Post by: idahohuntr on May 22, 2015, 10:25:20 PM
http://www.spokesman.com/stories/2015/may/22/dog-mistaken-wolf-shot-and-killed-man-north-idaho/
A North Idaho man said his dog was shot on a Forest Service road last weekend by a teen who mistook the husky-malamute cross for a wolf.
The dog later died. The same bullet struck Jim Rosauer’s second dog, which survived.
“We saw both of our dogs drop to the ground. It was just shocking,” said Rosauer, who lives near Eastport, Idaho.
Rosauer said he and his wife, Lisa, were hiking Sunday afternoon on the snow-covered road to Spruce Lake, which is near the Montana border. The dogs had run ahead of them.
“We saw the people about 180 yards away with a gun,” said Rosauer, who described them as a couple with their 19-year-old son. “The man said to me, ‘Sorry. It’s my fault. I told him (the son) to shoot the wolf.’”
Boundary County Sheriff Greg Sprungl confirmed that the shooting is under investigation, but said no charges have been filed. The sheriff’s department is working with the Idaho Department of Fish and Game on the investigation.
Dogs are sometimes mistaken for wolves, said Chip Corsi, Fish and Game’s regional supervisor in Coeur d’Alene. Several years ago, a wolf hunter brought an animal to a check station that was actually a dog.
Corsi said he couldn’t comment on the recent incident, since it’s still under investigation. However, “people need to know what they’re shooting at, and they need to be hunting legally,” he said.
Idaho’s wolf season on federal lands closed March 31. Hunters face fines of up to $1,000 if convicted of attempting to take a game animal during a closed season.
Rosauer, a 50-year-old log furniture maker, said he feels compelled to speak out about the incident. He’s an elk hunter who supports public hunting of wolves, but said the “reckless disregard” for safety and flouting of hunting laws appalled him.
Kenai, the dog that was killed, weighed 65 pounds and had some wolf-like features. But unlike a wolf, she had an ear that flopped down and a curly tail, Rosauer said. She was with the couple’s other dog, a lab-malamute mix.
“He doesn’t look anything like a wolf,” Rosauer said, “but that’s not even the point. There is no gray area here. The season was closed.”
Shooting into a roadway also endangered him and his wife, Rosauer said. They were a short distance behind the dogs.
Rosauer said the couple and their son stopped to apologize and helped him load the dogs into his vehicle. Kenai died in a Sandpoint veternarian’s office; her shoulder was shattered. The bullet struck the other dog in the leg, but it’s recovering.
Anti-wolf feeling runs high in Boundary County, where vehicles sport bumperstickers that say “Canadian wolves, smoke a pack a day.” Rosauer said that type of sentiment encourages people to act lawlessly.
“We’re teaching people to have zero respect for the animals. I don’t remember growing up like that,” he said. “Where are our hunting ethics? You don’t have to like wolves, but I think they should be treated with respect as a game animal and a creature of this planet.”
Rosauer said he still feels raw over Kenai’s loss.
“This is a sad story, but I want it to be an educational one for people,” he said. “I’d like to see the culture change.”
Post by: mfswallace on May 22, 2015, 10:40:20 PM
Post by: viva_che1363 on May 22, 2015, 10:42:50 PM
Post by: AspenBud on May 26, 2015, 04:56:08 PM
Hello lawsuit. :IBCOOL:
Post by: AspenBud on May 26, 2015, 04:59:36 PM
Didn't something real similar to this happen some time last year? I wanna say it was in ID too, lady letting her dogs run ahead of her and someone mistaken it for a wolf.
Here's one in Montana...
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/12/10/pet-malamute-killed-by-wolf-hunter/3950523/ (http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/12/10/pet-malamute-killed-by-wolf-hunter/3950523/)
Nothing like giving hunters a bad name.
Post by: AspenBud on May 26, 2015, 05:05:05 PM
Too d@$% many trigger happy folks shooting at guesses, kind of like the kid who shot the woman thinking she was a bear some years back.
Post by: andrew_in_idaho on May 26, 2015, 05:38:25 PM
I agree, this article is pathetic. :')
The only thing pathetic about this is that a kid was told by his father to shoot without properly identifying their target and even worse out of season. I understand people don't like wolves but the guy who's dog was just shot is right too many people with blind hatred for the wolves and blatant disregard of the law. None of us has to like the wolves but at least idaho is doing the best they can to manage them, too many more stories like this just add fuel to the anti hunters fire
Post by: KFhunter on May 26, 2015, 05:47:08 PM
Post by: MLBowhunting on May 26, 2015, 05:50:50 PM
Post by: trophyhunt on May 26, 2015, 06:01:17 PM
Post by: WA hunter14 on May 26, 2015, 06:03:58 PM
Post by: Bofire on May 26, 2015, 06:07:02 PM
Carl
Post by: ribka on May 26, 2015, 06:17:25 PM
Post by: AspenBud on May 26, 2015, 06:19:41 PM
If a person can't tell the difference between a hunting dog and a wolf, let alone a malamute and a wolf, they have no business hunting.
Post by: andrew_in_idaho on May 26, 2015, 06:22:44 PM
i worry about it too and my dogs dont look like wolves at all, i think both are at fault. sad situation but they both made errors.
How did the dog owner make an error or could you possibly place blame on him at all, I don't care if it was a pet wolf, wolf season was closed and the poachers failed to correctly identify their target. Placing blame on the dog owner is just ridiculous
Post by: WA hunter14 on May 26, 2015, 06:34:04 PM
Post by: andrew_in_idaho on May 26, 2015, 06:40:45 PM
Post by: KFhunter on May 26, 2015, 06:41:10 PM
Far more likely to loose your dog to a wolf than a person mistaking it for a wolf.
Post by: KFhunter on May 26, 2015, 06:47:07 PM
Not everyone in the woods is hunting, or for that matter training, with a turtle. A vest on a fast moving pointing dog busting through brush is something of a bad joke. Trying to stop it on command when it's 500-1000 yards in front of you is even more problematic. They don't run close, that's not how they are wired or work most effectively.
If a person can't tell the difference between a hunting dog and a wolf, let alone a malamute and a wolf, they have no business hunting.
True, but most fast moving bird dogs busting brush look nothing like a wolf...and they're in the brush making them hard to shoot :tung:
All the dogs shot (mistaking for a wolf) that I've seen are slow moving malamute/Husky/Shepard type dogs. A vest wouldn't hurt a thing on those dogs, and could benefit it greatly since those types of dogs will likely try to protect the owner from a wolf even if the wolf is really just after the dog. A bright hog dog type vest might save a malamutes life from both wolves and people.
Don't give people an opportunity to mess up, if you have a dog resembling a wolf and run it off leash put a bright vest on it.
Don't pick mushrooms during bear season in a black trench coat.
