Post by: trophyhunt on March 20, 2022, 10:15:51 AM
Post by: Cougartail on March 20, 2022, 10:40:37 AM
No longer will I bash any non natives for sneaking in early in that area, natives are allowed inside the gate to gather antlers, and harvest elk if it is within their time line. I guess this isn’t new but it’s the first I heard of it. Such BS
So it's not about stressing animals. :bash:
Post by: trophyhunt on March 20, 2022, 10:51:50 AM
exactly!!!No longer will I bash any non natives for sneaking in early in that area, natives are allowed inside the gate to gather antlers, and harvest elk if it is within their time line. I guess this isn’t new but it’s the first I heard of it. Such BS
So it's not about stressing animals. :bash:
Post by: KFhunter on March 20, 2022, 11:56:47 AM
Post by: Mudman on March 20, 2022, 12:10:34 PM
Don't get yourselves banned over this topic, discuss, but don't cross the lineIsnt that the same as Facebook and Twitter censoring woke subject matter? Sorry but Im free speech 100%. Just saying. I will not comment on this as we all are thinking the same thing. :bash:
Post by: KFhunter on March 20, 2022, 12:13:15 PM
Post by: Mudman on March 20, 2022, 12:31:52 PM
If you invite guests into the mudman home, and they start saying how awesome Inslee is, or how stupid your dog is, or how fat your wife is, do you say "oh well, that's free speech!" and give em another beer out of your fridge?Actually I do. Your talking about my family!!! Wife might get mad though. :chuckle: Serious we speak our minds.
Post by: bornhunter on March 20, 2022, 12:33:52 PM
No longer will I bash any non natives for sneaking in early in that area, natives are allowed inside the gate to gather antlers, and harvest elk if it is within their time line. I guess this isn’t new but it’s the first I heard of it. Such BS
First I heard of it too. Sad.
Post by: Cougartail on March 20, 2022, 01:01:57 PM
If you invite guests into the mudman home, and they start saying how awesome Inslee is, or how stupid your dog is, or how fat your wife is, do you say "oh well, that's free speech!" and give em another beer out of your fridge?Actually I do. Your talking about my family!!! Wife might get mad though. :chuckle: Serious we speak our minds.
Lmao. I want to drink with you! :chuckle:
Post by: Meathunter06 on March 20, 2022, 03:42:10 PM
Free speech what is that?Don't get yourselves banned over this topic, discuss, but don't cross the lineIsnt that the same as Facebook and Twitter censoring woke subject matter? Sorry but Im free speech 100%. Just saying. I will not comment on this as we all are thinking the same thing. :bash:
Post by: Jake Dogfish on March 20, 2022, 03:46:18 PM
Post by: bigdub257 on March 20, 2022, 03:53:31 PM
Post by: cem3434 on March 20, 2022, 04:39:27 PM
Personally, I think they should open it for everyone because there is no science that WDFW recognizes that supports closing it to keep the stress off the animals. :tup:
Post by: trophyhunt on March 20, 2022, 04:42:37 PM
It’s open exclusively to tribal members. Lots of people are natives but don’t have those special rights.so the tribal members don’t stress out the elk when they are in there then?
Post by: rtspring on March 20, 2022, 04:43:47 PM
No longer will I bash any non natives for sneaking in early in that area, natives are allowed inside the gate to gather antlers, and harvest elk if it is within their time line. I guess this isn’t new but it’s the first I heard of it. Such BS
How do we blame the “indians”, when we the “white” people gave them that!!!! See where I’m coming from? Its not their fault. Hell give me the option of hunting elk year round and I’m gonna kill some chit. And many many many on here would do the same damn thing.
Post by: Jake Dogfish on March 20, 2022, 04:44:56 PM
You tell me. :dunno:It’s open exclusively to tribal members. Lots of people are natives but don’t have those special rights.so the tribal members don’t stress out the elk when they are in there then?
Post by: Buzzsaw461 on March 20, 2022, 05:13:48 PM
Post by: trophyhunt on March 20, 2022, 05:56:21 PM
If you had the right to shoot 2 point mule deer, but you knew it wasn’t good for the herd, would you still do it? If you had the right to pick up antlers in winter grounds where the elk were stressed, and your encroachment made it worse for them, would you do it? If you could hunt at night and get away with it would you? If you could break tribal laws to sell jerky would you? My point….. and you already know this, just because you can, is it right? There is a f&@king reason why we should leave the elk alone this time of year, doesn’t matter what race you are. DamnNo longer will I bash any non natives for sneaking in early in that area, natives are allowed inside the gate to gather antlers, and harvest elk if it is within their time line. I guess this isn’t new but it’s the first I heard of it. Such BS
How do we blame the “indians”, when we the “white” people gave them that!!!! See where I’m coming from? Its not their fault. Hell give me the option of hunting elk year round and I’m gonna kill some chit. And many many many on here would do the same damn thing.
Post by: MADMAX on March 20, 2022, 06:08:49 PM
Post by: MADMAX on March 20, 2022, 06:17:33 PM
Post by: Buzzsaw461 on March 20, 2022, 06:30:44 PM
If you had the right to shoot 2 point mule deer, but you knew it wasn’t good for the herd, would you still do it? If you had the right to pick up antlers in winter grounds where the elk were stressed, and your encroachment made it worse for them, would you do it? If you could hunt at night and get away with it would you? If you could break tribal laws to sell jerky would you? My point….. and you already know this, just because you can, is it right? There is a f&@king reason why we should leave the elk alone this time of year, doesn’t matter what race you are. DamnNo longer will I bash any non natives for sneaking in early in that area, natives are allowed inside the gate to gather antlers, and harvest elk if it is within their time line. I guess this isn’t new but it’s the first I heard of it. Such BS
How do we blame the “indians”, when we the “white” people gave them that!!!! See where I’m coming from? Its not their fault. Hell give me the option of hunting elk year round and I’m gonna kill some chit. And many many many on here would do the same damn thing.
Post by: trophyhunt on March 20, 2022, 06:31:11 PM
They don't walk more than 20 feet from a road so calm down.:chuckle: thank God!!
Post by: rtspring on March 20, 2022, 06:56:19 PM
If you had the right to shoot 2 point mule deer, but you knew it wasn’t good for the herd, would you still do it? If you had the right to pick up antlers in winter grounds where the elk were stressed, and your encroachment made it worse for them, would you do it? If you could hunt at night and get away with it would you? If you could break tribal laws to sell jerky would you? My point….. and you already know this, just because you can, is it right? There is a f&@king reason why we should leave the elk alone this time of year, doesn’t matter what race you are. DamnNo longer will I bash any non natives for sneaking in early in that area, natives are allowed inside the gate to gather antlers, and harvest elk if it is within their time line. I guess this isn’t new but it’s the first I heard of it. Such BS
How do we blame the “indians”, when we the “white” people gave them that!!!! See where I’m coming from? Its not their fault. Hell give me the option of hunting elk year round and I’m gonna kill some chit. And many many many on here would do the same damn thing.
Your “damn” right I would. Its a dog eat dog world these days! Especially the “hunting community”. Like I said “ we gave them those rights!!!””” So blame the people who gave them the rights to get antlers early!
If you could buy $1.00 a gallon gas but no one else could, would you? Your damn right you would.
We can play the “stress” card all we want! But if by that thinking we shouldn’t be chasing el around for 3-4 months in the fall…. Way more stress than some shed hunters. Save the, well elk are weak in the spring speech. I don’t think thousands of elk die from shed hunters!!!!
Post by: cem3434 on March 20, 2022, 06:56:38 PM
We all know you're passionate about hunting and conservation, but we need to figure out how to team up (somehow) with the natives. They have the "right" to hunt, whereas we only have the "privilege" to hunt in the eyes of the law. I agree with you on doing the right thing versus what your allowed to do, but again they have the "right" to do so where we do not.
