Post by: bigtex on January 25, 2017, 04:08:40 PM
- Prohibits any person, including department staff, from translocating a live elk from an area with elk affected by hoof disease to any other location. The department may not issue a permit allowing such an action.
-While on duty, department staff in possession of a firearm must humanely euthanize an elk that is exhibiting a severe limp and is located in an area where hoof disease is present.
-An authorized person, as identified in (c) of this subsection, may humanely euthanize an elk that the person reasonably believes is exhibiting a severe limp and is located in an area where hoof disease is present. An authorized person may humanely euthanize an affected elk the person encounters without regard to hunting season dates and areas and no tag is required. An authorized person may retain the animal, at their discretion.
(b) An authorized person humanely euthanizing an elk under this subsection (3) must, except for a tribal member, notify the department of that action within forty-eight hours after taking that action.
(c) Those authorized to humanely euthanize an elk under this subsection (3) are a landowner humanely euthanizing an elk on their land, a person with a valid hunting license under chapter 77.32 RCW, and a person with a tribal identification card from a federally recognized tribe.
http://lawfilesext.leg.wa.gov/biennium/2017-18/Pdf/Bills/Senate%20Bills/5474.pdf
Post by: Special T on January 25, 2017, 04:17:42 PM
Post by: bigtex on January 25, 2017, 04:35:10 PM
There is no definition of what a "severe limp" is so what I may think is a "severe limp" may just be a 'normal limp' to the next guy. It'll basically come down to people shooting elk and just telling officers "well it had a severe limp" and there's nothing officers could do if they didn't see the elk walking itself.
The whole road kill savage law has created issues, but this one would create huge issues! :twocents:
Post by: Special T on January 25, 2017, 04:37:46 PM
This would truly create an enforcement mess!From the wardens I've talked to here in the Skagit Valley it has resolved lots of issues.
There is no definition of what a "severe limp" is so what I may think is a "severe limp" may just be a 'normal limp' to the next guy. It'll basically come down to people shooting elk and just telling officers "well it had a severe limp" and there's nothing officers could do if they didn't see the elk walking itself.
The whole road kill savage law has created issues, but this one would create huge issues! :twocents:
For a while the only way a road kill elk could get used was the tribe. They would only pickup the Bulls with horns.
Post by: Boss .300 winmag on January 25, 2017, 04:38:39 PM
This would truly create an enforcement mess!From the wardens I've talked to here in the Skagit Valley it has resolved lots of issues.
There is no definition of what a "severe limp" is so what I may think is a "severe limp" may just be a 'normal limp' to the next guy. It'll basically come down to people shooting elk and just telling officers "well it had a severe limp" and there's nothing officers could do if they didn't see the elk walking itself.
The whole road kill savage law has created issues, but this one would create huge issues! :twocents:
For a while the only way a road kill elk could get used was the tribe. They would only pickup the Bulls with horns.
:yeah:
Post by: bigtex on January 25, 2017, 04:41:59 PM
It's created issues statewide. There have actually been people witnessed placing apples and other bait next to fog lines in hopes that someone whacks a deer. The number of city cops/deputies calling WDFW because they have an "untagged deer" on a traffic stop is going thru the roof because as you know you don't get a tag for roadkill deer.This would truly create an enforcement mess!From the wardens I've talked to here in the Skagit Valley it has resolved lots of issues.
There is no definition of what a "severe limp" is so what I may think is a "severe limp" may just be a 'normal limp' to the next guy. It'll basically come down to people shooting elk and just telling officers "well it had a severe limp" and there's nothing officers could do if they didn't see the elk walking itself.
The whole road kill savage law has created issues, but this one would create huge issues! :twocents:
For a while the only way a road kill elk could get used was the tribe. They would only pickup the Bulls with horns.
Obviously there's positives in that less animals are wasted, but there are definitely people out there trying to screw the system. Never thought I'd hear about people placing bait on fog lines, but it's happened several times since the reg passed.
Post by: Boss .300 winmag on January 25, 2017, 04:45:19 PM
It's created issues statewide. There have actually been people witnessed placing apples and other bait next to fog lines in hopes that someone whacks a deer. The number of city cops/deputies calling WDFW because they have an "untagged deer" on a traffic stop is going thru the roof because as you know you don't get a tag for roadkill deer.This would truly create an enforcement mess!From the wardens I've talked to here in the Skagit Valley it has resolved lots of issues.
