Post by: philepe on December 16, 2013, 07:41:14 PM
Post by: buglebuster on December 16, 2013, 07:45:34 PM
Post by: snowpack on December 16, 2013, 07:50:29 PM
Post by: buckfvr on December 16, 2013, 08:00:45 PM
Regroup, start over somewhere else.....and good luck.
Post by: huntnphool on December 16, 2013, 08:03:25 PM
Title says it. :bash: Im looking for another state to deer hunt in just to fill the freezer. Im already looking forward to deer hunting next year, but probably not in western WA. I have only hunted in WA, almost exclusively wet side for a little over 15 years. I just need an ego boost this next year and to get the freezer filled. Yes I enjoy being in the woods but I also really really like to depend on having the meat because I hate buying meat at the store anymore. No I don't want to spend a fortune but which state would you guys recommend I start researching? Montana, Idaho, Nevada, Wyoming, Oregon, Northern Cali., Utah???? Im open for suggestions.If you are simply looking to fill the freezer then I wouldn't give up on Washington yet, it sounds like 2nd deer tags and multi season tags will be more readily available next year, so a doe might be a lot easier to tag.
Post by: dreamunelk on December 16, 2013, 08:06:37 PM
Post by: Russ McDonald on December 16, 2013, 08:21:24 PM
Post by: philepe on December 16, 2013, 08:43:33 PM
To be honest with you, deer are really simple to kill in this state. :twocents:To say that for all units would be pretty silly. What GMU's are you referring to? I have mostly the last 2 years been in 651, and 648. Before that I was in the Olympic unit I think its 621.
Post by: buglebuster on December 16, 2013, 08:52:36 PM
Def. Not the westside. I can consistantly find bucks in 2 of the worst units in the states number wise. Gmu 340 and 342.To be honest with you, deer are really simple to kill in this state. :twocents:To say that for all units would be pretty silly. What GMU's are you referring to? I have mostly the last 2 years been in 651, and 648. Before that I was in the Olympic unit I think its 621.
Post by: Karl Blanchard on December 16, 2013, 08:56:51 PM
They aren't that bad! Go find a buck up Rimrock or Bumping! Now thats bleek! I don't even think Rimrock broke the single digits for harvests for all the seasons! If you wanna just kill a deer for meat I would focus on some doe hunts. :twocents:Def. Not the westside. I can consistantly find bucks in 2 of the worst units in the states number wise. Gmu 340 and 342.To be honest with you, deer are really simple to kill in this state. :twocents:To say that for all units would be pretty silly. What GMU's are you referring to? I have mostly the last 2 years been in 651, and 648. Before that I was in the Olympic unit I think its 621.
Post by: buglebuster on December 16, 2013, 09:10:17 PM
Post by: mossback91 on December 16, 2013, 09:11:54 PM
Post by: Bigshooter on December 16, 2013, 09:13:08 PM
Post by: dreamunelk on December 16, 2013, 09:13:45 PM
Post by: wildweeds on December 16, 2013, 09:35:06 PM
Get 2 or 3 doe tags in Montana and have a good time.
Post by: Karl Blanchard on December 16, 2013, 09:41:14 PM
Oh come on karl :chuckle: I didnt know people actually hunted those units for deerThey don't! Guys just hit them with their trucks on the way down to silver beach to get more beer and throw tags on them! :chuckle:
I have hunted every square inch of the Rimrock unit over the last 18 years and have seen some very nice deer but there are not very many deer in that unit plain and simple. You keep talking about all these giant bucks you see but you never post up any pics? Do you not like to go kill these big bucks?They aren't that bad! Go find a buck up Rimrock or Bumping! Now thats bleek! I don't even think Rimrock broke the single digits for harvests for all the seasons! If you wanna just kill a deer for meat I would focus on some doe hunts. :twocents:Def. Not the westside. I can consistantly find bucks in 2 of the worst units in the states number wise. Gmu 340 and 342.To be honest with you, deer are really simple to kill in this state. :twocents:To say that for all units would be pretty silly. What GMU's are you referring to? I have mostly the last 2 years been in 651, and 648. Before that I was in the Olympic unit I think its 621.
I personally think there are a lot more deer in the bumping and rimrock than 342 :chuckle: :tung:. I couldn't believe some of the ghost bucks I saw in 356 during elk season. Same with 364 I always see quality ghost bucks in there. I am not giving my secret spots up either :sry:.Oh come on karl :chuckle: I didnt know people actually hunted those units for deer:chuckle: :chuckle:
and I agree with the above statements, stay on the westside. I saw deer west of the PCT every time I was on that side :twocents:
Post by: buglebuster on December 16, 2013, 10:29:12 PM
Post by: JLS on December 16, 2013, 10:34:29 PM
Saw a thing posted this weekend on another site claiming montana was considering discontinuing doe tags for a couple seasons due to a couple winters of pretty good winter kills,Hows that for a management tool............ foregoing the revenue income to benefit the herd,what a concept huh?Don't expect anything like that to EVER happen in washington.Get 2 or 3 doe tags in Montana and have a good time.
The relative revenue brought in from the doe tags is paltry compared to the revenue brought in by the deer/elk combination licenses.
Doe tags are sold their as a population management tool. That's why the price has been what it has for many years.
Post by: Smossy on December 16, 2013, 10:41:57 PM
All your unfilled tags (in my case all of them)
6 cups of water
1 Bullion cube
Salt and pepper to taste
First take all your unfilled tags and cut them up into bite sized pieces
Next boil up 6 cups of water.
Once the water comes to a boil add the bullion cube. Stir until it dissolves.
Add your unfilled tags and bring to a rapid boil.
Let simmer for 15 minutes or until the tags are tender.
Add salt and pepper to taste.
Open up a nice bottle of wine and . . .
There you go . . . :D
Post by: BoomWhop on December 16, 2013, 10:48:24 PM
Post by: RadSav on December 16, 2013, 11:25:03 PM
I'm not going to go on about how great the state of Washington hunting is. Not going to say how great the odds of shooting a Pope & Young buck or Boone & Crocket bull are here. But from someone who has hunted all of the western states Washington state is not that bad for the average meat hunter. I honestly can not imagine not tagging out in this state if all I wanted was to fill my freezer. And unless I have been given access to private land or set up with a quality guide I don't see the other states making my job of filling an elk or deer tag that much easier. There are just too many options that I know indepth here close to home. It's no longer 1990 and I can fill my freezer with a cow or doe in the first day or two of the season. But, it just isn't that much worse than DIY public land anywhere else I've hunted throughout the west.
