Post by: pianoman9701 on February 12, 2015, 05:55:28 PM
"Ruby Creek wolf captured, placed
in western Washington sanctuary
OLYMPIA – A wolf that had become habituated to humans, and could cause problems if left in the wild, was captured yesterday (Feb. 11) by state wildlife officials in northeast Washington and placed in a western Washington wolf sanctuary.
The adult female wolf, the last known member of the Ruby Creek pack, was captured near the community of Ione in Pend Oreille County where she had spent months living near people, domestic dogs and livestock.
Dave Ware, wolf policy lead for the Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife (WDFW), said the wolf’s behavior prompted concerns she would breed with a domestic dog, produce wolf-dog hybrids in the wild, and become increasingly associated with humans.
“This is a rare situation,” Ware said. “We know that placing wolves in captivity is not an option every time there is a problem. In this case, however, we believe permanent placement in a wolf sanctuary is a good match given the animal’s habituation to humans.”
Since last fall, the Pend Oreille County Commission has urged WDFW to move the wolf out of Ione, Ware said. Yet, she eluded capture and remained in the area despite the department’s efforts to trap her.
After the wolf’s capture, she was spayed and transported for permanent placement to Wolf Haven International, a non-profit wolf sanctuary and wildlife education facility in Thurston County.
“The female wolf was received last night and she’s in good health,” said Diane Gallegos, director of Wolf Haven International. “We’ve been coordinating with the department for several months now, and we are pleased to be able to accommodate this wolf.”
If the wolf does not adapt well to life in captivity, according to criteria developed by the department and Wolf Haven, she will be euthanized.
Ware said the decision to place the wolf in captivity was made after discussions with WDFW’s Wolf Advisory Group of citizens, the Washington Fish and Wildlife Commission, and the Pend Oreille County Commission.
“We discussed the pros and cons of possible actions, including translocation, euthanasia, or placement in captivity,” Ware said. “We appreciate the generous offer by Wolf Haven staff to take this individual into their care.”
The Ruby Creek pack was confirmed by WDFW in 2013 when two adult female wolves were found traveling together in the area of Ruby Creek south of Ione. A wolf pack is defined as two or more wolves traveling together. Last winter, after the other female mated with a domestic dog, it was captured, spayed and returned to the wild. That wolf was struck and killed by a motor vehicle on a road last spring.
The gray wolf is listed by the state as an endangered species throughout Washington and is federally listed as an endangered species in the western two-thirds of the state. WDFW is working to recover the state’s gray wolf population, guided by a citizen-developed plan to address conflicts with livestock and other impacts. For more information, see http://wdfw.wa.gov/conservation/gray_wolf/ (http://wdfw.wa.gov/conservation/gray_wolf/) "
Post by: pianoman9701 on February 12, 2015, 05:58:48 PM
Post by: chester on February 12, 2015, 06:19:27 PM
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Post by: carpsniperg2 on February 12, 2015, 06:24:52 PM
Post by: bobcat on February 12, 2015, 06:46:29 PM
Post by: wolfbait on February 12, 2015, 08:51:16 PM
At least they spayed her before turning her over to the wolf heaven place.
I would like to see the paper work from the vet, just to be sure. Do I trust WDFW, not one bit.
Post by: Curly on February 12, 2015, 08:53:16 PM
Post by: wolfbait on February 12, 2015, 09:01:31 PM
How much $ did all this cost? Wouldn't a bullet be much cheaper?
Wolf Haven will do a litte more hand feeding, then we can hear about how the wolves are harmless as they take it from school to school promoting wolves. Of course a WDFW biologist along with one of the pro-wolfers on the advisory committee will tag along for support, sending pamphlets home with the kids begging for money and promoting more habitat.
Post by: pianoman9701 on February 12, 2015, 09:02:08 PM
At least they spayed her before turning her over to the wolf heaven place.
:yeah:
Post by: villageidiot on February 12, 2015, 09:55:37 PM
Post by: timberfaller on February 12, 2015, 10:02:46 PM
Post by: M_ray on February 12, 2015, 10:57:18 PM
Post by: fair-chase on February 13, 2015, 12:34:48 AM
Post by: pianoman9701 on February 13, 2015, 05:00:55 AM
Once again you guys can't get through one wolf post without the mention of moving wolves to Seattle, the Wet Side blah blah blah :bash: and you wonder why a lot of your words go unnoticed or without much merit anymore? I have to say it on every wolf post .... I have yet to see a west side hunter say that they were in favor of wolves being re-introduced , translocated , or relocated anywhere in Wa East or west!!! But you guys won't be happy until every last hunter in this state suffers your same misery! Its an absurd comment and soon people are going to just quit reading these posts because of it ... I know I for one am already tired of it 😬
If you're tired of it, don't post. :dunno: Were you a hall monitor in high school?
Post by: wolfbait on February 13, 2015, 06:41:01 AM
Once again you guys can't get through one wolf post without the mention of moving wolves to Seattle, the Wet Side blah blah blah :bash: and you wonder why a lot of your words go unnoticed or without much merit anymore? I have to say it on every wolf post .... I have yet to see a west side hunter say that they were in favor of wolves being re-introduced , translocated , or relocated anywhere in Wa East or west!!! But you guys won't be happy until every last hunter in this state suffers your same misery! Its an absurd comment and soon people are going to just quit reading these posts because of it ... I know I for one am already tired of it 😬
M_Ray, you already have wolves on the west side, and just like the east side WDFW will not confirm until they are forced to, do to livestock predation or some other wolf problem. I highly doubt anyone could get WDFW to move wolves that included a paper trail. "Threatening" WDFW with a forced relocation might speed them up at confirming wolves that are already roaming the West side.
If getting in a twist over comments that some would want delisting sooner by forcing WDFW to "move" wolves around to speed up recover bothers you so much, maybe you shouldn't be reading the wolf thread. :dunno:
Post by: kodiak 907 on February 13, 2015, 06:42:46 AM
Once again you guys can't get through one wolf post without the mention of moving wolves to Seattle, the Wet Side blah blah blah :bash: and you wonder why a lot of your words go unnoticed or without much merit anymore? I have to say it on every wolf post .... I have yet to see a west side hunter say that they were in favor of wolves being re-introduced , translocated , or relocated anywhere in Wa East or west!!! But you guys won't be happy until every last hunter in this state suffers your same misery! Its an absurd comment and soon people are going to just quit reading these posts because of it ... I know I for one am already tired of it 😬
I'm over here on the west side. I say bring them on over, it's happening slowly but surely right now so why not speed it up? Help out with the hoof rot, maybe thin out a few lions, and add to the number of confirmed breeding pairs. Who knows maybe the wolves would get managed correctly after all.