There is no definition of what a "severe limp" is so what I may think is a "severe limp" may just be a 'normal limp' to the next guy. It'll basically come down to people shooting elk and just telling officers "well it had a severe limp" and there's nothing officers could do if they didn't see the elk walking itself.
The whole road kill savage law has created issues, but this one would create huge issues! :twocents:
For a while the only way a road kill elk could get used was the tribe. They would only pickup the Bulls with horns.
Obviously there's positives in that less animals are wasted, but there are definitely people out there trying to screw the system. Never thought I'd hear about people placing bait on fog lines, but it's happened several times since the reg passed.
The state needs to educate the police of the new law. How did they get caught baiting the fog lines?
Post by: olyguy79 on January 25, 2017, 04:48:47 PM
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: bigtex on January 25, 2017, 04:50:22 PM
There is a change in the works because it is an enforcement mess. I think what will end up happening is a permit system where any LEO can issue a salvage permit to a person. No more self reporting.:yeah:
That's what I am hearing as well. People aren't being honest so now WA could be like other states where an actual permit needs to be issued by an LEO before the animal can be taken.
Post by: bigtex on January 25, 2017, 04:56:07 PM
The issue is you are now having city/county officers who don't hunt trying to decipher okay is this a poached deer or a roadkill deer? I've had such officers call me and they cant tell me if the animal is a deer or an elk or a doe or a buck, you think they'll know how to decipher between a poached deer and roadkill?The state needs to educate the police of the new law. How did they get caught baiting the fog lines?It's created issues statewide. There have actually been people witnessed placing apples and other bait next to fog lines in hopes that someone whacks a deer. The number of city cops/deputies calling WDFW because they have an "untagged deer" on a traffic stop is going thru the roof because as you know you don't get a tag for roadkill deer.This would truly create an enforcement mess!From the wardens I've talked to here in the Skagit Valley it has resolved lots of issues.
There is no definition of what a "severe limp" is so what I may think is a "severe limp" may just be a 'normal limp' to the next guy. It'll basically come down to people shooting elk and just telling officers "well it had a severe limp" and there's nothing officers could do if they didn't see the elk walking itself.
The whole road kill savage law has created issues, but this one would create huge issues! :twocents:
For a while the only way a road kill elk could get used was the tribe. They would only pickup the Bulls with horns.
Obviously there's positives in that less animals are wasted, but there are definitely people out there trying to screw the system. Never thought I'd hear about people placing bait on fog lines, but it's happened several times since the reg passed.
For your second question. Bait was placed, officers removed, it was placed again, so they watched it for a night and the bait placer came back. That's one instance but it's happened throughout the state.
Post by: dreamunelk on January 25, 2017, 05:02:14 PM
That 6 point looked like it had a severe limp to me.
Post by: bigtex on January 25, 2017, 05:02:37 PM
Basically and open poaching season.:yeah:
That 6 point looked like it had a severe limp to me.
Post by: Boss .300 winmag on January 25, 2017, 05:05:56 PM
There is a change in the works because it is an enforcement mess. I think what will end up happening is a permit system where any LEO can issue a salvage permit to a person. No more self reporting.:yeah:
That's what I am hearing as well. People aren't being honest so now WA could be like other states where an actual permit needs to be issued by an LEO before the animal can be taken.
People don't have all day waiting for an officer to come to the scene. Keep online reporting, and officers come to the address of salvage person to issue tag/permit.:twocents:
Post by: Bob33 on January 25, 2017, 05:51:35 PM
Post by: JimmyHoffa on January 25, 2017, 06:00:17 PM
So, bigtex...would you have to use the method on your tag to shoot hoof rots or if you have an archery tag can you hunt the rest of the year with a rifle?
Post by: baker5150 on January 25, 2017, 06:10:56 PM
There is a change in the works because it is an enforcement mess. I think what will end up happening is a permit system where any LEO can issue a salvage permit to a person. No more self reporting.:yeah:
That's what I am hearing as well. People aren't being honest so now WA could be like other states where an actual permit needs to be issued by an LEO before the animal can be taken.
