Post by: bigskyhounds on December 10, 2019, 03:38:52 PM
This is in the mountains on private property near state and timber ground. Being a couple year old picture I'm sure the predators have taken a toll and you wouldn't have half these deer on camera now.
Post by: Skyvalhunter on December 10, 2019, 03:44:53 PM
Post by: huntnnw on December 10, 2019, 11:24:56 PM
Post by: JL on December 11, 2019, 12:26:45 AM
Post by: huntnnw on December 11, 2019, 12:31:53 AM
Post by: boneaddict on December 11, 2019, 06:20:59 AM
Anecdotally, during the rut, the ground opens up and bucks become visible that were there all the time, just not seen. In fact I venture that before the invention of the trailcam, there were many whitetail bucks that werent ever seen by human eyes.
Post by: Bango skank on December 11, 2019, 06:29:06 AM
I think the ratio thing is a flawed factor in their management practice. In no way shape or form should they be adding doe permits when densities are so low, to manage to a ratio.
Killing does is the easiest, most effective way to increase buck to doe ratios, but its only a valid option when your deer population is high enough to support killing off does. Ours is NOT. since we cant afford to kill does due to our low overall deer population, the next best thing to increase buck to doe ratios is the antler point restriction. Protect all those stupid, too-easy-to-kill peckerhead bucks. Bring back the 4pt apr, but this time for the entire ne corner, if not all whitetail units.
Post by: boneaddict on December 11, 2019, 06:31:01 AM
Post by: baldopepper on December 11, 2019, 07:46:03 AM
That would be my move, and eliminate all the special doe permits. All of them! Even the feel good ones.. I agree. I know many wouldn't like it, but I also think it might be time to eliminate the late hunt for a while also. The bucks did show up late in that hunt this year, but there was also a ton of hunters out chasing them. (Around my place there were a lot more hunters than there were for the early hunt). Also found two more small mule deer bucks near the road that had been shot and left. Wardens at the Miles/Creston checking station said they had reports of several more mule deer shot and left. I enjoy the late hunt, but not sure it's in the best interest for the either of the herds
Post by: Henrydog on December 11, 2019, 07:59:05 AM
My Fear with this though is 2 fold. I don't think APR have help the Mule deer recover at all. I am aware there are separate management issues with Mulie's but their number have not recovered under the 3 point restrictions.
2nd my main fear in this State. Once they take something they never give it back.
Post by: boneaddict on December 11, 2019, 08:15:14 AM
Post by: Gobble Doc on December 11, 2019, 08:29:04 AM
That would be my move, and eliminate all the special doe permits. All of them! Even the feel good ones.Agreed
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Wsucoug on December 11, 2019, 10:12:48 AM
Post by: nwalpineguide on December 11, 2019, 11:15:04 AM
In my humble opinion, I emphatically agree with Boneaddict. As this is true as well for mule deer where I run multiple trail cameras within and outside the GPW. Have done so now since 2010. Without these units and field surveys by professionals...inferences and anecdotal snippits is all we have to base CONCLUSIONS upon. :twocents:
Post by: bigskyhounds on December 12, 2019, 04:09:21 PM
Some herds will go through declines sometimes huge drops in numbers. Whether it be from blue tounge or hard winters. The ability to rebound depends on pressure. I know everyone here knows it but our predator problem is out of control and if wdfw doesn't do something it will only get worse. There will be no rebound.
There were a couple guys at the meeting in chewelah and they were talking about how they didn't care we got the 2 bear limit changed. they had never shot a bear and didn't have any desire to. they were worried about the deer and the elk though. Maybe these guys don't realize how hard bears are on fawns and calves but if you care about the herds buy a bear tag and shoot one!
Post by: hunter399 on December 12, 2019, 04:51:03 PM
The deer counts are a joke .what about deer/public land ratio which at a big zero for some areas.NE wa is all screwed up I do agree on that.
Post by: buckfvr on December 12, 2019, 04:57:52 PM
That would be my move, and eliminate all the special doe permits. All of them! Even the feel good ones.. I agree. I know many wouldn't like it, but I also think it might be time to eliminate the late hunt for a while also. The bucks did show up late in that hunt this year, but there was also a ton of hunters out chasing them. (Around my place there were a lot more hunters than there were for the early hunt). Also found two more small mule deer bucks near the road that had been shot and left. Wardens at the Miles/Creston checking station said they had reports of several more mule deer shot and left. I enjoy the late hunt, but not sure it's in the best interest for the either of the herds
Just by nature of the 4pt minimum for n.e. whitetails, not only would hunter numbers decline for the late hunt, but also the general season. No one seems to think they can find a 4pt. :dunno: :chuckle: :yike:
Post by: Bango skank on December 13, 2019, 03:58:04 AM
There were a couple guys at the meeting in chewelah and they were talking about how they didn't care we got the 2 bear limit changed. they had never shot a bear and didn't have any desire to. they were worried about the deer and the elk though. Maybe these guys don't realize how hard bears are on fawns and calves but if you care about the herds buy a bear tag and shoot one!
:bash:
This attitude drives me crazy. People who bitch about deer numbers, but refuse to make any attempt to kill their predators. If you wont even buy bear and lion tags i dont think you really have any right complaining about the lack of deer.
Hell, the way things are going, hunting bear in august is about the best big game opportunity we have now anyway. Easier to find a bear in august than it is to find a buck in november imo. If nothing else its a way to get some meat in the freezer incase you get skunked when deer season comes around.
Post by: HillHound on December 13, 2019, 04:22:08 AM