Post by: Curly on February 13, 2015, 09:00:53 AM
Are you thinking that wolves would kill some cougars?Once again you guys can't get through one wolf post without the mention of moving wolves to Seattle, the Wet Side blah blah blah :bash: and you wonder why a lot of your words go unnoticed or without much merit anymore? I have to say it on every wolf post .... I have yet to see a west side hunter say that they were in favor of wolves being re-introduced , translocated , or relocated anywhere in Wa East or west!!! But you guys won't be happy until every last hunter in this state suffers your same misery! Its an absurd comment and soon people are going to just quit reading these posts because of it ... I know I for one am already tired of it 😬
I'm over here on the west side. I say bring them on over, it's happening slowly but surely right now so why not speed it up? Help out with the hoof rot, maybe thin out a few lions, and add to the number of confirmed breeding pairs. Who knows maybe the wolves would get managed correctly after all.
Post by: Special T on February 13, 2015, 11:05:15 AM
The comments about dropping them off in SeaTown isnt directed at hunters, but all the ignorant bunny huggers that think they are soft and cuddly. Since I grew up in the greater seattle area i can tell you first hand how many of these ignorant people will blos this issue off until it affects THEM! I rember when all the Yuppies started building houses on a mountain outside of Issaquah. There was a huge outrage when someones fluffy was dragged off by a courgar.... Any one want to guess which mountain this ignoramus built thier subdivision?
Post by: kodiak 907 on February 13, 2015, 11:14:50 AM
Are you thinking that wolves would kill some cougars?Once again you guys can't get through one wolf post without the mention of moving wolves to Seattle, the Wet Side blah blah blah :bash: and you wonder why a lot of your words go unnoticed or without much merit anymore? I have to say it on every wolf post .... I have yet to see a west side hunter say that they were in favor of wolves being re-introduced , translocated , or relocated anywhere in Wa East or west!!! But you guys won't be happy until every last hunter in this state suffers your same misery! Its an absurd comment and soon people are going to just quit reading these posts because of it ... I know I for one am already tired of it
I'm over here on the west side. I say bring them on over, it's happening slowly but surely right now so why not speed it up? Help out with the hoof rot, maybe thin out a few lions, and add to the number of confirmed breeding pairs. Who knows maybe the wolves would get managed correctly after all.
I do think that a small pack of wolves would do a number on young cougars. IMO :dunno:
Post by: kodiak 907 on February 13, 2015, 11:18:06 AM
Ive seen wolves in the skagit and NWbowhunter has posted pics of a whole pack off the nooksack ON HERE that the WDFW did nothing about. It will be MUCH harder to document them here on the wet side than in E wa.
The comments about dropping them off in SeaTown isnt directed at hunters, but all the ignorant bunny huggers that think they are soft and cuddly. Since I grew up in the greater seattle area i can tell you first hand how many of these ignorant people will blos this issue off until it affects THEM! I rember when all the Yuppies started building houses on a mountain outside of Issaquah. There was a huge outrage when someones fluffy was dragged off by a courgar.... Any one want to guess which mountain this ignoramus built thier subdivision?
Post by: Jonathan_S on February 13, 2015, 11:21:49 AM
Post by: Special T on February 13, 2015, 11:23:36 AM
Kodiak 907 Do we both know the Picture taker in question?
Post by: baker5150 on February 13, 2015, 11:28:37 AM
Yup those are the pics i was refering to. I think i rember him saying he was blown off with the "we cant prove they are wolves from a Pic they could be Hybrids" BS
Kodiak 907 Do we both know the Picture taker in question?
I heard it was taken on the S. Fork of the Nooksack, but that could just be speculation/rumors. Looks like the N. Fork right at N. Fork rd. to me. :dunno:
Post by: kodiak 907 on February 13, 2015, 11:39:39 AM
I have not met the owner of the picture posted above.
Post by: WAcoyotehunter on February 13, 2015, 12:55:14 PM
Post by: Special T on February 13, 2015, 01:22:03 PM
When My brother Logged in that unit he was told by several of his co workers that thye had seen wolves WAY back plenty of times. Sadly my brother never saw one.
Post by: M_ray on February 13, 2015, 01:37:49 PM
Once again you guys can't get through one wolf post without the mention of moving wolves to Seattle, the Wet Side blah blah blah :bash: and you wonder why a lot of your words go unnoticed or without much merit anymore? I have to say it on every wolf post .... I have yet to see a west side hunter say that they were in favor of wolves being re-introduced , translocated , or relocated anywhere in Wa East or west!!! But you guys won't be happy until every last hunter in this state suffers your same misery! Its an absurd comment and soon people are going to just quit reading these posts because of it ... I know I for one am already tired of it 😬
If you're tired of it, don't post. :dunno: Were you a hall monitor in high school?
No but apparently some here need one.
Post by: pianoman9701 on February 13, 2015, 01:40:39 PM
Post by: M_ray on February 13, 2015, 02:00:42 PM
Once again you guys can't get through one wolf post without the mention of moving wolves to Seattle, the Wet Side blah blah blah :bash: and you wonder why a lot of your words go unnoticed or without much merit anymore? I have to say it on every wolf post .... I have yet to see a west side hunter say that they were in favor of wolves being re-introduced , translocated , or relocated anywhere in Wa East or west!!! But you guys won't be happy until every last hunter in this state suffers your same misery! Its an absurd comment and soon people are going to just quit reading these posts because of it ... I know I for one am already tired of it 😬
M_Ray, you already have wolves on the west side, and just like the east side WDFW will not confirm until they are forced to, do to livestock predation or some other wolf problem. I highly doubt anyone could get WDFW to move wolves that included a paper trail. "Threatening" WDFW with a forced relocation might speed them up at confirming wolves that are already roaming the West side.
If getting in a twist over comments that some would want delisting sooner by forcing WDFW to "move" wolves around to speed up recover bothers you so much, maybe you shouldn't be reading the wolf thread. :dunno:
No but once again you guys miss the point and I dont need you to tell us what we already know ... My point is WE DONT WANT THEM ANYWHERE! is that so hard to understand?