Post by: WA hunter14 on May 26, 2015, 07:09:45 PM
No there are plenty of would be poachers down here as well but blaming the dog owner for the actions of a poacher is about the dumbest thing I've read all week.
i didnt blame the dog owner for the guy shooting what he thought was a wolf i blame the dog owner for taking a wolf looking dog into wolf country and letting it run ahead of them off leash.
Post by: mfswallace on May 26, 2015, 07:23:32 PM
I agree, this article is pathetic. :')
The only thing pathetic about this is that a kid was told by his father to shoot without properly identifying their target and even worse out of season. I understand people don't like wolves but the guy who's dog was just shot is right too many people with blind hatred for the wolves and blatant disregard of the law. None of us has to like the wolves but at least idaho is doing the best they can to manage them, too many more stories like this just add fuel to the anti hunters fire
My point was this is completely one sided. I think what the dad and son were doing in the woods and what they thought when they saw a very wolf like animal in wolf country matter and should have been written into article, responsible journalism that's all...
Post by: idahohuntr on May 26, 2015, 08:17:45 PM
No there are plenty of would be poachers down here as well but blaming the dog owner for the actions of a poacher is about the dumbest thing I've read all week.:yeah:
And if you don't know what you are shooting at you do not pull the trigger. EVER.
Post by: Jarhead Chase on May 26, 2015, 08:22:55 PM
With that being said, if there is a leash law in effect, follow it. I stopped taking my dog (mastiff/pyrenees mix) hiking with me on public trails after having other dogs want to try their luck with him. I swear, every time we went there was at least one or two people letting their dogs run free.
Post by: wolfbait on May 27, 2015, 06:06:56 AM
Pathetic.
http://www.spokesman.com/stories/2015/may/22/dog-mistaken-wolf-shot-and-killed-man-north-idaho/
A North Idaho man said his dog was shot on a Forest Service road last weekend by a teen who mistook the husky-malamute cross for a wolf.
The dog later died. The same bullet struck Jim Rosauer’s second dog, which survived.
“We saw both of our dogs drop to the ground. It was just shocking,” said Rosauer, who lives near Eastport, Idaho.
Rosauer said he and his wife, Lisa, were hiking Sunday afternoon on the snow-covered road to Spruce Lake, which is near the Montana border. The dogs had run ahead of them.
“We saw the people about 180 yards away with a gun,” said Rosauer, who described them as a couple with their 19-year-old son. “The man said to me, ‘Sorry. It’s my fault. I told him (the son) to shoot the wolf.’”
Boundary County Sheriff Greg Sprungl confirmed that the shooting is under investigation, but said no charges have been filed. The sheriff’s department is working with the Idaho Department of Fish and Game on the investigation.
Dogs are sometimes mistaken for wolves, said Chip Corsi, Fish and Game’s regional supervisor in Coeur d’Alene. Several years ago, a wolf hunter brought an animal to a check station that was actually a dog.
Corsi said he couldn’t comment on the recent incident, since it’s still under investigation. However, “people need to know what they’re shooting at, and they need to be hunting legally,” he said.
Idaho’s wolf season on federal lands closed March 31. Hunters face fines of up to $1,000 if convicted of attempting to take a game animal during a closed season.
Rosauer, a 50-year-old log furniture maker, said he feels compelled to speak out about the incident. He’s an elk hunter who supports public hunting of wolves, but said the “reckless disregard” for safety and flouting of hunting laws appalled him.
Kenai, the dog that was killed, weighed 65 pounds and had some wolf-like features. But unlike a wolf, she had an ear that flopped down and a curly tail, Rosauer said. She was with the couple’s other dog, a lab-malamute mix.
“He doesn’t look anything like a wolf,” Rosauer said, “but that’s not even the point. There is no gray area here. The season was closed.”
Shooting into a roadway also endangered him and his wife, Rosauer said. They were a short distance behind the dogs.
Rosauer said the couple and their son stopped to apologize and helped him load the dogs into his vehicle. Kenai died in a Sandpoint veternarian’s office; her shoulder was shattered. The bullet struck the other dog in the leg, but it’s recovering.
Anti-wolf feeling runs high in Boundary County, where vehicles sport bumperstickers that say “Canadian wolves, smoke a pack a day.” Rosauer said that type of sentiment encourages people to act lawlessly.
“We’re teaching people to have zero respect for the animals. I don’t remember growing up like that,” he said. “Where are our hunting ethics? You don’t have to like wolves, but I think they should be treated with respect as a game animal and a creature of this planet.”
Rosauer said he still feels raw over Kenai’s loss.
“This is a sad story, but I want it to be an educational one for people,” he said. “I’d like to see the culture change.”
“We’re teaching people to have zero respect for the animals."
I think the USFWS and state game agencies are first in line, they introduce a non-native wolf into the lower 48 and then protect it above all else. The message they have sent out, is it's natures way to have the wolves slaughter the ungulates and livestock. Hitler comes to mind.
Where I live many people don't take their dogs with them on walks anymore, and if they do they go armed with their dog on a leash, not from fear of their dog getting shot yet, dogs are like a wolf magnet.
Not everyone in the woods is hunting, or for that matter training, with a turtle. A vest on a fast moving pointing dog busting through brush is something of a bad joke. Trying to stop it on command when it's 500-1000 yards in front of you is even more problematic. They don't run close, that's not how they are wired or work most effectively.
If a person can't tell the difference between a hunting dog and a wolf, let alone a malamute and a wolf, they have no business hunting.
True, but most fast moving bird dogs busting brush look nothing like a wolf...and they're in the brush making them hard to shoot :tung:
All the dogs shot (mistaking for a wolf) that I've seen are slow moving malamute/Husky/Shepard type dogs. A vest wouldn't hurt a thing on those dogs, and could benefit it greatly since those types of dogs will likely try to protect the owner from a wolf even if the wolf is really just after the dog. A bright hog dog type vest might save a malamutes life from both wolves and people.
Don't give people an opportunity to mess up, if you have a dog resembling a wolf and run it off leash put a bright vest on it.
Don't pick mushrooms during bear season in a black trench coat.
:yeah:
Post by: elkinrutdrivemenuts on May 27, 2015, 06:32:20 AM
No there are plenty of would be poachers down here as well but blaming the dog owner for the actions of a poacher is about the dumbest thing I've read all week.
i didnt blame the dog owner for the guy shooting what he thought was a wolf i blame the dog owner for taking a wolf looking dog into wolf country and letting it run ahead of them off leash.
Where else can you let your dog run off a leash than the woods? That's the only place I feel safe letting my dogs be dogs run around off a leash.
Post by: WA hunter14 on May 27, 2015, 06:51:54 AM
Post by: pianoman9701 on May 27, 2015, 07:03:21 AM
I agree, this article is pathetic. :')
The only thing pathetic about this is that a kid was told by his father to shoot without properly identifying their target and even worse out of season. I understand people don't like wolves but the guy who's dog was just shot is right too many people with blind hatred for the wolves and blatant disregard of the law. None of us has to like the wolves but at least idaho is doing the best they can to manage them, too many more stories like this just add fuel to the anti hunters fire
My point was this is completely one sided. I think what the dad and son were doing in the woods and what they thought when they saw a very wolf like animal in wolf country matter and should have been written into article, responsible journalism that's all...
