Post by: jstone on October 16, 2018, 10:47:10 AM
Crazy
Post by: jackmaster on October 16, 2018, 10:56:53 AM
Post by: DOUBLELUNG on October 16, 2018, 11:47:01 AM
Post by: jstone on October 16, 2018, 11:53:07 AM
Post by: BKMFR on October 16, 2018, 11:53:27 AM
Post by: dvolmer on October 16, 2018, 12:48:48 PM
Post by: skipjack on October 16, 2018, 02:02:28 PM
Post by: RockChuck on October 16, 2018, 02:05:55 PM
Post by: WAnoob on October 16, 2018, 02:28:36 PM
Please report it, it could lead to something more.
Post by: baldopepper on October 16, 2018, 03:04:28 PM
Post by: Mudman on October 16, 2018, 04:11:33 PM
Post by: Apples on October 16, 2018, 07:09:45 PM
Post by: Humptulips on October 16, 2018, 07:35:49 PM
I think 3pt and spike only rule is stupid. Flame on but hunt or don't hunt. Limit hunters but quit setting up for entrapment. Emotions are what people are about and mistakes will always be made based on emotions, its human nature. The sad thing is when a mistake is made people will leave n hide to avoid prosecution instead of NOT wasting and self reporting and taking the punishment. Of course when its such a severe punishment I PROMISE everyone flaming would do the same if they did make a mistake. Don't tell me YOU would NOT make a mistake unless u are not a human. Don't say I would self report cause IF you haven't you have no credibility. People are such armchair judges but cmon man people aren't perfect and will not risk their livelihood to man up. No I have not done it but I know its a possible outcome when I hunt as I do make mistakes. Sorry I am tired of the MR> Perfects ranting.... Geta grip and save your righteousness for yourself...………………………………………………...:yeah:
Post by: CAMPMEAT on October 16, 2018, 07:44:03 PM
Post by: elkboy on October 16, 2018, 07:45:59 PM
Post by: pd on October 16, 2018, 07:49:12 PM
I think 3pt and spike only rule is stupid. Flame on but hunt or don't hunt. Limit hunters but quit setting up for entrapment. Emotions are what people are about and mistakes will always be made based on emotions, its human nature. The sad thing is when a mistake is made people will leave n hide to avoid prosecution instead of NOT wasting and self reporting and taking the punishment. Of course when its such a severe punishment I PROMISE everyone flaming would do the same if they did make a mistake. Don't tell me YOU would NOT make a mistake unless u are not a human. Don't say I would self report cause IF you haven't you have no credibility. People are such armchair judges but cmon man people aren't perfect and will not risk their livelihood to man up. No I have not done it but I know its a possible outcome when I hunt as I do make mistakes. Sorry I am tired of the MR> Perfects ranting.... Geta grip and save your righteousness for yourself...………………………………………………...:yeah:
:yeah:
Post by: jstone on October 16, 2018, 09:22:23 PM
Post by: Biggerhammer on October 16, 2018, 09:25:49 PM
Post by: KFhunter on October 16, 2018, 10:18:04 PM
Post by: spin05 on October 17, 2018, 01:04:42 AM
If in Montana, common sense would be used. In Washington, get ready to lose your hunting privileges!! Maybe if WDFW used common sense in these instances the deer would not have went to waste. People would rather walk away- which is not right, but WDFW doesn't encourage people to do the right thing, when mistakes happen.