People don't have all day waiting for an officer to come to the scene. Keep online reporting, and officers come to the address of salvage person to issue tag/permit.:twocents:
They could easily issue a permit number over the phone and that number could be checked by other LEOs if they are stopped. Basically only requiring a phone call be made before removing the animal from the scene.
Post by: bigtex on January 25, 2017, 06:43:15 PM
which GMUs have hoof rot again....oh man, year round elk season! With hardly any fishing left....No tag needed just a "hunting license"
So, bigtex...would you have to use the method on your tag to shoot hoof rots or if you have an archery tag can you hunt the rest of the year with a rifle?
Post by: bigtex on January 25, 2017, 06:44:09 PM
Who's they? WDFW doesn't have a 24 7 communication centerThere is a change in the works because it is an enforcement mess. I think what will end up happening is a permit system where any LEO can issue a salvage permit to a person. No more self reporting.:yeah:
That's what I am hearing as well. People aren't being honest so now WA could be like other states where an actual permit needs to be issued by an LEO before the animal can be taken.
People don't have all day waiting for an officer to come to the scene. Keep online reporting, and officers come to the address of salvage person to issue tag/permit.:twocents:
They could easily issue a permit number over the phone and that number could be checked by other LEOs if they are stopped. Basically only requiring a phone call be made before removing the animal from the scene.
Post by: TONTO on January 25, 2017, 06:49:37 PM
Post by: bearpaw on January 25, 2017, 06:52:47 PM
There is a change in the works because it is an enforcement mess. I think what will end up happening is a permit system where any LEO can issue a salvage permit to a person. No more self reporting.:yeah:
That's what I am hearing as well. People aren't being honest so now WA could be like other states where an actual permit needs to be issued by an LEO before the animal can be taken.
People don't have all day waiting for an officer to come to the scene. Keep online reporting, and officers come to the address of salvage person to issue tag/permit.:twocents:
They could easily issue a permit number over the phone and that number could be checked by other LEOs if they are stopped. Basically only requiring a phone call be made before removing the animal from the scene.
This sounds reasonable, it works that way in Utah. One of my guides saw a car hit a moose, they left the moose, my guide called Utah DWR and was given an authorization, he recovered the moose, with the authorization it was just like placing a tag on the animal.
Regarding Hoof Rot Elk
Maybe hunters should be required to get a special authorization and it only be given to hunters without a record of violations?
Post by: bearpaw on January 25, 2017, 07:07:03 PM
which GMUs have hoof rot again....oh man, year round elk season! With hardly any fishing left....No tag needed just a "hunting license"
So, bigtex...would you have to use the method on your tag to shoot hoof rots or if you have an archery tag can you hunt the rest of the year with a rifle?
I agree with everyone who thinks there needs to be some form of accountability otherwise it opens the door to excessive poaching. :twocents:
Post by: KFhunter on January 25, 2017, 07:19:55 PM
I said a long time ago wolves were going to explode once they got into that smorgasbord just waiting for them.
Post by: jackmaster on January 25, 2017, 07:33:37 PM
Post by: KFhunter on January 25, 2017, 07:36:48 PM
This may have been answered but are those hoof rot elk safe to eat?
They say they're safe to eat in the same breath as they say spraying didn't cause it.
Post by: jackmaster on January 25, 2017, 07:39:05 PM
:chuckle: :chuckle: I just don't think I would have the stomach to eat one!! Did they ever find out EXACTLY what caused it? I think the spraying did it, but they won't admit to that !!This may have been answered but are those hoof rot elk safe to eat?
They say they're safe to eat in the same breath as they say spraying didn't cause it.
Post by: fireweed on January 26, 2017, 08:06:41 AM
Nature is hard, Animals suffer, everything dies. But it works that way.
Post by: Bob33 on January 26, 2017, 08:16:20 AM
This may have been answered but are those hoof rot elk safe to eat?There is no evidence indicating they are not safe to eat. I would use my senses; sight, smell, and common.
Post by: bowbuild on January 27, 2017, 11:06:57 AM
There is a change in the works because it is an enforcement mess. I think what will end up happening is a permit system where any LEO can issue a salvage permit to a person. No more self reporting.:yeah:
That's what I am hearing as well. People aren't being honest so now WA could be like other states where an actual permit needs to be issued by an LEO before the animal can be taken.