The comment "move them to Seattle or Wetside" is a idiotic statement IMO and does nothing to solve the issue. I don't doubt they are on the Westside in fact Ive seen their tracks within and hour drive of my house over 20 years ago. But again most and mean most of us here on this side were strongly against them being ANYWHERE in the state and now strongly against them spreading throughout the whole state. To put it into perspective lets say they started with the re-intro on the west side I wouldnt comment on every thread "Well we should move them to Spokane" It gets old real quick dont you think we know that we are out numbered by the Liberal do gooders? you try living with them it's maddening to say the least and I know its frustration and anger that you guys want the wolf lovers to have to live with them and suffer your pain ... but then go post that on their forums cause here your just channeling your anger towards the wrong group.
[quoteIf getting in a twist over comments that some would want delisting sooner by forcing WDFW to "move" wolves around to speed up recover bothers you so much, maybe you shouldn't be reading the wolf thread. :dunno:][/quote]
Then just say that and no one will get in a twist :) That is a reasonable comment "Move them to Seattle" isn't ... its redundant and you know the guys in Olympia would never do it so it serves no purpose other than to look as if you want the whole state ruined cause your honey hole got ruined! How are we on the west side supposed to take the rest of your comments seriously?
Post by: CAMPMEAT on February 13, 2015, 02:04:14 PM
Post by: pianoman9701 on February 13, 2015, 02:09:13 PM
Post by: M_ray on February 13, 2015, 02:13:24 PM
Once again you guys can't get through one wolf post without the mention of moving wolves to Seattle, the Wet Side blah blah blah :bash: and you wonder why a lot of your words go unnoticed or without much merit anymore? I have to say it on every wolf post .... I have yet to see a west side hunter say that they were in favor of wolves being re-introduced , translocated , or relocated anywhere in Wa East or west!!! But you guys won't be happy until every last hunter in this state suffers your same misery! Its an absurd comment and soon people are going to just quit reading these posts because of it ... I know I for one am already tired of it 😬
If you're tired of it, don't post. :dunno: Were you a hall monitor in high school?
No but apparently some here need one.
And Pianoman thats really mature making it a personal attack I dont even know why you and wolfbait are on me about my post when it was villageidiot that made the comment we seem a little defensive? ... but thanks for proving my point.
Post by: wolfbait on February 13, 2015, 02:19:17 PM
Once again you guys can't get through one wolf post without the mention of moving wolves to Seattle, the Wet Side blah blah blah :bash: and you wonder why a lot of your words go unnoticed or without much merit anymore? I have to say it on every wolf post .... I have yet to see a west side hunter say that they were in favor of wolves being re-introduced , translocated , or relocated anywhere in Wa East or west!!! But you guys won't be happy until every last hunter in this state suffers your same misery! Its an absurd comment and soon people are going to just quit reading these posts because of it ... I know I for one am already tired of it 😬
M_Ray, you already have wolves on the west side, and just like the east side WDFW will not confirm until they are forced to, do to livestock predation or some other wolf problem. I highly doubt anyone could get WDFW to move wolves that included a paper trail. "Threatening" WDFW with a forced relocation might speed them up at confirming wolves that are already roaming the West side.
If getting in a twist over comments that some would want delisting sooner by forcing WDFW to "move" wolves around to speed up recover bothers you so much, maybe you shouldn't be reading the wolf thread. :dunno:
No but once again you guys miss the point and I dont need you to tell us what we already know ... My point is WE DONT WANT THEM ANYWHERE! is that so hard to understand?
The comment "move them to Seattle or Wetside" is a idiotic statement IMO and does nothing to solve the issue. I don't doubt they are on the Westside in fact Ive seen their tracks within and hour drive of my house over 20 years ago. But again most and mean most of us here on this side were strongly against them being ANYWHERE in the state and now strongly against them spreading throughout the whole state. To put it into perspective lets say they started with the re-intro on the west side I wouldnt comment on every thread "Well we should move them to Spokane" It gets old real quick dont you think we know that we are out numbered by the Liberal do gooders? you try living with them it's maddening to say the least and I know its frustration and anger that you guys want the wolf lovers to have to live with them and suffer your pain ... but then go post that on their forums cause here your just channeling your anger towards the wrong group.
[quoteIf getting in a twist over comments that some would want delisting sooner by forcing WDFW to "move" wolves around to speed up recover bothers you so much, maybe you shouldn't be reading the wolf thread. :dunno:]
Then just say that and no one will get in a twist :) That is a reasonable comment "Move them to Seattle" isn't ... its redundant and you know the guys in Olympia would never do it so it serves no purpose other than to look as if you want the whole state ruined cause your honey hole got ruined! How are we on the west side supposed to take the rest of your comments seriously?
[/quote]
KFhunter has a horse trailer and he said he would haul the wolves for free, you just can't beat free wolves M-Ray. WDFW said it would cost them a million to translocate wolves to the west side. Maybe we can work a deal. What do you think?
Post by: M_ray on February 13, 2015, 02:31:08 PM
Once again you guys can't get through one wolf post without the mention of moving wolves to Seattle, the Wet Side blah blah blah :bash: and you wonder why a lot of your words go unnoticed or without much merit anymore? I have to say it on every wolf post .... I have yet to see a west side hunter say that they were in favor of wolves being re-introduced , translocated , or relocated anywhere in Wa East or west!!! But you guys won't be happy until every last hunter in this state suffers your same misery! Its an absurd comment and soon people are going to just quit reading these posts because of it ... I know I for one am already tired of it 😬
M_Ray, you already have wolves on the west side, and just like the east side WDFW will not confirm until they are forced to, do to livestock predation or some other wolf problem. I highly doubt anyone could get WDFW to move wolves that included a paper trail. "Threatening" WDFW with a forced relocation might speed them up at confirming wolves that are already roaming the West side.
If getting in a twist over comments that some would want delisting sooner by forcing WDFW to "move" wolves around to speed up recover bothers you so much, maybe you shouldn't be reading the wolf thread. :dunno:
No but once again you guys miss the point and I dont need you to tell us what we already know ... My point is WE DONT WANT THEM ANYWHERE! is that so hard to understand?
