Post by: KimberRich on October 14, 2009, 11:44:11 AM
I always read about guys with 3 shot groups touching at 100 yards, being able to put a nickel over a group, and Sub-moa.
I tend to shoot more than 3 shots myself.. Probably 5 at a minimum.. To make sure my rifles are zeroed before hunting with them. Honestly I have never shot a group of 3, let alone 5, that are touching. Maybe 3 that can be covered by a quarter and I'm happy with that.
What's your maximum acceptable shot grouping?
Like others have said..Let's refrain from the "My Winchester can hit a Gnats ass at 500 yards" or "My remington is a tack driver". Don't want another debate about which rifle is the best. Plenty of threads already debating that.
Just what your acceptable grouping is.
Post by: PolarBear on October 14, 2009, 11:49:06 AM
Post by: bullchaser on October 14, 2009, 11:53:39 AM
Post by: boneaddict on October 14, 2009, 11:55:58 AM
Post by: Buckmark on October 14, 2009, 12:00:28 PM
*
From a vice i demand much better than that.
*
Oh and My Browning .270 weatherby can hit a gnats gonaads at 1252.3 yds :chuckle:
Post by: jackelope on October 14, 2009, 12:00:58 PM
5 shot groups within a quarter at 200 yards minimum.
no disrespect but i'm calling b.s. too.
1.5" at 100 for hunting situations is good with me.
Post by: GoldTip on October 14, 2009, 12:03:22 PM
Post by: markts on October 14, 2009, 12:03:43 PM
5 shot groups within a quarter at 200 yards minimum.:o :o :o :o :oMark
Post by: Gobble on October 14, 2009, 12:04:05 PM
3 shots hundred yards quarter covering.
[/quote
:yeah: Thats always my criteria
Realistically for any deer or elk sized prey if you can hold a 4" pattern that will kill any animal that size
Post by: boneaddict on October 14, 2009, 12:04:25 PM
Post by: matlockmike on October 14, 2009, 12:06:08 PM
Post by: carpsniperg2 on October 14, 2009, 12:06:22 PM
Post by: Gutpile on October 14, 2009, 12:06:51 PM
Post by: boneaddict on October 14, 2009, 12:07:15 PM
Post by: KimberRich on October 14, 2009, 12:08:39 PM
5 shot groups within a quarter at 200 yards minimum.
no disrespect but i'm calling b.s. too.
1.5" at 100 for hunting situations is good with me.
I agree on both comments here.
Post by: boneaddict on October 14, 2009, 12:11:52 PM
Post by: JackOfAllTrades on October 14, 2009, 12:12:49 PM
For a big game hunting arm, 1.5 MOA at any distance is good for me. For a varmint gun -something less than .240cal, I'll demand MOA and better.
-Steve
Post by: carpsniperg2 on October 14, 2009, 12:14:39 PM
Post by: Gobble on October 14, 2009, 12:15:36 PM
In a deep West Virginia accent............"I can hit a pie plate at a 100 yards."
Bone Now youv'e done it.......You pulled the pie plate card :chuckle:
I almost said that earlier but I figured it would rile up the troops. You used to hear that all the time, If you can hit a pie plate at 100 yrds it will kill a deer, Unfortunately thats pretty true. I hold myself to higher standards though
Post by: mossback91 on October 14, 2009, 12:20:30 PM
Post by: spur_ride on October 14, 2009, 12:23:22 PM
Post by: bankwalker on October 14, 2009, 12:35:21 PM
i use to go to the range all the time, was a great shot. but i think i have lost of shooting ability
Post by: PolarBear on October 14, 2009, 12:35:54 PM
Post by: Rgrady35 on October 14, 2009, 12:37:24 PM
Post by: norsepeak on October 14, 2009, 12:38:32 PM
That's just my standards though....saw a guy cleanly miss a huge bull at 40 yards broadside with a 7mm this year, so his standard must be (in a strong West Virginia accent) "If I can hit a barndoor at 100 yards, it's good enough"
Post by: jackelope on October 14, 2009, 12:39:40 PM
Call BS all you want but I shot competition rifle and handgun for many years and yes, I sight my rifles in at those tolerances. Try shooting more than a couple of days a year and you can do it as well.
i'd like to know what you're shooting to do that...i shoot more than a couple times a year. you're talking about 1/4 moa out of a hunting rifle. i'm assuming it's a custom rifle with handloads?
