Post by: WapitiTalk1 on September 14, 2024, 08:40:16 PM
Post by: Dan-o on September 14, 2024, 09:15:42 PM
15+1 capacity.
More accurate (at least for me) than a wheel gun, with sufficient penetration for most circumstances...... My guess is that there are very limited shots where a 44 would penetrate that a hard cast 10MM wouldn't.
I just reallllllllllllllllllllllllllllly hope I never have to put it to the test.
Post by: MADMAX on September 14, 2024, 09:55:22 PM
And bear spray in area with grizz or Brownies
Shoots good with lots of capacity
I remember being over in Montana near Choteau shed hunting
Had a 41 on
Guy says that a Blackhawk ya got on ?
Yup
Says better get something semi or double action
Lots grizzlies out here
Thought about it
Peddled the 41
Never regretted it
Post by: WapitiTalk1 on September 14, 2024, 10:07:34 PM
Post by: WapitiTalk1 on September 14, 2024, 10:22:10 PM
I love my G20 as well
And bear spray in area with grizz or Brownies
Shoots good with lots of capacity
I remember being over in Montana near Choteau shed hunting
Had a 41 on
Guy says that a Blackhawk ya got on ?
Yup
Says better get something semi or double action
Lots grizzlies out here
Thought about it
Peddled the 41
Never regretted it
Choteau? I hope u picked up some Alpine Touch seasoning, Montana’s Special Spice…not much better.
Post by: BKMFR on September 15, 2024, 05:48:38 AM
Post by: Sakko300wsm on September 15, 2024, 07:05:12 AM
Post by: CarbonHunter on September 15, 2024, 07:13:51 AM
Always carry bear spray when hunting in bear country. Perfectly legal to spray the bear once he gets close and you don’t have to wait until the bear is attacking to react like you do with a firearm.
Post by: BLDtraLR on September 15, 2024, 08:53:27 AM
Why 15 rounds you ask. Try rolling a tire down a hill at you and see how many rounds you hit on target in a pressure situation simulating a charge. Sure it may only take 1 but i like having 14 more just in case. :chuckle:
Post by: ipkus on September 15, 2024, 08:56:04 AM
Post by: Sakko300wsm on September 15, 2024, 09:09:51 AM
G20 as well with 15 rounds of underwood 200 grain hard cast and an extra 15 rounds on my belt. I"ve seen the outcome of bear spray first hand if the wind is blowing in your direction and not the bear's ask my buddy how that felt. :yike: :bash: :dunno: :chuckle: :chuckle:
Why 15 rounds you ask. Try rolling a tire down a hill at you and see how many rounds you hit on target in a pressure situation simulating a charge. Sure it may only take 1 but i like having 14 more just in case. :chuckle:
:yeah: 💯%
Post by: WapitiTalk1 on September 15, 2024, 09:20:36 AM
Post by: ghosthunter on September 15, 2024, 09:22:23 AM
I will be out spotting for him when not tending camp. The largest hand gun I own is a 45 Judge. I did a lot of reading and if I have to go in on his moose kill I am carrying one or two of these.
Have pepper spray four cans.
KSG loaded with slugs
Coach Gun 12 Ga loaded with slugs
S& W SVE 40 auto
Judge 45 colt
Thats what I have and those I can shoot. I am not hunting just spotting ,cooking packing.
Post by: Magnum_Willys on September 15, 2024, 09:23:23 AM
Post by: wadu1 on September 15, 2024, 09:24:32 AM
Post by: Jellymon on September 15, 2024, 10:40:44 AM
Post by: Cougartail on September 15, 2024, 11:16:47 AM
Another vote for the G20, although youre limited to 10rd mags now. Very easy shooting gun and very reliable. A little on the heavy side though. Mine is 2lb 12oz loaded with 15rds of 200g hard casts.
XD-M 4.5 10mm. No spray! Many times you don't have time to switch deterrents. Warning shot and the finger is still on the trigger.
