came onto a pubic forum and admitted he was wrong and was just asking a couple questions. And you have to come back with this? I sure hope you have never made any kind of mistake in your life. Because that would make you a hypocrite on top of the jerk you are.
I think Mr. Naches is still young enough that he hasn't had time to realize that he is not as smart as he thinks he is. It took me some years to learn that, along with some big helpings of humble pie.
:yeah: Naches, your post sucks.
Post by: h20hunter on November 15, 2012, 10:02:02 AM
Post by: Bob33 on November 15, 2012, 11:11:22 AM
There's not a single hunter in here who hasn't made a mistake in the field.I agree, although from reading the posts on this thread it would appear that several members consider themselves above reproach. May we all strive to be perfect like them.
Post by: ecnclan on November 15, 2012, 12:08:55 PM
Quote
There's not a single hunter in here who hasn't made a mistake in the field. There are quite a few less who've made one and done the right thing. You're a stand up guy who'll pay the price, hopefully not a huge one. As you're a teacher, your students will benefit from being taught by one with honor and ethics. We need more teachers like you in our schools. Thank you for setting such a shining example of how to handle a personal failure.
That my friend was a very good post! I might even try to lose some of my hate for the lib's after reading that (for those of you that don't know what that meant it was referring to another thread).
:yeah:
Post by: combs338 on November 15, 2012, 12:31:52 PM
Post by: scout/sniper on November 15, 2012, 12:57:27 PM
You made an honest mistake (several by your count.) If this is the worst mistake you make in life, consider yourself blessed.Absolutely right.
I wish you well.
Most of these "sportsmen" that are flaming you have done the same thing, probably much worse if the truth were known.
Tell the truth and accept the punishment, your conscience will be clear and I'll bet it never happens again.
Post by: scout/sniper on November 15, 2012, 01:03:16 PM
Is there a special forum here for all the perfect people that keep offering their golden snippets?There's not a single hunter in here who hasn't made a mistake in the field.I agree, although from reading the posts on this thread it would appear that several members consider themselves above reproach. May we all strive to be perfect like them.
Maybe there should be, then they can stay there and talk about how much they love themselves.
It would keep them out of conversations like this.
Post by: dscubame on November 15, 2012, 01:21:27 PM
Good luck fighting this. From the sounds of it. There is no chance of you getting off the hook for what you did. At least you're not in jail.
Since you stated you are a high school teacher, you need to teach this valuable lesson to all your kids to not commit a crime and be an idiot like you were.
One question, we're you drunk or just stupid? It seems like a person like this should have their rights from hunting and fishing taken away for life.
The came came onto a pubic forum and admitted he was wrong and was just asking a couple questions. And you have to come back with this? I sure hope you have never made any kind of mistake in your life. Because that would make you a hypocrite on top of the jerk you are.
I think Mr. Naches is still young enough that he hasn't had time to realize that he is not as smart as he thinks he is. It took me some years to learn that, along with some big helpings of humble pie.
:yeah: Naches, your post sucks.
+3
Post by: pianoman9701 on November 15, 2012, 01:25:05 PM
Post by: jackelope on November 15, 2012, 01:33:23 PM
Post by: scout/sniper on November 15, 2012, 01:37:25 PM
Keep the personal attacks and name calling out of here.Wilco.
Post by: Arnbo on November 15, 2012, 01:49:32 PM
What brand & power binos and spotting scope do you own and what did you use to look at the deer to see the 3 points?I second this. Another mistake is coming on here before your court date.
The prosecutor will be checking your Facebook and any other forum from his smart phone...............Loose lips .....Sinks Ships
Post by: Evil_EdwardO on November 15, 2012, 01:50:20 PM
7/8 years ago a couple of knucklehead buddies of mine shot a Cougar with there bows, after all there bragging and wooping it up, I asked um
#1 how Did you two *censored*s get the drop on a Cat?!
#2 I've never know you 2 to ever have a cougar tag?!
Oh easy ill just go buy my tag tomorrow after work he said. And same as you somebody that saw them load it up in the woods called it in! So when these guy tagged it and waited a few days to bring the cat in for sealing the hide, the Game department was already waiting for them. They told they're story (How the Cougar was actually already shot wounded and dying). And it was' hence these two idiots even got it!
So they hired an Attorney and long story short they ended up winning! Cost them about $5000
I suggest a Lawyer
If having a lawyer is going to cost $5000 but the max fine is cheaper (from some posts on here say $2500) why would you. Save yourself $2500 and just pay the fine.
Post by: BK Dave on November 15, 2012, 02:16:27 PM
My point was, hiring a lawyer seems important.
Post by: skywalker253 on November 15, 2012, 02:32:42 PM
First of all let me say I am sorry for your temporary lapse in judgment,but ignorance of the law is not an excuse. I learned this the hard way myself.
Not sure if this has been said already but, a gross misdemeanor comes with the potential of up to a $5,000 fine and/or a year in jail. Not sure of the repercussions as far as hunting and/or firearm rights. From the RCW's that have been posted it looks like you could possibly lose your hunting rights for the two years.
This offense does not fall under the mandatory minimums law (with the exception of the hunting rights); so the judge could decide to be more or less lenient when it comes to sentencing.
Since it is a criminal charge, your first appearance in court will be an arraignment; this is where you enter a plea, you wont be sentenced. Personally, I suggest you plead not guilty and talk to a lawyer. The lawyer can work with the prosecutor to work out a plea deal. This is your best bet since you will have to make more than one appearance in court anyway. Going to a jury trial would be a huge mistake, you have far too much evidence against you and two law enforcement officers who will testify against you. Good intentions mean nothing in a court of law and your three mistakes will weigh heavily against you with a jury.
If this is your very first criminal offense and if your attorney is worth his or her salt, you will probably be spared any jail time. You are more than likely looking at a fine in the neighborhood of $500-$1,000, loss of hunting rights for a period of time (two years), and probably two years of probation. Again, all this could be more or less depending on the deal that is worked out with the prosecutor. But,remember our criminal justice system is based on a points system, meaning the more criminal offenses you have on your record the more points you have, the stiffer the penalty you will receive.
For what its worth, I hope this helps and good luck.
This is the best and most useful post in this topic. This guy is spot on. You need to get a lawyer. Had you not complicated your situation with additional mistakes, I would agree with the others who said not to get a lawyer. Don't get a lawyer out of your home town, or ask for the case be moved into your county. The county you offended in is familar with the charges and how they are enforced. Example-Moving it from a small county in South Eastern WA to Seattle, would be suicide. You will want to contact the top 3 lawyers in the county, which the violation took place in. They know the judges personally and are likely FREINDS with them. It makes for a much easier plea negotiation. I keep reading $5000 for lawyer fee's in the forum? That seems way out in left field. A member of our hunting camp shot a 2 point, tried to lie, etc. It cost him $1200 retainer fee and an additional $500 to handle the case. The lawyer will enter your plea for you at your first apperance. You should pled not guilty. This keeps the door open for negotiation. This is where you get the value for the money you are paying your attorney. They will negotiate on your behalf to try and minimize the charges and fee's to you. It is easy to say "don't get a lawyer" but when your standing in the court room with 50 plus people in the room hearing your case, dealing with a judge, it's not that easy. You have to be quick, know the laws, and on your A-Game or the judge will get frusterated with you and end the hearing. Then you will get nailed. You will likely get deferred prosecution with a good attorney, pay a fine, pay resitution to the court, and pay to get your gun back. I don't see you losing hunting privledges on a first offense.
Post by: Rooster1981 on November 16, 2012, 08:25:10 AM
Sounds like to me you got caught poaching :twocents:.
1. you shot an Illegal deer
2. you failed to call it in
3. you carried the animal out of the woods And hid it in the back seat of your truck :yike:
4. there were witnesses that called in the animal, and I bet they are hoping to cash in ten points
5. the most important mistake you have made, A hand written public statement of complete fault to you and your hunting partner.
WOW :bdid:
Post by: JLS on November 16, 2012, 09:04:14 AM
Sounds like to me you got caught poaching :twocents:.
1. you shot an Illegal deer
2. you failed to call it in
3. you carried the animal out of the woods And hid it in the back seat of your truck :yike:
4. there were witnesses that called in the animal, and I bet they are hoping to cash in ten points
5. the most important mistake you have made, A hand written public statement of complete fault to you and your hunting partner.
WOW :bdid:
I disagree with #5 in this instance. If the deck is stacked against you to the level it is here, I fail to see how owning up to your mistake is going to make things worse. :twocents:
Post by: 300UltraMagShooter on November 16, 2012, 09:25:30 AM
First of all let me say I am sorry for your temporary lapse in judgment,but ignorance of the law is not an excuse. I learned this the hard way myself.
actually, it is. where there is no intent to break the law, no law is broken. that has been the case since our "free" country was founded. unfortunately, this is yet another myth that has been passed down for so long that it has become common to find such error from judges top cops to even lawyers.
sad, but just looking at our laws and regulations now, it "should" be true more so now than ever.
Post by: Curly on November 16, 2012, 09:29:23 AM
First of all let me say I am sorry for your temporary lapse in judgment,but ignorance of the law is not an excuse. I learned this the hard way myself.
actually, it is. where there is no intent to break the law, no law is broken. that has been the case since our "free" country was founded. unfortunately, this is yet another myth that has been passed down for so long that it has become common to find such error from judges top cops to even lawyers.
sad, but just looking at our laws and regulations now, it "should" be true more so now than ever.
That may be true, however I don't think he was ignorant of the laws. He simply made a mistake in identifying the buck as a legal one.......... And he admitted his mistakes and simply is asking for advice.
Post by: 300UltraMagShooter on November 16, 2012, 09:30:59 AM
First of all let me say I am sorry for your temporary lapse in judgment,but ignorance of the law is not an excuse. I learned this the hard way myself.
actually, it is. where there is no intent to break the law, no law is broken. that has been the case since our "free" country was founded. unfortunately, this is yet another myth that has been passed down for so long that it has become common to find such error from judges top cops to even lawyers.
sad, but just looking at our laws and regulations now, it "should" be true more so now than ever.
That may be true, however I don't think he was ignorant of the laws. He simply made a mistake in identifying the buck as a legal one.......... And he admitted his mistakes and simply is asking for advice.
I agree 100%. I wasn't commenting on his actions. He made a mistake and if you want my $.02, he should be give a reward for having the courage to not walk off and waste the deer.
Post by: lokidog on November 16, 2012, 09:58:57 AM
If this is your very first criminal offense and if your attorney is worth his or her salt, you will probably be spared any jail time. You are more than likely looking at a fine in the neighborhood of $500-$1,000, loss of hunting rights for a period of time (two years), and probably two years of probation. Again, all this could be more or less depending on the deal that is worked out with the prosecutor. But,remember our criminal justice system is based on a points system, meaning the more criminal offenses you have on your record the more points you have, the stiffer the penalty you will receive.
This violation requires a MANDATORY $2,000 civil fine paid to WDFW upon a guilty conviction, in addition to any criminal fines set by a judge.
Would this be mitigated in any way if he had called immediately before gutting/tagging/moving the deer? Curious if there is actually any benefit to doing the "right" thing, other than having a clearer conscience.
No. There was talk several years ago abou creating some type of "accident" killing of wildlife charge in these circumstances when a friend of a legislator got in trouble, it went no where.
As I said, along with the conviction of killing a big game animal out of season (including 2pt in 3pt) requires a MANDATORY criminal wildlife penalty assessment, in this case it would be $2,000.
Now what a judge can do is say, no criminal penalties, just the civil penalty. To show the opposite extreme, the highest criminal penalty is $5,000 plus the $2,000 civil penalty.
Accidents can happen, I shot at a spike buck once in the fog, 60 yards, should have been DRT but I missed because I misjudged the animals position in the grass. Trying to get on the deer all I jumped was a doe. Makes me wonder if it was a spike or not, 9X scope, 60 yards, fog, were they antlers or just a perfect combination of branches? I'll never know, but at the time, I was 100% sure they were antlers. Honest mistakes CAN happen, should we do our best to not make any, sure. I bet many of you guys have made an "honest" mistake, hit two hen mallards with one shot when the limit was one, dropped two birds with one shot when one put you to your limit, forgot about that lead shell in your hunting jacket and now you are out duck hunting, shot a buck with a 7/8 inch eyeguard instead of 1" one, etc.
