Post by: sakoshooter on December 23, 2016, 09:15:46 PM
I think "OUR" money could be better spent.
And, who gives the agency permission for spending like this I wonder.
Post by: JimmyHoffa on December 23, 2016, 09:21:25 PM
Post by: Bob33 on December 23, 2016, 09:24:32 PM
Post by: Crunchy on December 23, 2016, 09:35:41 PM
Post by: bigtex on December 23, 2016, 09:38:19 PM
Posted: Friday, December 16, 2016 10:38 pm
By Natalie Johnson / njohnson@chronline.com | 2 comments
City of Centralia bulldozers removed about 21 tons of scrap metal, garbage and other debris Friday from an area formerly containing about four separate homeless encampments at the end of West Bridge Street.
The effort was part of continuing cleanup from a fire at a camp in the area in early November, said Centralia City Attorney Shannon Murphy-Olson.
“We’ve been working (with) WDFW, Department of Fish and Wildlife. It’s actually their property,” she said. “It was a pretty big disaster.”
In November, the Riverside Fire Authority estimated the brush fire was caused by a warming fire that got out of control. No burn restrictions were in effect at the time. The fire destroyed the contents of a campsite.
The WDFW will reimburse the city for the work to clean up the site, Murphy-Olson said.
City code enforcement officer Neil Hoium informed the homeless residents of the area, who were still living there until very recently, that the area would be bulldozed and cleaned out on Friday, she said.
“There was four main little camps down there and I would say that each camp was probably … about 20 feet by 30 feet,” said Kim Ashmore, Centralia’s street, stormwater and fleet manager, who was the city’s point of contact for the project. “The area looks bigger than it is.”
City crews filled several large dumpsters with trash and debris spread throughout the area.
“There was all kinds of metal and bike frames and left-over things from the fire. They were pretty well entrenched down there,” Murphy-Olson said.
Crews finished all of the work Friday, Ashmore said. On Monday, the city will spread straw over the disturbed land. In the spring, crews will spread grass seeds and other plants.
“That’s just kind of a natural area so we want it to remain that way,” Ashmore said. “We’re going to be good stewards of the property.”
Post by: huntnphool on December 23, 2016, 10:08:54 PM
Post by: quarterstaff on December 24, 2016, 07:07:35 PM
Post by: sakoshooter on December 24, 2016, 07:17:19 PM
Post by: bigtex on December 24, 2016, 07:21:25 PM
So what happened to anti littering laws? You know the signs that say litter and it will hurt.What about them?
Post by: yum tag soup on December 24, 2016, 07:23:48 PM
The state should come up with a new license plate to fund the homeless, perhaps one with a pic of "the jungle" or maybe one with a bag lady pushing a shopping cart, that way liberals could proudly display their support on the back of their Prius and Subarus.beautiful! Haven't read the whole thread but shouldn't everyone that voted Democrat be paying for things like this in a just world?
Post by: Humptulips on December 24, 2016, 07:29:17 PM
The state should come up with a new license plate to fund the homeless, perhaps one with a pic of "the jungle" or maybe one with a bag lady pushing a shopping cart, that way liberals could proudly display their support on the back of their Prius and Subarus.
I would buy that license if it had a picture of a bus ticket to California on it.
Post by: rtspring on December 24, 2016, 07:43:48 PM
Bout done in Wa! Way better places to hunt.
Post by: bigtex on December 24, 2016, 07:54:10 PM
Until "WE" stop buying into their BS they will continue to lie and do shady crap behind our backs.How is this shady? Who do you think pays for garbage service on WDFW lands? Pays for the spent shell casings left on WDFW lands to be picked up after people target shoot? It's WDFW. There's the whole WDFW lands program funded in part by the Discover Pass which helps fund garbage removal.
Bout done in Wa! Way better places to hunt.
Post by: hunter399 on December 24, 2016, 09:20:17 PM
Post by: Oh Mah on December 24, 2016, 11:52:14 PM
who do we think is paying/well make the litterer pay.you know in jail or community service like it used to be.I say used to be because courts don't do it any more,It was said to be unfair treatment.So back to the liberals.make the groups that support this way of life pay for it.as soon as they made welfare give a better less noticeable card for the recipients i new it was gonna get real bad. OH BUY THE WAY MERRY CHRISTMAS TO ALL MY HUNTING, FISHING, AND OUTDOOR ENTHUSIASTS.Until "WE" stop buying into their BS they will continue to lie and do shady crap behind our backs.How is this shady? Who do you think pays for garbage service on WDFW lands? Pays for the spent shell casings left on WDFW lands to be picked up after people target shoot? It's WDFW. There's the whole WDFW lands program funded in part by the Discover Pass which helps fund garbage removal.
Bout done in Wa! Way better places to hunt.
Post by: bigtex on December 25, 2016, 05:48:12 PM
WA has some of the toughest littering laws in the US. WA's littering law penalties are as follows:who do we think is paying/well make the litterer pay.you know in jail or community service like it used to be.I say used to be because courts don't do it any more,It was said to be unfair treatment.So back to the liberals.make the groups that support this way of life pay for it.as soon as they made welfare give a better less noticeable card for the recipients i new it was gonna get real bad.Until "WE" stop buying into their BS they will continue to lie and do shady crap behind our backs.How is this shady? Who do you think pays for garbage service on WDFW lands? Pays for the spent shell casings left on WDFW lands to be picked up after people target shoot? It's WDFW. There's the whole WDFW lands program funded in part by the Discover Pass which helps fund garbage removal.
