Post by: 1morebuck on August 02, 2010, 02:47:28 PM
As some of you know there has been drastic changes to the rules on the Skok (mouth caught fish only, no fishing on Mondays above the hwy. 106 bridge, only retain fin clipped kings), which is good and will help control the issues the WDFW has had there. Yes its Monday, so I was just scouting the area where Purdy Creek dumps into the Skok (I call it a$$hole). Upon arrival I noticed no less than 40 chrome-bright kings laying up against the log. As my hunting buddy and I pointed and looked at the nice fish here comes this white Dodge and one local "tribesman" and a "friend" who was as white as me (thats white!), carrying what looked like bottom fishing poles with treble hooks the size of my fist.
You guessed it... SNAG FEST 2010. These idiots put the waylay on three kings in 15 minutes and then had the nerve to ask me if I wanted to buy one. Here was my response:
No thanks guys, I prefer to treat our natural resources with respect and dignity. If I want one, I will come back down here and float some eggs or throw a spoon rather than rip a three inch hole in the side of my fish. I don't want to ruin my fillets.
Wow that pissed em' off. Along came the "F@#K YOU white boy" and "We'll snag every F@#KEN one of em' before tomorrow"
Gee, our tribes sure do know how to treat our natural resources with true respect and uphold their tribal heritage, I commend them as once again the tribes show their true colors. And yes, I have seen this before and no it's not just a select few, at the next hole down (called the Guard Rail hole) there were two more "tribesmen" treating their beloved Chinook the exact same way.
Post by: grundy53 on August 02, 2010, 03:09:08 PM
Post by: huntinhick on August 02, 2010, 03:09:32 PM
carl
Post by: 1morebuck on August 02, 2010, 03:20:52 PM
Well I live about 10 minutes from that very whole and refuse to fish it at all for the same reason. My daughter and I were at the logjam hole just around the bend where the walkin gate is, and a guys and his family come out on the res side and he poles his boat right into the hole and checks his net. he threw back 3 dead fish that where not legal while checking it, my daughter (12 at the time) got to love her made the comment, "dad as pale as that guy is I am more indian than he is" this is also the same girl who went she had to go to school on the skok res told the little girls on the res that were picking on her "that even though she had indian blood in her family she was american" got to love it when a kid understand something like that! any way we all but quit fishing that area because of the abuse oh and don't forget on net days they will net all the way to the hoodsport hatchery and the will surround the entire hatchery with nets. anyway sorry to rant on your post!
carl
That is one smart daughter you have there. If you are looking for a good spot on the Skok where you do not have to deal with the tribe, or many other fishermen, PM me and we can talk.
Kelly
Post by: seth30 on August 02, 2010, 03:35:51 PM
Post by: Houndhunter on August 02, 2010, 03:46:25 PM
Not sure too much of the rules for the rez, but all that they are doing is legal?
dont matter to them if its legal, but ya thats within there rights. although i thought they had to stop using treble hooks cause guys in the hatchery were having problems with it
Post by: spike on August 02, 2010, 04:06:40 PM
Post by: 1morebuck on August 02, 2010, 04:22:04 PM
Spike, I catch quite a few fin clipped kings on the Skok, but the unclipped ones are not native, so I do not know why they are putting that restriction on. :dunno:
Post by: Antlershed on August 02, 2010, 04:39:33 PM
Actually, I hope there aren't too many people in the spot I like to fish Eggs.
Post by: BigGoonTuna on August 02, 2010, 07:19:06 PM
of course us "white guys" have to get our act together before we can point the finger at them. i don't think there's 200 different indians that snag fish on that river, there's probably 200 white/black/brown dudes down there ripping on a typical august or october day any more.
Post by: ICEMAN on August 02, 2010, 07:24:27 PM
Post by: winston2789 on August 02, 2010, 07:30:13 PM
Post by: chevysquid on August 02, 2010, 07:51:00 PM
Post by: Antlershed on August 02, 2010, 08:11:03 PM
Wouldn't it be great if we could keep a film crew on station every day to document these SOB's. Not sure if the news would even be interested, not really news anymore. I bet that if you could get faces, fish, gear, and license plate numbers the fish and wildlife guys might be interested though.No they wouldn't. WDFW can't touch them.
Post by: Antlershed on August 02, 2010, 08:11:56 PM
i'd rather see the tribe snagging them than wiping it clean drifting gillnets downriver.And I'd be willing to bet that number is probably low...
of course us "white guys" have to get our act together before we can point the finger at them. i don't think there's 200 different indians that snag fish on that river, there's probably 200 white/black/brown dudes down there ripping on a typical august or october day any more.
