Hunting Washington Forum
Other Hunting => Waterfowl => Topic started by: Phartridge on October 21, 2010, 01:10:02 PM
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I have a 20 gauge pump action shotgun, and I am wondering if this is going to be enough to bring a goose down. It has a 28" barrel, and can hold 3" magnuns. I also have interchangable choke tubes, so I was assuming that a full choke would probably be best. I am just wondering if this is going to be adequate? Thanks 8)
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shoot the heads and get um close enough and u should be able to bring um down.
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Not with steel shot. But with some of the other alternatives it will work if you keep your shots on the short side. I'd say no more than about 35 yards.
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It will work fine, keep the range down and use the right size shot and you got yourself some geese!
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Well obviously bobcat doesnt know what he is talking about.
http://shotshell.drundel.com/pelletcount.htm (http://shotshell.drundel.com/pelletcount.htm)
The only difference is pellet count. I shoot a bunch of geese every year with 12 ga 2 3/4 in steel shells. Its very similar to a 20ga 3" shell.
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Well obviously bobcat doesnt know what he is talking about.
http://shotshell.drundel.com/pelletcount.htm (http://shotshell.drundel.com/pelletcount.htm)
The only difference is pellet count. I shoot a bunch of geese every year with 12 ga 2 3/4 in steel shells. Its very similar to a 20ga 3" shell.
It's simply my opinion. Doesn't mean I don't know what I'm talking about. I wouldn't recommend using a 20 gauge with steel shot for geese. I didn't say it wouldn't kill them, but why limit yourself by using steel shot when there are much better alternatives out there? Also it depends on what kind of geese you're talking about. He didn't say so I'm assuming Canada Geese.
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I trust pretty much whatever Bobcat says as he hasn't lead me astray before. :dunno: I do agree with him here as well. Not to say that a 20 gauge wouldn't bring down a goose but there are plenty of other means to make clean, lethal shots. If I had to hunt with a 20 gauge, I for sure wouldn't shoot past 30 yards or so but that is just me.
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Bring them in close.
My brother and I both started on .410's when we were kids and we've both killed geese with them.
Curtis
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Full choke is often not the best for sheel shot FYI. Modified with steel can act like a full.
the gauge of the gun doesnt matter. 97 pellets out of a 2 3/4 inch 12ga shell, go the same speed as the 87 out of a 3" 20ga.
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Gauge does matter. 12 gauge is better all the way around. More shot, and/or more velocity, along with a shorter shot column, which provides better patterns than the smaller gauge shotguns. Sounds to me like you need to do more homework, Professor.
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Ok, thanks for the input, but I now have a couple more questions. What kind of shells should I use? And, playing off that, I am getting the impression that I shouldn't use steel shot. Can I use lead? :dunno: Also, my Dad has a 12 gauge turkey gun that kicks like a mule. It has a ported barrel, and takes 3 1/2" shells. The thing about that is I like a little challenge, and my 20 gauge is way more fun to hunt with.
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Gauge does matter. 12 gauge is better all the way around. More shot, and/or more velocity, along with a shorter shot column, which provides better patterns than the smaller gauge shotguns. Sounds to me like you need to do more homework, Professor.
A pellet does not know if it comes out of a 20ga or 12ga.
If a #2 steel shot pellet at 1500 fps comes out of a 12 or 20 gauge wich is more lethal :bash:
A 20gauge shooting the correct size shot for the intended target and at a adequate velocity will kill geese as cleanly as a 12 or 10 gauge.
For canada geese a 3" load of #2 or BB steel shot at 1500 fps will kill like an act of god from a 20 gauge.
THE ONLY DIFFERENCE IS PELLET COUNT as prof chaos stated.
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The reason a 12 gauge will kill them more effeciantly (sp?) is because of pattern density. A 20 guage has less shot which means less dense of a pattern (usually)... unless the 12 gauge you have patterns like crap, I would use that. That is not to say that a 20 gauge wont kill geese, it most certainly will.
Umm don't use lead. Modified would be the choke to start with when patterning.