Bout done in Wa! Way better places to hunt.
Under a foot its a class 3 infraction with a $103 fine
Litter "potentially dangerous litter" such as glass, lit cigarettes, nails, etc. it's a class 1 civil infraction with a $1,025 fine
Litter over a foot your looking at a misdemeanor, up to a $1,000 fine and 90 days in jail, plus cleanup costs.
Over a cubic yard your looking at a gross misdemeanor up to a $5,000 fine and a year in jail, plus cleanup costs.
The two infractions are 'tickets' the other two are crimes, and that is where the problem is. In order to prosecute a criminal offense in WA you must have a mandatory court appearance and the prosecutor must actually prosecute the case. The prosecutor who would handle your misdemeanor littering case also would handle the DUI, domestic assault, and petty theft case. Out of those do you think they'll pick the criminal littering charge as the one to prosecute? Of course not. This is the same reason why fish and wildlife criminal offenses are not being filed by the prosecutor.
Quite simply there is just too few prosecutors working in our county prosecutor's office. When everyone talks about funding law enforcement to "get though on crime" they fund the cops but not the prosecutors. I'd take a funding increase for prosecutors over a funding increase for officers almost any day, because without a prosecutor your almost worthless as an officer.
Post by: Bofire on December 25, 2016, 06:11:29 PM
Carl
Post by: Lincoln4 on December 25, 2016, 07:17:48 PM
WA has some of the toughest littering laws in the US. WA's littering law penalties are as follows:who do we think is paying/well make the litterer pay.you know in jail or community service like it used to be.I say used to be because courts don't do it any more,It was said to be unfair treatment.So back to the liberals.make the groups that support this way of life pay for it.as soon as they made welfare give a better less noticeable card for the recipients i new it was gonna get real bad.Until "WE" stop buying into their BS they will continue to lie and do shady crap behind our backs.How is this shady? Who do you think pays for garbage service on WDFW lands? Pays for the spent shell casings left on WDFW lands to be picked up after people target shoot? It's WDFW. There's the whole WDFW lands program funded in part by the Discover Pass which helps fund garbage removal.
Bout done in Wa! Way better places to hunt.
Under a foot its a class 3 infraction with a $103 fine
Litter "potentially dangerous litter" such as glass, lit cigarettes, nails, etc. it's a class 1 civil infraction with a $1,025 fine
Litter over a foot your looking at a misdemeanor, up to a $1,000 fine and 90 days in jail, plus cleanup costs.
Over a cubic yard your looking at a gross misdemeanor up to a $5,000 fine and a year in jail, plus cleanup costs.
The two infractions are 'tickets' the other two are crimes, and that is where the problem is. In order to prosecute a criminal offense in WA you must have a mandatory court appearance and the prosecutor must actually prosecute the case. The prosecutor who would handle your misdemeanor littering case also would handle the DUI, domestic assault, and petty theft case. Out of those do you think they'll pick the criminal littering charge as the one to prosecute? Of course not. This is the same reason why fish and wildlife criminal offenses are not being filed by the prosecutor.
Quite simply there is just too few prosecutors working in our county prosecutor's office. When everyone talks about funding law enforcement to "get though on crime" they fund the cops but not the prosecutors. I'd take a funding increase for prosecutors over a funding increase for officers almost any day, because without a prosecutor your almost worthless as an officer.
Prosecutors and Corrections...
Post by: Special T on December 25, 2016, 08:36:09 PM
Post by: hunter399 on December 25, 2016, 09:15:01 PM
Post by: Oh Mah on December 25, 2016, 10:21:32 PM
Chain gang them in the park till it's clean,little community service not gonna hurtyep,like it used to be before the libs took over and started to think they don't have anything to talke so let them do whatever.There is always a way to make them pay,as long as you don't have to give them the comforts.
Post by: bigtex on December 26, 2016, 08:21:05 AM
That still requires a prosecutor to take the case. The issue here isn't the penalty, it's the lack of prosecutors in WA.Chain gang them in the park till it's clean,little community service not gonna hurtyep,like it used to be before the libs took over and started to think they don't have anything to talke so let them do whatever.There is always a way to make them pay,as long as you don't have to give them the comforts.
Post by: Romeo 2-6 on December 26, 2016, 09:02:07 AM
Great point.WA has some of the toughest littering laws in the US. WA's littering law penalties are as follows:who do we think is paying/well make the litterer pay.you know in jail or community service like it used to be.I say used to be because courts don't do it any more,It was said to be unfair treatment.So back to the liberals.make the groups that support this way of life pay for it.as soon as they made welfare give a better less noticeable card for the recipients i new it was gonna get real bad.Until "WE" stop buying into their BS they will continue to lie and do shady crap behind our backs.How is this shady? Who do you think pays for garbage service on WDFW lands? Pays for the spent shell casings left on WDFW lands to be picked up after people target shoot? It's WDFW. There's the whole WDFW lands program funded in part by the Discover Pass which helps fund garbage removal.
Bout done in Wa! Way better places to hunt.
Under a foot its a class 3 infraction with a $103 fine
Litter "potentially dangerous litter" such as glass, lit cigarettes, nails, etc. it's a class 1 civil infraction with a $1,025 fine
Litter over a foot your looking at a misdemeanor, up to a $1,000 fine and 90 days in jail, plus cleanup costs.