Post by: WDFW Hates ME!!! on August 02, 2010, 10:13:32 PM
Post by: Blsum on August 02, 2010, 11:17:30 PM
Post by: Gobble on August 03, 2010, 06:07:09 AM
Post by: 1morebuck on August 03, 2010, 10:06:39 AM
Film our native caretakers and offer it up to youtube and the local media.
Great idea ICEMAN. I think that any of us that have a "Flip" camera should do that. I'll take mine down next trip!
Oh and just an update, I was there this am. Yes the normal idiots were there, but there were also a bunch of guys floating eggs under bobbers and doing quite well. I fished for a bit and nailed two on eggs/bobber. It is getting better as far as the trash goes, now if we can just get the snaggin idiots out of there it may be a decent fishery.
Post by: Blsum on August 03, 2010, 06:58:44 PM
Post by: Navyhunter on August 04, 2010, 08:15:54 AM
Post by: woodswalker on August 04, 2010, 08:29:48 AM
Film our native caretakers and offer it up to youtube and the local media.
That method sort of shortcuts the Know-nothing/Dont-care news orgs...I LIKE IT
Post by: 1morebuck on August 04, 2010, 03:28:10 PM
Post by: seth30 on August 04, 2010, 03:36:32 PM
Post by: Navyhunter on August 04, 2010, 08:46:43 PM
Post by: 1morebuck on August 05, 2010, 03:22:41 PM
Post by: huntinhick on August 05, 2010, 03:26:04 PM
Post by: buckhorn2 on August 05, 2010, 03:38:46 PM
Post by: johng on August 05, 2010, 03:46:16 PM
I fished the Skok on Tuesday evening... used bobber and eggs and landed no fish. I think it is my bad steelhead luck carrying over to me learning how to fish for salmon.
:bash:
Anyhow, that being said a couple of old timers next to me were using basically the same kind of rigging and one guy landed his two and the other guy landed two but had to release one because it didn't have the clipped fin.
As to the snaggers... they were on the side of the river riffing away. I may be getting skunked lately but I sure as heck don't want to catch my fish like that.
As to the netting comment someone made a few posts back- I thought the tribes could only do that on Mondays? How much longer is the run going to be on the Skok?
Good luck to all!
- John
Post by: Special T on August 05, 2010, 04:03:28 PM
Post by: chevysquid on August 05, 2010, 04:28:41 PM
Post by: 1morebuck on August 05, 2010, 04:51:15 PM
Johng, sorry about your luck, stick with the eggs/bobber it will produce. PM me and maybe I can help. The Skokomish tribe can and is "fishing" from Monday mornings to Friday's, so we get Saturday and Sunday to fish net free. Oh, and the reason it is closed to ALL sport fishing from the 106 to the 101 bridge is to let chinook pass without pressure from sportfishers, yet the tribe can and is still taking those bottom fishing poles and 80lb. braided line with fist sized treble hooks and ripping three-inch holes in fish. YEA! What great use of their precious heritage.
Post by: WSU on August 05, 2010, 04:52:44 PM
Post by: huntinhick on August 05, 2010, 05:00:11 PM
Post by: ICEMAN on August 05, 2010, 05:33:55 PM
I tried not to get into this Indian debate, but I can't help it. Nearly all those fish are hatchery fish, and are meant to be killed. Further, the problem with the Skok's salmon runs is not due to the tribe. In fact, it is due to our piss-poor logging practices and placing of a dam in the upper watershed. I understand that there are competing users, but we should be just as quick to look in the mirror as we are to point the finger.
OMG!!!!! :bash: :bash: :bash:
Post by: WSU on August 05, 2010, 05:54:57 PM
so since the dam and the logging cause the problem for the salmon and that the fish are all hatchery fish and are meant to be killed does that mean you would support me going down there with a big dip net and just scooping them up? or that I could could just catch them and sell them also? if they are meant to be killed then why have part of the river closed to allow them to pass with out issue?
I'm not saying that I personally agree with how things are being done. This includes the Indians and the non-Indians. I do think that Indians with treaty rights have a legitimate reason and right to commercially fish these runs. I'm not sure if the Skoks are a treaty tribe (anyone know?). If they are, they bargained for a treaty right to catch these fish in order to sustain a living. I see no problem with them doing that now. We, however, do not have a treaty right to catch these fish to make living. Seems to me our country should stand behind our word (treaty). People are only as good as their word in my book.
Post by: WSU on August 05, 2010, 05:55:46 PM
I tried not to get into this Indian debate, but I can't help it. Nearly all those fish are hatchery fish, and are meant to be killed. Further, the problem with the Skok's salmon runs is not due to the tribe. In fact, it is due to our piss-poor logging practices and placing of a dam in the upper watershed. I understand that there are competing users, but we should be just as quick to look in the mirror as we are to point the finger.
