Post by: huntingaddiction on August 03, 2016, 10:57:59 PM
Post by: Mfowl on August 03, 2016, 11:02:13 PM
Post by: rtspring on August 03, 2016, 11:04:40 PM
I would of been pissed and he and everyone else around would of known all hell broke loose..
Damned idiots!!
Post by: jmscon on August 03, 2016, 11:10:10 PM
At that point he has threatened your life, act accordingly!
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 03, 2016, 11:37:32 PM
:yike: That friggin sucks!!Like I said I reacted poorly. He was smart enough to put down his gun.
At that point he has threatened your life, act accordingly!
Post by: kentrek on August 03, 2016, 11:44:17 PM
Post by: Duckslayer89 on August 03, 2016, 11:57:18 PM
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 12:17:03 AM
I think it happens more then we think. Lots of guys don't have binoculars and look at everything through their scopeI agree but that is no excuse. In this case it was at a hundred yards. He knew exactly what I was. I was standing skylined too.
Post by: Duckslayer89 on August 04, 2016, 12:33:22 AM
I think it happens more then we think. Lots of guys don't have binoculars and look at everything through their scopeI agree but that is no excuse. In this case it was at a hundred yards. He knew exactly what I was. I was standing skylined too.
Oh no way, not an excuse at all man was just mentioning that. Any sane capable person should know better. Hunter or not. Was this guy hunting? You have every right to be pissed, that is really close. I was thinking he was at least a few hundred yards away. That makes it even worse. Scary stuff!
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 12:44:32 AM
He was hunting or driving around with a rifle. Sorry didn't mean for it to come across like you were making an excuse for him. I knew you weren't. I just dont get it. At that range I had to assume the worst. I acted in such a manner. I really don't take stuff like that lightly. He put his gun on the ground and said it wasn't loaded. I proceeded to go over rule number one to treat every gun as if it were loaded. I then recommended that they leave as I was extremely pissed off. They did. Knowing they had to drive past my teuck to get out, I got to a position where I could see my truck just in case. No problems. Just really frustrating number one as a hunter and number two as a veteran. Guns are just not something you play with.I think it happens more then we think. Lots of guys don't have binoculars and look at everything through their scopeI agree but that is no excuse. In this case it was at a hundred yards. He knew exactly what I was. I was standing skylined too.
Oh no way, not an excuse at all man was just mentioning that. Any sane capable person should know better. Hunter or not. Was this guy hunting? You have every right to be pissed, that is really close. I was thinking he was at least a few hundred yards away. That makes it even worse. Scary stuff!
Post by: pianoman9701 on August 04, 2016, 06:12:48 AM
Post by: Timberstalker on August 04, 2016, 07:06:57 AM
Get behind cover and yell. You could technically report him for brandishing/threatening if you are able to get a license number and description to police. Aiming back isn't a great idea. It could quickly lead to an escalation. These people suck. I don't know how anyone who's gone through hunter ed can still demonstrate this behavior.
Nailed it.
Post by: HardCorpsHuntr on August 04, 2016, 07:11:00 AM
Get behind cover and yell. You could technically report him for brandishing/threatening if you are able to get a license number and description to police. Aiming back isn't a great idea. It could quickly lead to an escalation. These people suck. I don't know how anyone who's gone through hunter ed can still demonstrate this behavior.
:yeah: I would take the extra step and notify LE. Let the professionals deal with him. If he's doing that nowadays, there's probably more to his story that LE could piece together (e.g., EDP, felon, under the influence, been warned before....) And, after being contacted by LE, I'd bet he thinks twice about using his scoped rifle to look at people.
Post by: WAcoyotehunter on August 04, 2016, 07:18:06 AM
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 07:26:07 AM
So what did you do??I was pretty mad. Ruined the bear hunt as I was cussing them out. Got my gun ready in case I needed it. I did not put him in my scope. He made every excuse in the book. "The sun was in my eyes, I didn't know you were there. I tried to get a license plate. They backed out so I couldn't see it.
Post by: jmscon on August 04, 2016, 07:45:36 AM
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 08:10:59 AM
I read a story of a guy who either had a kid do it to him or saw a kid looking at something through his scope. He confronted the kid and asked if he knew how bad it was to do that and the reason to not do it. Kid said he simply didn't have any bino's. Guy gave the kid his $300 pair off his neck!That is awesome. We owe it to the next generation of hunters to teach them right. However that may be. Unfortunately I feel like my generation should know better. This was not a kid. I would have been a little more calm had it been.
Post by: Bob33 on August 04, 2016, 08:21:52 AM
Get behind cover and yell. You could technically report him for brandishing/threatening if you are able to get a license number and description to police. Aiming back isn't a great idea. It could quickly lead to an escalation. These people suck. I don't know how anyone who's gone through hunter ed can still demonstrate this behavior.The first step is move out of the line of fire to eliminate the threat to you.
Escalating a situation with an armed idiot or worse is probably not the wisest action.
Post by: JLS on August 04, 2016, 08:28:10 AM
So what did you do??I was pretty mad. Ruined the bear hunt as I was cussing them out. Got my gun ready in case I needed it. I did not put him in my scope. He made every excuse in the book. "The sun was in my eyes, I didn't know you were there. I tried to get a license plate. They backed out so I couldn't see it.
I know the feeling. I've had it happen several times. Kudos to you, it takes a lot of willpower to not beat someone into the ground when that happens.
Post by: JimmyHoffa on August 04, 2016, 08:36:48 AM
Get behind cover and yell. You could technically report him for brandishing/threatening if you are able to get a license number and description to police. Aiming back isn't a great idea. It could quickly lead to an escalation. These people suck. I don't know how anyone who's gone through hunter ed can still demonstrate this behavior.This is what I do. Then move a good distance if I can maintain cover/concealment.
Post by: JDHasty on August 04, 2016, 08:37:02 AM
By the time they are five years old using a binocular comes as naturally to them as walking. I also gave my nieces and nephews GOOD binoculars for their third birthday and they still own and use them north of twenty-five years later. Whenever we are headed out their binocular is the first thing they pack.
My two older kids got Leupold Yosemite 6x30s in pink mossy oak and and my son will get his pair (brick red) when he turns three. I have three years from the day they are born to shop for a great price on a pair and that is what I have done.
My nieces and nephews have Nikons and Bausch & Lombs and they have been well served by them.
I doubt that I will ever have to deal w/this nonsense from any of them, but if I ever catch any of these kids using a scoped rifle to glass with there is going to be a problem, a BIG problem. And they know it.
Post by: carpsniperg2 on August 04, 2016, 08:46:10 AM
Get behind cover and yell. You could technically report him for brandishing/threatening if you are able to get a license number and description to police. Aiming back isn't a great idea. It could quickly lead to an escalation. These people suck. I don't know how anyone who's gone through hunter ed can still demonstrate this behavior.The first step is move out of the line of fire to eliminate the threat to you.
Escalating a situation with an armed idiot or worse is probably not the wisest action.
:yeah: If the person is dumb enough to point a gun and something they for sure already know is a person. Then there thought process is a little hay wire already. So starting something with negative response may not be the best choice. All you can do if find cover and call out.
Post by: Special T on August 04, 2016, 09:27:55 AM
I fall some where closer to the grey line than those on here. If you point a gun at me I'm gona assume your going to shoot me. Getting a license plate and reporting is better at 100 yards but I wouldn't take getting scoped lightly.
Post by: huntnphool on August 04, 2016, 09:32:00 AM
Aiming or discharging firearms, dangerous weapons.
(1) For conduct not amounting to a violation of chapter 9A.36 RCW, any person who:
(a) Aims any firearm, whether loaded or not, at or towards any human being;
(b) Willfully discharges any firearm, air gun, or other weapon, or throws any deadly missile in a public place, or in any place where any person might be endangered thereby. A public place shall not include any location at which firearms are authorized to be lawfully discharged; or
(c) Except as provided in RCW 9.41.185, sets a so-called trap, spring pistol, rifle, or other dangerous weapon,
although no injury results, is guilty of a gross misdemeanor punishable under chapter 9A.20 RCW.
(2) If an injury results from a violation of subsection (1) of this section, the person violating subsection (1) of this section shall be subject to the applicable provisions of chapters 9A.32 and 9A.36 RCW.
If you get scoped and can get a license plate number, or can otherwise positively identify the perpetrator, I strongly recommend a call to the county sheriff. :twocents:
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 09:39:58 AM
RCW 9.41.230My guess is I will see them again. This is on permit only land. And it was a completely blacked out newer Chevy. Looked like it had a built in winch. If I see them I will turn them in. I am not a happy camper at all about it.
Aiming or discharging firearms, dangerous weapons.
(1) For conduct not amounting to a violation of chapter 9A.36 RCW, any person who:
(a) Aims any firearm, whether loaded or not, at or towards any human being;
(b) Willfully discharges any firearm, air gun, or other weapon, or throws any deadly missile in a public place, or in any place where any person might be endangered thereby. A public place shall not include any location at which firearms are authorized to be lawfully discharged; or
(c) Except as provided in RCW 9.41.185, sets a so-called trap, spring pistol, rifle, or other dangerous weapon,
although no injury results, is guilty of a gross misdemeanor punishable under chapter 9A.20 RCW.
(2) If an injury results from a violation of subsection (1) of this section, the person violating subsection (1) of this section shall be subject to the applicable provisions of chapters 9A.32 and 9A.36 RCW.
If you get scoped and can get a license plate number, or can otherwise positively identify the perpetrator, I strongly recommend a call to the county sheriff. :twocents:
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 09:44:45 AM
Well 100 yards is pretty close for that kind of encounter. I had a buddy get scoped at 600 yards. The message was understood when he grabbed his rifle sat behind a stump and scoped him back.Honestly that is exactly where my mind went. I was completely prepared for the worst. If somebody points a gun at me I have to assume it is loaded. Where I was at there was really no good cover. I was sitting there because you can see a lot and everything is within a couple hundred yards. I am just dumbfounded by the stupidity of people out there.
I fall some where closer to the grey line than those on here. If you point a gun at me I'm gona assume your going to shoot me. Getting a license plate and reporting is better at 100 yards but I wouldn't take getting scoped lightly.
Post by: rtspring on August 04, 2016, 09:49:36 AM
When a person points a gun at you, that is not a time to be nice! Nice has gotten many people killed and or wounded over the years.
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 09:55:56 AM
Ya be nice! That way the SOB can continue to scope people throughout his day and hunting career.I wasn't nice about it and he was rattled enough at how pussed I was to put his gun down and hands up.