Over a cubic yard your looking at a gross misdemeanor up to a $5,000 fine and a year in jail, plus cleanup costs.
The two infractions are 'tickets' the other two are crimes, and that is where the problem is. In order to prosecute a criminal offense in WA you must have a mandatory court appearance and the prosecutor must actually prosecute the case. The prosecutor who would handle your misdemeanor littering case also would handle the DUI, domestic assault, and petty theft case. Out of those do you think they'll pick the criminal littering charge as the one to prosecute? Of course not. This is the same reason why fish and wildlife criminal offenses are not being filed by the prosecutor.
Quite simply there is just too few prosecutors working in our county prosecutor's office. When everyone talks about funding law enforcement to "get though on crime" they fund the cops but not the prosecutors. I'd take a funding increase for prosecutors over a funding increase for officers almost any day, because without a prosecutor your almost worthless as an officer.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: quarterstaff on December 26, 2016, 09:49:31 AM
So what happened to anti littering laws? You know the signs that say litter and it will hurt.What about them?
sounds like a much worse case of littering than throwing a starbucks cup out of your prius.
Post by: boneaddict on December 26, 2016, 10:12:19 AM
Post by: fireweed on December 26, 2016, 10:59:51 AM
WDFW lands on the west side seem to be posted no camping and even no overnight parking. I stopped one night at a WDFW land that I've stayed at before with my camper to go fishing early the next morning. The land was now prolifically posted no camping and no overnight parking by WDFW. This is despite the fact that WDFW land and water access sites are supposed to allow limited camping with a Discover Pass. I had to leave at nearly midnight to find some state land. So it appears the WDFW is keeping legal and licenses hunters/anglers and Discover Pass holders from camping as legally allowed to do, and letting others "live" on the land for extended periods of time, all the while breaking numerous laws.
Basackwards
Post by: Special T on December 26, 2016, 12:55:37 PM
Wonder why the homeless weren't kicked off for trespassing earlier. I'm sure they didn't have a Discover Pass either.You have something to loose if you don't follow the rules. There is no way to enforce rules against homeless that will have an effect. More prosecutors won't solve the problem. You either fine people or jail them to change behavior. Bums have no $to take, and it costs too much to jail them. We either need to put these people in institutions or Institute some kind of corporal punishment system. I favor good old fashioned Canning like the people in Singapore use.
WDFW lands on the west side seem to be posted no camping and even no overnight parking. I stopped one night at a WDFW land that I've stayed at before with my camper to go fishing early the next morning. The land was now prolifically posted no camping and no overnight parking by WDFW. This is despite the fact that WDFW land and water access sites are supposed to allow limited camping with a Discover Pass. I had to leave at nearly midnight to find some state land. So it appears the WDFW is keeping legal and licenses hunters/anglers and Discover Pass holders from camping as legally allowed to do, and letting others "live" on the land for extended periods of time, all the while breaking numerous laws.
Basackwards
Post by: pianoman9701 on December 26, 2016, 01:27:45 PM
Until "WE" stop buying into their BS they will continue to lie and do shady crap behind our backs.
Bout done in Wa! Way better places to hunt.
If you owned land and a homeless camp needed to be removed from it, who do you think would be responsible for the bill?
Post by: bigtex on December 26, 2016, 05:01:29 PM
WDFW lands on the west side seem to be posted no camping and even no overnight parking. I stopped one night at a WDFW land that I've stayed at before with my camper to go fishing early the next morning. The land was now prolifically posted no camping and no overnight parking by WDFW. This is despite the fact that WDFW land and water access sites are supposed to allow limited camping with a Discover Pass. I had to leave at nearly midnight to find some state land. So it appears the WDFW is keeping legal and licenses hunters/anglers and Discover Pass holders from camping as legally allowed to do, and letting others "live" on the land for extended periods of time, all the while breaking numerous laws.The Discover Pass laws have nothing to do with camping on WDFW land. In fact, the only time the word camping is listed in the Discover Pass law is when it has to do with State Parks. If you have a camping permit for a State Park you don't need it a DP for that park, as soon as you hit DNR or WDFW land you need the pass.
Camping on WDFW lands is regulated by WAC 232-13-060 & 232-13-150 which basically says you can camp on WDFW land unless the agency closes the area to camping, you can only camp for 21 days, and you can't establish or occupy a "residence camp"
Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 05:28:51 PM
I disagree,Its not a lack of anything but the will to do it against the liberals of this state.If i went out and littered and i refused to pay the fine as you put it,The state would have no problem with getting a prosecutor to prosecute me. PERIOD.That still requires a prosecutor to take the case. The issue here isn't the penalty, it's the lack of prosecutors in WA.Chain gang them in the park till it's clean,little community service not gonna hurtyep,like it used to be before the libs took over and started to think they don't have anything to talke so let them do whatever.There is always a way to make them pay,as long as you don't have to give them the comforts.
Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 05:30:57 PM
Post by: EmeraldBullet on December 26, 2016, 05:40:55 PM
Post by: bigtex on December 26, 2016, 05:42:01 PM
If you went out and littered, lets say a garbage full of wrapping paper ($103 infraction) or a lit cigarette ($1,025 infraction) and you didn't pay it realistically nothing would happen. Technically the county could push the ticket to collections but its up to the county and collections. Theoretically a prosecutor could charge you with the crime of failing to pay a ticket, but I guarantee if you call your prosecutor and ask them the last time they filed charges on someone for failing to pay an infraction they would probably laugh at you.I disagree,Its not a lack of anything but the will to do it against the liberals of this state.If i went out and littered and i refused to pay the fine as you put it,The state would have no problem with getting a prosecutor to prosecute me. PERIOD.That still requires a prosecutor to take the case. The issue here isn't the penalty, it's the lack of prosecutors in WA.Chain gang them in the park till it's clean,little community service not gonna hurtyep,like it used to be before the libs took over and started to think they don't have anything to talke so let them do whatever.There is always a way to make them pay,as long as you don't have to give them the comforts.
If you fail to pay a traffic infraction your license is suspended.
Fail to pay a fish and wildlife infraction, it counts towards a fish and wildlife conviction for hunting and fishing license suspension.
Fail to pay any other 'infraction' it may get pushed to collections. It's not a crime so a warrant can't be issued for your arrest.
Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 05:47:12 PM
So what are these homeless people supposed to do? Where are they supposed to go? Many of them would be willing to work if you'd hire them....No takers?I'M NOT A POLITICALLY CORRECT PERSON,They can pound sand for all i care.There's work out there but its being done by the illegals that the same people are keeping here so to answer you,They can go live with all the liberals that help keep them where they are in society.DOWN AND IN NEED OF THEM TO CARE FOR THEM.
HOWS THAT FOR YOU?
Post by: olyguy79 on December 26, 2016, 05:51:21 PM
Bigtex is correct. Seems to be a lot of paranoia in here.If you went out and littered, lets say a garbage full of wrapping paper ($103 infraction) or a lit cigarette ($1,025 infraction) and you didn't pay it realistically nothing would happen. Technically the county could push the ticket to collections but its up to the county and collections. Theoretically a prosecutor could charge you with the crime of failing to pay a ticket, but I guarantee if you call your prosecutor and ask them the last time they filed charges on someone for failing to pay an infraction they would probably laugh at you.I disagree,Its not a lack of anything but the will to do it against the liberals of this state.If i went out and littered and i refused to pay the fine as you put it,The state would have no problem with getting a prosecutor to prosecute me. PERIOD.That still requires a prosecutor to take the case. The issue here isn't the penalty, it's the lack of prosecutors in WA.Chain gang them in the park till it's clean,little community service not gonna hurtyep,like it used to be before the libs took over and started to think they don't have anything to talke so let them do whatever.There is always a way to make them pay,as long as you don't have to give them the comforts.
If you fail to pay a traffic infraction your license is suspended.
Fail to pay a fish and wildlife infraction, it counts towards a fish and wildlife conviction for hunting and fishing license suspension.
Fail to pay any other 'infraction' it may get pushed to collections. It's not a crime so a warrant can't be issued for your arrest.
The legislature has not given the justice system any practical way of going after people who fail to pay what are known as 'civil infractions'. Examples are several littering statutes already mentioned, drinking in public, and smoking in public.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: olyguy79 on December 26, 2016, 05:52:46 PM
Good post Bigtex. Frustrating!:yeah:
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Post by: EmeraldBullet on December 26, 2016, 05:56:02 PM
So what are these homeless people supposed to do? Where are they supposed to go? Many of them would be willing to work if you'd hire them....No takers?I'M NOT A POLITICALLY CORRECT PERSON,They can pound sand for all i care.There's work out there but its being done by the illegals that the same people are keeping here so to answer you,They can go live with all the liberals that help keep them where they are in society.DOWN AND IN NEED OF THEM TO CARE FOR THEM.
HOWS THAT FOR YOU?
LOL. So you offer no solution. I agree that the liberal solution keeps them down and doesn't offer any real help. You're just as bad as a liberal. How's that for you?
The homeless are still people. They deserve some degree of decency. If you don't like the litter they create why not volunteer to help clean it up? Either do something to fix the problem or you are enabling the liberals to justify spending our tax dollars to do it.
Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 06:01:48 PM
SHOW ME LIBERALS THAT HAVE THESE IDEALS.I DO VOLUNTEER THANK YOU.
THIS IS ALL DONE BY U.S LIBERALS AND THE U.N.
Post by: hunter399 on December 26, 2016, 06:11:36 PM
Post by: bigtex on December 26, 2016, 06:13:33 PM
:yeah:Until "WE" stop buying into their BS they will continue to lie and do shady crap behind our backs.
Bout done in Wa! Way better places to hunt.
If you owned land and a homeless camp needed to be removed from it, who do you think would be responsible for the bill?
Expense falls on the landowner. Even if the offender is caught and convicted it is up to the judge to decide if they should pay restitution for clean up costs.
Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 06:18:34 PM
(a decent person would pick up after themselves when they left),From where i see it the homeless adult is homeless because of the choices made by them.DRUGS AND OTHER CRIMES.I am a vet and i cannot see in any way that a vet without being an addict or other type of criminal is homeless.