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In regards to the patterning. The 12 gauge will put 30 pellets in a pop can from about 40 yards. No kidding. :yike: It has a super full turkey choke in it. Is this pattern to tight for geese? My 20 has a bit looser pattern, but still not bad.
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My Nephew takes down geese with a 20ga mossberg 500 youth, but my brother does have him shooting heavy shot out of it. They get pretty spendy, and there isn't much of a selection in 20ga, but they will crumple a goose.
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My 20 is a Mossberg, but it is the full version. Where do you get your ammo? How far away are you shooting from. Crumpling a goose sounds pretty satisfying... :drool:
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In regards to the patterning. The 12 gauge will put 30 pellets in a pop can from about 40 yards. No kidding. :yike: It has a super full turkey choke in it. Is this pattern to tight for geese? My 20 has a bit looser pattern, but still not bad.
Yeah dont try to shoot steel through that choke, could end up bad. If the mod isnt tight enough for you, you could buy a long range waterfowl choke like a patternmaster. You dont need a super tight choke, geese arent bullet-proof.
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A pellet does not know if it comes out of a 20ga or 12ga.
If a #2 steel shot pellet at 1500 fps comes out of a 12 or 20 gauge wich is more lethal :bash:
A 20gauge shooting the correct size shot for the intended target and at a adequate velocity will kill geese as cleanly as a 12 or 10 gauge.
For canada geese a 3" load of #2 or BB steel shot at 1500 fps will kill like an act of god from a 20 gauge.
THE ONLY DIFFERENCE IS PELLET COUNT as prof chaos stated.
:bs: You need to do more studying just like the Professor. Did you read my entire post? The 12 gauge has a shorter shot column, not to mention MORE shot! I don't care what you say- a 12 gauge kills better and farther than a 20 gauge will. If it didn't, everybody would be shooting 20 gauge shotguns. The 20 gauge works acceptably for waterfowl but it's not much good with steel shot, as I already said. You need to use Hevi-shot or something similar. Or if you insist on using steel shot, then limit your shots to 25 yards.
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A pellet does not know if it comes out of a 20ga or 12ga.
If a #2 steel shot pellet at 1500 fps comes out of a 12 or 20 gauge wich is more lethal :bash:
A 20gauge shooting the correct size shot for the intended target and at a adequate velocity will kill geese as cleanly as a 12 or 10 gauge.
For canada geese a 3" load of #2 or BB steel shot at 1500 fps will kill like an act of god from a 20 gauge.
THE ONLY DIFFERENCE IS PELLET COUNT as prof chaos stated.
:bs: You need to do more studying just like the Professor. Did you read my entire post? The 12 gauge has a shorter shot column, not to mention MORE shot! I don't care what you say- a 12 gauge kills better and farther than a 20 gauge will. If it didn't, everybody would be shooting 20 gauge shotguns. The 20 gauge works acceptably for waterfowl but it's not much good with steel shot, as I already said. You need to use Hevi-shot or something similar. Or if you insist on using steel shot, then limit your shots to 25 yards.
Wow....................some people are clueless.
Of course a 1oz load of #2 steel has 125 pellets and a 1 1/8oz load of #2 steel has 141.
Do you think you will see a pattern density difference with 16 fewer pellets.......................NOPE!!!
Shot column is realative due to actual barrel dia., wad thickness, brand of choke ect,ect,ect.
I bet I can get as good of a pattern with a 1oz load out of a 20gauge with the right choke as you can with a 12gauge with a 1 1/8 load shooting equal velocity (1500-1550)
This reminds me of the guy that thinks muzzle loaders have firing pins ;)
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Bobcat, Were you comments directed at me, becasue I just wanted to let you know that I am getting a lot of information out of your posts. Sorry if I am not getting that across... :-/
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Meats,
I think by now it's obvious to everyone but you, that you're an idiot. Bigger is better.There's no way to rationally argue otherwise. Since you think a 20 gauge kills as good as a 12 gauge, do you have any shotguns you'd like to sell? I'll take those worthless 12 gauge shotguns off your hands if you like.
