Hunting Washington Forum

Equipment & Gear => Guns and Ammo => Topic started by: Drop-tine on December 10, 2014, 08:56:03 PM

Title: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: Drop-tine on December 10, 2014, 08:56:03 PM: I have been having a problem with reloading my 22-250 rounds. first time loading brand new casings the bullets fit just fine, but reloading them the second time is a different story, I loaded 50 rounds and put them in my individual ammo box got to the range opened my ammo box and my bullets had fallen through into the casing...? what is up with that? are my dies not crimping the bullets tight enough? are my casing necks expanding too much?
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: JimmyHoffa on December 10, 2014, 09:06:19 PM: It could be your die isn't fully resizing. Did you have to trim after you resized? Another thing that happens, but usually after a few shots is that the brass gets work hardened and acts like a spring, even with a good die it will fit and then spring back later. Annealing will soften the brass so it will keep the form from the die.
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: Biggerhammer on December 10, 2014, 09:08:32 PM: Check the dies and the expander. That shouldn't be happening. Make sure your dies are set correctly and your getting the neck completly sized.
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: Drop-tine on December 10, 2014, 09:15:44 PM: How do I check the expander? And the expander is the ball on the pin that you use to de prime the fired casings?
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: mountainman on December 10, 2014, 09:34:01 PM: Seating too deep?
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: Drop-tine on December 10, 2014, 09:40:25 PM: not seating too deep I start with the die raised and press the bullet to see where it ends up seated then make adjustments from there. I want to say its a bad set RCBS dies. But who knows I could have a faulty set of dies.
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: wildweeds on December 10, 2014, 10:00:04 PM: My buddy had your same exact problem last week with a fresh set of 300WSM dies.He called RCBS for a part for the dies as he had a stuck case,they said "No problem it's on it's way" Well they just sent him a complete new set,turns out the part he needed for the old set was wrong in the new set.One more call and he got yet again a new set,problem fixed.
Quote from: Drop-tine on December 10, 2014, 09:40:25 PM
not seating too deep I start with the die raised and press the bullet to see where it ends up seated then make adjustments from there. I want to say its a bad set RCBS dies. But who knows I could have a faulty set of dies.
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: Drop-tine on December 10, 2014, 10:02:30 PM: Awesome! ill give them a call tomorrow! thanks wildweeds hopefully that will solve the issue.
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: Kittman on December 11, 2014, 10:11:25 AM: Was there any gap between your shellholder and resizing die while compressing (full stroke) the reloading hand lever? In other words, were they almost in contact? If there was a noticeable or excessive space between the two components your cases may not have been traveling far enough into the dies.
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: Drop-tine on December 11, 2014, 11:58:46 AM: No it was all normal had the same feel as every other bullets I have loaded with no more resistance or no more ease than usual, still had the same smooth motion. I tried loosening up the top long screw on the set die without any good results then taking it back down gradually to where it needed to be and same problem. I called RCBS this morning and they said too big of a expander ball in the die so their sending me a new set, we'll see how they work.
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: Kittman on December 11, 2014, 12:13:26 PM: Thanks for sharing the details, and good information to know. I am looking to get a set of 30-30 dies soon, so I definitely will be watching for this. I have several sets of different caliber RCBS dies and never encountered this issue (so-far).
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: b23 on December 11, 2014, 01:03:28 PM: Quote from: Drop-tine on December 11, 2014, 11:58:46 AM
No it was all normal had the same feel as every other bullets I have loaded with no more resistance or no more ease than usual, still had the same smooth motion. I tried loosening up the top long screw on the set die without any good results then taking it back down gradually to where it needed to be and same problem. I called RCBS this morning and they said too big of a expander ball in the die so their sending me a new set, we'll see how they work.

So I'm assuming you loaded that first batch of new brass, the ones you didn't have any trouble with, without running them through your FL die first? They were brand new cases and you loaded them straight out of the box, yes?
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: wildweeds on December 11, 2014, 04:10:54 PM: Apparantly inspector #7 went on vacation or something,exact same problem on my buddys dies.

Quote from: Drop-tine on December 11, 2014, 11:58:46 AM
No it was all normal had the same feel as every other bullets I have loaded with no more resistance or no more ease than usual, still had the same smooth motion. I tried loosening up the top long screw on the set die without any good results then taking it back down gradually to where it needed to be and same problem. I called RCBS this morning and they said too big of a expander ball in the die so their sending me a new set, we'll see how they work.
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: Drop-tine on December 11, 2014, 04:48:45 PM: Thats correct, I didnt need to run it through the FL die because the casings were not primed so I just lubed them loaded the powder and pressed the bullets. Is it recommended to run them though the FL die first? I have never done that with brand new brass.

Quote from: b23 on December 11, 2014, 01:03:28 PM
Quote from: Drop-tine on December 11, 2014, 11:58:46 AM
No it was all normal had the same feel as every other bullets I have loaded with no more resistance or no more ease than usual, still had the same smooth motion. I tried loosening up the top long screw on the set die without any good results then taking it back down gradually to where it needed to be and same problem. I called RCBS this morning and they said too big of a expander ball in the die so their sending me a new set, we'll see how they work.

