Hunting Washington Forum

Equipment & Gear => Archery Gear => Topic started by: 92xj on April 01, 2018, 05:38:48 PM

Title: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: 92xj on April 01, 2018, 05:38:48 PM: I bought 4 different arrows to shoot, weigh, compare and decide which I am going to go to for this season.
Elk and deer hunting.
0-60 yard range
Hoyt AlphaMax 35
28.5 Draw
68lbs

1. Carbon Express Maxima Hunter 350
125 gr head
4" wrap
3 blazer vanes
414.4 gr total arrow weight
FOC = 11.7%
Total length, point to nock = 29.125"
Speed 1 arrow length in front of riser = 285.25 fps

2. Black Eagle Spartan 300
125 gr head
4" wrap
3AAE Max Hunter vanes
462.5gr total arrow weight
FOC = 10.8%
Total length, point to nock = 29.6875"
Speed 1 arrow length in front of riser = 271.25 fps

3. Axis Match Grade 5mm 340
125 gr head
4" wrap
3 AAE Max Hunter vanes
453.2gr total arrow weight
FOC = 9.9%
Total length, point to nock = 29.9375
Speed 1 arrow length in front of riser = 271.75 fps

4. FMJ 5mm 340
125 gr head
4" wrap
3AAE Max Hunter vanes
505.8gr total arrow weight
FOC = 8.9%
Total Length = 30.25"
Speed 1 arrow length in front of riser = 258.75fps

I have, on order, 150gr field points that should be here this week. I will be redoing the calcs with them to see if there is anything better than what I have above.

Out of the 4 above, which do you pick and why?
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: jstone on April 01, 2018, 05:45:09 PM: My carbon express arrows are almost the same. I shoot 70 pounds so my arrows are a little heavier. Every animal I have shot with that set up is lights out. I Love That set up
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: huntnfmly on April 01, 2018, 05:47:23 PM: #4
I like the heavy arrow and the momentum it will carry
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on April 01, 2018, 06:21:47 PM: #4
WEIGHT!
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: dscubame on April 01, 2018, 06:22:52 PM: Dedication putting the work in! Me like.
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: Stein on April 01, 2018, 06:43:32 PM: #2. 1 is too light, 4 is too heavy. I picked 2 over 3 due to the FOC.
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: 92xj on April 01, 2018, 06:45:26 PM: Quote from: dscubame on April 01, 2018, 06:22:52 PM
Dedication putting the work in! Me like.

It's an expensive test, but will be worth it. It would be nice to be able to buy a variety pack of arrows for this type of stuff but none to be had. Also, I didn't find much of weight, foc, etc in all my research so hopefully this thread helps others.
After I decide which setup to run I hope to sells the others tried in the testing to someone else looking to perfect their setup.
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: Seahawk12 on April 01, 2018, 07:11:58 PM: I like #4 for the weight but that foc isn't good.
If the heavier tip isn't enough then will that arrow take a weighted insert?
Interested to hear which one "feels" right when you shoot them.
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: demontang on April 01, 2018, 08:16:52 PM: Any will work. I'm running a set up close to the first one 420grns 11% foc and at 313fps. And I have a set up at 538grns 10%foc at 290fps. All those rigs are enough for elk, I personally like to try to keep speed up so in cover I can sneak a arrow through it easier with a flatter trajectory. :tup:
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: Greg Mullins on April 02, 2018, 08:38:20 PM: #4. I’ll take heavy any day.
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: bracer40 on April 02, 2018, 09:56:55 PM: This is a great test and post. Appreciate the share!
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: 92xj on April 03, 2018, 07:31:26 AM: Quote from: bracer40 on April 02, 2018, 09:56:55 PM
This is a great test and post. Appreciate the share!
Thanks, hopefully this helps others though I would still recommend them doing their own testing and calculating with their setup.

This weekend there will be more testing and calculating with the 4 arrows above.
I have enough room to cut roughly 2" off the arrow, shortening them and decrease weight by their gpi numbers. I also have 150gr heads that should be delivered today or tomorrow. My thought is I can shorten the arrows and add more FOC and hopefully stay within spine range.

by cutting the arrows I will lose 16-22grs of total weight but then add an additional 25 grs so increase total weights, from the above numbers, by 4-8grs, increase FOC by a good bit and hopefully be in the same speed range as the above numbers.

Friday the arrows will be cut and inserts installed, Saturday they will go through the chrono with the 150 heads and we shall see.
Hopefully by Sunday I will have my decision made on which arrow and head weight to use for the year.
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: Drewski on April 03, 2018, 07:39:19 AM: Nice test. Won't you be getting towards weak spined with the 150's? I shoot option 3 almost exactly. No complaints.
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: 92xj on April 03, 2018, 08:07:42 AM: I believe I will be getting closer to a weak spine but not sure if it will be too weak or not.
I'm ignornant to the spine game and have only used the charts in the past to determine what I use, arrow wise, based off poundage and length.
So this is all new research and learning.
I'm thinking once I cut down the arrows they should be roughly 2 inches shorter than above and hopefully keep the 150 heads in spine range. I will just have to not cut my finger off as it floats out in front of the riser.
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: demontang on April 03, 2018, 05:24:40 PM: I have my arrows cut to 29.25 for a 30.5" draw. You should be ok on spine at that length with 150 up front
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: DVET253 on April 03, 2018, 10:57:47 PM: 92xj