Not true. If you turn yourself you will lose the animal and thats about it. There not going to throw the book at you. We shot a spike with a doe tag once. Spikes were tucked behind the ears. The warden didnt even come out. Said take it to nearest butcher. Pay cut and wrap and will consider this your fine. Now this was for a 15 year old kid mind you so he maybe cutting some slack. Or maybe we just got a nice Warden. We also punched his tag
Post by: baldopepper on October 17, 2018, 04:18:04 AM
I think 3pt and spike only rule is stupid. Flame on but hunt or don't hunt. Limit hunters but quit setting up for entrapment. Emotions are what people are about and mistakes will always be made based on emotions, its human nature. The sad thing is when a mistake is made people will leave n hide to avoid prosecution instead of NOT wasting and self reporting and taking the punishment. Of course when its such a severe punishment I PROMISE everyone flaming would do the same if they did make a mistake. Don't tell me YOU would NOT make a mistake unless u are not a human. Don't say I would self report cause IF you haven't you have no credibility. People are such armchair judges but cmon man people aren't perfect and will not risk their livelihood to man up. No I have not done it but I know its a possible outcome when I hunt as I do make mistakes. Sorry I am tired of the MR> Perfects ranting.... Geta grip and save your righteousness for yourself...………… :yeah:……………………………………...So, still trying to figure this rant out, but seems to say if you see a deer with horns your emotions are likely to take over and you might blast it before checking if it's legal. BUT, that's ok because you're only human and can't control your emotions while out in the woods with a high powered rifle. Don't think there's any "Mr perfect" involvement here, but if you can't take the time to make sure your target is legal before shooting perhaps you should stay home with the other kids and play video games.
Post by: Skyvalhunter on October 17, 2018, 05:09:03 AM
Post by: baldopepper on October 17, 2018, 05:42:06 AM
where at and did u report itfound them just off hwy 25 in unit 121 and did call in. Was asked if I knew who shot them and was told enforcement would be out latter to check. Never saw any enforcement people and the deer we're still there a couple of days later. I also suspect they may have been jacklighted as we often see spotlighters going down the that road late at night. I've also reported that and been told they would patrol and check. Don't know if they do or not
Post by: Timberstalker on October 17, 2018, 05:42:21 AM
The minimum pt's rules is keeping yotes well fed. Wish they'd end this practice.
Let’s go back to the early 90’s where you were lucky to find a buck.
Post by: boneaddict on October 17, 2018, 06:45:44 AM
The minimum pt's rules is keeping yotes well fed. Wish they'd end this practice.
I sure don't. From a guy who lives and breathes deer, APRs are not the devil.
Slob hunters on the other hand .... they have always been around and always will be I guess.
Post by: jagermiester on October 17, 2018, 07:13:50 AM
If in Montana, common sense would be used. In Washington, get ready to lose your hunting privileges!! Maybe if WDFW used common sense in these instances the deer would not have went to waste. People would rather walk away- which is not right, but WDFW doesn't encourage people to do the right thing, when mistakes happen.
I lived in MT and have hunted there a lot for the last 25 years. You self report in MT because if you get caught trying to be sneaky they will throw the book at you. Rightfully so. I will say this though I wouldn’t want to tell any warden in Washington or Montana that I wasn’t sure if he had a third point so I shot him.... So I could get a closer look... That’s not an accident, that’s being irresponsible with your privilege to hunt.
An accident is when you are shooting at a legal deer and hit one that’s not . There are many other scenarios that are accidents.
Post by: Okanagan on October 17, 2018, 07:28:05 AM
That afternoon two men on horses rode by our backpack camp toward the basin with the big forkie.
Twenty minutes later we heard a shot as I headed out for my evening hunt. “Doggone, they shot that big forkie,” I said, then immediately regretted being so cynical and jealous that they got a buck. As I headed up the forest service trail they came riding fast, and turned off of the trail to avoid me. I casually changed course to intercept them because I wanted to hear their story.
One of them with wide eyes and waving hands blurted that he had missed a BIG buck in the basin when it bolted from a brush patch. The other fellow was obviously trying to get his partner to shut up and get out of there. The next morning we found the same big fork horn lying dead in a sloping alpine meadow, visible from anywhere on the rim of the basin.
We'd seen a pick-up at the trail head that was almost certainly theirs. It had a small business name and phone number on the door that I no longer remember but seems like it was from Snohomish. I don't think that we reported it, can't recall for sure. I don't excuse the man for shooting too quickly on a suddenly bounding buck with big antlers but felt bad for him. Another year up there some college fellows killed two legal bucks the afternoon before the season opened. That one I would have reported with relish but was not going to hike out nine miles and drive to a phone.