Now if you are wanting to bugle in a nice bull or stalk an open country muledeer on public land I do think many of the other states offer a better supply of options. And if you want a record class buck or elk and you do not draw one of the premium tags in this state Washington is much more difficult. But how can a public land DIY meat hunt be any better than your own back yard? We know these animals, we know where they go when spooked and we know the land well enough to get in front of animals when the unexpected dillweed come in and messes up a good thing. Its going to take a lot of time and money to get that personal with animals in another state even if they do have a few more animals per square mile and a few less hunters.
My recommendation for those who have been unsuccessful close to home is not to go in search of the holy grail of hunting grounds. Learn how to hunt and scout here at home first. Maybe go on a ranch hunt here or there. I probably learned more on a single trip to Catalina Island chasing goats and pigs than I did in five years on public land chasing elk and deer. Because I made about a dozen stalks on animals each day. My first trip I failed about 75% of the time, second trip about 50%, third trip about 25% until I had gotten to a point where messing up a stalk just seemed impossible. Maybe ranch hunting is not going to lead you to captain of the greatest hunters of all time league. And you may not leave feeling you had the most challenging hunt of your life. But you can think of these hunts as a college course in hunting with an almost guaranteed diploma.
Out of state hunting is not a cheep endeavor. It really is beneficial to learn how to hunt, how to scout, how to read a map, how to look/search where the animals are, and analyze a stalk opportunity for the best possible outcome before you go running off to a far away hunting ground expecting to find a scene from some Disney movie. I do highly recommend out of state hunting. It's an adventure truly worth the cost, time and effort involved. But preparing yourself for success at home first really does improve your odds and enjoyment when hunting unfamiliar ground.
As far as what states to start doing research I would have to put Idaho first. Not that the hunting there is better than Wyoming, Montana or Utah. But because finding public land to hunt accessible to the average guy is easier. And it is closer for the occasional getaway to scout. If I was going to hire a guide or purchase a trespass allowance that might change to Montana. Bearpaw's rifle hunts over there seem to be filled with plenty of adventure with a very high success rate. And last I checked you could add a few doe tags to really get that freezer stuffed! No permit applications too which is nice. For meat a Washington multi-season tag would be my third choice. Way more cost effective and an archery mule deer doe in the first week of this state is about as easy as bowhunting gets.
I really hope you can get that monkey off your back Philepe. The first one is the hardest. Whatever it takes to get that first one can pay big in the long run as they just seem to get easier with each filled tag. Best of luck to you. :tup:
Post by: Duffer on December 16, 2013, 11:40:10 PM
To be honest with you, deer are really simple to kill in this state. :twocents:
Nice. kick the guy when he's down.
Old guy opinions ahead:
1) Successful hunters are not casual hunters. I am a casual hunter. I don't have time to scout. I barely have time to hunt. I've only found some time recently by shutting down my home business (2nd job). Surprise, surprise - I'm not good at finding animals and if I get lucky enough to stumble upon one, I can't close the deal. Being successful is NOT EASY. It takes sacrifice and time.
2) It's easy to frequent a site like HW and believe that you are the only guy who can't fill a tag. Hogwash. Stats show % success. There may be a higher percentage of sucessful hunters here (and probably are) because alot of these guys & gals are serious hunters. See #1. example: what are my chances of filling an archery elk tag in Idaho (where I've gone now 2yrs out of 3)? about 10% It will take me (statistically) 10 YEARS! to fill a tag over there. and that's just on average. Since I consider myself a poor hunter at best, it will take me more than 10 years.
3) I believe some folks are luckier than others. The hunting gods smile on them a little bit more. You know those guys.... always first to land that fish. Just seem to draw the better hands playing cards. Take home a bit of cash every trip to the casino. This year, I PAID to finally fill a tag and still couldn't pull it off. The weather was HORRIBLE! Every legal whitetail I saw was running full out from one thicket to the next. The Guide's wife is calling me Bad Luck Chuck. :tung:
So don't feel too down. I have not filled a tag (no deer, no elk, no bear, no anything else on 4 legs) since I was in college. and I'm in my 50s now. In my entire half century+ of existence, I have one cow elk, a couple small blacktail bucks and one whitetail doe.
I've gotten out of it what I've put in to it. You will too.
Post by: RadSav on December 16, 2013, 11:57:27 PM
Idaho sure is a great place to hunt. Not what it once was before the wolves destroyed so much of it, but it's still one of my favorite states. However, it is still a place where one has to "Hunt" to fill their tag. Same goes for CA, WY, MT, CO, UT and AZ. But, sometimes a guy just needs to throw away a few extra dollars to find reality. Nothing at all wrong with that. Learning is almost never a bad thing! And occasionally the hunting gods reward those who take the risk. That's always fun too ;)
Post by: RadSav on December 17, 2013, 12:24:08 AM
So we get to some choice chucker ground and before we even get the guns out of the truck the dogs have busted the first covey. It was going to be one of those epic days!!! After a few hours I was limited out and my brother was still looking for his first bird. I was trying to give him some instruction on how to read my dog and also how to wait for the right shot. His response surprised me. He said, "Well, if I had a $3,000 gun I could be limited too." Not really wanting to swap my 5# gun for his 8# gun, but after that comment we switched. A few more hours later and we headed back to the truck to get more ammo. He did have one bird in his vest the Dancer Dog picked up on at least a 500 yard retrieve.
We decided to give these birds a rest and crossed the draw to hunt the other side of the canyon. In the creek bottom we jumped two roosters. The old Winchester Model 12 reported loudly twice and with a little work the Dancer dog retrieved both my birds. My brother had absolutely nothing to say when I commented, "Man! This gun brings back some fun memories ;)"
By the end of the day my brother was able to complete his bag limit on chucker, while I was able to complete my hat trick limiting on Chuckar, quail and pheasant. And the poor little Dancer dog after having the day of her life...slept straight through the next three days on the bed.
A year later after my brother spent a bunch of time at the sporting clays we did what became our annual chucker hunt again. This time the birds were hard to find and what birds we did find were busting out at extended range. At the end of the day my brother, still shooting my old Model 12, had reached his bag limit on chucker and me and my $3,000 gun had not. He had simply worked harder and was better prepared than I was that year. And to this day he still tries to rub it in my face >:(
We always want to believe our lack of success must be due to something else like the need for better guns or a better managed state. But more often than not our lack of success falls squarely in our own lap regardless of where we live or what we shoot.