They were knowingly poaching on the father's advice. Although, in retrospect, I'd agree that the dog owner may have saved his dog's life by putting an orange vest on him, he certainly had a reasonable expectation of being able to safely take his dogs out for a walk because the wolf season was closed. The article was factual. The "hunters" did none of the rest of us hunters a service. Part of our credibility as hunters died with that dog.
Post by: Curly on May 27, 2015, 07:04:11 AM
I do hope he gets some serious punishment though. Stories like this are going to make it impossible to get a wolf hunting season in this state. It's all going to be ammunition for the pro-wolfers to use to keep the wolves protected.
Post by: mburrows on May 27, 2015, 07:16:53 AM
do they look like wolves?!No, that dog has floppy ears and curly tail. If looking through a scope or binos anybody could tell it was not a wolf. Its really irrelevant to the issue. The kid had intentions of poaching, thats the issue. Not the family taking their pets for a walk.
Post by: elkinrutdrivemenuts on May 27, 2015, 07:27:36 AM
The shooter is probably lucky his target ended up being a dog instead of a wolf since the season was closed for wolves. I imagine the charges he will face will be much lighter for shooting a dog instead of if he poached a wolf.
I do hope he gets some serious punishment though. Stories like this are going to make it impossible to get a wolf hunting season in this state. It's all going to be ammunition for the pro-wolfers to use to keep the wolves protected.
We wouldn't be hearing about it if he shot a wolf lol.
Post by: elkinrutdrivemenuts on May 27, 2015, 07:40:51 AM
Pathetic.
http://www.spokesman.com/stories/2015/may/22/dog-mistaken-wolf-shot-and-killed-man-north-idaho/
A North Idaho man said his dog was shot on a Forest Service road last weekend by a teen who mistook the husky-malamute cross for a wolf.
The dog later died. The same bullet struck Jim Rosauer’s second dog, which survived.
“We saw both of our dogs drop to the ground. It was just shocking,” said Rosauer, who lives near Eastport, Idaho.
Rosauer said he and his wife, Lisa, were hiking Sunday afternoon on the snow-covered road to Spruce Lake, which is near the Montana border. The dogs had run ahead of them.
“We saw the people about 180 yards away with a gun,” said Rosauer, who described them as a couple with their 19-year-old son. “The man said to me, ‘Sorry. It’s my fault. I told him (the son) to shoot the wolf.’”
Boundary County Sheriff Greg Sprungl confirmed that the shooting is under investigation, but said no charges have been filed. The sheriff’s department is working with the Idaho Department of Fish and Game on the investigation.
Dogs are sometimes mistaken for wolves, said Chip Corsi, Fish and Game’s regional supervisor in Coeur d’Alene. Several years ago, a wolf hunter brought an animal to a check station that was actually a dog.
Corsi said he couldn’t comment on the recent incident, since it’s still under investigation. However, “people need to know what they’re shooting at, and they need to be hunting legally,” he said.
Idaho’s wolf season on federal lands closed March 31. Hunters face fines of up to $1,000 if convicted of attempting to take a game animal during a closed season.
Rosauer, a 50-year-old log furniture maker, said he feels compelled to speak out about the incident. He’s an elk hunter who supports public hunting of wolves, but said the “reckless disregard” for safety and flouting of hunting laws appalled him.
Kenai, the dog that was killed, weighed 65 pounds and had some wolf-like features. But unlike a wolf, she had an ear that flopped down and a curly tail, Rosauer said. She was with the couple’s other dog, a lab-malamute mix.
“He doesn’t look anything like a wolf,” Rosauer said, “but that’s not even the point. There is no gray area here. The season was closed.”
Shooting into a roadway also endangered him and his wife, Rosauer said. They were a short distance behind the dogs.
Rosauer said the couple and their son stopped to apologize and helped him load the dogs into his vehicle. Kenai died in a Sandpoint veternarian’s office; her shoulder was shattered. The bullet struck the other dog in the leg, but it’s recovering.
Anti-wolf feeling runs high in Boundary County, where vehicles sport bumperstickers that say “Canadian wolves, smoke a pack a day.” Rosauer said that type of sentiment encourages people to act lawlessly.
“We’re teaching people to have zero respect for the animals. I don’t remember growing up like that,” he said. “Where are our hunting ethics? You don’t have to like wolves, but I think they should be treated with respect as a game animal and a creature of this planet.”
Rosauer said he still feels raw over Kenai’s loss.
“This is a sad story, but I want it to be an educational one for people,” he said. “I’d like to see the culture change.”
I live here in good old North Idaho and this is a constant fear when I am out in the woods with my Husky. The blood lust for wolves and the lack of common sense by some of the people carrying firearms keeps me very vigilant while camping and hiking with her. Ill throw a red bandana on her neck and try to keep her in eyesight, but you cant control the other person. I never even pay attention to when the seasons are open, because I cannot trust most of the people up here to have any regard for the laws. There is no reason your dog should be shot in the woods if people just follow the rules and identify their target before pulling the trigger.
Post by: BNAElkhntr on May 27, 2015, 08:09:45 AM
That situation is why I put an orange vest on my chocolate lab when we go hiking, and he doesn't look like a wolf. It's not the owners fault, so don't get me wrong, if my dogs come close to looking like wolves in wolf country and it's known the public hates wolves, I'd have an orange vest on them. Slam on:yeah:
My Weimeraner always has the orange on when out in the woods and he looks nothing like a Wolf If I owned a Husky I'm damn sure have orange on it. I'm not excusing the people for shooting the dog my condolences to them. but at some point people need to think ahead just a little bit.
:twocents:
Post by: mfswallace on May 27, 2015, 09:13:42 AM
I agree, this article is pathetic. :')
The only thing pathetic about this is that a kid was told by his father to shoot without properly identifying their target and even worse out of season. I understand people don't like wolves but the guy who's dog was just shot is right too many people with blind hatred for the wolves and blatant disregard of the law. None of us has to like the wolves but at least idaho is doing the best they can to manage them, too many more stories like this just add fuel to the anti hunters fire
My point was this is completely one sided. I think what the dad and son were doing in the woods and what they thought when they saw a very wolf like animal in wolf country matter and should have been written into article, responsible journalism that's all...
They were knowingly poaching on the father's advice. Although, in retrospect, I'd agree that the dog owner may have saved his dog's life by putting an orange vest on him, he certainly had a reasonable expectation of being able to safely take his dogs out for a walk because the wolf season was closed. The article was factual. The "hunters" did none of the rest of us hunters a service. Part of our credibility as hunters died with that dog.