Curious as to if you’re using a form of archery software while expirementing with these builds? Archers advantage or software for archers. I run both and they’ve really helped reduce the quess work for myself, family and friends rigs. I also run an arrow configuration similar to your #4 build ( raw shaft is 29.25”, .300 spine FMJ with AAE stealth and 100gr tips) FOC is low (~9%)compared to “suggested” but has plowed through elk at 55 yds. If you like I can run some numbers for ya! I will be configuring a 4mm FMJ with the new titanium outsert from Easton to retain my standard 8/32 threaded points and heads anyways.
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: 92xj on April 04, 2018, 05:06:52 AM: I'm not using any sort of software or app beside a calculator and the chronograph. You are more than welcome to run the numbers and see what your info says. I've never seen or heard of those before and have no idea what they do, so I'm all ears to hear what they say and to learn more.

On a side note, I received the 150gr heads last night and threw them on the scale. The we're all between 49.8 and 50.2 good enough of me, my shooting and my testing.
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: theleo on April 04, 2018, 07:24:41 AM: My arrows now are pretty much identical to #3 minus about 10 grains. That being said, for no good reason I'm doing the same as you and going to play around with some 150gr points this year and see how I like them. It'll put my arrow weight just short of 480 grains.
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: 92xj on April 07, 2018, 02:16:59 PM: Got the arrows cut down to the shortest they can be with my rest and riser. Here are new numbers.
Same bow setup
Hoyt AlphaMax 35
28.5 Draw
68lbs

1
Carbon express 125gr head/150gr
Length tip to tip 27.9375"/28.3125
Total weight 410.3gr/435.8 gr
FOC 13.1%/14.5%
Speed 286.6fps/275.7fps

2
BlackEagleSpartan 125gr head/150gr
Length tip to tip 28.0"/28.375"
Total weight 444.4gr/469.9gr
FOC 11.2%/12.3%
Speed 276fps/266.3fps

3
Axis 125gr head/150gr
Length tip to tip 27.937"/28.312"
Total weight 433.4gr/458.9gr
FOC 10.9%/12.25%
Speed 279.3fps/270fps

4
FMJ 5mm 125gr head/150gr
Length tip to tip 27.875"/28.25"
Total weight 479.2gr/504.7gr
FOC 10.3%/11.5%
Speed 265.25fps/259 fps
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: D-Rock425 on April 09, 2018, 11:46:05 AM: Quote from: Stein on April 01, 2018, 06:43:32 PM
#2. 1 is too light, 4 is too heavy. I picked 2 over 3 due to the FOC.
I've killed a ton of stuff with similar sit ups to #1
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: 92xj on April 09, 2018, 11:59:01 AM: I've killed a ton with that #1 setup.
Me being me, it was time to tinker, run some numbers and do a little changing for the next few seasons.
As of right now I have decided to run the #3 with the shortened arrows and 150gr heads.

Axis 5 mm 150gr head
Length tip to tip 28.312"
Total weight 458.9gr
FOC 12.25%
Speed 270fps
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: Greg Mullins on June 06, 2018, 08:36:00 PM: #4 but #3 would be ok
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: 92xj on June 06, 2018, 08:43:58 PM: Well, this whole test is for the birds... I bought a new bow.
Now shooting a centergy. 71.5 lbs, 28.5 draw, 150gr heads, 4 Fletch max stealth, 27" carbon to carbon axis 300s. Total arrow weight is 500.7grains at 272 fps.
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: scottcrb on June 06, 2018, 09:20:37 PM: I would be interested to see which ones grouped the best. I would think a 29" 340 spine arrow at close to 500 gr shoiting 70lb would be underspined. I'd have to run the numbers though.
Title: Re: Arrow testing - Pick the best
Post by: SureThing on June 23, 2018, 02:54:48 PM: I personally try to build and arrow set up that maximizes the grouping and forgiveness to flight keeping speed to a minimum of 280fps with a target of 300 fps. I want to be in the stiffer side of suggested spine range no less tha 400-410 grains total weight and no shorter than 29”. I also want my arrows to all be within .001” of staightness at a minimum. Some suggestions to help your arrow set up is to lighten up the knock end by getting rid of the wrap going with the lightest knocks. You already had gone to 3” four fletch which is a huge improvement for fast arrows with broadheads. You need to keep your FOC at 11% or slightly better and going to a fixed broadhead with as little sideprofile as possible and as close to a cut on impact tip as possible for best penetration. Go online and get an arrow build software like archers avantage it will save you money in the long run. The thing you are missing in your test is your long range grouping test. I make my final decision by shooting and testing my grouping first at 40 then 60 and finally at 80 yards. If my groups at 80 yards with broadheads don’t match my groups with field points then i know something is wrong and i make adjustments until it is fix and that arrow setup never makes it to the field until it does.