Post by: andersonjk4 on January 02, 2021, 07:36:56 AM
That said, the next Wildlife Commission meeting is January 7th. The agenda:
• NE WA white-tailed deer hunting rule options for the 3-year packet CR-102
• General discussion – current events
https://wdfw.wa.gov/sites/default/files/2020-12/special_meeting_notice__january_7_wildlife_committee_web_conference.pdf (https://wdfw.wa.gov/sites/default/files/2020-12/special_meeting_notice__january_7_wildlife_committee_web_conference.pdf)
Post by: cem3434 on January 02, 2021, 07:44:57 AM
Post by: hunter399 on January 02, 2021, 07:45:53 AM
I know old meetings they would allow the public an hour or so to add comments.
Post by: hunter399 on January 02, 2021, 07:48:00 AM
Post by: Ghost Hunter on January 02, 2021, 08:04:30 AM
Post by: bearpaw on January 02, 2021, 08:57:30 AM
https://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/regulations/season-setting#
amazingly, I see some good things in some of the proposals...
Its very important to express your thoughts on proposals!
Post by: bearpaw on January 02, 2021, 08:59:24 AM
https://wdfw.wa.gov/sites/default/files/2020-08/deerproposals_public.pdf
Post by: ThurstonCokid on January 02, 2021, 09:13:18 AM
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Post by: greenhead_killer on January 02, 2021, 09:15:16 AM
Post by: KFhunter on January 02, 2021, 09:17:37 AM
1) people accidently shoot and waste bucks that aren't legal
2) promotes genetics of bucks that tend to not grow many points very early
on the flip it does put more 4pt or larger bucks in play and does improve trophy opportunities.
I'd like to see this discontinued after two 3 year cycles, or at least reevaluated so we don't get a bunch culls breeding does.
One thing I'd like to add
1) Youth any buck
Post by: Russ McDonald on January 02, 2021, 09:18:32 AM
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Post by: hunter399 on January 02, 2021, 09:50:36 AM
I can say that most things that are at these meetings going forward are what the WDFW is proposing to the commision and most will pass. There has been proposals that have been pulled from discussion and won't be recommended.Can you say what deer proposal won't be discussion or recommended.
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Post by: hunter399 on January 02, 2021, 09:56:52 AM
I don't mind a temporary antler point restriction in the 100 series GMU's, but my issues are that:I think youth,senior,disabled, would be exempt from an APR ,I will screen shot it .There are three different options ,and youth,disabled,senior will be exempt.
1) people accidently shoot and waste bucks that aren't legal
2) promotes genetics of bucks that tend to not grow many points very early
on the flip it does put more 4pt or larger bucks in play and does improve trophy opportunities.
I'd like to see this discontinued after two 3 year cycles, or at least reevaluated so we don't get a bunch culls breeding does.
One thing I'd like to add
1) Youth any buck
Post by: buckcanyonlodge on January 02, 2021, 10:06:11 AM
Post by: Tbar on January 02, 2021, 10:30:44 AM
I can say that most things that are at these meetings going forward are what the WDFW is proposing to the commision and most will pass. There has been proposals that have been pulled from discussion and won't be recommended.Although I do not completely disagree, comments like this really hurt when posted. When change does happen its usually because one side or another show up in numbers. Unfortunately it always seems to be the non consumptive, pro predator crowds that mobilize. The only organized effort from hunters seems to be waterfowl groups. Weather you agree or not I would encourage involvement at the commission level. Hunters voices are nearly silent at the majority of the meetings. :twocents:
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Post by: ThurstonCokid on January 02, 2021, 10:33:23 AM
They did not list over population of predators as a part of the decline in deer populations. How about adding limited hound cougar hunting in units that have an at-risk population?? Or upping the quota number for cats harvested before closing the season.Don’t use logic! But seriously. That’d be nice we can dream.
