Post by: Ridgerunner on March 07, 2009, 03:32:04 PM
Post by: dbllunger on March 07, 2009, 08:47:05 PM
Post by: Bunkster on March 07, 2009, 09:28:32 PM
Post by: Elkaholic daWg on March 08, 2009, 01:25:26 PM
Also I'm not sure what they will do with the GMU 122-117 4 point or better issue, there were many on both sides of that issue.
Nice drive home too........and woke up to 9 inches here.....melting as I post
Post by: MichaelJ on March 08, 2009, 04:46:41 PM
I don't know how it will end up. I think they backed down on some things, lip serviced some, and ignored some. Most had already spoke about the major areas I wanted to cover. I said my shortened version and just asked that they really listen to what all the previous comments had been. I was in the back, and one of the commission members out of my view threw a fit. He was wanking about all the negative comments towards the commission. "your treating us like a red headed step child, and I don't really appreciate it. I am pretty much turning you off". So you guess how it went, but he was the only one I heard being a baby. This was towards the end of the deer season and permit section. I sure wish there had been a lot more there, and expected a lot more based on the internet and even people I talked to.
Myself and Aaron (Colockum) were up front... I was in a black Vandals Logger Sports jacket jeans, boots, and camo hat... surprised you didn't come say hi... there's 3 members on here that were there and me and aaron never knew it... you guys should've showed up for dinner the night before!!!
Michael
Post by: woodswalker on March 08, 2009, 04:59:08 PM
Interesting that. The Archers were REALLY hammering on EVERYONE including Modern FA hunters....Its that kind of divisiveness that loses us these battles. Take a DEEP BREATH guys. We ALL like the outdoors, Hunting and the like...but to place one group as THE RESPONSIBLE ONES is just flat divisive and ultimately NOT usefull to hunting as a whole.
As long as WDFW can keep us fighting amongst ourselves...they will be able to avoid the HARD questions.
As far as the solution to the problem pictured with Whitetail take, just remove the doe take..that will drop the hunter days and harvest RIGHT back down as MOST of the large spike was DOES.
Just My :twocents:
Post by: hunt4 on March 08, 2009, 05:16:45 PM
I do remember a gentleman with allot of time and experience with the gamedepartment at the beginning suggest there be a house cleaning of the commission
Post by: Snapshot on March 08, 2009, 05:19:07 PM
Post by: woodswalker on March 08, 2009, 08:33:26 PM
My comments to the ones i spoke to was that we needed, as a user group to stick together and come up with SOLUTIONS, not just objections to the changes. I understand about WDFW kind of playing one group off another...typical divide and conquer strategy.
I also spoke to the Puyallup tribes game biologist, I'll be asking her to help with figuring out how to get accurate numbers in the harvest both as to what animals (bull/cow - Buck/doe and ages-maturity) and where they came from. The Puyallups HAVE and will share the data, the Muckleshoots and others HAVE the data and wont SHARE it. I know its a HUGE can of worms....but if we WANT to manage the resource we HAVE to have FACTS AND DATA.
As I stated in my opportunity to address the commission, Just like I design aircraft using science, facts and data, we need to manage the wildlife the same way and the ONLY way we can do that is if we have accurate harvest data from the tribes.
Post by: dbllunger on March 08, 2009, 08:36:23 PM
Post by: MichaelJ on March 08, 2009, 09:48:49 PM
Archers did not bash other user groups at all, and I was present 2hrs in the morning and two hours in the afternoon on Saturday. I missed commenting on the elk as I did not think I would be able to be back in time. Should have signed up as I made it. I did hear a lot of archers saying that their group was much more impacted then other user groups to the negative (true statement) and asking for true equality. If asking for equality is bashing then everyone bashed. Yes it takes effort and time but it has to be done. Had another hunting bud I had not seen in over a year. His first meeting and wanted to talk but felt not ready. I tried but he was just not ready to talk. Overall I felt everyone wanted what was best for the animals and hunting community not self serving. The only issue was no one including myself brought up tribal killing. I just flat forgot and screwed the dog on that one, but we all know no one including the commission will touch it regardless.
X100...
I am both a modern hunter as well as an archery hunter and I didn't think any one group got bashed... The archery hunts in this state were taking the biggest hits from the proposals and I believe any comments you think were directed at rifle hunters were most likely directed towards the commission and how THEY catered to the other user groups...
Michael
Post by: hunt4 on March 08, 2009, 10:04:38 PM
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several comments made about Archery being somehow better than rifle or muzzleloader....Several? :dunno:
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VERY against rifle hunters or muzzleloaders having time in the rutNo one asked or suggested modern give up units 105-127 during whitetail rut, or asked for a reduction in tags in the 200 units
during the mule deer rut. (maybe i missed that :dunno:)
I did here Status Quo for area 101 and 250 for archery over and over.
I will give you this i did here some one say these changes greatly favor modern firearms and greatly impact the archery hunters. So if that is bashing there it is.
Quote
come up with SOLUTIONS, not just objections to the changes.What is broken, what solutions are we looking for? According to the # in harvest for deer are right were the WDFG wants them, there going against there own plan :o if it is doe harvest issue permits and control that #, simple.
Now off in the corners and in the hallway not sure of what was said,
but i hope you can understand the frustration of loosing the thing you look forward to the most if it be a whitetail pre, peak, or post rut whitetail hunt or hunt up and down the hills of Swakane.
Post by: Snapshot on March 09, 2009, 10:46:24 PM
You wrote; "several of the archery speakers were VERY against rifle hunters or muzzleloaders having time in the rut..."
I understand how, without knowledge of the proposed reductions in archery opportunity, you could have misconstrued what was said during testimony regarding RETAINING the November 10 start date in the Sherman GMU 101 archery whitetail hunt and not having M/F in there immediately before archers. Modern firearms will, as always, have every single Region 1 GMU north of I-90 for hunting whitetail bucks November 7-19; except GMU 101 which has been an archery unit (and the ONLY archery whitetail RUT unit) for something like twenty-five or thirty years. Modern weapons have never had it and there is no justification for changing that.
A similar thing can be said of the Swakane GMU 250 if you didn't know its history: It is the last remaining Region 2 Late General Season Mule Deer hunt for archers in the vicinity of the old Nason Creek unit, where the first ever archery-only area was granted in about 1943. After losing the Entiat to the permit system in the last three-year package the Swakane is the only Late Season Region 2 GMU left North of I-90 and south of Lake Chelan. And they wonder why it got so crowded. That unit showed a huge spike in hunter numbers after the Department allowed anterless harvest in the last three-year package. It was a blip in 2005, but in 2006 and 2007 the doe harvest was at least equal to the buck harvest and maybe greater than. [All the department needs to do there to resolve the problem is go to a 3 point minimum restriction and open a couple of the units that have been lost over the years (maybe the Alpine and Chiwawa) and the archery hunters will all the room they need to spread out and the deer herd will be fine. And doing so won't displace anyone.]
"and there were several comments made about Archery being somehow better than rifle or muzzleloader...."
I suspect that most archery hunters have past experience in modern-weapons hunting and they who do are generally not shy about letting it be known that archery hunting is a different kind of experience than what they had while hunting with a modern weapon. The Commissioners, most of whom may never have tried archery let alone hunting with a bow and arrow, have to be educated about things that are obvious to seasoned hunters. If we don't explain to them how difficult it is to hunt with a close-range weapon, how are they going to make sound decisions? And by the way, I do consider it 'better' to have to get so close to game that I can count hairs. I wouldn't have it any other way.
I like porter better than beer, too, and I'll preach (given the chance) just how great I think it is. Doesn't make me better... just different.