Post by: dwtraut7 on September 15, 2024, 11:33:05 AM
Post by: jrebel on September 15, 2024, 07:51:56 PM
I really think a handloaded solid copper would be pretty awesome for deep penetration. Hammer Hunters 240 gr Jack Hammer would be a pretty amazing round out of the 454 casull as well.
Post by: WapitiTalk1 on September 15, 2024, 07:57:45 PM
Ruger 454 casull with 325 grain hard cast lead bullets. HSM makes some that are great...but I load my own but very similar. Buffalo Bore makes some good ammo for the casull as well.
I really think a handloaded solid copper would be pretty awesome for deep penetration. Hammer Hunters 240 gr Jack Hammer would be a pretty amazing round out of the 454 casull as well.
JR, what does that beast weigh?
Post by: jrebel on September 15, 2024, 08:03:52 PM
Ruger 454 casull with 325 grain hard cast lead bullets. HSM makes some that are great...but I load my own but very similar. Buffalo Bore makes some good ammo for the casull as well.
I really think a handloaded solid copper would be pretty awesome for deep penetration. Hammer Hunters 240 gr Jack Hammer would be a pretty amazing round out of the 454 casull as well.
JR, what does that beast weigh?
According to the internet....it is 49 ounces or 3.06 lbs. unloaded.
I have the 5" Talo toklat model. I wear it in a chest holster or a side sling holster depending on what and where I am going.
Post by: WapitiTalk1 on September 15, 2024, 08:42:28 PM
Post by: Wetwoodshunter on September 16, 2024, 06:33:22 AM
Post by: Stein on September 16, 2024, 08:22:40 AM
Post by: HuntNFish on September 16, 2024, 10:12:57 AM
Post by: Dirtnap on September 16, 2024, 10:06:45 PM
Post by: C-Money on September 17, 2024, 06:48:48 AM
Post by: spin05 on September 17, 2024, 10:18:59 AM
Post by: Ingwe on September 17, 2024, 02:58:00 PM
Post by: mcrawfordaf on September 17, 2024, 03:07:21 PM
(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/a5hZ-OivHvI/sddefault.jpg)
Post by: bearhunter99 on September 18, 2024, 06:03:48 PM
Post by: Sliverslinger on September 18, 2024, 09:51:44 PM
Post by: WapitiTalk1 on September 18, 2024, 09:59:55 PM
Post by: logola512c on September 19, 2024, 09:56:32 AM
I can shoot the 9mm with a high level of competency, meaning 150% bear-head-sized rapid fire groups at 15 yards, and bear-head sized rapid fire groups at 10 yards. For me, the 45 is probably about 10-15% less accurate at those ranges. I am absolutely terrible with the .44 unless it is under 7 yards or using some kind of rest.
So I have a high level of confidence that with the 9 or the 45, I can get more accurate shots and definitely a higher volume of shots on target, especially under duress. And I'd start pulling the trigger earlier and more often, trying my best to hit the head.
So then it comes down to the bullet type. I've seen a lot written about hard cast bullets and their penetration, etc. And there's good data about why the meplot of the bullets causes more wound channel damage, but there's also a lot of videos etc. that show that higher velocity FMJ bullets from a 9mm or 45ACP have suprisingly deep penetration because they don't really expand.
So is the goal to have a pistol that's going to be able to knock down a charging brown bear without a head shot? That's a tall order for any pistol round. That seems like shotgun land like others have said, especially a double or triple ought buck that is more forgiving of aim under duress.
So for me, if I had to choose between my three pistols, I'd carry my 9mm with 15 rounds of high velocity FMJ bullets, the same ones that I routinely practice with on the range and that I am highly confident will all hit the target, which is that face/brain that wants to eat and destroy me. And for me, it all comes down to what rounds are going to reliably hit that charging target that's hard to hit. I wish that was the 44 but it's not.