So I'm assuming you loaded that first batch of new brass, the ones you didn't have any trouble with, without running them through your FL die first? They were brand new cases and you loaded them straight out of the box, yes?
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: wildweeds on December 11, 2014, 06:15:30 PM: Sounds like they have killer customer service,copied this from my freinds message

" i love rcbs customer service, first they send me a whole new set of dies when all i wanted was a expander ball, that set had the wrong expander ball, so this just showed up, new spindle, expander ball and 5 decapping pins with a voucher for 50% off my next set of rcbs dies"
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: JJB11B on December 11, 2014, 06:31:49 PM: My 22-250 bullets tend to fall through or near animals.... :sry:
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: Drop-tine on December 11, 2014, 06:54:19 PM: Im very happy with their customer service right now! ill only buy RCBS now because of their customer service! And jjb11b my bullets usually fall through animals too when my bullets are actually able to fly through my gun :tup:
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: b23 on December 11, 2014, 07:11:49 PM: Most brass comes with the mouth and necks so beat up you almost need to run it through some type of die to get the necks round. Using the bullet to uniform and round out the necks as your seating it, probably isn't the best way to go. I only use Lapua brass and on occasion I'll get a few with flat spots on the mouth.

I don't like the button so I take them out of all my dies. Instead, I use an expander mandrel die that straightens the necks and makes them round and uniform. It slightly over sizes the neck and then I neck size to whatever neck tension I choose with my bushing die.

If I were you, I would pull the button out of your FL die, take one of the cases you've shot and run it through your FL die without the button in, then seat a bullet and see if that fixes your problem. If it does, you'll know the button is the problem. If it doesn't, well, that new button they're sending you won't change anything.
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: Biggerhammer on December 11, 2014, 09:36:48 PM: Quote from: Drop-tine on December 10, 2014, 09:40:25 PM
not seating too deep I start with the die raised and press the bullet to see where it ends up seated then make adjustments from there. I want to say its a bad set RCBS dies. But who knows I could have a faulty set of dies.

I had a bad set of RCBS .300 WSM dies once. Same issue, called and explained it to them and they recognized the problem right away. Didn't even ask for the faulty set back and shipped me a new set. Awful hard to seat a little 22-250 bullet too deep. I have run across that issue with several wildcats I reload with custom bullets but far and few between.
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: Drop-tine on December 11, 2014, 11:08:03 PM: Yeah I believe its the dies, because my measurements on the bullets is right where they need to be and its not shoving the bullets all the way through into the powder, they come out of the press looking the way they should just must be lose enough the vibrations from traveling from my reloading bench to the range is causing the bullets to fall through into the powder.
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: jasnt on December 12, 2014, 02:17:44 AM: I realize they are sending you a new one but you could chuck the old one up in a drill and polish it down .001" or 2 till it works properly. I always like to polish up my expander balls with flitz and steel wool. But I bet if you use some 800grit first you could have a back up or if you ever decided to play with neck tension. Trick I learned from catshooter @PM
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: AWS on December 12, 2014, 08:17:58 AM: I always wonder about a company that is known for their CS, I rather do business with a company that you don't have to use it. Just from this post RCBS has sent out a lot of bad dies.
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: b23 on December 12, 2014, 09:19:43 AM: I think it's great that they are sending you a new die but looking at it from a business stand point I don't understand why the CS rep was so quick to send out a whole new die if all he thought was wrong was the expander button. Why not have you take it out and try it to see if that really is the problem. Just doesn't seem like a smart business model to me.
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: Curly on December 12, 2014, 09:24:43 AM: Quote from: AWS on December 12, 2014, 08:17:58 AM
I always wonder about a company that is known for their CS, I rather do business with a company that you don't have to use it. Just from this post RCBS has sent out a lot of bad dies.

:yeah:

From this thread, I'd be nervous about buying RCBS dies. I have several myself, but it sounds like their quality has gone downhill............ :dunno:
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: Drop-tine on December 12, 2014, 02:57:29 PM: I understand what you guys are saying and im not going to argue the fact the their products could be going downhill in quality it seems to me that almost everything now days is made with less quality, and maybe the cs knows that they have some bad products, but them taking care of me and sending me a new set is better than me going to the store and paying 50$ for another set in my opinion. If the set they are sending me now does the same thing then ill tinker with them until i can figure it out or ill go to a different brand of dies.
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: Biggerhammer on December 12, 2014, 08:16:21 PM: Compared to the total amount of RCBS dies sold, it's nothing. They have a solid record and obviously a solid buisness model. They have been in buisness long before most on this site and from the looks of it. They will still be in buisness long after most of us are gone.
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: wildweeds on December 12, 2014, 09:48:50 PM: +1 No such thing as "perfection" it's strived for in many industries,truth is substandard parts slip through the cracks,perhaps an automated machine puked out a shifts worth of .002+ sized parts,which got mixed in with 20 other machines +/- 0 parts and the tech check station sampled 5% of the parts,those large parts are going to be like lottery tickets,you have to grab the right one.The GOOD part of the buisness is they stand behind their product and quickly correct mistakes.... no questions asked.Throw an underpaid human in the mix and it may very well be that someone didn't measure the parts before they chucked em together,a hangover and the mentality of "Why measure,the last 4 days worth have been spec" may very well be the issue.
Quote from: Biggerhammer on December 12, 2014, 08:16:21 PM
Compared to the total amount of RCBS dies sold, it's nothing. They have a solid record and obviously a solid buisness model. They have been in buisness long before most on this site and from the looks of it. They will still be in buisness long after most of us are gone.
Title: Re: 22-250 bullets falling through casings.
Post by: Drop-tine on December 14, 2014, 04:50:16 PM: I agree :tup: