Post by: WapitiTalk1 on February 03, 2015, 12:47:18 PM
Your move. Are you shooting, not shooting, trying to stop the bull with an elk sound? What is your move?
Reminder that if you save the picture to your desktop and open in MS Paint, you'll be able to place a spot, X, or whatever on the critter before you save it back to a jpg and add the marked up pic with your post (if you decide to shoot).
Post by: D-Rock425 on February 03, 2015, 12:55:05 PM
Post by: jrebel on February 03, 2015, 01:04:49 PM
Lots of variable that I am reading into....but doable at 20 yards with my set up. This is all assuming I am not shaking to bad due to adrenalin. :chuckle:
Post by: vandeman17 on February 03, 2015, 01:08:05 PM
Next step the left leg goes forward and I hit him in the bowler maker. This assumes he is walking very slow. If not I may try a quick cow call (if I am already at full draw) to get him to stop for a brief moment.
Lots of variable that I am reading into....but doable at 20 yards with my set up. This is all assuming I am not shaking to bad due to adrenalin. :chuckle:
My play as well. Wait until one more step for shoulder to clear and let him have it. At 20 yards and full draw, I should be able to put it pretty much right where I want to. One factor would be how bad I am shaking and how long I have held my draw. It would be 99% a feel/instinctual shot for me.
Post by: D-Rock425 on February 03, 2015, 01:10:11 PM
Post by: D-Rock425 on February 03, 2015, 01:13:14 PM
Post by: WapitiTalk1 on February 03, 2015, 01:13:38 PM
5th day of a 10 day hunt i'd pass on this dink bull. :chuckle:
Was waiting on that. Yah, he's barely a keeper :chuckle: Anybody considering throwing out a nervous grunt with their voice to stop bullwinkle before he enters the vital covering brush?
Post by: h20hunter on February 03, 2015, 01:13:53 PM
A) I've never killed an elk, let alone a bull
B) I shoot a Hoyt Spyder 34, heavy arrows, Montec b-head, about 73 lb draw.
I put one right on the mark and I get major arteries if not the heart, maybe the lung on my side, for sure the far side. He goes 75 yards and falls on his face.
Post by: IBspoiled on February 03, 2015, 01:15:44 PM
Post by: D-Rock425 on February 03, 2015, 01:21:33 PM
Post by: jrebel on February 03, 2015, 01:22:01 PM
Ok. I'll play and I'm open for correction on my shot.
A) I've never killed an elk, let alone a bull
B) I shoot a Hoyt Spyder 34, heavy arrows, Montec b-head, about 73 lb draw.
I put one right on the mark and I get major arteries if not the heart, maybe the lung on my side, for sure the far side. He goes 75 yards and falls on his face.
You are way to high for the heart and danger close to the shoulder blade. You may get major vessels and lung, but likely only one.
Post by: D-Rock425 on February 03, 2015, 01:25:32 PM
Post by: h20hunter on February 03, 2015, 01:28:52 PM
Post by: vandeman17 on February 03, 2015, 01:34:31 PM
Post by: jrebel on February 03, 2015, 01:37:43 PM
Post by: Dhoey07 on February 03, 2015, 01:41:37 PM
Post by: h20hunter on February 03, 2015, 01:43:26 PM
:chuckle:
Post by: Rainier10 on February 03, 2015, 01:44:30 PM
Man I love these, very real world and never a slam dunk shot, always something to think about.
Post by: jrebel on February 03, 2015, 01:48:30 PM
Post by: Russ McDonald on February 03, 2015, 01:49:35 PM
Post by: h20hunter on February 03, 2015, 01:50:37 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWH_PP0PAUc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWH_PP0PAUc)
Post by: jrebel on February 03, 2015, 01:53:16 PM
Post by: Russ McDonald on February 03, 2015, 01:54:12 PM
Post by: WSU on February 03, 2015, 01:57:44 PM
Also, the video doesn't look quartering to at all. The near leg is actually forward of the far leg. I'd wait for another step and the hug tight behind the shoulder.
Post by: h20hunter on February 03, 2015, 01:58:31 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=flYsFPJtSGQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=flYsFPJtSGQ)
Post by: jrebel on February 03, 2015, 02:01:29 PM
Here.....skip to 11:45......they even put a red dot on it!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=flYsFPJtSGQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=flYsFPJtSGQ)
Wow...that is almost straight on.....
Post by: h20hunter on February 03, 2015, 02:03:44 PM
Post by: jrebel on February 03, 2015, 02:06:05 PM
I think it looks more "head on" because of the camera angle compared to shooter angle. Regardless I thought it was a good example of the shot we are discussing. Also....who doesn't love to see a shot like that and then a nice bull take a faceplant!