Post by: JackOfAllTrades on October 14, 2009, 12:41:08 PM
Quote
............"I can hit a pie plate at a 100 yards."
Standing, I can hit a 10" plate 9 of 10 times at 200m with iron sights and every time with optical sight. With optical sight, the plate can get a lot smaller if I change to a supported shooting position.
Anything other than that is unacceptable to me.
So, that doesn't relate to the accuracy of the rifle, but does combine the rifle and shootists capability.
-Steve
Post by: JackOfAllTrades on October 14, 2009, 12:45:48 PM
He doesn't list the caliber. And that's 1/2moa. Certainly possible out of nearly any of the 6mm cartridges with good hunting barrels.
-Steve
-And I do know people with 7mm and .30cal hunting rifles that can do it too.. Not as many, but with a good schillen barrel or such.. Possible.
Post by: bow4elk on October 14, 2009, 12:46:05 PM
The point is, just practice and take ethical shots. The rest will work itself out.
Post by: carpsniperg2 on October 14, 2009, 12:46:54 PM
[/quote]
:mod_smackdown: :mod_smackdown: :mod_smackdown:
Post by: carpsniperg2 on October 14, 2009, 12:49:28 PM
Call BS all you want but I shot competition rifle and handgun for many years and yes, I sight my rifles in at those tolerances. Try shooting more than a couple of days a year and you can do it as well.
to say that we don't shoot more than a couple times a year is stupid because you don't know and what gun what load are they hand loads what about wind drift or titlt of the earth i am sure you know how to compisate for that as well lol
Post by: MtnMuley on October 14, 2009, 01:02:41 PM
Post by: Straight Shooter on October 14, 2009, 01:06:15 PM
Varmint/predator rifles... 0.75 MOA or better.
Post by: PolarBear on October 14, 2009, 01:19:40 PM
Kinda like the incoherent statement that you just made?Call BS all you want but I shot competition rifle and handgun for many years and yes, I sight my rifles in at those tolerances. Try shooting more than a couple of days a year and you can do it as well.
to say that we don't shoot more than a couple times a year is stupid because you don't know and what gun what load are they hand loads what about wind drift or titlt of the earth i am sure you know how to compisate for that as well lol
I have owned 2 rifles that I am capable of doing that with, one a custom H&K 91 with a 26" heavy barrel and my current custom worked Springfield 30-06. I shoot factory loads with a bench rest and take my time shooting. I've been shooting since I was 5 (even shot for the Federal Ammunition team in my teens) and take it very seriously. I didn't realize that it was such a big freaking deal.
Post by: MtnMuley on October 14, 2009, 01:24:00 PM
Post by: boneaddict on October 14, 2009, 01:29:07 PM
Quote
I didn't realize that it was such a big freaking deal.
Kinda what I was thinking. I thought that was the whole point of shooting alot. I wish I did more of it. I shoot Remington 700's that have had their beddings glassed. now if you wre talking quarter sized groups at 600 I might harass ya. Hell there is a guy on here bragging hitting a 50 cent piece at 80 yards every shot with his bow. I think that would be worth may more ribbing.
back to the original question.
Post by: youngchristof on October 14, 2009, 01:29:39 PM
Post by: sako223 on October 14, 2009, 01:30:30 PM
I want one ragged hole.
So 3 or 5 shots will not do for me. By about 50 shots I have one ragged hole about 2".