I see no reference to poaching in the article by idfw or dog owner or dads comment :dunno:
I agree that what happened is unfortunate and wrong
Post by: pianoman9701 on May 27, 2015, 09:20:53 AM
I agree, this article is pathetic. :')
The only thing pathetic about this is that a kid was told by his father to shoot without properly identifying their target and even worse out of season. I understand people don't like wolves but the guy who's dog was just shot is right too many people with blind hatred for the wolves and blatant disregard of the law. None of us has to like the wolves but at least idaho is doing the best they can to manage them, too many more stories like this just add fuel to the anti hunters fire
My point was this is completely one sided. I think what the dad and son were doing in the woods and what they thought when they saw a very wolf like animal in wolf country matter and should have been written into article, responsible journalism that's all...
They were knowingly poaching on the father's advice. Although, in retrospect, I'd agree that the dog owner may have saved his dog's life by putting an orange vest on him, he certainly had a reasonable expectation of being able to safely take his dogs out for a walk because the wolf season was closed. The article was factual. The "hunters" did none of the rest of us hunters a service. Part of our credibility as hunters died with that dog.
I see no reference to poaching in the article by idfw or dog owner or dads comment :dunno:
I agree that what happened is unfortunate and wrong
What do you call hunting game out of season?
Post by: Jonathan_S on May 27, 2015, 10:07:22 AM
I agree, this article is pathetic. :')
The only thing pathetic about this is that a kid was told by his father to shoot without properly identifying their target and even worse out of season. I understand people don't like wolves but the guy who's dog was just shot is right too many people with blind hatred for the wolves and blatant disregard of the law. None of us has to like the wolves but at least idaho is doing the best they can to manage them, too many more stories like this just add fuel to the anti hunters fire
My point was this is completely one sided. I think what the dad and son were doing in the woods and what they thought when they saw a very wolf like animal in wolf country matter and should have been written into article, responsible journalism that's all...
They were knowingly poaching on the father's advice. Although, in retrospect, I'd agree that the dog owner may have saved his dog's life by putting an orange vest on him, he certainly had a reasonable expectation of being able to safely take his dogs out for a walk because the wolf season was closed. The article was factual. The "hunters" did none of the rest of us hunters a service. Part of our credibility as hunters died with that dog.
I see no reference to poaching in the article by idfw or dog owner or dads comment :dunno:
I agree that what happened is unfortunate and wrong
What do you call hunting game out of season?
I don't know but his response is sure to include some of these: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash:
He's a shouter.
Post by: mfswallace on May 27, 2015, 10:17:29 AM
I often carry a rifle when in the woods whether in a hunting season or not...
I hope shooter and dad get all that the law can give them but you are assuming things that are not in the article,, that's all I was saying :sry: If u don't think shooter should get due process in this instance
:bash: :bash: :bash: I included your bash's Jon-S
Post by: pianoman9701 on May 27, 2015, 10:40:16 AM
I also see no reference to shooter hunting?
I often carry a rifle when in the woods whether in a hunting season or not...
I hope shooter and dad get all that the law can give them but you are assuming things that are not in the article,, that's all I was saying :sry: If u don't think shooter should get due process in this instance
:bash: :bash: :bash: I included your bash's Jon-S
I said nothing about him not getting due process. But he clearly admitted to doing this, to the dog owner, the sheriff, and the IDFG. He's a poacher by any definition of poacher there is.
I get the impression your nose is bent out of shape because you think he thought he was doing a good thing (killing a wolf), but just made a mistake. First of all, poaching isn't a good thing, whether it's on wolves, deer, elk, or any other species. It hurts our public image and it harms our resources. Second of all, he didn't know his target - huge, huge problem.
I pack a gun everywhere I go. We have terrorists in America. If I see a guy I think is a terrorist and shoot him, and he turns out not to be a terrorist, should I be given consideration because I thought I was doing a good thing? I don't think so. I think I should be tried for murder. Maybe I missed your point altogether. :dunno:
Post by: andrew_in_idaho on May 27, 2015, 10:50:52 AM
I also see no reference to shooter hunting?
I often carry a rifle when in the woods whether in a hunting season or not...
Do you often shoot at game animals which are not in season?
The article clearly states that wolf season closed March 31st, the incident happened in May. The kid said that his dad told him to shoot the wolf, so he intentionally aimed and fired at what he assumed to be a game animal that was out if season.
If you still don't see a reference to poaching in the article I can't help you.
Post by: mfswallace on May 27, 2015, 11:03:57 AM
It does say the dogs were running ahead, maybe the idiot dad thought they were in danger from 2 wolves running at them?
I totally agree with your other statements :tup: and my nose isn't bent out of shape, just wondering why your putting your own spin on it and then claiming it as fact when nothing in this article backs up your claim of knowingly poaching :dunno:
Post by: Holg3107 on May 27, 2015, 11:04:10 AM
Quote
I also see no reference to shooter hunting?
The moment you start to pursue game you are hunting, or in this case poaching. Not sure why you feel they need to spell it out more?
Post by: andrew_in_idaho on May 27, 2015, 11:12:58 AM
Do you know more than what is actually in this one article sighted? If so then please share because as I stated before, there is no mention of poaching or hunting.
It does say the dogs were running ahead, maybe the idiot dad thought they were in danger from 2 wolves running at them?
I totally agree with your other statements :tup: and my nose isn't bent out of shape, just wondering why your putting your own spin on it and then claiming it as fact when nothing in this article backs up your claim of knowingly poaching :dunno:
It is pretty hard to claim self defense from 180 yards away.
On another note are you by chance an attorney? If so can you send me a business card, I have no need for an attorney at the moment but never hurts to have a good one in mind lol
Post by: Jonathan_S on May 27, 2015, 11:24:04 AM
:bash: :bash: :bash: I included your bash's Jon-S
:chuckle:
Post by: mfswallace on May 27, 2015, 11:25:38 AM
Do you know more than what is actually in this one article sighted? If so then please share because as I stated before, there is no mention of poaching or hunting.
It does say the dogs were running ahead, maybe the idiot dad thought they were in danger from 2 wolves running at them?
I totally agree with your other statements :tup: and my nose isn't bent out of shape, just wondering why your putting your own spin on it and then claiming it as fact when nothing in this article backs up your claim of knowingly poaching :dunno:
It is pretty hard to claim self defense from 180 yards away.
On another note are you by chance an attorney? If so can you send me a business card, I have no need for an attorney at the moment but never hurts to have a good one in mind lol
:chuckle: :chuckle: I am not an attorney :chuckle: :chuckle:
I know it's not self defense and to help Pman understand, I'm sure that it is more probable than not that they were aware they were poaching :chuckle: It just isn't in the article as some are claiming and like Brady some dbags just get to have there side aired before they get condemned :twocents:
Post by: Jonathan_S on May 27, 2015, 11:33:12 AM
It just isn't in the article as some are claiming and like Brady some dbags just get to have there side aired before they get condemned :twocents:
Coming in hot from left.