Post by: hunter399 on December 26, 2016, 06:21:31 PM
Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 06:22:18 PM
Post by: EmeraldBullet on December 26, 2016, 06:34:01 PM
Like I said before, I agree with you that the liberals are a big part of the problem. But doing nothing is not a solution. If you see a problem do something directly to fix it, volunteer. Was you post in all caps supposed to be you yelling at me? LOL
Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 06:41:26 PM
Post by: EmeraldBullet on December 26, 2016, 06:44:40 PM
BTW, I get a kick out of your signature, "Boss of the woods" What a complete joke.
Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 06:50:58 PM
Everyone has family so that wont fly.IF YOU DONT HAVE THE MEANS TO PAY YOU CAN GET THE HELP TO PAY IT IF THESE CIRCUMSTANCES ARE MET BUT LIKE I SAID THESE ARE FAR AND FEW BECAUSE IN THE REAL WORLD THESE PEOPLE YOU SPEAK OF ARE NOT HOMELESS UNLESS THEY ARE LIKE I SAID EARLIER IN POSTS.DRUGGIES OR CRIMINALS
Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 06:53:54 PM
You can't just go live in one of those places if you are disabled, you have to be able to pay for it. Anyone could become homeless with the wrong circumstances. I hope it doesn't happen to you Oh Mah, but I think you would learn something if it did. Would you like to meet some of these people?I GUESS YOU DONT KNOW WHAT OH MAH IS!
BTW, I get a kick out of your signature, "Boss of the woods" What a complete joke.
Post by: bigtex on December 26, 2016, 07:30:28 PM
You don't have to put everything in capital letters to try and make your point :twocents:You can't just go live in one of those places if you are disabled, you have to be able to pay for it. Anyone could become homeless with the wrong circumstances. I hope it doesn't happen to you Oh Mah, but I think you would learn something if it did. Would you like to meet some of these people?I GUESS YOU DONT KNOW WHAT OH MAH IS!
BTW, I get a kick out of your signature, "Boss of the woods" What a complete joke.
Post by: EmeraldBullet on December 26, 2016, 07:42:36 PM
Post by: lewy on December 26, 2016, 07:48:29 PM
Post by: EmeraldBullet on December 26, 2016, 07:55:16 PM
Post by: lewy on December 26, 2016, 07:57:20 PM
Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 07:58:26 PM
sometimes it gets stuck on and im not gonna go back and retype the whole thing just to appease the the grammar police.Take me serious or not i don't care,You don't want to take off the blinders that's on you.BigTex I respect what your saying but quit with the excuses for the WDFW they could help in some ways.Why are the people allowed there to begin with while breaking rules they should be removed before the mess gets carried away Thats why we have the PUBLIC CONDUCT RULES FOR THE W>D>F>W isn't it?.There is no rational excuse for any of it.me going off in other tangents well just so you know because i feel it escapes you,They are all connected.TO LIBERAL ways of thinking.You don't have to put everything in capital letters to try and make your point :twocents:You can't just go live in one of those places if you are disabled, you have to be able to pay for it. Anyone could become homeless with the wrong circumstances. I hope it doesn't happen to you Oh Mah, but I think you would learn something if it did. Would you like to meet some of these people?I GUESS YOU DONT KNOW WHAT OH MAH IS!
BTW, I get a kick out of your signature, "Boss of the woods" What a complete joke.
Post by: EmeraldBullet on December 26, 2016, 08:01:36 PM
Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 08:05:01 PM
yep very liberal
Post by: lewy on December 26, 2016, 08:09:00 PM
Post by: bigtex on December 26, 2016, 08:11:57 PM
Yes there are public conduct rules for WDFW lands but for most of them, including the residency/camping rules, they are infractions so you cant arrest them for the violation, all you can do is write a ticket. So what do you do? Write them a ticket everyday which they probably wont pay and there's no ramification for that?sometimes it gets stuck on and im not gonna go back and retype the whole thing just to appease the the grammar police.Take me serious or not i don't care,You don't want to take off the blinders that's on you.BigTex I respect what your saying but quit with the excuses for the WDFW they could help in some ways.Why are the people allowed there to begin with while breaking rules they should be removed before the mess gets carried away Thats why we have the PUBLIC CONDUCT RULES FOR THE W>D>F>W isn't it?.There is no rational excuse for any of it.me going off in other tangents well just so you know because i feel it escapes you,They are all connected.TO LIBERAL ways of thinking.You don't have to put everything in capital letters to try and make your point :twocents:You can't just go live in one of those places if you are disabled, you have to be able to pay for it. Anyone could become homeless with the wrong circumstances. I hope it doesn't happen to you Oh Mah, but I think you would learn something if it did. Would you like to meet some of these people?I GUESS YOU DONT KNOW WHAT OH MAH IS!
BTW, I get a kick out of your signature, "Boss of the woods" What a complete joke.
If you didn't know, I am in law enforcement so this is the stuff I deal with day in and day out. We can't arrest for infractions, heck we realistically cant arrest for many crimes anymore because jails are full and if we did they'd be released before I even pulled out of the sallyport.
Post by: EmeraldBullet on December 26, 2016, 08:13:32 PM
Though you may think you are being conservative, your values are based in a very liberal ideology. Your lack of compassion for others, your indesire to be hands on in volunteering, your dependence on the government to fix the issue for you.
I will ask you again because you said "Show me one decent homeless person", will you like to meet some? I would be happy to introduce you to them.
Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 08:16:16 PM
sorry but according to RCW 77.15.230 any and all violations of any signs is in fact a misdemeanor.I take that as littering in these areas and any illegal drug use should fall under this.Yes there are public conduct rules for WDFW lands but for most of them, including the residency/camping rules, they are infractions so you cant arrest them for the violation, all you can do is write a ticket. So what do you do? Write them a ticket everyday which they probably wont pay and there's no ramification for that?sometimes it gets stuck on and im not gonna go back and retype the whole thing just to appease the the grammar police.Take me serious or not i don't care,You don't want to take off the blinders that's on you.BigTex I respect what your saying but quit with the excuses for the WDFW they could help in some ways.Why are the people allowed there to begin with while breaking rules they should be removed before the mess gets carried away Thats why we have the PUBLIC CONDUCT RULES FOR THE W>D>F>W isn't it?.There is no rational excuse for any of it.me going off in other tangents well just so you know because i feel it escapes you,They are all connected.TO LIBERAL ways of thinking.You don't have to put everything in capital letters to try and make your point :twocents:You can't just go live in one of those places if you are disabled, you have to be able to pay for it. Anyone could become homeless with the wrong circumstances. I hope it doesn't happen to you Oh Mah, but I think you would learn something if it did. Would you like to meet some of these people?I GUESS YOU DONT KNOW WHAT OH MAH IS!
BTW, I get a kick out of your signature, "Boss of the woods" What a complete joke.
If you didn't know, I am in law enforcement so this is the stuff I deal with day in and day out. We can't arrest for infractions, heck we realistically cant arrest for many crimes anymore because jails are full and if we did they'd be released before I even pulled out of the sallyport.
Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 08:17:38 PM
@Oh MahI volunteer all the time,Can't you read?
Though you may think you are being conservative, your values are based in a very liberal ideology. Your lack of compassion for others, your indesire to be hands on in volunteering, your dependence on the government to fix the issue for you.
I will ask you again because you said "Show me one decent homeless person", will you like to meet some? I would be happy to introduce you to them.
Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 08:19:47 PM
Post by: bigtex on December 26, 2016, 08:24:02 PM
No.sorry but according to RCW 77.15.230 any and all violations of any signs is in fact a misdemeanor.I take that as littering in these areas and any illegal drug use should fall under this.Yes there are public conduct rules for WDFW lands but for most of them, including the residency/camping rules, they are infractions so you cant arrest them for the violation, all you can do is write a ticket. So what do you do? Write them a ticket everyday which they probably wont pay and there's no ramification for that?sometimes it gets stuck on and im not gonna go back and retype the whole thing just to appease the the grammar police.Take me serious or not i don't care,You don't want to take off the blinders that's on you.BigTex I respect what your saying but quit with the excuses for the WDFW they could help in some ways.Why are the people allowed there to begin with while breaking rules they should be removed before the mess gets carried away Thats why we have the PUBLIC CONDUCT RULES FOR THE W>D>F>W isn't it?.There is no rational excuse for any of it.me going off in other tangents well just so you know because i feel it escapes you,They are all connected.TO LIBERAL ways of thinking.You don't have to put everything in capital letters to try and make your point :twocents:You can't just go live in one of those places if you are disabled, you have to be able to pay for it. Anyone could become homeless with the wrong circumstances. I hope it doesn't happen to you Oh Mah, but I think you would learn something if it did. Would you like to meet some of these people?I GUESS YOU DONT KNOW WHAT OH MAH IS!
BTW, I get a kick out of your signature, "Boss of the woods" What a complete joke.
If you didn't know, I am in law enforcement so this is the stuff I deal with day in and day out. We can't arrest for infractions, heck we realistically cant arrest for many crimes anymore because jails are full and if we did they'd be released before I even pulled out of the sallyport.
WDFW land use regs fall under WAC 232-13. If you look under the penalty section for WAC 232-13 "Unless otherwise provided, violation of any of the provisions of this chapter constitutes an infraction, pursuant to RCW 77.15.020 and 77.15.160."
The only time a WDFW land use reg is charged under 77.15.230 is when it is "otherwise provided" such as in WAC 232-13-050 "(2)(a) It is unlawful to possess or dispense beer or malt liquor in quantities subject to keg registration laws under RCW 66.28.210, on department lands, without a permit from the director. Violating this subsection is a misdemeanor, pursuant to RCW 77.15.230."
WDFW doesn't have their own WACs for drug use or littering, they rely on existing state statutes which apply statewide.
If you don't believe me, call WDFW Enforcement tomorrow morning...
Post by: olyguy79 on December 26, 2016, 08:26:44 PM
Bigtex is correct!No.sorry but according to RCW 77.15.230 any and all violations of any signs is in fact a misdemeanor.I take that as littering in these areas and any illegal drug use should fall under this.Yes there are public conduct rules for WDFW lands but for most of them, including the residency/camping rules, they are infractions so you cant arrest them for the violation, all you can do is write a ticket. So what do you do? Write them a ticket everyday which they probably wont pay and there's no ramification for that?sometimes it gets stuck on and im not gonna go back and retype the whole thing just to appease the the grammar police.Take me serious or not i don't care,You don't want to take off the blinders that's on you.BigTex I respect what your saying but quit with the excuses for the WDFW they could help in some ways.Why are the people allowed there to begin with while breaking rules they should be removed before the mess gets carried away Thats why we have the PUBLIC CONDUCT RULES FOR THE W>D>F>W isn't it?.There is no rational excuse for any of it.me going off in other tangents well just so you know because i feel it escapes you,They are all connected.TO LIBERAL ways of thinking.You don't have to put everything in capital letters to try and make your point :twocents:You can't just go live in one of those places if you are disabled, you have to be able to pay for it. Anyone could become homeless with the wrong circumstances. I hope it doesn't happen to you Oh Mah, but I think you would learn something if it did. Would you like to meet some of these people?I GUESS YOU DONT KNOW WHAT OH MAH IS!