I have passed shots on legal bucks because I was not sure of their antlers. I played tag with one such buck for 30 minutes and killed it my third opportunity when finally it turned its head just right and the doggone thing was a 4x4! It had given me several straight on looks in timber, all tines aligned and no way to count them.
Post by: Old Man Yager on October 17, 2018, 07:47:47 AM
Post by: throttlejocky20 on October 17, 2018, 08:56:01 AM
I like the rule and i wish they would follow Oregon and make the whole west coast 2 pt minimum. The only issue is people getting itchy on the trigger. I have watched a few buck just to see that they are leagal to late to get a shot. I would like to see more youth permits for any buck on the east side but if they took the point restriction away it would only take a year and you wouldnt being seeing bucks at all.The minimum pt's rules is keeping yotes well fed. Wish they'd end this practice.
I sure don't. From a guy who lives and breathes deer, APRs are not the devil.
Slob hunters on the other hand .... they have always been around and always will be I guess.
Post by: Big game archer on October 17, 2018, 09:00:42 AM
Post by: KFhunter on October 17, 2018, 09:01:22 AM
The minimum pt's rules is keeping yotes well fed. Wish they'd end this practice.
I sure don't. From a guy who lives and breathes deer, APRs are not the devil.
Slob hunters on the other hand .... they have always been around and always will be I guess.
Guess it would take some explaining how killing spikes and forkies make more bigger better bucks?
Seems to me that more people would go home with deer if they took a forkie and the big ones would still be out there :dunno:
Or maybe with the APR's in place less people go home with deer and the yotes eat just a little better, which makes more yotes to eat fawns...I digress :chuckle:
the guys that can get into the bigger bucks have a few more to choose from...it's that 10% of hunters that take big bucks that love APR's
I do know that forkies are hitting the dirt and being left in these GMU's and I can't wrap my head around the benefits of having them in the first place
Only thing I can really think of is those forkies are stupid and too many of them get killed hanging out with does, having a 3pt min in place allows them time to get into bachelor herds and less likely to get shot.
Post by: Okanagan on October 17, 2018, 09:28:57 AM
I like the rule and i wish they would follow Oregon and make the whole west coast 2 pt minimum. The only issue is people getting itchy on the trigger. I have watched a few buck just to see that they are leagal to late to get a shot. I would like to see more youth permits for any buck on the east side but if they took the point restriction away it would only take a year and you wouldnt being seeing bucks at all.
Hmmm... consider the long term consequences of protecting spikes and killing off young bucks with the genetics to produce multiple points their first antler year. My experience makes me think that it diminishes antler size in the whole deer population.
I used to live and hunt in California, where a fork horn or better rule has been in place for 50 (70?) years or more. (Don't know if it still is or not). I have never seen so many mature bodied spikes and old fork horn bucks anywhere else. LOTS of spikes. The long term consequence of the fork horn or better rule appears to give advantage to bucks with the genetics to be a spike rather than a fork their first year and never grow much for antlers. Some will never be more than a big spike, and some, like one huge ancient buck I killed, will max out as a fork. A fork horn or better rule appears to diminish antler size in the entire deer population.
Post by: npaull on October 17, 2018, 09:41:57 AM
Quote
A fork horn or better rule appears to diminish antler size in the entire deer population.
Doesn't just *appear* to. It ABSOLUTELY HAS to. The only question is how fast evolution will work in this scenario to produce the change. But given enough time (and it increasingly appears that it requires surprisingly little time to notice the effects) this absolutely, 100% of the time WILL happen.
Post by: baldopepper on October 17, 2018, 09:53:36 AM
Post by: bobcat on October 17, 2018, 10:19:43 AM
Post by: KFhunter on October 17, 2018, 10:47:03 PM
too many hunters, not enough deer > enter restrictions (while maintaining OTC tag sales)
Post by: dvolmer on October 18, 2018, 06:00:15 AM
Post by: fishngamereaper on October 18, 2018, 07:04:51 AM
Keep whackin the big ones you end up with a bunch of small ones..simple math.