I have seen a couple animals shot and watched them fall with archery equipment. Nothing better in the world. Fist pumps and high fives are in order when you see that. :tup:
Post by: Encore 280 on February 03, 2015, 02:06:19 PM
Post by: Russ McDonald on February 03, 2015, 02:08:13 PM
But H2O is right the angle of the camera is different then the shooter but the picture that the elk we are putting dots on is more broadside then the one in the last video
Post by: HntnFsh on February 03, 2015, 07:07:13 PM
Leg goes forward moving the bone and I hit him where the red dot is. To early and you hit bone.....I hit both lungs, maybe top of hart, maybe liver.
I'm prolly wrong, but it looks to me like your a bit far back. Maybe the near lung. Havent watched the video either though.
Post by: erk444 on February 03, 2015, 07:54:41 PM
Post by: jrebel on February 03, 2015, 08:05:19 PM
Post by: D-Rock425 on February 04, 2015, 06:16:39 AM
Post by: coachcw on February 04, 2015, 06:25:45 AM
Post by: D-Rock425 on February 04, 2015, 06:38:13 AM
Post by: D-Rock425 on February 04, 2015, 06:45:10 AM
you wont like my opinion but if you drove that arrow right inside of the left hip pocket high , that bull would bleed like a stuck hog and not want to go any where , I hit a cow there once off a defection she ran sixty yards and fell over dead looked like a blood bath .i dont like it.
Post by: Jonathan_S on February 04, 2015, 06:49:06 AM
5th day of a 10 day hunt i'd pass on this dink bull. :chuckle:
Was waiting on that. Yah, he's barely a keeper :chuckle: Anybody considering throwing out a nervous grunt with their voice to stop bullwinkle before he enters the vital covering brush?
:yeah: at that distance and with him close to broadside, I don't really care what sound I have to make to get him to stop. I could fart and he'd stop and look the same as if it were a cow call
Post by: coachcw on February 04, 2015, 07:40:14 AM
Post by: Karl Blanchard on February 04, 2015, 07:51:10 AM
This very same thing happened to Aaron a few years back. Spike comes in perfect broadside at 20yards. He calls, bull stops but when he cranks his head to look his chest comes forward just enough to make it a quartering to angle. He placed it perfect, tight to the pocket but due to the bull turning his body to look he didn't get the off side lung. He got one lung, liver and guts. He got lucky with the liver and the bull got pretty sick pretty fast but he wasn't gonna die anytime soon. A sneak and another arrow finished it. I've seen just enough bad things happen with archery tackle to know that its not worth sending that arrow on a shot that isn't optimal.
Pass on the shot, bull lives, come back and call him in again. If he is dead in the bushes a mile away because of a poorly placed arrow, you will never have an opportunity at him again.
Post by: Karl Blanchard on February 04, 2015, 07:52:18 AM
not the same shot not enough angle for the front entry at full draw give him three steps and slip it behind the shoulder .. :yeah:
Post by: Shawn Ryan on February 04, 2015, 04:18:39 PM
My first archery elk was a cow running broadside. Aluminum arrow broke in half, got the near lung and the liver. Found her 3 days later about a mile away, still alive and finished her. She was carrying the half-arrow in her, with broadhead on one end and jagged aluminum shaft on the other, bleeding bad. Lessons learned: one lung is insufficient on elk; hunt aggressively, shoot conservatively.
Post by: WSU on February 04, 2015, 04:40:02 PM
Post by: TommyH on February 04, 2015, 04:50:26 PM
not the same shot not enough angle for the front entry at full draw give him three steps and slip it behind the shoulder .. :yeah:
:yeah: I wouldn't even call if he is on a slow cautious approach. He will just turn more to your call.
Post by: D-Rock425 on February 04, 2015, 05:02:09 PM
A bit off topic, but what have people's experiences been with liver shots? I hit a cow in the liver plus one lung. She was dead by the time I could walk half a mile back to my truck and return with my pack. I did it with a bull but only got liver. He required a follow up about 2 miles and 5 hours later. Both worked out in the end but the bull required some good fortune to even recover him.I've shot 2 elk in liver one was straight liver guts the other 1lung plus liver she only went 50yards and died. It took about 40 minutes but she was in bad shape really quick.
Post by: jrebel on February 04, 2015, 07:23:11 PM
Post by: erk444 on February 04, 2015, 07:44:44 PM
Post by: kisfish on February 04, 2015, 09:10:25 PM
Post by: elk247 on February 04, 2015, 09:40:53 PM
Grunt, whistle, pop, glunk, mew ect. Anything that you can do at full draw. Wait as long as possible for the angle to be favorable. Passing on a bull with a questionable shot on the 5th day of a 10 day hunt in Montana in late September isn't the end of the world.5th day of a 10 day hunt i'd pass on this dink bull. :chuckle:
Was waiting on that. Yah, he's barely a keeper :chuckle: Anybody considering throwing out a nervous grunt with their voice to stop bullwinkle before he enters the vital covering brush?