Post by: carpsniperg2 on October 14, 2009, 01:30:51 PM
Post by: boneaddict on October 14, 2009, 01:35:28 PM
Quote
its pretty silly to have those standards for hunting
Some folks take hunting very seriously. I'd be careful who I was getting in a pecker measureing contest with on here. There are more hardcore folks on here than you might find anywhere at one time.
Post by: carpsniperg2 on October 14, 2009, 01:41:37 PM
Post by: WDFW-SUX on October 14, 2009, 02:06:09 PM
5 shots sub-moa at 200 isn't that hard people.. :dunno:
Post by: jackelope on October 14, 2009, 02:07:47 PM
Quote
5 shots sub-moa at 200 isn't that hard people..a moa at 200 yards though is 2". i would agree with you there.
Post by: WDFW-SUX on October 14, 2009, 02:10:37 PM
:'(
Post by: carpsniperg2 on October 14, 2009, 02:25:52 PM
Post by: JackOfAllTrades on October 14, 2009, 02:47:07 PM
Post by: Ray on October 14, 2009, 02:49:01 PM
3 shots with a one inch grouping at 100 yards is just fine for me. :twocents:
Post by: JackOfAllTrades on October 14, 2009, 02:52:43 PM
Quote
I like shooting the critters. Not holes in paper targets.
I like both.
Post by: 257 Wby Mag on October 14, 2009, 02:53:40 PM
Post by: Bofire on October 14, 2009, 02:55:33 PM
this works for me. TIKKA the heavy lines are 1 inch apart. 5 rounds/100
Carl
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv446%2FBofire%2FPDR_0060.jpg&hash=24737677486a42aaabf9e1865927a745799e3675)
Post by: jackelope on October 14, 2009, 02:57:16 PM
a guy that can shoot .25 or .5 off a bench is gifted. most guys can't shoot under 1" i know i can't but i know my rifle can.
if i put it in a vise thats a different story, but thats a great way to get sighted in too.
bugholes at 50-60 with the rimfire is a hoot, i could do that all day.
the shooting part i mean, not sure about the bug holes but it's fun trying.
Post by: Ray on October 14, 2009, 02:58:51 PM
QuoteI like shooting the critters. Not holes in paper targets.
I like both.
Sounds good to me. Not knockin' anyone. I prefer to shoot archery a lot more when it comes down to launching things down range. Nothing like flinging objects from a string.
Post by: 257 Wby Mag on October 14, 2009, 03:06:45 PM
Post by: 257 Wby Mag on October 14, 2009, 03:08:03 PM
Post by: jackelope on October 14, 2009, 03:09:31 PM
Yes, its in a frame. grin...
and on the wall?
Post by: carpsniperg2 on October 14, 2009, 03:10:21 PM
Post by: JackOfAllTrades on October 14, 2009, 03:14:02 PM
Most of you can't even get into the prone position.
-and yes, she's also a hunter. Accuracy to her is, well... pretty important. As a competitor and as a hunter.
-Steve
Post by: 270Shooter on October 14, 2009, 03:18:02 PM
I haven't had the chance to try any other bullets in my rifle, partly because I'm too cheap to go out and drop 40-50 bucks on a box of bullets that might only shoot a 2 inch group outta my gun. Someday I'll try something different.
Post by: JackOfAllTrades on October 14, 2009, 03:58:01 PM
Quote
because I'm too cheap to go out and drop 40-50 bucks on a box of bullets that might only shoot a 2 inch group outta my gunThen buy a box of Remington CoreLokts and be done with it!
Sounds like you've got a stock/action fit issue. Stringing with warm barrel shots is one thing. 'Consistant flyers' are something else.
-Steve
Post by: jackelope on October 14, 2009, 04:00:30 PM
Post by: Straight Shooter on October 14, 2009, 04:01:34 PM
Most of you can't even get into the prone position.
:chuckle: Too funny! :chuckle: The getting up part is the problem!