OMG!!!!! :bash: :bash: :bash:
OMG that was enlightening!!! Well put!!! :bash:
Post by: huntinhick on August 05, 2010, 06:13:23 PM
I see where you are coming from, I had that same type of view for awhile too. Now however I think that it is time that we take a serious look at the treaties and the harm or benefit they are doing. I don't know when the treaties where written but I doubt there were the issues they are currently having with salmon numbers. Also these little nations in a nation do not police them selves well, if you turn them in for not following the rules they will be right beck out the next day. I am not saying take away there source of income. either, use our money (tags/license) to buy their net rights for what they actually make not for some crazy amount or figure out how to police it better and ensure that everyone has a fair chance and piece of the resource. And I do also believe that it is not only the Indians that abuse the system I have seen people on both sides of the river snagging.
Post by: buckhorn2 on August 05, 2010, 07:08:21 PM
Post by: WDFW Hates ME!!! on August 05, 2010, 07:22:18 PM
Post by: BigGoonTuna on August 05, 2010, 09:46:58 PM
Why is it WSU that everytime anything about indians come up you jump in and stand up for them. Do you hunt or fish or is your real name cascade hunter. You never post unless it;s something to do with indians and treaty;s look in the mirrow again your on the wrong side again.never mind that he's stating the truth. sorry you don't like it.
Post by: 1morebuck on August 05, 2010, 09:51:24 PM
Post by: 1morebuck on August 05, 2010, 10:44:29 PM
Post by: BigGoonTuna on August 06, 2010, 07:26:15 AM
Ok guys, I just have one question. Didn't the Bolt Decision give the tribes 50% and the rest of us 50% of the total harvested catch? So can you honestly tell me that the sportfishers get our fair share of 50%? Oh and ther are NO commercial fishers other than the tribes on the Skok. :twocents:they don't split 50% over each river, it's out of the rough total estimate. the seasons get set at the north of falcon meetings every year. not a lot of tribal fishing going on at buoy 10, or sekiu etc. not to mention that the non indian catch is split between the white commercials, sport fishermen, and non-treaty tribes(like the chehalis who can net on their reservation).
unfortunately just about every river system outside willapa bay and a couple lower columbia tributaries in western WA has a tribal fishery. that sucks.
i can't understand why you would want to conduct a commercial fishery on the skok anyway, just because you're pissed that the indians do. i will say this, if you're fishing around the nets for kings, or the indian snagging platforms, you're fishing way too high up in the river to begin with ;)
Post by: PolarBear on August 06, 2010, 07:53:15 AM
I have family that go to school on the res. They live just up the road, and we camp near there and fish there every year. As a whole from what i have observed is the skoks are the most wastefull tribe. They are trash.Growing up on Kamilche Point in Shelton, it was well known that the Skoks were basically a bunch of drunken, drug addict, poaching outlaws. (for the most part) It is funny how different the tribes are. The Squaxin's have their bad apples but nothing like the Skok's.
Post by: Special T on August 06, 2010, 08:07:57 AM
I just have a problem with how it is used as a wedge by tribes for money in many cases where it should be a non issue.. For example dredging the Keystone ferry terminal that has been held up by tribes... Or any other waterway project for that matter... Many advances have been made in tech and understanding in making construction more fish friendly, but skidds still are greased just to do projects that have no or negligible affects on fish. :bash:
Post by: WSU on August 06, 2010, 09:48:19 AM
Why is it WSU that everytime anything about indians come up you jump in and stand up for them. Do you hunt or fish or is your real name cascade hunter. You never post unless it;s something to do with indians and treaty;s look in the mirrow again your on the wrong side again.
The reason I jump in is that we have a totally one sided view that is all over the board, and often the posts are factually wrong. Everyone can have their opinion, that's what makes this country and the boards great.
As for a report regarding hunting or fishing: went to the Skok this morning. Fished a couple hours, went 2 for 3 on bobber and eggs. The biggest problem is the people "drift fishing" who give a huge rippin' hookset every case. Totally turns the bite off, and makes the fish about 10 times harder to catch. The best part is, the drift "fishermen" land about 1 out of 10 since it is aweful hard to control a fish that's hooked in the a$$, and then have to release said 10th fish becuase it is snagged. Catch a fish, and all of a sudden you have 3 drift "fishermen" standing in your hip pocket. So, I moved on and hooked more fish, got mine, and am now back at the office.
1morebuck: thanks for the info. I went down below where you told me to go, but there are tons of fish around.
Post by: 300magman on August 06, 2010, 09:57:02 AM
You said "WE" have a one sided view.......... There is no "WE" from me.......The indians are destroying the fish runs in washington.