Any LEO , or game officer?
Post by: Mudman on January 27, 2017, 11:40:59 AM
Post by: Dhoey07 on January 27, 2017, 11:49:31 AM
Post by: Rainier10 on February 01, 2017, 11:33:28 AM
Doesn't sound like a solution to the problem to me.:yeah:
Sounds more like a solution that creates more problems.
Post by: Whitpirate on February 01, 2017, 11:49:03 AM
Who's they? WDFW doesn't have a 24 7 communication centerThere is a change in the works because it is an enforcement mess. I think what will end up happening is a permit system where any LEO can issue a salvage permit to a person. No more self reporting.:yeah:
That's what I am hearing as well. People aren't being honest so now WA could be like other states where an actual permit needs to be issued by an LEO before the animal can be taken.
People don't have all day waiting for an officer to come to the scene. Keep online reporting, and officers come to the address of salvage person to issue tag/permit.:twocents:
They could easily issue a permit number over the phone and that number could be checked by other LEOs if they are stopped. Basically only requiring a phone call be made before removing the animal from the scene.
I'd say write an app that can be loaded on phones but we've seen their amazing prowess on software design on the new site so I'd suggest smoke signals.
Post by: Bob33 on February 01, 2017, 12:13:22 PM
Post by: baker5150 on February 01, 2017, 12:25:17 PM
Who's they? WDFW doesn't have a 24 7 communication centerThere is a change in the works because it is an enforcement mess. I think what will end up happening is a permit system where any LEO can issue a salvage permit to a person. No more self reporting.:yeah:
That's what I am hearing as well. People aren't being honest so now WA could be like other states where an actual permit needs to be issued by an LEO before the animal can be taken.
People don't have all day waiting for an officer to come to the scene. Keep online reporting, and officers come to the address of salvage person to issue tag/permit.:twocents:
They could easily issue a permit number over the phone and that number could be checked by other LEOs if they are stopped. Basically only requiring a phone call be made before removing the animal from the scene.
I can think of other 24/7 comm centers that could handle it, 911 or local PD's, Sherriff's office, state patrol. Technically the accident needs to be called in anyway right? So why not use the system in place?
Post by: Mudman on February 01, 2017, 01:06:34 PM
Post by: bbarnes on February 01, 2017, 07:58:01 PM
Post by: Mudman on February 01, 2017, 11:52:41 PM
The state legislature won't fund a study or a live animal study,but they will authorize the slaughter, of our state elk herd.Ask yourself how many elk ,will be left in the woods if this bill passes.How these people get elected,is what is amazing to me.This is a bad idea.That's because they don't want the truth public! Or the liability.
Post by: dreamunelk on February 02, 2017, 01:37:56 AM
Post by: bbarnes on February 02, 2017, 08:09:16 AM
Post by: bbarnes on February 02, 2017, 08:57:54 AM
Post by: Practical Approach on February 02, 2017, 09:51:59 AM
Post by: Bob33 on February 02, 2017, 10:20:55 AM
These animals are not contagious and would be shot indiscriminately. Not toWhat is your basis for stating they are not contagious?
Post by: Practical Approach on February 02, 2017, 01:06:54 PM
Post by: Bob33 on February 02, 2017, 01:29:55 PM
Some hoof issues are not contagious such as an injured hoof or slipper hoof, hoof overgrowth due to long habituation of soft wet pastures or fields. I would say these are not contagious and do cause an elk to limp.You may be right, but I think you will have a hard time convincing legislators that is the case as it conflicts with the information provided by the technical advisory group.
"Treponeme-associated hoof disease in elk is infectious, and can be spread among elk through exposure to the bacteria that is associated with the disease. "
http://wdfw.wa.gov/news/oct1716a/
Post by: Mudman on February 02, 2017, 01:36:28 PM
Post by: lokidog on February 02, 2017, 01:41:15 PM
There is a change in the works because it is an enforcement mess. I think what will end up happening is a permit system where any LEO can issue a salvage permit to a person. No more self reporting.:yeah:
That's what I am hearing as well. People aren't being honest so now WA could be like other states where an actual permit needs to be issued by an LEO before the animal can be taken.