Post by: Bigshooter on December 17, 2013, 12:27:38 AM
You are right Duffer. The percentages show there are more guys like you out there than a hunting website would assume. That being said, what has your success ratio been out of state in the promised land? Sounds like it has been worse than your success ratio in your own Washington state back yard. :dunno: That is a hidden truth unsuccessful hunters looking to buy or move their way to an increased success ratio fail to realize.
Idaho sure is a great place to hunt. Not what it once was before the wolves destroyed so much of it, but it's still one of my favorite states. However, it is still a place where one has to "Hunt" to fill their tag. Same goes for CA, WY, MT, CO, UT and AZ. But, sometimes a guy just needs to throw away a few extra dollars to find reality. Nothing at all wrong with that. Learning is almost never a bad thing! And occasionally the hunting gods reward those who take the risk. That's always fun too ;)
I have never been on an out of state deer hunt where I couldn't have killed multiple bucks. On some hunts I could have killed as many as 50 different bucks. But hunting W WA for blacktails I have had years where I didn't see a single buck and I have also had many years where I didn't see 50 deer total all hunting season. So I can understand why people would be frustrated hunting W WA. But I will admit my success ratio is higher in WA than out of state hunting. But for only one reason. When I hunt out of state I am looking for something big and have no problem eating tag soup.
Post by: DBHAWTHORNE on December 17, 2013, 12:31:13 AM
Post by: Duffer on December 17, 2013, 01:39:10 AM
You are right Duffer. The percentages show there are more guys like you out there than a hunting website would assume. That being said, what has your success ratio been out of state in the promised land? Sounds like it has been worse than your success ratio in your own Washington state back yard. :dunno: That is a hidden truth unsuccessful hunters looking to buy or move their way to an increased success ratio fail to realize.
Idaho sure is a great place to hunt. Not what it once was before the wolves destroyed so much of it, but it's still one of my favorite states. However, it is still a place where one has to "Hunt" to fill their tag. Same goes for CA, WY, MT, CO, UT and AZ. But, sometimes a guy just needs to throw away a few extra dollars to find reality. Nothing at all wrong with that. Learning is almost never a bad thing! And occasionally the hunting gods reward those who take the risk. That's always fun too ;)
Sorry to the OP for hijacking his post.
My Idaho adventures, for elk only and only in the past couple of years, again displays "The Casual Hunter". I think I'll trademark that :chuckle: I don't spend hours scouring stats, applying for hot draws and studying maps in an attempt to hit it hot and hard. That was my dad. That was my uncle. Both successful hunters.
The Casual Hunter goes: 1) where it's familiar or 2) where his friends go. That's me & Idaho elk. Friends. I didn't go this year because of cost and odds of success. I actually hunted Wa to improve my odds. Yeah
I wouldn't suggest the OP go out of state to improve his odds unless he's paying for a canned hunt.
I would not have even entered this discussion at all (cuz I've got zero experienced advise) except for the lack of compassion I sometimes see in threads like this. If you are a highly successful and talented hunter, is it really necessary to slap a fellow hunter around with it? It's Christmas time. Show a little compassion.
Sorry for getting my Depends in a wad. ;) /rant off :sry:
Post by: Duffer on December 17, 2013, 01:55:34 AM
I wouldn't venture out of state to hunt if you are having trouble filling tags in WA. Make a solid commitment to scouting and you will be successful if your only goal is to fill the freezer. If you don't know what you are looking for then make a solid effort to learn more. A lot of people say they don't have time to do these things but then I see those same people watching football all day Sunday or doing other things with their leisure time... Bottom line it comes down to priorities.. If you are willing to commit more time or more money (or both) your success will increase.
Absolutely agreed. "don't have time" actually means "won't make it a priority"
I'll say it again. You get out what you put in. The best, most successful hunters here bleed & sweat for it. They live it, above all else. Respect deserved. The rest of us don't. or won't. wait for it...... hunting is not a high priority :yike:
The Casual Hunter has no grounds to bitch about it tho. That includes me and I don't. I just use my success rate to let other know they are not alone.
Post by: philepe on December 17, 2013, 06:27:27 AM
Post by: Taco280AI on December 17, 2013, 06:34:07 AM
Post by: MADMAX on December 17, 2013, 06:50:07 AM
Duffer and Radsav what you guys say has got me thinking a lot. I definitely could spend more time scouting that has not been a priority for me. Its hard to admit but I guess Im a casual hunter since I don't make time to be out in the woods more. During the season I work hard but I think I need to hit reset and figure out what Im doing wrong.
If your just after meat take up bowhunting, pretty hard to "not" get at least a blacktail doe
Post by: boneaddict on December 17, 2013, 07:05:50 AM
Post by: pianoman9701 on December 17, 2013, 08:30:21 AM
There are guys who post blacktail kills on this forum every single year. I would concentrate on their advice and threads in the deer category, get out some trail cams, definitely put some boot leather on the ground and you should find deer. Even i kill one every few years and I'm not 1/4 of the hunter most of these guys are. Good luck. :tup:
Post by: BullMagnet76 on December 17, 2013, 08:36:46 AM
To be honest with you, deer are really simple to kill in this state. :twocents:
:yeah:
Post by: philepe on December 17, 2013, 10:45:02 AM
Post by: pianoman9701 on December 17, 2013, 11:03:02 AM
To the guys saying it is so easy your full of it, :twocents:Either you bust your butt and earn it.or you may get lucky road hunting but that's not really hunting. To say hunting here is easy is kinda like bill gates saying its easy to make billions of $. Not very helpful advice, but yes entertaining.
Perhaps instead of telling successful hunters they're full of it, you might use them as a resource and find out why it's so easy for them. Either glean information or be defensive. These two options are mutually exclusive.
Post by: Buckmark on December 17, 2013, 11:12:06 AM
To the guys saying it is so easy your full of it, :twocents:Either you bust your butt and earn it.or you may get lucky road hunting but that's not really hunting. To say hunting here is easy is kinda like bill gates saying its easy to make billions of $. Not very helpful advice, but yes entertaining.If meat is all you are after, then yes having the opportunity to kill (harvest :chuckle:) a legal deer is not very difficult.
If wanting to tag a buck only then it gets a little more difficult, but still not that hard.
If wanting to tag a trophy (Define that as you want) then it gets much harder...
If you rifle hunt the general run and gun season only in areas that everyone else goes then yes you will eat more tags than fill, as long as you keep doing what you have been doing for the past 15yrs. If you do the same thing every year without success dont you think its time to either change tactics, weapons, area or all 3????