The comment "move them to Seattle or Wetside" is a idiotic statement IMO and does nothing to solve the issue. I don't doubt they are on the Westside in fact Ive seen their tracks within and hour drive of my house over 20 years ago. But again most and mean most of us here on this side were strongly against them being ANYWHERE in the state and now strongly against them spreading throughout the whole state. To put it into perspective lets say they started with the re-intro on the west side I wouldnt comment on every thread "Well we should move them to Spokane" It gets old real quick dont you think we know that we are out numbered by the Liberal do gooders? you try living with them it's maddening to say the least and I know its frustration and anger that you guys want the wolf lovers to have to live with them and suffer your pain ... but then go post that on their forums cause here your just channeling your anger towards the wrong group.
[quoteIf getting in a twist over comments that some would want delisting sooner by forcing WDFW to "move" wolves around to speed up recover bothers you so much, maybe you shouldn't be reading the wolf thread. :dunno:]
Then just say that and no one will get in a twist :) That is a reasonable comment "Move them to Seattle" isn't ... its redundant and you know the guys in Olympia would never do it so it serves no purpose other than to look as if you want the whole state ruined cause your honey hole got ruined! How are we on the west side supposed to take the rest of your comments seriously?
KFhunter has a horse trailer and he said he would haul the wolves for free, you just can't beat free wolves M-Ray. WDFW said it would cost them a million to translocate wolves to the west side. Maybe we can work a deal. What do you think?
[/quote]
Whatever? There's another of your reasonable comments that further proves my point :rolleyes:
If you want de-listing then channel your efforts towards the Dept and get them delisted. We all know if they did their job and were held accountable they probably allready would be delisted without further damage ...
I know that is a hard statement for you to understand because its too reasonable and makes too much sense :rolleyes:
Post by: pianoman9701 on February 13, 2015, 02:36:05 PM
Once again you guys can't get through one wolf post without the mention of moving wolves to Seattle, the Wet Side blah blah blah :bash: and you wonder why a lot of your words go unnoticed or without much merit anymore? I have to say it on every wolf post .... I have yet to see a west side hunter say that they were in favor of wolves being re-introduced , translocated , or relocated anywhere in Wa East or west!!! But you guys won't be happy until every last hunter in this state suffers your same misery! Its an absurd comment and soon people are going to just quit reading these posts because of it ... I know I for one am already tired of it 😬
If you're tired of it, don't post. :dunno: Were you a hall monitor in high school?
No but apparently some here need one.
And Pianoman thats really mature making it a personal attack I dont even know why you and wolfbait are on me about my post when it was villageidiot that made the comment in the first place ... we seem a little defensive? ... but thanks for proving my point.
You're very entertaining. Please continue to post. It's the most fun some of us have had all day. I can't believe you didn't add "nah-nah-nah-nah-nah-nah". :chuckle:
Post by: wolfbait on February 13, 2015, 02:37:40 PM
Once again you guys can't get through one wolf post without the mention of moving wolves to Seattle, the Wet Side blah blah blah :bash: and you wonder why a lot of your words go unnoticed or without much merit anymore? I have to say it on every wolf post .... I have yet to see a west side hunter say that they were in favor of wolves being re-introduced , translocated , or relocated anywhere in Wa East or west!!! But you guys won't be happy until every last hunter in this state suffers your same misery! Its an absurd comment and soon people are going to just quit reading these posts because of it ... I know I for one am already tired of it 😬
M_Ray, you already have wolves on the west side, and just like the east side WDFW will not confirm until they are forced to, do to livestock predation or some other wolf problem. I highly doubt anyone could get WDFW to move wolves that included a paper trail. "Threatening" WDFW with a forced relocation might speed them up at confirming wolves that are already roaming the West side.
If getting in a twist over comments that some would want delisting sooner by forcing WDFW to "move" wolves around to speed up recover bothers you so much, maybe you shouldn't be reading the wolf thread. :dunno:
No but once again you guys miss the point and I dont need you to tell us what we already know ... My point is WE DONT WANT THEM ANYWHERE! is that so hard to understand?
The comment "move them to Seattle or Wetside" is a idiotic statement IMO and does nothing to solve the issue. I don't doubt they are on the Westside in fact Ive seen their tracks within and hour drive of my house over 20 years ago. But again most and mean most of us here on this side were strongly against them being ANYWHERE in the state and now strongly against them spreading throughout the whole state. To put it into perspective lets say they started with the re-intro on the west side I wouldnt comment on every thread "Well we should move them to Spokane" It gets old real quick dont you think we know that we are out numbered by the Liberal do gooders? you try living with them it's maddening to say the least and I know its frustration and anger that you guys want the wolf lovers to have to live with them and suffer your pain ... but then go post that on their forums cause here your just channeling your anger towards the wrong group.
[quoteIf getting in a twist over comments that some would want delisting sooner by forcing WDFW to "move" wolves around to speed up recover bothers you so much, maybe you shouldn't be reading the wolf thread. :dunno:]
Then just say that and no one will get in a twist :) That is a reasonable comment "Move them to Seattle" isn't ... its redundant and you know the guys in Olympia would never do it so it serves no purpose other than to look as if you want the whole state ruined cause your honey hole got ruined! How are we on the west side supposed to take the rest of your comments seriously?
KFhunter has a horse trailer and he said he would haul the wolves for free, you just can't beat free wolves M-Ray. WDFW said it would cost them a million to translocate wolves to the west side. Maybe we can work a deal. What do you think?
Whatever? There's another of your reasonable comments that further proves my point :rolleyes:
If you want de-listing then channel your efforts towards the Dept and get them delisted. We all know if they did their job and were held accountable they probably allready would be delisted without further damage ...
I know that is a hard statement for you to understand because its too reasonable and makes too much sense :rolleyes:
[/quote]
If WDFW don't want to make a deal, would you be interested in showing us the best place to put them? On the west side of course, we can't change the location, thats a given. I'm thinking we could be loaded and ready to roll in about a week or two.
Post by: wolfbait on February 13, 2015, 02:41:03 PM
Once again you guys can't get through one wolf post without the mention of moving wolves to Seattle, the Wet Side blah blah blah :bash: and you wonder why a lot of your words go unnoticed or without much merit anymore? I have to say it on every wolf post .... I have yet to see a west side hunter say that they were in favor of wolves being re-introduced , translocated , or relocated anywhere in Wa East or west!!! But you guys won't be happy until every last hunter in this state suffers your same misery! Its an absurd comment and soon people are going to just quit reading these posts because of it ... I know I for one am already tired of it 😬
If you're tired of it, don't post. :dunno: Were you a hall monitor in high school?
No but apparently some here need one.