Gee, once again the State does its own thing w/o looking at how other states have already SUCCESSFULLY done it, and it's not working as they thought. :bash:
Post by: bbarnes on February 02, 2017, 09:45:05 PM
Post by: bigtex on February 02, 2017, 09:55:54 PM
This bill is about cattleman wanting the state to pay for free fencing,I found out today.The land owners in skagit county,don't want the elk on there land ,but don't want hunters to hunt them either.This whole thing is a cluster and I will be there Tuesday to show my disapproval .Makes sense now. I was wondering why Pearson was getting involved with something in SW WA.
Post by: Boss .300 winmag on February 02, 2017, 10:00:13 PM
This bill is about cattleman wanting the state to pay for free fencing,I found out today.The land owners in skagit county,don't want the elk on there land ,but don't want hunters to hunt them either.This whole thing is a cluster and I will be there Tuesday to show my disapproval .
The elk up here are really just for the tribe, very little permits, about the only way to get one is to hit it with your vehicle. They are just a nuisance to the people of the valley. :twocents:
Post by: pianoman9701 on February 03, 2017, 07:37:45 AM
Post by: fireweed on February 03, 2017, 08:44:52 AM
Post by: lamrith on February 03, 2017, 09:30:08 AM
This is the "20teens", it could very easily be setup as an automated system that would generate a record in a database and assign a tag number for the caller to use. Having that then tied in where other LEO could verify, or even have a number they could call to verify that tag number would alleviate the "big hassle" if someone with a salvage animal is involved in a traffic stop.Who's they? WDFW doesn't have a 24 7 communication centerThere is a change in the works because it is an enforcement mess. I think what will end up happening is a permit system where any LEO can issue a salvage permit to a person. No more self reporting.:yeah:
That's what I am hearing as well. People aren't being honest so now WA could be like other states where an actual permit needs to be issued by an LEO before the animal can be taken.
People don't have all day waiting for an officer to come to the scene. Keep online reporting, and officers come to the address of salvage person to issue tag/permit.:twocents:
They could easily issue a permit number over the phone and that number could be checked by other LEOs if they are stopped. Basically only requiring a phone call be made before removing the animal from the scene.
Anyone that has dealt with LEO much on a "customer" level knows that they are grossly overstretched already. The last thing we really want is LEO responding to a call and having to deal with issuing a salvage tag for a vehicle hit animal. They need to be out protecting and responding to true emergency calls. Plus the response time to non emergency LEO responsibilities is too long already. Takes hours in some places to get response to a break-in, let alone a salvage animal. Plus then you have someone wanting to salvage it waiting on side of road for hours which is a safety concern for them and other drivers. Current system might have issues, but they can be simply fixed with an automated system.
Post by: Widgeondeke on February 03, 2017, 09:59:09 AM
There is a change in the works because it is an enforcement mess. I think what will end up happening is a permit system where any LEO can issue a salvage permit to a person. No more self reporting.So if an LEO doesn't agree with the salvage law or just doesn't like hunters/salvagers. He only needs to say he has a more important call and never arrive to issue a permit :dunno:
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Squidward on February 03, 2017, 10:21:13 AM
Is there a single documented case of an elk infecting a cow or horse? SW Washington is full of hoof rot elk, but I don't here of it affecting domestic livestock. Heck even the deer here in Toutle, where at least 30% of the elk limp, seem to be immune and they stomp all over the same ground with the same bacteria.I talked to a farmer out in the Boisfort valley last yr while on a cow hunt. I asked if he had to treat his cows any more with the hoof rot around. he told me he didn't have to treat any more, however he did see more hoof issues.
Post by: Mudman on February 03, 2017, 10:53:33 AM
Is there a single documented case of an elk infecting a cow or horse? SW Washington is full of hoof rot elk, but I don't here of it affecting domestic livestock. Heck even the deer here in Toutle, where at least 30% of the elk limp, seem to be immune and they stomp all over the same ground with the same bacteria.Ask why deer are not affected? Elk spend much more time in cuts and eat more grasses n such. Exposure to chemicals is higher. They are immune compromised.