When a person points a gun at you, that is not a time to be nice! Nice has gotten many people killed and or wounded over the years.
Post by: jay.sharkbait on August 04, 2016, 10:09:55 AM
Maybe wave and see if they wave back.
Continue on hunt.
Not post on HUNTWA
but that's just me......................
Post by: rtspring on August 04, 2016, 10:11:24 AM
Ya be nice! That way the SOB can continue to scope people throughout his day and hunting career.I wasn't nice about it and he was rattled enough at how pussed I was to put his gun down and hands up.
When a person points a gun at you, that is not a time to be nice! Nice has gotten many people killed and or wounded over the years.
Wasn't directed at you, but the others suggesting to be nice. Hes already pointing a gun at you! How can it get any worse??? Shoot at you? I would loose my dang mind on someone pointing any weapon at me.
Just sucks for you that idiots like these do exist and many many people let them go do it again and again!
Post by: pianoman9701 on August 04, 2016, 10:22:17 AM
Post by: JDHasty on August 04, 2016, 10:22:37 AM
RCW 9.41.230
Aiming or discharging firearms, dangerous weapons.
(1) For conduct not amounting to a violation of chapter 9A.36 RCW, any person who:
(a) Aims any firearm, whether loaded or not, at or towards any human being;
(b) Willfully discharges any firearm, air gun, or other weapon, or throws any deadly missile in a public place, or in any place where any person might be endangered thereby. A public place shall not include any location at which firearms are authorized to be lawfully discharged; or
(c) Except as provided in RCW 9.41.185, sets a so-called trap, spring pistol, rifle, or other dangerous weapon,
although no injury results, is guilty of a gross misdemeanor punishable under chapter 9A.20 RCW.
(2) If an injury results from a violation of subsection (1) of this section, the person violating subsection (1) of this section shall be subject to the applicable provisions of chapters 9A.32 and 9A.36 RCW.
If you get scoped and can get a license plate number, or can otherwise positively identify the perpetrator, I strongly recommend a call to the county sheriff. :twocents:
:yeah:
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 10:25:30 AM
I wouldn't say anything.can I ask why? I think this is a good conversation to have. Accidents happen because people don't think even though they know better. Honestly the coversation needs to happen because it is NEVER ok to pint a gun at somebody with the exception of defending yourself. So sorry I am going to say something. This is unacceptable behavior and we should not stay quiet about.
Maybe wave and see if they wave back.
Continue on hunt.
Not post on HUNTWA
but that's just me......................
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 10:27:01 AM
RT, your blood pressure. Check it!He is right though.
Post by: pianoman9701 on August 04, 2016, 10:55:16 AM
RT, your blood pressure. Check it!He is right though.
It makes me crazy and he is right. But, you can't aim back or shoot back. Taking cover, yelling, and getting information on the culprits are all important, in that order.
Post by: Special T on August 04, 2016, 11:06:10 AM
Whether legal or not stuffing a gun in some ones face sends a Very clear message.RT, your blood pressure. Check it!He is right though.
It makes me crazy and he is right. But, you can't aim back or shoot back. Taking cover, yelling, and getting information on the culprits are all important, in that order.
If you do it first then I'm responding in defence. That is very different than being the instigator.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
Post by: JLS on August 04, 2016, 11:07:44 AM
RT, your blood pressure. Check it!He is right though.
It makes me crazy and he is right. But, you can't aim back or shoot back. Taking cover, yelling, and getting information on the culprits are all important, in that order.
Actually, someone pointing a gun at you and looking through their scope would be a pretty defensible situation for use of lethal force. State law does not require you to be shot at before you shoot at someone and you certainly don't know their intentions.
I am not advocating that people should shoot everyone for scoping them with their rifles. I never have. However, the thought STRONGLY crossed my mind on one occasion when the idiot kept his gun on me for what seemed like an eternity.
Post by: Special T on August 04, 2016, 11:10:05 AM
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 11:14:48 AM
Why would you not prepare to defend yourself? Serious question here. Just wondering, like I said I got ready and prepared for the worst but never actually aimed.RT, your blood pressure. Check it!He is right though.
It makes me crazy and he is right. But, you can't aim back or shoot back. Taking cover, yelling, and getting information on the culprits are all important, in that order.
Post by: Bob33 on August 04, 2016, 11:24:06 AM
Prepare to defend yourself? I think the odds of a hunter intentionally attempting to shoot another hunter are very small. I'd prefer to put all my efforts initially into removing myself from the threat.Why would you not prepare to defend yourself? Serious question here. Just wondering, like I said I got ready and prepared for the worst but never actually aimed.RT, your blood pressure. Check it!He is right though.
It makes me crazy and he is right. But, you can't aim back or shoot back. Taking cover, yelling, and getting information on the culprits are all important, in that order.
Post by: pianoman9701 on August 04, 2016, 11:28:20 AM
Why would you not prepare to defend yourself? Serious question here. Just wondering, like I said I got ready and prepared for the worst but never actually aimed.RT, your blood pressure. Check it!He is right though.
It makes me crazy and he is right. But, you can't aim back or shoot back. Taking cover, yelling, and getting information on the culprits are all important, in that order.
Because cover against getting shot by an idiot it what's needed immediately. Unless you are dealing with a psychopath who's actually trying to shoot you, which is highly unlikely, you could turn what amounts to a stupid move on the part of the idiot with a rifle into a fully blown exchange of gunfire. That would be a ridiculous escalation of the situation, when protecting yourself first, making your presence and your dissatisfaction known, and collecting the necessary info to have the authorities contact him is what's needed to keep it from ever happening again.
Post by: jay.sharkbait on August 04, 2016, 11:44:59 AM
I wouldn't say anything.can I ask why? I think this is a good conversation to have. Accidents happen because people don't think even though they know better. Honestly the coversation needs to happen because it is NEVER ok to pint a gun at somebody with the exception of defending yourself. So sorry I am going to say something. This is unacceptable behavior and we should not stay quiet about.
Maybe wave and see if they wave back.
Continue on hunt.
Not post on HUNTWA
but that's just me......................
I'm used to having rifles pointed at me and I don't think being scoped is that big of deal.
I certainly wouldn't flip out over it.
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 11:49:28 AM
how are you used to that?I wouldn't say anything.can I ask why? I think this is a good conversation to have. Accidents happen because people don't think even though they know better. Honestly the coversation needs to happen because it is NEVER ok to pint a gun at somebody with the exception of defending yourself. So sorry I am going to say something. This is unacceptable behavior and we should not stay quiet about.
Maybe wave and see if they wave back.
Continue on hunt.
Not post on HUNTWA
but that's just me......................
I'm used to having rifles pointed at me and I don't think being scoped is that big of deal.
I certainly wouldn't flip out over it.
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 11:52:20 AM
Fair enough but if I feel I need to find cover wouldn't I also be under the assumption that he is going to shoot?Why would you not prepare to defend yourself? Serious question here. Just wondering, like I said I got ready and prepared for the worst but never actually aimed.RT, your blood pressure. Check it!He is right though.
It makes me crazy and he is right. But, you can't aim back or shoot back. Taking cover, yelling, and getting information on the culprits are all important, in that order.
Because cover against getting shot by an idiot it what's needed immediately. Unless you are dealing with a psychopath who's actually trying to shoot you, which is highly unlikely, you could turn what amounts to a stupid move on the part of the idiot with a rifle into a fully blown exchange of gunfire. That would be a ridiculous escalation of the situation, when protecting yourself first, making your presence and your dissatisfaction known, and collecting the necessary info to have the authorities contact him is what's needed to keep it from ever happening again.
Post by: elkfins on August 04, 2016, 11:54:01 AM
2. If they are a threat, I become a threat to them.
3. If not a threat and just an idiot, take steps to confront them in a non threatening, courteous and adult manner. Express my concerns and educate them in proper firearm safety.
Their response to my confrontation will determine my next steps... either involve law enforcement or hope that I have educated them properly. If I witness the same behavior from them a 2nd time, I will immediately involve law enforcement.
Post by: pianoman9701 on August 04, 2016, 11:56:36 AM
Fair enough but if I feel I need to find cover wouldn't I also be under the assumption that he is going to shoot?Why would you not prepare to defend yourself? Serious question here. Just wondering, like I said I got ready and prepared for the worst but never actually aimed.RT, your blood pressure. Check it!He is right though.
It makes me crazy and he is right. But, you can't aim back or shoot back. Taking cover, yelling, and getting information on the culprits are all important, in that order.
Because cover against getting shot by an idiot it what's needed immediately. Unless you are dealing with a psychopath who's actually trying to shoot you, which is highly unlikely, you could turn what amounts to a stupid move on the part of the idiot with a rifle into a fully blown exchange of gunfire. That would be a ridiculous escalation of the situation, when protecting yourself first, making your presence and your dissatisfaction known, and collecting the necessary info to have the authorities contact him is what's needed to keep it from ever happening again.
So escalate instead of diffuse? Not me. If he started shooting and continued, maybe. This isn't combat, though. This is a stupid hunter. Way different. Maybe not less lethal, but way different. I've been shot at. It was a mistake and it ended with his one shot until we got the police involved. I don't believe he hunted again. Not sure.
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 11:58:19 AM
1. Immediately get cover and determine if the person pointing the rifle is a threat or just an idiot who forgot or disregards firearm safety rule #1.I think this is the best answer yet. However that decision may have to come quick. I feel that you have to assume the worst. I am not saying shoot them by any means, but most definitely prepare yourself.
2. If they are a threat, I become a threat to them.
3. If not a threat and just an idiot, take steps to confront them in a non threatening, courteous and adult manner. Express my concerns and educate them in proper firearm safety.
Their response to my confrontation will determine my next steps... either involve law enforcement or hope that I have educated them properly. If I witness the same behavior from them a 2nd time, I will immediately involve law enforcement.
Post by: jackelope on August 04, 2016, 11:59:47 AM
Fair enough but if I feel I need to find cover wouldn't I also be under the assumption that he is going to shoot?Why would you not prepare to defend yourself? Serious question here. Just wondering, like I said I got ready and prepared for the worst but never actually aimed.RT, your blood pressure. Check it!He is right though.
It makes me crazy and he is right. But, you can't aim back or shoot back. Taking cover, yelling, and getting information on the culprits are all important, in that order.
Because cover against getting shot by an idiot it what's needed immediately. Unless you are dealing with a psychopath who's actually trying to shoot you, which is highly unlikely, you could turn what amounts to a stupid move on the part of the idiot with a rifle into a fully blown exchange of gunfire. That would be a ridiculous escalation of the situation, when protecting yourself first, making your presence and your dissatisfaction known, and collecting the necessary info to have the authorities contact him is what's needed to keep it from ever happening again.