If WDFW has their way, all the elk hunting will be shutdown in that area in the next 10 years as there wont be a sustainable population to support all of the 4 legged predators. Just look at the slashing of the permits after years of overharveting, showing they have no ability to manage the herds while predator populations continue to thrive. If we can't get on the same page to fight WDFW and all of the antis, natives will be the only people still allowed to hunt in this state in the near future. :twocents:
Post by: rtspring on March 20, 2022, 06:59:29 PM
If you had the right to shoot 2 point mule deer, but you knew it wasn’t good for the herd, would you still do it? If you had the right to pick up antlers in winter grounds where the elk were stressed, and your encroachment made it worse for them, would you do it? If you could hunt at night and get away with it would you? If you could break tribal laws to sell jerky would you? My point….. and you already know this, just because you can, is it right? There is a f&@king reason why we should leave the elk alone this time of year, doesn’t matter what race you are. DamnNo longer will I bash any non natives for sneaking in early in that area, natives are allowed inside the gate to gather antlers, and harvest elk if it is within their time line. I guess this isn’t new but it’s the first I heard of it. Such BS
How do we blame the “indians”, when we the “white” people gave them that!!!! See where I’m coming from? Its not their fault. Hell give me the option of hunting elk year round and I’m gonna kill some chit. And many many many on here would do the same damn thing.
Your “damn” right I would. Its a dog eat dog world these days! Especially the “hunting community”. Like I said “ we gave them those rights!!!””” So blame the people who gave them the rights to get antlers early!
If you could buy $1.00 a gallon gas but no one else could, would you? Your damn right you would.
We can play the “stress” card all we want! But if by that thinking we shouldn’t be chasing el around for 3-4 months in the fall…. Way more stress than some shed hunters. Save the, well elk are weak in the spring speech. I don’t think thousands of elk die from shed hunters!!!!
I completely see your side!!! But sometimes look at who caused the problem not those that gained rights from the people who put the problems into law.
Some people think we shouldn’t hunt
some people think we shouldn’t kill pregnant cow elk
Some people think we should kill predators! But the law says we can so guess what???? WE DO IT ANYWAYS!!!
Post by: trophyhunt on March 20, 2022, 07:12:54 PM
Damn Jerry, chill out as we don't need you blowing a gasket. :chuckle:Honest question, do you think the natives give two F’s about the resource management or if we non natives have rights to hunt ? Why would they, they have their cake and eat it too. I’m F’ing tired of us versus them, we are the same for GODS sake. We lose spring bear, hound hunting, baiting, and the future looks bleak for non native hunters, but, tribal get to keep living free and do
We all know you're passionate about hunting and conservation, but we need to figure out how to team up (somehow) with the natives. They have the "right" to hunt, whereas we only have the "privilege" to hunt in the eyes of the law. I agree with you on doing the right thing versus what your allowed to do, but again they have the "right" to do so where we do not.
If WDFW has their way, all the elk hunting will be shutdown in that area in the next 10 years as there wont be a sustainable population to support all of the 4 legged predators. Just look at the slashing of the permits after years of overharveting, showing they have no ability to manage the herds while predator populations continue to thrive. If we can't get on the same page to fight WDFW and all of the antis, natives will be the only people still allowed to hunt in this state in the near future. :twocents:
What they want for ever. I wonder if we have a civil war against our government, who’s side will they be on?
Post by: Mudman on March 20, 2022, 07:13:25 PM
Post by: trophyhunt on March 20, 2022, 07:14:33 PM
Post by: KFhunter on March 20, 2022, 07:16:23 PM
Damn Jerry, chill out as we don't need you blowing a gasket. :chuckle:Honest question, do you think the natives give two F’s about the resource management or if we non natives have rights to hunt ? Why would they, they have their cake and eat it too. I’m F’ing tired of us versus them, we are the same for GODS sake. We lose spring bear, hound hunting, baiting, and the future looks bleak for non native hunters, but, tribal get to keep living free and do
We all know you're passionate about hunting and conservation, but we need to figure out how to team up (somehow) with the natives. They have the "right" to hunt, whereas we only have the "privilege" to hunt in the eyes of the law. I agree with you on doing the right thing versus what your allowed to do, but again they have the "right" to do so where we do not.
If WDFW has their way, all the elk hunting will be shutdown in that area in the next 10 years as there wont be a sustainable population to support all of the 4 legged predators. Just look at the slashing of the permits after years of overharveting, showing they have no ability to manage the herds while predator populations continue to thrive. If we can't get on the same page to fight WDFW and all of the antis, natives will be the only people still allowed to hunt in this state in the near future. :twocents:
What they want for ever. I wonder if we have a civil war against our government, who’s side will they be on?
They will continue to hunt, fish, trap and do all the things we no longer cannot.
Thanks to blue voters, not them. Our blue dem courts are very sympathetic to litigation brought by them.
RT has this right, don't bark up the wrong tree.
Post by: dreamingbig on March 20, 2022, 07:20:30 PM
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: trophyhunt on March 20, 2022, 07:23:31 PM
Post by: KFhunter on March 20, 2022, 07:27:04 PM
With what is going on, f barking, I think it’s time to bite. Not sure how many more of us can take this crap. Bend over, take it dry! Yeah, I’m pissed, pissed about a lot of crap going on, I understand the whole “straw that broke the camels back” now more than ever.
You gonna make a redneck posse and slash tires, dig ditches across roads, fell trees and harass tribal hunters?
Post by: fishngamereaper on March 20, 2022, 07:31:52 PM
Post by: trophyhunt on March 20, 2022, 07:32:15 PM
what I want to do and what I will do are totally different. This day and age, never post what you want to do.With what is going on, f barking, I think it’s time to bite. Not sure how many more of us can take this crap. Bend over, take it dry! Yeah, I’m pissed, pissed about a lot of crap going on, I understand the whole “straw that broke the camels back” now more than ever.
You gonna make a redneck posse and slash tires, dig ditches across roads, fell trees and harass tribal hunters?
Post by: KFhunter on March 20, 2022, 07:34:47 PM
Post by: trophyhunt on March 20, 2022, 07:35:40 PM
I know allot of non natives shed hunting right now... lot's of places besides oak Creek...is it only the welfare elk that are of concern.the point is that area is closed to keep pressure off the wintering elk, there are other places, most the state that are open for antler hunting.
Post by: trophyhunt on March 20, 2022, 07:36:48 PM
It was rhetorical, sort of, unless you were dumb enough to answer that (I knew you wouldn't be):chuckle:
Post by: Tbar on March 20, 2022, 07:44:40 PM
With what is going on, f barking, I think it’s time to bite. Not sure how many more of us can take this crap. Bend over, take it dry! Yeah, I’m pissed, pissed about a lot of crap going on, I understand the whole “straw that broke the camels back” now more than ever.Bite away!
Post by: fishngamereaper on March 20, 2022, 07:46:56 PM
I know allot of non natives shed hunting right now... lot's of places besides oak Creek...is it only the welfare elk that are of concern.the point is that area is closed to keep pressure off the wintering elk, there are other places, most the state that are open for antler hunting.
Are there any elk left down low..
When i lived in the burg we used to start shed hunting this time of year and even the welfare elk had started to move up...
I get why oak Creek is closed. But from what I've heard oak Creek has become quite the shire show for sheds... people glassing sheds from the parking lot and running to get them when the gate opens. How many tribal guys are being allowed in...does anyone know.
Guess I'm not inclined to get as worked up about it...I'm more concerned about the December hunting seasons than spring shed hunting.