Post by: pianoman9701 on February 03, 2017, 10:57:28 AM
Post by: bbarnes on February 03, 2017, 07:30:32 PM
Post by: fireweed on February 04, 2017, 08:49:15 AM
The white tailed deer in the mid west are.it was first shown on drury outdoors last year.But if it is so contagious and in the soil why don't the blacktails HERE have it? In my yard hoof rot elk and the local deer herd stomp over the same ground all day without a single deer showing symptoms.
Post by: JimmyHoffa on February 04, 2017, 08:51:17 AM
could be difference in dietThe white tailed deer in the mid west are.it was first shown on drury outdoors last year.But if it is so contagious and in the soil why don't the blacktails HERE have it? In my yard hoof rot elk and the local deer herd stomp over the same ground all day without a single deer showing symptoms.
Post by: fireweed on February 04, 2017, 08:53:28 AM
If it was open season on limping elk, the local tweekers would go Rambo shooting everything they could.
Post by: chester on February 04, 2017, 02:18:42 PM
:tup:
Post by: Blacktail Sniper on February 04, 2017, 02:26:09 PM
I like it, kill them all and start over with transplants from Olympic NP. Get rid of the limpers, watch the Weyco permit system go broke and bring in better genetics.
:tup:
Of course, if the underlaying issue that is causing the problem is not addressed and corrected, the "new" elk will just end up in the same condition...
Post by: bbarnes on February 05, 2017, 07:55:27 AM
Post by: ghosthunter on February 05, 2017, 08:13:59 AM
This would truly create an enforcement mess!
There is no definition of what a "severe limp" is so what I may think is a "severe limp" may just be a 'normal limp' to the next guy. It'll basically come down to people shooting elk and just telling officers "well it had a severe limp" and there's nothing officers could do if they didn't see the elk walking itself.
The whole road kill savage law has created issues, but this one would create huge issues! :twocents:
We are walking the same trail on this one. Too open. I was with it till we got to authorized person.
Post by: Elkcollector82 on February 05, 2017, 10:51:58 AM
Don't like it. Here there are lots of limping elk and if every one was open season year round there wouldn't be any elk left. The elk need a chance to fight the infection off--and if they succeed their calves might inherit a better ability to deal with hoof rot. Nature works that way. But herd immunity will never develop if every limping elk is shot before it has a chance to fight the disease.
Nature is hard, Animals suffer, everything dies. But it works that way.
So 15+ years of hoof rot. You think if an animal gonna beat the infection off it would have happened. But it comes from herbicide spraying. Can't beat that infection. When they keep doing it every year. People created the infection not nature. So there for people have to solve the problem. Could this turn into a poachers dream. Yes, but what's stopping the poachers now? Nothing! If someone gonna poach there gonna poach. No matter what laws or rules you put into effect. I've seen so many elk with this inflection it's sickening. So before you past judgement what's more cruel or unethical leaving a suffering animal that can't walk or put it out of its misery? They say it's ok to eat. But I would like to see them dish them self up a healthy plate and eat it with confidence. Highly doubt they will. This bill with some fine tuning could really end the hoof rot problem. Just like the road kill law. Yea there are people that take advantage of it. But then there's not. I know for a fact if I was driving down some highway with the family in car and seen some record bull standing in middle of the road. I'd slow down. Not worth risking my family for some horns. (Plus I don't think pope and young have a firestone/Bridgestone category) people are gonna do whatever they want. Right or wrong. That's just the way the world is.
Post by: fireweed on February 06, 2017, 08:26:40 AM
If the immune system (for whatever reason) is the issue, then killing off sick elk won't help much, especially if the bacteria is in the soil (as the WDFW claims).
There is such and outcry to "do something" that I am worried that lawmakers will jump in and do the wrong thing just to say the took action and did something. There is simply not enough information about the cause, spread, source of the disease to be shooting all the elk with symptoms.
Post by: Practical Approach on February 06, 2017, 09:46:04 AM
I like it, kill them all and start over with transplants from Olympic NP. Get rid of the limpers, watch the Weyco permit system go broke and bring in better genetics.There are limpers already documented on the Peninsula.
:tup:
Post by: Mudman on February 06, 2017, 10:18:00 AM
Post by: Curly on February 06, 2017, 10:21:09 AM
How many grouse do you see in sprayed timberlands? Enough said. Stop spraying please.