Post by: RockChuck on October 18, 2018, 07:07:33 AM
Post by: boneaddict on October 18, 2018, 07:08:05 AM
Post by: fishngamereaper on October 18, 2018, 07:11:04 AM
Keep wackin the little ones and they never grow up to be big ones, nor do they grow up at all. :)
Totally agree, but at some point you need to take the lifetime two points out of the equation.
Post by: bobcat on October 18, 2018, 07:19:33 AM
maybe some 2pt or better youth/senior permits for certain areas?
They do have some youth "any deer" permits in some units.
Post by: Karl Blanchard on October 18, 2018, 07:38:14 AM
Personally I don't believe the 3 point minimum restriction is a good management strategy, but if we are to have an unlimited number of over the counter deer tags in this state, it's impossible to do away with it. To go to an any mule deer buck hunting season would require some sort of limitation on the number of mule deer hunters in each GMU, in order to limit harvest to a sustainable level.This! We can piss and moan all we want about this or that but at the end of the day this fact ends the argument.
I'm also thinking some dont know how genetics work :chuckle:
Post by: Jonathan_S on October 18, 2018, 07:46:22 AM
I've said it multiple times that of all the "giant two points" I hear about and/or see, I can only recall one or two that was older than 1.5-2.5
Better find out a way to measure the genetic traits which a doe will pass on to buck fawns :o
Post by: RockChuck on October 18, 2018, 07:59:36 AM
maybe some 2pt or better youth/senior permits for certain areas?
They do have some youth "any deer" permits in some units.
ahh yes I have seen those :tup: are they in place/areas to help with this "problem"
I cant say that I have ever seen a very mature or old 2 pt but from reading seems others are so I'm just weighing in with no expertise here :chuckle:
Post by: Mudman on October 18, 2018, 08:11:02 AM
No not like that. People get excited. People see a branch n think its a rack. A buck may stand behind another. Seeing things ya want to see when its not really there. People do weird stuff not on purpose, humanity. Like an eye witness for example who sees things n misses things but swears they seen it! I just saying people r people. Mistake prone, even with training n good intentions.I think 3pt and spike only rule is stupid. Flame on but hunt or don't hunt. Limit hunters but quit setting up for entrapment. Emotions are what people are about and mistakes will always be made based on emotions, its human nature. The sad thing is when a mistake is made people will leave n hide to avoid prosecution instead of NOT wasting and self reporting and taking the punishment. Of course when its such a severe punishment I PROMISE everyone flaming would do the same if they did make a mistake. Don't tell me YOU would NOT make a mistake unless u are not a human. Don't say I would self report cause IF you haven't you have no credibility. People are such armchair judges but cmon man people aren't perfect and will not risk their livelihood to man up. No I have not done it but I know its a possible outcome when I hunt as I do make mistakes. Sorry I am tired of the MR> Perfects ranting.... Geta grip and save your righteousness for yourself...………… :yeah:……………………………………...So, still trying to figure this rant out, but seems to say if you see a deer with horns your emotions are likely to take over and you might blast it before checking if it's legal. BUT, that's ok because you're only human and can't control your emotions while out in the woods with a high powered rifle. Don't think there's any "Mr perfect" involvement here, but if you can't take the time to make sure your target is legal before shooting perhaps you should stay home with the other kids and play video games.
Post by: Karl Blanchard on October 18, 2018, 08:24:04 AM
There are many people who are concerned about this 3 pt rule (in place now for decades) enabling the mature 2 pt boogeyman. Yes I'm aware this has been identified in certain areas, mainly the agricultural areas around Lind/Ritzville and the farther to the SE.spot on!