Unfortunately, as BigTex indicated, there is NO incentive to "do the right thing". Would I have gutted the animal in this situation, probably, would I have hauled it out, no way, would I have called it in somehow anonymously, I would have tried, but in this day and age it seems pretty hard to be anonymous anymore.
The OP is going to have his hands full and his wallet drained with this, he probably doesn't need to keep being called an idiot or other names as he hopefully feels bad enough about making the original mistake. Thank you OP for putting this out there, if nothing else as a reminder to all of us that we need to be very careful when pulling the trigger.
I am amazed sometimes at what people post. I hit Reply to a lot of posts and type what my, often times, knee jerk reaction is. Fortunately, before AI hit Post, I reread what I typed with the thoughts of does this help the OP or does it just make me look like an A-hole? I back out of a lot of Replies.... :rolleyes: :chuckle: and do not hit the Post button in the end. Just because you can say something, doesn't mean you should.
Good luck and have fun out there in all of your pursuits this weekend.
Post by: Mike450r on November 16, 2012, 10:01:08 AM
First of all let me say I am sorry for your temporary lapse in judgment,but ignorance of the law is not an excuse. I learned this the hard way myself.
actually, it is. where there is no intent to break the law, no law is broken. that has been the case since our "free" country was founded. unfortunately, this is yet another myth that has been passed down for so long that it has become common to find such error from judges top cops to even lawyers.
sad, but just looking at our laws and regulations now, it "should" be true more so now than ever.
Not entirely accurate. Our justice system is based on "Old English Commonlaw", even the laws created after America won independence are based on the English common law.
What you are referring to as intent or lack of intent is called "malice aforethought" and only goes to determine the degree of guilt if found guilty but can sometimes be used to find a person innocent in certain cases.
Breaking the law is breaking the law, always has been. "Ignorance of the law is no excuse" is based on a quote from the 1500's and just like our current laws is based in English commonlaw. It was a successful argument by the prosecution pointing out that if a precedent were set then everybody would say they didn't mean to do it. Just a little stuff I remember from college, law classes were definitely my favorites.
Back to the topic, the OP made a mistake and I am willing to bet accepts a plea deal. I admire him for not leaving the deer there as a lot of people do and it makes me sick to see the waste.
Post by: Hi-Liter on November 16, 2012, 10:03:27 AM
Sounds like to me you got caught poaching :twocents:.
1. you shot an Illegal deer
2. you failed to call it in
3. you carried the animal out of the woods And hid it in the back seat of your truck :yike:
4. there were witnesses that called in the animal, and I bet they are hoping to cash in ten points
5. the most important mistake you have made, A hand written public statement of complete fault to you and your hunting partner.
WOW :bdid:
I disagree with #5 in this instance. If the deck is stacked against you to the level it is here, I fail to see how owning up to your mistake is going to make things worse. :twocents:
You never ever give a police officer or government official a written statement under penalty of perjury or an affidavit. Especially if you are the suspect, you owe no duty to give a statement or cooperate. This is biggest mistake you or anyone can make. Burden of proof is on the state, no you.
Post by: JLS on November 16, 2012, 10:26:31 AM
Unfortunately, as BigTex indicated, there is NO incentive to "do the right thing".
Again, I disagree here. The officer still has discretion on how to handle each violation.
As Loki said, honest mistakes happen. I have reported myself on mistakes (all of which are really preventable in some way) and received warnings on both.
I bet if you ask around you will find game wardens who have given warnings for rather major violations such as this when the situation warranted it. If you don't report yourself I would guess a warning is completely out the window.
If you think I'm wrong, we can agree to disagree. For those of you who do think I'm wrong, call up your local officer and ask him or her if this is a black and white situation. I bet you'll be surprised.
Post by: Curly on November 16, 2012, 10:36:20 AM
First of all let me say I am sorry for your temporary lapse in judgment,but ignorance of the law is not an excuse. I learned this the hard way myself.
Not sure if this has been said already but, a gross misdemeanor comes with the potential of up to a $5,000 fine and/or a year in jail. Not sure of the repercussions as far as hunting and/or firearm rights. From the RCW's that have been posted it looks like you could possibly lose your hunting rights for the two years.
This offense does not fall under the mandatory minimums law (with the exception of the hunting rights); so the judge could decide to be more or less lenient when it comes to sentencing.
Since it is a criminal charge, your first appearance in court will be an arraignment; this is where you enter a plea, you wont be sentenced. Personally, I suggest you plead not guilty and talk to a lawyer. The lawyer can work with the prosecutor to work out a plea deal. This is your best bet since you will have to make more than one appearance in court anyway. Going to a jury trial would be a huge mistake, you have far too much evidence against you and two law enforcement officers who will testify against you. Good intentions mean nothing in a court of law and your three mistakes will weigh heavily against you with a jury.
If this is your very first criminal offense and if your attorney is worth his or her salt, you will probably be spared any jail time. You are more than likely looking at a fine in the neighborhood of $500-$1,000, loss of hunting rights for a period of time (two years), and probably two years of probation. Again, all this could be more or less depending on the deal that is worked out with the prosecutor. But,remember our criminal justice system is based on a points system, meaning the more criminal offenses you have on your record the more points you have, the stiffer the penalty you will receive.
For what its worth, I hope this helps and good luck.
This is the best and most useful post in this topic. This guy is spot on. You need to get a lawyer. Had you not complicated your situation with additional mistakes, I would agree with the others who said not to get a lawyer. Don't get a lawyer out of your home town, or ask for the case be moved into your county. The county you offended in is familar with the charges and how they are enforced. Example-Moving it from a small county in South Eastern WA to Seattle, would be suicide. You will want to contact the top 3 lawyers in the county, which the violation took place in. They know the judges personally and are likely FREINDS with them. It makes for a much easier plea negotiation. I keep reading $5000 for lawyer fee's in the forum? That seems way out in left field. A member of our hunting camp shot a 2 point, tried to lie, etc. It cost him $1200 retainer fee and an additional $500 to handle the case. The lawyer will enter your plea for you at your first apperance. You should pled not guilty. This keeps the door open for negotiation. This is where you get the value for the money you are paying your attorney. They will negotiate on your behalf to try and minimize the charges and fee's to you. It is easy to say "don't get a lawyer" but when your standing in the court room with 50 plus people in the room hearing your case, dealing with a judge, it's not that easy. You have to be quick, know the laws, and on your A-Game or the judge will get frusterated with you and end the hearing. Then you will get nailed. You will likely get deferred prosecution with a good attorney, pay a fine, pay resitution to the court, and pay to get your gun back. I don't see you losing hunting privledges on a first offense.
You guys that say he needs a lawyer are probably right (I'm not arguing.....I'm just trying to understand). To me, it seems pretty simple that he is guilty of shooting a 2 point like he admits. So, why would he plead not guilty? Isn't that lying?
Seems like a guilty person would go in without a lawyer and plead guilty and take the the punishment? Why plead not guilty? Is it just because it was an honest mistake that he would want to plead not guilty and try to get the charge lowered? :dunno: Just trying to understand.
Post by: h20hunter on November 16, 2012, 10:37:27 AM
Post by: Curly on November 16, 2012, 10:46:05 AM
I think the punishment of simply pleading guilty and letting the judge crush you is far different from the punishment of negotiating a guilty plea with punishment before you get to the judge.
So basically a guy has to plead not guilty (even though he is guilty) and pay a lawyer to be able to get a better deal? I guess it is a way of keeping attorney's in business............ :dunno:
Post by: h20hunter on November 16, 2012, 10:54:17 AM
Post by: 300UltraMagShooter on November 16, 2012, 11:00:46 AM
First of all let me say I am sorry for your temporary lapse in judgment,but ignorance of the law is not an excuse. I learned this the hard way myself.
actually, it is. where there is no intent to break the law, no law is broken. that has been the case since our "free" country was founded. unfortunately, this is yet another myth that has been passed down for so long that it has become common to find such error from judges top cops to even lawyers.
sad, but just looking at our laws and regulations now, it "should" be true more so now than ever.
Not entirely accurate. Our justice system is based on "Old English Commonlaw", even the laws created after America won independence are based on the English common law.
What you are referring to as intent or lack of intent is called "malice aforethought" and only goes to determine the degree of guilt if found guilty but can sometimes be used to find a person innocent in certain cases.
Breaking the law is breaking the law, always has been. "Ignorance of the law is no excuse" is based on a quote from the 1500's and just like our current laws is based in English commonlaw. It was a successful argument by the prosecution pointing out that if a precedent were set then everybody would say they didn't mean to do it. Just a little stuff I remember from college, law classes were definitely my favorites.
Back to the topic, the OP made a mistake and I am willing to bet accepts a plea deal. I admire him for not leaving the deer there as a lot of people do and it makes me sick to see the waste.
Actually, you didn't really disagree with me. However, you did make one big mistake. You mentioned (what you "learned") back in school. Frankly put, our schools are a mess, and what is being taught on all levels needs to be taken with a LARGE grain of salt.
Breaking the law is not just breaking the law. There is not one person on this forum that hasn't broken some law in the last day, week, month, year.... it's impossible with our gigantic, monstrosity of a government. And frankly, way to many people warship the law and look far too down on other's that might have broken a law. :twocents:
What if he has accidentally shot the 2 pt and just walked off? Would you have thought less or more of him? Accidents happen.... and accidents are NOT breaking the law. Breaking the law is when one purposly sets out to shoot a 2 pt.
Post by: Curly on November 16, 2012, 11:12:15 AM
Accidents happen.... and accidents are NOT breaking the law. Breaking the law is when one purposely sets out to shoot a 2 pt.
Ok, now with that thinking, I can know see why a guy could plead not guilty in a case like this. He's not guilty of purposely shooting a 2 point.
Thanks for clearing that up for me 300UltraMagShooter. :tup:
Post by: 300UltraMagShooter on November 16, 2012, 11:17:27 AM
Accidents happen.... and accidents are NOT breaking the law. Breaking the law is when one purposely sets out to shoot a 2 pt.
Ok, now with that thinking, I can know see why a guy could plead not guilty in a case like this. He's not guilty of purposely shooting a 2 point.
Thanks for clearing that up for me 300UltraMagShooter. :tup:
actually, that is exactly right no matter how nonserious you are about it. however, i doubt it will work as a defense with these myths getting thrown around the way they are. he'd have to get really lucky to find a judge that knows intent the way it was originally intended.
i'm one that believes/knows that you can shoot that 2 pt and know in your mind 100% that you can "believe" it is a 3 pt. It happens... and it isn't his fault that someone wrote a law that doesn't take into account human error.
Post by: JLS on November 16, 2012, 11:24:46 AM
Post by: Curly on November 16, 2012, 11:27:08 AM
Accidents happen.... and accidents are NOT breaking the law. Breaking the law is when one purposely sets out to shoot a 2 pt.
Ok, now with that thinking, I can know see why a guy could plead not guilty in a case like this. He's not guilty of purposely shooting a 2 point.
Thanks for clearing that up for me 300UltraMagShooter. :tup:
actually, that is exactly right no matter how nonserious you are about it. however, i doubt it will work as a defense with these myths getting thrown around the way they are. he'd have to get really lucky to find a judge that knows intent the way it was originally intended.
i'm one that believes/knows that you can shoot that 2 pt and know in your mind 100% that you can "believe" it is a 3 pt. It happens... and it isn't his fault that someone wrote a law that doesn't take into account human error.
I was dead serious. I like your explanation a lot.
I had a b.s. traffic ticket that I'm still pissed about (from a couple years ago); technically I was guilty, but I wasn't purposely breaking the law and I was pissed that the cop would give me a ticket for such b.s. I debated for a week or so about fighting it, but finally gave in and just paid the damn thing. If I would have thought about the reasoning you just gave, I could have honestly checked the box about being NOT GUILTY and gone into court and argued my case. I just couldn't see checking that not guilty box at the time. (BTW, the ticket was for driving on the shoulder. It was during a snow storm and I thought the really wide paved shoulder was a lane.)
Post by: 300UltraMagShooter on November 16, 2012, 11:31:32 AM
Glad to be of some limited help. (and the driving on the curb in a snowstorm ticket fits exactly.... no intent and conditions account for your "error")
Post by: skywalker253 on November 16, 2012, 09:44:31 PM
First of all let me say I am sorry for your temporary lapse in judgment,but ignorance of the law is not an excuse. I learned this the hard way myself.
