Hunting Washington Forum

Other Activities => Fishing => Topic started by: jackelope on June 07, 2007, 04:50:51 PM

Title: lumii tribal member facing charges for illegal netting
Post by: jackelope on June 07, 2007, 04:50:51 PM: Tribal Member Sells Chinook, Illegally: Lummi Law and Order Officer Jefferson received a call from an anonymous citizen regarding a Lummi Tribal Member who was gillnetting threatened spring Chinook salmon from the lower Nooksack River. The suspect was reportedly selling large numbers of salmon to locals. Officer Jefferson passed along the information to WDFW Officer Jones and Sgt. Mullins. With returning spring Chinook numbers measured in the hundreds, this became the highest enforcement priority. Two illegal set nets were located in a remote part of the River delta, on reservation. The nets had cut-down floats that were clearly designed to help avoid detection. Officer Jones and Sgt. Mullins worked with Lummi Officer James and NMFS Special Agents to conduct extended surveillance. This led to video of the suspect using a kayak to remove seven 15 to 25 pound Chinook from one net over two days. Once commercial sale of two of the fish was documented, the suspect was immediately contacted and was prevented from killing any more of the fish. When confronted with the officers’ observations, the suspect decided to cooperate and subsequently admitted he had killed at least 25 spring Chinook over the previous two weeks and had sold 20 of them for $20 each. The suspect’s actions did not fall under State jurisdiction. Lummi Law and Order and NMFS intend to pursue simultaneous prosecutions under Lummi Title 10 and Federal ESA and Lacey Act. KING 5 and the Bellingham Herald ran the story. (Statewide Marine Division)

poached for a buck a pound...damn shame, less than hot dogs. it's good that he's facing charges by the feds. the nooksack springers are ESA listed. apparently the lumii tribe has a good record of crimes duely punished and this should not get swept under the carpet.
Title: Re: lumii tribal member facing charges for illegal netting
Post by: Dman on June 08, 2007, 09:02:41 AM: Jack, please keep us informed of what slap on the wrist this guys gets. We need to make sure our co-manager's are doing their job.
Title: Re: lumii tribal member facing charges for illegal netting
Post by: Buckrub on June 08, 2007, 10:05:47 AM: The state would actually make money if they subsidized the commercial portion of the fish from the tribes...rebuilt the fish runs and turn this state into a sportsman dream. Now it's like a group of kids around a bowl of candy...everyone getting as much as they can before its gone. The tribes are targeting native runs and destroying what we are $$paying for to rebuild....seems fishy.
My cost for springers is about $100.00 per fish...maybe more with all included.
Just my $.02
Title: Re: lumii tribal member facing charges for illegal netting
Post by: Ray on June 08, 2007, 10:17:02 AM: Quote
The state would actually make money if they subsidized the commercial portion of the fish from the tribes

Fantastic concept. The reality is America and Washington State politics doesn't want to touch that with a 10 foot pole. The governments are too busy trying to rectify what happened to Indian tribes generations ago. In light of that they have given them enough rights to destroy animal herds and fish populations which many of these claimed ownership and protectiveness over as part of their argument to get the rights they are now abusing.

The example you made which I quoted (not the part about breaking the existing laws) is more rooted in that than anything else as far as I can see. None of my ancestral blood had anything to do with native Indian oppression, decimation, domination, or the whole foundation which these special rights are built upon. Therefore I don't agree with the laws however I obey and honor them. I'd go on further but feel like I am already preaching to the choir.
Title: Re: lumii tribal member facing charges for illegal netting
Post by: jackelope on June 08, 2007, 10:23:09 AM: Quote
My cost for springers is about $100.00 per fish...maybe more with all included.
dang...you're doing good.
Title: Re: lumii tribal member facing charges for illegal netting
Post by: jackelope on June 08, 2007, 10:32:41 AM: maybe some more netters need to get the up-river bail of hay treatment. only problem with that is it makes a mess on the river.
does a number on nets from what i've heard though.
Title: Re: lumii tribal member facing charges for illegal netting
Post by: Buckrub on June 08, 2007, 10:37:09 AM: Like I said...maybe more $$ with everything involved...LOL
Growing up next to the tribe and seeing the shoot and kill anything anytime has soured me a bit. I don't blame the tribes, they are to get what they feel they can, just like everyone else.