And Pianoman thats really mature making it a personal attack I dont even know why you and wolfbait are on me about my post when it was villageidiot that made the comment in the first place ... we seem a little defensive? ... but thanks for proving my point.
You're very entertaining. Please continue to post. It's the most fun some of us have had all day. I can't believe you didn't add "nah-nah-nah-nah-nah-nah". :chuckle:
Dang it Pianoman, don't provoke him, he's starting to come around to our way of thinking. :yike: :chuckle:
Post by: M_ray on February 13, 2015, 03:10:47 PM
Post by: CAMPMEAT on February 13, 2015, 03:24:42 PM
Post by: Jonathan_S on February 13, 2015, 03:45:27 PM
Man up and use an angry emoticon. It's like an emotional girl who is too insecure to speak her mind so she uses LOL on her texts.
:chuckle:
Post by: M_ray on February 13, 2015, 06:37:27 PM
M-Ray, don't use :chuckle: when you really mean >:( :bash:
Man up and use an angry emoticon. It's like an emotional girl who is too insecure to speak her mind so she uses LOL on her texts.
:chuckle:
That totally makes sense :rolleyes: And you must feel so smart now
Post by: wolfbait on February 13, 2015, 07:00:24 PM
And you wonder why you get no support :chuckle:
Support? I share info about what has happened in other states with wolves, and what those same wolves are now doing to WA. My hope is that people share the info from this site with others. :tup:
Post by: mountainman on February 13, 2015, 07:26:04 PM
Post by: Jonathan_S on February 13, 2015, 07:45:45 PM
M-Ray, don't use :chuckle: when you really mean >:( :bash:
Man up and use an angry emoticon. It's like an emotional girl who is too insecure to speak her mind so she uses LOL on her texts.
:chuckle:
That totally makes sense :rolleyes: And you must feel so smart now
Lighten up Francis, you're getting this wrapped around the axle because the guy isn't making the argument the way you think he should.
Post by: M_ray on February 13, 2015, 10:35:04 PM
M-Ray, don't use :chuckle: when you really mean >:( :bash:
Man up and use an angry emoticon. It's like an emotional girl who is too insecure to speak her mind so she uses LOL on her texts.
:chuckle:
That totally makes sense :rolleyes: And you must feel so smart now
Lighten up Francis, you're getting this wrapped around the axle because the guy isn't making the argument the way you think he should.
Jonathan you clearly have no idea what you are saying ... this has nothing to do with a difference in an opinion ... I am not mad at the way Wolfbait thinks. If you actually read the thread instead of trying to stir the pot you would see that I made a response to villageidiot! None of this really has anything to do with you Wolfbait or Pianoman for that matter but for some reason you guys have decided to argue on behalf of villageidiot.
Post by: KFhunter on February 13, 2015, 10:45:02 PM
Only caveat would be that I as a taxpayer would not want to fund this thing beyond what it would take to just shoot it.
If a zoo wanted a bear that would otherwise be trapped and shot it's the same thing.
Post by: M_ray on February 13, 2015, 10:50:11 PM
And you wonder why you get no support :chuckle:
Support? I share info about what has happened in other states with wolves, and what those same wolves are now doing to WA. My hope is that people share the info from this site with others. :tup:
And I appreciate the info that you share and your passion against this fight, Not sure why you would think I don't. I just think the same idiotic statement "Move them to Seattle" over and over and over serves no purpose. I don't know why you would even argue that it does? Most of the time it hijacks your thread and starts a pissin match and gets everyone off the subject much the same as it has done with this thread. Is this the original reason for this post? I think not, but here we are once again and when others start the piling on you may not loose support but you sure loose the opportunity to gain anymore. Arguing and throwing out personal insults in my experience isn't the best way to gain friends. :twocents:
Post by: pianoman9701 on February 14, 2015, 06:42:28 AM
Post by: nwwanderer on February 14, 2015, 08:19:57 AM
Post by: CAMPMEAT on February 14, 2015, 08:34:51 AM
.................and my statement isn't aimed at anybody on here. It's aimed at the liberal voters in those counties who know nuttin'.. and vote kneejerk because of commercials, printings and lies.
Post by: M_ray on February 14, 2015, 11:37:48 AM
" Move them to Seattle ", is a saying we use because, King, Pierce, Snohomish, Thurston and the other west side counties control 100% of our state. So saying, " Move them to Seattle", is a perfectly sane saying. We're sick and tired of the WETSIDE controlling every aspect of our lives. That's why I moved away and am moving out-of-state soon.
.................and my statement isn't aimed at anybody on here. It's aimed at the liberal voters in those counties who know nuttin'.. and vote kneejerk because of commercials, printings and lies.
What you guys forget is that there are many hunters on this forum that live in these communities that are not the liberal voters you dislike and we didnt decide on the plan to put them in your backyard in the first place. IMO that comment gets old and would be better served on a wolf lovers forum not on this one ... It's really hard to get behind you guys on the East side when you aren't behind us.
We aren't advocating for wolves in your neck of the woods or anywhere but with this comment you keep advocating them in ours ... when you start thinking about it, it sounds really hypocritical now don't it? AND you loose credibility no matter how correct your argument or post might be? now think it from someone elses shoes for a change ;)
Post by: wolfbait on February 14, 2015, 11:58:09 AM
Once again you guys can't get through one wolf post without the mention of moving wolves to Seattle, the Wet Side blah blah blah :bash: and you wonder why a lot of your words go unnoticed or without much merit anymore? I have to say it on every wolf post .... I have yet to see a west side hunter say that they were in favor of wolves being re-introduced , translocated , or relocated anywhere in Wa East or west!!! But you guys won't be happy until every last hunter in this state suffers your same misery! Its an absurd comment and soon people are going to just quit reading these posts because of it ... I know I for one am already tired of it 😬
If you don't want people to reply to your posts M_ray, then perhaps you should state that in your post? Let us know that "you guys" means Villageidiot. It does kind of limit free speech, but I'm sure everyone will understand. ;)
And you wonder why you get no support :chuckle:
Support? I share info about what has happened in other states with wolves, and what those same wolves are now doing to WA. My hope is that people share the info from this site with others. :tup:
And I appreciate the info that you share and your passion against this fight, Not sure why you would think I don't. I just think the same idiotic statement "Move them to Seattle" over and over and over serves no purpose. I don't know why you would even argue that it does? Most of the time it hijacks your thread and starts a pissin match and gets everyone off the subject much the same as it has done with this thread. Is this the original reason for this post? I think not, but here we are once again and when others start the piling on you may not loose support but you sure loose the opportunity to gain anymore. Arguing and throwing out personal insults in my experience isn't the best way to gain friends. :twocents:
Not sure what you are talking about?