It's like if I shot somebody's pack goats in July thinking they were deer...would that be poaching deer? No. Would that person be a poacher for thinking they were shooting deer out of season?
Post by: pianoman9701 on May 27, 2015, 12:23:44 PM
Do you know more than what is actually in this one article sighted? If so then please share because as I stated before, there is no mention of poaching or hunting.
It does say the dogs were running ahead, maybe the idiot dad thought they were in danger from 2 wolves running at them?
I totally agree with your other statements :tup: and my nose isn't bent out of shape, just wondering why your putting your own spin on it and then claiming it as fact when nothing in this article backs up your claim of knowingly poaching :dunno:
OK, we're going in circles. I think we're actually not that far apart except for some semantics.
Post by: 92xj on May 27, 2015, 12:35:57 PM
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi452.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fqq243%2F92xj92yota%2FMobile%2520Uploads%2FIMG_20150328_152324849_zpsfb8f1737.jpg&hash=ecded9530a66967d24f47aa60e04014f5e97fa19) (http://s452.photobucket.com/user/92xj92yota/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20150328_152324849_zpsfb8f1737.jpg.html)
Post by: mfswallace on May 27, 2015, 12:40:19 PM
This wolf came running down the road towards me, passing three dogs, coming right at me, I was able to get this cell phone picture before it was to late.
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi452.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fqq243%2F92xj92yota%2FMobile%2520Uploads%2FIMG_20150328_152324849_zpsfb8f1737.jpg&hash=ecded9530a66967d24f47aa60e04014f5e97fa19) (http://s452.photobucket.com/user/92xj92yota/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20150328_152324849_zpsfb8f1737.jpg.html)
Your a good shot :chuckle:
Post by: huntinguy on May 27, 2015, 01:23:05 PM
That situation is why I put an orange vest on my chocolate lab when we go hiking, and he doesn't look like a wolf. It's not the owners fault, so don't get me wrong, if my dogs come close to looking like wolves in wolf country and it's known the public hates wolves, I'd have an orange vest on them. Slam on:yeah:
My Weimeraner always has the orange on when out in the woods and he looks nothing like a Wolf If I owned a Husky I'm damn sure have orange on it. I'm not excusing the people for shooting the dog my condolences to them. but at some point people need to think ahead just a little bit.
:twocents:
Orange vest for our Lab/Shepard mix. He knows what the vest means too... boy does he start to bounce when it comes out.
Something about being proactive.
Sorry for the family that lost the dog. A little more thought on both ends and things would have been different.
Post by: seth30 on May 27, 2015, 02:01:12 PM
:yeah: I put them on my labs when I go grouse hunting. They are black and I always worry someone may mistake them for a black bear.That situation is why I put an orange vest on my chocolate lab when we go hiking, and he doesn't look like a wolf. It's not the owners fault, so don't get me wrong, if my dogs come close to looking like wolves in wolf country and it's known the public hates wolves, I'd have an orange vest on them. Slam on:yeah:
My Weimeraner always has the orange on when out in the woods and he looks nothing like a Wolf If I owned a Husky I'm damn sure have orange on it. I'm not excusing the people for shooting the dog my condolences to them. but at some point people need to think ahead just a little bit.
:twocents:
Orange vest for our Lab/Shepard mix. He knows what the vest means too... boy does he start to bounce when it comes out.
Something about being proactive.
Sorry for the family that lost the dog. A little more thought on both ends and things would have been different.
Post by: DOUBLELUNG on May 27, 2015, 03:01:14 PM
Post by: seth30 on May 27, 2015, 03:15:39 PM
Post by: andrew_in_idaho on May 27, 2015, 03:39:24 PM
Don't even get me started on Brady. 4 games is way overkill for his punishment, plus the team hit with $1m fine and losing draft picks, c'mon the league rule book says the proper punishment for under inflated balls is a $25,000 fine for the team. :jacked:Do you know more than what is actually in this one article sighted? If so then please share because as I stated before, there is no mention of poaching or hunting.
It does say the dogs were running ahead, maybe the idiot dad thought they were in danger from 2 wolves running at them?
I totally agree with your other statements :tup: and my nose isn't bent out of shape, just wondering why your putting your own spin on it and then claiming it as fact when nothing in this article backs up your claim of knowingly poaching :dunno:
It is pretty hard to claim self defense from 180 yards away.
On another note are you by chance an attorney? If so can you send me a business card, I have no need for an attorney at the moment but never hurts to have a good one in mind lol
:chuckle: :chuckle: I am not an attorney :chuckle: :chuckle:
I know it's not self defense and to help Pman understand, I'm sure that it is more probable than not that they were aware they were poaching :chuckle: It just isn't in the article as some are claiming and like Brady some dbags just get to have there side aired before they get condemned :twocents:
Now back to the subject at hand, this is a forum not a court of law, and I don't believe for 1 second that this was anything other than the worst case of attempted poaching I've heard of. It seems we are actually on the same page that these guys need the book thrown at them. People's bloodlust after wolves will continue to fuel the antis cause and that is what outrages me the most about this. As hunters and conservationists we need to be level headed regarding wolves to ensure that we will be able to control these alpha predators to conserve our ungulate populations.
Post by: idahohuntr on May 27, 2015, 05:07:49 PM
:yeah: Absolutely spot on! :tup:People's bloodlust after wolves will continue to fuel the antis cause and that is what outrages me the most about this. As hunters and conservationists we need to be level headed regarding wolves to ensure that we will be able to control these alpha predators to conserve our ungulate populations.Do you know more than what is actually in this one article sighted? If so then please share because as I stated before, there is no mention of poaching or hunting.
It does say the dogs were running ahead, maybe the idiot dad thought they were in danger from 2 wolves running at them?
I totally agree with your other statements :tup: and my nose isn't bent out of shape, just wondering why your putting your own spin on it and then claiming it as fact when nothing in this article backs up your claim of knowingly poaching :dunno:
It is pretty hard to claim self defense from 180 yards away.
On another note are you by chance an attorney? If so can you send me a business card, I have no need for an attorney at the moment but never hurts to have a good one in mind lol
:chuckle: :chuckle: I am not an attorney :chuckle: :chuckle:
I know it's not self defense and to help Pman understand, I'm sure that it is more probable than not that they were aware they were poaching :chuckle: It just isn't in the article as some are claiming and like Brady some dbags just get to have there side aired before they get condemned :twocents:
Post by: grundy53 on May 27, 2015, 05:25:07 PM
I agree, this article is pathetic. :')
The only thing pathetic about this is that a kid was told by his father to shoot without properly identifying their target and even worse out of season. I understand people don't like wolves but the guy who's dog was just shot is right too many people with blind hatred for the wolves and blatant disregard of the law. None of us has to like the wolves but at least idaho is doing the best they can to manage them, too many more stories like this just add fuel to the anti hunters fire
My point was this is completely one sided. I think what the dad and son were doing in the woods and what they thought when they saw a very wolf like animal in wolf country matter and should have been written into article, responsible journalism that's all...