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Post by: JL on January 02, 2021, 10:55:26 AM
REDUCTION
Antlerless Harvest 100%
Antlered Harvest 34%
Total Harvest 50%
1 Point 32%
2 Point 10%
3 Point 24%
4 Point 43%
5+ Point 45%
ALL 45%
Post by: Russ McDonald on January 02, 2021, 04:10:07 PM
I can not tell you about deer. I just know what they told us is a turkey meeting with WDFW. Example is there was a proposal for using dogs during fall turkey season. That did not move forward and is no longer in any commision discussions.I can say that most things that are at these meetings going forward are what the WDFW is proposing to the commision and most will pass. There has been proposals that have been pulled from discussion and won't be recommended.Can you say what deer proposal won't be discussion or recommended.
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Post by: 10thmountainarcher on January 02, 2021, 05:09:18 PM
I don't mind a temporary antler point restriction in the 100 series GMU's, but my issues are that:
1) people accidently shoot and waste bucks that aren't legal
2) promotes genetics of bucks that tend to not grow many points very early
on the flip it does put more 4pt or larger bucks in play and does improve trophy opportunities.
I'd like to see this discontinued after two 3 year cycles, or at least reevaluated so we don't get a bunch culls breeding does.
One thing I'd like to add
1) Youth any buck
This is exactly my thoughts! The youth any buck during the early season in place of what used to be the doe season.
Post by: ne kid on January 02, 2021, 05:46:56 PM
Post by: 10thmountainarcher on January 02, 2021, 05:52:44 PM
Hopefully we get antlerless wolf season. Sure wish we could get hounds back on a 20 year study.
:chuckle: Hounds and an antler less wolf season would for sure help the herd!
Post by: Mtnwalker on January 02, 2021, 06:07:22 PM
Post by: Wsucoug on January 02, 2021, 06:34:55 PM
Hunting season setting and rulemaking
https://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/regulations/season-setting#
amazingly, I see some good things in some of the proposals...
Its very important to express your thoughts on proposals!
Do you know the best place to submit comments? Seems this is just a listen in.
Post by: Russ McDonald on January 02, 2021, 06:44:40 PM
https://wdfw.wa.gov/about/commission/contactHunting season setting and rulemaking
https://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/regulations/season-setting#
amazingly, I see some good things in some of the proposals...
Its very important to express your thoughts on proposals!
Do you know the best place to submit comments? Seems this is just a listen in.
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Post by: Wsucoug on January 02, 2021, 06:45:01 PM
I don't mind a temporary antler point restriction in the 100 series GMU's, but my issues are that:
1) people accidently shoot and waste bucks that aren't legal
2) promotes genetics of bucks that tend to not grow many points very early
on the flip it does put more 4pt or larger bucks in play and does improve trophy opportunities.
I'd like to see this discontinued after two 3 year cycles, or at least reevaluated so we don't get a bunch culls breeding does.
One thing I'd like to add
1) Youth any buck
With respect to point 2, I have yet to see any data that supports this information, in an area such as the Northwest. Everything I have seen is from the Midwest and South where the growing season is significantly longer and the deer get a steady diet of Ag crops (think Soy beans and Corn). I would like to see some actual data on this, in our area. If it does become a problem, maybe do a draw for some spike/2pt tags. Without some solid evidence, I would prefer not to cycle out, as its not easy to get these rules into place in the first place.
Post by: Skyvalhunter on January 02, 2021, 07:18:08 PM
Post by: KFhunter on January 02, 2021, 07:27:26 PM
I don't mind a temporary antler point restriction in the 100 series GMU's, but my issues are that:
1) people accidently shoot and waste bucks that aren't legal
2) promotes genetics of bucks that tend to not grow many points very early
on the flip it does put more 4pt or larger bucks in play and does improve trophy opportunities.
I'd like to see this discontinued after two 3 year cycles, or at least reevaluated so we don't get a bunch culls breeding does.