Post by: Tbar on March 20, 2022, 07:51:23 PM
:yeah:I know allot of non natives shed hunting right now... lot's of places besides oak Creek...is it only the welfare elk that are of concern.the point is that area is closed to keep pressure off the wintering elk, there are other places, most the state that are open for antler hunting.
Are there any elk left down low..
When i lived in the burg we used to start shed hunting this time of year and even the welfare elk had started to move up...
I get why oak Creek is closed. But from what I've heard oak Creek has become quite the shire show for sheds... people glassing sheds from the parking lot and running to get them when the gate opens. How many tribal guys are being allowed in...does anyone know.
Guess I'm not inclined to get as worked up about it...I'm more concerned about the December hunting seasons than spring shed hunting.
Are the boy scouts still collecting there? Even though they were allowed in early I never really got too worked up.
Post by: MADMAX on March 20, 2022, 08:04:53 PM
Game manager John would tell us don’t push them cows and get them running
If you see any dogs up there running loose feel free to shoot em
If not that , we’d go springer fishing
This was before turkey hunting was much of a thing about 25 years or so ago
$$$$ ruined it
Anybody remember a member named littlefoot ?
Talk about an avid shed hunter
He got sick of the bashing if I recall right and quit posting his impressive success
Post by: Naches Sportsman on March 20, 2022, 08:18:10 PM
They should very damn well be allowed to access the area for things being there’s artifacts within eyesight from the oak creek feedlot itself. However most act in good taste and don’t abuse their rights and it’s only a handful of their population that make them look bad.
Hopefully whitefoot chimes in if he sees this before the thread gets locked.
Post by: trophyhunt on March 20, 2022, 08:19:05 PM
Post by: Tbar on March 20, 2022, 08:20:54 PM
Post by: trophyhunt on March 20, 2022, 08:21:27 PM
Have you developed another hobby then to start a potential bashing thread on the Native Americans? I know quite a few of them that get a kick out of it when you stir *censored* up.oh, you a whitefoot fan now? Really! You not opposed to killing multiple bulls to sell for jerky meat against tribal laws?? Really! You need to wake up man.
They should very damn well be allowed to access the area for things being there’s artifacts within eyesight from the oak creek feedlot itself. However most act in good taste and don’t abuse their rights and it’s only a handful of their population that make them look bad.
Hopefully whitefoot chimes in if he sees this before the thread gets locked.
Post by: trophyhunt on March 20, 2022, 08:22:06 PM
John McGown used to let boyscouts in early to collect and sell antlers in near real time.used to, how long ago was that?
Post by: Tbar on March 20, 2022, 08:24:13 PM
:cryriver:Have you developed another hobby then to start a potential bashing thread on the Native Americans? I know quite a few of them that get a kick out of it when you stir *censored* up.oh, you a whitefoot fan now? Really! You not opposed to killing multiple bulls to sell for jerky meat against tribal laws?? Really! You need to wake the F up man.
They should very damn well be allowed to access the area for things being there’s artifacts within eyesight from the oak creek feedlot itself. However most act in good taste and don’t abuse their rights and it’s only a handful of their population that make them look bad.
Hopefully whitefoot chimes in if he sees this before the thread gets locked.
There are real issues that far outweigh this.
Post by: Timberstalker on March 20, 2022, 08:25:13 PM
Don’t get too worked up; WDFW will outlaw shed hunting before too long.
Pretty soon fishing will be illegal!!!!
Post by: fishngamereaper on March 20, 2022, 08:29:19 PM
Jerry,
Don’t get too worked up; WDFW will outlaw shed hunting before too long.
Pretty soon fishing will be illegal!!!!
They won't outlaw it but you can bet they'll profit from it ..antler tags and you have to pick your unit..mark my words. :rolleyes:
Post by: storyteller on March 20, 2022, 08:33:11 PM
Yes I do, I find how much most of us do not know
Post by: Naches Sportsman on March 20, 2022, 08:41:24 PM
Have you developed another hobby then to start a potential bashing thread on the Native Americans? I know quite a few of them that get a kick out of it when you stir *censored* up.oh, you a whitefoot fan now? Really! You not opposed to killing multiple bulls to sell for jerky meat against tribal laws?? Really! You need to wake the F up man.
They should very damn well be allowed to access the area for things being there’s artifacts within eyesight from the oak creek feedlot itself. However most act in good taste and don’t abuse their rights and it’s only a handful of their population that make them look bad.
Hopefully whitefoot chimes in if he sees this before the thread gets locked.
Just because I disagree with values and views of some people doesn’t mean I can’t respect them and carry out a conversation with them.
I’ve waked up and have multiple native friends who I’ve joined on hunts and have fished with. I’ve helped a few with goat tags. I’ve learned a hell of a lot from members of multiple tribes in the NW and Alaska and even have been invited back to a trappers cabin in Alaska. I’ve learned more history of areas and to live off the land from tribal members than I have reading books and textbooks published by Europeans.
Post by: Buzzsaw461 on March 20, 2022, 08:56:00 PM
Damn Jerry, chill out as we don't need you blowing a gasket. :chuckle:Honest question, do you think the natives give two F’s about the resource management or if we non natives have rights to hunt ? Why would they, they have their cake and eat it too. I’m F’ing tired of us versus them, we are the same for GODS sake. We lose spring bear, hound hunting, baiting, and the future looks bleak for non native hunters, but, tribal get to keep living free and do
We all know you're passionate about hunting and conservation, but we need to figure out how to team up (somehow) with the natives. They have the "right" to hunt, whereas we only have the "privilege" to hunt in the eyes of the law. I agree with you on doing the right thing versus what your allowed to do, but again they have the "right" to do so where we do not.
If WDFW has their way, all the elk hunting will be shutdown in that area in the next 10 years as there wont be a sustainable population to support all of the 4 legged predators. Just look at the slashing of the permits after years of overharveting, showing they have no ability to manage the herds while predator populations continue to thrive. If we can't get on the same page to fight WDFW and all of the antis, natives will be the only people still allowed to hunt in this state in the near future. :twocents:
What they want for ever. I wonder if we have a civil war against our government, who’s side will they be on?
Post by: Dan-o on March 20, 2022, 08:56:15 PM
Have you developed another hobby then to start a potential bashing thread on the Native Americans? I know quite a few of them that get a kick out of it when you stir *censored* up.oh, you a whitefoot fan now? Really! You not opposed to killing multiple bulls to sell for jerky meat against tribal laws?? Really! You need to wake the F up man.
They should very damn well be allowed to access the area for things being there’s artifacts within eyesight from the oak creek feedlot itself. However most act in good taste and don’t abuse their rights and it’s only a handful of their population that make them look bad.
Hopefully whitefoot chimes in if he sees this before the thread gets locked.
Just because I disagree with values and views of some people doesn’t mean I can’t respect them and carry out a conversation with them.
I’ve waked up and have multiple native friends who I’ve joined on hunts and have fished with. I’ve helped a few with goat tags. I’ve learned a hell of a lot from members of multiple tribes in the NW and Alaska and even have been invited back to a trappers cabin in Alaska. I’ve learned more history of areas and to live off the land from tribal members than I have reading books and textbooks published by Europeans.
:tup: :tup:
Post by: Buzzsaw461 on March 20, 2022, 09:01:08 PM
was waiting for Tbar (bag) to chime in.With what is going on, f barking, I think it’s time to bite. Not sure how many more of us can take this crap. Bend over, take it dry! Yeah, I’m pissed, pissed about a lot of crap going on, I understand the whole “straw that broke the camels back” now more than ever.Bite away!
Post by: jackelope on March 20, 2022, 09:09:16 PM
We’ve got native bashing, posts that are on the line of possibly racist, we’ve got name calling, we’ve got posts circumventing the curse word filters. We’ve got it all. Keep it up if you want it locked.