Post by: Jonathan_S on February 05, 2015, 09:26:42 AM
Post by: jrebel on February 05, 2015, 09:49:10 AM
1. Sharp broadhead.
2. Major vessel / organ. Major vessels will make an animal spray blood.
3. bottom 1/3 of the animal.
I have seen a couple high double lung shots that did not put blood on the ground. Due to the shot being high the elk filled up with blood not leaking much on the ground. When blood was found it was from the elk coughing / wheezing from not being able to breath.
Archery hunting does create wound cavities like rifles. It also does not create devastating exit wounds, if any at all. The best advise I could give anyone that hunts archery is to be super attentive. After the shot always mark the last place and direction the animal was seen. Sometimes you won't find blood for 20-30 yards because it takes that long for it to drip down their hair. Lastly....Don't cover up the blood you do find. Use direction of travel to find new blood....usually they will not do an about face and change direction sharply.
Post by: elk247 on February 05, 2015, 09:50:30 AM
Post by: Curly on February 05, 2015, 09:55:10 AM
Post by: D-Rock425 on February 05, 2015, 09:56:06 AM
Or another thought. I would hope D-Rock425 is with me and I have him with his hunting knife in his hand and throw him like a dart at the elk. Very caveman like :chuckle:this would be the safest bet off all. I'd ride that bull out until he died.
Post by: Jonathan_S on February 05, 2015, 10:35:57 AM
Let him continue to walk a bit until he is broadside or slightly quartering away. :twocents:
Yes. If that bull was stopped at that angle though and I thought wind might swirl, I'm taking the shot. I might get one lung but I can get the liver no problem. Liver hits are deadly with any weapon.
Post by: coachcw on February 05, 2015, 04:49:50 PM
Post by: WSU on February 05, 2015, 04:53:01 PM
Post by: jrebel on February 05, 2015, 05:07:11 PM
Post by: jrebel on February 05, 2015, 05:12:00 PM
These are animals that need to sit for a couple hours before tracking. If weather permits. :tup:
Post by: Jonathan_S on February 05, 2015, 05:41:34 PM
Elk are just amazingly tough, I've helped find bulls and cows that went forever on one lung too so unless you take out the heart or both lungs, it's anyone's guess. :twocents:
Post by: lamrith on February 05, 2015, 08:14:17 PM
Heres a good one that shows a shot close to this angle. The bull is a bit more broadside but I thought it does a good job (especially in the slow me) of showing the shoulder blade moving in relation to the area of impact we are talking about.Pretty gutsy shot given the brush. The arrow nicks it as it passes..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWH_PP0PAUc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWH_PP0PAUc)
Post by: coachcw on February 06, 2015, 12:55:34 PM
I don't see that as a gutsy shot that's real world . the pathetic thing is the lack of KE that guy is shooting . :twocents:Heres a good one that shows a shot close to this angle. The bull is a bit more broadside but I thought it does a good job (especially in the slow me) of showing the shoulder blade moving in relation to the area of impact we are talking about.Pretty gutsy shot given the brush. The arrow nicks it as it passes..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWH_PP0PAUc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWH_PP0PAUc)
Post by: Jonathan_S on February 06, 2015, 12:57:43 PM
Post by: pd on February 06, 2015, 02:57:07 PM
Post by: elk247 on February 06, 2015, 06:39:28 PM
:yeah: I wonder what setup he had? Not much penetration but it got the job done.I don't see that as a gutsy shot that's real world . the pathetic thing is the lack of KE that guy is shooting . :twocents:Heres a good one that shows a shot close to this angle. The bull is a bit more broadside but I thought it does a good job (especially in the slow me) of showing the shoulder blade moving in relation to the area of impact we are talking about.Pretty gutsy shot given the brush. The arrow nicks it as it passes..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWH_PP0PAUc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWH_PP0PAUc)
Post by: whackmaster on February 08, 2015, 06:06:02 PM
Post by: WapitiTalk1 on February 08, 2015, 09:26:50 PM
I know no one will agree but this is one deadly shot
Very low percentage shot in IMO sir. Remote chance of hitting off side leg artery but that's about it; most likely the shooter will end up with a dead elk by gut shot, perhaps days later with minimal chance of recovery.
Post by: whackmaster on February 08, 2015, 09:35:23 PM
Post by: Jonathan_S on February 09, 2015, 06:19:58 AM
Post by: Elknut1 on February 09, 2015, 06:49:56 AM
ElkNut1
Post by: Jonathan_S on February 09, 2015, 08:03:40 AM
With the number of lost elk threads we see annually that stem from "perfect shots" I am going to say that that hindquarter shot is statistically on par with broadside shots.
:peep:
Post by: coachcw on February 09, 2015, 07:54:02 PM
Post by: coachcw on February 09, 2015, 07:56:06 PM
Post by: Jonathan_S on February 09, 2015, 08:54:18 PM
Post by: coachcw on February 10, 2015, 05:35:00 PM