Post by: rtspring on December 17, 2013, 11:18:16 AM
I am simply amazed at hunters who think big game should be standing at every bend of a forest road waiting to be shot. That means get out and scout and hunt your butt off, you will be rewarded...
Now Im going to try with a bow..
Post by: Mike450r on December 17, 2013, 11:28:58 AM
To the guys saying it is so easy your full of it, :twocents:Either you bust your butt and earn it.or you may get lucky road hunting but that's not really hunting. To say hunting here is easy is kinda like bill gates saying its easy to make billions of $. Not very helpful advice, but yes entertaining.
Deer can be anywhere but definitely not everywhere. I have killed a blacktail pretty much every year for 30+ years, with rifle, bow, and muzzleloader so for me it can at least seem pretty easy most of the time. I have gotten them busting my butt and I have gotten lucky and got them easy even though I started the day with every intention of busting my butt if I needed too. Some have been pretty big, some pretty small, but on average generally what I consider a decent blacktail buck.
I have given advice and pointers a few times on here and so have many many others. If a person doesn't go to the right spot all the hard work and knowledge aint going to mean anything.
Post by: nw_bowhunter on December 17, 2013, 11:39:29 AM
My advice is be honest with yourself and evaluate your skill set.. Are you constantly trying to learn new tactics, animal behaviors, talking with other experience hunters, etc? Find an area and scout your tail off all year. Use the opportunity to enjoy the outdoors. Hunt the same area consistently for 3 to 5 years. Also, stay out in the woods all day. PS: Blacktails are challenging to hunt, try mule deer and get some experience under your belt.
I have been bow hunting elk for 12 years and shot 1 cow...maybe I'm a lousy elk hunter, or maybe there are other factors. I met up with a fellow bowhunter/elk hunter two years and he has taught me more in the limited time we hunted together in all the time hunting on my own. I'm not a successful trophy hunter but I have taken my fair share of mule deer. With family, work, etc my time for hunting is less each year. Personal advice is enjoy your self, maintain a positive attitude, always be thinking, dreaming and learning about hunting.. AND don't give up.
Opportunity and little luck also factor into being successful..
Post by: snowpack on December 17, 2013, 11:58:06 AM
Post by: deltaops on December 17, 2013, 12:08:37 PM
I want to say thank you to the ones who helped me out, if it wasn't for people like you on these forums, these forums would not exist. :brew:
Post by: philepe on December 17, 2013, 02:50:49 PM
Post by: pianoman9701 on December 17, 2013, 02:54:24 PM
Post by: RadSav on December 17, 2013, 04:59:53 PM
If I could give one single secret that would increase the average guys success each and every year it would be this. Think like the quarry you are hunting. You can do this by reading about certain species, spending time in the woods observing that species and/or hiring an expert guide willing to answer as many questions as you can throw at them while hunting under their supervision.
I have an old fishing client that still keeps in touch with me and sends me success photos constantly. After 20 years of trying to catch a steelhead with zero success his wife gave him a guided trip as a Christmas present. I don't remember it being an unusually good day on the water as far as fish went. But, I do remember this guy asking more questions than I could possible answer in one day. Every time I switched lures he would ask me, "Why?" Every time I would drop anchor he would ask, "Why?" Every time I would have him cast to a certain part in the river he would ask me, "Why?" I ended up telling him exactly why I was working a particular piece of water and how to read it before we made the first cast in each location. He took full advantage of my experience with steelhead. Not to increase his chances of catching a fish on that particular day. But, to educate himself for his future success without the assistance of a guide. He wasn't set on learning the way I did things as much as he was trying to learn why steelhead do the things they do. I can comfortably say with complete confidence that this past client is a better steelhead fisherman than I am today. He truly is one of the best I've seen. He had the raw talent and desire to begin with. All he needed was a little Steelhead 101 to get him started on the right track.
The same principles apply to deer and elk hunting. Show me an expert hunter for a specific species of animal and I will show you someone who is educated in the way that animal thinks. They don't watch an animal bust out of a hole without asking the question, "Why?" Why was that animal in that spot? Why was that animal spooked? Why did he run that way? What was he eating? How far from the rut are we? Where was he going? Should I expect him to return to this spot? How could I have made my approach differently? And then, If I find myself in this situation again how am I going to kill that animal next time?
I find Thomas Edison to be one of my best sources of inspiration. While educating yourself in your quarry it is important to also educate yourself in ways to succeed when obstacles and rejection try to tear you down. Probably no other man in history was as resilient to these issues as Thomas Edison. It is said that after developing a successful light bulb he admitted it was his two thousand and first prototype. It is claimed that he was asked by a reporter how he was able to continue working after failing 2,000 times. To which he answered, "I did not fail. I just found 2,000 ways how not to make a light bulb. I only needed to find one way to make it work."
Other Edison quotes I find helpful;
"Genius is one per cent inspiration and ninety-nine per cent perspiration. Accordingly, a 'genius' is often merely a talented person who has done all of his or her homework."
"Many of life's failures are experienced by people who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up."
Post by: Button Nubbs on December 17, 2013, 05:26:04 PM
If I could give one single secret that would increase the average guys success each and every year it would be this. Think like the quarry you are hunting. You can do this by reading about certain species, spending time in the woods observing that species and/or hiring an expert guide willing to answer as many questions as you can throw at them while hunting under their supervision.
I have an old fishing client that still keeps in touch with me and sends me success photos constantly. After 20 years of trying to catch a steelhead with zero success his wife gave him a guided trip as a Christmas present. I don't remember it being an unusually good day on the water as far as fish went. But, I do remember this guy asking more questions than I could possible answer in one day. Every time I switched lures he would ask me, "Why?" Every time I would drop anchor he would ask, "Why?" Every time I would have him cast to a certain part in the river he would ask me, "Why?" I ended up telling him exactly why I was working a particular piece of water and how to read it before we made the first cast in each location. He took full advantage of my experience with steelhead. Not to increase his chances of catching a fish on that particular day. But, to educate himself for his future success without the assistance of a guide. He wasn't set on learning the way I did things as much as he was trying to learn why steelhead do the things they do. I can comfortably say with complete confidence that this past client is a better steelhead fisherman than I am today. He truly is one of the best I've seen. He had the raw talent and desire to begin with. All he needed was a little Steelhead 101 to get him started on the right track.