[/quote]
I know that is a hard statement for you to understand because its too reasonable and makes too much sense :rolleyes:
[/quote]
:yike: :chuckle:
I try not to drop down into the ditch with the pro-wolf people anymore, it always gets me banned. :chuckle: and they :party1:
Post by: wolfbait on February 14, 2015, 12:03:16 PM
M-Ray, don't use :chuckle: when you really mean >:( :bash:
Man up and use an angry emoticon. It's like an emotional girl who is too insecure to speak her mind so she uses LOL on her texts.
:chuckle:
That totally makes sense :rolleyes: And you must feel so smart now
Lighten up Francis, you're getting this wrapped around the axle because the guy isn't making the argument the way you think he should.
Jonathan you clearly have no idea what you are saying ... this has nothing to do with a difference in an opinion ... I am not mad at the way Wolfbait thinks. If you actually read the thread instead of trying to stir the pot you would see that I made a response to villageidiot! None of this really has anything to do with you Wolfbait or Pianoman for that matter but for some reason you guys have decided to argue on behalf of villageidiot.
" Move them to Seattle ", is a saying we use because, King, Pierce, Snohomish, Thurston and the other west side counties control 100% of our state. So saying, " Move them to Seattle", is a perfectly sane saying. We're sick and tired of the WETSIDE controlling every aspect of our lives. That's why I moved away and am moving out-of-state soon.
.................and my statement isn't aimed at anybody on here. It's aimed at the liberal voters in those counties who know nuttin'.. and vote kneejerk because of commercials, printings and lies.
What you guys forget is that there are many hunters on this forum that live in these communities that are not the liberal voters you dislike and we didnt decide on the plan to put them in your backyard in the first place. IMO that comment gets old and would be better served on a wolf lovers forum not on this one ... It's really hard to get behind you guys on the East side when you aren't behind us.
We aren't advocating for wolves in your neck of the woods or anywhere but with this comment you keep advocating them in ours ... when you start thinking about it, it sounds really hypocritical now don't it? AND you loose credibility no matter how correct your argument or post might be? now think it from someone elses shoes for a change ;)
Post by: wolfbait on February 14, 2015, 12:07:58 PM
Ive seen wolves in the skagit and NWbowhunter has posted pics of a whole pack off the nooksack ON HERE that the WDFW did nothing about. It will be MUCH harder to document them here on the wet side than in E wa.
The comments about dropping them off in SeaTown isnt directed at hunters, but all the ignorant bunny huggers that think they are soft and cuddly. Since I grew up in the greater seattle area i can tell you first hand how many of these ignorant people will blos this issue off until it affects THEM! I rember when all the Yuppies started building houses on a mountain outside of Issaquah. There was a huge outrage when someones fluffy was dragged off by a courgar.... Any one want to guess which mountain this ignoramus built thier subdivision?
Post by: 4fletch on February 14, 2015, 12:50:34 PM
Based on that picture i certainly wouldn't confirm them as wolves. They look as much like huskys as wolves to me.then they must be dogs chasing deer that need to be taken out
Post by: M_ray on February 14, 2015, 12:54:10 PM
And guys can say it's not directed at the hunters of the west side all they want but making the comment in the first place is a$$inine and hypocritical for the reasons I previously stated. Like I said doesn't help when trying to gain our support to back your efforts on that side of the state when the next word is going to be place them in our backyard??? I'm sure we can find liberal bunny huggers in Spokane too but we don't say "Plant them in Spokane" Its a double standard to say the least and really not that hard to understand. There are 100 other guys thinking the same thing in fact my PM box is overflowing at the moment with PM's from people saying that they wont post on any of these wolf threads anymore cause it turns into an argument ... If you want more backing you should be finding common ground rather than discrediting your point by arguing a silly comment that serves no purpose. :twocents:
Post by: wolfbait on February 14, 2015, 01:18:58 PM
Wolfbait, copy and paste all of that does nothing but prove my point and does nothing but make you look like your more interested in an argument and stirring of the pot??? Hard to hear your original message when you spend more time arguing on a post than you do backing up your original point!
And guys can say it's not directed at the hunters of the west side all they want but making the comment in the first place is a$$inine and hypocritical for the reasons I previously stated. Like I said doesn't help when trying to gain our support to back your efforts on that side of the state when the next word is going to be place them in our backyard??? I'm sure we can find liberal bunny huggers in Spokane too but we don't say "Plant them in Spokane" Its a double standard to say the least and really not that hard to understand. There are 100 other guys thinking the same thing in fact my PM box is overflowing at the moment with PM's from people saying that they wont post on any of these wolf threads anymore cause it turns into an argument ... If you want more backing you should be finding common ground rather than discrediting your point by arguing a silly comment that serves no purpose. :twocents:
Since you are so dead set against moving wolves to the west side maybe you would be interested in pushing WDFW into confirming some of the packs that are already there?
I think what most people (hunters, farmers, ranchers, rural folks etc.) want is wolf management/control, so far we haven't seen any. All we have seen is WDFW dragging wolf delisting out by refusing to confirm wolf packs/BP's. They have lied about wolf predation on livestock, and if they are lying about predation on livestock they sure aren't going to acknowledge the impact on the game herds, which we are seeing.
Maybe if WDFW moves a few BP's to the west side and then monitored them until they reached the quota, we could delist and any wolves that multiplied beyond the management level could then be euthanized or spayed and given to wolf haven. Of course you would still have the wolves that WDFW refuse to confirm in the beginning.
I'm trying to work with you here M_ray. Calm Down.
"Like I said doesn't help when trying to gain our support to back your efforts on that side of the state when the next word is going to be place them in our backyard?"
I always thought we were all on the same side, I didn't realize we had a west side team and an east side team. Would seem to me, we would get more traction if your side joined our side and we had just one team? How big is your team?
Too bad we can't all be on the same team since the wolves will affect everyone.