I've said it multiple times that of all the "giant two points" I hear about and/or see, I can only recall one or two that was older than 1.5-2.5
Better find out a way to measure the genetic traits which a doe will pass on to buck fawns :o
Post by: D-Rock425 on October 18, 2018, 08:28:34 AM
Post by: h20hunter on October 18, 2018, 08:31:27 AM
Post by: boneaddict on October 18, 2018, 08:36:30 AM
Post by: D-Rock425 on October 18, 2018, 12:56:42 PM
Daughter tag one? Legal deer....not a 2pt of course.no I filled my doe tag on a shot to get for her to shoot. She had safety off a few times just could not get clear shots. Heading back this weekend.
Post by: Pathfinder101 on October 18, 2018, 01:10:02 PM
Always good to report them to WDFW enforcement. Maybe nothing happens, maybe they have information about a shooter but no dead two point.
:yeah:
Post by: Sakko300wsm on October 18, 2018, 08:05:42 PM
I think 3pt and spike only rule is stupid. Flame on but hunt or don't hunt. Limit hunters but quit setting up for entrapment. Emotions are what people are about and mistakes will always be made based on emotions, its human nature. The sad thing is when a mistake is made people will leave n hide to avoid prosecution instead of NOT wasting and self reporting and taking the punishment. Of course when its such a severe punishment I PROMISE everyone flaming would do the same if they did make a mistake. Don't tell me YOU would NOT make a mistake unless u are not a human. Don't say I would self report cause IF you haven't you have no credibility. People are such armchair judges but cmon man people aren't perfect and will not risk their livelihood to man up. No I have not done it but I know its a possible outcome when I hunt as I do make mistakes. Sorry I am tired of the MR> Perfects ranting.... Geta grip and save your righteousness for yourself...………… :yeah:……………………………………...So, still trying to figure this rant out, but seems to say if you see a deer with horns your emotions are likely to take over and you might blast it before checking if it's legal. BUT, that's ok because you're only human and can't control your emotions while out in the woods with a high powered rifle. Don't think there's any "Mr perfect" involvement here, but if you can't take the time to make sure your target is legal before shooting perhaps you should stay home with the other kids and play video games.
Exactly!! Do not ever shoot if you don’t know you’re target!!
Same people that shoot 2 points could very possibly be the same people that would shoot at a person that doesn’t have orange on!!
Complete *censored* for both
Post by: pashok23 on October 18, 2018, 08:50:20 PM
:yeah:I think 3pt and spike only rule is stupid. Flame on but hunt or don't hunt. Limit hunters but quit setting up for entrapment. Emotions are what people are about and mistakes will always be made based on emotions, its human nature. The sad thing is when a mistake is made people will leave n hide to avoid prosecution instead of NOT wasting and self reporting and taking the punishment. Of course when its such a severe punishment I PROMISE everyone flaming would do the same if they did make a mistake. Don't tell me YOU would NOT make a mistake unless u are not a human. Don't say I would self report cause IF you haven't you have no credibility. People are such armchair judges but cmon man people aren't perfect and will not risk their livelihood to man up. No I have not done it but I know its a possible outcome when I hunt as I do make mistakes. Sorry I am tired of the MR> Perfects ranting.... Geta grip and save your righteousness for yourself...………… :yeah:……………………………………...So, still trying to figure this rant out, but seems to say if you see a deer with horns your emotions are likely to take over and you might blast it before checking if it's legal. BUT, that's ok because you're only human and can't control your emotions while out in the woods with a high powered rifle. Don't think there's any "Mr perfect" involvement here, but if you can't take the time to make sure your target is legal before shooting perhaps you should stay home with the other kids and play video games.
Exactly!! Do not ever shoot if you don’t know you’re target!!
Same people that shoot 2 points could very possibly be the same people that would shoot at a person that doesn’t have orange on!!