Not sure if this has been said already but, a gross misdemeanor comes with the potential of up to a $5,000 fine and/or a year in jail. Not sure of the repercussions as far as hunting and/or firearm rights. From the RCW's that have been posted it looks like you could possibly lose your hunting rights for the two years.
This offense does not fall under the mandatory minimums law (with the exception of the hunting rights); so the judge could decide to be more or less lenient when it comes to sentencing.
Since it is a criminal charge, your first appearance in court will be an arraignment; this is where you enter a plea, you wont be sentenced. Personally, I suggest you plead not guilty and talk to a lawyer. The lawyer can work with the prosecutor to work out a plea deal. This is your best bet since you will have to make more than one appearance in court anyway. Going to a jury trial would be a huge mistake, you have far too much evidence against you and two law enforcement officers who will testify against you. Good intentions mean nothing in a court of law and your three mistakes will weigh heavily against you with a jury.
If this is your very first criminal offense and if your attorney is worth his or her salt, you will probably be spared any jail time. You are more than likely looking at a fine in the neighborhood of $500-$1,000, loss of hunting rights for a period of time (two years), and probably two years of probation. Again, all this could be more or less depending on the deal that is worked out with the prosecutor. But,remember our criminal justice system is based on a points system, meaning the more criminal offenses you have on your record the more points you have, the stiffer the penalty you will receive.
For what its worth, I hope this helps and good luck.
This is the best and most useful post in this topic. This guy is spot on. You need to get a lawyer. Had you not complicated your situation with additional mistakes, I would agree with the others who said not to get a lawyer. Don't get a lawyer out of your home town, or ask for the case be moved into your county. The county you offended in is familar with the charges and how they are enforced. Example-Moving it from a small county in South Eastern WA to Seattle, would be suicide. You will want to contact the top 3 lawyers in the county, which the violation took place in. They know the judges personally and are likely FREINDS with them. It makes for a much easier plea negotiation. I keep reading $5000 for lawyer fee's in the forum? That seems way out in left field. A member of our hunting camp shot a 2 point, tried to lie, etc. It cost him $1200 retainer fee and an additional $500 to handle the case. The lawyer will enter your plea for you at your first apperance. You should pled not guilty. This keeps the door open for negotiation. This is where you get the value for the money you are paying your attorney. They will negotiate on your behalf to try and minimize the charges and fee's to you. It is easy to say "don't get a lawyer" but when your standing in the court room with 50 plus people in the room hearing your case, dealing with a judge, it's not that easy. You have to be quick, know the laws, and on your A-Game or the judge will get frusterated with you and end the hearing. Then you will get nailed. You will likely get deferred prosecution with a good attorney, pay a fine, pay resitution to the court, and pay to get your gun back. I don't see you losing hunting privledges on a first offense.
You guys that say he needs a lawyer are probably right (I'm not arguing.....I'm just trying to understand). To me, it seems pretty simple that he is guilty of shooting a 2 point like he admits. So, why would he plead not guilty? Isn't that lying?
Seems like a guilty person would go in without a lawyer and plead guilty and take the the punishment? Why plead not guilty? Is it just because it was an honest mistake that he would want to plead not guilty and try to get the charge lowered? :dunno: Just trying to understand.
The same reason why a murderer kills 5 woman, then gets caught red handed. They always plead not guilty, because they keep some leverage. Plead guilty and your at the mercy of the courts. Plead not guilty and now you have the ability to plea bargain to reduce the penalties. Guilty plea comes with a stiff penalty and is pretty straight forward. Likely the death penalty in a murder case. Plea bargaining is basically saying "I'm guilty, but I'm going to make you prove it."which costs the courts money. The courts would rather negotiate to get the case resolved. Its not like the offender gets off. They still get jail time, fines, etc. But they likely won't get the death penalty because the plea bargained to work with the courts. Usually involves ratting someone else out. Big leap from making a mistake on shooting a big game animal, but the law is the law and they work off facts, statements, structure, etc. It is all relative....
Post by: boneaddict on November 16, 2012, 10:01:02 PM
Post by: skywalker253 on November 16, 2012, 10:08:57 PM
First of all let me say I am sorry for your temporary lapse in judgment,but ignorance of the law is not an excuse. I learned this the hard way myself.
actually, it is. where there is no intent to break the law, no law is broken. that has been the case since our "free" country was founded. unfortunately, this is yet another myth that has been passed down for so long that it has become common to find such error from judges top cops to even lawyers.
sad, but just looking at our laws and regulations now, it "should" be true more so now than ever.
Not entirely accurate. Our justice system is based on "Old English Commonlaw", even the laws created after America won independence are based on the English common law.
What you are referring to as intent or lack of intent is called "malice aforethought" and only goes to determine the degree of guilt if found guilty but can sometimes be used to find a person innocent in certain cases.
Breaking the law is breaking the law, always has been. "Ignorance of the law is no excuse" is based on a quote from the 1500's and just like our current laws is based in English commonlaw. It was a successful argument by the prosecution pointing out that if a precedent were set then everybody would say they didn't mean to do it. Just a little stuff I remember from college, law classes were definitely my favorites.
Back to the topic, the OP made a mistake and I am willing to bet accepts a plea deal. I admire him for not leaving the deer there as a lot of people do and it makes me sick to see the waste.
Actually, you didn't really disagree with me. However, you did make one big mistake. You mentioned (what you "learned") back in school. Frankly put, our schools are a mess, and what is being taught on all levels needs to be taken with a LARGE grain of salt.
Breaking the law is not just breaking the law. There is not one person on this forum that hasn't broken some law in the last day, week, month, year.... it's impossible with our gigantic, monstrosity of a government. And frankly, way to many people warship the law and look far too down on other's that might have broken a law. :twocents:
What if he has accidentally shot the 2 pt and just walked off? Would you have thought less or more of him? Accidents happen.... and accidents are NOT breaking the law. Breaking the law is when one purposly sets out to shoot a 2 pt.
So if I got to a bar and have a couple of beers, then get in an accident and kill someone, is that NOT breaking the law? It was an accident and I didn't mean to kill someone. My point is that the law has to draw the line somewhere. The law is the law. In this case a the courts take into consideration, that mistakes happen. That is why the penalty is UP TO A $5000 fine, loss of hunting privledges, etc. If it was an outright poaching of a deer, then he would likely get the maximum penalty enforced. Shooting a 2 point is a common hunting offense, which happens in most cases by accident or carelessness. First offenses come with a very reasonable/mild penalty. Again...they have to draw the line somewhere and hold people accountable to a certain degree. Otherwise 2 points would be getting shot all over the place and everyone would claim it was an accident, please let me off. Every hunter has made a mistake, but they vary by degree.
Post by: hunterrcc on November 16, 2012, 10:51:24 PM
What brand & power binos and spotting scope do you own and what did you use to look at the deer to see the 3 points?I second this. Another mistake is coming on here before your court date.
The prosecutor will be checking your Facebook and any other forum from his smart phone...............Loose lips .....Sinks Ships
What power binos and spotting scope and brand do you use or did you use. I would like to know?
Post by: 260Rem on November 16, 2012, 11:16:54 PM
The legal vs. moral thing you did was right as far as not wasting it, if in fact you made a "mistake" instead of intentially poaching it. You F-ed up by hiding it in your rig. Makes you look bad. Not sure how old you are but this is something that I would have also done in my 20's.
For what its worth I actually think you deserve to get a record for this. But I also think that this is something that won't define you as a person as long as you don't let it. Get an attorney, plead not guilty, then plead it out and get on with your life. If this is the worst thing you do in life, you are doing better than most.
With all of that that I said I don't condone what you did and question where were you binos, etc. that being said I'm sure you have asked yourself these questions a lot more than anyone can imagine.
Post by: GEARHEAD on November 16, 2012, 11:32:56 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on November 17, 2012, 12:30:26 AM
Post by: skywalker253 on November 17, 2012, 10:33:20 AM
Sounds like your toast on this one now you admitted guilt ...never ever do that ! Just go tell the judge exactly what took place and hopefully he understands and cuts you a deal ... :tup: Good luck ! its always fun dealing with them :dunno: :chuckle:
You always tell the truth once your turned in and questioned. What was he suppose to do? He hide the deer inside his truck. What is he going to say when they take ballistics off his rifle and match it to the deer. Once your questioned, its best to tell the truth and plea out on a first offense. Despite admitting guilt, you can still plead not guilty at his arraignment trial. Otherwise he would get the book thrown at him for trying to lie.
Post by: GEARHEAD on November 17, 2012, 12:58:52 PM
Post by: Chappyk16 on November 17, 2012, 04:24:47 PM
Post by: dscubame on November 17, 2012, 04:31:58 PM
If his story is true, compared to oh *censored* i got caught on the side of the highway. I give him props for owing up to his mistake, most people wouldnt do that.
It was a mistake but why turn yourself in for such serious punishment? Sounds sort of ridiculous to me. It's not like turning yourself in reverses what happened. If it makes you feel better donate 2k to a charity of your choice as self induced punishment and move on.
Post by: hunterrcc on November 17, 2012, 10:43:16 PM
SORRY BUT HIDING THE BUCK IN YOUR BACKSEAT, REALLY! THEN GOING ON HERE TO GET HELP. well here is my help save up some money go buy a pair of at least 10x50 binos quality brand but doesn't have to be some $2K brand. Leupold has great binos good quality and not too expensive! And make sure you know it has 3 points. Way too many people shoot 2 points because they don't own good enough optics and number two they rush their shot!
What brand & power binos and spotting scope do you own and what did you use to look at the deer to see the 3 points?I second this. Another mistake is coming on here before your court date.
The prosecutor will be checking your Facebook and any other forum from his smart phone...............Loose lips .....Sinks Ships
What power binos and spotting scope and brand do you use or did you use. I would like to know?
Post by: skywalker253 on November 18, 2012, 01:14:20 AM
If his story is true, compared to oh *censored* i got caught on the side of the highway. I give him props for owing up to his mistake, most people wouldnt do that.
It was a mistake but why turn yourself in for such serious punishment? Sounds sort of ridiculous to me. It's not like turning yourself in reverses what happened. If it makes you feel better donate 2k to a charity of your choice as self induced punishment and move on.
He did not turn himself in. He was turned in by another hunter, and they caught him with the deer in the back seat of his truck.
Post by: skywalker253 on November 18, 2012, 01:17:52 AM
my guess from the no answer of this question is that he is one of the guys I see using no binos hunting 3point of better units! Or he has some little low power binos that are as good as not having a pair.
SORRY BUT HIDING THE BUCK IN YOUR BACKSEAT, REALLY! THEN GOING ON HERE TO GET HELP. well here is my help save up some money go buy a pair of at least 10x50 binos quality brand but doesn't have to be some $2K brand. Leupold has great binos good quality and not too expensive! And make sure you know it has 3 points. Way too many people shoot 2 points because they don't own good enough optics and number two they rush their shot!What brand & power binos and spotting scope do you own and what did you use to look at the deer to see the 3 points?I second this. Another mistake is coming on here before your court date.
The prosecutor will be checking your Facebook and any other forum from his smart phone...............Loose lips .....Sinks Ships
What power binos and spotting scope and brand do you use or did you use. I would like to know?
Amen! I think one of the reasons hunters rush their shot on the east side, is all the surrounding hunters. Guys everywhere on opening day and people get caught up in the competitive situation and rush their judgement and shot. See it every year where I hunt. Shoot your deer, and run with your knife in one hand and your tag in your mouth. We can credit this to all the posted land, which piles hunters on top of each other. Does not seem very safe. I hope Wa becomes a draw state.
Post by: OutdoorFreak97 on November 18, 2012, 02:38:00 AM
Rule #2 be sure of you're target
Rule..... You took the hunters safety course, I understand its easier said than done, I should be better about it also
But seriously guys, if you aren't sure don't shot
It's not worth it, I saw someone with a not even legal 2 point with an eye guard about 3/4" in the big cooler
He's lucky he didn't get busted, maybe he did?
Sorry to here about your mishap man, it sucks.
Post by: scout/sniper on November 18, 2012, 07:11:07 AM
Rule #1 safetyI can see this mistake being an honest one. Judging 1/4" on an eye-guard at a distance could be difficult.
Rule #2 be sure of you're target
Rule..... You took the hunters safety course, I understand its easier said than done, I should be better about it also
But seriously guys, if you aren't sure don't shot
It's not worth it, I saw someone with a not even legal 2 point with an eye guard about 3/4" in the big cooler
He's lucky he didn't get busted, maybe he did?