Finding cover is the priority.
Post by: DOUBLELUNG on August 04, 2016, 12:02:06 PM
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 12:02:40 PM
What if the area was known for meth? Does that change the way you see thing? Just wondering?Why would you not prepare to defend yourself? Serious question here. Just wondering, like I said I got ready and prepared for the worst but never actually aimed.RT, your blood pressure. Check it!He is right though.
It makes me crazy and he is right. But, you can't aim back or shoot back. Taking cover, yelling, and getting information on the culprits are all important, in that order.
Because cover against getting shot by an idiot it what's needed immediately. Unless you are dealing with a psychopath who's actually trying to shoot you, which is highly unlikely, you could turn what amounts to a
So escalate instead of diffuse? Not me. If he started shooting and continued, maybe. This isn't combat, though. This is a stupid hunter. Way different. Maybe not less lethal, but way different. I've been shot at. It was a mistake and it ended with his one shot until we got the police involved. I don't believe he hunted again. Not sure.
Post by: JimmyHoffa on August 04, 2016, 12:12:26 PM
Probably not the best response, but if they are too far to hear what I'm yelling clearly, I flip them the bird. I have never been worried that it's a psycho, but unfortunately the hunter dumber than a box of rocks is too common in our ranks.I figure the same, just add in that they've probably been drinking and using drugs. Usually it's guys climbing out of a truck, scoping and peeing. Most of the time they are off-hand and unless they were match shooters couldn't hit house at 300 off hand, so plenty of time to just move into some cover/concealment.
Post by: Jpmiller on August 04, 2016, 12:17:45 PM
I wouldn't say anything.can I ask why? I think this is a good conversation to have. Accidents happen because people don't think even though they know better. Honestly the coversation needs to happen because it is NEVER ok to pint a gun at somebody with the exception of defending yourself. So sorry I am going to say something. This is unacceptable behavior and we should not stay quiet about.
Maybe wave and see if they wave back.
Continue on hunt.
Not post on HUNTWA
but that's just me......................
I'm used to having rifles pointed at me and I don't think being scoped is that big of deal.
I certainly wouldn't flip out over it.
Not a big deal? I would like to hear an expansion of that opinion. I can't imagine a scenario where it is not a big deal.
Post by: BGLEMIN on August 04, 2016, 12:21:50 PM
Post by: BGLEMIN on August 04, 2016, 12:25:03 PM
Post by: jay.sharkbait on August 04, 2016, 12:31:48 PM
I wouldn't say anything.can I ask why? I think this is a good conversation to have. Accidents happen because people don't think even though they know better. Honestly the coversation needs to happen because it is NEVER ok to pint a gun at somebody with the exception of defending yourself. So sorry I am going to say something. This is unacceptable behavior and we should not stay quiet about.
Maybe wave and see if they wave back.
Continue on hunt.
Not post on HUNTWA
but that's just me......................
I'm used to having rifles pointed at me and I don't think being scoped is that big of deal.
I certainly wouldn't flip out over it.
Not a big deal? I would like to hear an expansion of that opinion. I can't imagine a scenario where it is not a big deal.
Nope, not a big deal and I am not willing to go over the reasons why I (emphasis on I) feel that way.
Besides, I've seen how most hunters shoot and I doubt most could hit a man size target at 100yd offhand. :)
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 12:38:22 PM
I am not normal man sized. I dhot a bear at 150 off hand on monday night. You have a lot of confidence. I know a lot of veterans that would have freaked out worse than I did. It is scary that it wouldn't bother you.I wouldn't say anything.can I ask why? I think this is a good conversation to have. Accidents happen because people don't think even though they know better. Honestly the coversation needs to happen because it is NEVER ok to pint a gun at somebody with the exception of defending yourself. So sorry I am going to say something. This is unacceptable behavior and we should not stay quiet about.
Maybe wave and see if they wave back.
Continue on hunt.
Not post on HUNTWA
but that's just me......................
I'm used to having rifles pointed at me and I don't think being scoped is that big of deal.
I certainly wouldn't flip out over it.
Not a big deal? I would like to hear an expansion of that opinion. I can't imagine a scenario where it is not a big deal.
Nope, not a big deal and I am not willing to go over the reasons why I (emphasis on I) feel that way.
Besides, I've seen how most hunters shoot and I doubt most could hit a man size target at 100yd offhand. :)
Post by: pianoman9701 on August 04, 2016, 12:54:14 PM
What if the area was known for meth? Does that change the way you see thing? Just wondering?Why would you not prepare to defend yourself? Serious question here. Just wondering, like I said I got ready and prepared for the worst but never actually aimed.RT, your blood pressure. Check it!He is right though.
It makes me crazy and he is right. But, you can't aim back or shoot back. Taking cover, yelling, and getting information on the culprits are all important, in that order.
Because cover against getting shot by an idiot it what's needed immediately. Unless you are dealing with a psychopath who's actually trying to shoot you, which is highly unlikely, you could turn what amounts to a
So escalate instead of diffuse? Not me. If he started shooting and continued, maybe. This isn't combat, though. This is a stupid hunter. Way different. Maybe not less lethal, but way different. I've been shot at. It was a mistake and it ended with his one shot until we got the police involved. I don't believe he hunted again. Not sure.
What if, what if? Tweekers don't normally walk around the woods with rifles aiming at people. I could be wrong here but I've never heard of a tweeker shooting someone in the woods with a rifle from 100 yards. What if it were a PTSD combat vet, or a Muslim terrorist, or a bored rich kid, or an eco terrorist trying to save Bambi? It's not. It's a stupid hunter. If you get behind cover and he shoots and continues shooting, you know it's a more serious problem
Post by: ghosthunter on August 04, 2016, 01:22:08 PM
Prepare to defend yourself? I think the odds of a hunter intentionally attempting to shoot another hunter are very small. I'd prefer to put all my efforts initially into removing myself from the threat.Why would you not prepare to defend yourself? Serious question here. Just wondering, like I said I got ready and prepared for the worst but never actually aimed.RT, your blood pressure. Check it!He is right though.
It makes me crazy and he is right. But, you can't aim back or shoot back. Taking cover, yelling, and getting information on the culprits are all important, in that order.
I don't know . Not to long ago we had a hunter shoot a hiker intentionally thinking she was a bear.
Scoping is covered in every hunter ed class. No reason for it.
Post by: JDHasty on August 04, 2016, 01:29:45 PM
Prepare to defend yourself? I think the odds of a hunter intentionally attempting to shoot another hunter are very small. I'd prefer to put all my efforts initially into removing myself from the threat.Why would you not prepare to defend yourself? Serious question here. Just wondering, like I said I got ready and prepared for the worst but never actually aimed.RT, your blood pressure. Check it!He is right though.
It makes me crazy and he is right. But, you can't aim back or shoot back. Taking cover, yelling, and getting information on the culprits are all important, in that order.
I don't know . Not to long ago we had a hunter shoot a hiker intentionally thinking she was a bear.
Scoping is covered in every hunter ed class. No reason for it.
If convicted it should result in loss of hunting privilege until Hunter Education has been repeated and passed.
Post by: seth30 on August 04, 2016, 01:34:52 PM
Post by: pianoman9701 on August 04, 2016, 01:52:49 PM
Prepare to defend yourself? I think the odds of a hunter intentionally attempting to shoot another hunter are very small. I'd prefer to put all my efforts initially into removing myself from the threat.Why would you not prepare to defend yourself? Serious question here. Just wondering, like I said I got ready and prepared for the worst but never actually aimed.RT, your blood pressure. Check it!He is right though.
It makes me crazy and he is right. But, you can't aim back or shoot back. Taking cover, yelling, and getting information on the culprits are all important, in that order.
I don't know . Not to long ago we had a hunter shoot a hiker intentionally thinking she was a bear.
Scoping is covered in every hunter ed class. No reason for it.
If he thought it was a bear, it was unintentional, as opposed to intentional and homicidal.
Post by: seth30 on August 04, 2016, 01:54:36 PM
That was in Skagit right? There was another incident over on the coast where someone shot a brush picker.Prepare to defend yourself? I think the odds of a hunter intentionally attempting to shoot another hunter are very small. I'd prefer to put all my efforts initially into removing myself from the threat.Why would you not prepare to defend yourself? Serious question here. Just wondering, like I said I got ready and prepared for the worst but never actually aimed.RT, your blood pressure. Check it!He is right though.
It makes me crazy and he is right. But, you can't aim back or shoot back. Taking cover, yelling, and getting information on the culprits are all important, in that order.
I don't know . Not to long ago we had a hunter shoot a hiker intentionally thinking she was a bear.
Scoping is covered in every hunter ed class. No reason for it.
Post by: jay.sharkbait on August 04, 2016, 02:20:21 PM
I am not normal man sized. I dhot a bear at 150 off hand on monday night. You have a lot of confidence. I know a lot of veterans that would have freaked out worse than I did. It is scary that it wouldn't bother you.I wouldn't say anything.can I ask why? I think this is a good conversation to have. Accidents happen because people don't think even though they know better. Honestly the coversation needs to happen because it is NEVER ok to pint a gun at somebody with the exception of defending yourself. So sorry I am going to say something. This is unacceptable behavior and we should not stay quiet about.
Maybe wave and see if they wave back.
Continue on hunt.
Not post on HUNTWA
but that's just me......................
I'm used to having rifles pointed at me and I don't think being scoped is that big of deal.
I certainly wouldn't flip out over it.
Not a big deal? I would like to hear an expansion of that opinion. I can't imagine a scenario where it is not a big deal.
Nope, not a big deal and I am not willing to go over the reasons why I (emphasis on I) feel that way.
Besides, I've seen how most hunters shoot and I doubt most could hit a man size target at 100yd offhand. :)
Nice shooting!
Confident? I don't know, I think most hunters have good intentions and using a scope as a spotter is a common but ill advised practice. It just wouldn't cause me to lose it.
Ages ago I did some support work for some of the local cool guys. I was horrified to see them walking downrange(hot range) to change targets and later in the day I got to participate in that little exercise in trust. Listening to 556 hit a target 4 or 5 lanes over and trying to act like you've done it a million times before is something you'll never forget.
Post by: R2Rcoulee on August 04, 2016, 02:26:05 PM
Post by: JDHasty on August 04, 2016, 02:44:05 PM
Prepare to defend yourself? I think the odds of a hunter intentionally attempting to shoot another hunter are very small. I'd prefer to put all my efforts initially into removing myself from the threat.Why would you not prepare to defend yourself? Serious question here. Just wondering, like I said I got ready and prepared for the worst but never actually aimed.RT, your blood pressure. Check it!He is right though.
