Post by: Jingles on January 27, 2014, 07:50:08 AM
www.g2rammo.com (http://www.g2rammo.com)
Post by: stryker on January 27, 2014, 07:59:17 AM
http://www.gunbroker.com/All/BI.aspx?Keywords=g2+research+rip (http://www.gunbroker.com/All/BI.aspx?Keywords=g2+research+rip)
Post by: h20hunter on January 27, 2014, 08:10:24 AM
Post by: jay.sharkbait on January 27, 2014, 08:15:51 AM
I may or may not get flamed for this but here we go. There is no chance in heck I would ever carry those rounds in a pistol I would need to use in a self defense situation. The anit gunners and the jury would see you as a "hole saw" killing extremist. They are absurdly expensive and really just a gimmick. No thanks.
Agree 100%
Post by: stryker on January 27, 2014, 08:23:06 AM
http://www.ammunitiondepot.com/G2-Research-RIP-9MM-96-Grain-Hollow-Point-Ammo-p/g2rip9.htm (http://www.ammunitiondepot.com/G2-Research-RIP-9MM-96-Grain-Hollow-Point-Ammo-p/g2rip9.htm)
AND, Im gonna have to agree that from a liability stand point, ammo that advertises like this.... may not do well for you in court.
"eventual complete termination of interest."
Post by: PolarBear on January 27, 2014, 08:26:08 AM
I may or may not get flamed for this but here we go. There is no chance in heck I would ever carry those rounds in a pistol I would need to use in a self defense situation. The anit gunners and the jury would see you as a "hole saw" killing extremist. They are absurdly expensive and really just a gimmick. No thanks.:yeah:
Post by: WoodlandShooter on January 27, 2014, 09:53:33 AM
Post by: Biggerhammer on January 27, 2014, 09:57:00 AM
I may or may not get flamed for this but here we go. There is no chance in heck I would ever carry those rounds in a pistol I would need to use in a self defense situation. The anit gunners and the jury would see you as a "hole saw" killing extremist. They are absurdly expensive and really just a gimmick. No thanks.
Bingo! I agree..
Post by: deaner on January 27, 2014, 10:01:39 AM
I may or may not get flamed for this but here we go. There is no chance in heck I would ever carry those rounds in a pistol I would need to use in a self defense situation. The anit gunners and the jury would see you as a "hole saw" killing extremist. They are absurdly expensive and really just a gimmick. No thanks.
youre totally right there. id go so far as to say never use handloads in a personal defense gun either, at the risk of being pigeon holed as a gun nut in court. regular factory ammo in your carry gun / home defense gun is the way to go.
Post by: h20hunter on January 27, 2014, 10:03:51 AM
Post by: Jingles on January 27, 2014, 10:05:41 AM
Post by: jay.sharkbait on January 27, 2014, 10:08:34 AM
Post by: h20hunter on January 27, 2014, 10:08:51 AM
Post by: deaner on January 27, 2014, 10:14:18 AM
Well to those that feel it is necessary to load with only non descript factory loads so be it but I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6
i feel comfortable with the thought of defending my life with out of the box federal or hornady rounds.
Post by: Jingles on January 27, 2014, 10:18:40 AM
Post by: h20hunter on January 27, 2014, 10:21:42 AM
Nope not at all suggesting that it is that. currently loaded with Federal Hyrashocks modified HP
Fair enough. Those are solid rounds that would put out some major hurt.
Post by: WoodlandShooter on January 27, 2014, 10:33:25 AM
Humans aren't that hard to kill BTW.
Kinda like Varmits...
Post by: whacker1 on January 27, 2014, 12:06:04 PM
I don't have an opinion one way or another, but curious what others think. We on this forum have talked about using bird shot in a shot gun in the past for home defense, as they won't travel through walls where children may lay on the other side of the wall.
Thoughts?
Post by: Heredoggydoggy on January 27, 2014, 12:15:14 PM
Post by: grundy53 on January 27, 2014, 12:22:26 PM
sent from my typewriter
Post by: h20hunter on January 27, 2014, 12:26:30 PM
Post by: 300rum on January 27, 2014, 12:34:08 PM
Reloaded ammo in a defense situation has it's roots from Massad Ayoob writing about it as being a no-no and later saying that there is absolutely no case history where someone was convicted from having used reloaded ammo in a legitimate defense case. But, it is one of the regular ones that you hear of.
Another big one is the whole ricochet, "bullet going through the walls killing a sleeping newborn in a crib a mile away". You just don't see it. Police officers shoot innocent people all the time, including other officers and they don't go to jail if they are in a legitimate self-defense situation.
One I have seen on here every-once-in-awhile is the Winchester "Black-Talon" pistol ammo was outlawed because it either was too deadly or shot through bullet proof vests....... The truth is Winchester just re-branded it as "Ranger" ammo and sell it to this day without the black coating.
One of the big ones that is growing by the day is the "I don't take self defense (firearm) training because a prosecutor is going to say that you were training to kill someone".
Be careful what you read in a gun magazine.
Post by: h20hunter on January 27, 2014, 12:37:05 PM
Post by: snowpack on January 27, 2014, 12:39:48 PM
I will make the argument at home defense. If target is missed in home defense and goes through a wall, how far will the fragments travel? Is it possible that they may endanger other lives in the household, maybe? I ask, because I saw how far they traveled in the balistic gel.I don't think they will travel far or have enough energy to do much damage once released from the slug. (for the 9 mm) It starts off as 96 grains when whole, it has 8 of the petals/fragments. My guess is that the main slug is probably 40 grains and the fragments maybe 7 grains each (little less than #B shot). Or maybe even 56 grains on the slug and 5 grain fragments. (size of #2) Plus they would tumble after being released. Seems to me the effects are mostly confined to what it first hits for the fragment. The slug pushing them is more of concern, about like a .22 bullet.