Post by: Tbar on March 20, 2022, 09:23:56 PM
This thread is prime for a locking.Add in threats of violence and law breaking. This thread cracks me up after the last couple of months.
We’ve got native bashing, posts that are on the line of possibly racist, we’ve got name calling, we’ve got posts circumventing the curse word filters. We’ve got it all. Keep it up if you want it locked.
Post by: cem3434 on March 20, 2022, 09:27:33 PM
Damn Jerry, chill out as we don't need you blowing a gasket. :chuckle:Honest question, do you think the natives give two F’s about the resource management or if we non natives have rights to hunt ? Why would they, they have their cake and eat it too. I’m F’ing tired of us versus them, we are the same for GODS sake. We lose spring bear, hound hunting, baiting, and the future looks bleak for non native hunters, but, tribal get to keep living free and do
We all know you're passionate about hunting and conservation, but we need to figure out how to team up (somehow) with the natives. They have the "right" to hunt, whereas we only have the "privilege" to hunt in the eyes of the law. I agree with you on doing the right thing versus what your allowed to do, but again they have the "right" to do so where we do not.
If WDFW has their way, all the elk hunting will be shutdown in that area in the next 10 years as there wont be a sustainable population to support all of the 4 legged predators. Just look at the slashing of the permits after years of overharveting, showing they have no ability to manage the herds while predator populations continue to thrive. If we can't get on the same page to fight WDFW and all of the antis, natives will be the only people still allowed to hunt in this state in the near future. :twocents:
What they want for ever. I wonder if we have a civil war against our government, who’s side will they be on?
Honestly, I think many do care about managing the resources where they are there for future generations. I also know there are some bad apples that harvest dozens of mature bulls every year, making jerky to sell. It doesn't matter who the user group is, we all have our bad apples that reflect poorly on ALL hunters regardless if they are native or not.
For the second part of your question, no I think the natives only care about the resources for themselves. This is in part to threads like this bashing them because they have the right to do something we don't. If we as sportsmen want to have the privilege to hunt in the future we better get stuff figured out in a hurry. We need the natives as an ally, not as another foe as we already have plenty of those.
Your anger seems misguided because it's liberal politicians, WDFW and the antis chipping away at out recreational opportunities, not the natives. Not a single lost opportunity you listed above was a result of the natives. I like you and think you contribute a lot to this forum, but you're dead wrong on this one. Take a deep breath and try to think about this a little more clearly before you end up getting banned. :twocents:
Post by: jackelope on March 20, 2022, 09:50:01 PM
This thread is prime for a locking.Add in threats of violence and law breaking. This thread cracks me up after the last couple of months.
We’ve got native bashing, posts that are on the line of possibly racist, we’ve got name calling, we’ve got posts circumventing the curse word filters. We’ve got it all. Keep it up if you want it locked.
I didn’t read the whole thing. Mah bad.
Post by: Rainier10 on March 20, 2022, 09:54:36 PM
Just checking in.
Post by: JimmyHoffa on March 20, 2022, 10:05:31 PM
Agree, and for the bold I think they actually need the non-tribal hunters and fishermen even if they can't see it yet. The antis will go after them too. Right now the antis are too busy pretending to be friends of the tribes so they can use them against everyone else.Damn Jerry, chill out as we don't need you blowing a gasket. :chuckle:Honest question, do you think the natives give two F’s about the resource management or if we non natives have rights to hunt ? Why would they, they have their cake and eat it too. I’m F’ing tired of us versus them, we are the same for GODS sake. We lose spring bear, hound hunting, baiting, and the future looks bleak for non native hunters, but, tribal get to keep living free and do
We all know you're passionate about hunting and conservation, but we need to figure out how to team up (somehow) with the natives. They have the "right" to hunt, whereas we only have the "privilege" to hunt in the eyes of the law. I agree with you on doing the right thing versus what your allowed to do, but again they have the "right" to do so where we do not.
If WDFW has their way, all the elk hunting will be shutdown in that area in the next 10 years as there wont be a sustainable population to support all of the 4 legged predators. Just look at the slashing of the permits after years of overharveting, showing they have no ability to manage the herds while predator populations continue to thrive. If we can't get on the same page to fight WDFW and all of the antis, natives will be the only people still allowed to hunt in this state in the near future. :twocents:
What they want for ever. I wonder if we have a civil war against our government, who’s side will they be on?
Honestly, I think many do care about managing the resources where they are there for future generations. I also know there are some bad apples that harvest dozens of mature bulls every year, making jerky to sell. It doesn't matter who the user group is, we all have our bad apples that reflect poorly on ALL hunters regardless if they are native or not.
For the second part of your question, no I think the natives only care about the resources for themselves. This is in part to threads like this bashing them because they have the right to do something we don't. If we as sportsmen want to have the privilege to hunt in the future we better get stuff figured out in a hurry. We need the natives as an ally, not as another foe as we already have plenty of those.
Your anger seems misguided because it's liberal politicians, WDFW and the antis chipping away at out recreational opportunities, not the natives. Not a single lost opportunity you listed above was a result of the natives. I like you and think you contribute a lot to this forum, but you're dead wrong on this one. Take a deep breath and try to think about this a little more clearly before you end up getting banned. :twocents:
Post by: Fidelk on March 20, 2022, 10:13:11 PM
That setup could provide the Mother of all Thanksgiving dinners. You could make a fortune on the broadcast rights.If you invite guests into the mudman home, and they start saying how awesome Inslee is, or how stupid your dog is, or how fat your wife is, do you say "oh well, that's free speech!" and give em another beer out of your fridge?Actually I do. Your talking about my family!!! Wife might get mad though. :chuckle: Serious we speak our minds.
Post by: KFhunter on March 21, 2022, 05:02:37 PM
It's like saying we need to ally with Europe....well Europe has Russia, and Switzerland and Turkey, Ukraine and England..and a whole bunch of other countries. They're all different, some are more friendly than others.
If the Yakimas are Russians, then the Colvilles are Canadians..
Post by: huntandjeep on March 21, 2022, 05:08:26 PM
Post by: bornhunter on March 21, 2022, 05:28:09 PM
Post by: Cougartail on March 21, 2022, 05:36:17 PM
I thought there was a time when shed buyers were there and the money for the sheds went towards buying feed for the elk. Thing of the past???
In the feed area the horns are collected daily and sold at auction to feed them.
I have seen no evidence of anyone driving up Oak Creek yet this year.
Post by: snake on March 21, 2022, 08:14:40 PM
Post by: KFhunter on March 21, 2022, 08:50:14 PM
Like I said, discuss, but be mindful of making stereotypical comments that skirt the edges of racist remarks
It is wholly appropriate to discuss various tribal rights as it relates to outdoor activities, and abuses, it affects us all.
And positives too if ya got em, like wedge wolf trapping
Post by: bornhunter on March 21, 2022, 08:50:24 PM
I thought there was a time when shed buyers were there and the money for the sheds went towards buying feed for the elk. Thing of the past???
In the feed area the horns are collected daily and sold at auction to feed them.
I have seen no evidence of anyone driving up Oak Creek yet this year.
:tup:
Post by: trophyhunt on March 22, 2022, 01:35:46 AM
I do not believe it is "Native Bashing" just for someone to disagree that they have "rights" to hunt and kill whatever they want basically. Its ok to think something is wrong even if its legal. :twocents:agree. We can call out our fellow members who vote democrat and created this big pile of crap that our nation is in right now, but don’t say anything against natives who have supported the dem party for decades. You guys think if you kiss their butts enough they will be on your side? Lmao! They have the dems in their pocket, and the last thing they worry about is non natives losing a damn thing.