It makes me crazy and he is right. But, you can't aim back or shoot back. Taking cover, yelling, and getting information on the culprits are all important, in that order.
I don't know . Not to long ago we had a hunter shoot a hiker intentionally thinking she was a bear.
Scoping is covered in every hunter ed class. No reason for it.
If he thought it was a bear, it was unintentional, as opposed to intentional and homicidal.
It happened on Sauk Mountain. The woman was dressed in a purple jacket and I do believe IIRC that the killer was using a rifle scope to glass with.
Post by: WoodlandShooter on August 04, 2016, 02:46:15 PM
well, that depends....
if greater than 725 yards...meh...no worries.
but, if it happened more than once, I would get my LRF and zap them just to make sure I was in a safe place.
then is I was still being glassed, I would get out my dope card, making sure they saw exactly what I was doing...add some appropriate clicks to my scope...lick my finger to check the wind... :IBCOOL:
Post by: huntnphool on August 04, 2016, 02:47:03 PM
Post by: WoodlandShooter on August 04, 2016, 02:49:54 PM
Post by: JimmyHoffa on August 04, 2016, 02:50:56 PM
Wasn't it foggy and he just shot the moving silhouette or something? Seem to recall, that kid had some other problems too (legal) and probably shouldn't have had a gun to begin with. Or am I thinking of someone else?Prepare to defend yourself? I think the odds of a hunter intentionally attempting to shoot another hunter are very small. I'd prefer to put all my efforts initially into removing myself from the threat.Why would you not prepare to defend yourself? Serious question here. Just wondering, like I said I got ready and prepared for the worst but never actually aimed.RT, your blood pressure. Check it!He is right though.
It makes me crazy and he is right. But, you can't aim back or shoot back. Taking cover, yelling, and getting information on the culprits are all important, in that order.
I don't know . Not to long ago we had a hunter shoot a hiker intentionally thinking she was a bear.
Scoping is covered in every hunter ed class. No reason for it.
If he thought it was a bear, it was unintentional, as opposed to intentional and homicidal.
It happened on Sauk Mountain. The woman was dressed in a purple jacket and I do believe IIRC that the killer was using a rifle scope to glass with.
Post by: JDHasty on August 04, 2016, 02:51:13 PM
http://articles.latimes.com/2008/aug/14/nation/na-hiker14
Post by: JimmyHoffa on August 04, 2016, 02:53:40 PM
Over by Shelton. The supposed story was the brushpicker was wearing dark/black rain suit and was trying to hide by crawling around in the bushes.That was in Skagit right? There was another incident over on the coast where someone shot a brush picker.Prepare to defend yourself? I think the odds of a hunter intentionally attempting to shoot another hunter are very small. I'd prefer to put all my efforts initially into removing myself from the threat.Why would you not prepare to defend yourself? Serious question here. Just wondering, like I said I got ready and prepared for the worst but never actually aimed.RT, your blood pressure. Check it!He is right though.
It makes me crazy and he is right. But, you can't aim back or shoot back. Taking cover, yelling, and getting information on the culprits are all important, in that order.
I don't know . Not to long ago we had a hunter shoot a hiker intentionally thinking she was a bear.
Scoping is covered in every hunter ed class. No reason for it.
Post by: WoodlandShooter on August 04, 2016, 02:54:23 PM
I am not normal man sized. I dhot a bear at 150 off hand on monday night. You have a lot of confidence. I know a lot of veterans that would have freaked out worse than I did. It is scary that it wouldn't bother you.I wouldn't say anything.can I ask why? I think this is a good conversation to have. Accidents happen because people don't think even though they know better. Honestly the coversation needs to happen because it is NEVER ok to pint a gun at somebody with the exception of defending yourself. So sorry I am going to say something. This is unacceptable behavior and we should not stay quiet about.
Maybe wave and see if they wave back.
Continue on hunt.
Not post on HUNTWA
but that's just me......................
I'm used to having rifles pointed at me and I don't think being scoped is that big of deal.
I certainly wouldn't flip out over it.
Not a big deal? I would like to hear an expansion of that opinion. I can't imagine a scenario where it is not a big deal.
Nope, not a big deal and I am not willing to go over the reasons why I (emphasis on I) feel that way.
Besides, I've seen how most hunters shoot and I doubt most could hit a man size target at 100yd offhand. :)
Nice shooting!
Confident? I don't know, I think most hunters have good intentions and using a scope as a spotter is a common but ill advised practice. It just wouldn't cause me to lose it.
Ages ago I did some support work for some of the local cool guys. I was horrified to see them walking downrange(hot range) to change targets and later in the day I got to participate in that little exercise in trust. Listening to 556 hit a target 4 or 5 lanes over and trying to act like you've done it a million times before is something you'll never forget.
CRACK.DING.......WHOMP.
rinse and repeat.
Post by: jay.sharkbait on August 04, 2016, 02:56:09 PM
Yes, it was foggy
http://articles.latimes.com/2008/aug/14/nation/na-hiker14
So if he had binos would that have prevented the accident?
Post by: Yondering on August 04, 2016, 02:56:55 PM
If he thought it was a bear, it was unintentional, as opposed to intentional and homicidal.
Why would that even matter to this discussion? Being shot by accident isn't any better than being shot on purpose, and is probably more likely. It's not just people's intentions that matter.
Post by: JDHasty on August 04, 2016, 03:07:32 PM
Yes, it was foggy
http://articles.latimes.com/2008/aug/14/nation/na-hiker14
So if he had binos would that have prevented the accident?
Who knows
In Hunter Education class we teach that there are things that you NEVER do
One of these things is NEVER shoot unless you have positively identified your target and another is you NEVER use a scoped rifle to glass for game. If a person is so negligent and irresponsible that they routinely glass for game using a scoped rifle, it is more likely than not that there are other cardinal rules that they are inclined to disregard such as, but not limited to, shooting before they have positively identified their target.
Post by: andrew_in_idaho on August 04, 2016, 03:13:33 PM
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: jay.sharkbait on August 04, 2016, 03:27:44 PM
I mean heck, if the guy is carrying a Tika I would feel very safe.
Post by: fish vacuum on August 04, 2016, 03:43:03 PM
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 04:09:30 PM
Contact the timber company that issued the permits. Maybe they can narrow down the vehicle. If you can get a positive ID on it, they might lose their permit.
Post by: KopperBuck on August 04, 2016, 04:12:21 PM
Years ago an off duty GC Sheriff was shot will coyotee hunting. I believe the sheriff said the guy was scoping him, he tried to hide but ended up getting shot by an 30 06. The guy was a felon out hunting a special doe hunt with his dad, his dad had the permit. He made up some bs story, but was found guilty & got like 7 yrs. The sheriff is no longer a sheriff because of his injuries. You never know what other people are thinking & planning. Be safe out there.
I remember that - it was kind of touch and go for Earl there for a while. Messed up.
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 04:56:02 PM
Post by: Duckslayer89 on August 04, 2016, 05:09:14 PM
I guess my biggest thing is the it will never heppen to me attitude. We hear about these accidents every single year and yet some of these guys still think it is ok. It is not. Pointing a gun at me is not a great idea. Last night was obviously just idiocracy. How many times do we have to hear about it before it stops though?
This story makes me want to just wear orange all the time now. I have some under armor shirts in blaze orange and they stay nice and cool. They are the loose fitting ones. I would recommend them for summer time
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 05:20:22 PM
Unfortunately I don't think blaze orange would have made a difference at all...he just straight did not care.I guess my biggest thing is the it will never heppen to me attitude. We hear about these accidents every single year and yet some of these guys still think it is ok. It is not. Pointing a gun at me is not a great idea. Last night was obviously just idiocracy. How many times do we have to hear about it before it stops though?
This story makes me want to just wear orange all the time now. I have some under armor shirts in blaze orange and they stay nice and cool. They are the loose fitting ones. I would recommend them for summer time
Post by: steeleywhopper on August 04, 2016, 09:28:16 PM
Post by: Bean Counter on August 04, 2016, 09:29:45 PM
Post by: jmscon on August 04, 2016, 09:55:13 PM
But think about this: If a guy walks up to you on the street and points a hand gun at you what are you going to do? Then says "Oh, it isn't loaded."
Basically the same thing, right?
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 09:59:41 PM
I support not escalating if the guy realizes his err and puts his gun down.That is kind of my thought on it. I will report I have to call anyways cause some meth head was locked in when we got there.
But think about this: If a guy walks up to you on the street and points a hand gun at you what are you going to do? Then says "Oh, it isn't loaded."
Basically the same thing, right?
Post by: JimmyHoffa on August 04, 2016, 10:08:40 PM
I support not escalating if the guy realizes his err and puts his gun down.Not exactly. The rifle provided a scope which enhances your vision. If he's drawing a bead on you, then it is same as a guy putting a handgun in your face. I don't see utilizing a scope and aiming a rifle as being identical. ***I don't support/encourage 'scoping'.
But think about this: If a guy walks up to you on the street and points a hand gun at you what are you going to do? Then says "Oh, it isn't loaded."
Basically the same thing, right?
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 10:17:42 PM
so you don't support it but if he utilizes his scope(which oh yea has crosshairs in it) that is ok? That is just utilizing a scope. Kind of surlrised at some of these answers. Would honestly love to see aome of these guys react.I support not escalating if the guy realizes his err and puts his gun down.Not exactly. The rifle provided a scope which enhances your vision. If he's drawing a bead on you, then it is same as a guy putting a handgun in your face. I don't see utilizing a scope and aiming a rifle as being identical. ***I don't support/encourage 'scoping'.
But think about this: If a guy walks up to you on the street and points a hand gun at you what are you going to do? Then says "Oh, it isn't loaded."
Basically the same thing, right?
Post by: YukonHunter on August 04, 2016, 10:25:46 PM
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 10:34:55 PM
What about using your reticle to range targets is that ok in a hunting scenario?I assume you mean a rangefindibg scope? If so do you intend to shoot said target cause if not no...that is what a rangefinder is for. To be clear by intend to shoot I mean would you shoot there at that moment if a target were to step out. Is it safe and are you sure of what you are aiming at and what is beyod it?