A side note:
I wrote a letter to the WDFG with this concept recieved a not so nice letter stating that "it would be impossible to tell the difference between substance and commercial" all BS.
I think the answer is to let them rape it till it's gone....rebuild the fish runs without them and call it ours.
Title: Re: lumii tribal member facing charges for illegal netting
Post by: Dman on June 08, 2007, 11:46:04 AM: I actually like the idea of the Tribe's being co-manager's for one reason. It forces them to work with the State on fisherie's management, rather than ignore the State. Whether it will be a functional relationship remains to be seen. I do know that hatcherie's did not exist when the treaties were written. A clause should be added to Federal treaty laws stating that fish of public hatchery origin (fin clipped) shall be the eminent domain of the State, as they are paid for by tax and license money and did not exist at the time of the treaty agreement. Then tribes with hatchery production capabilities could leave their fish unmarked, as they can harvest the wilds anyway. The tribe's would then argue that the hatchery fish are used to supplement run's that have been lost that were once larger. Well, then once again, they can contribute to the public $$$ pool that has paid for restoration and habitat projects, dam removal, etc... Either way, they need to pony up more effort and $$$ in to fisheries management to harvest the amount of resources that they have been harvesting, or cut back. The point about subsistence is very accurate also. It was never the intention of the treaty rights to guarentee commercial harvesting opportunity, only subsistence. BS the State can't determine that, it's as easy as requiring the tribe's to file all the paperwork and adhere to all the regulations and season's commercial's fish now. Just another excuse.

Just my 3.5 cents
Title: Re: lumii tribal member facing charges for illegal netting
Post by: Otto1 on June 08, 2007, 07:11:24 PM: Quote from: jackelope on June 08, 2007, 10:32:41 AM
maybe some more netters need to get the up-river bail of hay treatment. only problem with that is it makes a mess on the river.
does a number on nets from what i've heard though.

that is a stupid idea and anyone that does should get whats coming to em.

Is what happens when some knucklehead hillbilly does that, Yea it f's up the net real good and then it has the potenial to pull it from its anchor system and then pull it away and downstream untill it gets caught it some underwater snag and is there catching fish for years. Derelict gear sucks more than illegal nets.

Jackelope, where did you get the above report of this from? I do not see any newslinks or reporters name that wrote it.
Title: Re: lumii tribal member facing charges for illegal netting
Post by: Otto1 on June 08, 2007, 07:35:28 PM: now this is ironic

http://www.bellinghamherald.com/102/story/80428.html

here is the B-Ham link for the story,

http://www.bellinghamherald.com/102/story/88872.html
Title: Re: lumii tribal member facing charges for illegal netting
Post by: Dman on June 09, 2007, 02:21:36 PM: Otto, from your post it seems you feel the tribe's don't get a fare shake. I'm 1/8 Blackfoot, hunt with an Ojibway and have also involved in ESA salmon planning for the Sound. Understand that the tribes are not subject to ESA laws, they harvest wild salmon all the time. The Makahs take wild's annually in their winter chinook troll and that fishery is not a gill net fishery, it is a long line fishery -in essence those fish could still be released. I don't care what nationality a person is, or of what origin. Every person has an obligation to contribute to the resources in this Country who harvest's them, much of the tribal harvest attitude is that everyone has taken what was theirs. Very simplistic attitude and not up to date with reality. Reality is that fishing only exist's because of non-tribal dollars, while some tribe's do contribute to the run's in hatchery production and are to be commended for that, the majority of State tribal harvest is made up of fish that are of State and private hatchery origin. Right now the tribe's have been recently handed the title of fisheries co-manager's with WDFW and they do not have to; report annual harvest, adhere to State season's, pay in to hatchery and enhancement project's, etc.. for this privelege. Sentiment towards the old native way of life has absolutely nothing to do with this issue.
Title: Re: lumii tribal member facing charges for illegal netting
Post by: Otto1 on June 09, 2007, 10:05:17 PM: Quote from: Dman on June 09, 2007, 02:21:36 PM
Otto, from your post it seems you feel the tribe's don't get a fare shake.

No, not really. I just kind of thought it funny that they had a big ol' cerimony over the salmon and how much its part of their heritage and a few weeks later one of their own gets nabbed for netting them.
As for doing hillbilly justice by throwing hay bales in the river to screw up nets, its just plain stupid, by doing that the dumb as s has the potenial to kill more fish than the net would do with someone tending it. Haybailing causes derilict gear that will catch and kill fish for years!

My second link was the only story I could find that was ran on the incident, but Jackelope posted what looked like an article but it had no mention of were it came from, no reporter, no newspaper no nothing. I personally would not post something like that without giving writting credits to who or what wrote it and I think he knows exactly what I am talking about.
Title: Re: lumii tribal member facing charges for illegal netting
Post by: Dman on June 10, 2007, 02:28:58 PM: Oh, misunderstood your meaning.
Title: Re: lumii tribal member facing charges for illegal netting
Post by: jackelope on June 11, 2007, 09:07:49 AM: i got the story off of another BB. i don't like to post links from other outdoor forums on this one and viceversa.
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what looked like an article but it had no mention of were it came from, no reporter, no newspaper no nothing
read the bottom of the article and you'd see this:
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KING 5 and the Bellingham Herald ran the story. (Statewide Marine Division)

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that is a stupid idea and anyone that does should get whats coming to em.
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by doing that the dumb as s has the potenial to kill more fish than the net would do

otto...ease up...it's a joke. i know you don't know me, but fishing is my biggest passion. bigger than hunting....and you will NEVER find me doing anything to harm the river or the fish in it. actually i would rather see the jackazz strung up by his b--ls than haybale his net.