Post by: hunter399 on March 22, 2022, 04:05:02 AM
Believe it or not ....i try to not bash people for being democrats. Spring bear makes me so angry .I do not believe it is "Native Bashing" just for someone to disagree that they have "rights" to hunt and kill whatever they want basically. Its ok to think something is wrong even if its legal. :twocents:agree. We can call out our fellow members who vote democrat and created this big pile of crap that our nation is in right now, but don’t say anything against natives who have supported the dem party for decades. You guys think if you kiss their butts enough they will be on your side? Lmao! They have the dems in their pocket, and the last thing they worry about is non natives losing a damn thing.
I blame inslee and his cronies on the Commission the most.
Natives anymore are just being native,you know that since of what's belongs to them I guess.
Probably still some sheds around just off the road aways.
Post by: Skyvalhunter on March 22, 2022, 05:14:28 AM
Post by: LDennis24 on March 22, 2022, 06:02:29 AM
Post by: Rainier10 on March 22, 2022, 06:34:33 AM
Do we know if theres any truth to the OP:yeah:
Post by: Buzzsaw461 on March 22, 2022, 07:48:48 AM
I do not believe it is "Native Bashing" just for someone to disagree that they have "rights" to hunt and kill whatever they want basically. Its ok to think something is wrong even if its legal. :twocents:agree. We can call out our fellow members who vote democrat and created this big pile of crap that our nation is in right now, but don’t say anything against natives who have supported the dem party for decades. You guys think if you kiss their butts enough they will be on your side? Lmao! They have the dems in their pocket, and the last thing they worry about is non natives losing a damn thing.
Post by: jackelope on March 22, 2022, 09:25:32 AM
I do not believe it is "Native Bashing" just for someone to disagree that they have "rights" to hunt and kill whatever they want basically. Its ok to think something is wrong even if its legal. :twocents:agree. We can call out our fellow members who vote democrat and created this big pile of crap that our nation is in right now, but don’t say anything against natives who have supported the dem party for decades. You guys think if you kiss their butts enough they will be on your side? Lmao! They have the dems in their pocket, and the last thing they worry about is non natives losing a damn thing.
We had to create a whole private board for the political crap here on the hunting forum. We can probably talk about a whole opt-in board to discuss native american topics. Happy to run it up the flag pole with the boss man and see what he wants to do.
Post by: pianoman9701 on March 22, 2022, 09:47:19 AM
I do not believe it is "Native Bashing" just for someone to disagree that they have "rights" to hunt and kill whatever they want basically. Its ok to think something is wrong even if its legal. :twocents:
The point is you're blaming the wrong people. Congress and the President gave treaty rights to Native tribes. They didn't just show up and demand them. Blame the gov't., not the Tribes.
If there were a lotto and you won exclusive rights to sheds or year-round elk hunting or unlimited crabbing or snagging chums or something else you love to hunt or fish, would you turn it down? I doubt it. If our government allows Native people to harvest antlers and elk at Oak Creek and you don't like it, talk to your duly-elected government.
Post by: KFhunter on March 22, 2022, 09:53:35 AM
But a lot of our current issues is previous lawsuits, which look more like reparations than proper interpretation of law
Post by: pianoman9701 on March 22, 2022, 10:02:23 AM
Ratified treaties are the law of the land, equal to our constitution in power.
But a lot of our current issues is previous lawsuits, which look more like reparations than proper interpretation of law
Again, those lawsuits have to do with previously ceded lands...to do with treaties. Regardless of whether it's treaties or judicial ruling, it's the government which gives them those rights. They don't just claim them.
Post by: idahohuntr on March 22, 2022, 10:58:54 AM
This is not correct and clarification here may help in understanding some of these tribal issues...treaty rights are often referred to as 'reserved' rights....rights the Tribes have always had (pre-dating US Gov't) and which are so important to them they explicitly reserved them at the time they ceded other rights/interests/claims to broad swaths of land.
Congress and the President gave treaty rights to Native tribes.
But a lot of our current issues is previous lawsuits, which look more like reparations than proper interpretation of lawI disagree. Federal Indian law and interpretation of treaties is generally well reasoned/supported by the case law. Obviously reasonable people can come to different conclusions on any individual case...but collectively I would not view any broad set of rulings as reparations...I think that view is more common from folks who forget the hundred-ish years treaty rights were ignored or even criminalized.
Post by: pianoman9701 on March 22, 2022, 11:08:34 AM
This is not correct and clarification here may help in understanding some of these tribal issues...treaty rights are often referred to as 'reserved' rights....rights the Tribes have always had (pre-dating US Gov't) and which are so important to them they explicitly reserved them at the time they ceded other rights/interests/claims to broad swaths of land.
Congress and the President gave treaty rights to Native tribes.But a lot of our current issues is previous lawsuits, which look more like reparations than proper interpretation of lawI disagree. Federal Indian law and interpretation of treaties is generally well reasoned/supported by the case law. Obviously reasonable people can come to different conclusions on any individual case...but collectively I would not view any broad set of rulings as reparations...I think that view is more common from folks who forget the hundred-ish years treaty rights were ignored or even criminalized.
You missed my point, which is that either by treaty or judicial decision, the government is responsible for Native resource rights. The tribes don't just decide something is theirs and take it.
Post by: trophyhunt on March 22, 2022, 12:02:28 PM
I personally wasn’t there to talk to the guys at the gate, but from this thread it sounds like it’s no secret, and falls in line with what I was told.Do we know if theres any truth to the OP:yeah:
Post by: nwmein199 on March 22, 2022, 12:25:24 PM
I personally wasn’t there to talk to the guys at the gate, but from this thread it sounds like it’s no secret, and falls in line with what I was told.Do we know if theres any truth to the OP:yeah:
So the answer to the question is "No"...there is no truth or evidence to support the claims OP made.
I was told it was only Eskimos being allowed in the gate at Oak Creek feeding station.
Post by: fishngamereaper on March 22, 2022, 12:33:36 PM
Post by: phildobaggins on March 22, 2022, 01:18:41 PM
Back in the day when I was helping feed the elk in the eburg area I had keys to the gates. I rolled through the gate one day and there was a handful of people trying to get pics of some welfare elk...they asked what I was doing... told them elk love alfalfa and I was going to lure them in and shoot the biggest bull...the reaction was priceless...thank goodness the internet didn't exist back then.. :chuckle:
I love that.
Post by: snake on March 22, 2022, 05:26:04 PM
I do not believe it is "Native Bashing" just for someone to disagree that they have "rights" to hunt and kill whatever they want basically. Its ok to think something is wrong even if its legal. :twocents:
The point is you're blaming the wrong people. Congress and the President gave treaty rights to Native tribes. They didn't just show up and demand them. Blame the gov't., not the Tribes.
If there were a lotto and you won exclusive rights to sheds or year-round elk hunting or unlimited crabbing or snagging chums or something else you love to hunt or fish, would you turn it down? I doubt it. If our government allows Native people to harvest antlers and elk at Oak Creek and you don't like it, talk to your duly-elected government.
Yes boss, I understand how it all works and how it came to be so. I still stand by my post. These "rights" are being greatly abused by many in the tribe and that's a fact. Its not native bashing.
Post by: trophyhunt on March 22, 2022, 05:38:30 PM
I don’t know man, you have proof?? The CNN fact checkers need more than just hearsay!!I do not believe it is "Native Bashing" just for someone to disagree that they have "rights" to hunt and kill whatever they want basically. Its ok to think something is wrong even if its legal. :twocents:
The point is you're blaming the wrong people. Congress and the President gave treaty rights to Native tribes. They didn't just show up and demand them. Blame the gov't., not the Tribes.
If there were a lotto and you won exclusive rights to sheds or year-round elk hunting or unlimited crabbing or snagging chums or something else you love to hunt or fish, would you turn it down? I doubt it. If our government allows Native people to harvest antlers and elk at Oak Creek and you don't like it, talk to your duly-elected government.