One thing I'd like to add
1) Youth any buck
With respect to point 2, I have yet to see any data that supports this information, in an area such as the Northwest. Everything I have seen is from the Midwest and South where the growing season is significantly longer and the deer get a steady diet of Ag crops (think Soy beans and Corn). I would like to see some actual data on this, in our area. If it does become a problem, maybe do a draw for some spike/2pt tags. Without some solid evidence, I would prefer not to cycle out, as its not easy to get these rules into place in the first place.
Mississippi state did a study on it, I can't get the study to pull up on the weblink, but here's an article which talks about it.
maybe it'll work on your computer? http://msudeerlab.com/management.asp
I thought this was pretty well settled science? :dunno:
Quote
However, researchers from Mississippi State University documented an undesirable side effect. Over time, the average antler size of bucks in the 2.5 and 3.5-year age classes declined by an average of 10 inches. The four-point rule resulted in what’s known as “high-grading,” where bucks with the greatest genetic potential for big antlers are harvested at a younger age, leaving only bucks with poorer quality antlers to mature into older age classes. And the effect was greatest in areas of high-quality soils, where yearling bucks have a higher potential of sporting legal racks at a younger age. As a result, the State placed large areas of state-managed lands in the Delta region under more stringent regulations, which include a 15-inch minimum inside spread and a tightly controlled lottery on a limited number of permits for taking bucks with fewer than four points.
These results point out several things. One is the importance of long-term monitoring. It took several years before researchers identified the high-grading. It also shows that things are seldom as simple and clear-cut as we might like them to be. It’s not just a matter of protecting younger bucks to produce older ones. When managing wildlife populations you need to consider numerous variables like habitat, hunting pressure and annual weather and climate variation, to name a few.
https://www.mossyoak.com/our-obsession/blogs/deer/antler-restrictions-good-or-bad
Post by: Wsucoug on January 02, 2021, 07:45:50 PM
I just don't think you can extrapolate the data.
Additionally my current understanding is age then nutrition then generics is the order of importance for antler size. I think we have a long road currently with age before we need to tackle genetics.
Post by: KFhunter on January 02, 2021, 07:55:42 PM
but antler quality isn't the goal here, it is reductions of harvest, the sales pitch is higher quality bucks on the landscape.
Post by: hunter399 on January 02, 2021, 08:31:27 PM
Ohh ya there's a proposal for tracking dog to be used Durring deer and elk season also .On a leash of course.But we all know somebody's dog will get free ,then some other hunter will shoot it thinking it's a wild dog .But that's a different story ,from Turkey hunting.I can not tell you about deer. I just know what they told us is a turkey meeting with WDFW. Example is there was a proposal for using dogs during fall turkey season. That did not move forward and is no longer in any commision discussions.I can say that most things that are at these meetings going forward are what the WDFW is proposing to the commision and most will pass. There has been proposals that have been pulled from discussion and won't be recommended.Can you say what deer proposal won't be discussion or recommended.
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Post by: hunter399 on January 02, 2021, 08:41:51 PM
Youth,senior,disabled, would stay any buck.
I've also been pushing a youth antlerless hunt-permit only so that Doe permits can stay highly regulated in amounts/with any kind of antlerless permits going towards youth first.
Basically quality of hunt/with opportunity for different user groups/sustainability in our deer herds would be the goals.
Post by: JL on January 02, 2021, 09:15:36 PM
Post by: hunter399 on January 02, 2021, 09:22:11 PM
IMO, District 1 decline is 100% predator for WT & MD.Your right 100% I won't debate that.
Majority of locals/hunters that come to district 1 come here to deer hunt,then don't come back till next year.Which leaves a huge predator pit.
So this is the option to keep sustainable deer ,hunters are not killing enough predators.
Post by: JL on January 02, 2021, 09:32:24 PM
Post by: hunter399 on January 03, 2021, 01:05:41 AM
Yup. Can't shoot wolves, no hounds for cats, and no bait for bears. Definitely the hunters' fault. Being facetious, of course.Wolves,hounds,bait for bears,is something we can't change though. We can change regulations to try and keep sustainable deer population for future hunters.