BTW, I get a kick out of your signature, "Boss of the woods" What a complete joke.
If you didn't know, I am in law enforcement so this is the stuff I deal with day in and day out. We can't arrest for infractions, heck we realistically cant arrest for many crimes anymore because jails are full and if we did they'd be released before I even pulled out of the sallyport.
WDFW land use regs fall under WAC 232-13. If you look under the penalty section for WAC 232-13 "Unless otherwise provided, violation of any of the provisions of this chapter constitutes an infraction, pursuant to RCW 77.15.020 and 77.15.160."
The only time a WDFW land use reg is charged under 77.15.230 is when it is "otherwise provided" such as in WAC 232-13-050 "(2)(a) It is unlawful to possess or dispense beer or malt liquor in quantities subject to keg registration laws under RCW 66.28.210, on department lands, without a permit from the director. Violating this subsection is a misdemeanor, pursuant to RCW 77.15.230."
WDFW doesn't have their own WACs for drug use or littering, they rely on existing state statutes which apply statewide.
If you don't believe me, call WDFW Enforcement tomorrow morning...
The majority of WDFW public conduct regulations enacted by the Commission are infractions, some more severe offenses are misdemeanors under 77.15.230 but the overwhelming majority are infractions enforced under 77.15.160
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Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 08:45:12 PM
I see no littering signs in these areas all the time,right when you enter.
Post by: bigtex on December 26, 2016, 08:53:42 PM
Sorry wrong RCW. WAC 232-13-050 it is unlawful to use dept. land in a manner or for a purpose contrary to signs or notices posted on those lands,waters or access areas.Violating this subsection is a misdemeanor Pursuant to Rcw 77.15.230And when the prosecutor looks and sees that they can just dispose of the offense as an infraction what will the officer say?
I see no littering signs in these areas all the time,right when you enter.
This is word-for-word the Snohomish County Prosecutor's Office policy for fish and wildlife violations "If a criminal referral is made, the Prosecutor's Office will review the referral, and should it be determined that a related infraction is an option, the case will be declined back to DFW for DFW to file an infraction" Other counties have similar policies.
So in your case WDFW sends a criminal referral to the prosecutor for violating signs, prosecutor declines and says write the infraction.
Just because the RCW or WAC says an offense is a criminal offense means a prosecutor will take it. It's a misdemeanor to use a rake on a huckleberry bush, think a prosecutor will file criminal charges on that? How about not having the emergency cut-off switch on your wrist on a jetski?
Post by: olyguy79 on December 26, 2016, 08:57:26 PM
:yeah:Sorry wrong RCW. WAC 232-13-050 it is unlawful to use dept. land in a manner or for a purpose contrary to signs or notices posted on those lands,waters or access areas.Violating this subsection is a misdemeanor Pursuant to Rcw 77.15.230And when the prosecutor looks and sees that they can just dispose of the offense as an infraction what will the officer say?
I see no littering signs in these areas all the time,right when you enter.
This is word-for-word the Snohomish County Prosecutor's Office policy for fish and wildlife violations "If a criminal referral is made, the Prosecutor's Office will review the referral, and should it be determined that a related infraction is an option, the case will be declined back to DFW for DFW to file an infraction" Other counties have similar policies.
So in your case WDFW sends a criminal referral to the prosecutor for violating signs, prosecutor declines and says write the infraction.
Just because the RCW or WAC says an offense is a criminal offense means a prosecutor will take it. It's a misdemeanor to use a rake on a huckleberry bush, think a prosecutor will file criminal charges on that? How about not having the emergency cut-off switch on your wrist on a jetski?
There's what the statute says and what the real world is. Statute says WDFW could file criminal charges for disobeying signs. Real world is if you ever tried that for 99% of the cases you'd be getting an angry phone call from the prosecutor. God forbid you actually arrest the guy and book him.
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Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 08:58:56 PM
Post by: EmeraldBullet on December 26, 2016, 09:00:12 PM
Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 09:00:54 PM
Post by: bigtex on December 26, 2016, 09:04:39 PM
That's fine but they can be arrested booked then bring that up in court.At least they got in trouble to begin with for breaking the law.I am simply saying that they can do something they should not be out in the field guessing what the judge is or is not gonna do or what the prosecutor may or may not do at a given time.Arrest them according to the law then let the chips fall where they may.It is a misdemeanor,Or do you still disagree?Disagree because it is still the officers a** on the line. Theoretically yes you can book the guy and he'll be released in about 10 minutes after his picture is taken. But it would essentially ruin your name with the prosecutors office because you will be known as the guy who booked the guy on the petty criminal offense.
Should it be this way? Of course not! But that's the world we live in, and it's not just in WA. Officers really have to think like prosecutors now and have a better relationship with prosecutors more so now then ever. You don't want to piss of the prosecutor who could be the one you are trying to convince to take your big game poaching case two months later.