The same principles apply to deer and elk hunting. Show me an expert hunter for a specific species of animal and I will show you someone who is educated in the way that animal thinks. They don't watch an animal bust out of a hole without asking the question, "Why?" Why was that animal in that spot? Why was that animal spooked? Why did he run that way? What was he eating? How far from the rut are we? Where was he going? Should I expect him to return to this spot? How could I have made my approach differently? And then, If I find myself in this situation again how am I going to kill that animal next time?
sheesh! you gotta give away all the secrets? :chuckle:
in all honesty this is some of the best advice i have seen on here. i feel like i have a pretty good grasp on fishing and yet i am still constantly asking myself questions as to why. i do the same thing with elk and feel i have the puzzle of the area i hunt pretty well figured out. there is a fine line between this and over thinking though. think about it but dont over think it, once you can find the medium between these two you will be successful.
great post rad!
Post by: Bigshooter on December 17, 2013, 06:19:59 PM
If you take away the hunter success statistics for blacktail in both Oregon and Washington almost all the western states published success ratios are about the same +/- 3-5%. Those success ratios are heavily weighed toward those who know their hunting areas well ie resident hunters vs resident hunters. So when guys post on the internet about the 50 bucks they see a day in "X" state or how they passed up "X" amount of deer per day looking for Mr. Big without scouting or hiring a guide in a different state you need to take it with a grain of salt. While the occasional guy does fall into a hot spot or hits the rut perfect or happens to be a true expert in research it is statistically the exception rather than the rule.
If I could give one single secret that would increase the average guys success each and every year it would be this. Think like the quarry you are hunting. You can do this by reading about certain species, spending time in the woods observing that species and/or hiring an expert guide willing to answer as many questions as you can throw at them while hunting under their supervision.
I have an old fishing client that still keeps in touch with me and sends me success photos constantly. After 20 years of trying to catch a steelhead with zero success his wife gave him a guided trip as a Christmas present. I don't remember it being an unusually good day on the water as far as fish went. But, I do remember this guy asking more questions than I could possible answer in one day. Every time I switched lures he would ask me, "Why?" Every time I would drop anchor he would ask, "Why?" Every time I would have him cast to a certain part in the river he would ask me, "Why?" I ended up telling him exactly why I was working a particular piece of water and how to read it before we made the first cast in each location. He took full advantage of my experience with steelhead. Not to increase his chances of catching a fish on that particular day. But, to educate himself for his future success without the assistance of a guide. He wasn't set on learning the way I did things as much as he was trying to learn why steelhead do the things they do. I can comfortably say with complete confidence that this past client is a better steelhead fisherman than I am today. He truly is one of the best I've seen. He had the raw talent and desire to begin with. All he needed was a little Steelhead 101 to get him started on the right track.
The same principles apply to deer and elk hunting. Show me an expert hunter for a specific species of animal and I will show you someone who is educated in the way that animal thinks. They don't watch an animal bust out of a hole without asking the question, "Why?" Why was that animal in that spot? Why was that animal spooked? Why did he run that way? What was he eating? How far from the rut are we? Where was he going? Should I expect him to return to this spot? How could I have made my approach differently? And then, If I find myself in this situation again how am I going to kill that animal next time?
I find Thomas Edison to be one of my best sources of inspiration. While educating yourself in your quarry it is important to also educate yourself in ways to succeed when obstacles and rejection try to tear you down. Probably no other man in history was as resilient to these issues as Thomas Edison. It is said that after developing a successful light bulb he admitted it was his two thousand and first prototype. It is claimed that he was asked by a reporter how he was able to continue working after failing 2,000 times. To which he answered, "I did not fail. I just found 2,000 ways how not to make a light bulb. I only needed to find one way to make it work."
Other Edison quotes I find helpful;
"Genius is one per cent inspiration and ninety-nine per cent perspiration. Accordingly, a 'genius' is often merely a talented person who has done all of his or her homework."
"Many of life's failures are experienced by people who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up."
I'm guessing your out of state hunting experience has been poor compared to mine and my friends that hunt out of state every year. A one eyed guy with no bino's could see multiple bucks every day in E MT just driving around on public land. Yes all of the things that you say do help. The only thing that I disagree with is that it's just as easy to kill something in W WA as it is in any other western state.
Post by: RadSav on December 17, 2013, 07:47:15 PM
I'm guessing your out of state hunting experience has been poor compared to mine and my friends that hunt out of state every year. A one eyed guy with no bino's could see multiple bucks every day in E MT just driving around on public land. Yes all of the things that you say do help. The only thing that I disagree with is that it's just as easy to kill something in W WA as it is in any other western state.
Canada is probably the only place I can think of where I've come back empty handed. But I figured out long ago that my experiences are not typical. Whether hunting Washington or some other state. Average hunters in Washington are the same as average hunters in other states. Published hunter success statistics support that thought with about a 5% variation if you eliminate Washington and Oregon blacktail numbers. The past four years those elk statistics do show Washington as a very different story. However, when comparing deer statistics it does fall within those close numbers. There are pockets in each state with extremely high success. If you find them it does seem like the whole state is filled with endless opportunities. Sure sounds like you have one heck of a nice spot in E. MT!
When I was a kid I thought everyone was successful at filling elk and deer tags. I figured if a guy did not fill a tag in Oregon or Washington he was lazy and never got out of his truck. But, as happens to so many young punk kids reality has a way of finding it's way home. I now know success that might come easy to some can come hard to some with even more motivation and just not as clear an understanding of the animal or hunting grounds. It's a bit of a selfish thought to think that it's a good thing not everyone finds filling a tag as easy as you and I do. But if everyone had the success of the 10% we would have little to no seasons due to over harvest. We've got to appreciate and remain understanding of our fellow hunters. They are family regardless of their success.
I find elk to be one of the easiest to tag and stupidest animals in the woods. So much so I rarely get excited for elk season to come preferring deer season. Does that make them easy for the average person to harvest? Success statistics say no. I've hunted with some human mountain goats with a ton of motivation that have not filled an elk tag since 1988. Are they lazy and/or stupid? Absolutely not! Some just understand animal behavior and some don't. We can all get better at it, but as with any sport some are just better at it than others. Just the way the world turns I expect. Will a change in environment help some? It certainly can. However, I still believe getting well educated at home will help you no matter what the scenery is and no matter what state is printed on your tag.
Another Edison quote that can find relevance here. Makes me day dream and conclude that I'll take smart hunting over hard hunting any day. Though I do enjoy a hard fought battle with a big buck;
"From his neck down a man is worth a couple of dollars a day, from his neck up he is worth anything that his brain can produce."
Post by: SCRUBS on December 17, 2013, 08:03:47 PM
Post by: DBHAWTHORNE on December 17, 2013, 08:05:52 PM
Location, location, location...