Post by: wolfbait on February 14, 2015, 01:46:46 PM
Based on that picture i certainly wouldn't confirm them as wolves. They look as much like huskys as wolves to me.then they must be dogs chasing deer that need to be taken out
What would that many husky's be doing out in the middle of nowhere, usually people notice right away when their dog team runs away :dunno:
Post by: Special T on February 14, 2015, 06:02:11 PM
Post by: Buckhunter82 on February 15, 2015, 02:09:49 AM
We understand theres a lot of hunters and a great people in general on the west side. The problem is that you live in a sewer and its over flowing across the entire state. We're knee deep in it. When we kick it back to where it came from, its nothing personal. Consider it friendly fire.
Post by: Buckhunter82 on February 15, 2015, 02:37:36 AM
Post by: villageidiot on February 15, 2015, 05:59:51 AM
M_ray
We understand theres a lot of hunters and a great people in general on the west side. The problem is that you live in a sewer and its over flowing across the entire state. We're knee deep in it. When we kick it back to where it came from, its nothing personal. Consider it friendly fire.
:yeah:
Post by: M_ray on February 15, 2015, 02:01:49 PM
M_ray
We understand theres a lot of hunters and a great people in general on the west side. The problem is that you live in a sewer and its over flowing across the entire state. We're knee deep in it. When we kick it back to where it came from, its nothing personal. Consider it friendly fire.
:yeah:
Wow thanks for pointing out the obvious .... Totally justify's hypocricy :rolleyes:
Post by: mountainman on February 15, 2015, 04:09:46 PM
M_ray:yeah:
We understand theres a lot of hunters and a great people in general on the west side. The problem is that you live in a sewer and its over flowing across the entire state. We're knee deep in it. When we kick it back to where it came from, its nothing personal. Consider it friendly fire.
Post by: M_ray on February 15, 2015, 04:33:13 PM
Wolfbait, copy and paste all of that does nothing but prove my point and does nothing but make you look like your more interested in an argument and stirring of the pot??? Hard to hear your original message when you spend more time arguing on a post than you do backing up your original point!
And guys can say it's not directed at the hunters of the west side all they want but making the comment in the first place is a$$inine and hypocritical for the reasons I previously stated. Like I said doesn't help when trying to gain our support to back your efforts on that side of the state when the next word is going to be place them in our backyard??? I'm sure we can find liberal bunny huggers in Spokane too but we don't say "Plant them in Spokane" Its a double standard to say the least and really not that hard to understand. There are 100 other guys thinking the same thing in fact my PM box is overflowing at the moment with PM's from people saying that they wont post on any of these wolf threads anymore cause it turns into an argument ... If you want more backing you should be finding common ground rather than discrediting your point by arguing a silly comment that serves no purpose. :twocents:
Since you are so dead set against moving wolves to the west side maybe you would be interested in pushing WDFW into confirming some of the packs that are already there?
I think what most people (hunters, farmers, ranchers, rural folks etc.) want is wolf management/control, so far we haven't seen any. All we have seen is WDFW dragging wolf delisting out by refusing to confirm wolf packs/BP's. They have lied about wolf predation on livestock, and if they are lying about predation on livestock they sure aren't going to acknowledge the impact on the game herds, which we are seeing.
Maybe if WDFW moves a few BP's to the west side and then monitored them until they reached the quota, we could delist and any wolves that multiplied beyond the management level could then be euthanized or spayed and given to wolf haven. Of course you would still have the wolves that WDFW refuse to confirm in the beginning.
I'm trying to work with you here M_ray. Calm Down.
"Like I said doesn't help when trying to gain our support to back your efforts on that side of the state when the next word is going to be place them in our backyard?"
I always thought we were all on the same side, I didn't realize we had a west side team and an east side team. Would seem to me, we would get more traction if your side joined our side and we had just one team? How big is your team?
Too bad we can't all be on the same team since the wolves will affect everyone.
If you want us to be on the same team don't create the divide in the first place by saying place them in Seattle! Now all of you are trying to justify why you have made the or supported the absurd comment in the first place.
Look like I said we can easily go walk down the streets of Spokane and find liberal do gooders that love wolves too but we don't say " move them to Spokane" IMO we don't want them any where and we want to try and stop the bleeding where it's at. Saying we want them anywhere out of spite is counter productive and a slap in the face to all these great people and hunters of the west side so why go there in the first place?
Post by: wolfbait on February 15, 2015, 04:51:10 PM
Wolfbait, copy and paste all of that does nothing but prove my point and does nothing but make you look like your more interested in an argument and stirring of the pot??? Hard to hear your original message when you spend more time arguing on a post than you do backing up your original point!
And guys can say it's not directed at the hunters of the west side all they want but making the comment in the first place is a$$inine and hypocritical for the reasons I previously stated. Like I said doesn't help when trying to gain our support to back your efforts on that side of the state when the next word is going to be place them in our backyard??? I'm sure we can find liberal bunny huggers in Spokane too but we don't say "Plant them in Spokane" Its a double standard to say the least and really not that hard to understand. There are 100 other guys thinking the same thing in fact my PM box is overflowing at the moment with PM's from people saying that they wont post on any of these wolf threads anymore cause it turns into an argument ... If you want more backing you should be finding common ground rather than discrediting your point by arguing a silly comment that serves no purpose. :twocents:
Since you are so dead set against moving wolves to the west side maybe you would be interested in pushing WDFW into confirming some of the packs that are already there?
I think what most people (hunters, farmers, ranchers, rural folks etc.) want is wolf management/control, so far we haven't seen any. All we have seen is WDFW dragging wolf delisting out by refusing to confirm wolf packs/BP's. They have lied about wolf predation on livestock, and if they are lying about predation on livestock they sure aren't going to acknowledge the impact on the game herds, which we are seeing.
Maybe if WDFW moves a few BP's to the west side and then monitored them until they reached the quota, we could delist and any wolves that multiplied beyond the management level could then be euthanized or spayed and given to wolf haven. Of course you would still have the wolves that WDFW refuse to confirm in the beginning.
I'm trying to work with you here M_ray. Calm Down.
"Like I said doesn't help when trying to gain our support to back your efforts on that side of the state when the next word is going to be place them in our backyard?"
I always thought we were all on the same side, I didn't realize we had a west side team and an east side team. Would seem to me, we would get more traction if your side joined our side and we had just one team? How big is your team?
Too bad we can't all be on the same team since the wolves will affect everyone.
If you want us to be on the same team don't create the divide in the first place by saying place them in Seattle! Now all of you are trying to justify why you have made the or supported the absurd comment in the first place.