Sorry to here about your mishap man, it sucks.
Post by: lokidog on November 18, 2012, 08:37:32 PM
Post by: h2ofowlr on November 18, 2012, 08:54:08 PM
Post by: scout/sniper on November 19, 2012, 07:33:49 AM
One easy way would be to make sure the eyeguard is as tall as a deer's eye is wide. Just an idea.:tup:
Post by: hunter360 on November 19, 2012, 09:30:37 AM
I believe he said he just wanted to know what to expect when he goes to court.
Some people on this site are quick to judge their fellow sportsman which is pretty pathetic if you ask me. I believe him that he just messed up. If he's telling the truth, he's not a poacher flat out. And why the hell would someone that was a real poacher and got caught come to this website to ask for help? Doesn't make sense. Like I said, I believe he is telling the truth.
To the people that think anyone that mess's up is a poacher, get a life! You guys that think you are high at mighty and have never made a mistake need to step back to reality. You are the ones that are not true sportsman imo.
Post by: Kc_Kracker on November 19, 2012, 09:40:34 AM
damn right, lets remember that fact, i see many posts about "hes trying to do the right thing",If his story is true, compared to oh *censored* i got caught on the side of the highway. I give him props for owing up to his mistake, most people wouldnt do that.
It was a mistake but why turn yourself in for such serious punishment? Sounds sort of ridiculous to me. It's not like turning yourself in reverses what happened. If it makes you feel better donate 2k to a charity of your choice as self induced punishment and move on.
He did not turn himself in. He was turned in by another hunter, and they caught him with the deer in the back seat of his truck.
no he isnt, he tried to poach a deer and got caught (where is the wanker emoticon when i need one).
all we can do is tell you to tell the truth and hope you learn from this and set better examples, so we dont have our youth members on here reading this thinking there is a way out of screwing up this bad. you didnt do ONE single honest thing is this entire hunting trip, not one, start now when you face the judge.
Post by: NWBREW on November 19, 2012, 10:09:18 AM
Loss of your hunting for a few years
Loss of your hunting rifle.
Loss of the hunting rig you were driving
Lots and lots of $ in fines and fees
I believe that about sums it up.
Post by: kentrek on November 19, 2012, 10:44:22 AM
"Some people on this site are quick to judge their fellow sportsman which is pretty pathetic if you ask me. I believe him that he just messed up. "
"To the people that think anyone that mess's up is a poacher, get a life! You guys that think you are high an mighty and have never made a mistake need to step back to reality. You are the ones that are not true sportsman imo."
:yeah: realy dont think this guy needs 11 pages of people telling him exactly what he did wrong...esp since he never asked that
Post by: Kc_Kracker on November 19, 2012, 12:42:30 PM
Post by: Mr Mykiss on November 19, 2012, 03:12:46 PM
Post by: Woodchuck on November 19, 2012, 03:14:33 PM
Post by: jeepguy on November 25, 2012, 08:42:00 PM
Post by: Rooster1981 on November 25, 2012, 09:23:54 PM
He never did tell us how court went?
Post by: h2ofowlr on November 25, 2012, 09:34:45 PM
Post by: kenzmad on November 26, 2012, 06:05:32 AM
:yeah:
He never did tell us how court went?
Can you blame him?
after monday and tuesday even the calendar says Wednesday,Thursday and Friday.
Post by: scout/sniper on November 26, 2012, 07:47:00 AM
HEY ,if you guys out who shoot 2 points thinking they are legal shouldnt be out there period . Check out some of these nice bucks ,now think how many more would be availble to pursue if you didnt pop off all the two's . Looking forsupport on your act here is a disgrace,besides who in heck would stick a deer inside the cab if something wasnt up my guess is if you didnt get BUSTED no one would of this pathetic act.I doubt that he was out to shoot a 2 point, and he obviously knows a 2 point is not legal.
Jumping on the bandwagon of people flaming him is a pathetic act.
Accidents happen and people do stupid things when they are scared "putting it in the cab"
I seriously doubt that he was poaching. As I stated earlier, I would love to know the real truth about the hunting activities of all you people who are condemning him.
I would wager that you people have done similar acts, probably much worse.
Post by: TikkaT3-270Shortmag on November 26, 2012, 11:51:06 AM
Post by: Skyvalhunter on November 26, 2012, 11:54:05 AM
Post by: Doc Sauce on November 26, 2012, 12:13:42 PM
Post by: Pathfinder101 on November 26, 2012, 12:19:43 PM
:yeah:
He never did tell us how court went?
He's probably tired of getting yelled at... Coming on this site and admitting to doing something wrong must feel a bit like going to confession, except that there is no screen and the priest keeps yelling at you and calling you names.... :(
Post by: Doc Sauce on November 26, 2012, 12:24:16 PM
:yeah:
He never did tell us how court went?
He's probably tired of getting yelled at... Coming on this site and admitting to doing something wrong must feel a bit like going to confession, except that there is no screen and the priest keeps yelling at you and calling you names.... :(
Yeah... I appreciate these threads though... at least the first few pages of them. Being a new hunter, I have wondered what I would do should I misjudge my game. I would have tagged it, hauled it out, taken it home, and then called it in. I would never have thought of calling 911 because shooting the wrong animal doesn't fit in the "emergency" category of my head. These threads help me see the legal process. If he is even checking this thread anymore, I'd love to know what happened.
Post by: Pathfinder101 on November 26, 2012, 12:59:34 PM
:yeah:
He never did tell us how court went?
He's probably tired of getting yelled at... Coming on this site and admitting to doing something wrong must feel a bit like going to confession, except that there is no screen and the priest keeps yelling at you and calling you names.... :(
Yeah... I appreciate these threads though... at least the first few pages of them. Being a new hunter, I have wondered what I would do should I misjudge my game. I would have tagged it, hauled it out, taken it home, and then called it in. I would never have thought of calling 911 because shooting the wrong animal doesn't fit in the "emergency" category of my head. These threads help me see the legal process. If he is even checking this thread anymore, I'd love to know what happened.
I know a guy that did this a few years ago. He called himself in immediately (before he even got it gutted). Still got the ticket. Court went a lot easier on him because he did though. A little more food for thought; when he called himself in the game warden said "Yeah, we already know about it. Someone called it in already..."
Post by: WSU on November 26, 2012, 01:33:22 PM
I think the punishment of simply pleading guilty and letting the judge crush you is far different from the punishment of negotiating a guilty plea with punishment before you get to the judge.
So basically a guy has to plead not guilty (even though he is guilty) and pay a lawyer to be able to get a better deal? I guess it is a way of keeping attorney's in business............ :dunno:
It's not like you have to hire an attorney. If you don't want to pay one feel free to just plead guilty and let the chips fall as they may....
Post by: Bob33 on November 26, 2012, 01:38:41 PM
Post by: Curly on November 26, 2012, 01:44:17 PM
I think the punishment of simply pleading guilty and letting the judge crush you is far different from the punishment of negotiating a guilty plea with punishment before you get to the judge.
So basically a guy has to plead not guilty (even though he is guilty) and pay a lawyer to be able to get a better deal? I guess it is a way of keeping attorney's in business............ :dunno:
It's not like you have to hire an attorney. If you don't want to pay one feel free to just plead guilty and let the chips fall as they may....
That is probably what I would do if I ever make a mistake like that. But if a guy wants to take a chance at getting a "deal" he has to plead not guilty apparently. It is too bad that the punishment for a mistake is the same as a poacher who purposely kills an illegal deer.
Post by: Bob33 on November 26, 2012, 01:53:40 PM
Quote
It is too bad that the punishment for a mistake is the same as a poacher who purposely kills an illegal deer.I would not presume that to be true in most instances. The enforcement officers I know would approach those situations differently and be more aggressive in a case of deliberate poaching.
Post by: WSU on November 26, 2012, 02:10:29 PM
Our hunter education classes usually have a session with an enforcement officer. He advises the students they are responsible for knowing the regulations. If a mistake is made, own up to it and accept the consequences. Trying to hide something or deceive them is going to exponentially increase the penalties if caught. As was pointed out, when they're asking you questions they typically already know the answer.
To each his own. I would tell them I will talk to my attorney about talking to them and leave it at that. It is plain stupid to talk to any law enforcement if you are being questioned prior to talking to a lawyer. Even if you do confess, it is better to work a deal through your attorney prior to doing so. Unless, of course, you are like Curly and just want to get the most severe punishment possible.
Post by: Hi-Liter on November 26, 2012, 02:46:45 PM
Our hunter education classes usually have a session with an enforcement officer. He advises the students they are responsible for knowing the regulations. If a mistake is made, own up to it and accept the consequences. Trying to hide something or deceive them is going to exponentially increase the penalties if caught. As was pointed out, when they're asking you questions they typically already know the answer.
To each his own. I would tell them I will talk to my attorney about talking to them and leave it at that. It is plain stupid to talk to any law enforcement if you are being questioned prior to talking to a lawyer. Even if you do confess, it is better to work a deal through your attorney prior to doing so. Unless, of course, you are like Curly and just want to get the most severe punishment possible.
Yep agree with WSU. You owe police officers no duty for cooperation or to give statements. Tell them you want a lawyer and shut up. You make your case worse the longer you speak or write statements. The worst Curely did was give them a written statement and stating that no lawyer will help my case- this is just stupid. Law is the law just because you admit to a crime, that doesn't mean you are entitled to a lesser degree of punishment or charge. I have seen some ridicolous statements from people to officer. I gues than go ahead admit you did, it just makes the police/prosecutors job a lot easier.
Post by: Hi-Liter on November 26, 2012, 02:51:19 PM
Post by: dscubame on November 26, 2012, 03:24:18 PM
Post by: Curly on November 26, 2012, 03:27:41 PM
Post by: Bob33 on November 26, 2012, 03:36:22 PM
I did not say to talk to law enforcement nor to avoid working towards a better deal. Accepting consequences to me means not being a victim and blaming others for your own actions.Our hunter education classes usually have a session with an enforcement officer. He advises the students they are responsible for knowing the regulations. If a mistake is made, own up to it and accept the consequences. Trying to hide something or deceive them is going to exponentially increase the penalties if caught. As was pointed out, when they're asking you questions they typically already know the answer.
To each his own. I would tell them I will talk to my attorney about talking to them and leave it at that. It is plain stupid to talk to any law enforcement if you are being questioned prior to talking to a lawyer. Even if you do confess, it is better to work a deal through your attorney prior to doing so. Unless, of course, you are like Curly and just want to get the most severe punishment possible.
Post by: WSU on November 26, 2012, 03:46:54 PM
I did not say to talk to law enforcement nor to avoid working towards a better deal. Accepting consequences to me means not being a victim and blaming others for your own actions.Our hunter education classes usually have a session with an enforcement officer. He advises the students they are responsible for knowing the regulations. If a mistake is made, own up to it and accept the consequences. Trying to hide something or deceive them is going to exponentially increase the penalties if caught. As was pointed out, when they're asking you questions they typically already know the answer.
To each his own. I would tell them I will talk to my attorney about talking to them and leave it at that. It is plain stupid to talk to any law enforcement if you are being questioned prior to talking to a lawyer. Even if you do confess, it is better to work a deal through your attorney prior to doing so. Unless, of course, you are like Curly and just want to get the most severe punishment possible.
I took your statement that you shouldn't try to hide anything and law enforcement already knows the answer if they are asking you questions to mean don't hide things from law enforcement. Sorry for the confusion.
Post by: scout/sniper on November 26, 2012, 03:47:45 PM
I did not say to talk to law enforcement nor to avoid working towards a better deal. Accepting consequences to me means not being a victim and blaming others for your own actions.:yeah:
Post by: JLS on November 26, 2012, 04:03:58 PM
Nothing you say to a cop can benefit you in any way, only harm.
Absolutely untrue.