Complete *censored* for both
Post by: Mudman on October 19, 2018, 07:14:50 AM
Post by: boneaddict on October 19, 2018, 07:59:40 AM
I think 3pt and spike only rule is stupid. Flame on but hunt or don't hunt. Limit hunters but quit setting up for entrapment. Emotions are what people are about and mistakes will always be made based on emotions, its human nature. The sad thing is when a mistake is made people will leave n hide to avoid prosecution instead of NOT wasting and self reporting and taking the punishment. Of course when its such a severe punishment I PROMISE everyone flaming would do the same if they did make a mistake. Don't tell me YOU would NOT make a mistake unless u are not a human. Don't say I would self report cause IF you haven't you have no credibility. People are such armchair judges but cmon man people aren't perfect and will not risk their livelihood to man up. No I have not done it but I know its a possible outcome when I hunt as I do make mistakes. Sorry I am tired of the MR> Perfects ranting.... Geta grip and save your righteousness for yourself...………… :yeah:……………………………………...So, still trying to figure this rant out, but seems to say if you see a deer with horns your emotions are likely to take over and you might blast it before checking if it's legal. BUT, that's ok because you're only human and can't control your emotions while out in the woods with a high powered rifle. Don't think there's any "Mr perfect" involvement here, but if you can't take the time to make sure your target is legal before shooting perhaps you should stay home with the other kids and play video games.
Exactly!! Do not ever shoot if you don’t know you’re target!!
Same people that shoot 2 points could very possibly be the same people that would shoot at a person that doesn’t have orange on!!
Complete *censored* for both
I was almost killed because of a hunter like this. I had three two points and a small three if I remember right, come jogging off the hill, pushed by hunters on opening morning. The lead deer was actually one of these giant twos you guys are referencing. He was headed for another county. The deer ran mere feet in front of me. The little three didn’t interest me. The deer passed by. All of a sudden BAM! I was sprayed with blood. The little forked horn fell dead at my feet. It literally died touching me. The guy came running up. “Did I get it”. I turned and walked away. I swear if I had said anything I’d have clubbed him to death. A couple other guys saw it and called it in. The guy tried to get the deer off the hill but WDFW caught him at his rig. All jacked up and excited. People need to,calm the heck down, or shouldn’t be out hunting with a gun. If you can’t take the time to know your target.....
Post by: Damnimissed on October 19, 2018, 07:47:18 PM
I have seen a couple of 2x2's dead over the years of hunting in Washington. Its non-explainable but it does happen. The first year the Yakima area went to spike only elk hunting I came across a guy that had shot a 2x2 bull thinking it was a spike. When I saw him he had a rock and was trying to brake the small point off. We should be better hunters and make sure before we shoot. Now with all this said, and I will probably take heat from this comment, If I ever was to make this mistake I wouldn't notify WDFW to turn myself in. In this state they would tell you thanks for being honest and then throw the absolute book at you! Thousands of dollars later and you picture in the paper it would be over.
I’ll tell you what; honesty and your attitude go a long way when someone owns up to a mistake like this. I would really hope you wouldn’t leave an animal to rot.
Post by: Mudman on October 20, 2018, 11:03:48 AM
Post by: RockChuck on October 20, 2018, 12:03:58 PM
Post by: BULLBLASTER on October 20, 2018, 12:28:34 PM
So why is it 3 point or better for deer and spike only for elk? What is the reason it is different?They are different species of animals. Why is it any bear but not any deer?
Hopefully my sarcasm came through with this post. 8)
Post by: Jonathan_S on October 20, 2018, 01:13:24 PM
Sorry @RockChuck maybe you meant something different by that question :hello:
Post by: rickomatic on October 20, 2018, 05:39:43 PM
Post by: RockChuck on October 20, 2018, 06:25:09 PM
So why is it 3 point or better for deer and spike only for elk? What is the reason it is different?They are different species of animals. Why is it any bear but not any deer?
Hopefully my sarcasm came through with this post. 8)
Lol yup I get the sarcasam, just thinking out loud but that makes sense
That’s actually extremely true. Different species.
Sorry @RockChuck maybe you meant something different by that question :hello:
I was thinking restriction wise not species but yes that was my question
Post by: RockChuck on October 20, 2018, 06:26:17 PM
Post by: rickomatic on October 21, 2018, 09:44:21 AM
Post by: KFhunter on October 22, 2018, 05:37:22 PM
Hearing that the wildlife department was out writing citations for hunters harvesting deer that didn't meet the 3 point restriction and then taking the illegal deer and giving them to other hunters in the area anybody been hearing anything about this?