Post by: JimmyHoffa on August 04, 2016, 10:41:11 PM
I agree the guy was/is a moron. anyone that scopes other armed people is probably a moron. But if on a ridgeline and see a moron looking at me in a scope is a bit different than a guy walking up to me on the street and pulling out a handgun and pointing it at me.so you don't support it but if he utilizes his scope(which oh yea has crosshairs in it) that is ok? That is just utilizing a scope. Kind of surlrised at some of these answers. Would honestly love to see aome of these guys react.I support not escalating if the guy realizes his err and puts his gun down.Not exactly. The rifle provided a scope which enhances your vision. If he's drawing a bead on you, then it is same as a guy putting a handgun in your face. I don't see utilizing a scope and aiming a rifle as being identical. ***I don't support/encourage 'scoping'.
But think about this: If a guy walks up to you on the street and points a hand gun at you what are you going to do? Then says "Oh, it isn't loaded."
Basically the same thing, right?
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 04, 2016, 10:42:34 PM
At 100 yards I view it as the same thing honestly.I agree the guy was/is a moron. anyone that scopes other armed people is probably a moron. But if on a ridgeline and see a moron looking at me in a scope is a bit different than a guy walking up to me on the street and pulling out a handgun and pointing it at me.so you don't support it but if he utilizes his scope(which oh yea has crosshairs in it) that is ok? That is just utilizing a scope. Kind of surlrised at some of these answers. Would honestly love to see aome of these guys react.I support not escalating if the guy realizes his err and puts his gun down.Not exactly. The rifle provided a scope which enhances your vision. If he's drawing a bead on you, then it is same as a guy putting a handgun in your face. I don't see utilizing a scope and aiming a rifle as being identical. ***I don't support/encourage 'scoping'.
But think about this: If a guy walks up to you on the street and points a hand gun at you what are you going to do? Then says "Oh, it isn't loaded."
Basically the same thing, right?
Post by: DaveMonti on August 04, 2016, 10:50:56 PM
Yes, I know it's possible and may even have happened, save me your stories and your "what if" scenarios and your "you're-really-a-liberal-in-disguise-who-wants-more-people-to-die-by-guns-so-you-can-ban-them-forever" and whatever else can escape from under your hot collar because I disagree with you.
While I would yell and probably even take cover, I'd chalk it up to someone being an idiot and I would not get confrontational. I'd protect myself, but if it was obvious that someone was using their scope in lieu of binoculars to scope me, I'm not going to get all upset. I personally think I face higher risk by riding my motorcycle on public roads.
As I said, it's not a safe practice, and to make sure nobody does it, we have to teach everyone that it's a sin akin to actual murder. I get it. I just don't think it's a big deal and it certainly doesn't warrant me getting into a confrontation with a stranger, where the odds of getting shot go up exponentially.
Post by: YukonHunter on August 04, 2016, 11:30:36 PM
Post by: csaaphill on August 05, 2016, 02:52:09 AM
I'm with jay on this. I certainly don't condone this behavior, and would intervene if I saw someone doing it, but I think it's highly unlikely that someone will shoot me while "scoping" me. People get shot because they are mistaken for game, not because someone mistakenly pulled the trigger on a loaded gun while the safety is off while scoping someone.:yeah:
Yes, I know it's possible and may even have happened, save me your stories and your "what if" scenarios and your "you're-really-a-liberal-in-disguise-who-wants-more-people-to-die-by-guns-so-you-can-ban-them-forever" and whatever else can escape from under your hot collar because I disagree with you.
While I would yell and probably even take cover, I'd chalk it up to someone being an idiot and I would not get confrontational. I'd protect myself, but if it was obvious that someone was using their scope in lieu of binoculars to scope me, I'm not going to get all upset. I personally think I face higher risk by riding my motorcycle on public roads.
As I said, it's not a safe practice, and to make sure nobody does it, we have to teach everyone that it's a sin akin to actual murder. I get it. I just don't think it's a big deal and it certainly doesn't warrant me getting into a confrontation with a stranger, where the odds of getting shot go up exponentially.
Post by: Jpmiller on August 05, 2016, 06:40:49 AM
The next day he shot a doe in an any buck area (was caught at the check station fortunately, rifle forfeiture). Come to find out from his brother this was not his first time doing that, told me he gets so excited when he sees something he just shoots it. After hearing that I am so thankful there wasn't a more serious mistake made. I doubt he is the only one who is like that, having a rifle pointed at you in the field is dangerous no matter what you think their intentions are, he didn't go out intending on poaching deer. I'm just glad it was a doe and not a person.
Post by: JDHasty on August 05, 2016, 08:22:42 AM
I went out ONE year with a guy who didn't need binoculars, he had a scope. Anytime he saw something or thought he saw something up went the rifle to check it out. We were hunting the Vail tree farm which was loaded with Hunter's. We all told him to knock it off and when we got back to camp we all told him we wouldn't go out with him again.
The next day he shot a doe in an any buck area (was caught at the check station fortunately, rifle forfeiture). Come to find out from his brother this was not his first time doing that, told me he gets so excited when he sees something he just shoots it. After hearing that I am so thankful there wasn't a more serious mistake made. I doubt he is the only one who is like that, having a rifle pointed at you in the field is dangerous no matter what you think their intentions are, he didn't go out intending on poaching deer. I'm just glad it was a doe and not a person.
I have been waiting for someone, anyone, to post their experience with hunting with someone in the party who used a scoped rifle to glass for game. I knew it was coming, I just had to be patient and it would show up.
And that, my friends, is EXACTLY how the shooting of the hiker on Sauk Mountain went down. The two brothers saw some movement they both thought was a bear, the younger one raised his rifle to check it out better through his rifle scope and as soon as he had the woman in his scope he pulled the trigger. He wanted to see a bear and he "saw" a bear in his scope and pulled the trigger. Had he checked out what he was looking at with a binocular things may well have turned out differently.
Post by: dwils233 on August 05, 2016, 08:36:16 AM
Post by: JDHasty on August 05, 2016, 08:58:18 AM
Vortex Raptor
Two nice Porro prism binoculars that anyone can afford, will last an entire lifetime, and are going to be totally functional for big game hunting. Roofs cost more to achieve a decent level of optical quality. It is just a function of their complexity.
I've picked them up in almost new condition off Craigslist to donate to junior programs and such.
Post by: Cougartail on August 05, 2016, 09:51:28 AM
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 05, 2016, 09:54:07 AM
Lol liberal? Far from it buddy. I love my guns and will stand next to anyone who wants to fight with me the day they try to take them. However, I won't point a gun at you unless I am defending myself or I intend to take your life. That is gun saftey. Don't throw around accusations that you have no idea about it has been a peaceful conversation. We do not need any idiocracy going on here cause somebody wants to be high and mighty. Thanks!I'm with jay on this. I certainly don't condone this behavior, and would intervene if I saw someone doing it, but I think it's highly unlikely that someone will shoot me while "scoping" me. People get shot because they are mistaken for game, not because someone mistakenly pulled the trigger on a loaded gun while the safety is off while scoping someone.:yeah:
Yes, I know it's possible and may even have happened, save me your stories and your "what if" scenarios and your "you're-really-a-liberal-in-disguise-who-wants-more-people-to-die-by-guns-so-you-can-ban-them-forever" and whatever else can escape from under your hot collar because I disagree with you.
While I would yell and probably even take cover, I'd chalk it up to someone being an idiot and I would not get confrontational. I'd protect myself, but if it was obvious that someone was using their scope in lieu of binoculars to scope me, I'm not going to get all upset. I personally think I face higher risk by riding my motorcycle on public roads.
As I said, it's not a safe practice, and to make sure nobody does it, we have to teach everyone that it's a sin akin to actual murder. I get it. I just don't think it's a big deal and it certainly doesn't warrant me getting into a confrontation with a stranger, where the odds of getting shot go up exponentially.
Post by: bknilvr00 on August 05, 2016, 10:21:18 AM
Post by: birddogdad on August 05, 2016, 10:51:07 AM
Post by: JDHasty on August 05, 2016, 11:04:44 AM
I believe some states consider the act brandishing or careless control of the firearm even in hunting applications subject to penalties...
As well they should
Post by: blackveltbowhunter on August 05, 2016, 11:54:28 AM
IMO assuming is just the way life is. There will always be assumptions, If I assume lethal intent every time I have been scoped there would be several dead guys in the woods. And odds are I would be in a heap of legal trouble if not in prison, and worse a guilty conscience. Yes If I killed someone for scoping me who had no ill intent, I would feel guilty. However, My personal enemy to idiot in the field ratio, leads me to assume that when a gun is scoping me it is from A) someone who doesn't know what they are looking at and is trying to confirm identity. Or B) Someone who knows i am there and is wanting to "spy" on me and is doing so with the only optics available or is a lazy fool. Both situations are grave and require immediate and rapid attention, but only if significant events unfold to change my assumptions up to that point will I start looking for a rest from cover with intent to kill. In the mean time removing myself from harms way in and expedient fashion will be first on my mind.
After I have assessed the situation from safety, and the other party is aware, I am aware, I will attempt to contact them. If an amicable albeit stern/frustrated/pissed off investigation turns up situation A ,I will likely be satisfied with a good tongue lashing followed by assistance if needed.
If situation B is presumed, I will do everything reasonable to make sure they are penalized. Scoping a known hunter even if not meaning any harm , is idiocy that deserves harsh punishment IMO.
For the record I have been in situation A come up a couple different times, both times resulted in shed tears and a good lesson. Also the gun was pulled away AS soon as it was known that it had been aimed at the wrong thing.
Post by: bigtex on August 05, 2016, 12:06:14 PM
I believe some states consider the act brandishing or careless control of the firearm even in hunting applications subject to penalties...WA is one of those states.
Post by: dwils233 on August 05, 2016, 01:57:14 PM
one of my hunting partners started big game this year. While he had a nice rifle he didn't yet own bino's and used his scope and it really irked me and our other buddy. We were on private land with no one else to scope and we hunted in a pair with me spotting, but it was still obviously something we wanted to avoid in the future. His birthday came around and we split a pair of leopolds for him and heckled him pretty hard so I expect them to be around his neck every time we hit the field this year. I keep some old junker binos in my truck now just in case I'm in the field and anyone, even a stranger, wants to use a rifle to scope. They can have them, I can keep my cool, and no escalation hopefully.
"...avoid in the future." All due respects, I don't know you or your friends, or where you're hunting, but I have to say that I've rarely heard such a relaxed attitude toward "scoping". Even if you see a deer, you don't put the scope on it until you want to destroy it. Personally, I would have been as upset about that as I would the loss of muzzle control. I would have insisted they stop immediately and whether or not I ever hunt with them would depend on whether they took it to heart. Just my :twocents:. I know: Boy Scout. My wife calls me that all the time.