They were knowingly poaching on the father's advice. Although, in retrospect, I'd agree that the dog owner may have saved his dog's life by putting an orange vest on him, he certainly had a reasonable expectation of being able to safely take his dogs out for a walk because the wolf season was closed. The article was factual. The "hunters" did none of the rest of us hunters a service. Part of our credibility as hunters died with that dog.
I see no reference to poaching in the article by idfw or dog owner or dads comment :dunno:
I agree that what happened is unfortunate and wrong
What do you call hunting game out of season?
Season is open year round IF on private property. I wonder if the FS road was actually Potlach or some other private timber company's road. :dunno: Still a bad deal for the dog owner. I agree with the others that an orange vest is a good idea. Especially in that area.
Post by: mfswallace on May 27, 2015, 05:40:56 PM
Post by: stevemiller on May 27, 2015, 05:47:52 PM
Not everyone in the woods is hunting, or for that matter training, with a turtle. A vest on a fast moving pointing dog busting through brush is something of a bad joke. Trying to stop it on command when it's 500-1000 yards in front of you is even more problematic. They don't run close, that's not how they are wired or work most effectively.Why exactly would they be running 500 to 1000 yards in front of you?In WA.?
If a person can't tell the difference between a hunting dog and a wolf, let alone a malamute and a wolf, they have no business hunting.
Post by: stevemiller on May 27, 2015, 05:49:32 PM
:yeah: Season closed,No excuse,No fault could be place on the dogs owner. :twocents:i worry about it too and my dogs dont look like wolves at all, i think both are at fault. sad situation but they both made errors.
How did the dog owner make an error or could you possibly place blame on him at all, I don't care if it was a pet wolf, wolf season was closed and the poachers failed to correctly identify their target. Placing blame on the dog owner is just ridiculous
Post by: stevemiller on May 27, 2015, 05:53:28 PM
I agree with this to an extent,What you are saying is that there was no way that any dog coul d be or should be mistaken for a wolf,That is ridiculous,There are a lot of dogs that they have to do DNA testing on to establish that. :twocents: The closed season is all that matters here.No there are plenty of would be poachers down here as well but blaming the dog owner for the actions of a poacher is about the dumbest thing I've read all week.:yeah:
And if you don't know what you are shooting at you do not pull the trigger. EVER.
Post by: grundy53 on May 27, 2015, 05:56:33 PM
I agree with this to an extent,What you are saying is that there was no way that any dog coul d be or should be mistaken for a wolf,That is ridiculous,There are a lot of dogs that they have to do DNA testing on to establish that. :twocents: The closed season is all that matters here.No there are plenty of would be poachers down here as well but blaming the dog owner for the actions of a poacher is about the dumbest thing I've read all week.:yeah:
And if you don't know what you are shooting at you do not pull the trigger. EVER.
Unless it was private property. then it wasn't closed.
Post by: stevemiller on May 27, 2015, 05:58:34 PM
I also see no reference to shooter hunting?Doesnt say he was hunting?When you go into the woods with your rifle you are not auto matically hunting no,But as soon as you aim and pull the trigger on an animal you are now hunting and if out of season you are a poacher. I withdraw this statement,I dont think that this would be considered poaching. :twocents:
I often carry a rifle when in the woods whether in a hunting season or not...
I hope shooter and dad get all that the law can give them but you are assuming things that are not in the article,, that's all I was saying :sry: If u don't think shooter should get due process in this instance
:bash: :bash: :bash: I included your bash's Jon-S
Post by: stevemiller on May 27, 2015, 06:08:33 PM
Post by: grundy53 on May 27, 2015, 06:17:15 PM
Just for the record for the forum members that want to say private property and all that stuff,The closed season statement was in the article which would indicate to me that where and when this happened the season was indeed closed to the shooter,Making this an attempted poaching incident,Attempted only because the fact remains that it was a dog and not a wolf.Excluding it from the crime of poaching. :twocents:
I agree. I want to make it clear I'm not trying to defend the actions of the shooter. Just trying to explain why MAYBE they didn't consider this attempted poaching.
Post by: andrew_in_idaho on May 27, 2015, 06:57:25 PM
What Idahohunter will never admit is the pro-wolf crowd won't change no matter what hunters do, good or bad :bash: spewing the same drivel over and over won't it changes anyone's minds
I can't speak for Idahohunter but it seems to me he and I kinda see eye to eye on this matter, so here is my opinion. You are correct we cannot change the opinion of the pro wolf crowd but this is not a black and white issue, there are a lot of people in the middle who don't have an opinion one way or the other about wolves and wolf hunting who may form an opinion upon reading an article about irresponsible and unethical acts committed by those who claim to be "hunters". This is why we need to tone it down with the kill em all, who cares about the law, SSS attitude or we will lose what ground we have and will gain in the future in efforts to restore some semblance of balance to our game populations.
Post by: stevemiller on May 27, 2015, 07:30:51 PM
I would never think you would defend anything that is illegal :tup: Took a couple post for me to realize this though.No game animal no property of the state ETC no poaching.In WA. State I think its a 1k fine for the killing or injury of someones pet.Not really sure how this one will play out since the shooter thought he was hunting (the wolf)and shot and killed what he thought was a wolf.The intention was there.Like fishing without a license,Your fishing whether you catch or not,keep or not. :dunno:Just for the record for the forum members that want to say private property and all that stuff,The closed season statement was in the article which would indicate to me that where and when this happened the season was indeed closed to the shooter,Making this an attempted poaching incident,Attempted only because the fact remains that it was a dog and not a wolf.Excluding it from the crime of poaching. :twocents:
I agree. I want to make it clear I'm not trying to defend the actions of the shooter. Just trying to explain why MAYBE they didn't consider this attempted poaching.
Post by: idahohuntr on May 27, 2015, 07:39:37 PM
Well said...and those points are exponentially more important in Washington where some of these greenie groups actually have pretty strong political clout as compared to an Idaho or Wyoming.What Idahohunter will never admit is the pro-wolf crowd won't change no matter what hunters do, good or bad :bash: spewing the same drivel over and over won't it changes anyone's minds
I can't speak for Idahohunter but it seems to me he and I kinda see eye to eye on this matter, so here is my opinion. You are correct we cannot change the opinion of the pro wolf crowd but this is not a black and white issue, there are a lot of people in the middle who don't have an opinion one way or the other about wolves and wolf hunting who may form an opinion upon reading an article about irresponsible and unethical acts committed by those who claim to be "hunters". This is why we need to tone it down with the kill em all, who cares about the law, SSS attitude or we will lose what ground we have and will gain in the future in efforts to restore some semblance of balance to our game populations.