Yes
We got two deer last year. The officers are getting so many illegal deer they cannot get rid of the fast enough.
The food bank will not take them.
One agent last year had five illegal heads in his truck from one day. One 3 point. It was shot by a Hunter across a hwy,on private property ,while folks were yelling at him not to shoot.
They will not give you a deer shot in the gmu where you are camped. You do not get the heads only the body with a paper which allows you to have the deer without head.
How many forkies are not being found?
Post by: Okanagan on October 22, 2018, 06:58:59 PM
by the way, if you all are so worried about genetics, you all would do away with all the late tags and quit shooting all the big bucks...(crickets)......I didn't think so. LOL
Bone, I think you know that I have the highest regard for you, so no disrespect intended when I say that your tongue in cheek comment is a little disingenuous. Somewhere between all or nothing, kill anything or kill no deer of any kind, there is a self sustaining balance, and looking for that is what this debate and game restrictions are about.
Not very many hunters consistently find big bucks to kill. How about a restriction that if you kill a 4x4 that scores above 160, you don't get any deer tag for the next three years? :) That is a narrowly targeted law, effecting few hunters, that would likely do more to preserve the genetics of big antlers than most other ideas we've posted here.
Post by: bigtex on October 22, 2018, 07:32:26 PM
If in Montana, common sense would be used. In Washington, get ready to lose your hunting privileges!! Maybe if WDFW used common sense in these instances the deer would not have went to waste. People would rather walk away- which is not right, but WDFW doesn't encourage people to do the right thing, when mistakes happen.WDFW Officers can and do use judgement in self reporting violations. Are they still going to get charged, sure (as they should). Is it automatically going to be for illegally taking an animal out of season (2pt in 3 or season), no. Plenty of times the individual is cited for something like failing to tag instead of the bigger charge of out of season, in fact this was seen on the Rugged Justice show.
Problem is if you say self reporters face no penalties then more people will take shots without identifying their game and if it's a 2pt in a 3pt they can call WDFW and walk away free.
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Post by: bustedoldman on October 31, 2018, 10:32:08 AM
There are many people who are concerned about this 3 pt rule (in place now for decades) enabling the mature 2 pt boogeyman. Yes I'm aware this has been identified in certain areas, mainly the agricultural areas around Lind/Ritzville and the farther to the SE.
I've said it multiple times that of all the "giant two points" I hear about and/or see, I can only recall one or two that was older than 1.5-2.5
I agree.... Not sure if this will sound too condescending, bitter, angry or right on spot...But if all one sees' is "Nothing but 2pts all the time!" spend a little more time in your hunting area. Not just pre-season.....Not just the week of hunting season( Yes I know location/finances play a huge roll.) ....But after season as well, it'll make you sad, mad and surprised by what you see. You'll ask yourself where was that monster hiding all year?!?! And I hunt south of Ritzville every year.
Post by: KP-Skagit on October 31, 2018, 10:49:51 AM
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Post by: jstone on October 31, 2018, 10:56:48 AM
Post by: ghosthunter on October 31, 2018, 11:07:29 AM
If in Montana, common sense would be used. In Washington, get ready to lose your hunting privileges!! Maybe if WDFW used common sense in these instances the deer would not have went to waste. People would rather walk away- which is not right, but WDFW doesn't encourage people to do the right thing, when mistakes happen.
Last year I know of a guy who shot a 2pt. while targeting a 3 pt. He dressed it out ,drug it down a mountain and called a game agent.
The agent took the deer, wrote a ticket, and shook the guys hand. He was free to continue to hunt.
Post by: ghosthunter on October 31, 2018, 11:59:31 AM
Those are just the ones that got reported.
We don't want to acknowledge it but I think that there is a huge population of hunters who are so goal driven that they just don't care. Its not a mistake. They are blasting at deer beyond their effective range or skills and when the points don't add up they leave it lay.