Phartridge,
No, my last couple of posts were not dircted at you. But you should still get something out of them. ;)
Basically all I'm saying is don't use steel shot. And lead is not legal so you can't use that either. The other more expensive alternatives will work much better for geese. And a modified or full choke is what you want. But of course it's best to pattern your gun and see what choke works best.
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Meats,
I think by now it's obvious to everyone but you, that you're an idiot. Bigger is better.There's no way to rationally argue otherwise. Since you think a 20 gauge kills as good as a 12 gauge, do you have any shotguns you'd like to sell? I'll take those worthless 12 gauge shotguns off your hands if you like.
Phartridge,
No, my last couple of posts were not dircted at you. But you should still get something out of them. ;)
Basically all I'm saying is don't use steel shot. And lead is not legal so you can't use that either. The other more expensive alternatives will work much better for geese. And a modified or full choke is what you want. But of course it's best to pattern your gun and see what choke works best.
I never said a 12 is not better than a 20 and I never said a 20 is better than a 12.
You are the one that says a 20 is no good,cant use steel and only able to kill to 25 yards.
I posted facts, you post you opinion(You even admitted this).
You have no ability to prove your point so you call me an idiot..............I love it.
You ever want to hook up for a hunt let me know.I will do everything SLOW so you can take lots of notes.
Guess the gun and load used on this hunt and I'll give it to you.
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi12.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fa214%2FBradRoberts%2FP1010401.jpg&hash=1aa1c236ae0c820cba684fa1ab8ae73dba677d99)
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So, if I can't use lead, and I maybe shouldn't use steel (still up for opinion), then what are my alternatives? Were you thinking along the lines of copper-coated, or zinc? Basically, what were you refering to when you said that there were more expensive alternatives? Thanks. 8) :) ;)
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Black cloud should work fine, but I think he was refering to tungsten, bismuth and hevi-shot.
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Chester, I have heard of all the others, but what is Black cloud? Thanks
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Black Cloud is a steel shot. its got some special design. it knocks birds dead with the right choke. tears them up a little tho.
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Thanks for the input. Does anybody else have reccomendation for shells to use with the 20?
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Black cloud is a shell made by federal, uses the flight control wad, throws tighter patterns. Hevi shot is spendy but probably worth it if you are shooting geese a lot with a 20.
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Used my Remington 870 youth model 20 gauge for 6 years hunting duck's and geese did pretty well. Used 3" #2 federal steel shot.
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Chester, I have heard of all the others, but what is Black cloud? Thanks
You can see it at the link below.
http://www.federalpremium.com/products/details/shotshell.aspx?id=840 (http://www.federalpremium.com/products/details/shotshell.aspx?id=840)
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If they are close and over the decoys, does it matter what you are shooting. 28,20,16,12 or 10. Nope. I didn't start shooting the 12 until about age 12 or 13. I killed several hundred geese with the 20. Get them with there feet down and practice your shot and you will dirt them. When they are real close it will look like a slug hit them.
My dad only shoots a .20 anymore because of arthritis. You wouldn't know the difference other than the kick. He drops them as good as anyone.
Only main comment would be to get rid of the extra full. Your pattern will go to crap with steel. Open it up. Shoot modified or IC a little practice and you will dirt birds within reason. You probably won't fair as well in the 70 yard club that some shoot at, but patience and good shots will earn you a limit.
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If they are close and over the decoys, does it matter what you are shooting. 28,20,16,12 or 10. Nope. I didn't start shooting the 12 until about age 12 or 13. I killed several hundred geese with the 20. Get them with there feet down and practice your shot and you will dirt them. When they are real close it will look like a slug hit them.
My dad only shoots a .20 anymore because of arthritis. You wouldn't know the difference other than the kick. He drops them as good as anyone.
Only main comment would be to get rid of the extra full. Your pattern will go to crap with steel. Open it up. Shoot modified or IC a little practice and you will dirt birds within reason. You probably won't fair as well in the 70 yard club that some shoot at, but patience and good shots will earn you a limit.