Post by: EastWaViking on October 14, 2009, 04:05:17 PM
1" group at 100 yards 3" high... rifle
Post by: Jamieb on October 14, 2009, 06:41:25 PM
Post by: Red Dawg on October 14, 2009, 08:05:58 PM
Post by: coachcw on October 14, 2009, 08:49:26 PM
Post by: 50CalJim on October 14, 2009, 09:09:05 PM
Post by: haugenna on October 14, 2009, 09:41:01 PM
When load developing though, less than an inch at 100 is sufficient.
Post by: ecnclan on October 14, 2009, 09:42:53 PM
Quote
I like to see a 3 shot group inside an inch at 100yds 2 inches high.:yeah:
I have rifles and loads that shoot better but with the time I have for practice and the ranges (under 400 yards) that I limit myself to this is plenty sufficient.
Post by: bobcat on October 14, 2009, 10:26:40 PM
Post by: BLKBEARKLR on October 15, 2009, 06:48:08 AM
Post by: ing on October 15, 2009, 07:09:36 AM
Post by: halflife65 on October 15, 2009, 07:23:40 AM
Post by: demontang on October 15, 2009, 07:45:40 AM
Post by: addicted on October 15, 2009, 08:02:21 AM
Post by: Hillbilly270 on October 15, 2009, 08:10:49 AM
Post by: halflife65 on October 15, 2009, 08:47:53 AM
am i crazy or is 10" at 100 and a paper plate at 50 acceptable? I couldn't feel confident shooting any further than 50 or 100 if thats how i sighted in......even at that I wouldn't feel confident i could hit the animal in the correct location.
Pretty sure that those people are joking. Nobody in their right mind thinks that's acceptable.
I
Post by: KimberRich on October 15, 2009, 09:03:16 AM
I was thinking about big game rifles when I started the topic and should have stated that. I also demand more from my varmint/coyote guns like most of you.. As for bench rest and competition rifles thats a different story.
From what I've read the average acceptable group so far is around 1" at 100 yards.
My opinion is that if you can shoot a .25" group of 5 shots at 200 yards out of a non custom gun with factory ammo, you should quit your day job and become a professional shooter. I'm not saying it isn't possible but I would have to witness it to believe it. :dunno:
Post by: CP on October 15, 2009, 09:08:45 AM
Post by: halflife65 on October 15, 2009, 09:20:26 AM
Group size is a range thing and by its self it doesn’t mean squat in a hunting situation. Shooting a one hole doesn’t put meat on the table if it is 2 feet off your point of aim. POA plus or minus 4 inches (8” group) may sound sloppy but it is good enough to put an animal down effectively. If I am confident that I can achieve that I will take the shot. The range will vary with the situation, weapon I’m using, off-hand, solid rest, leaning against a tree, wind speed, how hard I’m breathing, etc, etc, etc.
Sure, bench shooting in an unpressured environment is A LOT easier than shooting under pressure. But if you know that you can trust your rifle to be very accurate and precise, it gives you that much more confidence in your shot. The more confidence you have (and I don't mean the kind of over-confidence that leads to poor shot selection) the less nervous you'll be and the better chance you'll make a good shot.
I think that it's important to be able to shoot well at the range because it helps you in a hunting situation - where excitement can get to you.
Post by: thinkingman on October 15, 2009, 12:05:09 PM
Cold barrel, like it was a game animal and you had one shot to drop it.
That's how I look at my hunting rifles.
Post by: Hillbilly270 on October 15, 2009, 12:10:24 PM
Group size is a range thing and by its self it doesn’t mean squat in a hunting situation. Shooting a one hole doesn’t put meat on the table if it is 2 feet off your point of aim. POA plus or minus 4 inches (8” group) may sound sloppy but it is good enough to put an animal down effectively. If I am confident that I can achieve that I will take the shot. The range will vary with the situation, weapon I’m using, off-hand, solid rest, leaning against a tree, wind speed, how hard I’m breathing, etc, etc, etc.
so say u shoot an 8" group at 100..........would you feel comfortable shooting a deer at 300.....i mean shooting AT a deer at 300.