I agee...and WA...as a whole.. is a great location...and within that some locations will be more productive than others.
Post by: Bigshooter on December 17, 2013, 08:42:17 PM
I'm guessing your out of state hunting experience has been poor compared to mine and my friends that hunt out of state every year. A one eyed guy with no bino's could see multiple bucks every day in E MT just driving around on public land. Yes all of the things that you say do help. The only thing that I disagree with is that it's just as easy to kill something in W WA as it is in any other western state.
Canada is probably the only place I can think of where I've come back empty handed. But I figured out long ago that my experiences are not typical. Whether hunting Washington or some other state. Average hunters in Washington are the same as average hunters in other states. Published hunter success statistics support that thought with about a 5% variation if you eliminate Washington and Oregon blacktail numbers. The past four years those elk statistics do show Washington as a very different story. However, when comparing deer statistics it does fall within those close numbers. There are pockets in each state with extremely high success. If you find them it does seem like the whole state is filled with endless opportunities. Sure sounds like you have one heck of a nice spot in E. MT!
When I was a kid I thought everyone was successful at filling elk and deer tags. I figured if a guy did not fill a tag in Oregon or Washington he was lazy and never got out of his truck. But, as happens to so many young punk kids reality has a way of finding it's way home. I now know success that might come easy to some can come hard to some with even more motivation and just not as clear an understanding of the animal or hunting grounds. It's a bit of a selfish thought to think that it's a good thing not everyone finds filling a tag as easy as you and I do. But if everyone had the success of the 10% we would have little to no seasons due to over harvest. We've got to appreciate and remain understanding of our fellow hunters. They are family regardless of their success.
I find elk to be one of the easiest to tag and stupidest animals in the woods. So much so I rarely get excited for elk season to come preferring deer season. Does that make them easy for the average person to harvest? Success statistics say no. I've hunted with some human mountain goats with a ton of motivation that have not filled an elk tag since 1988. Are they lazy and/or stupid? Absolutely not! Some just understand animal behavior and some don't. We can all get better at it, but as with any sport some are just better at it than others. Just the way the world turns I expect. Will a change in environment help some? It certainly can. However, I still believe getting well educated at home will help you no matter what the scenery is and no matter what state is printed on your tag.
Another Edison quote that can find relevance here. Makes me day dream and conclude that I'll take smart hunting over hard hunting any day. Though I do enjoy a hard fought battle with a big buck;
"From his neck down a man is worth a couple of dollars a day, from his neck up he is worth anything that his brain can produce."
I have read on MM many times that a lot of ID guys don't report harvest to keep success rates low. I watched a Randy Newberg hunting show a couple years ago where he was hunting in E MT where harvest rates where 45% and he mentioned that the only way that there not 100% is because people are waiting to kill a big buck and have probably already filled a doe tag or two. My point is harvest statistics don't always mean a whole lot. There are many units in CO that have 60-90%+ success rates. But then there is what people consider trophy units that only have success rates in the 40%'s or even lower. Why do you think that is? My first guess wouldn't be because there aren't many deer. I just wouldn't use harvest numbers to gauge how easy it is to kill a deer. In fact when I research a new hunting area it is one of my least important things to look at.
Post by: kramman on December 18, 2013, 12:07:16 AM
Post by: RadSav on December 18, 2013, 12:51:50 AM
Again, I encourage guys getting out and hunting other states. I have enjoyed nearly every moment of hunting other states. I remember a day in AZ when I had five bucks surrounding me not far from the town of Globe. The smallest was a 180 class buck and the largest well over 200. I doubt you will experience that in Washington. In Idaho I failed to fill a tag one day because every time I drew my bow to shoot a nice buck a bigger one came into view. While I sat there trying to decide which one I wanted most the wind swirled and I didn't get a second chance at any of them. I haven't had many of those experiences here in Washington. And I remember making a stalk on three bucks, all over 170 in Oregon, when a 190 class buck came up from nearly under my feet like a grouse from the little hole he was hiding in. Again, I don't seem to have those problems here in Washington. It's been great fun hunting the west. I hope everyone who wants to experience that for themselves can find a way to get to these great Western locations and experience it for themselves.
But, my passion for this thread has more to do with helping the OP or other unsuccessful hunters reading it. I hope to point out that success isn't just a state away. Montana, Oregon, Arizona and Idaho are best experienced when fully prepared to make the most of it. And just because it is a different state doesn't necessarily mean you can take your unsuccessful tactics from here and use them there with success. If that were true the statistics from those states would reflect it. It can be an expensive learning experience filled with frustration if you are unprepared.
Bigshooter is right in that you can not completely rely on statistics alone for finding your own success. They don't always show the lay of the land, the public access or the pressure the animals in that area receive. Heck, if we looked at statistics alone we would never have even thought to hunt the area my wife took her nice blacktail this year. But, what information must you gather beyond statistics if you have no experience with success to fall back on? It's tough! Often DANG tough! Even when you are trying to find a new spot close to home it's tough. I know experienced guys much better than I who make mistakes in their research now and then. I would expect Bigshooter has made a mistake or two. And Lord knows I have made enough for both of us plus a couple more.
A good friend of mine is a wildlife biologist for the US Geological Survey. You won't find many more knowledgeable hunters in the woods. He is blessed with a great education, a serious analytical mind, a knack for research and a natural sense of what to do and when. One year he decided to get a Mtn Goat tag for an archery hunt. Statistically the area he chose was the best of the best. Big goats, high success numbers, low mortality rates and an aggressively increasing goat population. How could he possibly go wrong? When he finally got to the location with tag in hand he found that all the goats in this area during that time of year held in an almost vertical environment. Sure if he had been shooting a rifle and had rappelling gear he could have tagged a trophy goat within hours of the start of the season. But getting within recurve range and having no rappelling gear or experience meant he had just spent his substantial savings on a near impossible chance of success with limited options to put a hunt in his favor. Statistics had done him no favors at all.
Washington is not a bad place to hunt. Is it better than Montana, Idaho, Oregon or Arizona as a whole? Probably not! But it's right here where we spend our lives. And with a multi season tag there are areas of Washington that a meat hunter would be hard pressed not to fill a tag if serious about it and can shoot straight. Heck, I married a city girl, raised by a bunch of worthless drug addicts and convicts and she was successful every single year with a bow until she decided to set her goals higher than just filling the freezer. Even legally blind she experienced considerable success in this state hunting public land and OTC tags. It's just not all that bad. Sometimes a change in your state of mind can lead to greater success than hunting with the same mind set in a different state.