Post by: hunterrcc on November 26, 2012, 04:15:44 PM
They look legal at 200 yards with a Tasco 3x9 scope standing in front of a tree with lots of limbs. I ran across quite a few big two points attached to skulls when I hunted the breaks on the Snake river in Eastern Washington. I think it happens more than one would think and most guys just jam out and leave them. I had thought they were all winter kill, now I am rethinking it.The snake river breaks get really big two points and I have seen first hand two bucks shot that were both two points from a high vantage point and found a third one dead in one season and at least one every yeare I have hunted there! One two point was about 24" wide. Watched the buck in the spotting scope assuming that this group of guys in which I just warned their buddy that there was a huge two point in the draw they were going to walk down. He told his buddies well I stood there and they said ok! Then the walk right through the draw and about 600yards down the hill jump it out of the brush within 100 yards and shoot it and start screaming hell yeah got it. Walk up to it and start dragging in into the brush and run out of there. I had an off duty sherriff with me hunting and we both saw it and called it in but they didn't get there in time and I couldn't get up the hill to my truck and drive around in time to get to them but they were not around the next year but were back party hunting muzzleloader about 7 years later. Oh and no binos on there neck no of them! STUPID PEOPLE
Post by: willys7 on November 26, 2012, 06:24:06 PM
Post by: 300UltraMagShooter on November 26, 2012, 06:48:19 PM
HEY ,if you guys out who shoot 2 points thinking they are legal shouldnt be out there period . Check out some of these nice bucks ,now think how many more would be availble to pursue if you didnt pop off all the two's . Looking forsupport on your act here is a disgrace,besides who in heck would stick a deer inside the cab if something wasnt up my guess is if you didnt get BUSTED no one would of this pathetic act.
you just sound greedy... all about how big the deer is... might as well start huggin trees. :twocents:
to me, the ones that shouldn't be out there are the ones that come up with these dumb laws that are bound to get deer killed and left. it's common sense, and no matter how you whine and moan and try to call people names, this law will ALWAYS get bucks killed and left.
i don't know if they did it on purpose or not, but innocent until proven guilty... unfortunately, most doesn't seem to have the slightest clue as to what that really means and how important it is.
however, to answer your question "that you could answer yourself if you had the slightest interest in trying to think for yourself", a person that didn't want to leave a deer in the woods to go to waste might be the type of person that would put the deer in the cab.
i just hope you hold yourself to such high standards when you mess up....
and as far as the person in question, i hope he is telling the truth and didn't shoot the 2 pt on purpose.... impossible for any of us to know, but since I don't know, I'll leave it at that.
Post by: Hi-Liter on November 26, 2012, 07:32:59 PM
Nothing you say to a cop can benefit you in any way, only harm.
Absolutely untrue.
[/quot
True even off-duty or on-duty. There is always a business of words...
Post by: supermatt9 on November 26, 2012, 07:51:07 PM
My original court date got moved to this Wednesday. I won't comment anymore until all the legal proceedings are over, but I will let you all know how it turns out once it's done.
Thanks again for all the helpful advice. There are a lot of good people on here!
Post by: Greenhorn on November 26, 2012, 08:28:51 PM
Post by: mdbuck5x5 on November 26, 2012, 09:09:46 PM
Post by: BirdHunter on November 26, 2012, 09:27:42 PM
Post by: mtman on November 27, 2012, 07:49:52 PM
Post by: jeepguy on November 29, 2012, 01:02:41 AM
Post by: Tbar on November 29, 2012, 01:26:47 AM
WTF. Lets put it this way for all you people that do not understand. RULES ARE MADE TO FOLLOW,KNOW YOUR TARGET ,DONT BE A DUMB ASS LIKE THIS GUY AND *censored* UP AND SHOOT A TWO YES 2 POINT IN A THREE , YES 3 POINT AREAANYONE THAT DEFENDS THIS STUPID SON OF A BITCH IS A *censored*IN IDIOT AND PROBLY VOTED FOR THE *censored*, FOLLOW THE *censored*IN RULES BITCHES :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :tup:A touch of class, you are a piece of work jeepguy.
Post by: NWBREW on November 29, 2012, 01:28:51 AM
Post by: bearpaw on November 29, 2012, 01:36:11 AM
Forum Rules: http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,4100.0.html (http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,4100.0.html)
WTF. Lets put it this way for all you people that do not understand. RULES ARE MADE TO FOLLOW,KNOW YOUR TARGET ,DONT BE A DUMB ASS LIKE THIS GUY AND *censored* UP AND SHOOT A TWO YES 2 POINT IN A THREE , YES 3 POINT AREAANYONE THAT DEFENDS THIS STUPID SON OF A BITCH IS A *censored*IN IDIOT AND PROBLY VOTED FOR THE *censored*, FOLLOW THE *censored*IN RULES BITCHES :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :tup:
Post by: JoeE on November 29, 2012, 02:45:57 AM
Post by: Jonathan_S on November 29, 2012, 02:59:21 AM
This will not be tolerated, email sent and 3 day ban implemented. Next time this guy uses profanity or racial slurs the ban will be longer if not permanent. Let this be a warning to any other members who have been considering the same type of behaviour.
Forum Rules: http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,4100.0.html (http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,4100.0.html)WTF. Lets put it this way for all you people that do not understand. RULES ARE MADE TO FOLLOW,KNOW YOUR TARGET ,DONT BE A DUMB ASS LIKE THIS GUY AND *censored* UP AND SHOOT A TWO YES 2 POINT IN A THREE , YES 3 POINT AREAANYONE THAT DEFENDS THIS STUPID SON OF A BITCH IS A *censored*IN IDIOT AND PROBLY VOTED FOR THE *censored*, FOLLOW THE *censored*IN RULES BITCHES :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :tup:
I hope three days is enough to cool down and find the caps lock button again.
Thanks for cleaning house Bearpaw.
Post by: boneaddict on November 29, 2012, 05:08:46 AM
Post by: Skyvalhunter on November 29, 2012, 05:14:34 AM
Post by: browney5er on November 29, 2012, 05:31:00 AM
WTF. Lets put it this way for all you people that do not understand. RULES ARE MADE TO FOLLOW,KNOW YOUR TARGET ,DONT BE A DUMB ASS LIKE THIS GUY AND *censored* UP AND SHOOT A TWO YES 2 POINT IN A THREE , YES 3 POINT AREAANYONE THAT DEFENDS THIS STUPID SON OF A BITCH IS A *censored*IN IDIOT AND PROBLY VOTED FOR THE *censored*, FOLLOW THE *censored*IN RULES BITCHES :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :tup:
Other than the profanity and the racial slur I would have to say well put.
Post by: JLS on November 29, 2012, 05:35:44 AM
WTF. Lets put it this way for all you people that do not understand. RULES ARE MADE TO FOLLOW,KNOW YOUR TARGET ,DONT BE A DUMB ASS LIKE THIS GUY AND *censored* UP AND SHOOT A TWO YES 2 POINT IN A THREE , YES 3 POINT AREAANYONE THAT DEFENDS THIS STUPID SON OF A BITCH IS A *censored*IN IDIOT AND PROBLY VOTED FOR THE *censored*, FOLLOW THE *censored*IN RULES BITCHES :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :tup:
Odd how one guy can go on a rant about respecting rules when he clearly has no respect for other humans. :rolleyes:
Post by: h20hunter on November 29, 2012, 06:19:37 AM
Wow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Post by: scout/sniper on November 29, 2012, 06:24:23 AM
What good can he possibly do for this community after that?
Post by: Bob33 on November 29, 2012, 06:39:25 AM
Post by: bearpaw on November 29, 2012, 06:45:51 AM
A small handful of very unacceptable words are on the autocensor list, I would caution that if a *censored* pops up in your post that you had better be ready to do your own editing right away or risk a short vacation from the site.
Post by: Woodchuck on November 29, 2012, 06:52:09 AM
ding ding ding, well summed up IMO. JLS's comment that is.WTF. Lets put it this way for all you people that do not understand. RULES ARE MADE TO FOLLOW,KNOW YOUR TARGET ,DONT BE A DUMB ASS LIKE THIS GUY AND *censored* UP AND SHOOT A TWO YES 2 POINT IN A THREE , YES 3 POINT AREAANYONE THAT DEFENDS THIS STUPID SON OF A BITCH IS A *censored*IN IDIOT AND PROBLY VOTED FOR THE *censored*, FOLLOW THE *censored*IN RULES BITCHES :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :tup:
Odd how one guy can go on a rant about respecting rules when he clearly has no respect for other humans. :rolleyes:
Post by: kenzmad on November 29, 2012, 06:56:20 AM
after monday and tuesday even the calendar says Wednesday,Thursday and Friday.
Post by: BK Dave on November 29, 2012, 06:57:56 AM
WTF. Lets put it this way for all you people that do not understand. RULES ARE MADE TO FOLLOW,KNOW YOUR TARGET ,DONT BE A DUMB ASS LIKE THIS GUY AND *censored* UP AND SHOOT A TWO YES 2 POINT IN A THREE , YES 3 POINT AREAANYONE THAT DEFENDS THIS STUPID SON OF A BITCH IS A *censored*IN IDIOT AND PROBLY VOTED FOR THE *censored*, FOLLOW THE *censored*IN RULES BITCHES :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :tup:Stumbled home from a Bar @ 1:02am. Didja ?
Post by: Russ McDonald on November 29, 2012, 08:03:36 AM
Now on a different subject. I went through this whole thread to read everything before I commented. I all go to say it was the best way to spend an hour of my work day. Good entertainment by some and good information by most.
Post by: boneaddict on November 29, 2012, 08:58:37 AM
Quote
I went through this whole thread to read everything before I commented. I all go to say it was the best way to spend an hour of my work day. Good entertainment by some and good information by most.
One of the benefits of having your name in red or blue on here. :chuckle:
Post by: runamuk on November 29, 2012, 09:03:00 AM
:chuckle: :chuckle: we get a bit of that around here.....heck I love drunken facebooking its the bombWTF. Lets put it this way for all you people that do not understand. RULES ARE MADE TO FOLLOW,KNOW YOUR TARGET ,DONT BE A DUMB ASS LIKE THIS GUY AND *censored* UP AND SHOOT A TWO YES 2 POINT IN A THREE , YES 3 POINT AREAANYONE THAT DEFENDS THIS STUPID SON OF A BITCH IS A *censored*IN IDIOT AND PROBLY VOTED FOR THE *censored*, FOLLOW THE *censored*IN RULES BITCHES :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :tup:Stumbled home from a Bar @ 1:02am. Didja ?
Post by: Kc_Kracker on November 29, 2012, 09:05:18 AM
I added an additional "N" word to the auto censor list, that should take care of that particular racial slur now and in the future.do people actually still use that? sheesh!
Post by: bearpaw on November 29, 2012, 09:08:12 AM
I added an additional "N" word to the auto censor list, that should take care of that particular racial slur now and in the future.do people actually still use that? sheesh!
They won't be anymore...
Post by: Kc_Kracker on November 29, 2012, 09:10:54 AM
Hey guys, I promise I'm not ignoring you or giving up on this thread. I started it, so I will see it through to the end, if for no other reason so that people can learn from it. if I had read a thread like this one I would've handled things very differently.so how did court go? i haven't kept up on this train wreck to not know :chuckle:
My original court date got moved to this Wednesday. I won't comment anymore until all the legal proceedings are over, but I will let you all know how it turns out once it's done.
Thanks again for all the helpful advice. There are a lot of good people on here!
Post by: Kc_Kracker on November 29, 2012, 09:12:14 AM
wow, just wow cannot belive that someone would post that on a public forum more, worry but ban the loser i doubt ONE single member will care, miss him, or not be glad you did. shows his intellectual gearing :oI added an additional "N" word to the auto censor list, that should take care of that particular racial slur now and in the future.do people actually still use that? sheesh!
They won't be anymore...
Post by: KDume on November 29, 2012, 09:48:02 AM
Post by: Boss .300 winmag on November 29, 2012, 09:53:00 AM
Post by: Doc Sauce on November 29, 2012, 10:00:39 AM
So he has typing turrets? :dunno:
This might be an old phrase, but it's the first time i've heard it. Had to put my coffee down! Typing turrets... classic.
Post by: BK Dave on November 29, 2012, 10:01:51 AM
Post by: Kc_Kracker on November 29, 2012, 10:11:38 AM
It must be one of those "Jeep things" we just don't get itbaaaahahhahahhahhahaha
Post by: Greenhorn on November 29, 2012, 11:05:21 AM
I'm embarrassed to say I know Jeep Guy, used to work with him. He is suppose to be on medication for his behavior, it sounds to me he either skipped a pill or they need to increase his prescription. He actually can be a pretty nice person when he is under control!
Probably shouldn't be posting about Jeeps personal life. Since Jeeps is banned for a couple days and can't defend himself is one reason another is that it doesn't belong here. Either way it doesn't seem appropriate.