Yes boss, I understand how it all works and how it came to be so. I still stand by my post. These "rights" are being greatly abused by many in the tribe and that's a fact. Its not native bashing.
Post by: LDennis24 on March 22, 2022, 05:43:16 PM
Post by: trophyhunt on March 22, 2022, 05:54:15 PM
Literally a half dozen threads on hear going back to 2008 when Bone wanted to strangle some people over trying to shoot elk in the Oak Creek wildlife area. :dunno: This is old news and will continue until folks stop ranting on internet forums about fairness and actually do the dirty work of fighting for the change through legal means.thats right, it’s happening and we all know it, but people still ask for proof. What a joke.
Post by: trophyhunt on March 22, 2022, 05:58:20 PM
Post by: rtspring on March 22, 2022, 06:03:09 PM
Hunters, Hunting Community is a dog eat dog world. Always has been always will be.
Post by: bigtex on March 22, 2022, 06:19:11 PM
Dennis, there is no fight, that’s the truth.:yeah:
If anybody thinks that there is the actual political or legal will to amend/restrict/etc tribal hunting/fishing rights they are mistaken. We have a US Supreme Court which in just 2019 voted to affirm tribal hunting rights in Wyoming, and the deciding vote came down to Gorsuch who of course was nominated by Trump. In fact Gorsuch has almost always sided with tribes while on SCOTUS and as an appellate judge. And while the Court now has a conservative majority you have Gorsuch who almost always sides with tribes, and Coney-Barrett who basically has no background in tribal issues. So it really could be a toss-up if a tribal hunting/fishing rights made it to the Court.
Realistically, I think all we can do is bring the "issues" forward and post the abuses on social media. But lets face it, the tribes could just turn it around and point to examples of non-tribal members poaching.
Post by: trophyhunt on March 22, 2022, 06:28:45 PM
Post by: idaho guy on March 22, 2022, 06:58:49 PM
Agree bigtex, and the other prob is social media really won’t do anything, like this one. We could have video of a certain tribal member in flip flops killing multiple bulls to sell, and One non native spotlighting a spike, the woke news would only report on the non native. It’s a joke, just not funny.
I agree with you trophy especially on the mainstream media. Except I think posting abuses by tribal members all over the internet will have an effect. I don't think most people are aware of whats really going on. Be the best chance to hold the natives abusing stuff accountable.
Post by: KFhunter on March 22, 2022, 07:03:23 PM
Post by: idaho guy on March 22, 2022, 07:12:15 PM
Meh, It's been posted for years has it had an effect yet?
NO :chuckle: I was thinking other social media sites? Its been on this site for years but it doesnt seem to be out there much(except for this site Ha Ha).
Post by: NOCK NOCK on March 22, 2022, 07:24:30 PM
This is not correct and clarification here may help in understanding some of these tribal issues...treaty rights are often referred to as 'reserved' rights....rights the Tribes have always had (pre-dating US Gov't) and which are so important to them they explicitly reserved them at the time they ceded other rights/interests/claims to broad swaths of land.
Congress and the President gave treaty rights to Native tribes.But a lot of our current issues is previous lawsuits, which look more like reparations than proper interpretation of lawI disagree. Federal Indian law and interpretation of treaties is generally well reasoned/supported by the case law. Obviously reasonable people can come to different conclusions on any individual case...but collectively I would not view any broad set of rulings as reparations...I think that view is more common from folks who forget the hundred-ish years treaty rights were ignored or even criminalized.
You missed my point, which is that either by treaty or judicial decision, the government is responsible for Native resource rights. The tribes don't just decide something is theirs and take it.
Look at it this way.... If I had exclusive rights(or whatever ya wanna call it) to shoot bighorns in the Swak., as many as I wanted to, any day of the year.........I would not do it. I would take 1, and be happy. SHARING with your fellow sportsman/women, and helping others achieve the same goals we all have interest in is a long lost thing. SAD
Post by: trophyhunt on March 22, 2022, 07:29:46 PM
Post by: KFhunter on March 22, 2022, 07:50:29 PM
This is not correct and clarification here may help in understanding some of these tribal issues...treaty rights are often referred to as 'reserved' rights....rights the Tribes have always had (pre-dating US Gov't) and which are so important to them they explicitly reserved them at the time they ceded other rights/interests/claims to broad swaths of land.
Congress and the President gave treaty rights to Native tribes.But a lot of our current issues is previous lawsuits, which look more like reparations than proper interpretation of lawI disagree. Federal Indian law and interpretation of treaties is generally well reasoned/supported by the case law. Obviously reasonable people can come to different conclusions on any individual case...but collectively I would not view any broad set of rulings as reparations...I think that view is more common from folks who forget the hundred-ish years treaty rights were ignored or even criminalized.
You missed my point, which is that either by treaty or judicial decision, the government is responsible for Native resource rights. The tribes don't just decide something is theirs and take it.
Look at it this way.... If I had exclusive rights(or whatever ya wanna call it) to shoot bighorns in the Swak., as many as I wanted to, any day of the year.........I would not do it. I would take 1, and be happy. SHARING with your fellow sportsman/women, and helping others achieve the same goals we all have interest in is a long lost thing. SAD
Not had you been raised differently, you're using the lens of your upbringing, your ethics, your moral code.
Post by: KFhunter on March 22, 2022, 07:52:07 PM
Ask Plat
Post by: trophyhunt on March 22, 2022, 07:58:36 PM
Change cannot come from without, the law prevents this, it must come from within.kudos to plat for trying, I know he has. But the elders didn’t care, hopefully someday they do.
Ask Plat
Post by: Buzzsaw461 on March 22, 2022, 08:59:46 PM
I do not believe it is "Native Bashing" just for someone to disagree that they have "rights" to hunt and kill whatever they want basically. Its ok to think something is wrong even if its legal. :twocents:
The point is you're blaming the wrong people. Congress and the President gave treaty rights to Native tribes. They didn't just show up and demand them. Blame the gov't., not the Tribes.
If there were a lotto and you won exclusive rights to sheds or year-round elk hunting or unlimited crabbing or snagging chums or something else you love to hunt or fish, would you turn it down? I doubt it. If our government allows Native people to harvest antlers and elk at Oak Creek and you don't like it, talk to your duly-elected government.
Yes boss, I understand how it all works and how it came to be so. I still stand by my post. These "rights" are being greatly abused by many in the tribe and that's a fact. Its not native bashing.
Post by: trophyhunt on March 22, 2022, 09:04:22 PM
Post by: NOCK NOCK on March 23, 2022, 05:39:50 AM
This is not correct and clarification here may help in understanding some of these tribal issues...treaty rights are often referred to as 'reserved' rights....rights the Tribes have always had (pre-dating US Gov't) and which are so important to them they explicitly reserved them at the time they ceded other rights/interests/claims to broad swaths of land.
Congress and the President gave treaty rights to Native tribes.But a lot of our current issues is previous lawsuits, which look more like reparations than proper interpretation of lawI disagree. Federal Indian law and interpretation of treaties is generally well reasoned/supported by the case law. Obviously reasonable people can come to different conclusions on any individual case...but collectively I would not view any broad set of rulings as reparations...I think that view is more common from folks who forget the hundred-ish years treaty rights were ignored or even criminalized.
You missed my point, which is that either by treaty or judicial decision, the government is responsible for Native resource rights. The tribes don't just decide something is theirs and take it.
Look at it this way.... If I had exclusive rights(or whatever ya wanna call it) to shoot bighorns in the Swak., as many as I wanted to, any day of the year.........I would not do it. I would take 1, and be happy. SHARING with your fellow sportsman/women, and helping others achieve the same goals we all have interest in is a long lost thing. SAD
Not had you been raised differently, you're using the lens of your upbringing, your ethics, your moral code.