:yeah:
Stop spraying and bring back burning. Much better for the environment. :twocents:
Post by: JimmyHoffa on February 06, 2017, 10:24:15 AM
How many grouse do you see in sprayed timberlands? Enough said. Stop spraying please.There used to be some nice seasons in this state for band tailed pigeons. Used to seem like whole clouds of them would cover clear cuts (especially when the elderberries were ripe). The spray really knocked back the elderberries, now there's hardly a season for the band tailed pigeon.
Post by: dreamunelk on February 07, 2017, 04:56:49 AM
Post by: dreamunelk on February 07, 2017, 05:10:20 AM
Post by: dreamunelk on February 07, 2017, 05:15:23 AM
Post by: bbarnes on February 08, 2017, 09:08:31 AM
Post by: Mudman on February 08, 2017, 02:48:13 PM
How is this possible when WDFW has killed 76 elk,and only 4 of these elk had trepaniemes.three of them had leptospirosis, a total of 7 tested positive.trepaniemes are a secondary virus,so what's killing them ?I don't understand can you specify that comment? 76 were tested for all bacteriums?
Post by: bbarnes on February 08, 2017, 09:50:09 PM
Post by: Tbar on February 08, 2017, 10:06:13 PM
How is this possible when WDFW has killed 76 elk,and only 4 of these elk had trepaniemes.three of them had leptospirosis, a total of 7 tested positive.trepaniemes are a secondary virus,so what's killing them ?Where did you get this info? Just curious.
Post by: bbarnes on February 15, 2017, 08:36:08 AM
Post by: garrett89 on February 16, 2017, 10:36:35 AM
Post by: Browndawg on February 20, 2017, 08:43:52 PM
From going to every hoof rot meeting! I would also like to know,where all the the elk hunters were during testimony.All the hunting groups need to take a lesson, from the gays,lesbians and environmentalist in this county,THEY SHOW UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thanks for representing us bbarnes. I am just getting educated on this mess through this forum and a little on the word wide webbernet. I'm with the masses of the group on this. I don't like the bill.
I like the idea of having an incentive for hunters to kill infected elk. Give a hunter 2 preference points toward their Quality Bull/Bull/Antlerless. Or automatically give them a Multi-Season Elk permit. The infected elk would be inspected to verify it had hoof rot of course. I would drop one in a second if I knew I would be rewarded for it somehow.
Of course I've never been known to discriminate what is in my sights. Seems like more limping elk may turn the advantage in my favor.
Post by: konradcountry on February 25, 2017, 07:12:00 PM
This is not hoof rot,its a lack of habitat putting these animals into poor body condition.The timber company's are killing all of the spring, and fall habitat by spraying the toxins on the clear cuts.The first sentance of this bill, i completely agree with.The rest needs a complete overhaul.Hope to see all the REAL,elk hunters at the hearing Tuesday.
If it was something they were spraying we would see it in other areas.
And if they had some secret X formula that wasn't approved by the government they would have stopped using it by now.
The common herbicides are safe and are used heavily with livestock.
This is probably a bacteria which means the herd should be culled.
Post by: HntnFsh on February 25, 2017, 09:18:36 PM
This is not hoof rot,its a lack of habitat putting these animals into poor body condition.The timber company's are killing all of the spring, and fall habitat by spraying the toxins on the clear cuts.The first sentance of this bill, i completely agree with.The rest needs a complete overhaul.Hope to see all the REAL,elk hunters at the hearing Tuesday.
If it was something they were spraying we would see it in other areas.
And if they had some secret X formula that wasn't approved by the government they would have stopped using it by now.
The common herbicides are safe and are used heavily with livestock.
This is probably a bacteria which means the herd should be culled.
I wouldn't necessarily say that its directly a result of consuming the herbicides. But more likely a direct result of the herbicides killing the exact browse they need, that holds the minerals that keep their immune systems healthy and be able to fight off diseases.
Post by: chester on February 25, 2017, 09:22:46 PM
This is not hoof rot,its a lack of habitat putting these animals into poor body condition.The timber company's are killing all of the spring, and fall habitat by spraying the toxins on the clear cuts.The first sentance of this bill, i completely agree with.The rest needs a complete overhaul.Hope to see all the REAL,elk hunters at the hearing Tuesday.
If it was something they were spraying we would see it in other areas.