I have self reported myself 40 years ago and I was treated very fair.
I know folks who have self reported and also were treated very fair.
There are a ton of people out there that would be very pleased with a spike deer. I understand the 3 point rule but it does not take into account the ethics of many hunters and thus I believe allows over harvest. If you need proof of this just look at the folks you come in contact with every day in our lives. Breaking all kinds of laws because it is convenient for them to do so. Do you think a guy who holds his cell phone while driving or is texting will all of a sudden follow the rules out hunting. Do you think a person who drinks and drives, parks in a handicap spot, shoots over his limit in ducks, doesn't follow the 15 shell limit, catches too many crabs or fish, or any number of other infractions will all of a sudden be the perfect person while out hunting.
We have a large group of goal orientated hunters who want to succeed at any cost. We have seen this with TV pro hunters from time to time. The pressure to come home with an animal over rides common sense and ethics. Its like a person who shoplifts but has a wallet full of money. The need to succeed at any cost drives a lot of hunters to the gutter.
We had a fellow in our camp years ago. He would tell you right out that he only cared about the meat. That was the only reason he was hunting period. He followed the rules because our camp requires it. But the meat was all he was after. Not the experience, the friendship, the process just the meat. He no longer hunts with us.
On our cook shack wall is written.
"If You Came Only For The Meat, You Came For The Wrong Reason"
Post by: jstone on October 31, 2018, 12:31:41 PM
Post by: wildweeds on October 31, 2018, 12:38:09 PM
Post by: Bob33 on October 31, 2018, 12:43:25 PM
I suspect the number of hunters who violate a game law and get consequences that may be excessive or unreasonable is far outnumber by the number of hunters who violate a game a law and get off too easily, or aren't caught at all.If in Montana, common sense would be used. In Washington, get ready to lose your hunting privileges!! Maybe if WDFW used common sense in these instances the deer would not have went to waste. People would rather walk away- which is not right, but WDFW doesn't encourage people to do the right thing, when mistakes happen.WDFW Officers can and do use judgement in self reporting violations. Are they still going to get charged, sure (as they should). Is it automatically going to be for illegally taking an animal out of season (2pt in 3 or season), no. Plenty of times the individual is cited for something like failing to tag instead of the bigger charge of out of season, in fact this was seen on the Rugged Justice show.
Problem is if you say self reporters face no penalties then more people will take shots without identifying their game and if it's a 2pt in a 3pt they can call WDFW and walk away free.
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Post by: steen on November 06, 2018, 10:04:13 PM
Post by: Skyvalhunter on November 07, 2018, 05:06:49 AM
Post by: andrew_in_idaho on November 07, 2018, 10:16:46 AM
A couple of buddies and I were out hunting in some mixed scabland/dryland farm country. We spotted a group of deer, 3 bucks, 7 or 8 does. We are watching them cross this field and all 3 of us put a 3rd point on the right hand antler of the 2nd buck in line, my buddy shoots and he drops. We walk up to the buck and the 3rd point is not there. None of us are the type to walk away and leave a deer to waste, but we are also young and a little bit scared. 15-20 miles away is the one and only mule deer unit that is open to “any buck”(I think at that time it may have been any deer) we got that thing cleaned up and scooted on over to that unit for the rest of the day, and if we got checked the story was that this buck came from said unit. Was it right? Not in the least. Did 3 different sets of eyes,with time and glass, make a poor judgement call on whether or not there was an extra 1” projection on a set of antlers? Absolutely.
All of this to say I understand that mistakes do happen.
As to the 3 point minimum rule I don’t know the correct answer. Unlimited “any buck” hunting is not the answer. Very few of us want to see a draw only system so that probably isn’t it either. The 2 pt or less strategy is an interesting one but they are currently using that strategy in the Owyhee’s here in Idaho and I know that they are currently, quietly re-examining that strategy as they are starting to see detrimental effects to buck to doe ratios so that probably isn’t the answer either. As it stands the 3 pt minimum is probably the best tool in WDFW’s toolbox for managing their deer herds/hunters.
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