Hunting Washington Forum

Big Game Hunting => Muzzleloader Hunting => Topic started by: JJB11B on February 20, 2014, 04:14:48 PM

Title: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: JJB11B on February 20, 2014, 04:14:48 PM: I was given a CVA Elkhorn by my cousin but it is in terrible condition. I am getting ready to replace it but I can't decide if i should get a Knight or a Traditions. I get conflicting opinions when I ask around. The price difference isn't a factor in my decision making process so any advice I can get, Pros and Cons on the guns would be greatly appreciated.
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: Bookworm007 on February 20, 2014, 04:27:10 PM: Which exact models? The type of action greatly changes the comparison.
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: JJB11B on February 20, 2014, 04:36:30 PM: Knight Bighorn or one of the Traditions vorteks
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: Jellymon on February 20, 2014, 04:53:29 PM: Knight, you won't be disappointed. Here's my sight in groups from last year at 100yds with open sights, 300gr bloodlines. Every group I've shot at 100yds with this load has been sub 1 1/2". And I'm not the best shot. :chuckle:

This is a knight disk extreme, which has the same barrel as the bighorn. The bolt on the disk extreme western kit covers a lot of the cap, which is great in the weather, and is legal in WA. And the thumb hole stock makes it that much sweeter. :tup:
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: Damnimissed on February 20, 2014, 05:01:28 PM: You can't go wrong with a Knight. I picked up an Ultralight to replace my Vortek a few months ago.
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: duckmen1 on February 20, 2014, 05:01:54 PM: Knight all the way.
Traditions have had good and bad guns. My traditions being one of the bad. Firing pin would not strike hard enough to get caps to go off. The bolt handle cracked. Etc. decent accuracy from it but not great.
Our knight rifles are great. Have several and no issues and very accurate. You won't be disappointed.
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: Damnimissed on February 20, 2014, 05:05:38 PM: Hey Jellymon, those are some darn nice groups with open sights. Are you running a peep sight?
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: duckmen1 on February 20, 2014, 05:17:34 PM: Jelly on does not run a peep as of now.
I do. Works much better for me but he is good with the fiber optics that came with the gun.
Both of our guns are very accurate.
I use 300 gr xtps
He uses 300 bloodlines
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: Jellymon on February 20, 2014, 05:24:38 PM: Quote from: Damnimissed on February 20, 2014, 05:05:38 PM
Hey Jellymon, those are some darn nice groups with open sights. Are you running a peep sight?

No, just factory fiber optic open sight. I like them, I can see where my sight is while hunting better. Looking back, I can still see the three glowing dots in my mule deers vitals in my mind. :tup:

I'm running 300gr bloodlines with 100gr of ffg triple seven loose and musket caps.
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: Mfowl on February 20, 2014, 05:34:44 PM: I switched from a Bighorn to a Traditions Vortek and I have had no issues. I shot an elk with each one and they both did the job. I switched because my Bighorn was too inconsistent. I tried a lot of load/bullet combos in that gun but was never happy. My Vortek has been consistent since the start with none of the ignition issues people bring up. CVA Elkhorn is a good gun as well, my brother just bought one from here recently and another guy I know has one. You might give a look at the new NW legal CVA Accura as well.
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: usmc74 on February 21, 2014, 05:13:39 AM: My bighorn with peep can hold about 3" at 200 yds (with peep)

300gr SST, 110 2F-T7

Buddy sold his traditions, and bought a Knight ultralite
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: whacker1 on February 21, 2014, 05:17:14 AM: knight

maybe turn it into a poll?
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: barracuda163 on February 21, 2014, 06:12:52 AM: Very good grouping for me as well with my bighorn. Consistent firing unlike the traditions that my brother in law has. Another problem is the cerakote doesn't last and starts to flake at muzzle and breech.
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: MountainDevil54 on February 21, 2014, 09:57:05 AM: check out the new break action cva northwest rifles :tup:
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: superdown on February 21, 2014, 10:07:59 AM: Another vote for the bighorn easy to clean and very accurate. :tup:
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: Jellymon on February 21, 2014, 11:41:12 AM: Just wanted to add......With my knight I've never had one misfire or hangfire. Unless the cap doesn't go off. It feels like a cenerfire when I shoot it. Very fast lock time.
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: Damnimissed on February 21, 2014, 12:58:42 PM: Quote from: barracuda163 on February 21, 2014, 06:12:52 AM

Very good grouping for me as well with my bighorn. Consistent firing unlike the traditions that my brother in law has. Another problem is the cerakote doesn't last and starts to flake at muzzle and breech.
:yeah:
I recently noticed a bubble in the ceracote on my Vortek, and of course I picked it and had a small flake come off :o
I can't wait to pack my Knight around this fall!
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: scottcrb on February 21, 2014, 01:53:42 PM: I have a knight DISC and its been great. Had one hang fire last year but round had been in my gun for a week while hunting and was just firing to use it up before heading home. Don't left Mfowl sway you. He spends a lot of extra time cleaning his vortex than I do my knight and still has trouble getting the bolt out..
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: DOUBLELUNG on February 21, 2014, 02:06:58 PM: Torn between two smokepoles,
Feeling like a fool ...
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: JJB11B on February 21, 2014, 04:38:36 PM: Ok, With this feedback lets go this direction.....Whats the best Muzzlestuffer on the market? Modern rifles are so much easier. Rem 700 is the best all around gun. I need a quality muzzleloader. I am gonna put in for multi season tags and have 2 of the 3 options double covered...
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: kerrdog on February 21, 2014, 04:54:22 PM: Best all around is Knight disc extreme.(IMHO) Fast lock time. Accurate. You can waterproof the cap with tape (but I don't) You can sell it. I don't see buying a bighorn unless you get a super sweet deal. (No offense to bighorn owners. I just got my boy a little horn)