You missed the sentence before it then (and I didn't make it entirely clear). I was his spotter with my binoculars, he didn't use it to spot at all. Only when I put him on a legal buck. I just didn't want that situation (me not hunting to spot for someone else) to happen again. And I wouldn't say have a relaxed attitude, I obviously used some creative control to not type in all caps about that experience or explain my frustration with the situation and how it was discussed the day it happened. I'm not going to curse someone out on his first day big game hunting or threaten to shoot him as others have said they might do. I'm also not going to prevent him from hunting on the only day he could take from his family. I'm going to use it as a teaching opportunity, and put my hunting on the back burner. To each their own
edited*
Post by: Bob33 on August 05, 2016, 02:04:26 PM
I believe some states consider the act brandishing or careless control of the firearm even in hunting applications subject to penalties...WA is one of those states.
RCW 9.41.230
Aiming or discharging firearms, dangerous weapons.
(1) For conduct not amounting to a violation of chapter 9A.36 RCW, any person who:
(a) Aims any firearm, whether loaded or not, at or towards any human being;
(b) Willfully discharges any firearm, air gun, or other weapon, or throws any deadly missile in a public place, or in any place where any person might be endangered thereby. A public place shall not include any location at which firearms are authorized to be lawfully discharged; or
(c) Except as provided in RCW 9.41.185, sets a so-called trap, spring pistol, rifle, or other dangerous weapon,
although no injury results, is guilty of a gross misdemeanor punishable under chapter 9A.20 RCW.
(2) If an injury results from a violation of subsection (1) of this section, the person violating subsection (1) of this section shall be subject to the applicable provisions of chapters 9A.32 and 9A.36 RCW.
http://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9.41.230
Post by: pianoman9701 on August 05, 2016, 02:35:41 PM
one of my hunting partners started big game this year. While he had a nice rifle he didn't yet own bino's and used his scope and it really irked me and our other buddy. We were on private land with no one else to scope and we hunted in a pair with me spotting, but it was still obviously something we wanted to avoid in the future. His birthday came around and we split a pair of leopolds for him and heckled him pretty hard so I expect them to be around his neck every time we hit the field this year. I keep some old junker binos in my truck now just in case I'm in the field and anyone, even a stranger, wants to use a rifle to scope. They can have them, I can keep my cool, and no escalation hopefully.
"...avoid in the future." All due respects, I don't know you or your friends, or where you're hunting, but I have to say that I've rarely heard such a relaxed attitude toward "scoping". Even if you see a deer, you don't put the scope on it until you want to destroy it. Personally, I would have been as upset about that as I would the loss of muzzle control. I would have insisted they stop immediately and whether or not I ever hunt with them would depend on whether they took it to heart. Just my :twocents:. I know: Boy Scout. My wife calls me that all the time.
You missed the sentence before it then (and I didn't make it entirely clear). I was his spotter with my binoculars, he didn't use it to spot at all. Only when I put him on a legal buck. I just didn't want that situation (me not hunting to spot for someone else) to happen again. And I wouldn't say have a relaxed attitude, I obviously used some creative control to not type in all caps about that experience or explain my frustration with the situation and how it was discussed the day it happened. I'm not going to curse someone out on his first day big game hunting or threaten to shoot him as others have said they might do. I'm also not going to prevent him from hunting on the only day he could take from his family. I'm going to use it as a teaching opportunity, and put my hunting on the back burner. To each their own
edited*
You're right, I did miss that. Thanks for the clarification.
Post by: DaveMonti on August 05, 2016, 03:23:05 PM
Lol liberal? Far from it buddy. I love my guns and will stand next to anyone who wants to fight with me the day they try to take them. However, I won't point a gun at you unless I am defending myself or I intend to take your life. That is gun saftey. Don't throw around accusations that you have no idea about it has been a peaceful conversation. We do not need any idiocracy going on here cause somebody wants to be high and mighty. Thanks!I'm with jay on this. I certainly don't condone this behavior, and would intervene if I saw someone doing it, but I think it's highly unlikely that someone will shoot me while "scoping" me. People get shot because they are mistaken for game, not because someone mistakenly pulled the trigger on a loaded gun while the safety is off while scoping someone.:yeah:
Yes, I know it's possible and may even have happened, save me your stories and your "what if" scenarios and your "you're-really-a-liberal-in-disguise-who-wants-more-people-to-die-by-guns-so-you-can-ban-them-forever" and whatever else can escape from under your hot collar because I disagree with you.
While I would yell and probably even take cover, I'd chalk it up to someone being an idiot and I would not get confrontational. I'd protect myself, but if it was obvious that someone was using their scope in lieu of binoculars to scope me, I'm not going to get all upset. I personally think I face higher risk by riding my motorcycle on public roads.
As I said, it's not a safe practice, and to make sure nobody does it, we have to teach everyone that it's a sin akin to actual murder. I get it. I just don't think it's a big deal and it certainly doesn't warrant me getting into a confrontation with a stranger, where the odds of getting shot go up exponentially.
Huntingaddiction,
I am not calling you a liberal. I am saying to other readers who have a different opinion than myself to "save your statements to ME that I'm a liberal" because I disagree with you. Seems when there are differing opinions on some of the forums, some folks get nasty towards those with differing opinions and start calling folks liberal gun haters. I do not think you are a liberal gun hater.
That all being said, if we look at the scenario that occurred (my assumptions next), where the guy was clearly "scoping" you and NOT preparing to shoot you, not mistaking you for game, I personally feel that while it's extremely rude to point a firearm at someone like that, and while I do not condone it, I do not believe I would be upset because the likelihood that the guy had a loaded weapon, with the safety off, and somehow got the gun to mistakenly misfire and actually HIT ME while he was scoping me is extremely low, lower than the likelihood that I die in a motorcycle accident. Therefor, I'd not get highly upset and ream anyone out and get into a potential conflict. I would chalk it up to normal human stupidity, which seems to afflict well over 90% of the people out there, and if I go the chance to have a discussion with him about his actions, I'd explain my point to him about the poor practice he exhibited.
Post by: Bob33 on August 05, 2016, 03:43:23 PM
Yes, it was foggyThe hunters actually had binoculars. Condensation from the fog caused them to be unusable, so they used rifle scopes instead.
http://articles.latimes.com/2008/aug/14/nation/na-hiker14
Post by: jay.sharkbait on August 05, 2016, 03:44:05 PM
Lol liberal? Far from it buddy. I love my guns and will stand next to anyone who wants to fight with me the day they try to take them. However, I won't point a gun at you unless I am defending myself or I intend to take your life. That is gun saftey. Don't throw around accusations that you have no idea about it has been a peaceful conversation. We do not need any idiocracy going on here cause somebody wants to be high and mighty. Thanks!I'm with jay on this. I certainly don't condone this behavior, and would intervene if I saw someone doing it, but I think it's highly unlikely that someone will shoot me while "scoping" me. People get shot because they are mistaken for game, not because someone mistakenly pulled the trigger on a loaded gun while the safety is off while scoping someone.:yeah:
Yes, I know it's possible and may even have happened, save me your stories and your "what if" scenarios and your "you're-really-a-liberal-in-disguise-who-wants-more-people-to-die-by-guns-so-you-can-ban-them-forever" and whatever else can escape from under your hot collar because I disagree with you.
While I would yell and probably even take cover, I'd chalk it up to someone being an idiot and I would not get confrontational. I'd protect myself, but if it was obvious that someone was using their scope in lieu of binoculars to scope me, I'm not going to get all upset. I personally think I face higher risk by riding my motorcycle on public roads.
As I said, it's not a safe practice, and to make sure nobody does it, we have to teach everyone that it's a sin akin to actual murder. I get it. I just don't think it's a big deal and it certainly doesn't warrant me getting into a confrontation with a stranger, where the odds of getting shot go up exponentially.
That all being said, if we look at the scenario that occurred (my assumptions next), where the guy was clearly "scoping" you and NOT preparing to shoot you, not mistaking you for game, I personally feel that while it's extremely rude to point a firearm at someone like that, and while I do not condone it, I do not believe I would be upset because the likelihood that the guy had a loaded weapon, with the safety off, and somehow got the gun to mistakenly misfire and actually HIT ME while he was scoping me is extremely low, lower than the likelihood that I die in a motorcycle accident. Therefor, I'd not get highly upset and ream anyone out and get into a potential conflict. I would chalk it up to normal human stupidity, which seems to afflict well over 90% of the people out there, and if I go the chance to have a discussion with him about his actions, I'd explain my point to him about the poor practice he exhibited.
:yeah:
I think this is a great example of what to do.
I am alarmed at how many people who will escalate the situation and actually start shooting at someone who they think MIGHT be pointing a firearm at them. It is very hard to tell where a firearm is pointed even at as short a distance as 100yd.
And those who want to compare this to someone pointing a firearm at you on the street and at close range........get a grip
Post by: JDHasty on August 05, 2016, 04:09:16 PM
Yes, it was foggyThe hunters actually had binoculars. Condensation from the fog caused them to be unusable, so they used rifle scopes instead.
http://articles.latimes.com/2008/aug/14/nation/na-hiker14
Color me skeptical:
The boys both had rifles with 3X-magnification scopes and both looked through their scopes for “a few minutes” before the younger said, “It’s a bear, it’s a bear,” and, “I’ve got my cross hairs on it,” court documents allege.
http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/teen-charged-with-manslaughter-in-shooting-of-hiker/
Prosecutors say the young hunter was encouraged to fire at the target by his older teen-age brother who also misidentified the hiker as a bear through a riflescope.
http://www.skyvalleychronicle.com/BREAKING-NEWS/TEEN-HUNTER-ON-TRIAL-FOR-WOMAN-S-DEATH-78918
Both had a binocular that was fogged and unusable, but both rifle scopes were not???
Post by: Weatherby92 on August 05, 2016, 04:52:04 PM
Post by: Bob33 on August 05, 2016, 04:53:14 PM
http://www.goskagit.com/news/judge-won-t-dismiss-charge-in-sauk-case/article_e93799c6-897c-5b98-858f-9b18d4c29fbd.htmlYes, it was foggyThe hunters actually had binoculars. Condensation from the fog caused them to be unusable, so they used rifle scopes instead.
http://articles.latimes.com/2008/aug/14/nation/na-hiker14
Color me skeptical:
The boys both had rifles with 3X-magnification scopes and both looked through their scopes for “a few minutes” before the younger said, “It’s a bear, it’s a bear,” and, “I’ve got my cross hairs on it,” court documents allege.
http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/teen-charged-with-manslaughter-in-shooting-of-hiker/
Prosecutors say the young hunter was encouraged to fire at the target by his older teen-age brother who also misidentified the hiker as a bear through a riflescope.
http://www.skyvalleychronicle.com/BREAKING-NEWS/TEEN-HUNTER-ON-TRIAL-FOR-WOMAN-S-DEATH-78918
Both had a binocular that was fogged and unusable, but both rifle scopes were not???