When all the fish are gone, Are you still going to side with them??? I bet not...........
to hell with the indians......quit fishing years ago because of all the B.S.
Post by: WSU on August 06, 2010, 10:00:34 AM
Post by: 300magman on August 06, 2010, 10:10:54 AM
I understand where you are coming from now. Wasn't try to throw you under the bus. It is sad that as human beings we cant have equal rights for all!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
love to fish but the rules are way out of whack!!!!!!!!!!
300magman.............
Post by: 1morebuck on August 06, 2010, 10:19:37 AM
It is a sad fact that MOST, not all, of the the aforementioned tribal members are in fact destroying the salmon fishery on the Skok and wasting everyone's natural resources. And after talking to WDFW enforcement about it, they say that they report tribal members "jigging" and wasting on a regular basis only to have no response from tribal enforcement. Until ALL tribal leaders recognize and quit participating in these wasteful acts the spite will go on.
Post by: WSU on August 06, 2010, 10:21:45 AM
WSU,
I understand where you are coming from now. Wasn't try to throw you under the bus. It is sad that as human beings we cant have equal rights for all!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
love to fish but the rules are way out of whack!!!!!!!!!!
300magman.............
No sweat! I wouldn't make such posts if I didn't have thick skin!
Post by: huntinhick on August 06, 2010, 11:44:01 AM
Post by: 1morebuck on August 06, 2010, 02:33:18 PM
Tuesday I was on the river and there were at least 50-80 fish in the hole below where I was (the small pocket I was at was holding 6-8 fish) and on the short 1/2 mile walk I did every large hole was close to the same (WSU was there and should agree). Today at 5:15 am I did the same exact walk. Zero fish in the first three holes. And the hole where Purdy Creek dumps in (the one that usually has a ton of fish in it) 2 and one had the white death spots on it. Tell me the tribe is getting it's fair share.
Some have said the Skokomish runs are less important than certain Columbia runs. EVERY salmon and steelhead run is important to me. Someone else said to just give it to them. Hell no, sport fishers would still take the fall and then we would have to pay to return the runs back to their traditional levels.
On at least one good note, I want to thank and commend all of the members here and every other fisherman and woman who has gone down there this year and fished correctly. This isn't just for the egg tossers. This is for the "drifters" who have really laid back on the snagging and the keeping of foul-hooked fish. I understand that we are not perfect, hell I'm not. But there has been a great effort made on many's part and the river is MUCH cleaner this year too. Thanks.
Post by: buckhorn2 on August 06, 2010, 03:31:03 PM
Post by: 1morebuck on August 25, 2010, 10:29:20 AM
Post by: WDFW Hates ME!!! on August 26, 2010, 01:23:00 PM
Post by: 1morebuck on August 26, 2010, 02:32:41 PM
Post by: steeleywhopper on September 10, 2010, 01:48:35 AM
I was fishing there last year and had a nice at least 30 lb king on all legal and a native guy seen me playing with the fish. He pulls his line in and puts what looks like a 2nd treble hook on the size of his fist. Casts it in and trys to steal my fish. I was on Hunters Tree Farm Property and one of the hunters family members were out there. They carry conceled weapons along with me when I go I always carry a concealed weapon. I said take my fish you M&*$% and you will get shot. (Well I will NEVER shoot anyone I will always just fire in the air.)He said try it and I said well I'm a legal concealed weapons and I pretended to pull my gun... And he was scared *censored*less... dropped his pole and ran. I ended up reeling my fish in and his pole. Got a nice 34 lb king and a 140.00 rod and halibit reel with 3 treble hooks the size of a baseball!!Why and the heck would they arrest him when you are the one who gave him a death threat? I know interfearing with someone while fishing or hunting is a small crime, but threatening to shoot someone over a Skok infested fish is insane. :dunno:
I reported it to the sheriff and state patrol and got pictures and a police report and they found the guy and arrested him. Don't know what happened after this.
Post by: Yelm hunter on September 10, 2010, 02:04:28 AM
That tribe is worthless... It's NOT even a TRIBE... Nothing at all like the Nisqually Tribe or the Puyallup/Squaxin tribe
Post by: Bofire on September 10, 2010, 08:32:30 AM
One of them talked to me, thought he knew me, I asked about his gear, he was fishing 50 lb. braid with a 40 pound leader, he had a corkie on above a big treble hook.
He looked at my gear, I felt pathetic with my up to 1 ounce rod, small spinning reel and 8 lb line Bobber and Jig.!! I just left, I want nothing to do with that sort of "fishing"
It aint just the indians!
Carl
Post by: FMRDEVILDOG on September 11, 2010, 07:56:50 PM