I'm guessing I'll get roasted for this answer...
Post by: Rat44 on September 19, 2024, 12:04:45 PM
I've seen a lot of these discussions online, and they always fascinate me. My pistols include an 8-inch .44 magnum, a 45 with a 2.5 inch barrel and 12 round magazine, and a 9mm concealed carry that pre-dates magazine bans with a 15 round magazine.The best sidearm is the one you are good with.
I can shoot the 9mm with a high level of competency, meaning 150% bear-head-sized rapid fire groups at 15 yards, and bear-head sized rapid fire groups at 10 yards. For me, the 45 is probably about 10-15% less accurate at those ranges. I am absolutely terrible with the .44 unless it is under 7 yards or using some kind of rest.
So I have a high level of confidence that with the 9 or the 45, I can get more accurate shots and definitely a higher volume of shots on target, especially under duress. And I'd start pulling the trigger earlier and more often, trying my best to hit the head.
So then it comes down to the bullet type. I've seen a lot written about hard cast bullets and their penetration, etc. And there's good data about why the meplot of the bullets causes more wound channel damage, but there's also a lot of videos etc. that show that higher velocity FMJ bullets from a 9mm or 45ACP have suprisingly deep penetration because they don't really expand.
So is the goal to have a pistol that's going to be able to knock down a charging brown bear without a head shot? That's a tall order for any pistol round. That seems like shotgun land like others have said, especially a double or triple ought buck that is more forgiving of aim under duress.
So for me, if I had to choose between my three pistols, I'd carry my 9mm with 15 rounds of high velocity FMJ bullets, the same ones that I routinely practice with on the range and that I am highly confident will all hit the target, which is that face/brain that wants to eat and destroy me. And for me, it all comes down to what rounds are going to reliably hit that charging target that's hard to hit. I wish that was the 44 but it's not.
I'm guessing I'll get roasted for this answer...
Buffalo Bore makes a load that would work well in your 9 mm.
147 gr hardcast lead flat point at 1100 FPS.
Post by: Rat44 on September 19, 2024, 12:08:58 PM
The only gun I would have the most confidence in is a 12 Gauge with slugs.
But since we are talking pistols my 5 shot 44 Mag is my constant companion while in the woods these days.
I can hit what I am aiming at and can get off all 5 rounds on target.
Post by: crabcreekhunter on September 19, 2024, 04:12:17 PM
Post by: TeacherMan on September 19, 2024, 04:51:20 PM
Post by: scudmaster on September 20, 2024, 08:22:39 AM
But I go with a G21 with a 5" 10MM conversion barrel and hard cast 220s in a RAZCO chest bino rig.
Post by: boneaddict on September 20, 2024, 10:25:09 AM
Post by: pianoman9701 on September 20, 2024, 11:16:22 AM
Post by: birdshooter1189 on September 20, 2024, 02:32:02 PM
44 mag is generally my first choice if I think I might need stopping power.
I've never had to fire a pistol in self defense. If I ever do, I hope to be holding a 44 mag, 357 mag or max, or 10mm when it happens.
Post by: MAVsled on September 21, 2024, 01:50:57 PM
But when going back in to pack out meat in bear country, it's my Rem-1100 short 20" bbl, w/out plug, 1st 2 rounds are 000-buck, then 3 slugs.
40 years ago, while fishing Alaska's Russian river for reds, talked to 2 rangers in the parking area.
Both had Rem 870-pump shotguns, short barrels, slung over their shoulders and loaded with 000 buckshot.
North Central WA state soon to become bear country for GRIZZ
Post by: jackelope on September 21, 2024, 07:33:13 PM
Post by: Cougartail on September 22, 2024, 07:14:09 AM
If ultralight was really a concern, S&W 329pd. If you’re really that concerned about weight, drop a pound or 2 somewhere else and pack a G20. What’s 1-2 pounds when you’re packing out a bull? You won’t even notice it.