Look like I said we can easily go walk down the streets of Spokane and find liberal do gooders that love wolves too but we don't say " move them to Spokane" IMO we don't want them any where and we want to try and stop the bleeding where it's at. Saying we want them anywhere out of spite is counter productive and a slap in the face to all these great people and hunters of the west side so why go there in the first place?
Sure thing M_ray, whatever you say.
Post by: M_ray on February 15, 2015, 05:09:09 PM
Post by: wolfbait on February 15, 2015, 05:20:41 PM
Once again you guys can't get through one wolf post without the mention of moving wolves to Seattle, the Wet Side blah blah blah :bash: and you wonder why a lot of your words go unnoticed or without much merit anymore? I have to say it on every wolf post .... I have yet to see a west side hunter say that they were in favor of wolves being re-introduced , translocated , or relocated anywhere in Wa East or west!!! But you guys won't be happy until every last hunter in this state suffers your same misery! Its an absurd comment and soon people are going to just quit reading these posts because of it ... I know I for one am already tired of it 😬
I'm over here on the west side. I say bring them on over, it's happening slowly but surely right now so why not speed it up? Help out with the hoof rot, maybe thin out a few lions, and add to the number of confirmed breeding pairs. Who knows maybe the wolves would get managed correctly after all.
Three BPs would be about right, then we could delist in perhaps two years instead of whenever the environmentalist need some suing $$$.
Post by: wolfbait on February 15, 2015, 05:32:40 PM
Yeah I really didn't think you would have anything intelligent to say after that! Lol
Well you are the smart one here, you proved it over and over agin.
Post by: jasnt on February 15, 2015, 06:05:53 PM
Post by: wolfbait on February 15, 2015, 07:03:10 PM
Post by: Curly on February 15, 2015, 07:09:51 PM
Post by: wolfbait on February 15, 2015, 07:30:43 PM
Why the west side? Wolves aren't needed on the west side for delisting to happen according to the wolf plan.
Wolves must be geographically spread so there are breeding pairs in Eastern Washington, north-central Washington and a big region that includes the southern Cascades and Western Washington.
Fish and Wildlife estimates that at the end of 2013, there were at least 52 wolves in 13 packs roaming Eastern Washington.
Post by: Curly on February 15, 2015, 07:48:13 PM
Why the west side? Wolves aren't needed on the west side for delisting to happen according to the wolf plan.
Wolves must be geographically spread so there are breeding pairs in Eastern Washington, north-central Washington and a big region that includes the southern Cascades and Western Washington.
Fish and Wildlife estimates that at the end of 2013, there were at least 52 wolves in 13 packs roaming Eastern Washington.
Yep. And there doesn't need to be any wolves in King, Snohomish or any other counties up in NW Washington since the wolves in Teanaway count toward that zone up there.
We just need wolves to be confirmed south of I90 to count toward the zone they call southern cascades and western Washington. So if the teanaway pack would spread out to the south to little Naches or Taneum or other eastern Washington gmu's, that would count toward that southern cascades and western Washington wolf zone.
I think they should have named the zone different cuz I think there could be confusion. There doesn't need to be any wolves on the west side of the state for delisting. .......people talk about western Washington needing wolves and I'm not sure they are talking the west side of the state or the wolf zone with western Washington in the name. Just trying to clarify.
Post by: jasnt on February 15, 2015, 08:13:20 PM
Yes I agree
Post by: Special T on February 16, 2015, 10:04:24 AM
There is a lot more than just the wolf issue where this applies
Post by: wolfbait on February 16, 2015, 03:41:53 PM
Why the west side? Wolves aren't needed on the west side for delisting to happen according to the wolf plan.
Wolves must be geographically spread so there are breeding pairs in Eastern Washington, north-central Washington and a big region that includes the southern Cascades and Western Washington.
Fish and Wildlife estimates that at the end of 2013, there were at least 52 wolves in 13 packs roaming Eastern Washington.
Yep. And there doesn't need to be any wolves in King, Snohomish or any other counties up in NW Washington since the wolves in Teanaway count toward that zone up there.
We just need wolves to be confirmed south of I90 to count toward the zone they call southern cascades and western Washington. So if the teanaway pack would spread out to the south to little Naches or Taneum or other eastern Washington gmu's, that would count toward that southern cascades and western Washington wolf zone.
I think they should have named the zone different cuz I think there could be confusion. There doesn't need to be any wolves on the west side of the state for delisting. .......people talk about western Washington needing wolves and I'm not sure they are talking the west side of the state or the wolf zone with western Washington in the name. Just trying to clarify.
I think they should have named the zone different cuz I think there could be confusion. There doesn't need to be any wolves on the west side of the state for delisting. .......people talk about western Washington needing wolves and I'm not sure they are talking the west side of the state or the wolf zone with western Washington in the name. Just trying to clarify.
Yes I agree
Good point, I wonder if it was named that way because it sounded better.
People tend not to pay attention to a problem unless it affects them in some direct way. When people say "Release wolves in Seattle" what they are trying to say is... "Those who OKed this Bad Plan should have to deal with it."
There is a lot more than just the wolf issue where this applies
:yeah:
By now many people have come to realize wolves in WA is not a good thing and getting worse year by year. This isn't just an Eastern WA problem, it will affect everyone eventually in a negative way, except the money grubbing environmentalists and WDFW.
The wolves fit right in with WDFW's long term management plan, which will be funded mostly by the government.
If WDFW drags wolf delisting out for another six or seven years that will give WA 19-20 years of wolf growth.
Post by: mfswallace on March 04, 2015, 09:51:03 AM
With the state saying there were six packs in 92' wouldn't that be 30yrs ??
Post by: pianoman9701 on March 04, 2015, 10:10:11 AM
Post by: WAPatriot on March 04, 2015, 10:24:48 AM
Post by: wolfbait on March 04, 2015, 02:33:23 PM
If WDFW drags wolf delisting out for another six or seven years that will give WA 19-20 years of wolf growth.
With the state saying there were six packs in 92' wouldn't that be 30yrs ??
Thanks for pointing that out. :tup: I was going with WDFW's hide and seek wolves, starting with their first "official" wolves in 2002.
Post by: mfswallace on March 04, 2015, 07:33:28 PM
All wolves in captivity should have GPS tracking Collars that all citizens should have acess to. If a wolf is relased or escaped we need to be able to locate the wolf. I am just waiting for the day when some hippy releases these wolves. Wolves are like ebola
Legislate that NOW!!!!