Post by: Bofire on October 15, 2009, 01:11:39 PM
Carl
Post by: dbllunger on October 15, 2009, 02:01:25 PM
Post by: rasbo on October 15, 2009, 02:06:37 PM
Post by: rover747 on October 15, 2009, 02:54:58 PM
Post by: cully on October 15, 2009, 03:14:30 PM
Post by: MtnMuley on October 15, 2009, 03:15:54 PM
Post by: cully on October 15, 2009, 04:06:45 PM
Post by: Bofire on October 15, 2009, 04:59:33 PM
How do you do standing sitting leaning quickly laying wet dim light sun in eyes, this is what needs practice.
Carl
Post by: runamuk on October 15, 2009, 05:05:50 PM
:)Groups are great and do boost confidence. but delivery under hunting conditions is different. I see lots of guys I know shoot (practice) at a bench sitting down. That aint much.
How do you do standing sitting leaning quickly laying wet dim light sun in eyes, this is what needs practice.
Carl
actually sun glare in scope I am getting down pretty good...sitting on the ground off my knee is going well..off stumps kneeling or standing yep.....haven't tried prone yet need shooting sticks as well.......I am pretty good IF I have something to rest on and it doesn't take much I just cannot yet keep my rifle still enough off hand.....and my groups looked a hell of a lot better off a bench with a proper rest... they were touching a whole lot more often than off all the crap found at clearcuts and gravel pits :chuckle: :chuckle: I like practicing though and my goal is always to have them touching...I don't reach my goals every time but keep improving.....
Post by: Huntbear on October 15, 2009, 07:05:29 PM
To answer the original question, it has to be Sub MOA for me, since I shoot nothing but handloads anymore. As for real life practical shooting, I worked up a practice for myself. I would save all my gallon milk jugs, fill em with water, add red food coloring. I would find a good clearcut and grab some jugs start walking, setting a jug on this stump, next to that log, etc.... no yardage marker, no range finder. Go back, load up the rifle, and shoot the jugs, sitting, kneeling, off hand. It was great practice, and I got instant gratification watching the red explosion.
sorry if I rambled on and jacked the thread.
Post by: Bofire on October 16, 2009, 07:49:37 AM
Carl
Post by: runamuk on October 16, 2009, 11:50:00 AM
I do that too Huntbear, I like using the plastic quart oil jugs, try freezing them first sometime, makes a big "Poooof! I bought some out of date canned goods once too, the beets were great!
Carl
Oh I bet the beets were cool :yike:....I want to try this milk jug and dye thing one of these days.
I had the hubby and the kid and myself out back a couple weeks ago we were blasting cans and skeets and a target...with the shotguns and the 22 we only have about 30-40 yards behind the shop but it works when we can't get up to the woods.....it all started because I wanted to figure out how to shoot the.410 then the guys drug out all their turkey shot that is no longer legal pretty sure the neighbor really hates me now :chuckle: :chuckle:
Post by: NWBREW on October 16, 2009, 12:59:52 PM
Post by: uncoolperson on October 16, 2009, 02:05:32 PM
If I want to shoot flies off paper targets I've got a rifle for that.
(reminds me, next time I go out shootin, gotta remember to put some bacon grease on the target)
I should add, I shake like a madman all the time (hereditary tremor). I know my limits and keep to them (clay at 200 ain't happening, so anything but a target at 200 with these iron sights ain't happen).
Post by: BULLBLASTER on October 16, 2009, 02:19:35 PM
Post by: WDFW-SUX on October 16, 2009, 03:48:03 PM
Post by: HuntingFanatic on October 16, 2009, 04:13:03 PM
Post by: WDFW-SUX on October 16, 2009, 04:15:36 PM
Post by: HuntingFanatic on October 16, 2009, 04:19:47 PM
Post by: coachcw on October 18, 2009, 09:17:36 PM