"The attorney said in his opening statement that the boys had tried to use binoculars before they shot, but they were clouded with condensation. Weyrich has said in court the boys violated hunting regulations by not using binoculars."
Post by: JDHasty on August 05, 2016, 07:49:27 PM
http://www.goskagit.com/news/judge-won-t-dismiss-charge-in-sauk-case/article_e93799c6-897c-5b98-858f-9b18d4c29fbd.htmlYes, it was foggyThe hunters actually had binoculars. Condensation from the fog caused them to be unusable, so they used rifle scopes instead.
http://articles.latimes.com/2008/aug/14/nation/na-hiker14
Color me skeptical:
The boys both had rifles with 3X-magnification scopes and both looked through their scopes for “a few minutes” before the younger said, “It’s a bear, it’s a bear,” and, “I’ve got my cross hairs on it,” court documents allege.
http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/teen-charged-with-manslaughter-in-shooting-of-hiker/
Prosecutors say the young hunter was encouraged to fire at the target by his older teen-age brother who also misidentified the hiker as a bear through a riflescope.
http://www.skyvalleychronicle.com/BREAKING-NEWS/TEEN-HUNTER-ON-TRIAL-FOR-WOMAN-S-DEATH-78918
Both had a binocular that was fogged and unusable, but both rifle scopes were not???
"The attorney said in his opening statement that the boys had tried to use binoculars before they shot, but they were clouded with condensation. Weyrich has said in court the boys violated hunting regulations by not using binoculars."
Howson asked each of the investigators if they asked the two hunters if they had binoculars on them, and each investigator said no.
The boy told Walker that both brothers watched the figure through their rifle scopes for several minutes following what they saw as “the outline of a bear.”
A couple minutes is "forever and a day" when you are hunting and see what may be a game animal. Is it not?
The older brother confirmed the sighting as a bear and the younger boy pulled the trigger, Walker recalled.
This leads me to believe that a couple minutes was actually under five seconds from first sighting through the shot being taken. I think it is more likely than not that the first kid saw the "bear" first and when the second kid found the "bear" in his scope and was ready for a backup shot he dropped the green flag.
In the brief filed Thursday, Weyrich says Loftus’ planned testimony is common sense, which does not qualify him for expert testimony.
“It appears that the nature of his testimony would be ... simplistically, because the (boy) really wanted to see a bear, and because the conditions made it difficult to see clearly, that the (boy), in his own mind, thought he was shooting a bear,” Weyrich wrote.
IMHO, the first boy had seen the "bear" with his naked eyes and both had their 3-9 scopes turned all the way down (who outside of your's truly who has a 3 power Leupold kicking around somewhere has a 3 power scope?) in an effort to maximize the the field of view in an environment that makes it hard to get lined up on a target after bring their rifle up and that this took < five seconds total for both. The younger boy got on it first and the second boy, a fraction of a second later whispered "OK, I'm on it" boom. OK, so they both had already "identified the woman as a bear and the younger boy whispered he was on it and when the other boy said: OK, I'm on "it" the younger boy pulled the trigger. The older boy was not IMHO endeavoring to confirm the ID, he was confirming that found the target in his scope and therefore was ready for a followup shot.
I am a binocular user, they are up and down fifty times every five minutes when I am still hunting. I have a Badlands chest binocular pack (four of them) and my binocular is tethered so I can just drop it and it will hang if I don't have time to slip it in.
But the big thing here is they were NOT "scoping" to find game. They screwed the pooch by not confirming with their binocular BEFORE raising their rifles. Yours truly normally hunts from a blind or a tree stand and as such has all the time in the world (like two or three seconds to bring up his binocular first and look to make certain there is not a second animal and a shoot through) and all indications are that this spotting of a "bear" suggests the "bear" was unaware so that gave them all the "time in the world."
Not really "scoping" but still a major screwup. I don't want to come off as a "know-it-all" but I purchase a really good binocular for my kids and give it to them when they turn three. I want their binocular to be a part of them that they feel naked without when in the field. I want it to be a great optical instrument and I want them to take great pride of ownership of it.
My family ownes the optical instruments daddy has bought and they have names like Leica, Swarovski, Vortex, Leupold and Nikon attached to them. Daddy bought some (or had them given to him) long before they were born and they are there for everyone in the family to use. Being totally comfortable and relying on fine optics is something I want them to live. Daddy's mom did a great job of trying to support daddy's interest in the out of doors and provided daddy with what salesmen recommended within a certain price point and daddy is, and will be forever grateful. But what I had still left a lot to be desired. Mom was not competent to make a selection and I ended up with an eight to 20 power Bushnell variable because that is what the salesman said was the best they had at that price, and mom looked to the expert.
Mom was not an expert, but daddy is and daddy has an interest in making the absolute best choice and daddy is also connected and can get real expert advice and then do an independent eval before purchase.
I have done the research and my budget was south of a buck fifty and if nothing else resonates with all of the stuff I post please, at least, give some consideration to making a selection geared towards getting your kids so comfortable with their binocular that it is something they feel naked without.
OK now, the purchase price is only the beginning. From age three through six and a half YOU are going to focus it and hand it back. AND, you are going to let the kids trade with you and use yours and if you choose the 6-30 Leupold Yosemite I recommend the FOV and DOF is going to make them wanting yours a thing of the past real soon. They will be able to see what you are pointing out through THEIRS long before they will be able to be successful through an 8x42 or such. AND they will figure out all on their own that their binocular is better than yours.
I'm talking < a C note here guys. And it will be money well spent. Leupold has been very, very good to daddy, but daddy is not a special pleader for Leupold. Nikon has also been very, very generous over the years. But I did the research before my oldest child turned three and you are encouraged to validate what I am recommending, when I did likewise for nieces and nephews two decades ago it was Baush & Lomb and Nikon who got the nod (and my money).
Please, like I said, if nothing else I have posted, or will ever post, give what I post on this topis some consideration. My seven (and a half) year old is totally comfortable with relying on her binocular today. Her sister just turned three and will look through the wrong end on hers she just got, but make it second nature. Using (relying on) optics is no different than learning a second language. Start them young and it comes naturally.
Post by: coachcw on August 05, 2016, 08:58:23 PM
Post by: Mudman on August 05, 2016, 09:09:31 PM
Post by: DaveMonti on August 05, 2016, 09:23:28 PM
This thread is very informative/alarming on how some "hunters" can be. That being said I honestly think that huntingaddiction did not act out of reason in anyway. This is something not to be taken lightly and will only hurt us with the whole "gun control" issue in the long run if it is allowed/escalates. I take it upon myself to help educate and instruct other younger or new hunters in safe acts and ethical hunting as I know all of you do as well. I feel like I'm preaching to the choir on this forum. I'm not out to look down on new hunters as I am a believer in the saying "you don't know what you don't know", but as long as they passed hunters safety they should know that it isn't in the least bit excepted to scope someone. :twocents:
I want to clarify, I'm only stating what I would do. I'm not saying anyone is "wrong" in their approach (other than those who would drop into a prone position and start firing IN THIS PARTICULAR SITUATION). I'm just saying how I would handle this situation, the risk I see associated with it, and how I have very little faith in the intelligence and common sense of most humans.
I am SURE that the offender now has a memorable impression about scoping someone after huntingaddiction got done with him.
Post by: jmscon on August 05, 2016, 11:28:00 PM
Quote
11. SHOOTER: 33 year-old male VICTIM: 32 year-old male FIREARM: 7mm rifle TYPE: Non-fatal COUNTY: Skamania BLAZE ORANGE: No HUNTER ED GRADUATE: Unknown DATE OF ACCIDENT: 11/5/02 NARRATIVE: The shooter and victim (brothers) were elk hunting when they saw possible elk movement along an old logging road. The victim—who did not have the required elk tag—agreed to enter the forest and try and push the elk towards the other two hunters. The shooter noticed movement (of his brother in camouflage) some 70 yards away, and used the telescopic sight to get a better view. The shooter’s gun discharged, striking his brother just above the collarbone.
CAUSE: Careless handling; victim mistaken for game
This is a great example of why no one should use their scope to do anything except aim to fire!
The fact that so many people are saying it isn't so bad is unbelievable! I'm guessing that those people who say that are doing it themselves.
If you are purposely pointing a gun at someone, whether its ten feet or 250 yards, you better be doing it in self defense. It doesn't matter if it's a handgun or a rifle they both have the same purpose, to kill.
I've taught a few hunter ed classes and the first three rules are muzzle control, muzzle control and muzzle control. The way I have taught is that the only way to fail the field course is to show lack of muzzle control. If it is blatant, your done, I'm taking the dummy firearm out of your hands for the rest of the class.
Treat a gun as if it is always loaded right? Why? "Well, I thought I cleared that round.", "I didn't think it was loaded.", Etc.
Scoping someone is more than careless and, whether you believe it or not, you are putting that persons life in jeopardy!
Read through the incident reports on the right side. Every hunter should read through these, new and old.
http://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/huntered/hunting_incidents.html
Post by: csaaphill on August 06, 2016, 12:41:46 AM
yean and don't think anyone has called you a liberal. You asked how we would handle and that's how. I don't get that upset over it unless they do try and shoot at me. Of which I have been. Up Archery hunting several years ago climbing up the other side of this mountain some bear hunters stop just in front of where my rig was parked. I was on a stump sitting and seen them stop get out and begin spotting the hillside I was on. I had binoculars so could see what they were doing. All of a sudden they began to shoot what looked or seemed like my direction. I had orange on too even though in archery season you don't need it unless it's overlapped I think. I yelled hey I'm here and waved they still shot several times. Don't know if they were pissed I was on that hill side or what but..... :bash: Needless to say I climbed back down and climbed back up the hill where I was parked. they were gone By the time I got back. Thinking they were scaring me out but what ever. In that situation I if I'd of had a gun might have opened back on them just missing them maybe since from my POV they did seem to be shooting at me. But if they'd of only scoped me I'd of stood up waved to let them know I'm not a bear or deer other than that don't think I'd do much. I know I've been scoped to usually from the road bellow when I'm sitting on a hill top and they see something the want to know what it is. I usually as I said stand wave and make sure they're not going to shoot.Lol liberal? Far from it buddy. I love my guns and will stand next to anyone who wants to fight with me the day they try to take them. However, I won't point a gun at you unless I am defending myself or I intend to take your life. That is gun saftey. Don't throw around accusations that you have no idea about it has been a peaceful conversation. We do not need any idiocracy going on here cause somebody wants to be high and mighty. Thanks!I'm with jay on this. I certainly don't condone this behavior, and would intervene if I saw someone doing it, but I think it's highly unlikely that someone will shoot me while "scoping" me. People get shot because they are mistaken for game, not because someone mistakenly pulled the trigger on a loaded gun while the safety is off while scoping someone.:yeah:
Yes, I know it's possible and may even have happened, save me your stories and your "what if" scenarios and your "you're-really-a-liberal-in-disguise-who-wants-more-people-to-die-by-guns-so-you-can-ban-them-forever" and whatever else can escape from under your hot collar because I disagree with you.