Or knight ultralight. But it's $200 more.
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: Pete112288 on February 21, 2014, 05:51:06 PM: I like my Vortek, I love how simple and easy to clean it is. And it is super easy to cap without having a capper, even with adrenaline. I have not had field time with any knights but I havent heard anything bad really. Out of the box my vortek was putting 3 shots touching at 100 with the fiber optic sights if I did my part. It is also light and easy handling. First time I picked it up it just felt right and fit me right. I had my choice between the knight bighorn or the vortek when I got it as a gift. I am not disappointed in my choice. Only misfires I have had have been my own fault. Then again the knights have a good rep. I would have one of each if I could, never cared for muzzleloader, just wanted one because I was getting drawn for multiseason tags. First time I took it out and shot it I was hooked.
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: ghosthunter on February 21, 2014, 05:56:55 PM: Knight

My buddy bought a vortex and couldn't get rid of it fast enough.

Lots of threads on here about Vortex problem.

Just get a knight. :twocents:
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: barracuda163 on February 21, 2014, 06:13:30 PM: I own two bighorns, both shoot extremely accurate and flawless, however it didn't happen overnight. Working up a load that a given rifle will digest takes time at the bench. One other point I'd like to make is that don't exclude yourself from limited hunting opportunities with a muzzle loader, you can use a scope on your ml to hunt rifle season in weapon restriction areas.
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: Sabotloader on February 21, 2014, 07:04:48 PM: Quote from: JJB11B on February 20, 2014, 04:14:48 PM
I was given a CVA Elkhorn by my cousin but it is in terrible condition. I am getting ready to replace it but I can't decide if i should get a Knight or a Traditions. I get conflicting opinions when I ask around. The price difference isn't a factor in my decision making process so any advice I can get, Pros and Cons on the guns would be greatly appreciated.

I would highly suggest the Knight over any Traditions. The Knight is made for cap ignition using a solid plunger to strike the cap. The traditions are 209 guns that have been modified to shoot a cap. They use a striking pin driven by a hammer blow. Often depending on how you have placed the cap on the nipple post they may or may not create ignition.
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: Sabotloader on February 21, 2014, 07:10:36 PM: Quote from: JJB11B on February 21, 2014, 04:38:36 PM
Ok, With this feedback lets go this direction.....Whats the best Muzzlestuffer on the market? Modern rifles are so much easier. Rem 700 is the best all around gun. I need a quality muzzleloader. I am gonna put in for multi season tags and have 2 of the 3 options double covered...

For Pacific Northwest hunting - I really would suggest a Knight DISC Extreme for most - Stepping up from the DISC you could work your way into a Mountaineer or my reference the Knight Ultra-Lite.

If you are interested check Bob's Sporting Goods in Longview or Sunbirds in Chehalis - they have the best price on Knights that I have seen.

Might look at this...

http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,120357.msg1587606.html#msg1587606 (http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,120357.msg1587606.html#msg1587606)

http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,121220.msg1599212.html#msg1599212 (http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,121220.msg1599212.html#msg1599212)

http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,121376.msg1601949.html#msg1601949 (http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,121376.msg1601949.html#msg1601949)

Hope some of this helps... mike
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: bear hunter on February 21, 2014, 07:12:26 PM: Quote from: Sabotloader on February 21, 2014, 07:04:48 PM
Quote from: JJB11B on February 20, 2014, 04:14:48 PM
I was given a CVA Elkhorn by my cousin but it is in terrible condition. I am getting ready to replace it but I can't decide if i should get a Knight or a Traditions. I get conflicting opinions when I ask around. The price difference isn't a factor in my decision making process so any advice I can get, Pros and Cons on the guns would be greatly appreciated.

I would highly suggest the Knight over any Traditions. The Knight is made for cap ignition using a solid plunger to strike the cap. The traditions are 209 guns that have been modified to shoot a cap. They use a striking pin driven by a hammer blow. Often depending on how you have placed the cap on the nipple post they may or may not create ignition.
:yeah: My buddy's have the Traditions and it goes off after the 2nd try. He has missed out on some deer and was luck on last years deer. The doe jumped but he was able to cock the hammer again and fire. Go with Knight :tup:
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: ML_Hunter on February 21, 2014, 07:23:56 PM: Quote from: JJB11B on February 20, 2014, 04:36:30 PM
Knight Bighorn or one of the Traditions vorteks

When the Vortex first came out, there were a ton of issues with them. At the time I was working at the Lacey Cabela's. I worked with management there to make a HUGE puss to finally get in some Northwest leagle muzzies...The first Northwest muzzies we got were the Vortex and the T/C Blackdiamond XR. We sold tons of each...then got a bunch of the Vortex rifles returned.

Problems included the rifle folding over and then not snapping back together, Front sling stud coming out, Trigger would mush and not fire the round. and not striking the #11 cap hard enough to ignite the charge.

This was back around 2008/2009...but ever since Triditions have left a bad taste in my mouth and I would never own one. I have also heard a lot of people with excellent reviews over the rifle. One of the guys who I hunt with owns a Vortex and he loves it! Not to mention, the problems may have been fixed by now. But, I would still steer away from them IMO.

Hope this helps...
Title: Re: I am torn between two muzzle loaders.
Post by: sagewalker on February 21, 2014, 07:26:44 PM: I have a Knight Bighorn 50 cal. and Traditons Vortek UL LDR Northwest Magnum 50 cal. I love them both. The Traditions is very light and has great sights, shoots well. The Knight is pretty stout but shoots great as well. Great boom sticks