Post by: Night goat on April 10, 2020, 12:00:12 PM
so my buddy just got into hunting and he already wants to do an archery bear hunt this August. Not my first choice of a hunt but if it's to get my buddy into the sport I'm just happy he wants to do it.
now before I ask this question, my first choice in sidearm would be a shaved hammer stainless 357 or 44 but I don't have one.
only handgun I own is a 9mm taurus. with proper ammo like buffalo bore hard cast +P
https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=388
would a 9mm be an acceptable side arm?
I am talking strictly for black bear in the casades, forget Alaska forget canada, I've spent enough time up there to know what works and what doesn't, but the critters here are smaller and not as agro.
I am skeptical but curious none the less
Post by: h20hunter on April 10, 2020, 12:02:33 PM
Post by: Jason on April 10, 2020, 12:06:14 PM
I remember Tonymoe bringing his .380 to montana one year, we laughed as he said he only needed one round to off himself hopefully before the Grizz got him.
Post by: Night goat on April 10, 2020, 12:08:32 PM
I would say no to the 9mm being an acceptable firearm for Black Bear.
I remember Tonymoe bringing his .380 to montana one year, we laughed as he said he only needed one round to off himself hopefully before the Grizz got him.
well we all know the best bear gun is a 22 short. just gotta get your buddy in the leg and you're safe
Post by: bhawley76 on April 10, 2020, 12:08:53 PM
Post by: magnanimous_j on April 10, 2020, 12:09:27 PM
I'm a big advocate for the 9mm. I think as black bear defense, it rates somewhere between "a lot better than nothing" to "adequate, but not ideal"
Post by: Jason on April 10, 2020, 12:16:00 PM
You will get 1000 opinions but basically, imo, sure. Rung what yah brung. Better than nothing. 99.9% he will never need it for lil blackies.:yeah: I do agree that it is better than having nothing.
Post by: JJB11B on April 10, 2020, 12:21:24 PM
I think someone on here recently posted a study that showed that using a firearm of ANY caliber was effective about 97% of the time in stopping a bear attack (brown bears included).I concur
I'm a big advocate for the 9mm. I think as black bear defense, it rates somewhere between "a lot better than nothing" to "adequate, but not ideal"
Post by: carpsniperg2 on April 10, 2020, 12:30:09 PM
Post by: Jpmiller on April 10, 2020, 12:36:59 PM
Post by: jrebel on April 10, 2020, 12:40:14 PM
You have a better chance of drawing a sidearm on a meth head in the woods in my opinion and a 9mm is plenty adequate for that.
Post by: h20hunter on April 10, 2020, 12:46:38 PM
Agreed about trailhead tweekers.
Post by: Night goat on April 10, 2020, 12:48:25 PM
First off..... how many people on here have ever been confronted by a Washington black bear? A very small percentage I bet. Second when around a black bear what has been your observations? Mine, well they want nothing to do with me. With the above said......I would be willing to bet anything that goes bang will scare a bear away. 9mm will be just fine if my experiences and theory are correct. If I was targeting a black bear with a pistol caliber.....I would pick something bigger.
You have a better chance of drawing a sidearm on a meth head in the woods in my opinion and a 9mm is plenty adequate for that.
yeah I'm not concerned about bumping into a bear, our bears here are total weenies, I'm more concerned about my buddy hopped up on adrenaline and wounding a bear and having to then deal with that
the typical Alaska bear encounter is simply not going to happen to a pair of dudes in the Cascades where you'd have to drop a raging griz at point blank
Post by: Stein on April 10, 2020, 12:48:43 PM
My 9mm holds 15 in a standard mag. Not being any kind of veteran or policeman trained to and experienced in shooting where something is shooting or attacking back I like the comfort of knowing I have a few more chances. I've never felt under gunned and when I was in Wyoming with an outfitter whose guide had just been killed by a grizz he seemed to think my G19 was a fine companion.
Trained police don't have a stellar record and that's against a guy who isn't running like a speeding train with a circulatory system that allows them to live several minutes after a heart shot. It's one of the reasons I carry spray for bears.
Quote
KEY FINDINGS
Donner and Popovich consider these results to be of significance:
Incident-level accuracy: Among all 149 shootings studied, officers struck the suspect “with at least one round 54 percent of the time.” There was some fluctuation from year to year, but the overall prevailing trend was about a 50/50 split between hits and misses – “not very accurate,” the researchers note.