Post by: Hi-Liter on November 29, 2012, 12:08:07 PM
Post by: WSU on November 29, 2012, 12:20:09 PM
WTF. Lets put it this way for all you people that do not understand. RULES ARE MADE TO FOLLOW,KNOW YOUR TARGET ,DONT BE A DUMB ASS LIKE THIS GUY AND *censored* UP AND SHOOT A TWO YES 2 POINT IN A THREE , YES 3 POINT AREAANYONE THAT DEFENDS THIS STUPID SON OF A BITCH IS A *censored*IN IDIOT AND PROBLY VOTED FOR THE *censored*, FOLLOW THE *censored*IN RULES BITCHES :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :twocents: :tup:Stumbled home from a Bar @ 1:02am. Didja ?
That's what I was thinking. I love posts like this. The poster goes out of his way to call the OP stupid but can't spell or punctuate at an elementary school level.
Post by: Kowsrule30 on November 29, 2012, 12:24:35 PM
Hope court went well!!
Post by: dscubame on November 29, 2012, 12:59:22 PM
I'm embarrassed to say I know Jeep Guy, used to work with him. He is suppose to be on medication for his behavior, it sounds to me he either skipped a pill or they need to increase his prescription. He actually can be a pretty nice person when he is under control!
Probably shouldn't be posting about Jeeps personal life. Since Jeeps is banned for a couple days and can't defend himself is one reason another is that is doesn't belong here. Either way it doesn't seem appropriate.
I say bash the heck out of him!!
Post by: AOD on November 29, 2012, 02:03:19 PM
Post by: cleem-j3(BBD!!!) on November 29, 2012, 02:54:26 PM
Post by: h20hunter on November 29, 2012, 03:06:34 PM
"Hey guys, I promise I'm not ignoring you or giving up on this thread. I started it, so I will see it through to the end, if for no other reason so that people can learn from it. if I had read a thread like this one I would've handled things very differently.
My original court date got moved to this Wednesday. I won't comment anymore until all the legal proceedings are over, but I will let you all know how it turns out once it's done.
Thanks again for all the helpful advice. There are a lot of good people on here"
Just from a few pages back.....think he is keeping quiet to sort this out and then post regarding outcome if he chooses to.
Post by: Russ McDonald on November 29, 2012, 03:17:09 PM
Post by: Kowsrule30 on November 29, 2012, 03:58:10 PM
Post by: b0bbyg on November 29, 2012, 04:06:39 PM
So he has typing turrets? :dunno:
Had not seen this before, but I really like it :chuckle:
By Jeep guys own standards he should be banned for life, after all the rules are the rules and he did not follow them.
Post by: jackelope on November 29, 2012, 07:25:06 PM
So he has typing turrets? :dunno:
Had not seen this before, but I really like it :chuckle:
By Jeep guys own standards he should be banned for life, after all the rules are the rules and he did not follow them.
And its not the 1st time....
Post by: scout/sniper on November 30, 2012, 06:28:34 AM
Like Bob33 said, action has been taken and maybe it will help.So he has typing turrets? :dunno:
Had not seen this before, but I really like it :chuckle:
By Jeep guys own standards he should be banned for life, after all the rules are the rules and he did not follow them.
And its not the 1st time....
He certainly should not be granted leniency the next time.
Post by: Kc_Kracker on November 30, 2012, 08:33:30 AM
Post by: scout/sniper on November 30, 2012, 08:36:07 AM
ok poster you went to court already, and you been logged in everyday, so whats the update? alot of members put alot of energy into typing stuff out and tryingt o offer help I think its only fair, what happened at court? :dunno::yeah:
Post by: BNAElkhntr on November 30, 2012, 08:41:20 AM
This is a prime example of how this state is so screwed up...I would be willing to bet that the OP "Thought" this deer was a 3 point hoping for an eye guard..They need to take this stupid ass rule out of the equation, that would save a hell of a lot of 2 points from being killed..But we all know this state is all about the all mighty "Dollar"...3 points on the main beam only. Eye guards should never be considered a point.
Good lick to the OP on your court case..
Hunterman(Tony)
Post by: dscubame on November 30, 2012, 08:42:22 AM
Post by: rtspring on November 30, 2012, 09:21:20 AM
Post by: Kc_Kracker on November 30, 2012, 10:06:32 AM
just because you were wrongly accused dont let it cloud your judgement of a hunter that did actually do it, then tried to get away with it. if we all patted him on the back, hugged him and said its ok, what would he learn :dunno:
i would assume he learned alot in the course of this thread legally and morally, thats all anyone could ask for :tup: he stated he would update us, so lets hope he does, I for one hope they had some mercy on him as a first offense and he moves on to be a great example for others as a good future hunter :tup:
Post by: jackelope on November 30, 2012, 10:36:52 AM
Post by: Sneekee23 on November 30, 2012, 10:56:42 AM
Post by: Kc_Kracker on November 30, 2012, 11:10:34 AM
if we all patted him on the back, hugged him and said its ok, what would he learn :dunno:
its not the forums/public's place to teach him a lesson..that's what the courts are for..
uh hello, this is a DISCUSSION FORUM or did you miss that :chuckle: but your right we as hunters should not have a open opinion on poaching, we dont want to offend the poachers we want them to feel all welcome warm and fuzzy, we should not tell them how we feel about poaching, we dont want to set a positive tone or example we should just shut our mouths and wait for the law to flog them.
you should pm bearpaw and tell him all threads, posts, and replies that state negative feelings towards poaching you want removed immediately because its the courts job to tell them its bad, not ours.
its our sport, if we dont give a damn who will? sorry but your theory is asinine :rolleyes:
Post by: jackelope on November 30, 2012, 11:22:59 AM
ok poster you went to court already, and you been logged in everyday, so whats the update? alot of members put alot of energy into typing stuff out and tryingt o offer help I think its only fair, what happened at court? :dunno:The guy should keep his mouth shut until his trial and everything else is done. He should not be running his mouth on an Internet forum telling everybody what is going on. That will not work out well for him in the end. To expect him to come on here and tell everyone on a wide-open Internet forum what is going on with his trial as it is still going on is crazy. I felt the same way with rtspring and his ordeal. This is no different. It's like babbling to the free world about any other crime and court proceedings someone is going through.
Why should anyone post all the details on the Internet for the world to see? They shouldn't!!
Post by: bobcat on November 30, 2012, 11:26:31 AM
It would be poaching if it were done intentionally. But it was a mistake, so no it wasn't poaching, and he is not a poacher.
Post by: Kc_Kracker on November 30, 2012, 11:32:56 AM
Post by: supermatt9 on November 30, 2012, 11:33:35 AM
Post by: JLS on November 30, 2012, 11:34:28 AM
the shot was accidental, but on top of that smuggling it out, hiding it in his back seat and trying to drive home and being busted on the road by the cops with an illegal kill in his vehicle isnt poaching? are you kidding me bobcat, did you just say that's not poaching? :o
Semantics Grasshoppa ;)
Post by: rtspring on November 30, 2012, 11:38:13 AM
Post by: Kc_Kracker on November 30, 2012, 11:45:03 AM
JLS- sorry the semantics changed to a fact when the animal entered the vehicle :bash: but i am for second chances :tup:
RT- rot? who said anything about rotting. I didnt jump his case, i jumped YOURS for defending a poached animal, and ill jump anyone's case for defending a poach
Post by: JLS on November 30, 2012, 11:45:52 AM
What was he suopose to do? Leave it to rot? BS, get off his case!
Uh, he could have self reported :dunno:
Post by: JLS on November 30, 2012, 11:47:56 AM
Kracker,
I was entirely being a smartass (or a *censored* depending on your perspective). Every year we have these raging debates about what consitutes "poaching". As if it really matters in the long run. He's not being charged with "poaching", he's being charged will illegally killing a two point.
I too hope he learns from it.
Post by: bobcat on November 30, 2012, 11:49:07 AM
What was he suopose to do? Leave it to rot? BS, get off his case!
Uh, he could have self reported :dunno:
He said he planned to do so. :dunno:
Post by: JLS on November 30, 2012, 11:53:43 AM
And yes, he said he was going to but you snooze you lose. I'm guessing he had a cell phone and cell signal, make some phone calls. I'm not judging, I'm just saying.
Post by: bobcat on November 30, 2012, 11:56:54 AM
I was answering RT's question, that insinuated the poor soul had no options.
And yes, he said he was going to but you snooze you lose. I'm guessing he had a cell phone and cell signal, make some phone calls. I'm not judging, I'm just saying.
I'm only going by the story he told on here. What if you don't own a cell phone? Wouldn't you drive home, or perhaps to the nearest pay phone (do those exist anymore?) and then make the call?
Post by: hillbillyhunting on November 30, 2012, 03:12:24 PM
I am glad the OP seems to be trying to do the right thing, and I am glad that he is having to live up to his mistakes, but i wouldnt go as far as calling him a poacher.
Post by: Curly on November 30, 2012, 03:14:28 PM
Post by: blacktailer on November 30, 2012, 03:23:17 PM
Sorry Kracker, but it seems a little funny to me that the same person who is posting questions about how to interpret the hunting regulations is so passionate about another hunter acidentally breaking the law. If you are not careful you may end up a "poacher" too. Before asking the question on an open forum you were under the impression that you could hunt modern season with an archery tag and bow :dunno:
I am glad the OP seems to be trying to do the right thing, and I am glad that he is having to live up to his mistakes, but i wouldnt go as far as calling him a poacher.
Right on Hillbilly :tup:
Post by: kckrawler on November 30, 2012, 05:17:18 PM
Sorry Kracker, but it seems a little funny to me that the same person who is posting questions about how to interpret the hunting regulations is so passionate about another hunter acidentally breaking the law. If you are not careful you may end up a "poacher" too. Before asking the question on an open forum you were under the impression that you could hunt modern season with an archery tag and bow :dunno:
I am glad the OP seems to be trying to do the right thing, and I am glad that he is having to live up to his mistakes, but i wouldnt go as far as calling him a poacher.
:yeah: Agree 100%
Post by: 300UltraMagShooter on November 30, 2012, 05:33:40 PM
There is a lot of risk in calling it in... hard to say who you're going to get on the other end of the line. Reasonable person or whacko that goes through your truck and takes your stuff (if not your truck)... who knows what else they'd try to do depending on their attitude/mood. (Just look at some of the law worshipers here... I'd sure hate to think of them having autority over me or one of my family members in such a case. As if their idea of right and wrong was better than ours.)
I wont judge either way. Take a lot of courage to call it in, but I guess you just take your lumps?
Post by: 300UltraMagShooter on November 30, 2012, 05:43:20 PM
:yeah:This is a prime example of how this state is so screwed up...I would be willing to bet that the OP "Thought" this deer was a 3 point hoping for an eye guard..They need to take this stupid ass rule out of the equation, that would save a hell of a lot of 2 points from being killed..But we all know this state is all about the all mighty "Dollar"...3 points on the main beam only. Eye guards should never be considered a point.
Good lick to the OP on your court case..
Hunterman(Tony)
Better idea, let's just say 3 pts on a side and size doesn't matter.... Plus, let's not make it a law, just a rule..... or something like that. Why must every silly idea become a law punishable by $$$ and threat? To err is human...
This would also stop every goofball calling someone a poacher when they make a mistake?
Post by: runamuk on November 30, 2012, 09:17:48 PM
the shot was accidental, but on top of that smuggling it out, hiding it in his back seat and trying to drive home and being busted on the road by the cops with an illegal kill in his vehicle isnt poaching? are you kidding me bobcat, did you just say that's not poaching? :oyes and I agree not poaching.....accidents happen this state would rather an accident become a wasted animal, than an honest attempt to right the wrong by not just leaving the animal to become coyote food. Its sad that we live in a place so cluttered with laws and laws where money not morals is the reason for enforcement. If our government actually gave a crap it would always try and salvage meat from every situation, accidents would not be treated the same as intentional killing by slobs who then leave carcasses but take heads....if our state put the meat on the animal ahead of the damn money to be made on the horns it would go a long way to cleaning up poaching by true slobs who would just shoot animals to see them die or to take their horns.
Quote
poach 2 (pch)
v. poached, poach·ing, poach·es
v.intr.
1. To trespass on another's property in order to take fish or game.
2. To take fish or game in a forbidden area.
3. To become muddy or broken up from being trampled. Used of land.
4. To sink into soft earth when walking.
5.
a. To take or appropriate something unfairly or illegally.
b. Sports To play a ball out of turn or in another's territory, as in doubles tennis.
v.tr.