Post by: AspenBud on May 28, 2015, 02:12:51 PM
Not everyone in the woods is hunting, or for that matter training, with a turtle. A vest on a fast moving pointing dog busting through brush is something of a bad joke. Trying to stop it on command when it's 500-1000 yards in front of you is even more problematic. They don't run close, that's not how they are wired or work most effectively.Why exactly would they be running 500 to 1000 yards in front of you?In WA.?
If a person can't tell the difference between a hunting dog and a wolf, let alone a malamute and a wolf, they have no business hunting.
I think this quote (regarding English Pointers) from another forum sums it up...
"Pointers, especially trial bred pointers, are EXPECTED to hunt independently, at distances exceeding gun range. They can be cuddle bugs at home, but also can be somewhat aloof. But in the field, they are hunting machines, first and last. It is what they do. It is what they are.
If that ain't what you want, don't get a Pointer. It's just that simple."
I know of several people who hunt chukar that like dogs to run at that range and I know of many who are willing to let their dogs stretch the distance in the woods going after grouse as well.
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 02:23:04 PM
Post by: AspenBud on May 28, 2015, 03:10:56 PM
What good does it do a hunter to be hunting birds if the dog is 500 to 1000 yards ahead?
If you are hunting chukar in a canyon with a 2500 foot near vertical climb what's more efficient? Trying to walk every square inch of that to find birds or let the dog do it as quickly as possible, covering as much ground as possible, stopping only to stand on point when it find its quarry?
A pointing dog seeking birds like a heat seeking missile can cut the time it takes to find birds dramatically.
Is the bird goin to just hover until you get there?
You might be surprised.
If your dog is out hunting itself and you are 500 to 1000 yards back and the dog is taking game on its own well then there are other legal issues at hand.
Which is why you steady your dog and don't let it extend the range until that is done. Extreme range does not equal self hunting or out of control if you have laid the training foundation properly.
In short your dog has no reason in WA. State to be 500 to 1000 yards away from its owner on public property.
I suspect a lot of pointing dog people would disagree.
It's a matter of preference. I don't prefer those ranges and like a dog that sticks more within 200-300 yards max. But some guys do and in open country a dog that sets the landscape on fire is a real asset. A dog that can do that and be smart enough to tighten up the range when in dense cover is even better. We have lots of open spaces in Washington and lots of areas with tight cover conditions.
Once upon a time guys hunted bear and cougars with dogs that more than doubled the range I mentioned here, like we go from hundreds of yards away to potentially miles away there. Hunting with hounds is illegal except under special conditions now, hunting birds with pointing dogs is not, and if it ever does become illegal Washington and I are done.
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 03:59:42 PM
Post by: Jonathan_S on May 28, 2015, 04:02:25 PM
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 04:05:44 PM
Post by: Jonathan_S on May 28, 2015, 04:07:11 PM
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 04:08:05 PM
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 04:09:41 PM
Yes once upon a time there were reasons for your hunting dog to be 500 to 1000 yards away,but sadly not anymore.There is no good reason that you can come up with(you dont even like it yourself you posted)to be over 1/4 to over a 1/2 mile away from your hunting dog. :dunno:
you see the OVER part?Why do people always jump into a discussion only reading part of it before posting,then start a problem?
Post by: Jonathan_S on May 28, 2015, 04:13:26 PM
I read the whole thing Steve. Believe it or not your typing skills are not airtight and easily lead to confusion.
Just because I don't type a bunch of gobbledygook throughout the thread doesn't mean I am not paying attention.
Post by: Jonathan_S on May 28, 2015, 04:18:19 PM
Post by: AspenBud on May 28, 2015, 04:22:02 PM
Yes once upon a time there were reasons for your hunting dog to be 500 to 1000 yards away,but sadly not anymore.There is no good reason that you can come up with(you dont even like it yourself you posted)to be over 1/4 to over a 1/2 mile away from your hunting dog. :dunno:
I don't like those ranges because it is outside my comfort zone with my dogs. That doesn't mean those ranges don't work here.
Whether you think there is a legitimate reason or not, people are running dogs like that. So what? It works for them.
People need to be mindful of that before they pull the trigger...and they can be out there any time between August 1 and the start of April doing anything from hunting to training on wild birds.
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 04:47:06 PM
Post by: AspenBud on May 28, 2015, 05:02:50 PM
yep and interfering with other hunters as well.if your hunting and your dog is out 1000 yards in any direction on public land then you must believe that you are entitled to hunt over 500 acres of land that everyone else must stay off of,is this correct?
Or are you interfering with my hunt? hmmm
Public land is public land, I have a right to be there with my dogs as much as you and I generally try not to park where someone else obviously has so as to limit such encounters.
I did have a guy roll up in his truck last year and tell me that it was the first day of bow season, effectively telling me to leave even though I was parked there first, geared up, and had the dog out of the box. We had a stare down and then he asked if we could share the space and declared that I might be helpful in getting the deer to move around and not hunker down (really, he thought of that all on his own). I had no problem with that.
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 05:10:26 PM
Post by: AspenBud on May 28, 2015, 05:17:15 PM
I believe that you have every right that i do yes.Your dog no.Your dog In my op needs to be within a reasonable distance from his owner even in the wild.If its public land that is.You are not entitled to public land with your dog,If this was the case there would be no leash laws but yet there are. :twocents:
Leash laws do not apply to dogs used to hunt or being trained to hunt.
Are you going to push for legislation on the maximum distance a dog can be from the handler too? :chuckle:
Are you against hunting with hounds as well? Would you vote against bringing it back?
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 05:23:39 PM
Post by: Curly on May 28, 2015, 05:26:10 PM
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 05:28:48 PM
Steve, it's obvious that you don't know how pointers work. Are you just arguing for fun?No I am not. :bash: :bash: what are pointers for?Birds. OK can you see your dog point at over a half mile away no can you shoot a bird at over a half mile away ? No you can not. so who is arguing?
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 05:54:53 PM
Steve, it's obvious that you don't know how pointers work. Are you just arguing for fun?Why do you put me out here?Why am I the one arguing and not the other way around?It doesnt take a genius to know that a bird dog does you no good at these distances.How long does it take you to walk 1000 yards in the field?
Post by: AspenBud on May 28, 2015, 06:16:42 PM
Steve, it's obvious that you don't know how pointers work. Are you just arguing for fun?No I am not. :bash: :bash: what are pointers for?Birds. OK can you see your dog point at over a half mile away no can you shoot a bird at over a half mile away ? No you can not. so who is arguing?
If your dog can find and point a bird at those distances you stand a chance of walking up and flushing the bird and shooting it. If it didn't work people wouldn't do it. But it does and people do.
Post by: AspenBud on May 28, 2015, 06:23:12 PM
Post by: deltaops on May 28, 2015, 06:56:39 PM
GPS Tracking and lets you know when your dog is on point!