Post by: boneaddict on December 18, 2013, 06:37:46 AM
Post by: bobcat on December 18, 2013, 06:47:27 AM
Washington doesn't even come close to having good public land hunting like other states have, in my opinion.
Post by: RadSav on December 18, 2013, 12:11:18 PM
Dang you are long winded. :chuckle:
Passionate about the topic! Just seen way to many guys thinking all they have to do is drive across the border to find success. If you are one of the 90% here your probably going to be one of the 80 or 90% there if you attack it the same way. That's an awful expensive lesson too many learn the hard way. Many of those who failed at great expense were close personal friends who were led astray by my stories of success. I try to not hide the tough times I've had filling tags in other states like I use too. I felt it wasn't important information to indulge in my excitement back then. And it hurt a few financially as a result.
If I could I'd probably hunt Washington state very little. Animal quality and concentration of people is not the same in Washington and Oregon as it is in most other western states. But, it is not an answer if the tactics of failure here are employed there. Washington is a great place to practice in preparation for that big hunt of a lifetime. As someone once said, "If you can make it here, you can make it anywhere..." And if you are simply hunting for meat the Multi-Season opportunities here just aren't that bad. And will save a guy a whole bunch of money.
Of course deer is the main subject of my posts here. Bull elk might be a completely different story as would record book size opportunities.
Post by: MADMAX on December 18, 2013, 12:16:40 PM
Totally agree, I have killed cougars, good bulls, bears, deer.
I have no B&C or P&Y heads but I am consistent on decent animals
sure now in my mids 50s starting to slow down a step or 2 , no more deep canyon bull pack out by my self type thing.
Went WY once ,2 antelope and 3x4 buck
Went to Montana once, came home with a doe.
Its how much you put in to it.
Lots of opportunities here in WA
Post by: 300UltraMagShooter on December 18, 2013, 12:17:34 PM
Post by: DBHAWTHORNE on December 18, 2013, 02:07:25 PM
The units in Washington that have decent success rates for deer are 99% private land. Other states like Oregon, Idaho, Montana, and Wyoming have the same success rates in units that are almost all public land.
Washington doesn't even come close to having good public land hunting like other states have, in my opinion.
..unless you are after Whitetail.. We have some of the best public land Whitetail hunting in the U.S.
Post by: bobcat on December 18, 2013, 02:24:40 PM
The units in Washington that have decent success rates for deer are 99% private land. Other states like Oregon, Idaho, Montana, and Wyoming have the same success rates in units that are almost all public land.
Washington doesn't even come close to having good public land hunting like other states have, in my opinion.
..unless you are after Whitetail.. We have some of the best public land Whitetail hunting in the U.S.
Yes, I won't argue with that. I guess I was mostly thinking of blacktail, since that's what I hunt when I hunt from home, and mule deer, because that's what I hunt when I go east.
Hear that everyone? If you want to kill a deer, go to the NE for whitetails! (It's easy) ;)
Post by: RadSav on December 18, 2013, 02:30:38 PM
We have some of the best public land Whitetail hunting in the U.S.
A buddy of mine on the east coast called wanting advise on hunting whitetail out west. He is a complete whitetail fanatic. I sent him to Montana where he got on a three year waiting list to hunt some private property with fine deer in good numbers. And the wait was worth it as he harvested a real good buck. Then he gets home and starts looking at the "2013 Bucks - Post them here" thread on H-W. He calls me up flipping me grief for not having him hunt Washington! He lives in whitetail central and is now dreaming of coming to Washington to hunt big western bucks. Guess no matter where you live a guys going to want to jump state lines to find something better. Nothing wrong with that...even if your destination ends up being Washington state and you can only get one tag!
Post by: DBHAWTHORNE on December 18, 2013, 02:31:43 PM
The units in Washington that have decent success rates for deer are 99% private land. Other states like Oregon, Idaho, Montana, and Wyoming have the same success rates in units that are almost all public land.
Washington doesn't even come close to having good public land hunting like other states have, in my opinion.
..unless you are after Whitetail.. We have some of the best public land Whitetail hunting in the U.S.
Yes, I won't argue with that. I guess I was mostly thinking of blacktail, since that's what I hunt when I hunt from home, and mule deer, because that's what I hunt when I go east.
Hear that everyone? If you want to kill a deer, go to the NE for whitetails! (It's easy) ;)
NE is ok but SE is much better. :tup:
Post by: DBHAWTHORNE on December 18, 2013, 02:34:55 PM
We have some of the best public land Whitetail hunting in the U.S.
A buddy of mine on the east coast called wanting advise on hunting whitetail out west. He is a complete whitetail fanatic. I sent him to Montana where he got on a three year waiting list to hunt some private property with fine deer in good numbers. And the wait was worth it as he harvested a real good buck. Then he gets home and starts looking at the "2013 Bucks - Post them here" thread on H-W. He calls me up flipping me grief for not having him hunt Washington! He lives in whitetail central and is now dreaming of coming to Washington to hunt big western bucks. Guess no matter where you live a guys going to want to jump state lines to find something better. Nothing wrong with that...even if your destination ends up being Washington state and you can only get one tag!
:chuckle:... Between WA and ID there are certainly some great OTC public land whitetail opportunities.
Post by: boneaddict on December 19, 2013, 05:21:40 AM
Post by: Killmore on December 19, 2013, 09:01:57 AM
Post by: MTMule on December 22, 2013, 08:16:00 PM
Post by: RadSav on December 22, 2013, 08:25:19 PM
Success rate in W. Washington is pretty horrid for those of you making it sounds like its easy. Id like to know how many spikes you have killed in the last 5 years if you get one ever year.
We spread our deer around the state so western Washington success is not each year. We both love muledeer hunting so Westside deer are our backup plan in most years. But to answer your question I think the last spike we killed was 2001. That year we both took spikes on the same day late in the season. Probably another five years back to find the next one. There have been a few does between then and now too.
Post by: buckhorn2 on December 22, 2013, 08:52:38 PM
Post by: Button Nubbs on December 22, 2013, 11:10:33 PM
I like to hunt about anywhere I can afford to go but to keep saying scout it is;nt possible to do so easily out of state. We go to eastern mt. and there are a lot more deer to see standing in fields and open hill sides but I still like to hunt Washington. When you say scout a lot of people think that means look for animals. I don't see many where I hunt but I do see rubs;trails piles of elk poop things that let me know where things live and use. I watch the road for elk tracks probley more than I glass but when I find a place they are using it's where I will look when I am hunting. Just saying I think if a person spent as much time looking for trails and sign when the time is right you will see deer.Very good post. I rarley see animals in the areas I scout, but I'm typically not looking for them. I'm looking for sign or areas I can tell they have been using.