Some fiber in your diet and a good movement will drop a pound for most. :chuckle:
Post by: kselkhunter on September 24, 2024, 04:35:11 PM
If all I could take was a pistol it would be my 460 Rowland with the 290gr ammo. I like shooting that suppressed, but would probably put the compensator back on instead for faster draw time (the 45 suppressors are long).
Post by: ridgefire on September 25, 2024, 08:27:57 AM
Post by: Magnum_Willys on September 25, 2024, 08:31:19 AM
Have any of you guys had any issues shooting 200 or 220 grain Underwood’s out of your G20? My G20 would jam every 3rd or 4th round with those bullets so I switched to Underwood 140 grain extreme penetrators. My gun likes them much better.Yikes! Thanks for heads up, will be testing for sure. Maybe try another brand.
Post by: 85yota on September 25, 2024, 12:36:08 PM
Post by: Dan-o on September 25, 2024, 12:40:10 PM
Have any of you guys had any issues shooting 200 or 220 grain Underwood’s out of your G20? My G20 would jam every 3rd or 4th round with those bullets so I switched to Underwood 140 grain extreme penetrators. My gun likes them much better.
No issues here, but I did put a heavier spring in.
I did that on the advice of a Glock loving friend.
I won't pretend to know exactly how that helps but I think it does.
Post by: birddogdad on September 25, 2024, 02:48:33 PM
My G20, 10mm with Underwood 200gr cast bullets (ie bear rounds) is always carried while hunting, archery a& rifle seasons.
But when going back in to pack out meat in bear country, it's my Rem-1100 short 20" bbl, w/out plug, 1st 2 rounds are 000-buck, then 3 slugs.
40 years ago, while fishing Alaska's Russian river for reds, talked to 2 rangers in the parking area.
Both had Rem 870-pump shotguns, short barrels, slung over their shoulders and loaded with 000 buckshot.
North Central WA state soon to become bear country for GRIZZ
i just upped to a G20 in 10mm.. waiting for the mag dance to make its way to court... maybe when someone dumps 10 and gets injured, they will sue the state for restricting their protection...wish the state supreme court would just get it done!.
Post by: Sunbkpk on September 25, 2024, 03:42:05 PM
Of course if I carry for bears it is a single action 44 magnum as it is what I have. UL it is not.
Post by: Cougartail on September 25, 2024, 04:57:34 PM
Why no love for the S&W 327 in 357 magnum and moon clips and all the love of 10mm Autos when bear gun and cartridges are discussed? Same energy or a little more than 10mm, 8 shots with fast reloads, and more reliability for no jams. About the same weight with the trr8 and very accurate. Jerry Miculek demonstrates it can be very fast and accurate. Autos are not faster than he is with the 327.
Of course if I carry for bears it is a single action 44 magnum as it is what I have. UL it is not.
I have no issue with the 357 and hardcast bullets. Tia Shoemaker, daughter of Alaska bear guide Phil Shoemaker carries it. Phil killed a big brown bear with the 9mm protecting clients.
Most people who have lived around bears lose the irrational fear of them. Someone back east killed a huge black bear a couple years ago with the 357. Reported over 600lbs I believe..
Post by: BLDtraLR on September 25, 2024, 06:28:59 PM
Have any of you guys had any issues shooting 200 or 220 grain Underwood’s out of your G20? My G20 would jam every 3rd or 4th round with those bullets so I switched to Underwood 140 grain extreme penetrators. My gun likes them much better.
O issues in our G20's with underwood.Is your's a 4th gen or 5th?. Mine is a 4th gen and i think my buddies is a 3rd gen. Have run many box's of 200 grain both with mine and my buddies no issues what so ever.Stock barrels on both.Stock 15 round mags. :dunno: Tried some 220 grain but they seamed to tumble a bit just like Hickok45 said on Utube . Which is NOT good for bear defense.