Exactly what I was trying to say.
Bobcat wont agree but you speak the truth.
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Go big, go with the punt gun! One shot, limit out!
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Grizzly, That is awsome. We went to Boston this last summer and saw one. Takes out 30 ducks with one shot. Are those legal? LOL... :)
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So, if I can't use lead, and I maybe shouldn't use steel (still up for opinion), then what are my alternatives? Were you thinking along the lines of copper-coated, or zinc? Basically, what were you refering to when you said that there were more expensive alternatives? Thanks. 8) :) ;)
If I were going to use my 20ga on geese (mine is only 2 3/4"), I think I'd use Nice Shot........ : http://store.fastcommerce.com/niceshot/20-gauge-ff8081811ba399ad011c067e043f649b-p.html (http://store.fastcommerce.com/niceshot/20-gauge-ff8081811ba399ad011c067e043f649b-p.html)
1 oz load of #5's should work well (for decoying geese under 40 yards).
If I had a 3" 20ga, I'd probably go with Remington HD (http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/cb/remington-wingmaster-hd-waterfowl-loads-10-ga-3-1-2-1-3-4-oz-ammo-10-rds.aspx?a=327623) in the 3" mag #4's.
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if you use decoys like your supposed to there is no question about it, all i used to hunt with was my 870 20ga. with 3'' 2 shot and mod. choke it works really well. the only reason someone would say other wise is because the just don't know how to shoot so they need all the shot they can get (12ga 3.5, or a 10ga) :twocents: :twocents:
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Thanks for all the info. I think I am going to go with the 20 gauge. I have always liked using light gear for a bigger challenge. I flyfish alot, and I use a 2 weight, because it just adds that extra bit of tension. Same with spinning, I always use an ultralight.
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So, your 20ga is only full choke? Does it have choke tubes? Full choke and steel don't always work so well. You should plan on patterning before hunting with whatever load you choose.
Good luck.
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No, I have interchangable chokes, so I have full, modified, and Imp.. Should I pattern the gun like I would pattern it for a turkey. What should my density of my pattern be? Also, I have fiber-optic sights, and bead sights. I think I will probably go with the fiber-optic.
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Just draw a 30" dia. circle and shoot at it at 30 or 40 yards and check to see which choke gives you the most uniform pattern with as few flyers as possible. Sometimes full choke will leave some large gaps and produce a bunch of flyers (especially w/ steel shot). Sometimes modified or IC will give you a better pattern than full. I've gotten 80% of the pellets within a 30" circle at 40yards with IC choke before.
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I love black cloud loads! You should see the damage they do. Drop ducks much quicker than standard steel, for not much more of a price. I think the new non toxic loads cost WAY too much! I can shoot 3 times the amount of shells for the same price of those boxes of ten you get. Really, TEN shells? :twocents:
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My wife has a 12 and a 20. 90% of the time she takes her 20 out. If they are close enough your average duck load will do the trick. The best thing that i have found for her to shoot (when i do) :chuckle: Is Remington HD in 4 or 6 so you still have a decent pattern. Feels like ur shootin lead! As far as the black cloud loads for the 20 the ones i have found are 1300 or so fps. With steel speed kills.
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If you're going to edit my stuff, just delete it then.... >:(
sorry for speaking my opinion.
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20 gauges also work on deer when shooting slugs. :twocents:
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20 gauge will work fine for geese! Ive brought down many a limit of geese with at 20...plus 5 turkeys...just use 3'' and you'll do fine!
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for sure a goose killer...but only if you can bring the birds in close....im not saying you wont get a head wack every now and again..but if your hunting Honkers you will want them pretty close. 20gauge will do the job but make sure you dont try for the "sky bust" shots or you wont be doing anything but thowning shells away.
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20 gauges also work on deer when shooting slugs. :twocents:
hahahahahaha
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I never try to talk someone ot of buying a new gu :rolleyes:
so ofcourse it's "not" big enough