1. To trespass on (another's property) for fishing or hunting.
2. To take (fish or game) illegally.
3. To make (land) muddy or broken up by trampling.
4.
a. To take or appropriate unfairly or illegally.
b. Sports To play (a ball) out of turn or in another's territory.
[Obsolete French pocher, to poke, thrust, intrude, from Old French pochier, to poke, gouge, of Germanic origin.]
Post by: csaaphill on November 30, 2012, 09:40:38 PM
been really letting this one go by though. hadn't really wanted to get into it all lol.
anyways I wish the guy luck whatever punishment they give don't pout it could of been worse.
Post by: Dan-o on November 30, 2012, 10:05:41 PM
Some of the internet long arm police will crucify you on the spot..... Sheesh.
Post by: csaaphill on November 30, 2012, 10:08:52 PM
Post by: Buckmark on November 30, 2012, 10:42:17 PM
Why would he post? Some of you.have him a covicted murderer over a frickin deer!Some people LOVE drama :dunno:
Post by: rotty33 on December 01, 2012, 09:16:59 AM
Post by: Curly on December 01, 2012, 09:18:41 AM
In his post he says: "We saw one buck in the group that we both would have sworn on a bible that was a 3 point." So, apparently he was "sure"............he just wasn't right. Doesn't mean that WDFW shares any blame in it.........
Post by: rotty33 on December 01, 2012, 09:29:30 AM
Post by: bobcat on December 01, 2012, 09:33:01 AM
It needs to be improved.
:bdid:
Post by: Atroxus on December 01, 2012, 09:43:04 AM
It needs to be improved.
Really? What could they "improve" that would have resulted in the OP making a better identification? :dunno: The fact is the OP made a mistake, he owned up to it and is facing the consequences. He is not blaming WDFW, why should we?
Post by: rotty33 on December 01, 2012, 09:50:38 AM
Post by: rotty33 on December 01, 2012, 09:55:12 AM
Post by: Atroxus on December 01, 2012, 10:16:02 AM
I think the consequences of your actions and ethical topics should be instilled more for boneheads who are either trigger happy or think they can get away with things like this. This wasn't a mistake. The person wasn't careful enough to make sure of his target. Most people should know to be extra careful with a deer that looks to barely make the 3 pt. min. Just like the hunters who shoot at 1x2 bulls in a true spike unit.
They already teach ethics and target identification in hunter's education. It's pretty easy to say "This program should be better." It's a bit more difficult though to actually come up with ideas on HOW to make it better.
Seems a lot of people here think they are perfect and would never misidentify a target. It never ceases to amaze me how quickly and fervently some of us will turn on each other over even the most trivial of infractions. We are all hunters, and as far as I know we are all human, which makes us inherently imperfect. We have all made mistakes, and/or bad decisions and will likely make numerous more before we hit the end of the trail. Mocking and ridiculing someone who openly admitted to their wrongs and is facing the consequences of those actions just seems petty to me. :twocents:
Plus he didn't own up to it. They should teach a person what to do if they do mess up. Call right away!!!! Because if you don't you look like a criminal. He might be hosed. The fact is he was caught and didn't own up right away. That looks really bad whether he had good intentions or not!
Maybe I am too trusting at times, but I see no reason not to take the guy at his word. If he was trying to weasel out of the charges, or get away with something, then posting about it on the internet and admitting fault would be about the stupidest way I could think of to go about it.
Post by: rotty33 on December 01, 2012, 11:43:17 AM
Just wondering if you all think this should be taught in hunter Ed so everyone understands what to do?
Post by: GEARHEAD on December 01, 2012, 12:32:29 PM
Post by: skywalker253 on December 01, 2012, 12:45:54 PM
Post by: xXLojackXx on December 01, 2012, 03:47:26 PM
Post by: jackelope on December 01, 2012, 03:51:03 PM
Post by: 400out on December 01, 2012, 03:59:07 PM
Post by: jeepguy on December 03, 2012, 07:57:50 AM
Post by: Curly on December 03, 2012, 08:05:57 AM
Post by: dscubame on December 03, 2012, 09:16:56 AM
Okay i crossed the line lost my composer on this i shoulda justlet this go.But i have read posts scince ,suddenly it was said tobe a acciddental shooting ? so was the SAUK MT incident both cases the shooters did not know thier targets, why ? i would say lack of skill pateince.You spot a possible legal buck ur not sure but u take the shot anyway ?I would hunt anydeer if i were u until u git a few harvests under ur hat. I realize there are all kinds that hunt ,maybe they should bring back squirrel huntin for them. Its not okay wat ya did there is no sympathy for u,u should be required to take and pass hunter education every year u hunt .To those that responded to my post yea wat ever ,to the moniters i apologize for abusing wat some of u have worked hard to make a enjoyable site. I hold myself to a high quality standard when out in the field ,its things like this that prove u cant just give anybody a firearm and send them out hunting.This time it was a deer next time who knows wat it could be.stay in 410 dude
And I would jump all over you for your spelling and grammar. I think if one cannot spell or write correctly they have no business on a forum that requires so much spelling and grammar. I mean how can someone not know what they are going to write when they use the keyboard? if you do not know what to write do not use the keyboard. I am just saying I have patience, proper typing education, adequate writing education, and forum ethics when it comes down to it. And for those that go off writting half cocked it just proves you cannot just give anybody a keyboard and send them out on a forum. (By the way did you even count all the spell check errors you have?)
Post by: scout/sniper on December 03, 2012, 09:31:57 AM
Okay i crossed the line lost my composer on this i shoulda justlet this go.Your behavior goes far beyond being upset over a thread.
The language and terms you used show what a bigot and who you really are at the core.
IMO someone like you has no business here.
I will certainly never take you seriously.
Post by: Hi-Liter on December 03, 2012, 09:40:51 AM
Post by: Pathfinder101 on December 03, 2012, 10:06:38 AM
Okay i crossed the line lost my composer on this i shoulda justlet this go.But i have read posts scince ,suddenly it was said tobe a acciddental shooting ? so was the SAUK MT incident both cases the shooters did not know thier targets, why ? i would say lack of skill pateince.You spot a possible legal buck ur not sure but u take the shot anyway ?I would hunt anydeer if i were u until u git a few harvests under ur hat. I realize there are all kinds that hunt ,maybe they should bring back squirrel huntin for them. Its not okay wat ya did there is no sympathy for u,u should be required to take and pass hunter education every year u hunt .To those that responded to my post yea wat ever ,to the moniters i apologize for abusing wat some of u have worked hard to make a enjoyable site. I hold myself to a high quality standard when out in the field ,its things like this that prove u cant just give anybody a firearm and send them out hunting.This time it was a deer next time who knows wat it could be.stay in 410 dude
And I would jump all over you for your spelling and grammar. I think if one cannot spell or write correctly they have no business on a forum that requires so much spelling and grammar. I mean how can someone not know what they are going to write when they use the keyboard? if you do not know what to write do not use the keyboard. I am just saying I have patience, proper typing education, adequate writing education, and forum ethics when it comes down to it. And for those that go off writting half cocked it just proves you cannot just give anybody a keyboard and send them out on a forum. (By the way did you even count all the spell check errors you have?)
:chuckle: :chuckle:
Post by: Arnbo on December 03, 2012, 10:09:03 AM
Not to good at learning?.......lol
Post by: MtnMuley on December 03, 2012, 10:10:36 AM
:lol4:Okay i crossed the line lost my composer on this i shoulda justlet this go.Your behavior goes far beyond being upset over a thread.
The language and terms you used show what a bigot and who you really are at the core.
IMO someone like you has no business here.
I will certainly never take you seriously.
I seriously enjoy his posts now, because he is so pathetic it's humorous!
Post by: Gutpile on December 03, 2012, 10:58:09 AM
I just want to know if he had his day in court yet. Anybody? Anybody?
Post by: Blacktail Sniper on December 03, 2012, 11:05:46 AM
GEEEZUZZZZZZZ!!! I wish some of you wuld STFU!!! :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle:
I just want to know if he had his day in court yet. Anybody? Anybody?
Back on page 17, reply #253 :chuckle: he said he would update us when it was all said and done. Likely told by an Atty to stop posting stuff about the case on an open fourm.
Post by: scout/sniper on December 03, 2012, 11:07:27 AM
GEEEZUZZZZZZZ!!! I wish some of you wuld STFU!!! :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle:He already said it could be months.
I just want to know if he had his day in court yet. Anybody? Anybody?
Post by: Gutpile on December 03, 2012, 11:10:08 AM
I shot two grouse with one shot once which put me one over the limit. Am I a poacher??
Post by: NWBREW on December 03, 2012, 11:11:34 AM
Thanks guys. Ive been skimming through just looking for his posts. :chuckle:
I shot two grouse with one shot once which put me one over the limit. Am I a poacher??
yes. :chuckle:
Post by: Gutpile on December 03, 2012, 11:13:08 AM
Post by: boneaddict on December 03, 2012, 11:15:48 AM
Post by: Atroxus on December 03, 2012, 11:21:34 AM
GEEEZUZZZZZZZ!!! I wish some of you wuld STFU!!! :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle:
I just want to know if he had his day in court yet. Anybody? Anybody?
Back on page 17, reply #253 :chuckle: he said he would update us when it was all said and done. Likely told by an Atty to stop posting stuff about the case on an open fourm.
If his attorney didn't tell him that, then either he didn't tell his attorney what he has been posting, or he needs to find a new attorney. :chuckle:
Post by: scout/sniper on December 03, 2012, 01:47:35 PM
:yeah::lol4:Okay i crossed the line lost my composer on this i shoulda justlet this go.Your behavior goes far beyond being upset over a thread.
The language and terms you used show what a bigot and who you really are at the core.
IMO someone like you has no business here.
I will certainly never take you seriously.
I seriously enjoy his posts now, because he is so pathetic it's humorous!
Post by: BK Dave on December 03, 2012, 03:16:20 PM
Okay i crossed the line lost my composer on this i shoulda justlet this go.But i have read posts scince ,suddenly it was said tobe a acciddental shooting ? so was the SAUK MT incident both cases the shooters did not know thier targets, why ? i would say lack of skill pateince.You spot a possible legal buck ur not sure but u take the shot anyway ?I would hunt anydeer if i were u until u git a few harvests under ur hat. I realize there are all kinds that hunt ,maybe they should bring back squirrel huntin for them. Its not okay wat ya did there is no sympathy for u,u should be required to take and pass hunter education every year u hunt .To those that responded to my post yea wat ever ,to the moniters i apologize for abusing wat some of u have worked hard to make a enjoyable site. I hold myself to a high quality standard when out in the field ,its things like this that prove u cant just give anybody a firearm and send them out hunting.This time it was a deer next time who knows wat it could be.stay in 410 dudeHey don't listen to these guys. I kinda hear what you're trying to say here.....
I have kids
4yr old grabs my phone and types all the time
Post by: rock on December 03, 2012, 03:27:03 PM
Okay i crossed the line lost my composer on this i shoulda justlet this go.But i have read posts scince ,suddenly it was said tobe a acciddental shooting ? so was the SAUK MT incident both cases the shooters did not know thier targets, why ? i would say lack of skill pateince.You spot a possible legal buck ur not sure but u take the shot anyway ?I would hunt anydeer if i were u until u git a few harvests under ur hat. I realize there are all kinds that hunt ,maybe they should bring back squirrel huntin for them. Its not okay wat ya did there is no sympathy for u,u should be required to take and pass hunter education every year u hunt .To those that responded to my post yea wat ever ,to the moniters i apologize for abusing wat some of u have worked hard to make a enjoyable site. I hold myself to a high quality standard when out in the field ,its things like this that prove u cant just give anybody a firearm and send them out hunting.This time it was a deer next time who knows wat it could be.stay in 410 dudeYou should go back to elementary school is what you should do. Get off the guys arse about the deer, when you can't even spell out your insults. It's nearly impossible to understand your "post".