One of the reasons why someone may let a dog get out a ways from them. :dunno: Just Sayin!
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 07:01:39 PM
Sport Dog Tech 2.0I knew this might come up lol.Isnt it illegal to hunt with these gps trackers?If the dog is on point that tracker is being used for hunting right?
GPS Tracking and lets you know when your dog is on point!
One of the reasons why someone may let a dog get out a ways from them. :dunno: Just Sayin!
Post by: KFhunter on May 28, 2015, 07:03:57 PM
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 07:06:05 PM
Post by: andrew_in_idaho on May 28, 2015, 07:06:38 PM
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 07:09:21 PM
steve you should step back from this thread, you're not accomplishing anything good for yourself or the thread.The rest of your buddies here are though right?Getting tired of you mods always singleing out certain people.I thought that was against forum rules.
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 07:14:36 PM
Let's get this thread moved to the hunting dogs section :chuckle:The reason the hunting dog got brought into this thread is because some are giving reasons for a dog to be away from the owner,Some feel as much as over a half mile is acceptable on public land.This is another reason some of these pets are mistakenly being shot,Some feel that an orange vest would help,I agree,
Post by: deltaops on May 28, 2015, 07:33:25 PM
Sport Dog Tech 2.0I knew this might come up lol.Isnt it illegal to hunt with these gps trackers?If the dog is on point that tracker is being used for hunting right?
GPS Tracking and lets you know when your dog is on point!
One of the reasons why someone may let a dog get out a ways from them. :dunno: Just Sayin!
I was just stating that the yhave them. I really do not know if its legal or illegal in WA State, but I wasn't referring to a particular State. We are taling about a dog being shot cause someone thought it was a wolf in Idaho.
Anyways, I have a black and white Field Springer, depending on where we go, depends on what color collar and or vest he wears.
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 07:36:48 PM
Was just rereading through some of this thread saw this.A little out of range it says.Do you consider 950 yards only a little out of range?Not everyone in the woods is hunting, or for that matter training, with a turtle. A vest on a fast moving pointing dog busting through brush is something of a bad joke. Trying to stop it on command when it's 500-1000 yards in front of you is even more problematic. They don't run close, that's not how they are wired or work most effectively.Why exactly would they be running 500 to 1000 yards in front of you?In WA.?
If a person can't tell the difference between a hunting dog and a wolf, let alone a malamute and a wolf, they have no business hunting.
I think this quote (regarding English Pointers) from another forum sums it up...
"Pointers, especially trial bred pointers, are EXPECTED to hunt independently, at distances exceeding gun range. They can be cuddle bugs at home, but also can be somewhat aloof. But in the field, they are hunting machines, first and last. It is what they do. It is what they are.
If that ain't what you want, don't get a Pointer. It's just that simple."
I know of several people who hunt chukar that like dogs to run at that range and I know of many who are willing to let their dogs stretch the distance in the woods going after grouse as well.
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 07:38:30 PM
they work great for locating i agree.i think the range for most good ones is 500 yards.they might have some high dollar ones that will go 1000 not sure.Sport Dog Tech 2.0I knew this might come up lol.Isnt it illegal to hunt with these gps trackers?If the dog is on point that tracker is being used for hunting right?
GPS Tracking and lets you know when your dog is on point!
One of the reasons why someone may let a dog get out a ways from them. :dunno: Just Sayin!
I was just stating that the yhave them. I really do not know if its legal or illegal in WA State, but I wasn't referring to a particular State. We are taling about a dog being shot cause someone thought it was a wolf in Idaho.
Anyways, I have a black and white Field Springer, depending on where we go, depends on what color collar and or vest he wears.
Post by: WA hunter14 on May 28, 2015, 07:51:17 PM
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 07:52:30 PM
Post by: JLS on May 28, 2015, 08:48:30 PM
Steve, it's obvious that you don't know how pointers work. Are you just arguing for fun?No I am not. :bash: :bash: what are pointers for?Birds. OK can you see your dog point at over a half mile away no can you shoot a bird at over a half mile away ? No you can not. so who is arguing?
You WALK over to the dog that is pointing the bird, flush it and shoot it. How hard is it? My dog routinely works 2-500 yards out chukar hunting.
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 08:59:38 PM
Post by: JLS on May 28, 2015, 09:03:13 PM
Post by: WA hunter14 on May 28, 2015, 09:05:15 PM
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 09:08:37 PM
Not everyone in the woods is hunting, or for that matter training, with a turtle. A vest on a fast moving pointing dog busting through brush is something of a bad joke. Trying to stop it on command when it's 500-1000 yards in front of you is even more problematic. They don't run close, that's not how they are wired or work most effectively.this is where.
If a person can't tell the difference between a hunting dog and a wolf, let alone a malamute and a wolf, they have no business hunting.
Post by: WA hunter14 on May 28, 2015, 09:25:53 PM
Not everyone in the woods is hunting, or for that matter training, with a turtle. A vest on a fast moving pointing dog busting through brush is something of a bad joke. Trying to stop it on command when it's 500-1000 yards in front of you is even more problematic. They don't run close, that's not how they are wired or work most effectively.this is where.
If a person can't tell the difference between a hunting dog and a wolf, let alone a malamute and a wolf, they have no business hunting.
well i think a bird dog chasing birds is like the least likely situation where a dog in the woods would be mistaken for a wolf and shot
Post by: hunter399 on May 28, 2015, 09:48:48 PM
Post by: KFhunter on May 28, 2015, 09:55:35 PM
Everbody keeps saying vest ,but a cheaper and just as good is flaging tape ,around the neck or tied to a tail works good comes in bright colors and sometimes u can find it in the woods already dont even have to buy it .
Finally! A good use for flaggery
glad someone was thinking about the well being of our furry friends and providing us with tear off ribbons so hunters don't shoot out dogs.
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.minnpost.com%2Fsites%2Fdefault%2Ffiles%2Fimagecache%2Farticle_detail%2For-fladry-corral_main.jpg&hash=fc64600d6a40cd00b2b7e040993083fa4fc04573)
Post by: stevemiller on May 28, 2015, 09:58:39 PM
Another perfect example of abusive name calling behavior from another HW member that didnt read thread before posting.Yet again mods are picking and choosing who they want to harass about these behaviors.Thanks you just keep making the in crowd in and keep the out crowd out i guess.I for one dont like being treated less than anyone else.Every time i get into a discussion about something one of the HW elite has to get an argument started then their followers jump on that wagon and it steam rolls from there.Steve, it's obvious that you don't know how pointers work. Are you just arguing for fun?No I am not. :bash: :bash: what are pointers for?Birds. OK can you see your dog point at over a half mile away no can you shoot a bird at over a half mile away ? No you can not. so who is arguing?
You can't fix stupid.
You WALK over to the dog that is pointing the bird, flush it and shoot it. How hard is it? My dog routinely works 2-500 yards out chukar hunting.