So you can forecast MY actions/behaviors, Especially since you've never met me? :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: Thats completely laughable :chuckle:
Post by: Skyvalhunter on March 23, 2022, 05:42:46 AM
Post by: fishngamereaper on March 23, 2022, 06:13:53 AM
If you want to find tribal abuse of fish and game it's out there...but, just the same, if you want to find non tribal abuse of fish and game it's out there as well...And probably at higher levels. Does going in oak Creek for an unknown elk harvest....season driven, ceremonial or otherwise constitute abuse. And does collecting shed antlers constitute abuse. I mean shed antlers aren't even "managed" by the State. Plenty of places to shed hunt. And plenty of non tribal guys sneaking in from the back roads and the tops via snow machines and quads to get first dibs... Maybe gathering shed's should be illegal. I'm sure if enough people complain about who gets first dibs the state will just list sheds the same as deadheads.
I guess in my book this a small part of a bigger problem.
Now, if you want to get me fired up let's talk about tribal halibut fishing that started a couple weeks ago.... :chuckle:
Post by: trophyhunt on March 23, 2022, 06:53:13 AM
These threads show up a few times a year. I get it, venting and frustration. But allot of it is I heard from a guy that heard from a guy, then it turns into mob mentality and some comments show up that are flat out disrespectful, distasteful and hate filled. We all know tribes have rights to fish and game that exceed most of our own. And no I don't always agree with them. And sometimes I vent. But venting hatred is not going to accomplish anything. Except continue the division that drives good people away from this site. We used to have some level headed tribal perspective but those days are gone. And I don't blame those guy's for leaving or not chiming in anymore...Are you sure they started halibut fishing or did you just hear about it??? Have you seen it for yourself????
If you want to find tribal abuse of fish and game it's out there...but, just the same, if you want to find non tribal abuse of fish and game it's out there as well...And probably at higher levels. Does going in oak Creek for an unknown elk harvest....season driven, ceremonial or otherwise constitute abuse. And does collecting shed antlers constitute abuse. I mean shed antlers aren't even "managed" by the State. Plenty of places to shed hunt. And plenty of non tribal guys sneaking in from the back roads and the tops via snow machines and quads to get first dibs... Maybe gathering shed's should be illegal. I'm sure if enough people complain about who gets first dibs the state will just list sheds the same as deadheads.
I guess in my book this a small part of a bigger problem.
Now, if you want to get me fired up let's talk about tribal halibut fishing that started a couple weeks ago.... :chuckle:
:chuckle:
Post by: fishngamereaper on March 23, 2022, 06:57:49 AM
These threads show up a few times a year. I get it, venting and frustration. But allot of it is I heard from a guy that heard from a guy, then it turns into mob mentality and some comments show up that are flat out disrespectful, distasteful and hate filled. We all know tribes have rights to fish and game that exceed most of our own. And no I don't always agree with them. And sometimes I vent. But venting hatred is not going to accomplish anything. Except continue the division that drives good people away from this site. We used to have some level headed tribal perspective but those days are gone. And I don't blame those guy's for leaving or not chiming in anymore...Are you sure they started halibut fishing or did you just hear about it??? Have you seen it for yourself????
If you want to find tribal abuse of fish and game it's out there...but, just the same, if you want to find non tribal abuse of fish and game it's out there as well...And probably at higher levels. Does going in oak Creek for an unknown elk harvest....season driven, ceremonial or otherwise constitute abuse. And does collecting shed antlers constitute abuse. I mean shed antlers aren't even "managed" by the State. Plenty of places to shed hunt. And plenty of non tribal guys sneaking in from the back roads and the tops via snow machines and quads to get first dibs... Maybe gathering shed's should be illegal. I'm sure if enough people complain about who gets first dibs the state will just list sheds the same as deadheads.
I guess in my book this a small part of a bigger problem.
Now, if you want to get me fired up let's talk about tribal halibut fishing that started a couple weeks ago.... :chuckle:
:chuckle:
Yes I know allot of tribal guys ..
I stay in the loop...gets me good Intel on halibut spots and also a preview of shrimp numbers since they have seasons coming up in a couple weeks.
Post by: Odell on March 23, 2022, 10:47:14 AM
These threads show up a few times a year. I get it, venting and frustration. But allot of it is I heard from a guy that heard from a guy, then it turns into mob mentality and some comments show up that are flat out disrespectful, distasteful and hate filled. We all know tribes have rights to fish and game that exceed most of our own. And no I don't always agree with them. And sometimes I vent. But venting hatred is not going to accomplish anything. Except continue the division that drives good people away from this site. We used to have some level headed tribal perspective but those days are gone. And I don't blame those guy's for leaving or not chiming in anymore...
If you want to find tribal abuse of fish and game it's out there...but, just the same, if you want to find non tribal abuse of fish and game it's out there as well...And probably at higher levels. Does going in oak Creek for an unknown elk harvest....season driven, ceremonial or otherwise constitute abuse. And does collecting shed antlers constitute abuse. I mean shed antlers aren't even "managed" by the State. Plenty of places to shed hunt. And plenty of non tribal guys sneaking in from the back roads and the tops via snow machines and quads to get first dibs... Maybe gathering shed's should be illegal. I'm sure if enough people complain about who gets first dibs the state will just list sheds the same as deadheads.
I guess in my book this a small part of a bigger problem.
Now, if you want to get me fired up let's talk about tribal halibut fishing that started a couple weeks ago.... :chuckle:
A significant difference is enforcement. It seems there is no ability to address tribal members shooting bulls and bucks for jerky and antler sales.
I would like the whole thing demonetized. It needs to be illegal to sell or purchase any part of a game animal. No antlers, no meat, no taxidermy, no nothing.
this already exists with waterfowl
Post by: Rainier10 on March 23, 2022, 11:19:47 AM
Post by: Skyvalhunter on March 23, 2022, 11:37:43 AM
Post by: Rainier10 on March 23, 2022, 11:42:04 AM
Different standardThe poster before me said the significant difference is enforcement. I would say there is little difference between enforcement of egregious tribal and non tribal overharvest.
Post by: trophyhunt on March 23, 2022, 12:13:52 PM
Do I need to bring up operation Cody and all the deer and elk one non tribal individual was killing and got 90 days house arrest for. I’m not sure I would call that enforcement/punishment that fit the crime.That sob did not get what he deserved, but the yakama members that delivered deer and elk every week to him didn't get anything.
Post by: Buzzsaw461 on March 23, 2022, 02:03:15 PM
Do I need to bring up operation Cody and all the deer and elk one non tribal individual was killing and got 90 days house arrest for. I’m not sure I would call that enforcement/punishment that fit the crime.That sob did not get what he deserved, but the yakama members that delivered deer and elk every week to him didn't anything.
Post by: Buzzsaw461 on March 23, 2022, 02:06:43 PM
These threads show up a few times a year. I get it, venting and frustration. But allot of it is I heard from a guy that heard from a guy, then it turns into mob mentality and some comments show up that are flat out disrespectful, distasteful and hate filled. We all know tribes have rights to fish and game that exceed most of our own. And no I don't always agree with them. And sometimes I vent. But venting hatred is not going to accomplish anything. Except continue the division that drives good people away from this site. We used to have some level headed tribal perspective but those days are gone. And I don't blame those guy's for leaving or not chiming in anymore...Are you sure they started halibut fishing or did you just hear about it??? Have you seen it for yourself????