Post by: Tbar on December 03, 2012, 03:29:17 PM
Okay i crossed the line lost my composer on this i shoulda justlet this go.But i have read posts scince ,suddenly it was said tobe a acciddental shooting ? so was the SAUK MT incident both cases the shooters did not know thier targets, why ? i would say lack of skill pateince.You spot a possible legal buck ur not sure but u take the shot anyway ?I would hunt anydeer if i were u until u git a few harvests under ur hat. I realize there are all kinds that hunt ,maybe they should bring back squirrel huntin for them. Its not okay wat ya did there is no sympathy for u,u should be required to take and pass hunter education every year u hunt .To those that responded to my post yea wat ever ,to the moniters i apologize for abusing wat some of u have worked hard to make a enjoyable site. I hold myself to a high quality standard when out in the field ,its things like this that prove u cant just give anybody a firearm and send them out hunting.This time it was a deer next time who knows wat it could be.stay in 410 dudeYou really want to compare a tragedy on multiple levels to shooting a 2 point. Your train of thought amazes me, what happened on Sauk not only destroyed two lives (the victim and the shooter) it painted us as sportsman and hunters in a terrible light. The OP shot a 2 point.
Post by: link on December 03, 2012, 04:32:54 PM
Post by: xXLojackXx on December 03, 2012, 07:33:00 PM
Post by: ellensburgpo on December 03, 2012, 07:34:27 PM
Can we all pitch in $5 and buy JeepGuy a copy of Rosetta Stone so he can learn some damn English?
:chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle: :'( :'( :'( :'( :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle:
So funny...
Post by: lokidog on December 03, 2012, 08:32:09 PM
Can we all pitch in $5 and buy JeepGuy a copy of Rosetta Stone so he can learn some damn English?
:chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle: :'( :'( :'( :'( :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle:
So funny...
:chuckle: :chuckle:
Post by: jeepguy on December 03, 2012, 08:38:36 PM
Post by: Bean Counter on December 03, 2012, 08:43:19 PM
Can we all pitch in $5 and buy JeepGuy a copy of Rosetta Stone so he can learn some damn English?
:chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle: :'( :'( :'( :'( :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle:
So funny...
:chuckle: :chuckle:
I'm good for $10. The lack of punctuation makes me want to gouge my eye balls out.
Post by: kentrek on December 03, 2012, 08:48:20 PM
Well the guy that shot the two point in a three point area should have to take hunter ed every six months he called it a accidental shooting at one point next time it could be a another hunter. Someone said the game department is at fault thats impossible the guy with the rifle is guilty as all get out trigger happy should be his name cause theres nothin super about him
if you get a speeding ticket should you have to retake drivers ed ???
hows a deer turn into a hunter exactly ???
either way ive honestly seen a 6 point bull that after an hour of watching turned out to be a three by four..it happens....hunters like jeepguy an a lot of the other "perfect hunters" on here is just another reason why i avoid talking to people in the woods in WA,your setting a cruddy environment for us all,no wonder people in idaho hate WA residents....
Post by: runamuk on December 03, 2012, 08:50:52 PM
Well the guy that shot the two point in a three point area should have to take hunter ed every six months he called it a accidental shooting at one point next time it could be a another hunter. Someone said the game department is at fault thats impossible the guy with the rifle is guilty as all get out trigger happy should be his name cause theres nothin super about him
if you get a speeding ticket should you have to retake drivers ed ???yes :tup:
hows a deer turn into a hunter exactly ???
either way ive honestly seen a 6 point bull that after an hour of watching turned out to be a three by four..it happens....hunters like jeepguy an a lot of the other "perfect hunters" on here is just another reason why i avoid talking to people in the woods in WA,your setting a cruddy environment for us all,no wonder people in idaho hate WA residents....
Post by: Bob33 on December 03, 2012, 08:57:42 PM
Guess I'll be hunting alone again. :chuckle:
Post by: kentrek on December 03, 2012, 08:59:51 PM
if you get a speeding ticket should you have to retake drivers ed ???yes :tup:
:chuckle:
Post by: Skyvalhunter on December 03, 2012, 09:00:31 PM
Post by: Tbar on December 03, 2012, 09:01:40 PM
Wanted: perfect hunter partner. Must never make any mistake and his stuff can't smell. Candidates without perfect spelling need not apply.But jeepguy shoots 180'' deer in general season on public land.
Guess I'll be hunting alone again. :chuckle
Post by: dscubame on December 03, 2012, 09:04:31 PM
Post by: deerslyr on December 03, 2012, 09:15:16 PM
Post by: jeepguy on December 03, 2012, 10:00:49 PM
Post by: RifleRidge on December 03, 2012, 10:04:00 PM
Post by: Greenhorn on December 03, 2012, 10:08:54 PM
Post by: RifleRidge on December 03, 2012, 10:16:57 PM
Why do I keep coming back to this thread? Would you all stop posting on here, it is driving me nuts!
:sry: :yeah:
Post by: jackelope on December 03, 2012, 10:36:06 PM
Post by: skywalker253 on December 03, 2012, 11:29:25 PM
Since everyone is saying this is a dead thread; let me bring it back to life. I have posted numerous times in here, and I have no reason to BS or lie. I have nothing to gain out of this. After going back and reading the thread, I began to wonder. A few days ago, I asked "what GMU did this take place in?" No response. So why did I ask that? Because I am 99.9% sure that I am the one, who turned this guy in. His story is all BS. Allow me to explain....
All little history of the area....
The offense took place in GMU 162. I have hunted there for over 25 years. My father is 66 years old and has hunted there since he was 18 years old. We know all the land owners and have taken our share of deer. Those who are not familar; much of 162 and 163 is apart of the Puget Sound Energy and Pacific Corp windmill project. Hunters have to watch a safety video, sign their life away, etc. to hunt the property. For years the Pacific Corp area has been closed. Recently they have become more open to hunting. They have begun to open more of the area. PSE property has always been 50% open. It has pretty much stayed the same for the last 10 years. Bottom line....the last thing hunters need is for a fellow hunter to screw it up for everyone and get the entire area closed. It is a highly sensitive area to hunters.
In regards to the 3 point or better rule....
Every year I find dead does and bucks; usually 2 points. Every couple of years I witness someone shoot an illegal deer. I ususally turn the other way and hope they would do the ethical thing and turn themselves in, or pack it out and not let the deer go to waste. This year was a different story.
The offense....
It was the second day of modern deer season. I tagged out on opening day with a nice 3 x 3, so we decided we would do a little road hunting and recover from the prior days pack. We head up the road and see 20 deer standing out in the field. The field is posted every 15 feet "NO HUNTING". I happen to know the land owner, who is a fellow hunter. It is freshly seeded field. The field also houses 2 main Pacific Corp power facilities. These are the main facilities, which all the windmill power generated feeds into. On the backside of the field is a road, which leads to some state land. The adjacent road has a nice open area for hunters to park in. Basically it is a parking lot during hunting season. We notice 5 vehicles full of hunters parked and preparing to hunt. We later learn they were all together, as one large group of 11 hunters with a few young kids. The herd of 20 deer has two 2 points and a spike. The rest are does. We park and start checking out the deer via spotting scope. We watch the large group of 11 hunters trespass into the field. One of the adults raises his rifle TOWARDS THE MAIN POWER STATIONS and fires at a spike. He makes a terrible shot on the deer and it eventually goes down and dies. The Pacific Corp employees are waiving their hands and yelling at the hunter. Basically they were saying "WTF are you doing! You bleeping idoit!". The group walks up to the deer and soon realizes that they are being watched by 6 vehicles on the main road, and another 5 vehicles on the state land road. Everyone was looking at this group like they were a bunch of "idiot/meatball hunters" wondering WTF they were thinking. Soon the offenders partners were looking embarassed and questioning WTF was their hunting buddy thinking. You could see it all over their faces. Soon to realize they are in deep poo poo. They decide to get the hell outta there before they get caught. They drive up and down both roads for everyone to see their license plate number. Then they decide....maybe we should turn around and go back. They go out and pick the deer up whole, and place it in the back of their Jeep. As they drive down the road, they then decide it would be smarter to HIDE THE DEER IN THE BACKSEAT!!!! Soon later they then decide it would be even better to throw the deer off into the ditch. As they were doing this, the sheriff pulls up and starts questioning them. After lieing the game warden arrives. Soon the confess etc. and the rest is history.
A couple of things....
I was told the offender is a teacher from the Tri Cities.
I was told they said they did not have cell phone service and were planning to call it in.
There was 20 deer.
They put the deer in the backseat.
The Sheriff stopped them first, prior to the game warden arriving 5 minutes later.
I was told the initial court date was 11/21/12, which is the same court date.
The deer was taken by the game department to a local butcher at the gun club, to be later donated to the shelter.
These are all identical FACTS to his story.
Sounds to me to be the same flipping guy. He is an idiot and deserves to get nailed. He even tried to say it was his 11 year old kid, who shot the deer. Said his kid thought it was a whitetail doe, since he is a youth and they can shoot them during the general season. This was the ONE STUPID HUNTER, who potentially could ruin the entire area for the hunters, whom access the windmill project land. Imagine if he misses and hit a main power grid, or injures an employee of the power company. The deer was a flipping yearly spike! This was the second day of the season on a highly traveled main road. No 3 point is going to be standing on a main road on the second day of the season. It is a freeway over there with hunters. Any ethical, smart hunter, should be smart enuff to know that it is likely NOT LEGAL. Even if it was, the land is POSTED FOR A REASON. This entire story is BS and this guy did everything he could to cover up his stupidity and his mistakes. To the point he tried to get his 11 year old kid to take the bullet for the offense. Take this guys hunting privledges and thanks but NO THANKS!! That is the real story.
Now let the speculation begin...
Post by: deerslyr on December 03, 2012, 11:42:09 PM
Post by: skywalker253 on December 03, 2012, 11:51:25 PM
Well im not sure but it sounds like your making some assumptions here and I would of left it alone :twocents:
I waited a month or more to post this. I followed every post and made sure I got my facts straight before I posted. I did not want to make assumptions or jump to conclusions. Like I said...I have zero to gain out of this. All I am doing is putting it out there, that this guy is a lier and trying to twist his story to make himself look like he was the village idiot, who made an honest mistake. Later to regret it and depend on a public forum to advise him on how to handle his mistake. He is only sorry, because he and his buddies got caught by the Sheriff ditching the deer off. Lied to the Sheriff that they were involved in shooting the deer. Lied that his kid shot it etc. He is a POS and deserves to have his ass handed to him.
Post by: csaaphill on December 04, 2012, 12:01:42 AM
after reading his original post I kind of think he may have been trying to get away with something. But who really knows. Even if so he did do a good thing and at least try to get the deer out. Even a game warden would say they admire that. POS no but I don't know the guy personally might just be. before I get flamed ill read your whole post but felt I got the jest.
I may re post after but for now this is what I say.
Actually 163 might be part of the windmill areas 162 isn't 162 is more in the mountains and part of it is the rainwater area up in the blues. I'd gotten one of those permits didn't use it cuss i got mine closer to home.
not sure but thinking your mixing up two diff occasions.
Thinking of what you say as a spike even bad optics would tell that unless very far off. then he shouldn't be shooting anyways. Youths can shoot does but wouldn't think they would mistake a spike for a doe. Maybe a yearling without showing points but not spikes that are showing. climbing up a hill during deer season saw what looked like a spike or1x2 was very small though but still could tell that even with my optics. However yes he coudl just be lying strait up then you would be right.
I say leave the horse alone and move on now though he's in trouble as it is and hope he updates us all when done.
Post by: skywalker253 on December 04, 2012, 01:57:11 AM
Post by: boneaddict on December 04, 2012, 05:11:20 AM
Post by: Skyvalhunter on December 04, 2012, 05:17:37 AM
Post by: ldjbuff on December 04, 2012, 06:04:01 AM
Post by: longstevo on December 04, 2012, 06:09:58 AM
The reception is never good.
Post by: 92xj on December 04, 2012, 06:17:26 AM
blah blah blah.... No 3 point is going to be standing on a main road on the second day of the season. blah blah blah....
So, you're telling me deer can count and see their own antlers!?!
I think I'm doing all this hunting stuff wrong and underestimating deer.
Post by: Russ McDonald on December 04, 2012, 06:21:03 AM
Post by: Woodchuck on December 04, 2012, 06:39:14 AM
Definatley a different version of the story if it is the same event. If its not the same event then there are two idiots out there.Thers is lots more than 2. It happens a whole bunch more than anyone wants to see or even admit to seeing. :twocents:
Post by: xXLojackXx on December 04, 2012, 06:44:02 AM
Post by: Bluesdude on December 04, 2012, 06:46:47 AM
Post by: ldjbuff on December 04, 2012, 06:57:28 AM
Post by: boneaddict on December 04, 2012, 07:01:34 AM