Bullet-level accuracy: Here, officers fired 354 rounds at suspects. Half the officers “were entirely inaccurate,” including one who fired 23 misses! Overall, about one-third (35 percent) of all officers’ rounds hit the targeted suspect. Most of those who had “perfect marksmanship” fired only one round.
Post by: Cougartail on April 10, 2020, 12:50:15 PM
hey guys
so my buddy just got into hunting and he already wants to do an archery bear hunt this August. Not my first choice of a hunt but if it's to get my buddy into the sport I'm just happy he wants to do it.
now before I ask this question, my first choice in sidearm would be a shaved hammer stainless 357 or 44 but I don't have one.
only handgun I own is a 9mm taurus. with proper ammo like buffalo bore hard cast +P
https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=388
would a 9mm be an acceptable side arm?
I am talking strictly for black bear in the casades, forget Alaska forget canada, I've spent enough time up there to know what works and what doesn't, but the critters here are smaller and not as agro.
I am skeptical but curious none the less
Underwood Hardcast 147grain. That will fix most bear problems. I never worried about bears until one charged me. When food is scarce or an animal is injured normal behavior goes out the window. Also had 4 dirtbags try and kill me once too up in the mountains..things happen but rarely..
Post by: Night goat on April 10, 2020, 12:50:41 PM
Post by: carpsniperg2 on April 10, 2020, 01:16:13 PM
Post by: Jpmiller on April 10, 2020, 01:27:00 PM
My 9mm holds 15 in a standard mag. Not being any kind of veteran or policeman trained to and experienced in shooting where something is shooting or attacking back I like the comfort of knowing I have a few more chances. I've never felt under gunned and when I was in Wyoming with an outfitter whose guide had just been killed by a grizz he seemed to think my G19 was a fine companion.
Trained police don't have a stellar record and that's against a guy who isn't running like a speeding train with a circulatory system that allows them to live several minutes after a heart shot. It's one of the reasons I carry spray for bears.QuoteKEY FINDINGS
Donner and Popovich consider these results to be of significance:
Incident-level accuracy: Among all 149 shootings studied, officers struck the suspect “with at least one round 54 percent of the time.” There was some fluctuation from year to year, but the overall prevailing trend was about a 50/50 split between hits and misses – “not very accurate,” the researchers note.
Bullet-level accuracy: Here, officers fired 354 rounds at suspects. Half the officers “were entirely inaccurate,” including one who fired 23 misses! Overall, about one-third (35 percent) of all officers’ rounds hit the targeted suspect. Most of those who had “perfect marksmanship” fired only one round.
My point being that I would rather have 16 shots with my 9mm than 6 with the 357. Hopefully I'll be cool calm and collected should I need to be, buy probably I'll need as many shots as I can. If the guys with training hit around half the time I would bet that as awesome as I think that I am, I'm probably not as good as them.
Post by: Night goat on April 10, 2020, 01:29:48 PM
Its true that there is a small % of people that have problems with bears. However there is plenty of members on here such as myself that have had problems with bears. I have had 2, I have posted pictures of one of the times I got charged by a sow. Another time I had to shoot to get a sow to stop coming for me. A member I think it was Wea300mag had to shoot at a bear that kept coming for him and he had pics or a video if I remember right. Heck Bone got mobbed by one and I think it was a single shot contender pistol that saved him with a bear on him. Another member had pics or a video of a bear that was aggressive and he shot at multiple times to get it to leave. Trust me it happens. The idea of probably wont happen is legit but in fact it does happen. There was a thread on here with people posting that had to actually use a firearm to stop a incident from happening. A large majority of the time its going to be a sow with cubs. The cubs often hide or go up a tree and mama doesn't just run and leave in the couple of times I have had bad encounters with bears.
those are the exact reasons why I am thinking about this. 90% chance wouldn't need it but that remaining 10% is what I'm considering because it will be 100% real if things go gunnysack. my 9mm with hard cast +p has 13 rounds, where as a 357 would have 6... ones heaver hitting, the other has 2x and the rounds, but less power however will stay on target way easier and possibly will land more hits
id be high if i were considering this anywhere else.
maybe I'll just buy a Mossberg shockwave 12 gauge and call it good...