Post by: EmeraldBullet on December 26, 2016, 09:04:50 PM
Post by: olyguy79 on December 26, 2016, 09:08:36 PM
Who cares if it upsets the prosecuting att. They work for us too you know.That statement right there shows how little you know about the justice system. The LAST thing you want to do as a LEO is go against your prosecutor, if you do that you might as well transfer to a different county or turn in your badge.
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Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 09:10:06 PM
Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 09:14:59 PM
Post by: bigtex on December 26, 2016, 09:24:06 PM
I guess this mentality is why UCWARDEN had so much trouble.UCWARDEN must be 1 in a million in the dept.Will do his job no matter what others think. :tup:Todd worked in counties with great prosecutors. His last uniformed position was in San Juan County, one of the best counties to work in when it comes to fish and wildlife prosecutions. When Todd was there one of the prosecutors in the county got an award from the state game warden association for being so good with fish and wildlife offenses.
Unfortunately what happens in San Juan County in regards to fish and wildlife prosecutions is not the norm elsewhere.
Post by: Special T on December 26, 2016, 10:07:40 PM
This reinforces my earlier point about the inability to do something about the problem.Yes there are public conduct rules for WDFW lands but for most of them, including the residency/camping rules, they are infractions so you cant arrest them for the violation, all you can do is write a ticket. So what do you do? Write them a ticket everyday which they probably wont pay and there's no ramification for that?sometimes it gets stuck on and im not gonna go back and retype the whole thing just to appease the the grammar police.Take me serious or not i don't care,You don't want to take off the blinders that's on you.BigTex I respect what your saying but quit with the excuses for the WDFW they could help in some ways.Why are the people allowed there to begin with while breaking rules they should be removed before the mess gets carried away Thats why we have the PUBLIC CONDUCT RULES FOR THE W>D>F>W isn't it?.There is no rational excuse for any of it.me going off in other tangents well just so you know because i feel it escapes you,They are all connected.TO LIBERAL ways of thinking.You don't have to put everything in capital letters to try and make your point :twocents:You can't just go live in one of those places if you are disabled, you have to be able to pay for it. Anyone could become homeless with the wrong circumstances. I hope it doesn't happen to you Oh Mah, but I think you would learn something if it did. Would you like to meet some of these people?I GUESS YOU DONT KNOW WHAT OH MAH IS!
BTW, I get a kick out of your signature, "Boss of the woods" What a complete joke.
If you didn't know, I am in law enforcement so this is the stuff I deal with day in and day out. We can't arrest for infractions, heck we realistically cant arrest for many crimes anymore because jails are full and if we did they'd be released before I even pulled out of the sallyport.
Post by: Special T on December 26, 2016, 10:10:37 PM
@Oh MahIt's not the same everywhere, but when I hear about beds going empty in the Union Gospel mission and Salvation Army it's hard for me to think there are very many good (un mentally disturbed/addict) people that aren't getting help.
Though you may think you are being conservative, your values are based in a very liberal ideology. Your lack of compassion for others, your indesire to be hands on in volunteering, your dependence on the government to fix the issue for you.
I will ask you again because you said "Show me one decent homeless person", will you like to meet some? I would be happy to introduce you to them.
Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 10:53:01 PM
@Oh MahI have said so many times in this thread,I DO VOLUNTEER,I volunteer with my church often helping with these people.I have been robbed and assaulted by these people.The don't respect or appreciate much of what they get.They want more and better all the time.If you don't see this then you are dealing with a better class of homeless than me.
Though you may think you are being conservative, your values are based in a very liberal ideology. Your lack of compassion for others, your indesire to be hands on in volunteering, your dependence on the government to fix the issue for you.
I will ask you again because you said "Show me one decent homeless person", will you like to meet some? I would be happy to introduce you to them.
Post by: Oh Mah on December 26, 2016, 10:54:27 PM
Yes i realize you are LEO and you are appreciated. :tup:Yes there are public conduct rules for WDFW lands but for most of them, including the residency/camping rules, they are infractions so you cant arrest them for the violation, all you can do is write a ticket. So what do you do? Write them a ticket everyday which they probably wont pay and there's no ramification for that?sometimes it gets stuck on and im not gonna go back and retype the whole thing just to appease the the grammar police.Take me serious or not i don't care,You don't want to take off the blinders that's on you.BigTex I respect what your saying but quit with the excuses for the WDFW they could help in some ways.Why are the people allowed there to begin with while breaking rules they should be removed before the mess gets carried away Thats why we have the PUBLIC CONDUCT RULES FOR THE W>D>F>W isn't it?.There is no rational excuse for any of it.me going off in other tangents well just so you know because i feel it escapes you,They are all connected.TO LIBERAL ways of thinking.You don't have to put everything in capital letters to try and make your point :twocents:You can't just go live in one of those places if you are disabled, you have to be able to pay for it. Anyone could become homeless with the wrong circumstances. I hope it doesn't happen to you Oh Mah, but I think you would learn something if it did. Would you like to meet some of these people?I GUESS YOU DONT KNOW WHAT OH MAH IS!
BTW, I get a kick out of your signature, "Boss of the woods" What a complete joke.
If you didn't know, I am in law enforcement so this is the stuff I deal with day in and day out. We can't arrest for infractions, heck we realistically cant arrest for many crimes anymore because jails are full and if we did they'd be released before I even pulled out of the sallyport.