And if they had some secret X formula that wasn't approved by the government they would have stopped using it by now.
The common herbicides are safe and are used heavily with livestock.
This is probably a bacteria which means the herd should be culled.
I wouldn't necessarily say that its directly a result of consuming the herbicides. But more likely a direct result of the herbicides killing the exact browse they need, that holds the minerals that keep their immune systems healthy and be able to fight off diseases.
Or a dairy farmer got a bad batch of feed from somewhere that carried leptospirosis, fed to his cows and spread the manure over a green field where the elk fed . Treated the cattle and never thought about it again.
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Post by: Mudman on February 25, 2017, 10:15:03 PM
Post by: Humptulips on February 26, 2017, 08:17:52 PM
This is not hoof rot,its a lack of habitat putting these animals into poor body condition.The timber company's are killing all of the spring, and fall habitat by spraying the toxins on the clear cuts.The first sentance of this bill, i completely agree with.The rest needs a complete overhaul.Hope to see all the REAL,elk hunters at the hearing Tuesday.
If it was something they were spraying we would see it in other areas.
And if they had some secret X formula that wasn't approved by the government they would have stopped using it by now.
The common herbicides are safe and are used heavily with livestock.
This is probably a bacteria which means the herd should be culled.
I don't imagine there are many farmers/ranchers spraying their livestocks forage with herbicide and then turning them into the field to graze that night.
Weyerhaeuser was the first timber company I know of to go to wholesale spraying. There are others now but SW WA seemed to me to get the first heavy doses.
Correct me if I am wrong.
Post by: pianoman9701 on February 27, 2017, 06:44:43 AM
"If it was something they were spraying we would see it in other areas. And if they had some secret X formula that wasn't approved by the government they would have stopped using it by now. The common herbicides are safe and are used heavily with livestock. This is probably a bacteria which means the herd should be culled."
On Saturday, I spoke with the bio who's leading the Hoof disease discussion in the WDFW, Brooke George. There may be many reasons we don't see hoof disease in other areas of the state where some factors are in common, like the spraying of herbicides. Some of the factors are moisture levels, elevation, sunlight, and temperature. It hasn't widely spread past the Cascades for one or a combination of these factors, or possibly other factors they haven't considered yet. They do have one confirmed case in northeast WA now and OR has a case they're investigating in the Blues in the northeast part of that state. It is a bacteria. The question remains which bacteria is really the culprit. WDFW is sticking with treponema. Others believe leptospira.
Post by: Tbar on February 27, 2017, 06:54:39 AM
This bill was not killed in committee. There is a substitute Bill with a narrow scope. If the bill passes Brooke will not be leading, WSU will.
Post by: pianoman9701 on February 27, 2017, 07:09:29 AM
Post by: fireweed on February 27, 2017, 07:40:09 AM
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/roundup-weed-killer-lawsuit-monsanto-glyphosate-cancer-claims/
Post by: headshot5 on February 27, 2017, 07:42:21 AM
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NEW SECTION. Sec. 3. A new section is added to chapter 77.12 RCW to read as follows:
Subject to the availability of amounts appropriated for this specific purpose, the legislature designates Washington State University college of veterinary medicine as the state lead in developing a program to monitor and assess causes of and potential solutions for elk hoof disease. The college must establish an elk monitoring system in southwest Washington in order to carry out this mission. In conducting this work, the college must work collaboratively with entities including the department, the state veterinarian, and any tribes with interest in participating. The college must provide regular updates, at minimum on an annual basis, to the appropriate committees of the legislature and the commission on its findings, program needs, and any recommendations.
Post by: pianoman9701 on February 27, 2017, 07:47:08 AM
Post by: headshot5 on February 27, 2017, 08:18:31 AM
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I'm afraid that if WSU takes over, one of the solutions will include cutting hunters out of the equation.
True, but at the rate we are going currently (20 years of non-action from WDFW)... Elk hunters in Southwest Washington are looking at a few more years of hunting, and by that point there really won't be enough left without hoof rot to make hunting worth while.
It's a delicate balance between doing what is in the hunters best interest, and doing what is best in the elk's best interest. All the things we have been asking for are coming along finally. Independent testing and monitoring...
Post by: hoof rot on February 27, 2017, 07:10:51 PM