it's just the whole show with Cubs thing or a pissed off boar with an arrow in it's ass...
in Alaska I wouldn't settle for anything less than a 44 mag or 12 gauge.
what will probably happen is I'd let my buddy have a kill while I'd be backup
maybe I'm over thinking this... maybe it's my Alaska experience talking
Post by: carpsniperg2 on April 10, 2020, 01:58:26 PM
The 2 times I have pulled and fired my handgun with wildlife. 1 time I was like a well oiled machine and everything went perfect and I saved myself from getting cut up by a wounded boar a archery hunter has wounded. I was on edge and expecting something. The 2nd time I was not expecting anything and it was a s show. I had my rifle on my back in some steep country. I came to a bench and looked up as soon as I looked up I saw a sow and cubs and she instantly saw me and came. I pulled my side arm and discharged it in her general direction. Did not have time to aim or even think. Scared me and I was left with a oh my what just happened feeling. Thank goodness the gun blast was enough to deter her from the attacked. Both of these were not bluff charges and one I did well in and one I just had enough time to discharge and deter a attack. The boar I fired 3 rounds and 2 hits, 1 miss. First struck the head 2nd was over top of him and 3rd was a body shot. As fast as I could work my trigger in a 44 revolver. He broke cover to come far enough to me that my first shot was well aimed and did the stopping. Once again I was following him and figured he was alive and going to fight. The bear no idea.
When a person can prepare a little I think you have a much better chance. However we all know a lot of these situations don't give you time to prepare. As with the bear in the case above the discharge of a firearm made the difference. Not the horse power. The boar shot placement. If I had hit the boar in the same place with the first shot to the head with even a 9mm It would have done the trick.
If you hit nervous system caliber should not matter much 9mm/357/44 etc. All should do the trick with the right bullet. The big difference is ke for body shots. If you miss head spine etc on a moving target and just strike the body the bigger calibers will favor you to be able to slow or stop/knock down the animal.
Post by: Alchase on April 10, 2020, 04:12:32 PM
hey guys
so my buddy just got into hunting and he already wants to do an archery bear hunt this August. Not my first choice of a hunt but if it's to get my buddy into the sport I'm just happy he wants to do it.
now before I ask this question, my first choice in sidearm would be a shaved hammer stainless 357 or 44 but I don't have one.
only handgun I own is a 9mm taurus. with proper ammo like buffalo bore hard cast +P
https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=388
would a 9mm be an acceptable side arm?
I am talking strictly for black bear in the casades, forget Alaska forget canada, I've spent enough time up there to know what works and what doesn't, but the critters here are smaller and not as agro.
I am skeptical but curious none the less
There will be a 100 answers to your question, the correct answer is:
"if a 9mm is what you have, bring it."
Pretty simple really, even better with Buffalo Bore :hello:
:chuckle:
Post by: JJB11B on April 10, 2020, 05:59:39 PM
Post by: jasnt on April 10, 2020, 08:32:27 PM
Only bear I’ve ever had charge me I could have drop kicked 40 yards. Kid you not. Could have fit in a 5 gal bucket live. Thing thought it was a badger though.
Post by: konradcountry on April 13, 2020, 06:10:20 PM
First off..... how many people on here have ever been confronted by a Washington black bear? A very small percentage I bet. Second when around a black bear what has been your observations? Mine, well they want nothing to do with me.
Yea odds are that is what will happen and I used to say the same thing.
Then I had one charge me after I shot and tracked it. They are way tougher than people realize.
I would say no to 9mm if your main weapon is archery. If you go that route then use xtreme penetrators.
Taking a 12 gauge is the way to go if you don't have to walk that far. I'd get a mossy 500 with a pistol grip over a shockwave.
Post by: trophyhunt on April 13, 2020, 06:23:21 PM
Post by: JJB11B on April 14, 2020, 07:55:59 AM
I know someone who killed a 300 lb bear with .38’s in a 357 revolver, had little time to think about it. Bear didn’t go far, maybe 100 yards.and 9mm has higher velocity than most .38SPL loads, and most 9mm handguns carry at least 10+rounds
https://gunnewsdaily.com/38-special-vs-9mm/
Post by: konradcountry on April 14, 2020, 01:42:16 PM
But if you plan on hunting them I would carry a bigger sidearm.
Once you call one in a 10mm or 357 in a holster will feel worth every penny.