I don't have an opinion one way or another, but curious what others think. We on this forum have talked about using bird shot in a shot gun in the past for home defense, as they won't travel through walls where children may lay on the other side of the wall.
Thoughts?
Post by: jaymark6655 on January 27, 2014, 12:40:32 PM
I like the Ranger rounds....got about 96 of 'em left at home. Nasty little bullet. I agree that one must be carefull what the read in magazines...almost like internet forums!!!
:yeah: I think I even have a box of Ranger somewhere. From what I understand though, plastic coating on pistol ammo has been outlawed, unless it is a shotshell.
Post by: 300rum on January 27, 2014, 12:40:52 PM
I have seen some guys who reload, I would never run their reloads through my pistol, let alone try to defend myself with them. Reliability is a much better reason not to use reloads!
Now, If I need a pistol because someone is in the house running down the hall way at me with a cleaver, are reloads going to matter to a prosecutor?
Post by: 300rum on January 27, 2014, 12:43:40 PM
Check out JM coatings. The big thing in reloading is plastic coating on lead bullets. It is much, much cheaper then jacketed or plated bullets and cleaner then lead bullets. I have shot 15k of them myself and they are every bit of accurate as anything I have shot, cheaper and cleaner.
I like the Ranger rounds....got about 96 of 'em left at home. Nasty little bullet. I agree that one must be carefull what the read in magazines...almost like internet forums!!!
:yeah: I think I even have a box of Ranger somewhere. From what I understand though, plastic coating on pistol ammo has been outlawed, unless it is a shotshell.
Post by: h20hunter on January 27, 2014, 12:59:00 PM
That's right.
I have seen some guys who reload, I would never run their reloads through my pistol, let alone try to defend myself with them. Reliability is a much better reason not to use reloads!
Now, If I need a pistol because someone is in the house running down the hall way at me with a cleaver, are reloads going to matter to a prosecutor?
I would agree with that 100%
Post by: snowpack on January 27, 2014, 01:06:53 PM
That's right.Interesting. I do reloads for my protection rounds because of increased reliability. I get to inspect all the parts before assembly. I've had a few misfires using commercial ammo in the past and that is one main reason I started reloading. Carried over from hunting ammo to defense ammo.
I have seen some guys who reload, I would never run their reloads through my pistol, let alone try to defend myself with them. Reliability is a much better reason not to use reloads!
Now, If I need a pistol because someone is in the house running down the hall way at me with a cleaver, are reloads going to matter to a prosecutor?
Post by: WoodlandShooter on January 27, 2014, 01:13:32 PM
One I have seen on here every-once-in-awhile is the Winchester "Black-Talon" pistol ammo was outlawed because it either was too deadly or shot through bullet proof vests....... The truth is Winchester just re-branded it as "Ranger" ammo and sell it to this day without the black coating.
what about the rifle caliber Black Talon/FailSafe bullets...They were kinda like the illigitimate love child of a Nosler Partition and a Barnes Tripple Shock...What killed off those in the marketplace????
Post by: 300rum on January 27, 2014, 02:10:17 PM
One I have seen on here every-once-in-awhile is the Winchester "Black-Talon" pistol ammo was outlawed because it either was too deadly or shot through bullet proof vests....... The truth is Winchester just re-branded it as "Ranger" ammo and sell it to this day without the black coating.
what about the rifle caliber Black Talon/FailSafe bullets...They were kinda like the illigitimate love child of a Nosler Partition and a Barnes Tripple Shock...What killed off those in the marketplace????
Post by: 300rum on January 27, 2014, 02:15:48 PM
That's right.Interesting. I do reloads for my protection rounds because of increased reliability. I get to inspect all the parts before assembly. I've had a few misfires using commercial ammo in the past and that is one main reason I started reloading. Carried over from hunting ammo to defense ammo.
I have seen some guys who reload, I would never run their reloads through my pistol, let alone try to defend myself with them. Reliability is a much better reason not to use reloads!
Now, If I need a pistol because someone is in the house running down the hall way at me with a cleaver, are reloads going to matter to a prosecutor?
Post by: grundy53 on January 27, 2014, 02:28:19 PM
That's right.I disagree. When I reload I have less variation from round to round and tighter quality control. therefore I trust my rounds to be more reliable then a factory round.
I have seen some guys who reload, I would never run their reloads through my pistol, let alone try to defend myself with them. Reliability is a much better reason not to use reloads!
sent from my typewriter
Post by: 300rum on January 27, 2014, 02:32:28 PM
That's right.I disagree. When I reload I have less variation from round to round and tighter quality control. therefore I trust my rounds to be more reliable then a factory round.
I have seen some guys who reload, I would never run their reloads through my pistol, let alone try to defend myself with them. Reliability is a much better reason not to use reloads!
sent from my typewriter
Post by: DoubleJ on January 28, 2014, 06:03:39 AM
I may or may not get flamed for this but here we go. There is no chance in heck I would ever carry those rounds in a pistol I would need to use in a self defense situation. The anit gunners and the jury would see you as a "hole saw" killing extremist. They are absurdly expensive and really just a gimmick. No thanks.
I basically said this in the other thread on these things. You couldn't pay me to carry them in my defense pistol