Post by: bowhuntersd on January 07, 2014, 04:56:33 PM
To be honest with you, deer are really simple to kill in this state. :twocents:I'm sorry but I have a problem with this statement. It is a very AREGENT thing to say. >:(
I hunt, and hunt hard and I'm eating both tags elk and as you say SIMPLE DEER.
Post by: buglebuster on January 07, 2014, 06:22:49 PM
Sorry if my opinion offends you, oh wait no i'm not. I wasnt the only one who agreed with that statement either :tup:To be honest with you, deer are really simple to kill in this state. :twocents:I'm sorry but I have a problem with this statement. It is a very AREGENT thing to say. >:(
I hunt, and hunt hard and I'm eating both tags elk and as you say SIMPLE DEER.
Post by: Jonathan_S on January 07, 2014, 06:40:51 PM
To be honest with you, deer are really simple to kill in this state. :twocents:I'm sorry but I have a problem with this statement. It is a very AREGENT thing to say. >:(
I hunt, and hunt hard and I'm eating both tags elk and as you say SIMPLE DEER.
Is it AREGENT? It might be a bit arrogant but I can tell you it's basically true. You can hunt hard all you want but if you're not hunting right, you'll continue to eat tag soup. I could stomp around in the NE woods all I wanted after a mature whitetail buck but would receive 100x more opportunities if I sat in a tree or groundblind.
The only difference with some states is that there are different seasons and more deer. How many deer do you need to choose from and how many weeks do you need if you understand the deer? Less than you think. Washington is an incredible state to hunt in several ways.
Post by: xXLojackXx on January 14, 2014, 02:37:50 PM
Post by: RadSav on January 14, 2014, 03:20:03 PM
Somebody put together a book of RadSav's comments. I want the first copy :chuckle: so entertaining to read.
Not sure if that is a compliment or I should be insulted :chuckle:
Post by: Jonathan_S on January 14, 2014, 03:22:08 PM
Somebody put together a book of RadSav's comments. I want the first copy :chuckle: so entertaining to read.
Not sure if that is a compliment or I should be insulted :chuckle:
I would take it as a compliment! Many on here could have their posts compiled for a study by psychologists ???
Post by: RadSav on January 14, 2014, 03:27:25 PM
I would take it as a compliment! Many on here could have their posts compiled for a study by psychologists ???Somebody put together a book of RadSav's comments. I want the first copy :chuckle: so entertaining to read.Not sure if that is a compliment or I should be insulted :chuckle:
I'M NOT CRAZY, MY MOTHER HAD ME TESTED (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjluRCKL8R4#ws)
Post by: buckfvr on January 14, 2014, 03:56:22 PM
Its always about the right place at the right time................theres always a right place at the wrong time, but a wrong place will only be wrong.
I get the multi-season so I can be in search of muy grande from sept til dec if necessary. That is huge...........but so is knowing when crunch time is.......... :tup:
Post by: RadSav on January 14, 2014, 04:03:54 PM
A lot of it is timing..........if you have to plan vacation or some other such, then you are starting out as a victim of your schedule, unless you understand timing.
Its always about the right place at the right time................theres always a right place at the wrong time, but a wrong place will only be wrong.
I get the multi-season so I can be in search of muy grande from sept til dec if necessary. That is huge...........but so is knowing when crunch time is.......... :tup:
Right on :tup:
Post by: blackveltbowhunter on January 14, 2014, 04:38:09 PM
For elk hands down out of state is better IMO. If you archery hunt it doesnt even compare.
Post by: GurrCentral on February 09, 2014, 08:01:05 PM
Maybe it is your tactics? Just saying.
Exactly.......but you will have much more luck out of state... :chuckle:
Post by: xXLojackXx on February 10, 2014, 11:43:17 AM
Post by: Bean Counter on February 10, 2014, 01:19:04 PM
I have little to add other than my experience. I've been hunting for less than a decade and am primarily self taught. I would agree with the others that if you can't make it happen in your own home state, that going out in search of greener pastures is going to be an expensive lesson. The best lesson if you have money to burn is to hire a guide, particularly early in your hunting career, and pick their brain non stop as RadSav's steelhead story goes. I would consider BearPaw Outfitters as they are the host of this site and prices are very reasonable indeed.
I am venturing out into other states, primarily in "point building mode" right now. This means a few years spending hundreds per state per year to buy points in hopes of some day drawing a quality tag. This is more about getting access to hunt quality animals and do it more frequently than every 5, 10, or 15 years in my home state. If I wanted I could kill a cow elk and a little dink buck every year, but that doesn't suit my purpose anymore. This is the natural progression for many ambitious hunters.
Post by: Mr Mykiss on February 11, 2014, 01:08:38 PM
To be honest with you, deer are really simple to kill in this state. :twocents::yeah: The only hunters that I know in this state that eat tag soup are the guys who pass on multiple bucks and intentionally don't hunt the cupcake areas where trophy potential is almost nonexistent.
Do not go with an outfitter in E WA on private ground, unless you want to learn how to hunt deer for thousands of dollars on private ground every year. In the stead find yourself some chunks of public ground or FFTH and hike your butt off. It's ok if you can't see deer from your truck...just get out and walk.
Post by: RB on February 11, 2014, 02:19:12 PM
By this statement I mean in shear numbers of game animals. Yes if a person has areas they know like the back of their hand and know game movements they can be successful every year. I know this because I had such a spot years ago, but that is gone now.
Walking through the woods in Idaho and Alaska was pure enjoyment the numbers of all animals was spectacular! Grouse, Turkeys, Deer, Elk, Moose, Coyotes, Mink, Marten, the list goes. Here in Western Washington where I learned to hunt I have spent days in the brush and not even seen a tweety bird!
So I would vote yes to go out of state not necessarily to just get a Deer, but to witness how much more game and cool critters a person can find in areas that are far away from major development. It is a numbers game other Western states have far more animals than Washington, so if a person spends more time with more game they are bound to finally connect. Thats my :twocents:
Post by: Mr Mykiss on February 11, 2014, 03:15:58 PM
Then I moved to eastern WA:
I was all like...
What??!!!! No trees?? Deer everywhere?? You can see more than 8' in front of you?!?! Easy peasy...
Post by: barracuda163 on February 11, 2014, 05:46:31 PM
Post by: Olympics777 on February 13, 2014, 10:06:37 AM