While I would yell and probably even take cover, I'd chalk it up to someone being an idiot and I would not get confrontational. I'd protect myself, but if it was obvious that someone was using their scope in lieu of binoculars to scope me, I'm not going to get all upset. I personally think I face higher risk by riding my motorcycle on public roads.
As I said, it's not a safe practice, and to make sure nobody does it, we have to teach everyone that it's a sin akin to actual murder. I get it. I just don't think it's a big deal and it certainly doesn't warrant me getting into a confrontation with a stranger, where the odds of getting shot go up exponentially.
I've even had a 12 year old kid pop off a round at me and my friend once. I believe the state never did do anything with him either so...
We don't condone it either my dad told me as a kid to never do that so from then on I never have. But I think too some of us come from a time when people didn't freak out and not sure on the others but I don't change either. SO yea were not condoning it just saying how we'd deal with it. :twocents:
Post by: DaveMonti on August 06, 2016, 10:37:43 AM
From WDFW:Quote11. SHOOTER: 33 year-old male VICTIM: 32 year-old male FIREARM: 7mm rifle TYPE: Non-fatal COUNTY: Skamania BLAZE ORANGE: No HUNTER ED GRADUATE: Unknown DATE OF ACCIDENT: 11/5/02 NARRATIVE: The shooter and victim (brothers) were elk hunting when they saw possible elk movement along an old logging road. The victim—who did not have the required elk tag—agreed to enter the forest and try and push the elk towards the other two hunters. The shooter noticed movement (of his brother in camouflage) some 70 yards away, and used the telescopic sight to get a better view. The shooter’s gun discharged, striking his brother just above the collarbone.
CAUSE: Careless handling; victim mistaken for game
This is a great example of why no one should use their scope to do anything except aim to fire!
The fact that so many people are saying it isn't so bad is unbelievable! I'm guessing that those people who say that are doing it themselves.
If you are purposely pointing a gun at someone, whether its ten feet or 250 yards, you better be doing it in self defense. It doesn't matter if it's a handgun or a rifle they both have the same purpose, to kill.
I've taught a few hunter ed classes and the first three rules are muzzle control, muzzle control and muzzle control. The way I have taught is that the only way to fail the field course is to show lack of muzzle control. If it is blatant, your done, I'm taking the dummy firearm out of your hands for the rest of the class.
Treat a gun as if it is always loaded right? Why? "Well, I thought I cleared that round.", "I didn't think it was loaded.", Etc.
Scoping someone is more than careless and, whether you believe it or not, you are putting that persons life in jeopardy!
Read through the incident reports on the right side. Every hunter should read through these, new and old.
http://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/huntered/hunting_incidents.html
I don't think ANYONE here has said "It's OK to look at a person through a rifle scope". This particular post is "WHAT WOULD YOU DO IF SOMEONE POINTS A GUN AT YOU". It is not "IS IT OK IN YOUR OPINION TO USE RIFLE SCOPES TO LOOK AT A PERSON".
My way of handling the situation that huntingaddiction found himself in is different than others. That does not mean that I feel it's OK for someone to use a scoped rifle to look at me.
I really wish people would start comprehending what is written. I think we are all in agreement about the severity of the situation. However, how that particular situation is handled varies from "If someone points a gun at me, I'm shooting at them!" to "I'd take care of myself and not get confrontational or escalate the situation."
Can you explain to me how these responses indicate in any way that "That guy pointing a gun at huntingaddiction was a totally safe and accepted practice?"
Post by: elkfins on August 06, 2016, 01:36:58 PM
In 2013, my son and I were deer hunting in GMU 336. The area was cut and re-planted about 15 - 20 years ago. We were standing on a knoll in the middle of the cut watching a draw and the opposite hillside when we saw 8 or 9 deer single file up the opposite hillside about 200 yards away. I recognized the last deer as a buck and by my naked eye, I was about 90% certain it was a legal 3pt. I brought my rifle up and confirmed he was legal then watched the buck as he walked for about 20 yards up the hill following the does waiting for him to come to an open spot where I could get a clear shot... maybe 20 seconds or so. Once he reached the spot I wanted, I shot and knocked him down.
As we crossed the draw, I saw 2 hunters (Father and his son) coming down towards the fallen buck and were standing about 20 yards away when my son and I reached the buck.
They congratulated me on a good shot and then started to tell me that they were watching me the whole time and were sitting on the hillside about 50 yards above the deer but did not know they were there as the deer were below a small rise and out of their view. I never saw them until I was approaching the downed buck. They were certain at the time I was watching the buck through my scope that I was looking at them through my scope and were discussing whether to confront me about it or not up to the point that I shot. After the shot, the remaining deer ran up the hill towards them and they realized I was not scoping them.
Had they been of mind to immediately shoot at me because they "thought" I was scoping them, I may not be alive today. So, if you think someone is scoping you, make damn certain they are a threat and intend you harm before you just react in an aggressive manner. Don't let your anger at being scoped by another cause you to disregard your common sense.
Post by: pawpaw1934 on August 06, 2016, 02:01:31 PM
Post by: jmscon on August 06, 2016, 02:22:23 PM
I wouldn't say anything.can I ask why? I think this is a good conversation to have. Accidents happen because people don't think even though they know better. Honestly the coversation needs to happen because it is NEVER ok to pint a gun at somebody with the exception of defending yourself. So sorry I am going to say something. This is unacceptable behavior and we should not stay quiet about.
Maybe wave and see if they wave back.
Continue on hunt.
Not post on HUNTWA
but that's just me......................
I'm used to having rifles pointed at me and I don't think being scoped is that big of deal.
I certainly wouldn't flip out over it.
Post by: jay.sharkbait on August 06, 2016, 03:00:10 PM
Davemonti, this is what I was talking about.I wouldn't say anything.can I ask why? I think this is a good conversation to have. Accidents happen because people don't think even though they know better. Honestly the coversation needs to happen because it is NEVER ok to pint a gun at somebody with the exception of defending yourself. So sorry I am going to say something. This is unacceptable behavior and we should not stay quiet about.
Maybe wave and see if they wave back.
Continue on hunt.
Not post on HUNTWA
but that's just me......................
I'm used to having rifles pointed at me and I don't think being scoped is that big of deal.
I certainly wouldn't flip out over it.
So the OP asks for input on what you (I) would do if someone pointed a rifle at me in a hunting environment and I answered.
I even clarified why I felt that way.
Never at any point did I say that I have scoped anyone or said it was ok for others to do it.
Sorry you don't like it, but it is my input on the matter.
Post by: csaaphill on August 06, 2016, 08:41:16 PM
For those of you who are advocating or stating that you would shoot back, consider this true story.:yeah:
In 2013, my son and I were deer hunting in GMU 336. The area was cut and re-planted about 15 - 20 years ago. We were standing on a knoll in the middle of the cut watching a draw and the opposite hillside when we saw 8 or 9 deer single file up the opposite hillside about 200 yards away. I recognized the last deer as a buck and by my naked eye, I was about 90% certain it was a legal 3pt. I brought my rifle up and confirmed he was legal then watched the buck as he walked for about 20 yards up the hill following the does waiting for him to come to an open spot where I could get a clear shot... maybe 20 seconds or so. Once he reached the spot I wanted, I shot and knocked him down.
As we crossed the draw, I saw 2 hunters (Father and his son) coming down towards the fallen buck and were standing about 20 yards away when my son and I reached the buck.
They congratulated me on a good shot and then started to tell me that they were watching me the whole time and were sitting on the hillside about 50 yards above the deer but did not know they were there as the deer were below a small rise and out of their view. I never saw them until I was approaching the downed buck. They were certain at the time I was watching the buck through my scope that I was looking at them through my scope and were discussing whether to confront me about it or not up to the point that I shot. After the shot, the remaining deer ran up the hill towards them and they realized I was not scoping them.
Had they been of mind to immediately shoot at me because they "thought" I was scoping them, I may not be alive today. So, if you think someone is scoping you, make damn certain they are a threat and intend you harm before you just react in an aggressive manner. Don't let your anger at being scoped by another cause you to disregard your common sense.
and from what I can tell, he wasn't condoning the act he was just saying.
Post by: jmscon on August 06, 2016, 09:10:59 PM
Davemonti, this is what I was talking about.I wouldn't say anything.can I ask why? I think this is a good conversation to have. Accidents happen because people don't think even though they know better. Honestly the coversation needs to happen because it is NEVER ok to pint a gun at somebody with the exception of defending yourself. So sorry I am going to say something. This is unacceptable behavior and we should not stay quiet about.
Maybe wave and see if they wave back.
Continue on hunt.
Not post on HUNTWA
but that's just me......................
I'm used to having rifles pointed at me and I don't think being scoped is that big of deal.
I certainly wouldn't flip out over it.
So the OP asks for input on what you (I) would do if someone pointed a rifle at me in a hunting environment and I answered.
I even clarified why I felt that way.
Never at any point did I say that I have scoped anyone or said it was ok for others to do it.
Sorry you don't like it, but it is my input on the matter.
Fair enough.
I feel that any time a person points a gun at another person it's pretty serious! The OP asked what would you do but I still think it should be reiterated how serious this should be taken.
Post by: huntingaddiction on August 07, 2016, 09:40:35 AM
Post by: OutHouse on August 17, 2016, 09:48:23 AM
Post by: crowinghen on August 17, 2016, 10:26:55 AM
We have had this discussion in the past. What is really disturbing is there are members on this site, no doubt some have read this thread, that find nothing wrong with using their scope this way. :mor:
Exactly! I've been scoped before , scared the you know what outta me. Some punk going- hey I think it's a girl
I would have never imagined that people do that-- it's a fricking gun!
Post by: EmeraldBullet on August 17, 2016, 10:36:21 AM
Post by: follow maggie on August 19, 2016, 11:03:50 PM
Post by: jmscon on August 19, 2016, 11:13:21 PM