If you want to find tribal abuse of fish and game it's out there...but, just the same, if you want to find non tribal abuse of fish and game it's out there as well...And probably at higher levels. Does going in oak Creek for an unknown elk harvest....season driven, ceremonial or otherwise constitute abuse. And does collecting shed antlers constitute abuse. I mean shed antlers aren't even "managed" by the State. Plenty of places to shed hunt. And plenty of non tribal guys sneaking in from the back roads and the tops via snow machines and quads to get first dibs... Maybe gathering shed's should be illegal. I'm sure if enough people complain about who gets first dibs the state will just list sheds the same as deadheads.
I guess in my book this a small part of a bigger problem.
Now, if you want to get me fired up let's talk about tribal halibut fishing that started a couple weeks ago.... :chuckle:
:chuckle:
Post by: royalbull on March 26, 2022, 09:39:35 PM
Post by: Colby Otto on March 28, 2022, 08:35:55 AM
I could care less about those sheds in Oak Creek, I just wish the Muckleshoots would stay on the West side and not venture onto the little naches to kill elk
:yeah:
Post by: trophyhunt on March 28, 2022, 08:51:18 AM
I could care less about those sheds in Oak Creek, I just wish the Muckleshoots would stay on the West side and not venture onto the little naches to kill elkThey tricked the yakamas, and I believe that first year after they got permission to hunt the Eastside the mucks took as many deer as non natives. Now some would say that’s a 50/50 split, but it’s more like 1% of the population getting more than their share. Not sure what the numbers have been the past few years.
Post by: Whitefoot on March 28, 2022, 11:19:24 AM
With what is going on, f barking, I think it’s time to bite. Not sure how many more of us can take this crap. Bend over, take it dry! Yeah, I’m pissed, pissed about a lot of crap going on, I understand the whole “straw that broke the camels back” now more than ever.:chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle:
Post by: Whitefoot on March 28, 2022, 11:25:28 AM
No longer will I bash any non natives for sneaking in early in that area, natives are allowed inside the gate to gather antlers, and harvest elk if it is within their time line. I guess this isn’t new but it’s the first I heard of it. Such BS
What's our timeline Jerry?
Post by: Tbar on March 28, 2022, 11:33:05 AM
Fishing was decent today. Not great but got a few. :tup:These threads show up a few times a year. I get it, venting and frustration. But allot of it is I heard from a guy that heard from a guy, then it turns into mob mentality and some comments show up that are flat out disrespectful, distasteful and hate filled. We all know tribes have rights to fish and game that exceed most of our own. And no I don't always agree with them. And sometimes I vent. But venting hatred is not going to accomplish anything. Except continue the division that drives good people away from this site. We used to have some level headed tribal perspective but those days are gone. And I don't blame those guy's for leaving or not chiming in anymore...Are you sure they started halibut fishing or did you just hear about it??? Have you seen it for yourself????
If you want to find tribal abuse of fish and game it's out there...but, just the same, if you want to find non tribal abuse of fish and game it's out there as well...And probably at higher levels. Does going in oak Creek for an unknown elk harvest....season driven, ceremonial or otherwise constitute abuse. And does collecting shed antlers constitute abuse. I mean shed antlers aren't even "managed" by the State. Plenty of places to shed hunt. And plenty of non tribal guys sneaking in from the back roads and the tops via snow machines and quads to get first dibs... Maybe gathering shed's should be illegal. I'm sure if enough people complain about who gets first dibs the state will just list sheds the same as deadheads.
I guess in my book this a small part of a bigger problem.
Now, if you want to get me fired up let's talk about tribal halibut fishing that started a couple weeks ago.... :chuckle:
:chuckle:
Post by: Whitefoot on March 28, 2022, 11:39:33 AM
Fishing was decent today. Not great but got a few. :tup:These threads show up a few times a year. I get it, venting and frustration. But allot of it is I heard from a guy that heard from a guy, then it turns into mob mentality and some comments show up that are flat out disrespectful, distasteful and hate filled. We all know tribes have rights to fish and game that exceed most of our own. And no I don't always agree with them. And sometimes I vent. But venting hatred is not going to accomplish anything. Except continue the division that drives good people away from this site. We used to have some level headed tribal perspective but those days are gone. And I don't blame those guy's for leaving or not chiming in anymore...Are you sure they started halibut fishing or did you just hear about it??? Have you seen it for yourself????
If you want to find tribal abuse of fish and game it's out there...but, just the same, if you want to find non tribal abuse of fish and game it's out there as well...And probably at higher levels. Does going in oak Creek for an unknown elk harvest....season driven, ceremonial or otherwise constitute abuse. And does collecting shed antlers constitute abuse. I mean shed antlers aren't even "managed" by the State. Plenty of places to shed hunt. And plenty of non tribal guys sneaking in from the back roads and the tops via snow machines and quads to get first dibs... Maybe gathering shed's should be illegal. I'm sure if enough people complain about who gets first dibs the state will just list sheds the same as deadheads.
I guess in my book this a small part of a bigger problem.
Now, if you want to get me fired up let's talk about tribal halibut fishing that started a couple weeks ago.... :chuckle:
:chuckle:
Post by: Whitefoot on March 28, 2022, 11:55:36 AM
They don't walk more than 20 feet from a road so calm down.:chuckle: thank God!!
Post by: trophyhunt on March 28, 2022, 12:10:21 PM
Well Arron, it's anytime, but you know that.No longer will I bash any non natives for sneaking in early in that area, natives are allowed inside the gate to gather antlers, and harvest elk if it is within their time line. I guess this isn’t new but it’s the first I heard of it. Such BS
What's our timeline Jerry?
Post by: Whitefoot on March 28, 2022, 12:12:04 PM
Well Arron, it's anytime, but you know that.No longer will I bash any non natives for sneaking in early in that area, natives are allowed inside the gate to gather antlers, and harvest elk if it is within their time line. I guess this isn’t new but it’s the first I heard of it. Such BS
What's our timeline Jerry?
Anytime? Here I thought You actually had dates for your rant!
Post by: Whitefoot on March 28, 2022, 12:13:35 PM
Agree bigtex, and the other prob is social media really won’t do anything, like this one. We could have video of a certain tribal member in flip flops killing multiple bulls to sell, and One non native spotlighting a spike, the woke news would only report on the non native. It’s a joke, just not funny.lol. :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle: What's wrong with flip flops?
Post by: trophyhunt on March 28, 2022, 12:16:17 PM
Dates, dark or light out, 24/7 for you, and it's all legal to boot. How many did you kill this year? (I have to ask but you never answer that one).Well Arron, it's anytime, but you know that.No longer will I bash any non natives for sneaking in early in that area, natives are allowed inside the gate to gather antlers, and harvest elk if it is within their time line. I guess this isn’t new but it’s the first I heard of it. Such BS
What's our timeline Jerry?
Anytime? Here I thought You actually had dates for your rant!
Post by: trophyhunt on March 28, 2022, 12:18:00 PM
With all that jerky money you'd think a guy would buy some boots at least!! lolAgree bigtex, and the other prob is social media really won’t do anything, like this one. We could have video of a certain tribal member in flip flops killing multiple bulls to sell, and One non native spotlighting a spike, the woke news would only report on the non native. It’s a joke, just not funny.lol. :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle: What's wrong with flip flops?
Post by: Whitefoot on March 28, 2022, 12:18:50 PM
Dates, dark or light out, 24/7 for you, and it's all legal to boot. How many did you kill this year? (I have to ask but you never answer that one).Well Arron, it's anytime, but you know that.No longer will I bash any non natives for sneaking in early in that area, natives are allowed inside the gate to gather antlers, and harvest elk if it is within their time line. I guess this isn’t new but it’s the first I heard of it. Such BS
What's our timeline Jerry?
Anytime? Here I thought You actually had dates for your rant!
[/quote
Yup, can write all the letters and stalk my fb page all you want. Won't get you anywhere.
Post by: h20hunter on March 28, 2022, 12:20:10 PM